# Labor Day 2019 Are we still fighting for working people



## MTW (Aug 28, 2013)

I celebrate labor day every year by working. Labor day is a joke. It's the labor movement in the United States that's largely responsible for destroying this country's once powerful manufacturing base. All a working person has to do is show up, do their job and collect a paycheck. They have no risk and no skin in the game. On the other hand, it's the entrepreneurs that actually should be celebrated because they take enormous risk and liability and often don't make as much money as their employees do, particularly if a small business. 

As for your nonsensical question, the "living wage" concept is purely socialist. It's akin to McDonald's workers demanding $15 per hour. The cost of labor is driven by the free market, aka supply and demand. All of us electrician hourly workers should make $70 an hour or more for our skills, right? That would be great, but it's unrealistic because the market won't bear that kind of price. But a socialist like you would be glad to have the government force employers to pay a "living wage", wouldn't you?


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## Southeast Power (Jan 18, 2009)

MTW said:


> I celebrate labor day every year by working. Labor day is a joke. It's the labor movement in the United States that's largely responsible for destroying this country's once powerful manufacturing base. All a working person has to do is show up, do their job and collect a paycheck. They have no risk and no skin in the game. On the other hand, it's the entrepreneurs that actually should be celebrated because they take enormous risk and liability and often don't make as much money as their employees do, particularly if a small business.
> 
> As for your nonsensical question, the "living wage" concept is purely socialist. It's akin to McDonald's workers demanding $15 per hour. The cost of labor is driven by the free market, aka supply and demand. All of us electrician hourly workers should make $70 an hour or more for our skills, right? That would be great, but it's unrealistic because the market won't bear that kind of price. But a socialist like you would be glad to have the government force employers to pay a "living wage", wouldn't you?


Sir. You are the problem and your own worst enemy. :vs_cry::drink:

Labor Day is to honor those that have sacrificed so that we can have a decent workweek and for us union folks a decent pension and healthcare. 

Why are people vilified for wanting to better themselves?


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## Southeast Power (Jan 18, 2009)

I constantly compete for work against contractors that refuse to pay a living wage and any kind of benefits. 

*The people that work for these jerks have been conditioned *to believe they are "greedy" to even desire a living wage and healthcare or any kind of pension.


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## MechanicalDVR (Dec 29, 2007)

Labor day is a funny thing in my family. 

Rumor has it that a distant relative started it, but which one?:

Some records show that Peter J. McGuire, general secretary of the Brotherhood of Carpenters and Joiners and a co-founder of the American Federation of Labor, was first in suggesting a day to honor those "who from rude nature have delved and carved all the grandeur we behold."

But Peter McGuire's place in Labor Day history has not gone unchallenged. Many believe that Matthew Maguire, a machinist, not Peter McGuire, founded the holiday. Recent research seems to support the contention that Matthew Maguire, later the secretary of Local 344 of the International Association of Machinists in Paterson, N.J., proposed the holiday in 1882 while serving as secretary of the Central Labor Union in New York.


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## Fist of lightning (Aug 15, 2019)

Southeast Power said:


> Labor Day is to honor those that have sacrificed so that we can have a decent workweek and for us union folks a decent pension and healthcare.
> 
> Why are people vilified for wanting to better themselves?
> 
> ...


Happy Labor Day brothers

I feel that the need for unions during present day is just as necessary during the time of industrial revolution with the men in the steel mills and bad conditions all over the work place .

It’s becoming the norm for ceos and corporations to make billions in profits and bonuses , while they sit in meetings talking about how they can trim the fat by taking the workers pensions and retirement and sending more and more jobs over seas .it seems like the GAp between the rish and the middle class is greater and greater. Jobs that offer good benies and retirement is hard to come by .

In the pri sector in my experience it’s extremely hard to find someone that is willing to pay high wages and retirement plans , being at the bosses mercy on when I should get a rasie and how little he will give .

Not shure why the contractors never really would offer retirement but it was very hard to come by . 

Things really only changed for me when I was able to break through and get into the union . And the bright future it gives , this opertunity has changed my life and I’m very thank full for unions and the ibew .

So this Labor Day I will give a thanks to the men that died to give us unions and better wages working conditions and have given us collective bargaining where we can continue to fight for good wages and retirement and provide a good life for us and our family’s .


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## Fist of lightning (Aug 15, 2019)

Southeast Power said:


> I constantly compete for work against contractors that refuse to pay a living wage and any kind of benefits.
> 
> *The people that work for these jerks have been conditioned *to believe they are "greedy" to even desire a living wage and healthcare or any kind of pension.


I agree when I worked for those contractors they would laugh when I would mention benefits or retirement,


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## FishinElectrcian (Jul 18, 2019)

Ah yes the most sacred of all holidays for those that are or have been brothers and sisters. 

I hope we're still fighting out there, more than ever we need strength within our ranks to fight those that would try to pay less, hire the unqualified with minimal, barely qualified supervision. One 3rd year and 4 helpers meets the ratio right? It feels like it's been going backwards for a while and these companies are clawing back all that they can.

It sounds kinda scary down there as far as licensing and qualification of people that are supposedly electricians. I didn't know that was still an issue.

The union started apprenticeship programs, before that there was nothing... to ensure that workers had a minimum amount of training and to ensure that their workers were a "guaranteed product" with a skillset to get things done properly and safely. Not to mention quality of life for workers. 

There's a lot of misconceptions in the non union side about unions. If you have never been part of it or worked with a good "salt" you just assume all the worst stereotypes are true. 

It breaks my heart when I would be on a union job, especially one of the rare ones in town and a guy will be dragging his ass... and then be working on a non union job and there's the same guy running around like an idiot so he doesn't get fired. Few years after that the nice in town job disappeared when the company shut down. 

Best guys I ever worked with are union... And the worst guys I've ever worked with are union. 

I'm trained as a steward, was a union organizer, and a salt. I'm running my own shop now but I still tell the young guys about my positive experiences with the union and today especially I remember it fondly.


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## MechanicalDVR (Dec 29, 2007)

From my seat it seems there is one party fighting hardest for those that don't work, the ones that just walk over the border and get everything handed to them.....medical care, college educations, housing, and every other welfare program available.....and all just for votes...


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## Fist of lightning (Aug 15, 2019)

MTW said:


> I celebrate labor day every year by working. Labor day is a joke. It's the labor movement in the United States that's largely responsible for destroying this country's once powerful manufacturing base. All a working person has to do is show up, do their job and collect a paycheck. They have no risk and no skin in the game. On the other hand, it's the entrepreneurs that actually should be celebrated because they take enormous risk and liability and often don't make as much money as their employees do, particularly if a small business.
> 
> As for your nonsensical question, the "living wage" concept is purely socialist. It's akin to McDonald's workers demanding $15 per hour. The cost of labor is driven by the free market, aka supply and demand. All of us electrician hourly workers should make $70 an hour or more for our skills, right? That would be great, but it's unrealistic because the market won't bear that kind of price. But a socialist like you would be glad to have the government force employers to pay a "living wage", wouldn't you?



The labor movement gave workers safe working conditions, fair wages , retirement, overtime ,and stoped the use of child labor . I wouldn’t call those accomplishments a joke .

As far as electricians shouldn’t make 70ph the local I’m in the total package is probably more and our books have been clear for years now and will continue to be for years to come . The contractors are making money and so are the men .

In the same area theirs men working for half the price with no retirement, 

What a diff collective bargaining can do


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## MTW (Aug 28, 2013)

Fist of lightning said:


> The labor movement gave workers safe working conditions, fair wages , retirement, overtime ,and stoped the use of child labor . I wouldn’t call those accomplishments a joke .
> 
> As far as electricians shouldn’t make 70ph the local I’m in the total package is probably more and our books have been clear for years now and will continue to be for years to come . The contractors are making money and so are the men .
> 
> ...


The labor movement gave us the Rust Belt. Thank you very much.


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

> Why are people vilified for wanting to better themselves?


 No one is vilified for wanting to better themselves. I have a lot of respect for people who want to better themselves. Bettering oneself is only accomplished through hard work and lots of ambition.

The people who are vilified are those who want to use the government to steal from other people in order to give to themselves. That’s not bettering oneself, that is turning oneself into a liberal socialist thief.


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## nrp3 (Jan 24, 2009)

Never been a union electrical worker, however, no one, if they look honestly at turn of the century conditions of average workers in mines and the mills here locally would ever want to return to that. We need to find something of a balance. I work in subsidized elderly housing. I don't want to find myself there. I do the best I can to save for retirement. My account asks why is he responsible for all of this?


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## FishinElectrcian (Jul 18, 2019)

Another story from me.. 

Back in the day turn of the century 20yrs ago Alberta was booming again but the attitude hadn't changed since the crash from '88.. "You should show up early, work late and no we don't pay overtime. You should be happy, you are lucky to have a job". 

Wage was below $20 an HR.. In BC it was $24+. We can't afford to pay more they said.. All the workers were getting squeezed and the economy was taking off. A man and a van was billed out $100 an HR. 

Funny thing though the union took a run at flipping a CLAC company (employer union) and almost did it, missed by a few votes. Within a month or two the non union rate went up by almost $4 an hour out of fear of getting flipped and none of those companies went broke. The non union rate was higher (without benefits added in) for awhile too.

Union benefits everyone whether you work in it or not.


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

FishinElectrcian said:


> Union benefits everyone whether you work in it or not.


Yes, but like with everything else, there is always bad to go with the good.

Unions have screwed up bigtime and it's the reason why they have steadily lost marketshare and will be gone in my lifetime.


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## splatz (May 23, 2015)

I can't take unions seriously when they complain that more contractors don't sign, while being so elitist with how many workers they let in. That's the side that can drive the growth.


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## Fist of lightning (Aug 15, 2019)

The local I’m in has recently changed that they are accepting more apprentices in every year and organizing more and more contractors each year . 

And it hasn’t hurt our local we have over 4,000 members and all are working right now no one is sitting it has been this like this for five years now , and our work outlook is even brighter our books should be clear for the next five years .

I looked on online to see how other locals are doing for work and they have open calls all over I suspect those locals will be letting in more and more apprentices aswell.


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## Southeast Power (Jan 18, 2009)

HackWork said:


> No one is vilified for wanting to better themselves. I have a lot of respect for people who want to better themselves. Bettering oneself is only accomplished through hard work and lots of ambition.
> 
> The people who are vilified are those who want to use the government to steal from other people in order to give to themselves. That’s not bettering oneself, that is turning oneself into a liberal socialist thief.


*The people who are vilified are those who want to use the government to steal from other people in order to give to themselves. That’s not bettering oneself, that is turning oneself into a liberal socialist thief.*

AGREED!!

Just Ahead of Labor Day, Trump Floats Tax Cut Condemned as 'Pure Giveaway to Wealthy'
"Apart from just sending millionaires checks, it's hard to think of a tax cut more targeted to the ultra-rich."


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## Fist of lightning (Aug 15, 2019)

Southeast Power said:


> I constantly compete for work against contractors that refuse to pay a living wage and any kind of benefits.
> 
> *The people that work for these jerks have been conditioned *to believe they are "greedy" to even desire a living wage and healthcare or any kind of pension.


I appreciate you being a signatory contractor and paying your men retirement and fair wages it makes a hudge diff.

Getting into the union has been a absolute life changer for me I went from living paycheck to paycheck with no guaranteed raises ,to in a few years I’ll be able to buy a house and llive a good middle class life with retirement. 

We do appreciate it .


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## Southeast Power (Jan 18, 2009)

MechanicalDVR said:


> From my seat it seems there is one party fighting hardest for those that don't work, the ones that just walk over the border and get everything handed to them.....medical care, college educations, housing, and every other welfare program available.....and all just for votes...


Why didn't the GOP change the laws when they had both the legislative and executive branches under their control??? So, those that "walk over the border" can vote? Are the Russians still sending you crap on Facebook? :vs_laugh:


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

Southeast Power said:


> *The people who are vilified are those who want to use the government to steal from other people in order to give to themselves. That’s not bettering oneself, that is turning oneself into a liberal socialist thief.*
> 
> AGREED!!
> 
> ...


Did you lose the password to your NewElect account?


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## FishinElectrcian (Jul 18, 2019)

It really depends on each local and the work load that they have. In theory a large pool of capable people is a great idea. Never kid yourself though a union is a business, their business is representing workers. The better their market share the better working conditions are. 

Many locals approach things differently. When I was in BC the union wasn't letting guys in, needed grade 12 math and a friend. At that time the union was strong but losing ground and a lot of work from perception of costs and a backlash under Vanderzam.

I moved to AB and it was open membership, the union was weak after the crash and they relied heavily on large oil projects. They wanted all the guys they could get and sometimes you had to ride the books for a year or more to get a decent call. They encouraged their guys to work non union and spread the word. Nothing better than the best hard working guy on the crew being a "brother" 

Their collective bargaining was tied to 17 other trades, fitters down to painters. Once enough trades signed they got forced into binding arbitration, losing high time a few years before I joined even though it wasn't even in contention with our contractors but the other trades had bargained it away.

The travellers from BC I worked with in the oil sands were exceptionally well trained and productive. I asked a guy Wayne about it and he said: they had to be to compete in BC. They took lots of extra courses and had to offer a better product than cheaper non union which explained the elitism I encountered years earlier.

I think the unions will live on, if they disappear they will come back when the conditions get unbearable but God help us if that happens. Work union or don't, but remember what they have done for us working class. That's why this holiday is important to tradesmen.


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## TGGT (Oct 28, 2012)

Labor day was created after non-union wildcat strikes.

Teachers recently have earned wage increases after striking, also majority non-union.

Most established unions are a leash on workers. The leadership terrified of upsetting management and local politicians, rarely call for any action.

Fact of the matter is direct action yields the most results, and you don't need to pay a handler for the privilege to strike.

Sent from my SM-G930T using Tapatalk


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## Incognito (Apr 14, 2019)

MTW said:


> I celebrate labor day every year by working.


That is true for many non union workers who don’t have a pension actually, not really much to celebrate there knowing they will have to work much longer in life.


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## Fist of lightning (Aug 15, 2019)

MTW said:


> Fist of lightning said:
> 
> 
> > The labor movement gave workers safe working conditions, fair wages , retirement, overtime ,and stoped the use of child labor . I wouldnâ€™️t call those accomplishments a joke .
> ...


Lol cant even take that seriously


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## Southeast Power (Jan 18, 2009)

HackWork said:


> Did you lose the password to your NewElect account?


What you are doing to my beloved Labor Day thread:


https://www.reddit.com/r/funny/comm..._manuevere/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=web2x


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## Incognito (Apr 14, 2019)

I worked non union, no bennies, no pension and my charge out rate was $120. 
Same year I went to the union, full bennies, large pension and $5 an hour more but my charge out rate was less, only $100?

That was 15 years ago and Those two companies are in direct competition with each other. Both still in business


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

Incognito said:


> I worked non union, no bennies, no pension and my charge out rate was $120.
> Same year I went to the union, full bennies, large pension and $5 an hour more but my charge out rate was less, only $100?
> 
> That was 15 years ago and Those two companies are in direct competition with each other. Both still in business


So what you just told us is that it's much better to be a non-union contractor :vs_laugh::vs_laugh::vs_laugh:


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## Southeast Power (Jan 18, 2009)

HackWork said:


> So what you just told us is that it's much better to be a non-union contractor :vs_laugh::vs_laugh::vs_laugh:


Well....You should know. 






Oh Dawg..


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## Incognito (Apr 14, 2019)

HackWork said:


> Incognito said:
> 
> 
> > I worked non union, no bennies, no pension and my charge out rate was $120.
> ...


More like much better being a union employee


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

Incognito said:


> More like much better being a union employee


Umm, no. It's much better being a business owner than an employee.

I thought you were done with the trolling? You gonna start up again??


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## Fist of lightning (Aug 15, 2019)

Incognito said:


> MTW said:
> 
> 
> > I celebrate labor day every year by working.
> ...


One of the many reason I love Labor Day


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## Incognito (Apr 14, 2019)

HackWork said:


> Incognito said:
> 
> 
> > More like much better being a union employee
> ...


Personally, I prefer the high wage, pension and bennies paid by the employer, no risk employee position but to each their own. 

As for trolling, no one can match your skills in that department. You can keep the trolling king of ET crown.


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## MechanicalDVR (Dec 29, 2007)

Southeast Power said:


> Why didn't the GOP change the laws when they had both the legislative and executive branches under their control??? So, those that "walk over the border" can vote? Are the Russians still sending you crap on Facebook? :vs_laugh:



Maybe they never thought the dems would possibly bend over to the illegals so readily.

Sad to say you are so far off base, I have no Russians on facebook.


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## Southeast Power (Jan 18, 2009)

MechanicalDVR said:


> Maybe they never thought the dems would possibly bend over to the illegals so readily.
> 
> Sad to say you are so far off base, I have no Russians on facebook.


You do realize thats how all of you guys seem to belive the same fairy tales. 

Also, how many trade unions support illegal immigration? 

Uh, zero.


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## Fist of lightning (Aug 15, 2019)

Incognito said:


> HackWork said:
> 
> 
> > Incognito said:
> ...


True not having the stress of owning a business and still making over 100k a year with retirement.

Can’t beat being a union electrician


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

Fist of lightning said:


> True not having the stress of owning a business and still making over 100k a year with retirement.
> 
> Can’t beat being a union electrician


Of course you can beat it. I made over $100K in the check plus all the bennies for the last 8 or 9 years I was doing union work and I would never, ever, ever go back.


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## MechanicalDVR (Dec 29, 2007)

TGGT said:


> Labor day was created after non-union wildcat strikes.
> 
> Teachers recently have earned wage increases after striking, *also majority non-union.*
> 
> ...


Not true 70% of teachers are unionized.


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## Fist of lightning (Aug 15, 2019)

HackWork said:


> Fist of lightning said:
> 
> 
> > True not having the stress of owning a business and still making over 100k a year with retirement.
> ...


I’m glad your doing well that’s awsome . 

I feel the same way about working non union I would never ever go back to being a non union electrician.

As far as a contractor I don’t think I’m a good business man I would probably go under .and couldn’t deal with the customers or the stress aspect. 

But I’m glad you don’t have to work with the tools anymore and have your own business,


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## MTW (Aug 28, 2013)

Fist of lightning said:


> Lol cant even take that seriously


Of course not, because it wasn't spoon fed to you at the union hall. It is a verifiable fact that they labor movement played a major roll in destroying America's many heavy industries, or causing them to move to non-union states. Prime example - why do you think most auto assembly is now done in RTW states these day? But people like you and many other would rather bury their heads in the sand and pretend it's not true. This is why the unions will continue to shrink because it never learns from its mistakes and never changes when it needs to.


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## MTW (Aug 28, 2013)

Southeast Power said:


> You do realize thats how all of you guys seem to belive the same fairy tales.
> 
> Also, how many trade unions support illegal immigration?
> 
> Uh, zero.


You raise a great point which again illustrates the utter insanity of liberalism. The IBEW may be against illegal immigration but it will be first in line to support radically left politicians who are completely for open borders. That will be no different in the 2020 election, mark my words. As long as that kind of hypocrisy continues, the IBEW will remain a joke to me.


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## TGGT (Oct 28, 2012)

MechanicalDVR said:


> Not true 70% of teachers are unionized.


70% are part of a union OR association. They are different. That statistic is a about 3 years old.

All the states where teachers walked out were Right to Work republican states. Strikes there are illegal for teachers, but not "work actions".

This is the best statistic I could find on teacher membership. https://www.bls.gov/news.release/union2.t03.htm

The education column shows about 34% union which is one of the highest percentages of any industry.

Sent from my SM-G930T using Tapatalk


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## Fist of lightning (Aug 15, 2019)

MTW said:


> Fist of lightning said:
> 
> 
> > Lol cant even take that seriously
> ...


The unions were not the sole factor in why the American auto industry is were it is today .

Cheap parts coming in over seas , 
Also they started making the cars using less man power .

The reason most companies move to right to work states is so they can exploit the workers and have more leverage over them. 

In any regards unions have done more for the working class and working man than harm .

Im living it right now my life and family’s life have improved tremendously since I joined a union .


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## Incognito (Apr 14, 2019)

Fist of lightning said:


> True not having the stress of owning a business and still making over 100k a year with retirement.
> 
> Can’t beat being a union electrician


I agree. 

Of course you could always work more and make more, but I’m happy working my 36 hours a week with all the benefits and great pension to look forward to. 

My company vehicle gets parked and my phone gets turned off at 3:15 every weekday and stays off all weekend. 

Also, today I made a full days pay while sitting by the lake. 

Happy labour day!


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## MTW (Aug 28, 2013)

Fist of lightning said:


> The unions were not the sole factor in why the American auto industry is were it is today .
> 
> Cheap parts coming in over seas ,
> Also they started making the cars using less man power .
> ...


I understand that you're not able to see outside of your union paradigm. This is what brainwashing does to people.

The steel industry was destroyed by the unions. That is a fact. They won't teach you this at the union hall either. 

As for worker exploration, that only exists in prison labor camps in North Korea. A worker isn't "exploited" if they are in a voluntary relationship with their employer. 
But again, they don't teach you thing like this at the union hall. All the union wants is a bunch of sheep to repeat the talking points, as you've repeatedly done.


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## MTW (Aug 28, 2013)

Incognito said:


> I agree.
> 
> Of course you could always work more and make more, but I’m happy working my 36 hours a week with all the benefits and great pension to look forward to.
> 
> ...


Thanks for proving my point about entrepreneurs, and why they deserve the credit, not the labor force. You have no skin in the game. You get to go home and shut off your connection to your employer. An employer NEVER gets to do that with their customers, ever.


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## Incognito (Apr 14, 2019)

MTW said:


> Thanks for proving my point about entrepreneurs, and why they deserve the credit, not the labor force. You have no skin in the game. You get to go home and shut off your connection to your employer. An employer NEVER gets to do that with their customers, ever.


And that is exactly why I am happy as a union employee.

He doesn’t loose money with me, I have the training and the skill, his expertise is getting the work and collecting the money. It’s a win/win situation


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## nrp3 (Jan 24, 2009)

If you are making good money and happy where you are at, union or non union, good. If not, make the change to improve your lot in life. I like the freedom to be subject to few rules. If I want to work through lunch I do, If I don't feel like going to work, I don't. Work still needs to be done if I want to get paid. I worked off and on all weekend, mainly because I felt like things needed to be done to keep work on track. Working for an employer is fine too. To each their own. Had I gone union, I wouldn't be where I am at, but who knows, maybe somewhere equally good.


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## Incognito (Apr 14, 2019)

nrp3 said:


> If you are making good money and happy where you are at, union or non union, good. If not, make the change to improve your lot in life. I like the freedom to be subject to few rules. If I want to work through lunch I do, If I don't feel like going to work, I don't. Work still needs to be done if I want to get paid. I worked off and on all weekend, mainly because I felt like things needed to be done to keep work on track. Working for an employer is fine too. To each their own. Had I gone union, I wouldn't be where I am at, but who knows, maybe somewhere equally good.


That’s the key right there. Be happy what you do. Of course there is always greener grass somewhere else, but there is also burn grass on the other side of the fence. 

I do believe as an employee, you will work harder if your treated well but it is always a give and take sort of thing. Some take advantage of the take side and that will not work for long.

Around here there are some very successful large non union contractors who pay their employees a fair rate and have benefit plans very close to what the union offers. Their employees have no interest in becoming union, why would they?


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## nrp3 (Jan 24, 2009)

Incognito said:


> That’s the key right there. Be happy what you do. Of course there is always greener grass somewhere else, but there is also burn grass on the other side of the fence.
> 
> I do believe as an employee, you will work harder if your treated well but it is always a give and take sort of thing. Some take advantage of the take side and that will not work for long.


And yes, when I go on vacation, the phone calls, texts, emails, etc, go on from home to FL and back. It's the way it is. I'm ok with that, nor do I look down on the ability to shut it all off at the end of the day.


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## TGGT (Oct 28, 2012)

MTW said:


> Thanks for proving my point about entrepreneurs, and why they deserve the credit, not the labor force. You have no skin in the game. You get to go home and shut off your connection to your employer. An employer NEVER gets to do that with their customers, ever.


It's up to the business owner to set boundaries for themselves.

You can also choose which customers to do business with.

Sent from my SM-G930T using Tapatalk


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## nrp3 (Jan 24, 2009)

TGGT said:


> It's up to the business owner to set boundaries for themselves.
> 
> You can also choose which customers to do business with.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G930T using Tapatalk



And I try to do this, boundaries, and absolutely on choices of customers.


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## stiffneck (Nov 8, 2015)

Southeast Power said:


> You do realize thats how all of you guys seem to belive the same fairy tales.
> 
> Also, how many trade unions support illegal immigration?
> 
> Uh, zero.


 This is just one example of "trade unions" supporting illegal aliens in this country, at that time. Any attempt by the majority was met with your people pulling the "race" card, (how original). Big Democrat party, Big Catholic church and Big Unions want these people, because the rest of us have left your organizations. Ever thought about cleaning up your act, for us to come back?


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## Southeast Power (Jan 18, 2009)

MTW said:


> I understand that you're not able to see outside of your union paradigm. This is what brainwashing does to people.
> 
> The steel industry was destroyed by the unions. That is a fact. They won't teach you this at the union hall either.
> 
> ...


You are the exact kind of fukhead that shlts in his own lunchbox and blames everyone else for his problems. How about you do us all a solid and stay off the union topics and not come here and try to hang with the big boys and show how much of a chicken shlt dumbazz you are. :wink:


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## MTW (Aug 28, 2013)

Southeast Power said:


> You are the exact kind of fukhead that shlts in his own lunchbox and blames everyone else for his problems. How about you do us all a solid and stay off the union topics and not come here and try to hang with the big boys and show how much of a chicken shlt dumbazz you are. :wink:



That was a great effort you made to use logic and reasoning to disprove what I said. I can see you put much though into an intelligent reply. I really appreciate it.


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## Fist of lightning (Aug 15, 2019)

MTW said:


> Fist of lightning said:
> 
> 
> > The unions were not the sole factor in why the American auto industry is were it is today .
> ...


Lol again unions were not the sole purpose of losing the steel industry . Usa is still the fourth highest country in producing the product 

Why do you think that the steel industry became unionized , the workers didn’t just come up with the idea out of the sky.

They unionized Bc the men were being worked to death in unsafe conditions 7 days a week .

Of course your going to have some corruption in the unions ,it’s a business and acceptable to greed. But it’s a small price to pay from having child labor in the steel mills and men being worked to death in un safe conditions .

I don’t believe unions are without sin but they have done a lot of good aswell and I feel you need a balance between management and the workers . 

If the steel mills didn’t treat the workers like they were **** they would’ve never unionized in the first place . The truth is some were in the middle .

It seems like Your way off from the middle by saying the labor movement was completely a horrible thing that’s not being a realist that’s crazy talk .

the unions have had their issues yes but no we’re close to the corruption in the management,corporate sector .


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## stiffneck (Nov 8, 2015)

Southeast Power said:


> Labor Day is to honor those that have sacrificed so that we can have a decent workweek and for us union folks a decent pension and healthcare.
> 
> Why are people vilified for wanting to better themselves?
> 
> ...



Since 1940, ibew has been convicted thousands of times of "unfair hiring practices". ibew was a leading factor for Federal/State governments to invent quotas. Giving women and minorities "special rights" not "equal rights". After years of giving us the middle finger, now you want us to come back? Here we are today, thousands of Electrical workers across this country continue to ignore ibew's new "open door polices" why? You have only yourself to blame for 2002-2015 500,000 membership decline. Still haven't figured that one out yet? Ever wonder why you club is crawling back to 1-million members? A number you had over 20 years ago. Instead of being nearly 2-million today? Are you one of those whose "path was paved for you"? What do you know about "conditioning"? Would you like some ibew "conditioning"? Familiar with being "denied the right to work"? Ever experience that? Do we have to go over the word "Nepotism" again? So who are the "Jackwagons"?


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## FishinElectrcian (Jul 18, 2019)

nrp3 said:


> And yes, when I go on vacation, the phone calls, texts, emails, etc, go on from home to FL and back. It's the way it is. I'm ok with that, nor do I look down on the ability to shut it all off at the end of the day.


I don't look down on that ability to shut it down, I look up with envy. Yay Christmas is coming, extra bills and extra work and service calls to try and make other people's Xmas a merry one.


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## cuba_pete (Dec 8, 2011)

I’m glad that we can live in a country where we have choices. We can all share our values freely and everything matters. It’s all worth fighting for and keeping around. 

Both of my parents were UAW at Delco Remy and put food on the table and clothes on our backs. My mom later was a Teamster, and kept us fed at least. 

I have yet to join any union, but some of my family members have.

I have to say I wouldn’t be who I am today, so I guess that’s alright. 

Happy Labor Day.


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