# Motor starters with overloads



## Mike52876 (Jun 28, 2012)

I have been doing electrical work for some 20 years, I recently took a job with a large company and the have hundreds of motors and starters. I am lost needing help, i have checked you tube and such but only found bin 95.com. I was a residential/commercial electrician with very little motor control experience which they knew upon hiring me. I am looking for videos explaing motor starters, relays, contactors control wiring. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks


----------



## tates1882 (Sep 3, 2010)

Mike52876 said:


> I have been doing electrical work for some 20 years, I recently took a job with a large company and the have hundreds of motors and starters. I am lost needing help, i have checked you tube and such but only found bin 95.com. I was a residential/commercial electrician with very little motor control experience which they knew upon hiring me. I am looking for videos explaing motor starters, relays, contactors control wiring. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks


Try this book. http://www.licensedelectrician.com/Store/AT/Elec_Mtr_Ctrls.htm


----------



## JRaef (Mar 23, 2009)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2n9YzhWigxE&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lb9ZnQubim4&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u_ZRlmLmbV0&feature=related


Not a video, but there used to be a really good on-line learning center called Kilowatt Classroom. It's gone now, but some of his archives still exist. Here's the one on overload relays and motor starters.

http://educypedia.karadimov.info/library/MotorOL.pdf


----------



## John Valdes (May 17, 2007)

How did you get the job if you are "lost" as you say?
If you have lots of motors and starters, you probably have instrumentation. PLC's and drives.
I hope you can get up to speed asap. We here can try and help as much as possible. But in the end it's experience that trumps everything else.
Experience can even cover up defects regarding the lack of knowledge in a particular discipline.
Just keep in mind that every single one of us had to learn and we all have to keep learning if we are to be successful.
I am retired and I still try my best to keep up. Good Luck and do not hesitate to ask the questions.


----------



## Mike52876 (Jun 28, 2012)

John Valdes said:


> How did you get the job if you are "lost" as you say?
> If you have lots of motors and starters, you probably have instrumentation. PLC's and drives.
> I hope you can get up to speed asap. We here can try and help as much as possible. But in the end it's experience that trumps everything else.
> Experience can even cover up defects regarding the lack of knowledge in a particular discipline.
> ...


Thanks for the reply, i did expect some negative feedback, I should of mentioned that in my interview i told the head of the electrical department that I lacked skills in motors and pkc and such, they told me id be ok and they were here to help me learn.... However, I am not the type to sit back and wait i wanna learn as much as possible, i have just not had the opportunity to get my hands dirty in these items. I do ask questions but like most people they just don't wanna come off any information. Thank you for replying though. I am extremely confident in my electrical skills just not on industrial situations


----------



## Mike52876 (Jun 28, 2012)

JRaef said:


> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2n9YzhWigxE&feature=related
> 
> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Lb9ZnQubim4&feature=related
> 
> ...


Thank you for your reply i looked into it and it looks like an awesome website.. I appreciate it alot.


----------



## Wirenuting (Sep 12, 2010)

Mike52876 said:


> I have been doing electrical work for some 20 years, I recently took a job with a large company and the have hundreds of motors and starters. I am lost needing help, i have checked you tube and such but only found bin 95.com. I was a residential/commercial electrician with very little motor control experience which they knew upon hiring me. I am looking for videos explaing motor starters, relays, contactors control wiring. Any help would be appreciated. Thanks


Here is a Square D wiring book for you. 
Remember that on a motor control, Auto is the complete control process including safeties. 
Hand will normally be only safeties & interlocks. 
It won't take you long to catch on.

Google motor control center wiring diagrams, air handler wiring diagrams and things of that nature. Just to get your feet wet.
The construction book store has some pretty good books also.

Welcome to a great site. 
You will find a lot of bright people here that can normally answer just about everything. 
But remember, they love pictures.


----------



## Open Delta (Apr 17, 2012)

Motor Starters and Contactors are the same thing with the exception that Motor Starters have overload protection and contactors do not.


----------



## John (Jan 22, 2007)

Try to find/buy a copy of "Americian Electricians' Handbook" by Croft Summers


----------



## John Valdes (May 17, 2007)

Open Delta said:


> Motor Starters and Contactors are the same thing with the exception that Motor Starters have overload protection and contactors do not.


Lets not confuse him any more than we have to.
You are right, motor starters and contactors are exactly the same thing. But, you can easily use a OL relay with either of the two. 
OL relays can be mounted remotely as well as piggy backed (same brand, style and size) to any contactor/starter.


----------



## Mike52876 (Jun 28, 2012)

I have contacted bin 95. I am supposed to have someone calling me and sending me some information. Thank you for all your help


----------



## jstrick2 (Jun 29, 2012)

You should hunt through manufacturer websites. Specifically the ones you will have to deal with obviously, but their websites have very good documentation on how everything works and how its laid out.

http://cmsapps.sea.siemens.com/controls/speedfax07/07Speedfax_pdfs/07Speedfax_15/15_02-05.pdf

Just an example above.

Same thing goes for motors.


----------



## heavysparky (Jun 2, 2009)

WOW. You took a job damn well knowing that you had to have knowledge of motors and controls. Yet you have none


----------



## hardworkingstiff (Jan 22, 2007)

heavysparky said:


> WOW. You took a job damn well knowing that you had to have knowledge of motors and controls. Yet you have none


I think you have this backwards, you should be saying to the employer "damn, you hired a guy that told you he didn't have a lot of experience in motors and controls?". 

Actually, if you think about it, even with motor controls you still need to run conduit and pull wire. You don't need a lot of motor experience to do this. Someone can instruct you and cut you loose. Maybe, the employer needs someone with good construction skills. He might have plenty of prima donna motor control guys and is looking for a good "construction" guy. Maybe he needs someone with a good attitude and figures he can teach him the rest.

Congrats to the OP. Keep your good attitude and don't listen to the naysayers. You will do just fine, your new boss heard you and doesn't expect you to perform above your level. He is probably going to give you opportunities to learn that you didn't have before. Embrace them, learn, give it all you have and I bet it's a win/win for you and your boss.


----------



## ohiosparky99 (Nov 12, 2009)

heavysparky said:


> WOW. You took a job damn well knowing that you had to have knowledge of motors and controls. Yet you have none


He told them he had no experience, they said they would hire him and help him learn, therefor it's on them, if I was looking for a job and they said they would hire me without the experience needed, I'd take it too.


----------



## WarAdmiral (Jul 13, 2012)

Everyone that has MC experience has been given a chance to learn it from someone else. You have been give the opportunity to learn it. What you have to keep in your head is do not over react. A Motor does what? How do you get them to do what you want them to do? I would suggest you spend the week examine each motor. Look how they are wired draw a print from each one. This will be a start. Scroll up someone left you a like to a bookstore. Buy the book, and read your code book. Have no fear just a positive additude and sense and you will do fine.


----------



## heavysparky (Jun 2, 2009)

check out siemens. they have a series of books and workbooks


----------



## heavysparky (Jun 2, 2009)

ohiosparky99 said:


> He told them he had no experience, they said they would hire him and help him learn, therefor it's on them, if I was looking for a job and they said they would hire me without the experience needed, I'd take it too.


See I wouldn't take the job. I wouldn't want to get blamed for longer then normal down times. Since I would be lacking the experience to troubleshoot the problem. But that is just me


----------



## ohiosparky99 (Nov 12, 2009)

heavysparky said:


> See I wouldn't take the job. I wouldn't want to get blamed for longer then normal down times. Since I would be lacking the experience to troubleshoot the problem. But that is just me


If a employer is willing to pay to train you, you better believe I'm all for it


----------



## Mike52876 (Jun 28, 2012)

hardworkingstiff said:


> I think you have this backwards, you should be saying to the employer "damn, you hired a guy that told you he didn't have a lot of experience in motors and controls?".
> 
> Actually, if you think about it, even with motor controls you still need to run conduit and pull wire. You don't need a lot of motor experience to do this. Someone can instruct you and cut you loose. Maybe, the employer needs someone with good construction skills. He might have plenty of prima donna motor control guys and is looking for a good "construction" guy. Maybe he needs someone with a good attitude and figures he can teach him the rest.
> 
> Congrats to the OP. Keep your good attitude and don't listen to the naysayers. You will do just fine, your new boss heard you and doesn't expect you to perform above your level. He is probably going to give you opportunities to learn that you didn't have before. Embrace them, learn, give it all you have and I bet it's a win/win for you and your boss.


Thanks for your input, its all good. I am a strong conduit runner and terminator, just lack the industrial side of schematics and starter buckets... Its all good though I had some real good guys take me under their wing. As far as downtime like you mentioned we work in pairs 2 electricians at a time. So one of knows what we doing at least. Thank you all for the encouraging words.


----------



## jstrick2 (Jun 29, 2012)

heavysparky said:


> See I wouldn't take the job. I wouldn't want to get blamed for longer then normal down times. Since I would be lacking the experience to troubleshoot the problem. But that is just me


 
So if you only take jobs that you know how to tackle, how does one start initially?

Or do you just stare at clouds?


----------



## Mike52876 (Jun 28, 2012)

jstrick2 said:


> So if you only take jobs that you know how to tackle, how does one start initially?
> 
> Or do you just stare at clouds?


That's funny... Apparently he just knows everything... I can be honest and say when I don't know something... Clouds... Funny as hell


----------



## Tsmil (Jul 17, 2011)

Sounds like you have a decent employer willing to give you the time to learn. 
You have been given some great advice along with links to study material. Take it one step further and set up a test bench and practice what you are reading about. Actually seeing how a contactor works and 2 wire and 3 wire controls. Adding and building for more complicated controls. Reading is one thing but to see it is another. Hands on experience will take you a long way. And get your work partner to help you over the areas you have trouble with.


----------



## Mike52876 (Jun 28, 2012)

So I've been at my job over a year now... Ive learned alot about motors and such. Now starting to learn about controls and plc's. Has anyone used any training software for industrial applications such as motor starters plc's. I've looked at bin 95. Com. But its pretty expensive however if it is as good as they say it may be worth it. Just wondering if anyone has bought it and used it. Thanks for all your advice and constructive criticism.


----------



## John Valdes (May 17, 2007)

Mike52876 said:


> So I've been at my job over a year now... Ive learned alot about motors and such. Now starting to learn about controls and plc's. Has anyone used any training software for industrial applications such as motor starters plc's. I've looked at bin 95. Com. But its pretty expensive however if it is as good as they say it may be worth it. Just wondering if anyone has bought it and used it. Thanks for all your advice and constructive criticism.


I have been in your shoes before. The learning is just starting. 

Here's my personal advice. It's old school because when I was young, we had no internet.

Find the guy at work that does know what he is doing. By now, you should have a good idea who the guy is.
Try and stay with him and ask him for help. Offer to help him every time you think he could use some.
Once you have built trust, the rest comes easier.

You are going to meet plenty great guys. Smart ****ers.
These are the dudes you want to be with and emulate.

I trouble shot equipment for years and got very good at it. I became the go to guy in that facility.

At another facility I met a guy from the Navy. Smart. Knew his ****.
Could care less about the code. Did not know the code.
But he could design any system or application you could throw at him.

I was given the task of wiring a bale press once with professional drawn prints.
I accomplished it and thought I was doing great. Great until I was asked to come up with a scheme for a machine.
To draw it, to build the control panel, to do all the conduit work and all the wire pulling and disconnects. All of it.

Had I not been trained by this ex -Navy guy, I would have been lost.
He was not physically with me, when I was doing this project. But he was there is a certain way.
When I got swimmy headed, I just thought about what he would have done and how he would have approached the issue.

I was successful and went on to design and implement many many projects over the years.
This is my story. Make your own. You can do it. :thumbsup:


----------



## Michigan Master (Feb 25, 2013)

Mike52876 said:


> So I've been at my job over a year now... Ive learned alot about motors and such. Now starting to learn about controls and plc's. Has anyone used any training software for industrial applications such as motor starters plc's. I've looked at bin 95. Com. But its pretty expensive however if it is as good as they say it may be worth it. Just wondering if anyone has bought it and used it. Thanks for all your advice and constructive criticism.


I took several PLC classes at the local community college and learned most everything else on the job; however, if you don't get a lot of exposure it will take a while and be more difficult to retain.

I know several journeymen who created "trainer boards" (or rather directed their apprentices to build them). They consisted of an old PLC, a variety of different types of switches (momentary, maintained, normally open, normally open held closed, normally closed, etc.) and some relays and lights for outputs. Some of the trainer boards I've seen were pretty elaborate.

They could then tell the apprentice to write a PLC program to do xxx... Once accomplished, they could then "break" the trainer and have the apprentice troubleshoot it. Then have them modify the program to do yyy or add more components... Can be a really good training tool if properly administered or done by a motivated individual.

Also, a lot of the PLC programs have tutorials and help guides that can be very beneficial when trying to teach yourself something.


----------



## Introyble (Jul 10, 2010)

Open Delta said:


> Motor Starters and Contactors are the same thing with the exception that Motor Starters have overload protection and contactors do not.


:blink:


----------



## Brian971 (Nov 7, 2012)

*Link to Siemens Quick Step training material*

Below is a link to some Siemens training material, can either watch online or download a pdf of lessons.

http://www.industry.usa.siemens.com/topics/us/en/archivedsites/quickstep/pages/default.aspx


----------



## Safari (Jul 9, 2013)

Brian971 said:


> Below is a link to some Siemens training material, can either watch online or download a pdf of lessons.
> 
> http://www.industry.usa.siemens.com/topics/us/en/archivedsites/quickstep/pages/default.aspx


hey you guys have been good to the thread starter keep it up.i feel sorry for others who have posted something similar and the replies they got literally kicked them out of this forum:laughing::laughing:


----------

