# Shopping for a Ferrule Crimper



## splatz (May 23, 2015)

I have to land some category cables on regular DIN rail terminal blocks. The minimum wire size for the terminal blocks is 18AWG and category cables are 23 or 24 awg. So far I have been using a butt splice to splice a few inches of 18 awg onto the 24 awg, which works OK but not great. 

I was thinking about using ferrules instead but I'd need the crimper. The circular crimp type look like they are either real expensive from high end tool makers or real cheap knockoffs. 










I'd rather not spend over $200 on a crimper, but I avoid the knockoffs. The only one I found in between is the Knipex 97 71 180 which is not the circular type, but I am thinking I might take the simpler high quality tool over the cheapo fancy tool. 










Anyone used the Knipex? Does it work with generic ferrules? It's rated for .25mm2 which means 23 awg min, not 24awg, but I think that will work out for me.


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## nrp3 (Jan 24, 2009)

Remind me, whats a ferrule?


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## VELOCI3 (Aug 15, 2019)

Strip the wire back further and fold over the cable or take a short section of #18 solid and wrap the 22 around it then insert it. 


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## splatz (May 23, 2015)

nrp3 said:


> Remind me, whats a ferrule?


The main use is to put a nice solid end on a stranded wire so there's no whiskers sticking out making shorts or getting bunged up when you insert it in the terminal block.


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)




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## splatz (May 23, 2015)

VELOCI3 said:


> Strip the wire back further and fold over the cable or take a short section of #18 solid and wrap the 22 around it then insert it.


I have tried folding it over, or folding it over and twisting it, and I'll do it in a pinch but it has not worked great. Wrapping a bit of larger wire is a good idea but I want this to be idiot proof or at least idiot resistant so that maintenance staff can work on it with no issues. I could see someone removing the wire, losing the scrap bit, replacing it and getting a lousy connection.


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## VELOCI3 (Aug 15, 2019)

How many are you landing? 


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## nrp3 (Jan 24, 2009)

I've seen those before, now I know what they are called.


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## splatz (May 23, 2015)

VELOCI3 said:


> How many are you landing?
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


About 320 if everything goes perfect the first time but you know how that goes


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

What about a solder pot?


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## splatz (May 23, 2015)

HackWork said:


> View attachment 142556


Now THAT is a nice crimper!


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## splatz (May 23, 2015)

HackWork said:


> What about a solder pot?


That's a good idea for avoiding the whiskering, I might use that for other connections in these little panels now that you mention it. 

But I am more just trying to build up the diameter of the 24 awg to 18 awg or better so the terminal clamp can get a grip on the wire.


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## nrp3 (Jan 24, 2009)

So, you're working with network cables? What are you using to strip the actual conductors themselves without stripping. I see my hands and wrists cramping up after a day of doing that. The out jacket is no problem, but working with the conductors must be a pain.


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## VELOCI3 (Aug 15, 2019)

Pro way is ferrules or (if possible) use something like the Schneider Electric term blocks that go down to #24. 


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## VELOCI3 (Aug 15, 2019)

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## splatz (May 23, 2015)

nrp3 said:


> So, you're working with network cables? What are you using to strip the actual conductors themselves without stripping. I see my hands and wrists cramping up after a day of doing that. The out jacket is no problem, but working with the conductors must be a pain.


I used to use Excelite adjustable strippers for repetitive things like this because you set it and there's just one hole, you don't have to look for the right hole every time. 










Now I use the automatic strippers for work in panels, they make the strip length consistent and quick. The Knipex 12 62 180 is the best one I have but the Felo is good too. 










I actually keep the Knipex set to the terminal block strip length and the Felo set to the Phoenix block strip length so I don't have to monkey with them.


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## pjones (Oct 7, 2019)

HackWork said:


> What about a solder pot?




You can get a poor connection when using tinned ends. Soldered wire is not smooth and does not conform well so you get poor contact area. It’s not recommended. 

A ferrule is the right product for the job and makes installation and rework much easier than bare wire alone. 


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## splatz (May 23, 2015)

VELOCI3 said:


>


Damn! I was mistaken, I just checked the specs for the terminal blocks and they are actually rated for 24AWG. 

But I was having the wires fail the tug test too often and checked the specs, I must have looked at the wrong blocks when I checked. 

Maybe I should still use the ferrules ... whatever the spec says, I had too many failing the tug test. Yeah I guess I will in the interest of making it idiot-resistant.


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## joe-nwt (Mar 28, 2019)

Speaking from experience, don't waste your time with crimpers made for lugs or wrapping solid wire around stranded. You will just increase your frustration. My advice is to bite the bullet and buy a quality crimper. 

I have the Pheonix Contact 1202072 kit. Comes with assorted ferrules from 24-10AWG. They also make a kit with only the bigger ferrules. Kit comes with a wire stripper as well. Extra ferrules are readily available, even the double wire/single ferrule variety. 

Not saying that kit is the best or the cheapest. There are likely other kits of the same quality that would serve you as well, just offering a starting point in your search.

The only other advice I can offer is to never, ever knock the kit off the bench onto the floor. Picking up and sorting hundreds of tiny ferrule will test your patience like it has never been tested before. Trust me.:vs_no_no_no:


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## varmit (Apr 19, 2009)

A Panduit #CT1003 is a really nice ferrule crimper. i have had one for many years. It is a little pricey, but very quick to use as the die is self adjusting. Just strip wire, put ferrule on wire, insert in end of crimper, and mash handles.
It lists #26 as minimum.


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

splatz said:


> Now THAT is a nice crimper!


It is pretty nice and for $200 it's a good price. It's just too bad that it won't do (2) #4's :sad:


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## splatz (May 23, 2015)

varmit said:


> A Panduit #CT1003 is a really nice ferrule crimper. i have had one for many years. It is a little pricey, but very quick to use as the die is self adjusting. Just strip wire, put ferrule on wire, insert in end of crimper, and mash handles.
> It lists #26 as minimum.


If it was even $100 I'd just buy it but it looks like over $300  

If I spring for one, you bet I'll be buying the Knipex too just for the sake of comparison.


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## micromind (Aug 11, 2007)

VELOCI3 said:


> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Phoenix Contact, Eaton and Schnider are all identical except for the brand marking. 

If the wire is solid, I can't see any reason to use a ferrule.

With small solid wire, I usually overstrip and fold the bare part over so effectively there's 2 wires under the terminal. Even if the block is rated for the wire size.


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## MotoGP1199 (Aug 11, 2014)

I have a cheap knockoff set of the circular ones you pictured. Kit was like $20 or $30 on amazon and came with a few hundred assorted ferrules. They are adjustable and have worked fine for a few years now.

EDIT:
https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B07212XQTV/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_search_asin_title?ie=UTF8&psc=1

Now for regular RED/BLUE/YELLOW crimps I use the KNIPEX that are $150 and they are a HUGE improvement over standard crimpers. For ferrules I have not had a problem with the cheap crimpers.


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## gpop (May 14, 2018)

Wally world 20 bucks.

Ive used this brand for years with out a problem.


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## Breakfasteatre (Sep 8, 2009)

I use these strippers for tew and control wiring. These do not work well with t90 because of the nylon jacket










and i use these for ferrules











the strippers can also strip the jacket off of a 4 conductor, 24awg sensor cable without damaging the conductors underneath

you can purchase both the stripper and ferrule crimper with a cable cutter in a package. I think it was around 200 canadian copacks about 5 years ago


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## GatorIE (Mar 22, 2020)

I've used ferrule crimpers from just about every common manufacturer--Weidmuller, Knipex, Panduit, BM Group (unfortunate name there), and a number of off-brand models. I have a set of the non-ratcheting half-moon crimpers you linked in your first post (the Knipex 97 61 145) and a pair of the square-die ratcheting crimpers also sold by Knipex (97 53 18). There's a huge price difference and both of them are handy for different purposes. The manual set are nice because they're easier to carry in your pocket/tool pouch if you're only terminating a couple wires here and there, but for control panel work where many terminations are required, you'll appreciate the repeatability and the fact that there is no requirement to choose the correct die position.


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## splatz (May 23, 2015)

Great info, thanks! 





GatorIE said:


> I've used ferrule crimpers from just about every common manufacturer--Weidmuller, Knipex, Panduit, BM Group (unfortunate name there), and a number of off-brand models. I have a set of the non-ratcheting half-moon crimpers you linked in your first post (the Knipex 97 61 145) and a pair of the square-die ratcheting crimpers also sold by Knipex (97 53 18). There's a huge price difference and both of them are handy for different purposes. The manual set are nice because they're easier to carry in your pocket/tool pouch if you're only terminating a couple wires here and there, but for control panel work where many terminations are required, you'll appreciate the repeatability and the fact that there is no requirement to choose the correct die position.


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## mburtis (Sep 1, 2018)

I have the klein ratcheting crimper frame with the dies for ferrules. It seems to do an alright job even though I haven't used it all that much. Don't remember how small it will go down to though. Have regular red,yellow,blue dies for it as well that I really like. Its import but seems to be nice enough and wasn't very expensive.


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## Mbit (Feb 28, 2020)

I was going to make the same post and then found yours.


I'm currently carrying around the Knipex self adjusting crimper but I want to switch to the pliers style of Knipex that you linked to if they do a decent job.


Did you use them?


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## splatz (May 23, 2015)

Mbit said:


> I was going to make the same post and then found yours.
> 
> 
> I'm currently carrying around the Knipex self adjusting crimper but I want to switch to the pliers style of Knipex that you linked to if they do a decent job.
> ...


Not yet, based on post #27 I think they will be fine but I didn't order yet.


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## just the cowboy (Sep 4, 2013)

I used about 2000 Ferrules when I move our plant. The best way I found was to use the terminal strip to crimp them. I think it was John V that said to do it that way. Yes some people said it was not compliant but I had better success than with a crimper. I just slid the ferrule on the wire and tightened it in the term strip. Tug test worked and connection was flat and Undamaged. I found the crimper sometimes put a bend in the ferrule. 


Cowboy


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## Mbit (Feb 28, 2020)

Ok the one I have now is amazing and no complaints other that the size and weight.


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## GatorIE (Mar 22, 2020)

Sorry to bring up an old thread but I was just thinking about this discussion today and have to ask... where in the world is @HackWork getting 2x4AWG ferrules?? I'm pretty sure the DIN 46228 ferrules aren't available in sizes over 2x6AWG or even single-1AWG (while remaining UL-listed). I've never seen anything bigger than a 2x6AWG in the wild but I'm curious to know if they're out there.

Additionally, I'm pretty sure a 2x4AWG ferrule would be the same diameter as a 1AWG single ferrule when considering cross-sectional area (2x4AWG is 2x25mmsq and 1AWG is 50mmsq). So, while maybe not exactly kosher, I'm sure you could use a ferrule with either an auto-adjusting die or a specific die for 1AWG ferrules to get a nice crimp on the elusive 2x4AWG ferrule.


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## MotoGP1199 (Aug 11, 2014)

GatorIE said:


> Sorry to bring up an old thread but I was just thinking about this discussion today and have to ask... where in the world is @HackWork getting 2x4AWG ferrules?? I'm pretty sure the DIN 46228 ferrules aren't available in sizes over 2x6AWG or even single-1AWG (while remaining UL-listed). I've never seen anything bigger than a 2x6AWG in the wild but I'm curious to know if they're out there.
> 
> Additionally, I'm pretty sure a 2x4AWG ferrule would be the same diameter as a 1AWG single ferrule when considering cross-sectional area (2x4AWG is 2x25mmsq and 1AWG is 50mmsq). So, while maybe not exactly kosher, I'm sure you could use a ferrule with either an auto-adjusting die or a specific die for 1AWG ferrules to get a nice crimp on the elusive 2x4AWG ferrule.


I've only seen doubles in 6awg and smaller but McMaster does carry singles up to 4/0


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

GatorIE said:


> Sorry to bring up an old thread but I was just thinking about this discussion today and have to ask... where in the world is @HackWork getting 2x4AWG ferrules?? I'm pretty sure the DIN 46228 ferrules aren't available in sizes over 2x6AWG or even single-1AWG (while remaining UL-listed). I've never seen anything bigger than a 2x6AWG in the wild but I'm curious to know if they're out there.
> 
> Additionally, I'm pretty sure a 2x4AWG ferrule would be the same diameter as a 1AWG single ferrule when considering cross-sectional area (2x4AWG is 2x25mmsq and 1AWG is 50mmsq). So, while maybe not exactly kosher, I'm sure you could use a ferrule with either an auto-adjusting die or a specific die for 1AWG ferrules to get a nice crimp on the elusive 2x4AWG ferrule.


Not ferrules. I just want a small crimper to crimp together 2 #4 copper conductors.


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## MTW (Aug 28, 2013)

Estwing makes a good one.


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## GatorIE (Mar 22, 2020)

MotoGP1199 said:


> I've only seen doubles in 6awg and smaller but McMaster does carry singles up to 4/0


I took a look at the Zoller-Frohlich catalog we typically order from and found the same thing on the doubles and singles up to 350. Still no sign of a 4AWG double.



HackWork said:


> Not ferrules. I just want a small crimper to crimp together 2 #4 copper conductors.


Gotcha, that makes a lot more sense. I spent way too long looking for a 2x4AWG ferrule and thought you had secured the only source of the rare beast.



MTW said:


> Estwing makes a good one.











Available in tons of different crimping pressures AND it's easily adjustable. :smile::smile:


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## bill39 (Sep 4, 2009)

just the cowboy said:


> I used about 2000 Ferrules when I move our plant. The best way I found was to use the terminal strip to crimp them. I think it was John V that said to do it that way. Yes some people said it was not compliant but I had better success than with a crimper. I just slid the ferrule on the wire and tightened it in the term strip. Tug test worked and connection was flat and Undamaged. I found the crimper sometimes put a bend in the ferrule.
> 
> 
> Cowboy


There is no way doing it how you described is acceptable. I have had to troubleshoot and repair wiring/ferrule installs like yours and it is a real pain.

I would fire you in a heartbeat for doing this and backcharge you for the time it took to fix it.


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