# Personal gangbox question



## johnniefive (Jul 27, 2016)

I’ve been in the trade for 8yrs now. I started and finished my apprenticeship and became a JW outside the union. 

One of the things that bothers me and happens both in and out of the union is the use of personal tools by other co-workers. In my non-union days I had a personal gang box because I was tired of my tools missing from company gang boxes, only time I ended up with a tool missing after that was if I loaned it out and never got it back. 

I’ve beeb a union sparky for almost 4yrs and I can say that getting your tools stolen rarely happens but recently on a new job I’ve been on, I’ve had tools go missing from my tool pouch a number times. So far I’ve replaced my lineman’s once, a beater screw driver 4 times and needle nose twice. Also on this job the shop provided a brand new dewalt cordless set with drills, saw, chargers and 5 batteries and **** always ends up missing. I’m beginning to miss being able to lock up my tools in my personal box because of this but I know stuff like that is frowned upon in the union

What I’m trying to get at is do any of you have your own box at your shops and how was that taken


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

47 years only worked with one tool thief that was an electrician, had other trades steal tools.

Must be a CA thing


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## telsa (May 22, 2015)

In my foreman days... I fired so many dudes for tool theft... I can't count that high.

One dude stole my Kleins ***** -- straight out of my tool sacks -- while I was wearing them.

Problem: we were walking right in front of a mirror.

Whoops. (!)


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## eddy current (Feb 28, 2009)

I had a guy steal expensive drill bits once. When I asked where the bits were He told me he took them because the office was giving him a hard time about loosing a parking receipt and wouldn't pay him back.

They owed him $11, he stole $200 worth in bits.


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## eddy current (Feb 28, 2009)

Get a big enough tool box that your pouch and all your tools can fit into and lock it.


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## macmikeman (Jan 23, 2007)

See what happens when you work around non union electricians? Rejoin the brotherhood brother and we will guard your screwdrivers with our very lives. 




Need I say anything else about this?


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## johnniefive (Jul 27, 2016)

macmikeman said:


> See what happens when you work around non union electricians? Rejoin the brotherhood brother and we will guard your screwdrivers with our very lives.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I think you misread the post. The recent theft has been occurring on a union job I’ve been on. Sharing a gangbox with others raises your chances of tools getting stolen. 

When I was non union I only had tools stolen till I got my own box where only I had access to it. Never had a tool stolen after that


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## macmikeman (Jan 23, 2007)

johnniefive said:


> I think you misread the post. The recent theft has been occurring on a union job I’ve been on. Sharing a gangbox with others raises your chances of tools getting stolen.
> 
> When I was non union I only had tools stolen till I got my own box where only I had access to it. Never had a tool stolen after that



See what happens when you work around Union Electricians!


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## TGGT (Oct 28, 2012)

Never had an issue. Must be the high California rent.

Sent from my SM-G930T using Tapatalk


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## Southeast Power (Jan 18, 2009)

I think it's very rare here.
The only tools we lost were to people outside of our electrical crew.
We have a tool list and that's it.
It's understood that if you bring in anything else, you had better keep it up your tush. The shop will only replace hand tools on the list and supplies everything else.
I had one guy bring in a small gang box. I told him not to put any of my crap in there and he wasn't to put any of his crap in mine.
I was very leery about a box rolling around that I didn't have a key to.


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## MechanicalDVR (Dec 29, 2007)

I had one of those small Greenlee boxes in my company truck to secure my own tools and never had any problems.

In your case I'd get a metasl toolbox that holds whatever you aren't carrying on you.


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## Southeast Power (Jan 18, 2009)

MechanicalDVR said:


> I had one of those small Greenlee boxes in my company truck to secure my own tools and never had any problems.
> 
> In your case I'd get a metasl toolbox that holds whatever you aren't carrying on you.


I've seen strong boxes like that inside of vans. I would like to see something like a gang box turned on end like a gun safe. That seems to me like it would be easy to keep organized.


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## MechanicalDVR (Dec 29, 2007)

Southeast Power said:


> I've seen strong boxes like that inside of vans. I would like to see something like a gang box turned on end like a gun safe. That seems to me like it would be easy to keep organized.


Yeah it wasn't huge (@32"x 20") but it held my bags and all well.


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## splatz (May 23, 2015)

I haven't had that much theft on construction sites but one job in particular there was constant pilfering. I am 99% sure most of it was a few bad apples from one of the three union electrical contractors on the job. 

I didn't have enough proof to actually confront them but I decided I did have enough to go to their foremen at lunch and lose my mother****ing mind ranting like an idiot about what was going to happen if so much as one more roll of tape went missing on me. 

The theft did stop after that, but looking back it probably would have been fine to just call it to the attention of the foremen and skip the terroristic threats. But then again once in a while going full maniac is the right thing to do. 

But yeah, anyone that says "not electricians" or "not union electricians," that was then, this is now.


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## Southeast Power (Jan 18, 2009)

I'm on a site with a couple of other union contractors and we constantly borrow back and forth and help eachother out with material and equipment.
We try to keep it quid pro quo. I'm only talking a bout a bundle of pipe or a box of fittings, piece of all thread, maybe our bender is closer to where they are working or us near theirs. 
We always ask eachothers foreman not just any of the guys unless it's a couple pieces of hardware or a fitting.
I'll agree it's a rare situation. you have to have the right people and a quasi etiquette in place to pull it off.


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## splatz (May 23, 2015)

I was not counting the "borrowing" tape, lube, string, etc. as theft. It was a bit of a nuisance creating unexpected supply house runs but these things happen. When borrowing on purpose I'd expect a call text or note, but realistically I think a lot of guys just saw supplies lying around and assumed they were for grabs. A lot of the guys were not used to working with other electrical contractors around. 

I am talking about diamond core bits, radios, duct rodder, gopher pole, batteries and a charger with my name on them, stuff like that, stolen not borrowed or mixed up, stolen.


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## Chris1971 (Dec 27, 2010)

Buy cheap tools or paint your existing tools pink.


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## Southeast Power (Jan 18, 2009)

splatz said:


> I was not counting the "borrowing" tape, lube, string, etc. as theft. It was a bit of a nuisance creating unexpected supply house runs but these things happen. When borrowing on purpose I'd expect a call text or note, but realistically I think a lot of guys just saw supplies lying around and assumed they were for grabs. A lot of the guys were not used to working with other electrical contractors around.
> 
> I am talking about diamond core bits, radios, duct rodder, gopher pole, batteries and a charger with my name on them, stuff like that, stolen not borrowed or mixed up, stolen.


I see. That either a thief or a conspiracy to make it very tough to work on that site.
I'm not saying I condone it but, there was a time when it was very, very risky to be a non-Union crew on a 100% union job.
It's not always other electricians that would remove your tools and materials from the jobsite or bury them, weld them shut. There are plenty of those stories out there but, that was a long time ago. I don't know of any contemporary stories like that.


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## splatz (May 23, 2015)

Southeast Power said:


> I see. That either a thief or a conspiracy to make it very tough to work on that site.
> I'm not saying I condone it but, there was a time when it was very, very risky to be a non-Union crew on a 100% union job.
> It's not always other electricians that would remove your tools and materials from the jobsite or bury them, weld them shut. There are plenty of those stories out there but, that was a long time ago. I don't know of any contemporary stories like that.


There was some of that going on. There was some sabotage of installed and uninstalled materials reported at another nearby job going on at the same time. That one was a prevailing wage job. This one was union only - no prevailing wage for non-union - which I don't even think is legal. 

I was allowed to work due to an exception allowing owners to work without being union members - supposedly. But another owner was thrown off the same job after the union made a stink about him. He was the exact same status as me doing the same work, but for whatever reason I was tolerated, he was not. 

He had a contract but they said he could take them to court, but if he showed up, they'd call the cops to remove him. They paid him for what he had in the job and he did not fight city hall. 

Now a lot of people thought it was really out of line to promise to fly a plane into their job trailer right after the food truck left, over a roll of tape. But what they do, no problem. That is some hypocritical bull**** right there.


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## Southeast Power (Jan 18, 2009)

splatz said:


> There was some of that going on. There was some sabotage of installed and uninstalled materials reported at another nearby job going on at the same time. That one was a prevailing wage job. This one was union only - no prevailing wage for non-union - which I don't even think is legal.
> 
> I was allowed to work due to an exception allowing owners to work without being union members - supposedly. But another owner was thrown off the same job after the union made a stink about him. He was the exact same status as me doing the same work, but for whatever reason I was tolerated, he was not.
> 
> ...


I found out if someone wanted to remove me for being a working owner, they would need to pay off my contract. I would be all for that. :whistling2:


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## manchestersparky (Mar 25, 2007)

when I ran work, I told the guys the gang boxes were provided to store and secure company tools and various materials. Any personnel items left in them was done so at their own risk and was not covered by insurance or any thing else. 
Yes there was thefts but he guys understood they took the risk and it was on them.
Me personally never left personnel items in company boxes ,unless it was one of the many prison/ jail projects I did. But then again it was rare I was using my tools on most of the jobs I ran. They were safely locked in my truck.
I also made it very clear anyone caught stealing anything was terminated not just just from my project but from the company on the spot. All my projects were PW projects so theft was rare as guys didn't want to risk losing a PW job. But there were those who did steal and were terminated.
I had no issue with a guy wanting to use his own gang box on my projects. They understood that if it was chained to something and needed to be moved and they were not around I would cut the chain and move it ( did it a few times and re-locked it up using a company lock until they the next day). Hell I had my own gang box


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## MechanicalDVR (Dec 29, 2007)

splatz said:


> There was some of that going on. There was some sabotage of installed and uninstalled materials reported at another nearby job going on at the same time. That one was a prevailing wage job. This one was union only -* no prevailing wage for non-union* - which I don't even think is legal.


That isn't legal in any manner and the labor board would have had a field day with that going on.

All the time I spent working on military/government support projects was all PW and that went for anyone that stepped onsite for 15 minutes.

Seen several of the GCs get busted for breaking the rules with extra sets of books and using illegals and that type thing, also seen the fines they got when they were published in the newspapers.


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## TGGT (Oct 28, 2012)

MechanicalDVR said:


> That isn't legal in any manner and the labor board would have had a field day with that going on.
> 
> All the time I spent working on military/government support projects was all PW and that went for anyone that stepped onsite for 15 minutes.
> 
> Seen several of the GCs get busted for breaking the rules with extra sets of books and using illegals and that type thing, also seen the fines they got when they were published in the newspapers.


Still painfully common...

Sent from my SM-G930T using Tapatalk


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## MechanicalDVR (Dec 29, 2007)

TGGT said:


> Still painfully common...
> 
> Sent from my SM-G930T using Tapatalk


Sometimes one has to drop a dime and see what happens.


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## active1 (Dec 29, 2009)

You can take your tools home with you.
Lock them up in a tool box.
I got a plastic Dewalt box with a slam latch I like from HD.
It does have a spot for a lock.
The lock could be defeated.
But at that point you have a clear theft and not maybe you lost it.
I learned anytime you have tools exposed open for display to some it's like a buffet free for all.

If you have a steward you could talk to them.

That said there is some reason for what's happening to you.
Are others missing tools also? If so then it may be people from another trade or company.
Is it a union / non-union job?
Lots of other trades there?
Are the tools missing when in the gang box at night, when you turn around, after break, or go to the toilet?

One person that want's to build their collection wouldn't keep taking the same tool.
Tools are valuable, but a beater screwdriver is hardly worth the gas to get there if sold at a pawn shop.

If your the only one missing tools then someone has it out for you.
Get in an argument with anyone? 
Are you bringing tools to work not on the tool list? Sometimes those turn up missing.
Taking breaks like you should?
Or anything else considered wormy?
Did you organize in, not going to the JATC apprenticeship?
There are a few (insert descriptive negative word) that will always hate you for that.
Not condoning any of the above. Just saying some of the mentality.


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## kg7879 (Feb 3, 2014)

I wouldn't get a gangbox that goes against the contract. Obviously, report it to your foreman because contractors are responsible for providing a safe place for your tools. 

I hope it isn't a fellow electrician but that does happen from time to time. Like others have suggested maybe buy a toolbox that locks up.


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## active1 (Dec 29, 2009)

Forgot about what kg7879 said.
Your contract might require the employer to cover theft.

We have several contracts. I don't think the show contract covers tools, where construction does. For shows we walk in and out every day with our tools. They don't provide gang boxes for personal tools.


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## splatz (May 23, 2015)

MechanicalDVR said:


> That isn't legal in any manner and the labor board would have had a field day with that going on.
> 
> All the time I spent working on military/government support projects was all PW and that went for anyone that stepped onsite for 15 minutes.


No I did not mean there were people not paid prevailing wage - if I understand correctly, that would be in violation of the Davis Bacon act. I mean there was no non-union prevailing wage allowed to work, UNION ONLY. 

I believe it's actually illegal for public work to REQUIRE union membership for all labor. Everyone's supposed to have an equal shot at public work. It doesn't seem fair that someone can't have a shot at a fair wage for work they are qualified to do because they aren't a member of the union. 

The kickbacks from workers to employers on prevailing wage work are definitely a problem but I don't think it's fair to exclude everyone else because some of them are dirty. If they got even slightly serious about enforcing those laws they could catch these guys very easily. Most of the perpetrators are morons, not master criminals.


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## MechanicalDVR (Dec 29, 2007)

splatz said:


> No I did not mean there were people not paid prevailing wage - if I understand correctly, that would be in violation of the Davis Bacon act. I mean there was no non-union prevailing wage allowed to work, UNION ONLY.
> 
> I believe it's actually illegal for public work to REQUIRE union membership for all labor. Everyone's supposed to have an equal shot at public work. It doesn't seem fair that someone can't have a shot at a fair wage for work they are qualified to do because they aren't a member of the union.
> 
> The kickbacks from workers to employers on prevailing wage work are definitely a problem but I don't think it's fair to exclude everyone else because some of them are dirty. If they got even slightly serious about enforcing those laws they could catch these guys very easily. Most of the perpetrators are morons, not master criminals.


I've never seen non-union guys excluded from a project, that is total BS an I wouldn't be surprised if there were some envelopes being handed out behind closed doors.

The guys I have seen busted were idiots far from master criminals that had some major fines handed down.


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## splatz (May 23, 2015)

MechanicalDVR said:


> I've never seen non-union guys excluded from a project, that is total BS an I wouldn't be surprised if there were some envelopes being handed out behind closed doors.
> 
> The guys I have seen busted were idiots far from master criminals that had some major fines handed down.


There was a LOT of crooked stuff going on, which is totally normal around here, but this was a new one - out in the open, in the RFPs, a union labor requirement. 

But this is in a place about as crooked as you can get without travelling to Louisiana.


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## MechanicalDVR (Dec 29, 2007)

splatz said:


> There was a LOT of crooked stuff going on, which is totally normal around here, but this was a new one - out in the open, in the RFPs, a union labor requirement.
> 
> But this is in a place about as crooked as you can get without travelling to Louisiana.


I have about 20 years of NJ under my belt, yeah maybe Louisiana is worse but not sure how much really. . .


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## cabletie (Feb 12, 2011)

splatz said:


> No I did not mean there were people not paid prevailing wage - if I understand correctly, that would be in violation of the Davis Bacon act. I mean there was no non-union prevailing wage allowed to work, UNION ONLY.
> 
> *I believe it's actually illegal for public work to REQUIRE union membership for all labor.* Everyone's supposed to have an equal shot at public work. It doesn't seem fair that someone can't have a shot at a fair wage for work they are qualified to do because they aren't a member of the union.
> 
> The kickbacks from workers to employers on prevailing wage work are definitely a problem but I don't think it's fair to exclude everyone else because some of them are dirty. If they got even slightly serious about enforcing those laws they could catch these guys very easily. Most of the perpetrators are morons, not master criminals.


Not 100% sure, but I thought that's what project labor agreements were for.


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## cabletie (Feb 12, 2011)

For the longest time our tool list had a lockable toolbox just for this reason. It was very rare that I saw someone with a lock on their toolbox. The locking requirement was taken out of the contract about ten years ago. The main requirement is to have your required tools near you, in a tool bag or box, not out in your car or truck. 

The job I'm on now most guys have a company issue lockable tool cart. Everyone is issued a changeable combination lock, and the combination you choose is on file with the general Forman. All company issued tools are also on file with the tool number.

It's amazing how many company tools get left out and gangboxes left open. Some guys are just completely oblivious to housekeeping and locking up ladders. It's brought up every week. It's usually those guys that can never find material even if there standing on it.


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