# Judging someone from their tools?



## heavysparky (Jun 2, 2009)

Went to a good sized commercial bid today. The Owner had Myself and some other guy there to bid the job. When I saw what tools . the guy had with him. I could not help but think hack and bottom feeder.

The guy a pair of Husky ***** and some cheap dollar store screwdriver. I had to loan him my lantern to see in the basement. I knew I had lost the bid. But I decided to be an ass and ask the guy some questions. He was asking to borrow tools and ladders. 


anyway does anyone else judge other tradesmen on their tools


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## jett95 (Sep 18, 2012)

If you dont have klien, ideal and fluke you are a hack. Point blank period


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## Big John (May 23, 2010)

If a guys tools are so cheap/busted/nonexistent that he can't get the job done, you bet I judge him. 

No different than if I called a taxi and they showed up on a moped.


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## ampman66 (Dec 5, 2012)

If I were the owner, those tools and the fact that he was borrowing stuff that he should have brought with him from you would have raised a red flag for me.


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

heavysparky said:


> Went to a good sized commercial bid today. The Owner had Myself and some other guy there to bid the job. When I saw what tools . the guy had with him. I could not help but think hack and bottom feeder.
> 
> The guy a pair of Husky ***** and some cheap dollar store screwdriver. I had to loan him my lantern to see in the basement. I knew I had lost the bid. But I decided to be an ass and ask the guy some questions. He was asking to borrow tools and ladders.
> 
> ...



He probably calling around right now getting other peoples prices...


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## Pete m. (Nov 19, 2011)

ampman66 said:


> If I were the owner, those tools and the fact that he was borrowing stuff that he should have brought with him from you would have raised a red flag for me.


I could be wrong but I would bet the owner only looks at the bottom dollar.

Pete


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## ampman66 (Dec 5, 2012)

Pete m. said:


> I could be wrong but I would bet the owner only looks at the bottom dollar.
> 
> Pete


 No doubt.
There are owners who actually care about quality, even if it costs a bit more, but they're a dying breed.


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## heavysparky (Jun 2, 2009)

ampman66 said:


> No doubt.
> There are owners who actually care about quality, even if it costs a bit more, but they're a dying breed.


true.

Got the call That I was way over priced a few minutes ago oh well.

The job was a big one and the bottom feeder bid it at wages


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## heavysparky (Jun 2, 2009)

This was the job. It was replacing all of this and reloacting the service point to outside the building. From inside. Whole building needs rewired. Upgraded to code. Big job. 
Dude bid it for dope money


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## B4T (Feb 10, 2009)

Is Pete M a moderator now.. he is in block letters...

Back to tools.... I can't get used to seeing professional electricians using their "pockets" for tools instead of a tool belt...

It just looks hack to me... I have always been around guys wearing the right apparatus to do the right job..:whistling2:


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## ampman66 (Dec 5, 2012)

heavysparky said:


> true.
> 
> Got the call That I was way over priced a few minutes ago oh well.
> 
> The job was a big one and the bottom feeder bid it at wages


 Sorry to hear that.
It looks like it would have been a good job, but nothing worth losing your shirt over.
The idiot who won the job isn't going to make any money. He's probably using it to keep his guys working, and stay afloat.
But....you never know.
You may get a call-back.


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## bkmichael65 (Mar 25, 2013)

There are some hacks that camouflage themselves with quality tools, so the brand of tools someone uses isn't a good gauge of their skills


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## Hippie (May 12, 2011)

bkmichael65 said:


> There are some hacks that camouflage themselves with quality tools, so the brand of tools someone uses isn't a good guage of their skills


No but going to bid a job with no flashlight is


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## bkmichael65 (Mar 25, 2013)

Hippie said:


> No but going to bid a job with no flashlight is


True. If a someone showed up to bid a job and didn't have what he needed, I would cross him off the list right there


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## MTW (Aug 28, 2013)

heavysparky said:


> anyway does anyone else judge other tradesmen on their tools


Yes, absolutely. They hired a guy at work a few months ago. He shows up with his tools in a broken $5 Workforce tool box (the really small one.) He has the cheapest Stanley screwdrivers, those really awful generic pliers and *****, a socket set from Job Lot (store like Big Lots). The only real tools he has are Klein lineman pliers but they are all rusty and the blades are dull. 

I know right away that this guy is a hack and is not going to last. Sure enough, several months later this guy is one of the worst employees the company has ever hired.


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## Big John (May 23, 2010)

MTW said:


> ...I can do my job without using a tool belt.


 IMPOSSIBLE!!!1!!11238threesevenfour


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## MTW (Aug 28, 2013)

B4T said:


> Back to tools.... I can't get used to seeing professional electricians using their "pockets" for tools instead of a tool belt...


Well, that's too bad for you. :laughing:



> It just looks hack to me...


I can do my job just fine without a tool belt as can many other professional electricians. The opposite can be said, it looks hack when a guy has to carry around a whole tool belt just to do some basic tasks. 



> I have always been around guys wearing the right apparatus to do the right job..:whistling2:


I guess you need to get out more then.


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## Bkessler (Feb 14, 2007)

I moved on from a tool belt to tool carts.


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## MTW (Aug 28, 2013)

Bkessler said:


> I moved on from a tool belt to tool carts.


What a hack, a real electrician would put the contents of that cart on a tool belt and carry it around.


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## Big John (May 23, 2010)

MTW said:


> What a hack, a real electrician would put the contents of that cart on a tool belt and carry it around.


 Alright, that was funny.


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## Bkessler (Feb 14, 2007)

MTW said:


> What a hack, a real electrician would put the contents of that cart on a tool belt and carry it around.


Stop your words are hurting me.


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## FrunkSlammer (Aug 31, 2013)

I always wore a tool belt with too much weight in it, now I have back problems from it. 

Stupid is as stupid does.


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## That_Dude (Feb 13, 2012)

B4T said:


> Is Pete M a moderator now.. he is in block letters...
> 
> Back to tools.... I can't get used to seeing professional electricians using their "pockets" for tools instead of a tool belt...


Most of my 12R (interior electrician) buddies do that, and I'm guilty of it too. Guess us Army folks are hacks with licenses. :whistling2::laughing:
There's a reason they make so many pockets in pants. :jester:


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## MTW (Aug 28, 2013)

Bkessler said:


> Stop your words are hurting me.


You should report my post to the mods and then tell me I'm making cheap shots.


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## Bkessler (Feb 14, 2007)

MTW said:


> You should report my post to the mods and then tell me I'm making cheap shots.


Be careful i might call uhaul.


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## I_get_shocked (Apr 6, 2009)

heavysparky said:


> anyway does anyone else judge other tradesmen on their tools



YES. In every way imaginable too. If the tools are nice and new it means they dont work much. If the tools are junk it means they're unprofessional. I only respect used quality tools.


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## ampman66 (Dec 5, 2012)

FrunkSlammer said:


> I always wore a tool belt with too much weight in it, now I have back problems from it.


 I did too.
After a good chiropractor straightened me out, I took to loading up a tool belt with the tools that I needed to do the job, carrying it to where I'm working, and leaving it nearby while I grab whatever I need out of it.
If I need something that I don't have with me, I go back and get it.
This approach makes you think about what you need to do, and the tools that you need to do it with.


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## FrunkSlammer (Aug 31, 2013)

ampman66 said:


> After a good chiropractor straightened me out


Does that work well? 

I've never been to a chiropractor, my wife has scared me away from them with too many horror stories from the ER. But I've heard some positive things from other guys... lots of pain, hobble in, get an adjustment and walk out almost completely better.


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## ampman66 (Dec 5, 2012)

FrunkSlammer said:


> Does that work well?


 It does for me. And it sure as hell beats back surgery, which never seems to work.
It seems like everyone has a different experience, so if you're thinking about it, give it a shot for a while and see if it helps you.
A massage prior to getting adjusted is a good bet as well.
I've also heard good things about acupuncture. I haven't felt the need to try it as of yet, but it's another option to consider. Most reputable chiropractors know a good acupuncturist, and can hook you up.


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## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

I've been to both chiro's and acupuncturists, they work albeit they're a tad addictive

~CS~


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## MHElectric (Oct 14, 2011)

I look at it like this - hand tools and regular use power tools are what you want to spend your money on. They should be name brand. Odd ball sockets, wrenches, and tools that dont get used on a regular basis - you can slide by with an off brand. Just my opinion though. 

I worked next to so many guys that bought all their tools from Harbor Freight and Big Lots, ive even been guilty of it myself from time to time. Sometimes first impressions can be very deceiving.

BTW, I am also a back pocket electrician.


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## ampman66 (Dec 5, 2012)

chicken steve said:


> they're a tad addictive
> 
> ~CS~


 Yup. I agree.
Lucky for me, my chiro has an extremely hot assistant, (Umm....yes, a woman) who rubs me down, and gets me ready for my adjustment.
Need I say more?:thumbsup:


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## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

I've abused every decent brand of tool there is, smoked milwaukees, porter cables, dewalts, kleins , flukes, greenlees , etc

that's because i like to _work _'em.....:thumbsup:

So maybe the OP would care to consider, there are those that judge a man by the tools he has, and there are those that judge him by what he can accomplish with them

~CS~


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## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

ampman66 said:


> Need I say more?:thumbsup:


yeah....a ph # Ampdude! :laughing:~CS~


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## ampman66 (Dec 5, 2012)

chicken steve said:


> yeah....a ph # Ampdude! :laughing:~CS~


 I'll get it for you, but it's a long drive for you.


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## Wirenuting (Sep 12, 2010)

I wear what ever I need for the job. I have several pouches to select from, or a nice cart, or a bucket on a hand cart with a bucket boss or even I'll carry a bag.. 
Of course if I'm changing a light bulb, I'll carry the 1 or 2 things I might need in my pocket..


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## MTW (Aug 28, 2013)

chicken steve said:


> I've abused every decent brand of tool there is, smoked milwaukees, porter cables, dewalts, kleins , flukes, greenlees , etc
> 
> that's because i like to abuse 'em.....:thumbsup:


Fify. I've never burned up a tool in my life. All tools have limitations, and if you "smoke" something, you've abused it.


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## BBQ (Nov 16, 2010)

I have not owned a tool belt for at least 25 years, I do have tool, boxes, bags and carts. 



I guess I just suck.


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## MTW (Aug 28, 2013)

BBQ said:


> I have not owned a tool belt for at least 25 years, I do have tool, boxes, bags and carts.
> 
> 
> 
> I guess I just suck.


B4T says those who don't use tools belts look hack and lazy, so add those to your list of negatives.


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## MTW (Aug 28, 2013)

bkmichael65 said:


> There are some hacks that camouflage themselves with quality tools, so the brand of tools someone uses isn't a good guage of their skills


Good point. When a guy shows up with a brand new SnapOn rollaway loaded down with every brand new tool that's never been touched, that's as much of a red flag as the guy with with a box full of busted junk tools.


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## SEREMan2000 (Aug 29, 2011)

Wow MTW what do wear when you go into home worth tens of millions of dollars and the homeowner says no belts?


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## MTW (Aug 28, 2013)

SEREMan2000 said:


> Wow MTW what do wear when you go into home worth tens of millions of dollars and the homeowner says no belts?


:001_huh:

I don't wear tool belts. Just what are you asking?


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## Bkessler (Feb 14, 2007)

I also have these 3 rolling carts. My goal on the job is to be productive with as little bending over as possible.


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## Semi-Ret Electrician (Nov 10, 2011)

Loosing a job to a low baller is not always bad.

The low baller might just mean he will be tied up for a long time and possibly go bankrupt.

In many cases the second choice gets to finish the job with considerable profit after he fixes all the mess.


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## SEREMan2000 (Aug 29, 2011)

My bad MTW I thought you were calling no tool belt wearers hacks. My personal opinion is to each there own. Go with what comfortable.


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## thoenew (Jan 17, 2012)

Just started trimming out a house. The carpenter showed up to hang the doors and start the trim. 

The first morning he started with this miter saw










After lunch he had this set up. I was surprised he put a brand new decent blade in it. Yes, he set it up in the kitchen/ dining room.


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## MTW (Aug 28, 2013)

thoenew said:


> Just started trimming out a house. The carpenter showed up to hang the doors and start the trim.
> 
> The first morning he started with this miter saw


That guy is a hack. That's all I have to see to know that he does horrible work.


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## papaotis (Jun 8, 2013)

i know a carpenter that has very messy work area practices, but does beautiful work!


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## ponyboy (Nov 18, 2012)

Their*


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## markore (Dec 7, 2011)

thoenew said:


> Just started trimming out a house. The carpenter showed up to hang the doors and start the trim.


To judge a carpenter I ask them to show me as they cope a piece of scrap base or crown then scribe a 3 dimensional shelf insert into a recess.

If they can't / don't cope and scribe, then they are not capable of stain grade work and are only worth the same to me as any other painter/laborer.

Actually, I would much prefer to kick somebody off the saw and move them as a finisher/painter a than have a loose "carpenter" running around who wastes material and creates callbacks. Caulk has its limits.

A test piece is essential for tight miters, reveals on doors and windows should be between 3/16 and 5/16, miters should be glued and anchored with 23 guage pins, and a carpenter should know when to pre-fab and when to mark and layout before cutting. They should have a planer and belt sander and be able to deal with compound build up around corners and low spots around casing. They should scribe baseboard to the floor when there is no shoe and/or when the gap is larger than 1/8.

Finally, dust control is ESSENTIAL for "finish" work and remodeling, and requires a whole 'nother level of investment and preparation. Also many finish carpenters are not trained on the proper tools and materials for anchoring trim to metal studs, or suspended ceilings, or soundproofing techniques. These are specialty trades that have their own nuances they will not be able to pick up on just one job.

The above is how I judge a carpenter from a laborer with a van of tools.


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## five.five-six (Apr 9, 2013)

FrunkSlammer said:


> I always wore a tool belt with too much weight in it, now I have back problems from it.
> 
> Stupid is as stupid does.


Suspenders, that and load your bags for the job at hand.


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## uconduit (Jun 6, 2012)

markore said:


> To judge a carpenter I ask them to show me as they cope a piece of scrap base or crown then scribe a 3 dimensional shelf insert into a recess.
> 
> If they can't / don't cope and scribe, then they are not capable of stain grade work and are only worth the same to me as any other painter/laborer.
> 
> ...


sounds like you know a little _too much_ about carpentry, :laughing:, I couldn't follow half of that


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## RIVETER (Sep 26, 2009)

heavysparky said:


> Went to a good sized commercial bid today. The Owner had Myself and some other guy there to bid the job. When I saw what tools . the guy had with him. I could not help but think hack and bottom feeder.
> 
> The guy a pair of Husky ***** and some cheap dollar store screwdriver. I had to loan him my lantern to see in the basement. I knew I had lost the bid. But I decided to be an ass and ask the guy some questions. He was asking to borrow tools and ladders.
> 
> ...


What kind of a "GOOD" size commercial job has a basement?


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## Big John (May 23, 2010)

markore said:


> ...If they can't / don't cope and scribe, then they are not capable of stain grade work and are only worth the same to me as any other painter/laborer....


 That's how I measure barbers: Doesn't matter if I don't go there for a shave, if they don't know how to use a straight-razor, I ain't interested.


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## heavysparky (Jun 2, 2009)

RIVETER said:


> What kind of a "GOOD" size commercial job has a basement?


 
6500+ sqft building. ( Actual is 6547 ) Not including basement. Which is being turned into small child care area )Basicaly a new wire job. New service. All new fixtures. Building was last used for a multi use building. Now it is being converted into offices

Most comm building here have basements even the new ones being built


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## RIVETER (Sep 26, 2009)

heavysparky said:


> 6500+ sqft building. ( Actual is 6547 ) Not including basement. Which is being turned into small child care area )Basicaly a new wire job. New service. All new fixtures. Building was last used for a multi use building. Now it is being converted into offices
> 
> Most comm building here have basements even the new ones being built


A little bit larger than my house but I guess it could be used as commercial.


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## heavysparky (Jun 2, 2009)

Big John said:


> That's how I measure barbers: Doesn't matter if I don't go there for a shave, if they don't know how to use a straight-razor, I ain't interested.


Straight- razor what the hell is that :laughing::laughing:













I remember getting my first shave from one. And the guy using the " Strap" on it. Man those are close shaves


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## heavysparky (Jun 2, 2009)

nice size house we don't really get them that big here.


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## RIVETER (Sep 26, 2009)

heavysparky said:


> nice size house we don't really get them that big here.


Well, I worked hard for it all of my life and to be honest with you it includes my back yard.:thumbsup:


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## Chrisibew440 (Sep 13, 2013)

I worked with a guy who had a John Wayne electrician set of tools from big lots. Funny stuff. He actually was a good electrician but had terrible mechanical skills and he had the tools to prove it.


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## MTW (Aug 28, 2013)

Chrisibew440 said:


> He actually was a good electrician but had terrible mechanical skills and he had the tools to prove it.


How can you be a good electrician but have terrible mechanical skills? You can't have one without the other.


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## ibuzzard (Dec 28, 2008)

heavysparky said:


> And the guy using the " Strap" on it. Man those are close shaves


You mean "strop". 

Straights are still used by many, if fact there is a resurgence in their use.

About 5 years ago, I went back to what I started out on, double edged safety razor. Clean shave, and two years worth of blades cost about 35 bucks. A good badger brush, and good shaving soap, and your set.


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## The_Modifier (Oct 24, 2009)

FrunkSlammer said:


> I always wore a tool belt with too much weight in it, now I have back problems from it.
> 
> Stupid is as stupid does.


You said it. That used to be me. Just got diagnosed with a herniated disk. Mornings aren't fun trying to get out of bed. :laughing:


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## markore (Dec 7, 2011)

uconduit said:


> sounds like you know a little _too much_ about carpentry, :laughing:, I couldn't follow half of that


If you print it out you will be able to interview and hire a good carpenter.

...he will be the guy who can explain all the above in 10 minutes or demonstrate all of the above in 30...

...you may have to interview 15 or 30 guys to find that one guy, but once you find him there will be no question who your new foreman is... Tom Silva style.


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## The_Modifier (Oct 24, 2009)

ampman66 said:


> Yup. I agree.
> Lucky for me, my chiro has an extremely hot assistant, (Umm....yes, a woman) who rubs me down, and gets me ready for my adjustment.
> Need I say more?:thumbsup:


Does she tell you to turn over and lay on your stomach before she starts? :laughing:


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## heavysparky (Jun 2, 2009)

ibuzzard said:


> You mean "strop".
> 
> Straights are still used by many, if fact there is a resurgence in their use.
> 
> About 5 years ago, I went back to what I started out on, double edged safety razor. Clean shave, and two years worth of blades cost about 35 bucks. A good badger brush, and good shaving soap, and your set.


Yeah. Had to goggle it. My grand father told me it was what bad kids got hit with.So I all ways assumed he ment strap when he said it :laughing:


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## markore (Dec 7, 2011)

The_Modifier said:


> You said it. That used to be me. Just got diagnosed with a herniated disk. Mornings aren't fun trying to get out of bed. :laughing:


If you're not already try sleeping on your back instead of prone or on your side.
... the discs de-compress and straighten more in this position.

(you can search google for alexander method. its not a marketing ploy, its actually an old school well documented physical therapy technique)


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## Jlarson (Jun 28, 2009)

Stuff out of my pockets and off my belt from today :laughing:


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## ibuzzard (Dec 28, 2008)

Jlarson said:


> Stuff out of my pockets and off my belt from today :laughing:


That'd be about all you need for many of the tasks we perform daily.


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## MTW (Aug 28, 2013)

Interesting, those Channelock strippers look exactly like Ideals Reflex strippers. I wonder if Channelock OEM's them for Ideal like they do with pliers.

Edit: I just checked and the Ideal Reflex Super T-Strippers and the Channelocks are exactly identical except for the grips. Clearly Channelock makes them for Ideal. :nerd::nerd:


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## uconduit (Jun 6, 2012)

Jlarson said:


> Stuff out of my pockets and off my belt from today :laughing:


I actually have the same exact tester, channel locks, klein screwdriver, and maglight (except in a different color)


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## MTW (Aug 28, 2013)

ibuzzard said:


> That'd be about all you need for many of the tasks we perform daily.


Yup, I call that the perfect tool kit. :thumbsup:


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## papaotis (Jun 8, 2013)

Jlarson said:


> Stuff out of my pockets and off my belt from today :laughing:


they look awful clean to me!:whistling2:


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## cwsims84 (Jan 21, 2012)

RIVETER said:


> What kind of a "GOOD" size commercial job has a basement?


how about a 5 story Intel Manufacturing facilty with a 100k sq ft basement!!


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## heavysparky (Jun 2, 2009)

cwsims84 said:


> how about a 5 story Intel Manufacturing facilty with a 100k sq ft basement!!


 
out of my league at the current time.

would love to bid those in the future but not now


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## cwsims84 (Jan 21, 2012)

heavysparky said:


> out of my league at the current time.
> 
> would love to bid those in the future but not now


Shell and core= $14million electric alone... Tool install and rest of work(including shell and core) = $50million not including RFI's


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## Jlarson (Jun 28, 2009)

MTW said:


> Interesting, those Channelock strippers look exactly like Ideals Reflex strippers. I wonder if Channelock OEM's them for Ideal like they do with pliers.
> 
> Edit: I just checked and the Ideal Reflex Super T-Strippers and the Channelocks are exactly identical except for the grips. Clearly Channelock makes them for Ideal. :nerd::nerd:


Yeah. I figure western forge makes them or something, I have pairs with almost identical casting marks.


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## Semi-Ret Electrician (Nov 10, 2011)

IMO the world's most critical organization for judging someone by their tools is Habitat For Humanity.

You may the best craftsman on earth but don't show up with new boots, gloves or tools!:laughing:


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## deverson (Feb 15, 2012)

We had a new contractor show up to do preliminary work for a new dorm on our campus. Two guys and all new tools from the supply house. Not a good feeling seeing that.


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## markore (Dec 7, 2011)

Semi-Ret Electrician said:


> IMO the world's most critical organization for judging someone by their tools is Habitat For Humanity.


Its funny you mention that as I've seen a lot of girls who were getting ready to volunteer to pad their resume specifically go out thrift shopping to find clothes beat in enough to not take flak. :hammer: :cowboy:

Nice to see someone else carrying that 25' komeleon tape. I bought like 15 of them in the older style casing on clearance at sears in the 3pack for like $1 each, and they still had lots more on the shelves when I left.
Having them on on rotation has led to my tapes looking a little too new.


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## uconduit (Jun 6, 2012)

cwsims84 said:


> how about a 5 story Intel Manufacturing facilty with a 100k sq ft basement!!


brought back some unpleasant memories, this did...


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## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

Why not judge on what one can accomplish *with* the toolage s/he has?

~CS~


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## markore (Dec 7, 2011)

chicken steve said:


> Why not judge on what one can accomplish *with* the toolage s/he has?~CS~


Thanks for acknowledging the female tradespeople.


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## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

Back in the day I served with a number of extraordinarily fit female FF's that would kick my azz if i didn't Mark.....

~CS~


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## fanelle (Nov 27, 2011)

chicken steve said:


> Why not judge on what one can accomplish with the toolage s/he has?
> 
> ~CS~



The tools are part of the first impression that your customer gets. Its sort of like a uniform. If you show up with clean well used tools it shows a customer that you are experienced and professional. If you have all new tools then it seems that you are green. If you have all cheap tools or old unkempt tools that need to be replaced they assume that your work will match. Because in most cases your not able to see how professional someone is it gives you gauge as to how their should be.


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## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

Methinks most of us in the serv industry are aware of the book cover paradox, and how to play it Fanelle

We've been privy to everything from the pink breast awareness shoe protectors to the company pen cha cha , etc

I want someone that does the job, doesn't whine, doesn't feed me a line of upsell bs, or waste my time with excuses because s/he doesn't like to get dirty

~CS~


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## chewy (May 9, 2010)

markore said:


> Thanks for acknowledging the female tradespeople.


Are you female?


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## backstay (Feb 3, 2011)

chewy said:


> Are you female?


I figured you got booted?


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## chewy (May 9, 2010)

backstay said:


> I figured you got booted?


You know what happens when you git to a figuring.


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## backstay (Feb 3, 2011)

chewy said:


> You know what happens when you git to a figuring.


That whole epic thread got tossed and I haven't seen you on here since.


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## chewy (May 9, 2010)

backstay said:


> That whole epic thread got tossed and I haven't seen you on here since.


Yeah, that was a good one. I got unbanned.


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## backstay (Feb 3, 2011)

chewy said:


> Yeah, that was a good one. I got unbanned.


Glad to hear that!


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## electricmanscott (Feb 11, 2010)

B4T said:


> Is Pete M a moderator now.. he is in block letters...
> 
> Back to tools.... I can't get used to seeing professional electricians using their "pockets" for tools instead of a tool belt...
> 
> It just looks hack to me... I have always been around guys wearing the right apparatus to do the right job..:whistling2:


:lol::lol::lol::lol::lol: Buckets :whistling2:


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## BBQ (Nov 16, 2010)

electricmanscott said:


> :lol::lol::lol::lol::lol: Buckets :whistling2:


A van full of them. :laughing:


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## B4T (Feb 10, 2009)

electricmanscott said:


> :lol::lol::lol::lol Buckets :whistling2:


Of course the *REASON *for having buckets means nothing to you and that "pot stirring.. paranoid.. cement making.. bacon lover" who just pulled a hamstring laughing... :no:


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## Semi-Ret Electrician (Nov 10, 2011)

markore said:


> Its funny you mention that as I've seen a lot of girls who were getting ready to volunteer to pad their resume specifically go out thrift shopping to find clothes beat in enough to not take flak. :hammer: :cowboy:
> 
> Nice to see someone else carrying that 25' komeleon tape. I bought like 15 of them in the older style casing on clearance at sears in the 3pack for like $1 each, and they still had lots more on the shelves when I left.
> Having them on on rotation has led to my tapes looking a little too new.


I went to a Habitat project but not as an electrician, that was a sub contract.

I was one of about 100 volunteers to work on a 1200 sqft house. I was assigned to help shingle a roof working for a 16 year old gal. She was a "regular" and had about 10 of her classmates there that day also.

She was a great group leader, I would work for her anytime!:thumbsup:


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## HawkShock (Nov 27, 2012)

People can judge others on almost anything. I guess someone might be inclined to judge others on how they use the words "there" "their" and "they're".:whistling2:
Hint... Especially in the titles of threads.


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## markore (Dec 7, 2011)

chewy said:


> Are you female?


Are you a wookie? And how did you get banned?


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## markore (Dec 7, 2011)

B4T said:


> Of course the *REASON *for having buckets means nothing to you and that "pot stirring.. paranoid.. cement making.. bacon lover" who just pulled a hamstring laughing... :no:


It seems somebody in this thread knows a little too much about thinset and deck mud? This isn't john bridge...


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## markore (Dec 7, 2011)

SEREMan2000 said:


> Wow MTW what do wear when you go into home worth tens of millions of dollars and the homeowner says no belts?


Maybe he grabs one of these when he's done to hide the scratches?








Mean streak white grease pencil


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## chewy (May 9, 2010)

markore said:


> Are you a wookie? And how did you get banned?


Im drunk and sunburnt.


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## freeagnt54 (Aug 6, 2008)

cwsims84 said:


> Shell and core= $14million electric alone... Tool install and rest of work(including shell and core) = $50million not including RFI's


If you are talking about d1x I'm sure the base build electrical was far more then $14 million. Unless you are talking about just your companies scope of work.


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## Brodieman (Aug 31, 2013)

My boss hired a new journeyman recently and I am not one to "judge" people but his tools, or lack there of, is throwing me for a loop. He brings a tool bag full of stuff that the company stocks in our work vehicles but didn't think much of it as it's a new company for him. Then after he was asking me (1st year apprentice) for random things like drill bits I realized all he brought with him, aside from said cordless power tools, was a nearly empty tool pouch every day:blink: He's knowledgeable and great to work with so I guess some guys can just get a lot done with some linesman's and a multi-driver:laughing: 

I know his previous employer and have worked with him so I pretty sure he just used his stuff all the time (was just the two of them I believe) but I think he's going to be doing some tool shopping soon because if he has to do a job alone he's F&^%ed :laughing:

As for tool belts, my boss and a few of the journeymen I work with have ruined backs so they are all about tool carriers and only wearing belts when absolutely necessary and carrying only what you need in them. Makes sense to me.


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## doublejelectric (Jan 23, 2013)

B4T said:


> Is Pete M a moderator now.. he is in block letters... Back to tools.... I can't get used to seeing professional electricians using their "pockets" for tools instead of a tool belt... It just looks hack to me... I have always been around guys wearing the right apparatus to do the right job..:whistling2:


Back in the day, I could out run just about anyone running rigid pipe with two levels, a tape measure and two pairs of channel locks, in my POCKETS, no need to carry fully loaded tool bags when you know what tools you need for the job at hand. My dad always told me to never judge a guy by his tools, but by how he uses em, I've seen some good electricians use s&[email protected] tools and seen [email protected]&$ electricians use good tools. What pisses me off is when a guy borrows tools all the time. You should never need to borrow a tape, screwdriver, level, or channel locks, ever., but, it's my opinion


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## doublejelectric (Jan 23, 2013)

MTW said:


> What a hack, a real electrician would put the contents of that cart on a tool belt and carry it around.


Yeah, I've seen that also, shop in Oregon makes their guys carry cordless drills and saws all on their tool belts. And they were a union shop.


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## electricmanscott (Feb 11, 2010)

Brodieman said:


> My boss hired a new journeyman recently and I am not one to "judge"* people but keep reading where I judge him*...but his tools, or lack there of, is throwing me for a loop. He brings a tool bag full of stuff that the company stocks in our work vehicles but didn't think much of it as it's a new company for him. Then after he was asking me (1st year apprentice) for random things like drill bits I realized all he brought with him, aside from said cordless power tools, was a nearly empty tool pouch every day:blink: He's knowledgeable and great to work with so I guess some guys can just get a lot done with some linesman's and a multi-driver:laughing:
> 
> I know his previous employer and have worked with him so I pretty sure he just used his stuff all the time (was just the two of them I believe) but I think he's going to be doing some tool shopping soon because if he has to do a job alone he's F&^%ed :laughing:
> 
> As for tool belts, my boss and a few of the journeymen I work with have ruined backs so they are all about tool carriers and only wearing belts when absolutely necessary and carrying only what you need in them. Makes sense to me.




:thumbup:


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## electricmanscott (Feb 11, 2010)

Judging someone by _there_ tools is silly. I prefer to judge them by their poor spelling. nline2long:


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## Southeast Power (Jan 18, 2009)

ibuzzard said:


> You mean "strop".
> 
> Straights are still used by many, if fact there is a resurgence in their use.
> 
> About 5 years ago, I went back to what I started out on, double edged safety razor. Clean shave, and two years worth of blades cost about 35 bucks. A good badger brush, and good shaving soap, and your set.


I did the same thing about a year ago. But, writhing the last few months, I have ditched my fancy best badger brush and soap for Shea Butter. 
It comes in a small jar in a solid form. You scoop a little out and it will melt on your finger tips with a little hot water.
Rub it into your whiskers real good and then go at it with the double edge. Very smooth and just wipe your face with a towel when done.


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## chewy (May 9, 2010)

Making up your shaving cream with hot green tea is pretty good for senstive skinned people.


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## newbi (Dec 17, 2011)

doublejelectric said:


> Yeah, I've seen that also, shop in Oregon makes their guys carry cordless drills and saws all on their tool belts. And they were a union shop.


**** that. I would require a chiropractor in my pocket as well.


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## mdnitedrftr (Aug 21, 2013)

*Whats everyone using for lunch boxes/coolers?*

Ive been using these cheapo promotional soft lunch bags for awhile now and they're junk. 

I need something hard sided but I think an Igloo might be too big for me. What are you guys using?


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## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

Well you see real 'lectricians don't eat Drifter, we just keep going on stray emf....:laughing:~CS~:jester:


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## gnuuser (Jan 13, 2013)

chicken steve said:


> Well you see real 'lectricians don't eat Drifter, we just keep going on stray emf....:laughing:~CS~:jester:


 and the occasional whiff of the magic smoke from the motors:thumbup::laughing:


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## RIVETER (Sep 26, 2009)

heavysparky said:


> Went to a good sized commercial bid today. The Owner had Myself and some other guy there to bid the job. When I saw what tools . the guy had with him. I could not help but think hack and bottom feeder.
> 
> The guy a pair of Husky ***** and some cheap dollar store screwdriver. I had to loan him my lantern to see in the basement. I knew I had lost the bid. But I decided to be an ass and ask the guy some questions. He was asking to borrow tools and ladders.
> 
> ...


I never wore a tool pouch to bid a job.


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## mdnitedrftr (Aug 21, 2013)

chicken steve said:


> Well you see real 'lectricians don't eat Drifter, we just keep going on stray emf....:laughing:~CS~:jester:


Wow, how the heck did I manage that one? :laughing:

That was supposed to be a new topic.


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## dirtyfrank (Jan 25, 2011)

Pretty shallow to judge someone on their tools, or if they use a tool belt, before seeing them do any work. 

Who cares if someone wants to use their pockets, or something that you don't feel is quality. 

Judge a company/workers on the quality of their work, and the ability to stay competitive and successful at the same time. That is what makes a lasting impact on customers.


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## 360max (Jun 10, 2011)

...'skilled labor isn't cheap, cheap labor isn't skilled'


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## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

I was employed by a large (by my state's standards) electrical outfit with a fleet of these crappy S10 trucks once. 

They were in some sort of competition with the other local EC , who had a similar fleet. Never washed 'em, never maintained 'em, _zip zero, nada nothing_:no:


So one day we're tooling on through the mountains and hear a hordenous noise and wobble , tried slowing down, all happened quickly....and the pass rear tire zooms ahead of us 

It was dusk and the tire took off out into a cow pasture. So here we are trompin' through manure looking for the  tire

I calls the boss and explain_ 'we're knee deep in sh&t , no 'effin' tire to be found'_

He says _'well, sh&t happens, do what you gotta do'_.....:whistling2:

~C_(walk a mile in my muck lucks before you judge me)_S~


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## Jhellwig (Jun 18, 2014)

I have seen guys with chapie walmart tools do amazing things and I have seen guys with the most expensive tools you can by blow them up. It isn't the quality of the tool, it is the guy running the tool that determins the quality of work.

And if I had to wear a tool belt all day I would leave the trade.


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## TheApprentice_ (Apr 11, 2015)

thoenew said:


> Just started trimming out a house. The carpenter showed up to hang the doors and start the trim.
> 
> The first morning he started with this miter saw
> 
> ...


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## MHElectric (Oct 14, 2011)

You can get the same job done with harbor freight tools as you can with name brands. Only difference is you save a ton of money. 

Let people laugh and talk - save some money, and be the real hero.


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## MTW (Aug 28, 2013)

MHElectric said:


> You can get the same job done with harbor freight tools as you can with name brands. Only difference is you save a ton of money.
> 
> Let people laugh and talk - save some money, and be the real hero.


No, no you can't actually. You're not being a "hero" because you saved some money using garbage tools. You're being foolish and shortsighted. If I see a tradesman of any kind using HF tools, I know he is a hack.


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## MHElectric (Oct 14, 2011)

MTW said:


> No, no you can't actually. You're not being a "hero" because you saved some money using garbage tools. You're being foolish and shortsighted. If I see a tradesman of any kind using HF tools, I know he is a hack.


 Yes you can Pete, I do it every day.

There is a median for everything in life. You can't always get away with cheap things, but you don't always need something expensive. Discretion is figuring out what works for the situation.

I have a bunch of cheap cheap tools and I have plenty of expensive tools. Both will get the job done, but if I can get away with it, I'll usually buy the cheaper of the two.

Hack hack hack hack :laughing:


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## GrayHair (Jan 14, 2013)

There was a time when I did wonders using sorry tools, but then there were days I couldn't do anything right with top of the line tools; like the day I found my toddler daughter had swapped some items in my pouch with ones from her "toolbox" (*nobody* asked to borrow that *pink* handled screwdriver with the plastic shaft).

Good tools were hard on the wallet, but easier on the body and mind. Kinda like pushing a dull bit through the work instead of having a sharp one cut its way through.

Regards!


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## MHElectric (Oct 14, 2011)

My oldest son just bought his first set of tools & tool bag. He's been working with me lately and he's had a little bit off money that's burning a hole in his pocket. :laughing:

I took him to Harbor Freight during their red tag blow out sale and he loaded up on stuff. It's good to see him working hard and learning the value of a dollar.


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## papaotis (Jun 8, 2013)

im not embarrased by my tools except the ones i screw up from not thinking first!:whistling2:i buy good tools for the things i use all the time and cheap tools for the other stuff. in some cases i cant tell the difference,except that SOME of the more exspensive tools last longer.and i used to be good at speling!


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## jimmy21 (Mar 31, 2012)

Brands aren't everything. I bought a set of the more expensive harbor freight screw drivers for around the house and they seem to be just fine. I'm sure their cheapest ones are complete garbage. I bought a pair of their cheap lineman pliers for around the house and they are complete junk, they work in a pinch around the house, but id never dream of taking them to work. So to sum up what I'm trying to say, I couldn't judge someone off the brand of tools, I'd need to actually see Their bag to be able to tell.

I'm curious, do you guys buy all snap on wrenches and sockets too?


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## Southeast Power (Jan 18, 2009)

I buy sockets and wrenches from HF. I use them very rarely and don't care if they get lost.
I can't trust saws all blades, hacksaw blades or drill bits from them. They seem to just be decorative items and not hard steel.

I can only buy Klein screwdrivers, Klein linemans and challelock, channel locks.
I can't do the Euro design stuff yet. I'm thinking about it but, I'm just not ready.


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## Southeast Power (Jan 18, 2009)

ampman66 said:


> If I were the owner, those tools and the fact that he was borrowing stuff that he should have brought with him from you would have raised a red flag for me.


That was reverse shill, a friend of the owner.
He brought him in to get lower prices from you guys.


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## Southeast Power (Jan 18, 2009)

Sometimes it's just a guy trying to get back on his feet and maybe borrowed some money to buy what he could.
People use what they need.
I like certain brands, others might too but can't get them right now.


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## jabantik (Jan 13, 2015)

jrannis said:


> I buy sockets and wrenches from HF. I use them very rarely and don't care if they get lost.
> I can't trust saws all blades, hacksaw blades or drill bits from them. They seem to just be decorative items and not hard steel.


I am a low-wage apprentice. I like HF drill bits and saw blades. 2 large unibits from HF are less than $20, while 1 Klein unibit is over $50 at home cheapo. You can get a big box of drill bits for under $10 with their coupon. HF bits are titanium nitride coated and last longer than I expect based on their low price. HF sawzall blades are about $6-7 for a 5-pack. My company supplies name brand blades and hole saws, but I have HF blades and holesaws (~$25 for a small kit and $35 for the big kit) in my box for backup. 
I keep receipts and itemize my purchases, but I am a fan of a lot of HF stuff all the same. Some of their stuff is pure crap, but some of their stuff is good value.


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## jimmy21 (Mar 31, 2012)

jabantik said:


> I am a low-wage apprentice. I like HF drill bits and saw blades. 2 large unibits from HF are less than $20, while 1 Klein unibit is over $50 at home cheapo. You can get a big box of drill bits for under $10 with their coupon. HF bits are titanium nitride coated and last longer than I expect based on their low price. HF sawzall blades are about $6-7 for a 5-pack. My company supplies name brand blades and hole saws, but I have HF blades and holesaws (~$25 for a small kit and $35 for the big kit) in my box for backup.
> I keep receipts and itemize my purchases, but I am a fan of a lot of HF stuff all the same. Some of their stuff is pure crap, but some of their stuff is good value.


You could save even more money if you just didn't buy all that stuff? You seriously buy your own Sawzall blades?


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## Jlarson (Jun 28, 2009)

Only that Komelon tape and my T+Pro are still alive, everything else dead. 



jimmy21 said:


> I'm curious, do you guys buy all snap on wrenches and sockets too?


SK, Armstrong, Wright and Williams (Snap on owned) mostly here. You don't see much Snap on in industrial here because we get a lot of our tools from McMaster, Grainger or a local fastener wholesaler rather then a tool truck.


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## Southeast Power (Jan 18, 2009)

jimmy21 said:


> You could save even more money if you just didn't buy all that stuff? You seriously buy your own Sawzall blades?


I think maybe he does a few side jobs and doesn't steal consumables from his employer


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## Southeast Power (Jan 18, 2009)

jabantik said:


> I am a low-wage apprentice. I like HF drill bits and saw blades. 2 large unibits from HF are less than $20, while 1 Klein unibit is over $50 at home cheapo. You can get a big box of drill bits for under $10 with their coupon. HF bits are titanium nitride coated and last longer than I expect based on their low price. HF sawzall blades are about $6-7 for a 5-pack. My company supplies name brand blades and hole saws, but I have HF blades and holesaws (~$25 for a small kit and $35 for the big kit) in my box for backup.
> I keep receipts and itemize my purchases, but I am a fan of a lot of HF stuff all the same. Some of their stuff is pure crap, but some of their stuff is good value.


Maybe I got a bad batch but the saws all blades I got were just a piece of sheet metal with some ragged notches in them and wore flat during the first cut.
Maybe they just skipped the hardening process.
I'm not a fan of unibits for everyday use so, I can't comment much on that.


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## Chris1971 (Dec 27, 2010)

B4T said:


> Is Pete M a moderator now.. he is in block letters...
> 
> Back to tools.... I can't get used to seeing professional electricians using their "pockets" for tools instead of a tool belt...
> 
> It just looks hack to me... I have always been around guys wearing the right apparatus to do the right job..:whistling2:


Pockets work just fine.:laughing:


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## jimmy21 (Mar 31, 2012)

Chris1971 said:


> Pockets work just fine.:laughing:


Depends on what you are doing. Most of the work I do, I do 99% of the job with a level, tape measure, baby knipex cobras, a screw driver and sometimes a wrench. No reason to carry everything else on me, when I can just keep my tool bag near by

Maybe if you were doing something where you didn't know what you were going to run in to


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## MTW (Aug 28, 2013)

Jlarson said:


> Only that Komelon tape and my T+Pro are still alive, everything else dead.


How do you kill Channelocks, linesmans and wire strippers? I can see the wirestrippers getting dull, but everything else?


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## Wpgshocker (Jan 25, 2013)

MTW said:


> How do you kill Channelocks, linesmans and wire strippers? I can see the wirestrippers getting dull, but everything else?


Easy, I use my linesman as a hammer, prybar, wrench and occasionally as linesmans. They don't like being used like that, not sure why.


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## EB Electric (Feb 8, 2013)

jimmy21 said:


> I'm curious, do you guys buy all snap on wrenches and sockets too?


Nope, I don't buy all snap on. I have a collection of wrenches and sockets, enough to equip a few guys anyways, and apart from a few snap on and old williams, they are pretty well all Mastercraft maximum, the sears craftsman professional equivalent here in Canada. The finish, quality, feel and warranty is great. Sure, it's not snap on flank drive plus, but I use them almost everyday and they serve me well. My take on it is I'm not a flat rate mechanic in an auto shop. Most of the fasteners I deal with are not corroded or half rounded off or torqued to the point I need a 5ft cheater bar to remove. That said, just my 2 cents, nothing against anyone for having snap on, they are definitely nice, just more of a luxury then a necessity for me. 

I also have a few complete sets of impact sockets, and they are princess auto brand (Canada's Harbor Freight).Yeah they are a bit bulkier and heavier then a snap on or mac but they are the right tool for the job and do me just fine. I don't know why, but it bothers me seeing guy's using the regular chrome sockets on impact guns. I don't care what brand, using the normal chrome sockets on an impact, doing heavy work, there's a good chance they are going to crack after repeated stress from the hammering of an impact mechanism.


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## Hippie (May 12, 2011)

Funny you say that, I hate seeing a chrome socket on an impact myself, not that I haven't done it a few times but it does just sorta bother me


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## Jlarson (Jun 28, 2009)

MTW said:


> How do you kill Channelocks, linesmans and wire strippers? I can see the wirestrippers getting dull, but everything else?


Blew a chunk out of the channellocks welding and that pair of linemans has cut so much hard wire and fish tape the cutter is gone.


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## nbb (Jul 12, 2014)

jrannis said:


> I buy sockets and wrenches from HF. I use them very rarely and don't care if they get lost.
> I can't trust saws all blades, hacksaw blades or drill bits from them. They seem to just be decorative items and not hard steel.
> 
> I can only buy Klein screwdrivers, Klein linemans and challelock, channel locks.
> I can't do the Euro design stuff yet. I'm thinking about it but, I'm just not ready.


Try the Knipex Cobra slip joint pliers first. While Irwin has done good with the channel lock brand, and they still make good linesmans and *****. Knipex's Cobra pliers are superior in every way.


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## chewy (May 9, 2010)

nbb said:


> Try the Knipex Cobra slip joint pliers first. While Irwin has done good with the channel lock brand, and they still make good linesmans and *****. Knipex's Cobra pliers are superior in every way.


Irwin now are using rebranded NWS pump pliers which should be equal if not superior to knipex.


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## chewy (May 9, 2010)

http://toolguyd.com/irwin-nws-pliers/


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## nbb (Jul 12, 2014)

chewy said:


> Irwin now are using rebranded NWS pump pliers which should be equal if not superior to knipex.


I will keep that in mind if my Cobras ever wear out. I have had them 3 years now, and the jaws are in excellent shape, considering the abuse.


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