# Identification 3 phase Wye or Delta ?



## John

turnNburn1x said:


> I need help badly. I need to i.d. my power supply type. so I can order the proper step up transformer. My machine is configured for 460v or 575v @ 30amps. I will have an electrician do the work , just needed to know what step up to order. Any help would be a God send at this time. I am in dire straights and need to be working but cant open the doors until I havee everything in working order. Just a humble beginning, dirt floor shop for now.
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> Actual reading on voltage meter at box: (L1-120v / L2-120v / L3-213v) Looks to be a 4-wire configuration with one wire being a neutral. Dont know if its delta or wye????


OK since nobody else is going to....
What is the make and model of the machine tool. We need more information.

It would be best if you call an electrician. There are a lot that don't have a lot of work. so you should be able to find one easily.


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## turnNburn1x

John said:


> OK since nobody else is going to....
> What is the make and model of the machine tool. We need more information.
> 
> It would be best if you call an electrician. There are a lot that don't have a lot of work. so you should be able to find one easily.


No problem, I have got to gett an electrician to install and wire, but where I live there aren't any qualified on 3-phase. Ive tried. I am going to find in Macon Ga. which is 80mi away, but wanted to have everything ready so as to handle in one trip.

No problem, I appreciate it anyway. Live in a small town and don't have much money. Ive had machines for two months now and getting desperate for help..... I'll just have to wait alittle longer until I can find one comfortable with 3-phase.

Just in case: Miller CP-300, Serial# JH202536, Miller Welds has a resourse that allows the use of pdf owners manul down load for info..... if needed let me know and I'll get it for you. Thanks, GT.


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## John

when you call the electrician it would help to have the make, model and any other information about the machines to help him get you up and running faster.


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## turnNburn1x

*Got it, Thanks*



John said:


> when you call the electrician it would help to have the make, model and any other information about the machines to help him get you up and running faster.


4-wire closed delta, 120 / 120 / 208 / Nue. Now the manufacturer of step up transformer can make a quote on price. :thumbup: This site rocks!!!:thumbsup:


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## randas

Give your electrician the details and let him order it, chances are he will get a better price than you


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## stars13bars2

turnNburn1x said:


> 4-wire closed delta, 120 / 120 / 208 / Nue. Now the manufacturer of step up transformer can make a quote on price. :thumbup: This site rocks!!!:thumbsup:


What is a four wire closed delta? I would bet on a four wire open delta. Go look at your pole that serves you and see how many transformers are on it. Let us know how many. I would think two, with one larger than the other.


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## 10492

turnNburn1x said:


> No problem, I have got to gett an electrician to install and wire, but where I live there aren't any qualified on 3-phase. Ive tried. I am going to find in Macon Ga. which is 80mi away, but wanted to have everything ready so as to handle in one trip.


 
Send me a big enough retainer, and I'll be on the next plane.


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## stars13bars2

Dnkldorf said:


> Send me a big enough retainer, and I'll be on the next plane.


 
I can be there quicker, and am running recession specials right now!


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## 10492

stars13bars2 said:


> I can be there quicker, and am running recession specials right now!


 
Low balling Hack.


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## stars13bars2

I'll get the change order once I get the job.


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## micromind

It's a delta system for sure, but it doesn't matter if it's open or closed.

The transformer will see phase to phase voltages, it doesn't care how it's supplied or what the voltage to neutral/ground is. 

The transformer you need will be 3 phase, and have a 240 volt delta primary. The secondary can be either wye or delta, if it were up to me, I'd opt for the wye. that way XO can be grounded and result in less voltage phase to ground than a delta would. 

I cannot help but wonder though, this welder is easily connectable to operate on 240 volts 3 phase. Why would you want a transformer? It seems to me that it'd be much simpler and a LOT less expensive to simply connect the welder for 240. 

The welder doesn't care whether it runs on 208, 240, 480, or 575. It doesn't care if the supply is a wye, a closed delta or an open delta. All it cares about is if the voltage is the same as the taps inside are connected for, and that the phase balance is somewhat reasonable. 

If I remember right, these welders have a terminal strip on the side where the power goes in, and several jumpers to re-arrange for the various voltages. Easy to change.

Rob


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## Southeast Power

stars13bars2 said:


> What is a four wire closed delta? I would bet on a four wire open delta. Go look at your pole that serves you and see how many transformers are on it. Let us know how many. I would think two, with one larger than the other.


It doesn't really if its an open or closed Delta.
Its just a Delta configuration.


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## turnNburn1x

micromind said:


> It's a delta system for sure, but it doesn't matter if it's open or closed.
> 
> The transformer will see phase to phase voltages, it doesn't care how it's supplied or what the voltage to neutral/ground is.
> 
> The transformer you need will be 3 phase, and have a 240 volt delta primary. The secondary can be either wye or delta, if it were up to me, I'd opt for the wye. that way XO can be grounded and result in less voltage phase to ground than a delta would.
> 
> I cannot help but wonder though, this welder is easily connectable to operate on 240 volts 3 phase. Why would you want a transformer? It seems to me that it'd be much simpler and a LOT less expensive to simply connect the welder for 240.
> 
> The welder doesn't care whether it runs on 208, 240, 480, or 575. It doesn't care if the supply is a wye, a closed delta or an open delta. All it cares about is if the voltage is the same as the taps inside are connected for, and that the phase balance is somewhat reasonable.
> 
> If I remember right, these welders have a terminal strip on the side where the power goes in, and several jumpers to re-arrange for the various voltages. Easy to change.
> 
> Rob


 
First of all thank you for your help, this machine was bought at auction from a liquidator in Canada, not surre if that means it was special ordered for those two voltages or not but 460v and 575v are the only two options jumpered on the terminal strip. I wish there was a way that would allow the use of what I have instead of having to buy a step up transformer. My electrician here says he doesn't have access to them anymore, not sure why, but he didn't bother to tell me if it was wye or delta, and I didnt know I would need that info either. Not until I started to look around for the transformer. Now I know and my electrician is out of town on a job comming home every other weekend. New coal burner job, but as soon as I get everything in order he's gonna hook me up on the first available weekend.

My Syncrowave 250 is single phase and the available jumpers are: 230 / 460 / 575. It came from the same liquidator. In use at a company in Canada also.


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