# Best tool to cut long strips of drywall out?



## Southeast Power (Jan 18, 2009)

Just use a regular saws all blade, nothing special needed. you will be just fine:thumbsup:


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## big2bird (Oct 1, 2012)

My house is button board and plaster. I use a Milwaukie oscillating tool with a Bosch Carbide tip. Works great.
Buy the tool. Once you have one, you will use it quite often. It works well for cutting in boxes here and there.


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## big2bird (Oct 1, 2012)

jrannis said:


> Just use a regular saws all blade, nothing special needed. you will be just fine:thumbsup:


Any blade except carbide will be dulled really fast.


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## BBQ (Nov 16, 2010)

sparkyforlife said:


> Best tool to cut long strips of drywall out?


A carpenter or laborer.


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## sparkyforlife (Sep 4, 2012)

This is so unlike me but... HF has one for $40. I always buy quality name brand tools but a Fein is $200 and the last time I had to cut access strips that long was a long time ago. Not sure still thinking

http://www.harborfreight.com/variable-speed-multifunction-power-tool-67537.html


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## big2bird (Oct 1, 2012)

BBQ said:


> A carpenter or laborer.


Naw. They scream too much when you bash their head thru the wall. The blood is a mess also.


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## big2bird (Oct 1, 2012)

sparkyforlife said:


> This is so unlike me but... HF has one for $40. I always buy quality name brand tools but a Fein is $200 and the last time I had to cut access strips that long was a long time ago. Not sure still thinking
> 
> http://www.harborfreight.com/variable-speed-multifunction-power-tool-67537.html


I have found HF power tools to be trash.:no:

If you want to be cheap, just use a keyhole saw.


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## Southeast Power (Jan 18, 2009)

big2bird said:


> Any blade except carbide will be dulled really fast.


I know, he might go though a blade or two but, it will get the job done and he won't have to but any other tool.
Just my experience. I've bought every kind of tool there is but will usually come back to the basics.


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## Southeast Power (Jan 18, 2009)

sparkyforlife said:


> This is so unlike me but... HF has one for $40. I always buy quality name brand tools but a Fein is $200 and the last time I had to cut access strips that long was a long time ago. Not sure still thinking
> 
> http://www.harborfreight.com/variable-speed-multifunction-power-tool-67537.html


Note to self:
Never buy blades from HF, they are only for decorative use.


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## sparkyforlife (Sep 4, 2012)

jrannis said:


> I know, he might go though a blade or two but, it will get the job done and he won't have to but any other tool.
> Just my experience. I've bought every kind of tool there is but will usually come back to the basics.


Yeah but you know how much dust a circular saw will create inside a house. The place will look like a blizzard white out.


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## sparkyforlife (Sep 4, 2012)

jrannis said:


> Note to self:
> Never buy blades from HF, they are only for decorative use.


Your right I was going to buy the HF tool and buy a name brand blade like Dremel.


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## 99cents (Aug 20, 2012)

I say a Hackzall. I have only used it occasionally on plaster so I can't comment on how long the blades will last. It uses regular Sawzall blades as well as the shorter Hackzall blades.

The reason I say a Hackzall is that you will end up using it almost daily once you have one. It isn't a tool you will end up throwing in a corner of your truck to collect dust. The Hackzall has a lot of blade choices. It even has a jigsaw blade.

I use the 12V one. It only has a 1/2" travel so for bigger jobs I use the regular Sawzall. Some guys like the 18V Hackzall.


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## big2bird (Oct 1, 2012)

sparkyforlife said:


> Yeah but you know how much dust a circular saw will create inside a house. The place will look like a blizzard white out.


If you use an oscillating, sawzall, jig saw with a carbide blade, and hold a shop vac hose next to it as you go, the dust won't be that bad. Tape a plastic curtain and work underneath with a dust mask.
I do this crap at home all the time.


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

IMO the oscillating tool is something that an electrician can use often, so I don't think you would be wasting your money buying a decent one. You don't need the Fein, there are many others that work just as well. I am happy with my Rockwell. FWIW, I have talked to many people who are happy with the Harbor Freight model, so if you don't think you are going to use it a lot, I don't think you could go wrong with that.

IMO, an oscillating tool isn't best for such a long channel. It's going to be a lot of work. What you have is normal plaster on gypsum lath (or rock lath like you said, taken from the term sheetrock). It's much easier to deal with than plaster on wood or metal lath, but it's still plaster and could be hard to cut. 

IMO, the best thing for that is a jigsaw with a carbide grit blade. The grit blade cuts in both directions, in and out, and works very fast. I've cut out a 5 foot wide by 3.5 foot high pass-thru in the gypsum lath and plaster in my own home very easily this way. When using the oscillating tool with a brand new grit blade on the same plaster, it is very slow.

But here's the thing, I'm not a fan of cutting out channels for electrical work. I use a 4" grit holesaw and cut a hole centered on each stud. I then use the oscillating tool to cut a small channel in the face of the stud for the cable to sit. Then I thread the cable from one hole to the other, then I re-insert the plugs I drilled out and screw them back in, right to the studs.

It's fast, easy, and also easy to patch. Just my opinions.


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## BBQ (Nov 16, 2010)

big2bird said:


> I do this crap at home all the time.


The 'Honey do list'?

I have become a pro at ignoring it. :jester:


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## big2bird (Oct 1, 2012)

BBQ said:


> The 'Honey do list'?
> 
> I have become a pro at ignoring it. :jester:


I am winding up a 2 year remodel. Roof to floor, front to back, revised floor plan, termite repair, you name it. The kids say I am nesting for retirement. (They be right).:thumbup:


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## captkirk (Nov 21, 2007)

jrannis said:


> Note to self:
> Never buy blades from HF, they are only for decorative use.


Rlmfao......
The fein tool with grout blade will give you the most milage per blade....


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## sparkyforlife (Sep 4, 2012)

HackWork said:


> IMO the oscillating tool is something that an electrician can use often, so I don't think you would be wasting your money buying a decent one. You don't need the Fein, there are many others that work just as well. I am happy with my Rockwell. FWIW, I have talked to many people who are happy with the Harbor Freight model, so if you don't think you are going to use it a lot, I don't think you could go wrong with that.
> 
> IMO, an oscillating tool isn't best for such a long channel. It's going to be a lot of work. What you have is normal plaster on gypsum lath (or rock lath like you said, taken from the term sheetrock). It's much easier to deal with than plaster on wood or metal lath, but it's still plaster and could be hard to cut.
> 
> ...


Very good ideas and I agree with most of it. My only concern is when using a jig saw the throw of the blade could cut into something in the stud bay. 

This is actually a 2 level apartment building but I'm working on the first floor and the apartment sits on a concrete slab so I'm not too worried about cutting into unknown stuff but you never know.

With a circular or oscillating tool you can set the depth of cut on it to match the thickness of the drywall.


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

Pretty much every job I go to is plaster so I deal with it a lot. I've found these blades to be the best for it:

http://imperialblades.com/blades/tile-grout-accessories/1-1-4-flush-cut-carbide-blade.html

But again, for such a long channel I would just use a grit blade in a jigsaw. You can find them cheap on eBay.


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## sparkyforlife (Sep 4, 2012)

Just found this :thumbsup:

http://www.homedepot.com/p/DEWALT-4...-Tile-cutter-DWC860W/203164110#specifications

or

http://www.homedepot.com/p/t/203162...ct-1-_-203164110-_-203162016-_-N#.Uep9FdLqlYA


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## Southeast Power (Jan 18, 2009)

sparkyforlife said:


> Yeah but you know how much dust a circular saw will create inside a house. The place will look like a blizzard white out.


Just saying that if the OP just needs to cut a one time 12' piece of rock Lath and plaster, it would be more economical to just consume a couple of saws all blades then to buy a new tool that he may use once or twice a year.


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

sparkyforlife said:


> Just found this :thumbsup:
> 
> http://www.homedepot.com/p/DEWALT-4...-Tile-cutter-DWC860W/203164110#specifications


Do you have an angle grinder? It would be pretty much the same as using that. Both will throw out a crazy amount of dust. The oscillating tool or jigsaw doesn't make too much dust, a vacuum held next to it will pretty much make it dust free. But with those high speed spinning things, a vacuum doesn't do much.


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## big2bird (Oct 1, 2012)

sparkyforlife said:


> Very good ideas and I agree with most of it. My only concern is when using a jig saw the throw of the blade could cut into something in the stud bay.


Not gonna happen. You have 3/8" button board with 3/8" plaster/sand coating. You will "feel" any obstruction.
That tile saw will sit for months/years at a time.


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## big2bird (Oct 1, 2012)

jrannis said:


> Just saying that if the OP just needs to cut a one time 12' piece of rock Lath and plaster, it would be more economical to just consume a couple of saws all blades then to buy a new tool that he may use once or twice a year.


I would agree, but I don't get the blade thing. Carbide blades are $10, and last for years till they bend/break. Why burn up 3 or 4 good blades?


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## big2bird (Oct 1, 2012)

HackWork said:


> Do you have an angle grinder? It would be pretty much the same as using that. Both will throw out a crazy amount of dust. The oscillating tool or jigsaw doesn't make too much dust, a vacuum held next to it will pretty much make it dust free. But with those high speed spinning things, a vacuum doesn't do much.


I use a peanut grinder with a diamond blade on stucco. You can't wear it out.


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## sparkyforlife (Sep 4, 2012)

I've decided to just use a circular saw that way I can set the depth and I don't have to buy any new tools.

A masonry blade I should use right? Plaster is basically stone.


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## aDudeInPhx (Feb 20, 2012)

HackWork said:


> Do you have an angle grinder? a vacuum held next to it will pretty much make it dust


This. With a diamond blade.


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

sparkyforlife said:


> I've decided to just use a circular saw that way I can set the depth and I don't have to buy any new tools.
> 
> A masonry blade I should use right? Plaster is basically stone.


Yes.

Just be prepared for an immense amount of dust.


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

aDudeInPhx said:


> This. With a diamond blade.


That's not what I said :laughing:


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## Southeast Power (Jan 18, 2009)

big2bird said:


> I would agree, but I don't get the blade thing. Carbide blades are $10, and last for years till they bend/break. Why burn up 3 or 4 good blades?


I usually keep some old blades around just for this kind of work.
If you have a chance to pick up a couple of grit blades then even better.

Just sayin, I wouldn't think I would go out of my way to buy anything special.

I went through the hassle of using an abrasive blade on a lath and plastered column thinking it was the only way to cut it.
I found my apprentice using the saws all wit a regular blade and he was making much more progress and none of the mess.


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## sparkyforlife (Sep 4, 2012)

HackWork said:


> Yes.
> 
> Just be prepared for an immense amount of dust.


Going to use plastic and section off the room like someone previously mentioned. Get in there with my ear plugs, mask and goggles on and come out looking like an albino...no offense to any albinos if we have any here:laughing:


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## big2bird (Oct 1, 2012)

Are you going to do the patching?


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## sparkyforlife (Sep 4, 2012)

big2bird said:


> Are you going to do the patching?


Why?


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## drumnut08 (Sep 23, 2012)

sparkyforlife said:


> I have a job coming up adding outlets in a bedroom where I need to cut a long access strip to run wire. It's not actual drywall it's old stuff I think called rock lathe? Doesn't have wire or wood lathe behind it but harder then modern drywall and chips like plaster when you hit it.
> 
> Anyway I was thinking an oscillating tool? like a Fein? I have to cut out like a 12' long strip. I don't own an oscillating tool and don't want to spend $200 for a Fein but if I have to I'm sure I'll have to use it again.
> 
> The other way I thought was using a circular saw with a masonry blade but that would blow out an insane amount of dust.


When you say " adding " receptacles , I'm assuming you mean tapping off of existing ones already in the room ( no new home runs ) if this is the case , why not flex bit from location to location ? Start from an existing box location , remove it and go left or right ? I've had lots of success with this , but I'll figure a way to get wire from point a to b without having to patch . I hate patching a d am too cheap to pay someone else to do it , lol !


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

drumnut08 said:


> When you say " adding " receptacles , I'm assuming you mean tapping off of existing ones already in the room ( no new home runs ) if this is the case , why not flex bit from location to location ? Start from an existing box location , remove it and go left or right ? I've had lots of success with this , but I'll figure a way to get wire from point a to b without having to patch . I hate patching a d am too cheap to pay someone else to do it , lol !


Drilling horizontally thru a studded wall is very hard with a flex bit. It's not like a ceiling where there is much more room (9" vs. 3.5"). How far is the furthest you were able to drill without busting thru the wall?


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## big2bird (Oct 1, 2012)

sparkyforlife said:


> Why?


If a drywaller is, I can tell you right now he will have to recut it to tie it back in. Just beat a slot out with a hammer and let him fix it.
The fix is to cut it down the middle of the adjacent suds, install 1/4" furring strips, 1/2" rock, then hot mud in a wide feather patch.
If you cut a slot, you have to screw in backing, 1/2" drywall, then hot mud a 1/4" fill.
A good drywaller will tell you "Do what you have to do and I'll fix it."


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## drumnut08 (Sep 23, 2012)

HackWork said:


> Drilling horizontally thru a studded wall is very hard with a flex bit. It's not like a ceiling where there is much more room (9" vs. 3.5"). How far is the furthest you were able to drill without busting thru the wall?


3 stud bays ( 48" ) . It's not easy and I've had an occasional casualty , but it can be done .


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## big2bird (Oct 1, 2012)

HackWork said:


> Drilling horizontally thru a studded wall is very hard with a flex bit. It's not like a ceiling where there is much more room (9" vs. 3.5"). How far is the furthest you were able to drill without busting thru the wall?


How big is a hole? How long is a piece of string? If your gonna make holes, make em big enough to work. A good rocker doesn't care. It's the motions, not the size.


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

drumnut08 said:


> 3 stud bays ( 48" ) . It's not easy and I've had an occasional casualty , but it can be done .


You still need to make an opening every 4' then.


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## Southeast Power (Jan 18, 2009)

sparkyforlife said:


> I've decided to just use a circular saw that way I can set the depth and I don't have to buy any new tools.
> 
> A masonry blade I should use right? Plaster is basically stone.


I really think that would be my very last choice.


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

big2bird said:


> How big is a hole? How long is a piece of string? If your gonna make holes, make em big enough to work. A good rocker doesn't care. It's the motions, not the size.


I don't know what this has to do with my post to drumnut...



In the end, I don't like cutting out long slots. A 4" hole on each stud makes no dust in the air, it easy, quick, and clean. Patching it is also very easy, no tape, just smear some hot mud over it and you're done, let the homeowner do the second and third coat of spackle if they want to.


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## sparkyforlife (Sep 4, 2012)

jrannis said:


> I really think that would be my very last choice.


Why?

Mark 2 lines and run right down the lines with the saw simple.


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## big2bird (Oct 1, 2012)

HackWork said:


> I don't know what this has to do with my post to drumnut...
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, I don't like cutting out long slots. A 4" hole on each stud makes no dust in the air, it easy, quick, and clean. Patching it is also very easy, no tape, just smear some hot mud over it and you're done, let the homeowner do the second and third coat of spackle if they want to.


My point is it's not plastic surgery. Patching is patching. Cut out what you need to do the job, then patch it back. It's the motion. Small holes and big holes take the same amount of time/motion.
Drywallers could care less if the hole is 6" square or a foot square.


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## sparkyforlife (Sep 4, 2012)

HackWork said:


> I don't know what this has to do with my post to drumnut...
> 
> 
> 
> In the end, I don't like cutting out long slots. A 4" hole on each stud makes no dust in the air, it easy, quick, and clean. Patching it is also very easy, no tape, just smear some hot mud over it and you're done, let the homeowner do the second and third coat of spackle if they want to.


By cutting out a long strip you can screw a new strip of drywall right to the studs. If you use a hole saw you have to use wood to support the patches or some other time consuming method. Also you have to feather/blend all those holes pretty damn good or your going to see a bunch of bumps down the wall. Also it's color paint they are using on the walls not white. White will hide things better not colored paint. One long strip is a thousand times easier to mud then 10+ pucks that have to be feathered out.


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## HDPro (Jan 4, 2011)

HackWork said:


> IMO the oscillating tool is something that an electrician can use often, so I don't think you would be wasting your money buying a decent one. You don't need the Fein, there are many others that work just as well. I am happy with my Rockwell. FWIW, I have talked to many people who are happy with the Harbor Freight model, so if you don't think you are going to use it a lot, I don't think you could go wrong with that.
> 
> IMO, an oscillating tool isn't best for such a long channel. It's going to be a lot of work. What you have is normal plaster on gypsum lath (or rock lath like you said, taken from the term sheetrock). It's much easier to deal with than plaster on wood or metal lath, but it's still plaster and could be hard to cut.
> 
> ...


This ^^^^^^.

Quit being a cheapwad. Spend a couple bucks and get an oscillating tool with a good blade.

Using a circular saw, you're going to create so.much dust and headache for you and your customer. By the time someone cleans up all that dust, it won't be any less time than the suggestion above. And the holes will be far easier to deal with, and make a much nicer looking repair.

Or am I wrong, and that's not what this board is about anymore? 

As a side note, I've been away from ET for awhile. Just came back. It seems like things have gone downhill here bigtime. The language has gotten worse, and the quality is lacking. Doesn't really seem to be a quality site anymore for the most part.......

Carry on!


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## 99cents (Aug 20, 2012)

sparkyforlife said:


> Why?
> 
> Mark 2 lines and run right down the lines with the saw simple.


I think the circular saw would be awkward. Guard gets in the way, it comes up short of your destination and, speaking for myself, I would be missing a couple of fingers and a thumb by the end of the job  .


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## drumnut08 (Sep 23, 2012)

HackWork said:


> You still need to make an opening every 4' then.


The few times I've done it this way , the homeowner wasn't put off by extra receptacles ( most aren't ) . I made it match the room layout wise and they were happy that I ( or they ) didn't have any patching to do . This obviously won't always work , but I'd still consider it a first attempt over the cutting , patching and dust bowl technique .


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## 99cents (Aug 20, 2012)

HDPro said:


> This ^^^^^^.
> 
> Quit being a cheapwad. Spend a couple bucks and get an oscillating tool with a good blade.
> 
> ...


You're right. This is turning into the "I'm right and you're wrong" site. Too many alpha dogs in the same kennel.

Of course, you did announce your return by saying, "Quit being a cheapwad".


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## sparkyforlife (Sep 4, 2012)

Thanks for all the suggestions here.:thumbsup:

I'll mull it over some more on the best way I have a few days before the job starts.


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## drumnut08 (Sep 23, 2012)

99cents said:


> You're right. This is turning into the "I'm right and you're wrong" site. Too many alpha dogs in the same kennel.


Yep , lol ! That happens on pretty much every thread anymore . Especially the Non electrical ones . What works for one , may not work for others , but it doesn't necessarily make it wrong either .


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

sparkyforlife said:


> By cutting out a long strip you can screw a new strip of drywall right to the studs.


 That drywall is going to be set back from the plaster which varies from 3/4" to 7/8". You are going to have to fill it in by covered the entire piece of drywall with mud. A lot of work and a perfect place for cracking to happen.



> If you use a hole saw you have to use wood to support the patches or some other time consuming method.


 Untrue. Go back and read my first post in the thread. You make the hole directly centered over each stud. You screw the same plug of plaster that you drilled out right back on the stud.



> Also you have to feather/blend all those holes pretty damn good or your going to see a bunch of bumps down the wall.


 That's the whole point I am making, you DON'T have to feather it in or do perfect work this way. Without using tape, all you are doing is filling in the gap. By using hot mud, it will stay strong and never crack. There is no reason to feather it in nearly as much as you would have to if you cut an entire channel out.

I've done it this way probably around 40 times over the years, always works out well. You literally smear the hot mud over the 4" patch and wipe it away- done. If the homeowner wants to sand it and give it a second coat the next day, that's up to them. No customer wants to pay an electrician to come back to spackle.



> One long strip is a thousand times easier to mud then 10+ pucks that have to be feathered out.


Again, I disagree. My father was a carpenter and had his own business. I was spackling kitchen remodels and additions when I was 10 years old.


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## sparkyforlife (Sep 4, 2012)

HackWork said:


> That drywall is going to be set back from the plaster which varies from 3/4" to 7/8". You are going to have to fill it in by covered the entire piece of drywall with mud. A lot of work and a perfect place for cracking to happen.
> 
> Untrue. Go back and read my first post in the thread. You make the hole directly centered over each stud. You screw the same plug of plaster that you drilled out right back on the stud.
> 
> ...


Sorry did misread what you typed. I was thinking you were drilling access holes in the center of each stud bay. 

I've done a ton of drywall work myself over 15+ years. I try to do it most of the time myself to save aggrevation for the customer having to shop around to find the best guy and wait and schedule.

So anyway skip the patching talk don't worry about that.


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## Southeast Power (Jan 18, 2009)

sparkyforlife said:


> Why?
> 
> Mark 2 lines and run right down the lines with the saw simple.


Just way too much mess for me to even consider.

Maybe use a grit hole saw to remove the plaster on the face of a stud then use a smaller butterfly bit wide enough to lay the romex across the stud.
Then put some mud on the plaster plug you cut out and stick it back in the hole.


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

jrannis said:


> Maybe use a grit hole saw to remove the plaster on the face of a stud then use a smaller butterfly bit wide enough to lay the romex across the stud.
> Then put some mud on the plaster plug you cut out and stick it back in the hole.


Wow, what a novel idea 

FWIW, you can just screw the plug back to the stud, I don't know if mudding it to the stud would hold it straight for long.


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## 99cents (Aug 20, 2012)

jrannis said:


> Just way too much mess for me to even consider.
> 
> Maybe use a grit hole saw to remove the plaster on the face of a stud then use a smaller butterfly bit wide enough to lay the romex across the stud.
> Then put some mud on the plaster plug you cut out and stick it back in the hole.


My GC's like a square hole because they say it's easier to repair. I end up using a Hackzall. I'm okay with that. Blades are cheaper than hole saws.


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## janagyjr (Feb 7, 2011)

big2bird said:


> My house is button board and plaster. I use a Milwaukie oscillating tool with a Bosch Carbide tip. Works great.
> Buy the tool. Once you have one, you will use it quite often. It works well for cutting in boxes here and there.


Why not a rotozip? Seems like one with the appropriate blade would be ideal for this.



BBQ said:


> A carpenter or laborer.


:thumbup:


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## forsaledun (Nov 15, 2012)

Not sure what the HF oscillating tool is like but I had a dremel, couldn't stand using because it was so loud. High pitched scream. Went to Menards and got a Rockwell cheaper(on sale for $90 plus 11% rebate) and it is great. I use it a lot for holes in plaster, cutting receptacles in cabinets and such.


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## Southeast Power (Jan 18, 2009)

HackWork said:


> Wow, what a novel idea
> 
> FWIW, you can just screw the plug back to the stud, I don't know if mudding it to the stud would hold it straight for long.


I wanted to bring your suggestion back around but didn't want to scroll back and see who suggested here first.
It shall be forever known as the HackWork suggestion. :thumbsup:


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## Southeast Power (Jan 18, 2009)

99cents said:


> My GC's like a square hole because they say it's easier to repair. I end up using a Hackzall. I'm okay with that. Blades are cheaper than hole saws.


I would give them the round plug and tell them to square up the hole.


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

jrannis said:


> I wanted to bring your suggestion back around but didn't want to scroll back and see who suggested here first.
> It shall be forever known as the HackWork suggestion. :thumbsup:


:thumbup:


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## 8V71 (Dec 23, 2011)

jrannis said:


> I wanted to bring your suggestion back around but didn't want to scroll back and see who suggested here first.
> It shall be forever known as *the HackWork suggestion*. :thumbsup:


I like this the best by far.


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## Southeast Power (Jan 18, 2009)

I like the suggestion that this suggestion suggests.


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## 8V71 (Dec 23, 2011)

And it will still give you the perfect excuse to buy a new tool but please go up a bit from the HF model. There are plenty between the Stein and HF. Slice your studs to the proper depth, make a vertical cut in the middle, and knock those chunks out.


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

8V71 said:


> And it will still give you the perfect excuse to buy a new tool but please go up a bit from the HF model. There are plenty between the Stein and HF. Slice your studs to the proper depth, make a vertical cut in the middle, and knock those chunks out.


I also like the idea that someone else brought up about using a paddle bit. Two quick drills with a 1 inch paddle bit would be perfect, nice and quick


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## sparky970 (Mar 19, 2008)

sparkyforlife said:


> I have a job coming up adding outlets in a bedroom where I need to cut a long access strip to run wire. It's not actual drywall it's old stuff I think called rock lathe? Doesn't have wire or wood lathe behind it but harder then modern drywall and chips like plaster when you hit it.
> 
> Anyway I was thinking an oscillating tool? like a Fein? I have to cut out like a 12' long strip. I don't own an oscillating tool and don't want to spend $200 for a Fein but if I have to I'm sure I'll have to use it again.
> 
> The other way I thought was using a circular saw with a masonry blade but that would blow out an insane amount of dust.


It's only $200.


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## 8V71 (Dec 23, 2011)

HackWork said:


> I also like the idea that someone else brought up about using a paddle bit. Two quick drills with a 1 inch paddle bit would be perfect, nice and quick


Agreed....easiest and quickest. I was playing the "excuse for new tool card". :laughing:


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## drspec (Sep 29, 2012)

Dude,

if there is a HF near you, they have those multi tools for around $20 normally and they always have 20% off coupons so you can get it for $15. It's not a bad tool. Only thing I use from there and their wood cutting blades last longer than any of the others I have used.

I have the Dremel version myself (it sucks), have used the Fein and a Ridgid versions and I like the HF better. 

To each their own, but for $15 it's definitely worth it.


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## Southeast Power (Jan 18, 2009)

HackWork said:


> I also like the idea that someone else brought up about using a paddle bit. Two quick drills with a 1 inch paddle bit would be perfect, nice and quick


Hey, wait a minute.:whistling2:


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## cultch (Aug 2, 2011)

A few times I have lucked out and new baseboards were going in so I made my channel there.

I really like Hackworks method.


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## drumnut08 (Sep 23, 2012)

8V71 said:


> And it will still give you the perfect excuse to buy a new tool but please go up a bit from the HF model. There are plenty between the Stein and HF. Slice your studs to the proper depth, make a vertical cut in the middle, and knock those chunks out.


I like the sounds of this method , but I'll continue to use my flex bits until My luck runs out and i end up drilling through a wall through a priceless painting or something , lol ? If possible I like leaving a job with zero repairs and no sign I was ever there , but new working outlets where there weren't previously . I'll make a hole if needed , but I usually try other methods first .


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

drumnut08 said:


> I like the sounds of this method , but I'll continue to use my flex bits until My luck runs out and i end up drilling through a wall through a priceless painting or something , lol ? If possible I like leaving a job with zero repairs and no sign I was ever there , but new working outlets where there weren't previously . I'll make a hole if needed , but I usually try other methods first .


I hate making holes when not necessary as well. I'm also a fan of long flexible bits, unlike some other people. 

But drilling horizontally and blindly through a narrow stud cavity seems like more danger than it's worth. To each his own.


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## 99cents (Aug 20, 2012)

HackWork said:


> I hate making holes when not necessary as well. I'm also a fan of long flexible bits, unlike some other people.
> 
> But drilling horizontally and blindly through a narrow stud cavity seems like more danger than it's worth. To each his own.


As well, I have cut notches behind baseboard. Inspector said it was okay as long as I protected the cable the entire length with strip steel.


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## Southeast Power (Jan 18, 2009)

...............


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## HDPro (Jan 4, 2011)

99cents said:


> You're right. This is turning into the "I'm right and you're wrong" site. Too many alpha dogs in the same kennel.
> 
> Of course, you did announce your return by saying, "Quit being a cheapwad".


Point well taken!


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## FastFokker (Sep 18, 2012)

I have one of those Milwaukee m12 oscillating multi tools. I use that damn thing all the time. One of the best tools in my truck.

I can't imagine doing work without it now.

$200? You'll get that money back in no time!


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

FastFokker said:


> I have one of those Milwaukee m12 oscillating multi tools. I use that damn thing all the time. One of the best tools in my truck.
> 
> I can't imagine doing work without it now.
> 
> $200? You'll get that money back in no time!


Having other M12 tools and batteries, I was all set to buy that M12 oscillating tool. However, a lot of people here said that it didn't have the balls to cut thru hard plaster very well and the battery didn't last long, so I didn't get it.

The Rockwell Oscillating tool I have is one of the few tools I have left that is not battery operated.


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## FastFokker (Sep 18, 2012)

HackWork said:


> Having other M12 tools and batteries, I was all set to buy that M12 oscillating tool. However, a lot of people here said that it didn't have the balls to cut thru hard plaster very well and the battery didn't last long, so I didn't get it.
> 
> The Rockwell Oscillating tool I have is one of the few tools I have left that is not battery operated.


It's probably not the best oscillating tool out there, but I wanted to keep in the m12 line. Hate having different cordless sets... And I really hate cords!

I put the bigger battery on the oscillating tool and I can get pretty good usage out of it.

I haven't used it on plaster yet, don't encounter that very often at all. But it eats through gyprock(drywall), any wood and plastic.


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

I've never actually used my oscillating tool on drywall. I deal with plaster so often that when I get a job in which I have to cut a hole in drywall it's like a treat. 10 seconds with the jabsaw and the hole is cut!!!! :laughing:


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## big2bird (Oct 1, 2012)

HackWork said:


> Having other M12 tools and batteries, I was all set to buy that M12 oscillating tool. However, a lot of people here said that it didn't have the balls to cut thru hard plaster very well and the battery didn't last long, so I didn't get it.


I cuts anything, but the battery does not last long. They say the larger one does. 
I only bought it because I have the matching pipe cutter. Working with copper tubing is a breeze with that deal.


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## drspec (Sep 29, 2012)

I forgot I have the M12 oscillating tool as well. Got it with a battery and charger for $79. Only used it a couple of times, but it's not bad. Kills a standard battery pretty fast though.


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

If I were to find it with a battery and charger for that price, I'd jump on it in a heartbeat.


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## big2bird (Oct 1, 2012)

HackWork said:


> If I were to find it with a battery and charger for that price, I'd jump on it in a heartbeat.


Just watch the Home Dump ads. It's on sale here and there.


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## 220/221 (Sep 25, 2007)

You have a sawzall....right? 

Just get the right blade, or several expendables, and make your cuts.

If the dust is an issue have someone hold a vacuum or tape it to the sawzall.


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## drspec (Sep 29, 2012)

HackWork said:


> If I were to find it with a battery and charger for that price, I'd jump on it in a heartbeat.


I got the M12 right angle drill with a battery and charger for $20. :thumbup:

I rarely pay full price for any tools.


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## papaotis (Jun 8, 2013)

HackWork said:


> IMO the oscillating tool is something that an electrician can use often, so I don't think you would be wasting your money buying a decent one. You don't need the Fein, there are many others that work just as well. I am happy with my Rockwell. FWIW, I have talked to many people who are happy with the Harbor Freight model, so if you don't think you are going to use it a lot, I don't think you could go wrong with that.
> 
> IMO, an oscillating tool isn't best for such a long channel. It's going to be a lot of work. What you have is normal plaster on gypsum lath (or rock lath like you said, taken from the term sheetrock). It's much easier to deal with than plaster on wood or metal lath, but it's still plaster and could be hard to cut.
> 
> ...


 ill bet you could do this on every other stud an drill abd push to next hole. half as much repair!


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

papaotis said:


> ill bet you could do this on every other stud an drill abd push to next hole. half as much repair!


Yes, you could drill over thru the middle stud with a flexible bit, and it wouldn't be drilling blind since you could see from the other hole.

But it's just so easy to patch these 4" holes. I'm being serious when I say that all you gotta do is smear hot mud (the powder type that you mix, preferably 5 minute Sheetrock brand EasySand) over the plug and that's it. No tape, no feathering. The hot mud dries hard and strong like plaster, if you smear it in deep enough it will never crack.


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## papaotis (Jun 8, 2013)

are sure about it never cracking, or at least for a long time?


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

papaotis said:


> are sure about it never cracking, or at least for a long time?


I'll give you a 100% money back guarantee, how's that?


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## papaotis (Jun 8, 2013)

if only i could take that to bank:laughing:thanks hack


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## sparky970 (Mar 19, 2008)

If you can't afford $200, you are doomed


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## aftershockews (Dec 22, 2012)

sparkyforlife said:


> I have a job coming up adding outlets in a bedroom where I need to cut a long access strip to run wire. It's not actual drywall it's old stuff I think called rock lathe? Doesn't have wire or wood lathe behind it but harder then modern drywall and chips like plaster when you hit it.
> 
> Anyway I was thinking an oscillating tool? like a Fein? I have to cut out like a 12' long strip. I don't own an oscillating tool and don't want to spend $200 for a Fein but if I have to I'm sure I'll have to use it again.
> 
> The other way I thought was using a circular saw with a masonry blade but that would blow out an insane amount of dust.


We call it RockBoard. Your still dealing with plaster. I would go with a sawsall and a carbide tip blade on the distance you present.


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## 220/221 (Sep 25, 2007)

papaotis said:


> ill bet you could do this on every other stud an drill abd push to next hole. half as much repair!


Half as much square footage does not equal half as much repair.

For example, a 10x10" hole would take the same effort as a 20x20. His 12' x 12" strip will require the same amount of repair work as 6 smaller sections.

Now, if someone wanted to cut narrow 3/4" slots and snake around the studs, the repair would be significantly less as you would simply have to fill the small holes with patching compound.

I have learned that, once you get over an inch or so, you might as well cut a big enough hole to make your job easy.


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## sparkyforlife (Sep 4, 2012)

HackWork said:


> IMO the oscillating tool is something that an electrician can use often, so I don't think you would be wasting your money buying a decent one. You don't need the Fein, there are many others that work just as well. I am happy with my Rockwell. FWIW, I have talked to many people who are happy with the Harbor Freight model, so if you don't think you are going to use it a lot, I don't think you could go wrong with that.
> 
> IMO, an oscillating tool isn't best for such a long channel. It's going to be a lot of work. What you have is normal plaster on gypsum lath (or rock lath like you said, taken from the term sheetrock). It's much easier to deal with than plaster on wood or metal lath, but it's still plaster and could be hard to cut.
> 
> ...


Forgot to ask...do you nail plate the bottom of every joist?


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

sparkyforlife said:


> Forgot to ask...do you nail plate the bottom of every joist?


That all depends on the measurements.


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## sparkyforlife (Sep 4, 2012)

HARRY304E said:


> That all depends on the measurements.


I dont follow what do you mean?


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

sparkyforlife said:


> I dont follow what do you mean?



If your holes in the joists are more than 2" in then you really don't need nail plates.

I think in article 300 it's 1 1/4"


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## papaotis (Jun 8, 2013)

220/221 said:


> Half as much square footage does not equal half as much repair.
> 
> For example, a 10x10" hole would take the same effort as a 20x20. His 12' x 12" strip will require the same amount of repair work as 6 smaller sections.
> 
> ...


 post#87 by hack, and where are you getting square footage?


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## Cow (Jan 16, 2008)

HARRY304E said:


> If your holes in the joists are more than 2" in then you really don't need nail plates.
> 
> I think in article 300 it's 1 1/4"


Harry, he's referring to Hackwork cutting a slug out of the sheetrock and notching the stud to lay the wire in. Then screwing the slug back in the hole. That would require nailplates.


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## Switched (Dec 23, 2012)

Sounds like a lot of lathe and plaster to cut through......Lots of dust....Lots of debris.....Did you test it for Lead?

Remember, the EPA is out to get you!:laughing:


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## papaotis (Jun 8, 2013)

now that you mention it, that would require a plate, and then, how would you screw the cutout back in? sorry hack, glue?


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

sparkyforlife said:


> Forgot to ask...do you nail plate the bottom of every joist?


No, never. You would have to take more wood out to be able to fit a nail plate under the plug that you put back.


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

papaotis said:


> now that you mention it, that would require a plate, and then, how would you screw the cutout back in? sorry hack, glue?


Is a nail plate required in old work??

You can use an oscillating tool to remove enough wood off the face of the stud to fit a nail plate.

I just do the work where someone shouldn't be nailing. If they do, then more money for me to fix it.


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## big2bird (Oct 1, 2012)

HackWork said:


> Is a nail plate required in old work??
> 
> You can use an oscillating tool to remove enough wood off the face of the stud to fit a nail plate.
> 
> I just do the work where someone shouldn't be nailing. If they do, then more money for me to fix it.


Hack. If your adding a wire, how can you call it old work?:laughing:


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

big2bird said:


> Hack. If your adding a wire, how can you call it old work?:laughing:


If I snake a wire down a wall cavity, that's old work and doesn't have to be supported, right? :whistling2:



Don't ruin my Sunday morning by telling me all of my work over the years is illegal!! :thumbup::laughing:


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## big2bird (Oct 1, 2012)

HackWork said:


> If I snake a wire down a wall cavity, that's old work and doesn't have to be supported, right? :whistling2:
> 
> 
> 
> Don't ruin my Sunday morning by telling me all of my work over the years is illegal!! :thumbup::laughing:


Apples and oranges. 
When you go up a wall cavity, you staple it in the center to minimize damage. When you fish in a wall, any subsiquent fastener will push the wire away, preventing damage.
When you drill a stud in the center, you keep it centered. When you slot a stud, you have to protect it from damage.
"Where a nail should not normally be" is BS. You can't monitor the homeowner.
Not being too critical here, just sayin...........


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

big2bird said:


> Apples and oranges.


 You asked "_If your adding a wire, how can you call it old work?_". I gave an example of adding a wire in an old work situation.

I still question whether I need to keep the wire back or use nail plates in old work. I don't know either way.


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## big2bird (Oct 1, 2012)

HackWork said:


> You asked "_If your adding a wire, how can you call it old work?_". I gave an example of adding a wire in an old work situation.
> 
> I still question whether I need to keep the wire back or use nail plates in old work. I don't know either way.


I would say if you could keep it centered in the stud with a staple or other means, it would be fine. Otherwise, a plate.
Those who said a shallow groove behind a baseboard are asking for it. Baseboards aren't normally glued on. They are NAILED.


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

big2bird said:


> I would say if you could keep it centered in the stud with a staple or other means, it would be fine. Otherwise, a plate.
> Those who said a shallow groove behind a baseboard are asking for it. Baseboards aren't normally glued on. They are NAILED.


I drill holes out on the face of each stud, then make a shallow groove for the wire to sit in, then screw the plugs back in. I usually do it about 2' high where no nails should be going in.

I've done it behind the baseboard molding, but I am always the one to nail the molding back up.

I've also wrapped romex around the ceiling and then the homeowner had a carpenter come in and cover it with crown molding. So if that's allowed, then I'm not worried about not using nail plates when I notch the studs.


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## big2bird (Oct 1, 2012)

HackWork said:


> I've also wrapped romex around the ceiling and then the homeowner had a carpenter come in and cover it with crown molding. So if that's allowed, then I'm not worried about not using nail plates when I notch the studs.


That will be a hoot when the next homeowner doesn't like the look of crown moulding. "WTF is this?" :laughing::blink:


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## Southeast Power (Jan 18, 2009)

I just assumed that you would drill the hole deep enough to comply with the 1-1/2" requirement.

I guess you could drill it wide enough to install a kickplate in the hole sideways or something like that and then do the hot mud trick.
Also assuming the mud would hole the patch in place.


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## Next72969 (Dec 9, 2012)

HackWork said:


> I've also wrapped romex around the ceiling and then the homeowner had a carpenter come in and cover it with crown molding. So if that's allowed, then I'm not worried about not using nail plates when I notch the studs.


Was the moulding in the future plans or due to your work? Either way i got a kick out of that


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

jrannis said:


> I just assumed that you would drill the hole deep enough to comply with the 1-1/2" requirement.


 That would destroy the integrity of the stud/joist.



> I guess you could drill it wide enough to install a kickplate in the hole sideways or something like that and then do the hot mud trick.
> Also assuming the mud would hole the patch in place.


You put the plug back in and screw it to the stud/joist, then mud over it and you're done.


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## big vic (Jan 23, 2012)

http://www.lowes.com/pd_255390-54602-RK3440K_0__


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## sparkyforlife (Sep 4, 2012)

I'm still thinking of the best way to do this job.

Now I am thinking about running the 3 dedicated circuits from the panel out into the eave on the front of the apartment and back into the apartment to each location.

All the ceiling joists run perpendicular to the front eave. This would eliminate a ton of holes I would have to cut in the ceiling inside and I would only have to cut a few. Otherwise I would be cutting holes at every ceiling joist and I have to go across like 15+ of them.

Good idea?


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## papaotis (Jun 8, 2013)

sounds reasonable.


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

It's so hard to say without looking at it.


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## JoeKP (Nov 16, 2009)

sparkyforlife said:


> This is so unlike me but... HF has one for $40. I always buy quality name brand tools but a Fein is $200 and the last time I had to cut access strips that long was a long time ago. Not sure still thinking
> 
> http://www.harborfreight.com/variable-speed-multifunction-power-tool-67537.html


The blades are junk but the tool itself is great!


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## sparkyforlife (Sep 4, 2012)

HackWork said:


> It's so hard to say without looking at it.


Here I made this up real quick. All the red lines are the circuits/outlets I'm adding. The front eave is about 3 foot wide and runs down the whole building about 100 feet across the other apartments too.


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

You're still going to have to make holes in the ceilings above the receptacle locations. I would just go down the hallway with the feeds.

In the bedroom I would go around the wall. Either remove the molding or cut out holes on each stud.


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## sparkyforlife (Sep 4, 2012)

HackWork said:


> You're still going to have to make holes in the ceilings above the receptacle locations. I would just go down the hallway with the feeds.
> 
> In the bedroom I would go around the wall. Either remove the molding or cut out holes on each stud.


Yeah I know about the holes above each location. And I was planning to go down the hallway but I have to go across 15+ joists.

And like I was saying before every joist has to be nail plated too. Then I'll have to buy another hole saw because I bet I burn up the one I have on this material.


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## gold (Feb 15, 2008)

sparkyforlife said:


> Yeah but you know how much dust a circular saw will create inside a house. The place will look like a blizzard white out.


Circ is fastest IMO. A little happy say with a vacuum attached. Your gonna trash the blade tho in that stuff, maybe 2. I'd get a mason blade in a happy saw with a vac. Just my opinion tho, and yes you will need a lot of plastic. The circ also keeps a nice straight line so its easier to patch.


I got that corded oscillator from Rigid (has the interchangeable heads) with the jigsaw head. Good investment if you do any old work. It doesn't cut wood well or fast but with the jigsaw attachment and a quick swap. They work good together.

I used that oscillator once to cut a piece of paneling once to get behind it ... worked great.


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## Blaer (Mar 15, 2013)

I'm kind of disappointed at all the answers that are based on guessing, rather than any real experience. Being somewhat low on the totem pole, I get stuck with a lot of the less glamorous things - like cutting drywall.

A 12-ft cut is pretty long, and that has some influence on how you do it. Probably the most important detail is how much of a problem dust is.

Oscillating tools are great for cutting drywall- they're relatively quiet, and you don't kick dust into the air. You have great control, and can easily cut intricate shapes. For adding an old-work box, they can't be beat. If you're cutting old-style lath & plaster, there's not really any other decent way. The only drawback is that they are slow. 

If you've got a killer vacuum, a helper, and dust really isn't a concern, you really can't beat a circular saw, with the helper holding the vac hose in front of the blade. Hanging a board as a saw guide also helps corral the dust.

Router-type tools, like the Rotozip, work well, but really throw dust into the air. You can't deny they're pretty fast, though. I usually use mine with the optional 'saber saw' base.

For that matter, a normal saber saw does a pretty good job. Studs are a bit of a problem, and you don't want to slice through other stuff either.

The concern of damaging other stuff inside the wall pretty much rules out using a sawsall. It's also really embarrassing when you unknowingly punch through to the occupied office next door.

Even with all these fancy tools, sometimes the old way is best: score the path with your boxcutter, then chisel out the plaster between. There's almost no dust made, just large chips.

Now I need to ask the $1 Million dollar question: how will the wall be patched? Perhaps it will be better to make a larger hole.


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## 8V71 (Dec 23, 2011)

sparkyforlife said:


> Now I am thinking about running the 3 dedicated circuits from the panel out into the eave on the front of the apartment and back into the apartment to each location.


Thread killer!!:jester:

This and the asshole thread have been neck and neck from the start. I've been watching to see which thread will win. :laughing:


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

Blaer said:


> I'm kind of disappointed at all the answers that are based on guessing, rather than any real experience.


I've based all my posts on many years of experience working in houses with plaster and wood or gypsum lath.


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## gold (Feb 15, 2008)

Blaer said:


> I'm kind of disappointed at all the answers that are based on guessing, rather than any real experience.


No real experience here. Hail the apprentice. Now go get me coffee and when you get back there is a crawlspace that needs to be cleaned.


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