# Home Builders and WiFi



## Wired4Life10 (Jul 9, 2011)

I'm just curious to know how many of you work with home builders or any type of GC on the residential side that don't care if there are direct ethernet runs anymore and say "well they say everything will be wireless in a year anyway". I've explained to him that while wireless is very prominent, it is still a luxury and should only be used continuously for mobile devices and laptops. I've finally convinced him to let me run direct ethernet to the home office and any TV locations in the home so that smart TVs, Denon receivers with AirPlay, and other web enabled devices can directly connect but he still isn't fond of putting Cat6 throughout the home due to costs and most HO think the same way. I've begun to just price it in my budget and do it as part of the communications wiring package for each home


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## backstay (Feb 3, 2011)

I wire, they pound nails. When they start to listen to me telling them where the 2x4 go, I will listen them telling where the wires go.


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## The_Modifier (Oct 24, 2009)

Wired4Life10 said:


> "well they say everything will be wireless in a year anyway".


Really? It's been around for almost a decade, and I can tell you that it won't ever replace the hardwired solid connection. And it's kind of harder to hack into from the street.:thumbsup: 

The really odd thing is that they would rather dump the money into the wifi add on pieces for equipment. I never could figure that out. Maybe I'm to young for this LOL


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## administr8tor (Mar 6, 2010)

Why cat6?


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## Going_Commando (Oct 1, 2011)

administr8tor said:


> Why cat6?


Higher transfer speeds than Cat5e.


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## mikeh32 (Feb 16, 2009)

while wireless is huge, its not the future. 

the speeds people want, are not achievable through wireless.


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## Stuff (Oct 14, 2012)

administr8tor said:


> Why cat6?


Planning for the future? Very few need it to run 10 gb/s in a home today.
Cat 6a also handles slightly higher PoE loads. Something like 51 watts.


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## Wired4Life10 (Jul 9, 2011)

The_Modifier said:


> The really odd thing is that they would rather dump the money into the wifi add on pieces for equipment. I never could figure that out. Maybe I'm to young for this LOL


Exactly. I had a lady a while back that didn't get the option to run ethernet and she spent $59.99/device for those little Netgear wireless bridge adapters and $129.99 for a PowerLine AV kit for the home theater rather than just spending $32/cable and having more locations for possible devices in the future.

Side note: We normally charge more than $32/cable but with our houses that we run every LV cable, we package it together as a bundle and that's what the ethernet usually comes out to.


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## Wired4Life10 (Jul 9, 2011)

administr8tor said:


> Why cat6?


Future proofing. Kind of like guys who put in Cat5 for phone lines 10 years ago rather than using Cat3. You have to think about there being a good chance this stuff could potentially be in the walls for the next 25 years and people still trying to use it if fiber hasn't completely dominated by then. In that case, wouldn't you like your name to be on something that has a lasting potential?


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## Ty Wrapp (Aug 24, 2011)

90% of the houses I work in are high end . The houses are completely wired with Cat5 for phone and ethernet, and coax for TV. Once I hook up service they are good to go. Occasionally I will have to correct the teriminations. Any wire that I install is Cat5.


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## Going_Commando (Oct 1, 2011)

Stuff said:


> Planning for the future? Very few need it to run 10 gb/s in a home today.
> Cat 6a also handles slightly higher PoE loads. Something like 51 watts.


That is also a major plus to the newer variations of Cat6. Going forward, we are going to see more and more devices that are PoE (power over ethernet), plus the speeds are awesome. My desktop is hard wired, and after going through 2 routers, my internet speed is still 80+ mb/s off a 100mb/s feed from Charter. My laptop on wireless sits are more around 30 mb/s. I need that speed for my **** and netflix. :laughing:


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## Wired4Life10 (Jul 9, 2011)

Going_Commando said:


> That is also a major plus to the newer variations of Cat6. Going forward, we are going to see more and more devices that are PoE (power over ethernet), plus the speeds are awesome. My desktop is hard wired, and after going through 2 routers, my internet speed is still 80+ mb/s off a 100mb/s feed from Charter. My laptop on wireless sits are more around 30 mb/s. I need that speed for my **** and netflix. :laughing:


Why two routers? You're not double nat-ing are you?


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## Going_Commando (Oct 1, 2011)

Wired4Life10 said:


> Why two routers? You're not double nat-ing are you?


I recounted, and we have 1 main router running Smoothwall, a switch, a wireless access point, and 2 routers acting as wireless access points. The WAP and 1 router are on 2.4ghz sharing SSIDs, tapped off the switch with the 5ghz router, and the smoothwall does all the DHCP licensing and such. My roommates are real geeks, so I may have some of the terminology mixed up, but that is the gist of it. :nerd:


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## Wired4Life10 (Jul 9, 2011)

Ok as long as DHCP, DNS, and firewall are turned off on any routers behind the main one. I run a similar situation at the office.


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## Wired4Life10 (Jul 9, 2011)

While we are on the subject of wifi, does anyone have a good recommendation for a clean looking access point that would fit into a double gang box? I had considered something from Luxul but at $700 retail and about $400 wholesale, I would like to see if there are any other items that people would recommend. PoE is a must.


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## Going_Commando (Oct 1, 2011)

Wired4Life10 said:


> Ok as long as DHCP, DNS, and firewall are turned off on any routers behind the main one. I run a similar situation at the office.


Everything is done right. My roommates both have experience doing business networks, and tons of home networks, so I'm not worried about it. When it stops working I power cycle it, and if that doesn't work I just call one of them. Easier that way.


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## Holt (Jun 20, 2011)

administr8tor said:


> Why cat6?


Because it all going to be cat6 in a year :whistling2:


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## FlyingSparks (Dec 10, 2012)

Stuff said:


> Planning for the future? Very few need it to run 10 gb/s in a home today.
> Cat 6a also handles slightly higher PoE loads. Something like 51 watts.


Do realize gigabit networks will eventually become what we refer to as 'slow.' Also it's rated for 10 gbps not 10 gb/s. 10gbps is more like 1.250 gb/s.


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## FlyingSparks (Dec 10, 2012)

Remember

8 bits = 1 byte

Mbps = megaBITS per second
MB / s = megaBYTES per second

To convert divide by 8 or multiply by 8 depending on the conversion direction. Capital B is byte, lower b is bit.


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## Stuff (Oct 14, 2012)

I just hate typing gbps as too many unrelated characters. I had to put a space and everything fell apart. 

On another note we used to be told that structured wiring had a life span of 10 years. Never could figure out how the cabling could wear out. Now CommScope is pushing their 20 year warranty. Wondering what kind of wiring will be used in 20 years.


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## Ty Wrapp (Aug 24, 2011)

Stuff said:


> On another note we used to be told that structured wiring had a life span of 10 years. Never could figure out how the cabling could wear out. wiring .


The wire does not wear out...technology changes!


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## jeffmoss26 (Dec 8, 2011)

Thank you! ^^


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## UncleMike (Jan 2, 2013)

Ty Wrapp said:


> The wire does not wear out...technology changes!


Yeah, technology changes, but just because something new is available/popular doesn't mean the previous generation stuff is unusable. I ran Cat5 (not 5e) in my house 16 years ago, and I'm running gigabit ethernet over it today. Of course most of the runs are relatively short when compared to specs, so that helps, but a lot of it has to do with quality materials and workmanship :icon_cheesygrin:


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## Peewee0413 (Oct 18, 2012)

Might be a little more than a year but wireless is something else. I have wi-power internet. Chose them for their future. They're not fancy yet, but the potential is there. As for now wifi can be labeled as convenient, not completely efficient.


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## BBQ (Nov 16, 2010)

mikeh32 said:


> while wireless is huge, its not the future.
> 
> the speeds people want, are not achievable through wireless.


The speeds people want? Who are these people?

Forget about yourself and your techno geek friends. All average people want is it to work. No average homeowner is having data speed wars with their neighbors. 

6e in a home, yeah that is needed. 

I will put money that wireless in the home is the future, it is easy, it is convenient and with all the mobile devices in a home now it makes sense.


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## dowmace (Jan 16, 2008)

BBQ said:


> The speeds people want? Who are these people?
> 
> Forget about yourself and your techno geek friends. All average people want is it to work. No average homeowner is having data speed wars with their neighbors.
> 
> ...


The generation about to graduate high school fully expects 10mbit download no matter where they are. It's a byproduct of hspa+ and lte on our phones being so fast now.


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## BBQ (Nov 16, 2010)

dowmace said:


> The generation about to graduate high school fully expects 10mbit download no matter where they are. It's a byproduct of hspa+ and lte on our phones being so fast now.


As you pretty much say, they are used to wireless. 

They will expect wireless


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## Peewee0413 (Oct 18, 2012)

I think so.


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## Peewee0413 (Oct 18, 2012)

UncleMike said:


> Yeah, technology changes, but just because something new is available/popular doesn't mean the previous generation stuff is unusable.


Unusable and undesired is two different things. U want my old non color having nokia phone from 13 yrs ago, that has the game snake on it? Didn't think so. Same goes with the rest of technology . Old is boring new is better/more capable....


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## Ty Wrapp (Aug 24, 2011)

UncleMike said:


> Yeah, technology changes, but just because something new is available/popular doesn't mean the previous generation stuff is unusable. :icon_cheesygrin:


I agree. 20 years ago fiber was the latest and greatest. But wait, they found out that there was a lot more that could be accomplished with twisted pair copper for a lower price. Fiber is now becoming more main stream. From what I see, wireless rules the residential market where as wired still dominates the business class.


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