# Rigid bending layout



## newbi (Dec 17, 2011)

Hey guys, I am in my 2nd year of apprenticeship and still fairly new to bending. It was taught in the classroom that bends can be aligned but have different angles or all the bends could have the same angles but different center of bend locations on a rack.

This makes sense to me because of trigonometry. However, I was told by a journeyman that bends on a rack can have the same center of bend alignments and angles by using the method of spacing+OD of conduit.

Have any of you done this and if so could you explain it to me ?


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## 360max (Jun 10, 2011)

http://www.porcupinepress.com/_bending/ParallelBends.htm


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## freeagnt54 (Aug 6, 2008)

Depends on what kind of bends you're talking about. If the offsets are the same you can match centers and degrees. Kick 90's you have to either stagger the bends or modify the degree of your bend. Parallel kick 90's are a little more complicated but your bends will still be staggered.


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## piperunner (Aug 22, 2009)

newbi said:


> Hey guys, I am in my 2nd year of apprenticeship and still fairly new to bending. It was taught in the classroom that bends can be aligned but have different angles or all the bends could have the same angles but different center of bend locations on a rack.
> 
> This makes sense to me because of trigonometry. However, I was told by a journeyman that bends on a rack can have the same center of bend alignments and angles by using the method of spacing+OD of conduit.
> 
> Have any of you done this and if so could you explain it to me ?


Well just a few times yes hes correct some what any conduit any size has a center point of that bend at that angle you pick .

Get some pipe any size bend a 5 deg 10 deg 15 deg 20 deg 30 deg 45 deg 50 deg 60 deg and a 90 deg on the same conduit each deg lay that bent deg on the floor . By the way use the same conduit take it out of the shoe and put it back in each time saves lots of conduit just in case your thinking a new conduit for each added deg.

Now make a straight line down the center from bent end of pipe do the same make a straight line down the pipe from the leg end . Meaning draw a pencil line on the conduit for each bend of deg erase and draw over and over .

These lines cross hair at the center of that pipe your just bent at any angle .


Now what ever size conduit it was record this the length from bent end to were they cross hair . Now this is from collar or the arrow mark on your bending shoe or hand bender your start mark on hand bender 
your collar front edge on your big bender .

Each bender or pipe you use during your time in the trade will be different on small conduit hand benders it doesnt matter that much .
But there not the same so if your serious do it .


Put it in a book for yourself you now have the center of bend from the end of conduit at that angle with no math needed this is the most important thing you need to bend conduit trust me on this . If you want to make money for your company or spend hours doing math think about it. Its production its labor saving and time is money .

When you start a rack you can bend at any angle and use this measurement to add or subtract distance so all your conduits align in order with correct spacing between conduits .

Meaning inside to outside or outside to inside racking if you want to bend conduit and want make it look good every time on every job .

Add coupling length to center mark or add distance of spacing racking out or subtract it when racking inside try it let me know how it goes . :thumbsup:


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## eejack (Jul 14, 2012)

piperunner said:


> Put it in a book for yourself...


I got this advice from an oldtimer nearly 30 years ago. Been bending conduit for all this time with notes out of those books.

Wasting a bit of pipe and a bit of time in the beginning of a job is well worth it in the end.


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## piperunner (Aug 22, 2009)

eejack said:


> I got this advice from an oldtimer nearly 30 years ago. Been bending conduit for all this time with notes out of those books.
> 
> Wasting a bit of pipe and a bit of time in the beginning of a job is well worth it in the end.


Well gee i hope iam posting in the correct topic section maybe this should be a off topic since its going to be just about conduit which any glue sniffing monkey can install or any sand jockey from Florida .



Well at 60 years old i guess we have bent a few sticks and wasted a few funny Greenlee gives formulas they give charts on there benders. Plus there's books out and apps for the cell phones what a joke using a ipod to bend conduit we would run your off our job that day .

Great but we never use them because when we started they didnt have that no battery drills no charts and no internet
when you hit the job and said you could run pipe you better run pipe or you got canned .

If you bend alot of back to backs on big pipe say 2 inch and larger i watch guys use the deduct and fight to bend it up in the air as it rises up .


What we did years ago after running rigid it got a little old so we made our own chart for back to backs on any size 2" to 4".

We bend it back to back not with the full leg up or deduct process but with a set measurement like on 2 inch its 9 5/8" added you add this measurement not the normal deduct when you BB on the 555 SB from back of first 90 to second bend mark put it in add 9 5/8" and bend its done perfect . 

We bend so the second bend rises up and as you bend it you can hold a tape measure on each 90 outside level and paralleled to the floor while the bender is bending .

You stop when you hit the mark or back to back length you measured plus its easy less work and your two 90 stubs are sticking up in front of you like it was installed already and your viewing both 90 's so you can see there lined up plumb with the eyes.

This way its a double check when your level on the conduit straight between 90 's its done plus you can measure with your tape edge to edge of each conduit outside BB while conduit is moving during your bending process this is more accurate then any formula .

Your looking at it level seeing both stubs in front of you while its moving and never a dog leg use three levels during this BB bending process one on each stub one on the straight . We do this because its the right way to install exposed work thats going to be looked at for years trust me its not covered up like they say .

Ive never seen a bender after years of use give you a true 90 deg bend there off by 2 or 3 degrees. This effects offsets or 90 's and once you test it your correction is done for that bender . Now the guys can bend and not waste time with bad pipe.

And you never see my crew with any conduit wasted in the dumpster 
or climbing up and down to take a little out .
I know eejack you have done this finding a spot to unbend what you just bent we all have many times LOL .:laughing::laughing::laughing:




They dont give that out in any chart its some of the things you pick up over time this is our job now just starting no lights in the electrical room yet and my phone cam sucks.
Thats the normal power pull box from hell photo you dont make a mistake cutting its about 800 bucks for the box!
Plus theres tons of conduit under that gear in addition to the overhead lots of fun times.


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## eejack (Jul 14, 2012)

You would be fun to bend pipe with, that is for certain.

I usually use the travel method, I work out what the travel is on bends ( either the ram travel or the pipe ) and bend to that. I almost never get to bend on level ground.

Nineties are the most important bend so I work out that travel with the greatest care and the gain - from there I can do the back to backs pretty much the same way you do them.

Think in the morning in case you drink in the afternoon.


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## piperunner (Aug 22, 2009)

Well we have used a flip top many years ago with the ram wow thats a while back. we still have one of these for 6 inch







785 Greenlee she will take a 20 ft 6 inch rigid pipe and it still bends pipe as the day it was new must be over 40 years old needs 30amp crt .:laughing:

We have a new 6 inch bender big blue but i perfer mother Greenlee it takes 30 minutes to bend a 90 on a 6 inch from set up to finish .


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## newbi (Dec 17, 2011)

Thanks for the replies guys. You have been a great help. I have been working with a jw doing bending rigid pipe for the past 2 weeks for 12 hours today. Today we bent a pipe the had two offsets, a compound 90, and did this without a no dog, just a level and eyeballs. It looked great.


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## eejack (Jul 14, 2012)

newbi said:


> Thanks for the replies guys. You have been a great help. I have been working with a jw doing bending rigid pipe for the past 2 weeks for 12 hours today. Today we bent a pipe the had two offsets, a compound 90, and did this without a no dog, just a level and eyeballs. It looked great.


It sounds like you are having fun - good for you.

FWIW I got my no dog from http://www.no-dog.com/ with my name and local engraved on it - it is a small and simple no dog easily stuck on your hardhat.

However, if you end up needing one and do not have one....keep in mind many of the straps you use can be converted into a flat edge for putting your level on and making a no dog.

For example, a short piece of strut and a strut strap, strapped to the pipe, makes for a nice level landing point.

Keep having fun.


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## newbi (Dec 17, 2011)

Funny thing is, we both have no dog levels.
:thumbsup:


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## 360max (Jun 10, 2011)

newbi said:


> Funny thing is, we both have no dog levels.
> :thumbsup:


yeah, but only one of you (JW) has 'the eye', in time you'll get one


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