# Service disconnects



## WronGun (Oct 18, 2013)

Do they still apply for commercial retail buildings ?

I’ve noticed so many commercial spaces without disconnects and the panel is over 8’ away.

I’m getting ready to do my first 3 Ph commercial service , so now I’m buried back in the code book, blue book and computer .... 


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## RePhase277 (Feb 5, 2008)

Yes, but it will depend on your POCO rules mostly. The rules are the same in the code for the most part between residential and commercial service disconnects.


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## Drsparky14 (Oct 22, 2016)

Conduit on the outside of the building helps with the 6' rule. 


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## RePhase277 (Feb 5, 2008)

Drsparky14 said:


> Conduit on the outside of the building helps with the 6' rule.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


What is this 6' rule you speak of?


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

8 foot, 6 foot, 3 stud cavities, etc.

Many areas actually give a distance that the service disconnect can be from where it enters the structure, while the NEC doesn't.


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## WronGun (Oct 18, 2013)

I figured same rule applied , will have to see about a bypass


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## cdslotz (Jun 10, 2008)

HackWork said:


> 8 foot, 6 foot, 3 stud cavities, etc.
> 
> Many areas actually give a distance that the service disconnect can be from where it enters the structure, while the NEC doesn't.


True....you need to check your local ordinance.
Also, you local ahj may require service disconnects on the outside for fire dept access


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## WronGun (Oct 18, 2013)

Mine as well add some photos. 

Panel 10-12’ away

Pole where feeds are coming from is leaning on the building 

Prior fire , retail spot rebuild


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

Wow, you found one of chicken Steve's services!


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## WronGun (Oct 18, 2013)

It only took a month for utility to remove their damn lines from the mast 

No damage to the service from fire , but utility will not reconnect without a rebuild .... understandably 

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## frenchelectrican (Mar 15, 2007)

The disconnecting that depending on your local codes if they do required or not and I think most small commercial building most case under 200 amp both single and three phase typically dont put a disconnect switch on there very often unless you are going more than 6 feet inside of building then yes you have to add a disconnection switch..

But for 480 volt network system it is automatic required disconnect switch outdoor location reguardless of size.,, 


I can see one service is single phase and look like other one is three phase there if latter just becarefull some can have wicked delta system so be aware of it.
( look like it have pole top CT there so just becarefull with it. )


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## sbrn33 (Mar 15, 2007)

WronGun said:


> Mine as well add some photos.
> 
> Panel 10-12’ away
> 
> ...


Not to be a **** but what do those pics have to do with the original question?


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## Cow (Jan 16, 2008)

Looks good, can't see why anyone would think that'd need to be upgraded??


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## WronGun (Oct 18, 2013)

sbrn33 said:


> Not to be a **** but what do those pics have to do with the original question?




Nothing directly , but the question is regarding this service...I like pictures myself and wouldn’t mind seeing more pics in regards to posts, that’s just me though..

And since this is my first commercial service like stated , maybe someone may see something I’m missing , like French pointed out


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## WronGun (Oct 18, 2013)

frenchelectrican said:


> The disconnecting that depending on your local codes if they do required or not and I think most small commercial building most case under 200 amp both single and three phase typically dont put a disconnect switch on there very often unless you are going more than 6 feet inside of building then yes you have to add a disconnection switch..
> 
> But for 480 volt network system it is automatic required disconnect switch outdoor location reguardless of size.,,
> 
> ...




Not sure I understand .. what do you mean by be careful with it? Im not familiar with CT Installs


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## backstay (Feb 3, 2011)

I don't see any CTs. An open CT's voltage will rise until failure.


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## frenchelectrican (Mar 15, 2007)

WronGun said:


> Not sure I understand .. what do you mean by be careful with it? Im not familiar with CT Installs
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Ahh ok the CT mean current transformer 

the reason why I say becarefull due some CT system the service entrance conductors can be wired directally to the main breaker and the ct meter is used .

There is a major golden rules you will have to remember when anytime you work on the CT system is that you have to shunt them if you going do anything with CT core or metering itself due if you ever get those CT meter or core open the voltage will go very high level and can do some damage there espcally if any loads is on that circuit. 

I know it may get you off guard but you will learn very quickly on that. 

and that photo you provided there is a 2 or 3 inch conduit on the pole going down to the building and there is a smaller conduit I think either a inch or inch and quarter that is typically a CT metering so make sure you look up there is a CT core up the top of pole., if so that will change the game a little so just be aware of it. 

I dont know which POCO you are using in your area but make sure you are up to the speed with their regulations so just in case something do come up pretty fast.


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## frenchelectrican (Mar 15, 2007)

backstay said:


> I don't see any CTs. An open CT's voltage will rise until failure.


True but hard to see due the leaves are blocking a nice view for us .,,  just hurry up with fall season lol .,,


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## WronGun (Oct 18, 2013)

frenchelectrican said:


> Ahh ok the CT mean current transformer
> 
> 
> 
> ...




I see what your saying , so the pole that’s leaning on the building has main feeds coming in towards back of the building and from there it also jumps to the building Next door 

From this pole the only thing that comes to the building I’m working on is a 4 wire 


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## WronGun (Oct 18, 2013)

You bet I have another one









You can see the lines going towards the left which serve my meter 

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## frenchelectrican (Mar 15, 2007)

WronGun said:


> I see what your saying , so the pole that’s leaning on the building has main feeds coming in towards back of the building and from there it also jumps to the building Next door
> 
> From this pole the only thing that comes to the building I’m working on is a 4 wire
> 
> ...


Ahh ok sound like 4 wire delta but make sure you spot the pigs sitting on the pole if you can see it to make sure you got delta or wye system ( but more likey you will snag a delta system )


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## backstay (Feb 3, 2011)

You don't have CTs on that pole.


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## frenchelectrican (Mar 15, 2007)

backstay said:


> You don't have CTs on that pole.


I switched over to the computer so I can see it closer and ya there none there on the pole top and ya are safe there WronGun.,, :thumbsup:


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## WronGun (Oct 18, 2013)

I’ve never seen this though 

Why are the feeds coming from the next buildings meters banks and not from the pole

Forget it , they are just tapped ....
Obviously , not used to commercial setups 

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## frenchelectrican (Mar 15, 2007)

WronGun said:


> I’ve never seen this though
> 
> Why are the feeds coming from the next buildings meters banks and not from the pole
> 
> ...


The simple reason is keep the service drops or laterals riser to minuim so it easier to group a bunch of meter at one location than try to spit out so many service drops or lateral risers.

Some POCO have specific reason for that.


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