# time clock



## uber stein (Aug 20, 2010)

How do you EC's pay your guys for the day? 

(A) Does their time stop when they leave the last job and head back to the shop to go home

(B) Does their time end when they get back to the shop to go home?


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

Depends on whether they're in a company truck.


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## jza (Oct 31, 2009)

uber stein said:


> How do you EC's pay your guys for the day?
> 
> (A) Does their time stop when they leave the last job and head back to the shop to go home
> 
> (B) Does their time end when they get back to the shop to go home?


Time starts when we leave the shop in the morning (in company vehicle). Time stops when we leave the job (unless we're very far from the shop).

Not fair in my opinion. We should be paid when we leave the shop until we get back to the shop.


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## uber stein (Aug 20, 2010)

480sparky said:


> Depends on whether they're in a company truck.



Yea, company van and i have to lock up the van.. After 5 minutes of hassling the bosses for the gate key to lock up van.

Today was 45 minute drive back to shop then wasting more time calling boss to see what he wanted to do with van since no one was at shop.


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

In the US, most laws state that if if you're in company truck, you're on the clock.

I can see this thread turning into an ugly pro-union one.


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## uber stein (Aug 20, 2010)

Not trying to make anything ugly but tired of wasting my time. 

I love to aggravate the owner in the mornings. Time starts at 7:30, at 7:22 he usually wants me to get the van pulled around front and start loading materials. I just stand there and look at my watch


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

uber stein said:


> Not trying to make anything ugly but tired of wasting my time. ......


Comment wasn't directed at you... it's directed at the hardcore union people who will tell you you're a rat that cannot stand up for himself and allows himself to become a whore for the company so the boss can make tons of money off your free work.


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## Frasbee (Apr 7, 2008)

My current employer, and another employer I had not too long ago wanted you at the shop a half hour early.

That half hour is not paid.

My current employer wants you back at the shop and GONE by the end of the day.

The other employer didn't want to see you until half an hour to a whole hour after you were off his clock. To him, 6:30-4:30 = 8 hours.


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

Frasbee said:


> ............The other employer didn't want to see you until half an hour to a whole hour after you were off his clock. To him, 6:30-4:30 = 8 hours.


Huh?









You show up at the shop at 3:30, clock out, and you're supposed to disappear for an hour, _then_ go home?


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## Frasbee (Apr 7, 2008)

480sparky said:


> Huh?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


No, he only wanted to pay you for as long as you were on the job. So you didn't leave the site until 3:30, and in the half hour-hour that it would take us to get back and lock up was unpaid.

EDIT: And he didn't mind if you stayed late to finish the job, but you weren't going to get paid for that either.


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## captkirk (Nov 21, 2007)

Time starts when they show up in the morning and stops when the last job of the day is done... They basically dont get paid for the ride home...


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## Bob Badger (Apr 19, 2009)

480sparky said:


> In the US, most laws state that if if you're in company truck, you're on the clock


Ditto that.


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## JTMEYER (May 2, 2009)

On the clock at 7, shoot the bull with boss till 7:20-30, close garage door at 3:30 and go home.


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## Shockdoc (Mar 4, 2010)

I'm back woods, pay is $160 to $200 for the day which is normally 7 am to 4:30 pm quit. My days goes by quota or profit. Some days go from 7 am to 7pm to achieve this.


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## tates1882 (Sep 3, 2010)

uber stein said:


> How do you EC's pay your guys for the day?
> 
> (A) Does their time stop when they leave the last job and head back to the shop to go home
> 
> (B) Does their time end when they get back to the shop to go home?


 
If I go to the shop in the morning or pick up another employee then time starts. Other wise time starts when I pull up to the job and stops when I get in the van to leave. I hate the way they do it but eveyone gets punished for a few people padding their time. I also take my truck home everynight so it saves me about $200/month in fuel in my pov. Keeping track of all the unpaid travel time and will seek compensation after I leave this company, this is the second time I will have to do this to a company.


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## Magnettica (Jan 23, 2007)

Bob Badger said:


> Ditto that.


Have you been listening to Rush?


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## Magnettica (Jan 23, 2007)

Shockdoc said:


> I'm back woods, pay is $160 to $200 for the day which is normally 7 am to 4:30 pm quit. My days goes by quota or profit. Some days go from 7 am to 7pm to achieve this.


Sometimes even longer than that!


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## mattsilkwood (Sep 21, 2008)

Most of our work is within 15 minutes of the house and the company trucks go home with us, so normally we get paid for time on the job or traveling between jobs. If we do have any kind of travel time we get paid one way. If it's far enough to stay out we get paid both ways.


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## jay_bolton (Feb 26, 2009)

I get paid from the moment I punch in at the shop to the moment I punch out at the shop and go home. Travel is paid both ways.


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

I get paid by the job.


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## Mr. Sparkle (Jan 27, 2009)

captkirk said:


> Time starts when they show up in the morning and stops when the last job of the day is done... They basically dont get paid for the ride home...


kirk, 

You might want to look into the labor laws in regards to stopping the clock when you leave the job, I think in NJ the law states employee is paid until they get back to the shop if they do not take the van home. FYI, I'm only relaying a message here not trying to bust your balls.


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

Mr. Sparkle said:


> kirk,
> 
> You might want to look into the labor laws in regards to stopping the clock when you leave the job, I think in NJ the law states employee is paid until they get back to the shop if they do not take the van home. FYI, I'm only relaying a message here not trying to bust your balls.



Why should they get paid to ride around:laughing::laughing::laughing::laughing:


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## Bob Badger (Apr 19, 2009)

Magnettica said:


> Have you been listening to Rush?



Phuck no!:laughing:


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

Magnettica said:


> Have you been listening to Rush?





Bob Badger said:


> Phuck no!:laughing:


Rush told Bob to say that! :thumbup:


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## Jbird66 (Oct 26, 2010)

My guys drive their vans when ever and to where ever they want. I guess I better look at the labor laws I do not want to have to pay them on Saturday to go do some work at their parents house or to help a friend.


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## manchestersparky (Mar 25, 2007)

Basically it depends on IF the boss *requires *you to come to the shop / office in the mornings and in the evenings.
If the boss requires you to return to the shop then you are to be paid till you arrive and have completed any required tasks ( parking /locking vehicles,putting tools away ).
If the boss require you to go to the shop first thing in the morning then your time / pay starts at the time you are required to arrive.


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

Jbird66 said:


> My guys drive their vans when ever and to where ever they want. I guess I better look at the labor laws I do not want to have to pay them on Saturday to go do some work at their parents house or to help a friend.


Uh, you may want to rethink that 'policy'. What happens when they're driving your van drunk as a skunk at 3 AM and they take out a carload of people?


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## Jbird66 (Oct 26, 2010)

480sparky said:


> Uh, you may want to rethink that 'policy'. What happens when they're driving your van drunk as a skunk at 3 AM and they take out a carload of people?


In most circumstances I would totally agree.

All my guys are long term and that is one thing I do not worry about at all.

I went to a Christmas party last year to find a room full of people drinking at the open bar and 2 of my guys were sitting there drinking soda. I showed up and grabbed a beer and they asked if they could have 1 also. I told them I would have 1 and that is the limit. We all drank our 1 beer and went back to soda. 

Its hard to explain but my guys realize that we are a team. Without me they do not eat and with out them I do not eat. Its a shame more employees and employers can not embrace the idea that together we can all make money


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## Dennis Alwon (May 9, 2009)

I pay my guys travel time to and from the job. They come to the shop in the morning - time starts-- they come back at the end of the day- time stops. If they get home early because they finished they still get paid for the day.


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

480sparky said:


> I get paid by the job.


And sometimes they make you wait for ever:no:


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## Pilky (Oct 20, 2009)

Boss likes us there for 7:15

We get paid from 7:30 - 4:00 for 8 hours, no pay for the ride back to the shop.


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## Zog (Apr 15, 2009)

Dennis Alwon said:


> I pay my guys travel time to and from the job. They come to the shop in the morning - time starts-- they come back at the end of the day- time stops. If they get home early because they finished they still get paid for the day.


Yep, that is the way I do it too. Some field jobs are budgeted for a certian amount of time, they finish it early, they still get paid. 

This thread is a little shocking to me, seems like a lot of employers looking to screw employees out a an hour here and an hour there. I am pretty easy I guess, pay guys for all sorts of stuff that is not really work.


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

Pilky said:


> Boss likes us there for 7:15
> 
> We get paid from 7:30 - 4:00 for 8 hours, no pay for the ride back to the shop.


So you get back to the shop by 3:45 right:laughing::laughing:


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

Pilky said:


> Boss likes us there for 7:15
> 
> We get paid from 7:30 - 4:00 for 8 hours, no pay for the ride back to the shop.


If you're there at 7:15 loading tools, material, etc... you're legally on the clock starting at 7:15 _no matter what the boss says or wants_. And if you're in a company truck on the way back to the shop and don't arrive until 4:30, your day ends at 4:30 _no matter what the boss says or wants_.


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## lordlondis (Oct 28, 2010)

I worked for a guy who used to not pay us for the ride back and we called up the local labor board and were told that it goes by whatever the employer and employee agree to. So if you are hired and told that you wont get paid then thats what it is. If you always got paid for it then the employer couldnt take it away.


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## Bob Badger (Apr 19, 2009)

Zog said:


> Yep, that is the way I do it too. Some field jobs are budgeted for a certain amount of time, they finish it early, they still get paid.
> 
> This thread is a little shocking to me, seems like a lot of employers looking to screw employees out a an hour here and an hour there. I am pretty easy I guess, pay guys for all sorts of stuff that is not really work.


Trying to compare your business situation with ECs is laughable.:laughing:

Your business is as different from typical EC business as Kia's are to Bentley's. 

That said I still agree with Ken, if they are required to be at the shop at 6AM that is when the time starts and if they are required to end the day at the shop that is when the time starts.


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## Mike_586 (Mar 24, 2009)

Bob Badger said:


> Trying to compare your business situation with ECs is laughable.:laughing:
> 
> Your business is as different from typical EC business as Kia's are to Bentley's.
> 
> That said I still agree with Ken, if they are required to be at the shop at 6AM that is when the time starts and if they are required to end the day at the shop that is when the time starts.


I get what you're saying and I agree with it, but when does it end? 

:laughing:


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## oldtimer (Jun 10, 2010)

Mike_586 said:


> I get what you're saying and I agree with it, but when does it end?
> 
> :laughing:


Like this thread, NEVER ! :whistling2:


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## Zog (Apr 15, 2009)

Bob Badger said:


> Trying to compare your business situation with ECs is laughable.:laughing:
> 
> Your business is as different from typical EC business as Kia's are to Bentley's.
> 
> That said I still agree with Ken, if they are required to be at the shop at 6AM that is when the time starts and if they are required to end the day at the shop that is when the time starts.


How so?

We, and testing companies I worked for in the past usually have job assignments each day. You show up at the office, load your van with the test equipment and tools needed for that day and go out to visit 1-4 customers for that day, at the end of the day you drive you van back to the shop and unload your equipment. Usually these guys are electricians, and often they are IBEW. 

How is that so different?


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

Mike_586 said:


> I get what you're saying and I agree with it, but when does it end?
> 
> :laughing:


Your day ends when you return the company-owned vehicle to the shop..... later if you must do any sort of company-related tasks (remove excess material from vehicle, or load material needed for the next day, or fill out paperwork, etc.)


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## MDShunk (Jan 7, 2007)

Zog said:


> How so?
> 
> We, and testing companies I worked for in the past usually have job assignments each day. You show up at the office, load your van with the test equipment and tools needed for that day and go out to visit 1-4 customers for that day, at the end of the day you drive you van back to the shop and unload your equipment. Usually these guys are electricians, and often they are IBEW.
> 
> How is that so different?


You'll have to forgive the confusion. From some of your early posts, we were lead to believe that you honcho the nuclear division, with trucks like this:


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## Zog (Apr 15, 2009)

We have normal vehicles too.


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## Mike_586 (Mar 24, 2009)

480sparky said:


> Your day ends when you return the company-owned vehicle to the shop..... later if you must do any sort of company-related tasks (remove excess material from vehicle, or load material needed for the next day, or fill out paperwork, etc.)


Like I said to Bob's post, I get (what he meant if not what he wrote) it and agree with it completely. 

I was poking fun at how it was worded....



> That said I still agree with Ken, if they are required to be at the shop at 6AM *that is when the time starts* and if they are required to end the day at the shop *that is when the time starts*.


....he keeps clocking in but never clocks out :jester:


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

Mike_586 said:


> .................he keeps clocking in but never clocks out :jester:


Well, that's Bob! He puts in 178 hours a week.

I was just so floored he was agreeing with me, I couldn't read straight.


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## Jlarson (Jun 28, 2009)

480sparky said:


> Well, that's Bob! He puts in 178 hours a week.


I think we are talking about time on the job, not on the various forums. :laughing:


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

Jlarson said:


> I think we are talking about time on the job, not on the various forums. :laughing:


Yes, we are.


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## MarkyMark (Jan 31, 2009)

Every State is different, but in NC you have to pay for driving time both to and from the shop. In some cases you do not have to pay riding time for a passenger.

http://www.nclabor.com/wh/fact sheets/driving_riding_time.htm


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## Bob Badger (Apr 19, 2009)

Zog said:


> How so?
> 
> We, and testing companies I worked for in the past usually have job assignments each day. You show up at the office, load your van with the test equipment and tools needed for that day and go out to visit 1-4 customers for that day, at the end of the day you drive you van back to the shop and unload your equipment. Usually these guys are electricians, and often they are IBEW.
> 
> How is that so different?


It is a lot different.

How many legitimate competitors do you have?

I bet you can count on one hand the number of companies that can provide all the services you can.

How many competitors does the typical EC have .... countless

I doubt you will want to say them here but what are your typical percentages made on your jobs?

I bet they are more than 50%.

What are typical ECs taking work at now?

More like 5%.

Your typical customers, regardless of the economy do they really have much of a choice if they employ a testing company?

An ECs typical customer can certainly decide not put that addition on, or add that second production line etc.


I am in no way trying to give you a hard time, you are in a niche market which is awesome, good for you and I mean that.

ECs are not in a niche market, typical ECs are a dime a dozen.


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## local134gt (Dec 24, 2008)

If you drive a company vehicle from your house to the job and back you should get paid for time on the job only. If you have to pick the van up at the shop and return it each day then your time should start and end at the shop.

Thats how it works at the shop I work for and sounds fair to me! And if you drive a company vehicle they pay gas and tolls.


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## B4T (Feb 10, 2009)

Dennis Alwon said:


> I pay my guys travel time to and from the job. They come to the shop in the morning - time starts-- they come back at the end of the day- time stops. If they get home early because they finished they still get paid for the day.


Dennis.. you should get a plaque for being good to your men.. :thumbsup:

I thought those days were long gone where an employee gets done early and the boss is nice enough to pay him for the day..

Don't ever change.. good guys are hard to find these days..


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## miller_elex (Jan 25, 2008)

Lately, I was surprised to get paid for some windshield time. 

WTF?? Is this a kinder, gentler America?

The shop also wants to pay for cheap motel rooms AND $30 for meals a day on the road. Am I dreaming? I only ever worked for PM's who want to bend me over! (metaphorically, don't get excited Frasbee.)

Now for the real shocker... the van had less than 1000 miles on it. If the boss doesn't bend me over, I may do it voluntarily. What is this new strategy of being nice to employees? Is it destined for failure?


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## miller_elex (Jan 25, 2008)

480sparky said:


> it's directed at the hardcore union people who will tell you you're a rat that cannot stand up for himself and allows himself to become a whore for the company so the boss can make tons of money off your free work.


Go find a non-TR receptacle, and stuff that tiny weeny of yours into the right side.

I even picked up materials on the way home for free because I know how the numbers roll.


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## miller_elex (Jan 25, 2008)

tates1882 said:


> If I go to the shop in the morning or pick up another employee then time starts. Other wise time starts when I pull up to the job and stops when I get in the van to leave. I hate the way they do it but eveyone gets punished for a few people padding their time. I also take my truck home everynight so it saves me about $200/month in fuel in my pov. Keeping track of all the unpaid travel time and will seek compensation after I leave this company, this is the second time I will have to do this to a company.


Awww shucks.... sounds like you got a winner there.... NOT!


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## miller_elex (Jan 25, 2008)

Zog said:


> This thread is a little shocking to me, seems like a lot of employers looking to screw employees out a an hour here and an hour there.


I've worked for contractors who want every single minute of your time. Others still, it felt like they wanted every second too. Aka sweat shops.


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## miller_elex (Jan 25, 2008)

480sparky said:


> Your day ends when you return the company-owned vehicle to the shop.....


I've gone whole months without setting foot in the shop. Need something? The shop boy delivers it. Paperwork included.


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## 76nemo (Aug 13, 2008)

Zog said:


> How so?
> 
> We, and testing companies I worked for in the past usually have job assignments each day. You show up at the office, load your van with the test equipment and tools needed for that day and go out to visit 1-4 customers for that day, at the end of the day you drive you van back to the shop and unload your equipment. Usually these guys are electricians, and often they are IBEW.
> 
> How is that so different?


 

"Usually these guys are electricians, and often they are IBEW."

"How is that so different?"


How the **** can I answer that politely?


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## Wirenuting (Sep 12, 2010)

We are 7 to 3:30 here. If we work off site the start time is the same but we get 32 cents a mile travel pay. OT is normally minimal for me. But some bosses live on it. 
I don't like to squeeze the customer for the OT cost. Besides I like my off time.


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## Greg (Aug 1, 2007)

The company I work pays from when you show up at the shop in the morning till you get back in the afternoon. I can take my van home but do not because of HOA and still get paid. The guys that take their vans home get paid until they are home. The company has GPS in the vehicles so there is no cheating on the time. Everyone is honest because we do not want to lose the privilege.


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