# Kitchen island Receptacle



## WronGun (Oct 18, 2013)

Ok where do I put a Receptacle ?! Left side all draws , right side is trash been ? Puzzled










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## 99cents (Aug 20, 2012)

Do you have room for a shallow box in the side? If not, the back is the only choice.


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## Dennis Alwon (May 9, 2009)

On the back sides between the drawer and the back. Use the sillite receptacles


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## Dennis Alwon (May 9, 2009)

You drill an 1 3/4" hole and Voila-- 2 screws that go in at an angle can be seen in the second photo above


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## 99cents (Aug 20, 2012)

That's cool. Do they make a duplex?


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## Dennis Alwon (May 9, 2009)

99cents said:


> That's cool. Do they make a duplex?


No it would defeat the purpose but it is TR

You could use 2 of them one above the other but usually no one wants them anyway so these are great

http://sillite.com


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## WronGun (Oct 18, 2013)

Dennis Alwon said:


> On the back sides between the drawer and the back. Use the sillite receptacles




Nice , never seen them .. do they take MC or just romex?


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## Dennis Alwon (May 9, 2009)

WronGun said:


> Nice , never seen them .. do they take MC or just romex?
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


They used to be listed for mc but they lost that listing but it will take 2- 12/2 nm cables-- I have done it and it is not that difficult to install. Of course it is easier with just one cable.


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

I often sleeve a piece of 3/8" flex over romex to protect it in situations like that. Same end result as using MC, but easier.


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## Dennis Alwon (May 9, 2009)

HackWork said:


> I often sleeve a piece of 3/8" flex over romex to protect it in situations like that. Same end result as using MC, but easier.


I assume you don't put the mc under the connector.. Most of the time the nm is behind a drawer so I never protect it


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

Dennis Alwon said:


> I assume you don't put the mc under the connector.. Most of the time the nm is behind a drawer so I never protect it


Usually I use a 2-screw romex connector that is rated for MC, and I will put the flex into it. 

But in the situation of the OP, he can run the flex right up to (but not inside of) the outlet that you posted to protect it.


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## griffws (Oct 24, 2008)

I use plug-mold if I can't cut in a box.

http://www.legrand.us/wiremold/at-h...r-strips/pm-plugmold-multi-outlet-strips.aspx


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

Hey WronGun, how big is the counter going to be? is it going to have a large overhang for sitting at? 

If so, it might be easier to just surface mount a WireMold box like this up high underneath the counter where it's hard to see:

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B...0_4?ie=UTF8&psc=1&refRID=PBPXXV7VWW91A53C9TTN

Paint it brown to blend in with the cabinets.


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## Majewski (Jan 8, 2016)

dennis alwon said:


> on the back sides between the drawer and the back. Use the sillite receptacles


cool!


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## drspec (Sep 29, 2012)

These are the tits when you have no room

http://tasklighting.com/angle-power-strip/


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## splatz (May 23, 2015)

There's these...










you can mount them tall ways or wide ways

http://ecatalog.hubbell-wiring.com/press/catalog/X-28.pdf


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## Drsparky14 (Oct 22, 2016)

Left side, horizontal where the drawers won't hit it


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## ppsh (Jan 2, 2014)

Rear or side with one of these, just cut out your opening with an oscillating tool.


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## frenchelectrican (Mar 15, 2007)

Normally I useally install in backside but just give you a heads up on backside watch for the back of cabent for their filler sheet sorta like a thin plywood that is prestained to match the cabent.

somecase I use the side depending how far the overhang it going be on backside. 

I useally use the shallow box unless you got a overlayer on backside then I can switch over to standard depth box on the backside.


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## Dennis Alwon (May 9, 2009)

ppsh said:


> Rear or side with one of these, just cut out your opening with an oscillating tool.


Please explain how an 8 cu in box is compliant with a device and #12 wire.


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## telsa (May 22, 2015)

WronGun said:


> Ok where do I put a Receptacle ?! Left side all draws , right side is trash been ? Puzzled
> 
> 
> 
> ...


It's hard to believe that the bin goes all the way to the back.


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## daveEM (Nov 18, 2012)

WronGun said:


> Ok where do I put a Receptacle ?! Left side all draws , right side is trash been ? Puzzled


Easy. Left side, rear.

Cab guy will shorten the drawer. Really. Might not even squawk.  Receptacle is code, drawer depth is optional.

Done that a few times.

I put a full size box in too. You have room for the wire behind so he only adjusts the top drawer.

Cab guy I get to cut the hole. I don't like being accused of scratching the finish. 

1/2" screws, 2 hole straps folded to secure the wire of course, - or shorter.


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## splatz (May 23, 2015)

HackWork said:


> I often sleeve a piece of 3/8" flex over romex to protect it in situations like that. Same end result as using MC, but easier.





Dennis Alwon said:


> I assume you don't put the mc under the connector.. Most of the time the nm is behind a drawer so I never protect it





daveEM said:


> Easy. Left side, rear.
> 
> Cab guy will shorten the drawer. Really. Might not even squawk.  Receptacle is code, drawer depth is optional.


I tend to be a worrier in general but I'd worry about NM back there. That's not dead space like inside a wall. When you overstuff a drawer things often hang out the back, and the person closing it will usually try force before trying to rearrange the drawer. So if a knife or spatula is hanging over the back, they could be jamming that into your cable. 

I like the idea of shortening the drawer to make room for the box.


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## daveEM (Nov 18, 2012)

splatz said:


> I tend to be a worrier in general but I'd worry about NM back there. That's not dead space like inside a wall. When you overstuff a drawer things often hang out the back, and the person closing it will usually try force before trying to rearrange the drawer. So if a knife or spatula is hanging over the back, they could be jamming that into your cable.
> 
> I like the idea of shortening the drawer to make room for the box.


Some guys will just cut the corner out others start up their table saw and wack off 3 or 4 inches. 

Sometimes a shorter slide is required on the box side.

I'm with you on protecting the wire.


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## 99cents (Aug 20, 2012)

Shortening a drawer is a good trick during reno work when you need to find a place to hide a junction box too  . 

For cutting the hole, I use a Hackzall with the jigsaw blade and put painter's tape on the cabinet so it won't get marred. I fasten the flex/BX with stickybacks and tie wraps (maybe code even allows that now).


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

99cents said:


> Shortening a drawer is a good trick during reno work when you need to find a place to hide a junction box too  .
> 
> For cutting the hole, *I use a Hackzall with the jigsaw blade* and put painter's tape on the cabinet so it won't get marred. I fasten the flex/BX with stickybacks and tie wraps (maybe code even allows that now).


Do you use the wood or metal jigsaw blade?

I know that it seems like the wood blade would be best, but sometimes the metal blade with the smaller teeth cuts better and doesn't kickback which can damage the cabinet.


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## 99cents (Aug 20, 2012)

HackWork said:


> Do you use the wood or metal jigsaw blade?
> 
> I know that it seems like the wood blade would be best, but sometimes the metal blade with the smaller teeth cuts better and doesn't kickback which can damage the cabinet.


The wood one. I didn't know they made a metal one. The metal one might be better because splinters wouldn't be an issue (the painter's tape helps).

M12 Hackzall is better for cabinets because the M18 is less forgiving.

You also have to wait for the Hackzall blade to stop before you pull it out of the cabinet. Otherwise, you can jab the cabinet and you have some explaining to do. I have never done it on cabinetry but on drywall a million times.


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## telsa (May 22, 2015)

In all finish work, you want fine blades -- with plenty of teeth.


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## Dennis Alwon (May 9, 2009)

Do be careful of the overhang. If the overhang on all sides is more than 6" then you are in deep do-do.... You would need a pop up receptacle


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

telsa said:


> In all finish work, you want fine blades -- with plenty of teeth.


That's why I was thinking of these: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B...9_3?ie=UTF8&psc=1&refRID=MJVF69T70YCZZ3PEKDE1

Instead of these: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B...g_3?ie=UTF8&psc=1&refRID=2B666G24WDBEVBVP4ABE

But I wanted people's real world experience first.


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## splatz (May 23, 2015)

There are a ridiculous selection of blades for jigsaws and they don't cost much, they make blades just for this kind of thing...

https://www.boschtools.com/us/en/boschtools-ocs/t-shank-jig-saw-blades-for-wood-t101ao-29830-p/


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

splatz said:


> There are a ridiculous selection of blades for jigsaws and they don't cost much, they make blades just for this kind of thing...
> 
> https://www.boschtools.com/us/en/boschtools-ocs/t-shank-jig-saw-blades-for-wood-t101ao-29830-p/


We are talking about jigsaw style blades with a sawzall style shank so they will work in a hackzall


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## 99cents (Aug 20, 2012)

HackWork said:


> That's why I was thinking of these: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B...9_3?ie=UTF8&psc=1&refRID=MJVF69T70YCZZ3PEKDE1
> 
> Instead of these: https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B...g_3?ie=UTF8&psc=1&refRID=2B666G24WDBEVBVP4ABE
> 
> But I wanted people's real world experience first.


The wood blade has fairly fine teeth, certainly finer than a Milwaukee Ax. My concern with the metal jigsaw blade is that it might be too fine and you burn your way through rather than cut it. I think painter's tape and the wood blade are the way to go.


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## 99cents (Aug 20, 2012)

Dennis Alwon said:


> Do be careful of the overhang. If the overhang on all sides is more than 6" then you are in deep do-do.... You would need a pop up receptacle


Is that a code requirement down there?


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## OldMasterTech (Mar 12, 2014)

daveEM said:


> Easy. Left side, rear.
> 
> Cab guy will shorten the drawer. Really. Might not even squawk.  Receptacle is code, drawer depth is optional.
> 
> ...


If you shorten a drawer also add a drawer stop to match new depth, otherwise someone could swap the drawers and hit your work with the longer one.


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## frenchelectrican (Mar 15, 2007)

frenchelectrican said:


> Normally I useally install in backside but just give you a heads up on backside watch for the back of cabent for their filler sheet sorta like a thin plywood that is prestained to match the cabent.
> 
> somecase I use the side  depending how far the overhang it going be on backside.
> 
> I useally use the shallow box unless you got a overlayer on backside then I can switch over to standard depth box on the backside.





Dennis Alwon said:


> Do be careful of the overhang. If the overhang on all sides is more than 6" then you are in deep do-do.... You would need a pop up receptacle





99cents said:


> Is that a code requirement down there?


99cents.,
it is written in the NEC code for a quite a while and more than 6" inches can get ya a red tag if you are not aware of that. 

that why I always have to make a alternative location in case of overhang get ya due most appalinces do have very short cord about 2 feet or so.


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## PlugsAndLights (Jan 19, 2016)

WronGun said:


> Ok where do I put a Receptacle ?! Left side all draws , right side is trash been ? Puzzled
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Is there 2.25" between back of top drawers and back of cabinet? 
If so, I'd mount the box to the back of the cabinet, sticking out the side. 
Use either a 2104 or plastic 1 gang. Put coreline sleeve over nmd 
attached to back panel with band iron and SHORT SCREWS(same 
goes for the box). 
How far away is the sink? Up here you need GFI if within 1.5m. 
If so, I'd use plastic 1 gang. 
One "gotcha" is that the back panel has to be thick enough that the 
plug plate won't overhang. Spacing the box towards the front would
fix this, if there's room. 
P&L


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## telsa (May 22, 2015)

WronGun said:


> Ok where do I put a Receptacle ?! Left side all draws , right side is trash been ? Puzzled
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Is it my tired eyes ?

These look like bookended units that will have a gap between them.

The cabinetry is not such that they'll sit flush and adjacent.

Elaborate, please.


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## Drsparky14 (Oct 22, 2016)

I prefer a rotozip with a wood blade or 
I use this tool with my oscillating cutter. 

https://www.amazon.com/SQ1000-S-Oscillating-Multi-Tool-Single-Outlet/dp/B01GKKE2W0


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## Dennis Alwon (May 9, 2009)

99cents said:


> Is that a code requirement down there?


Yep, it is



> (5) Receptacle Outlet Location. Receptacle outlets shall
> be located on or above, but not more than 500 mm (20 in.)
> above, the countertop. Receptacle outlet assemblies listed
> for the application shall be permitted to be installed in
> ...


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## electricguy (Mar 22, 2007)

Drsparky14 said:


> I prefer a rotozip with a wood blade or
> I use this tool with my oscillating cutter.
> 
> https://www.amazon.com/SQ1000-S-Oscillating-Multi-Tool-Single-Outlet/dp/B01GKKE2W0
> ...


looks like drywall only


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## telsa (May 22, 2015)

electricguy said:


> looks like drywall only


Get a load of its price tag... and how rarely you'd use it.


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## drspec (Sep 29, 2012)

99cents said:


> The wood one. I didn't know they made a metal one. The metal one might be better because splinters wouldn't be an issue


if youre worried about splinters you could always score the wood with a razor blade before cutting


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## Drsparky14 (Oct 22, 2016)

telsa said:


> Get a load of its price tag... and how rarely you'd use it.




I used this tool at least 2-3 times a week. I have bought one for each of my trucks. 

Perfect hole every time, and I can hold a vacuum in one hand and the tool in another. Leaving no mess from drywall or cabinets. Well worth the investment in my opinion. 


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## Going_Commando (Oct 1, 2011)

Does it cut holes that are metal 1 gang box sized or the large 1 gang cut in plastic?


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## Dennis Alwon (May 9, 2009)

I thought about designing something like that 20 years ago but what I didn't like was once you start that's it. With a keyhole saw you can feel for obstructions without making a big mess


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## splatz (May 23, 2015)

Dennis Alwon said:


> I thought about designing something like that 20 years ago but what I didn't like was once you start that's it. With a keyhole saw you can feel for obstructions without making a big mess


This is true, your stud finder better be exactly right if it's in a wall. Again a good hand saw doesn't take much more time expecially if it saves you a trip to the truck. 

I had a really nice retractable compass saw, a Japanese one, it was the same size as a utility knife. I cut the hole for a mail slot in my grandfather's door with it, I used his eggbeater drill to make the starter holes. He couldn't believe it worked. I had to give him that saw


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## 99cents (Aug 20, 2012)

Dennis Alwon said:


> I thought about designing something like that 20 years ago but what I didn't like was once you start that's it. With a keyhole saw you can feel for obstructions without making a big mess


Agreed. I'm always cautious and start with a small hole and make it bigger. If I have a 1" hole saw handy, that's a good start.


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

99cents said:


> Agreed. I'm always cautious and start with a small hole and make it bigger. If I have *a 1" hole saw* handy, that's a good start.


Even that is a little big, if you hit a stud you might not be able to cover it with the plate.

That's why I have always done like splatz mentioned in another post and cut with a jabsaw until I hit something.


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## 99cents (Aug 20, 2012)

HackWork said:


> Even that is a little big, if you hit a stud you might not be able to cover it with the plate.
> 
> That's why I have always done like splatz mentioned in another post and cut with a jabsaw until I hit something.


Yep, that's even better  .


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

With all due respect to Drsparky14, I don't think that box contraption is going to cut thru a cabinet with any efficiency, if at all. It's only rated for drywall, if it could cut wood they would say so.

I am also waiting for Drsparky14 to explain how 240V appliances are much more efficient than 120V because of all the lost power that goes down the neutral.


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## 99cents (Aug 20, 2012)

HackWork said:


> With all due respect to Drsparky14, I don't think that box contraption is going to cut thru a cabinet with any efficiency, if at all. It's only rated for drywall, if it could cut wood they would say so.
> 
> I am also waiting for Drsparky14 to explain how 240V appliances are much more efficient than 120V because of all the lost power that goes down the neutral.


He found a contraption that works for him. This site works best with the free flow of ideas on how we get things done.


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

99cents said:


> He found a contraption that works for him. This site works best with the free flow of ideas on how we get things done.


Thanks mom.

No one is trying to stop the free flow of ideas. I simply said that I don't believe it cuts wood easily. 

Right now it's you who appears to be trying to stop my free flow of ideas.


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## 99cents (Aug 20, 2012)

HackWork said:


> Thanks mom.
> 
> No one is trying to stop the free flow of ideas. I simply said that I don't believe it cuts wood easily.
> 
> Right now it's you who appears to be trying to stop my free flow of ideas.


Maybe it does work in wood. Yesterday I used thermostat wire as a fish tape. It worked.


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## splatz (May 23, 2015)

I am pretty sure drsparky is not old enough to drive. 

When you make a plunge cut in wood with the oscillating blades, they often melt right through for a fraction of an inch then stop dead, you have to rock the blade to change angles or etc. I think it's because they don't clear the sawdust out of the kerf but I am not sure. 

I'd love to see video of that box cutter zipping right through some 3/4" furniture grade plywood, that would convince me it works. I still won't buy it right now, but I'll believe it works  I'd buy it if I had a job where I knew I'd be doing a BUNCH.


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

99cents said:


> Maybe it does work in wood. Yesterday I used thermostat wire as a fish tape. It worked.


Maybe it does work in wood. 

As I mention two other times, I personally don't believe that it would cut wood easily or with any efficiency. I would be impressed to see that it does, and still curious why the manufacturer didn't put wood on the rating.


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## splatz (May 23, 2015)

HackWork said:


> Thanks mom.
> 
> No one is trying to stop the free flow of ideas. I simply said that I don't believe it cuts wood easily.
> 
> Right now it's you who appears to be trying to stop my free flow of ideas.


This Sam and Diane back and forth thing you two do has been entertaining but I'm ready for you to just sleep together already this season.


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## 99cents (Aug 20, 2012)

I'm always suspicious of a comment that begins with "With all due respect"...


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## 99cents (Aug 20, 2012)

splatz said:


> This Sam and Diane back and forth thing you two do has been entertaining but I'm ready for you to just sleep together already this season.


I agree. Diane needs to settle down.


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

splatz said:


> I am pretty sure drsparky is not old enough to drive.


 Agreed. After his electrical theory posts and his complaining about people who use Wiggy's being 80+ year olds, I came to the same conclusion. But this thing with 99cents has boiled over from elsewhere. 



> When you make a plunge cut in wood with the oscillating blades, they often melt right through for a fraction of an inch then stop dead, you have to rock the blade to change angles or etc. I think it's because they don't clear the sawdust out of the kerf but I am not sure.
> 
> I'd love to see video of that box cutter zipping right through some 3/4" furniture grade plywood, that would convince me it works. I still won't buy it right now, but I'll believe it works  I'd buy it if I had a job where I knew I'd be doing a BUNCH.


That tool cutting thru wood would be awesome for paneling. But it's just too good to be true.

I think the oscillating tool would bog down too much since the blade on that contraption would be trying to cut way too much wood at one time. You've got what, 11" of blade trying to cut?


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

99cents said:


> I'm always suspicious of a comment that begins with "With all due respect"...


I was trying to be nice instead of just saying outright that I think he's a fraud like spatz did.


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## 350X (May 20, 2016)

With all due respect to Mr. Hack work. Careful bud, your panties get too tight and your bound to step in the boo-B trap. Then the transformation will be complete-I am Cait.


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

350X said:


> With all due respect to Mr. Hack work. Careful bud, your panties get too tight and your bound to step in the boo-B trap. Then the transformation will be complete-*I am Cait*.


You are? 

And where are the boobies?


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## Drsparky14 (Oct 22, 2016)

Going_Commando said:


> Does it cut holes that are metal 1 gang box sized or the large 1 gang cut in plastic?




Larger 1 gang plastic 


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## drspec (Sep 29, 2012)

Im going to buy the qbit just to test it out in wood

Ive wasted more money on worse things so if it doesnt work oh well


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## Dennis Alwon (May 9, 2009)

For cabinets and wood walls I always used a sawzall. I loved to watch the cabinet guy's face when I would pull that out. He would say "I have a jigsaw" Nah-- I have always used a sawzall.... The trick is to score the cutout with a knife drill a hole and cut away. 

Now in cabinets we always use the sillite receptacle. Drill a 1 3/4" hole and you're done.

My guess use the oscillating tool- Takes too long IMO


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## WronGun (Oct 18, 2013)

These sillites are a pain to get ! No amazon prime for this one 


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## Dennis Alwon (May 9, 2009)

WronGun said:


> These sillites are a pain to get ! No amazon prime for this one
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Years ago I forced my supply company to get an account. They are very happy that they did as they sell lots of them.

Before TR receptacles came out I called sillite receptacle company and got the owner. When I said my name he said "I know you. You advertise my product for me on the electrical forums."

I was surprised but I asked him what it would take to get my supplier to get an account. The rest is history--that was many years ago.


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## drspec (Sep 29, 2012)

Ive used the sillite receptacles a few times in the past. Theyre ok and work when you are limited on space.

Im partial to the task lighting angle strips now. Easy, fast install and tuck right under the overhang.


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## Majewski (Jan 8, 2016)

Dennis Alwon said:


> Years ago I forced my supply company to get an account. They are very happy that they did as they sell lots of them.
> 
> Before TR receptacles came out I called sillite receptacle company and got the owner. When I said my name he said "I know you. You advertise my product for me on the electrical forums."
> 
> I was surprised but I asked him what it would take to get my supplier to get an account. The rest is history--that was many years ago.


I know someone famous!


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## Gnome (Dec 25, 2013)

Drsparky14 said:


> I prefer a rotozip with a wood blade or
> I use this tool with my oscillating cutter.
> 
> https://www.amazon.com/SQ1000-S-Oscillating-Multi-Tool-Single-Outlet/dp/B01GKKE2W0


That looks amazing.

And it's too bad those sillites don't have a Canadian listing.


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