# Does old wire contain asbestos?



## 360max (Jun 10, 2011)

http://www.mesothelioma.com/asbestos-exposure/products/wiring-insulation/


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

From T310-2(a) of the 1965 NEC:


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## Elemento1991 (Aug 21, 2013)

Looks pretty scary. Hopefully I didn't bone myself at 23 years old as it would be setting in around age 50. We had a fair share of 277/480 and 120/208 blocks being replaced with breaker panels. Probably 30 or 40. Nothing I can do now I guess. It's surprising this isn't common knowledge throughout the field. I've been going through the apprenticeship for four years now and they havs never once mentioned this to us.


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## Black Dog (Oct 16, 2011)

Elemento1991 said:


> Hey guys I have a question about the older style cloth wire. Last year I was on a gig for about 5-6 months where we were swapping out old fuse block panels in a museum. The wires were the old cloth style of insulation. They were brittle and when bent the insulation would crack or break. Also when burnt the insulation didn't burn off entirely and left a very brittle white coating that was almost like a dust. Don't ask how I know I just do.
> 
> So anyways about two or three months after the fact someone said we could have been working with asbestos insulation the whole time. Does anyone know if there's truth to this?


Start Smoking heavily :laughing:











> Since the first signs of asbestos-related illnesses may not begin to appear until 35 to 40 years after exposure, many thousands of smokers and former smokers could be suffering from the symptoms, unaware of the cause. Indeed, some have died without knowing how or where the asbestos exposure occurred.
> Cited From: Asbestos in Cigarette Filters -Asbestos.net http://www.asbestos.net/exposure/products/general/cigarette-filters/#ixzz3P7zSluF6
> ​


Gee, I wonder why so many smokers died from smoking...


http://www.nytimes.com/2012/07/08/magazine/who-made-that-cigarette-filter.html


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## bkmichael65 (Mar 25, 2013)

Here's what asbestos insulation looks like


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## Meadow (Jan 14, 2011)

Even the green wire?


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## Elemento1991 (Aug 21, 2013)

Yep the two on the right look like what we worked with for the majority of the branch circuits.


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## bkmichael65 (Mar 25, 2013)

Elemento1991 said:


> Looks pretty scary. Hopefully I didn't bone myself at 23 years old as it would be setting in around age 50. We had a fair share of 277/480 and 120/208 blocks being replaced with breaker panels. Probably 30 or 40. Nothing I can do now I guess. It's surprising this isn't common knowledge throughout the field. I've been going through the apprenticeship for four years now and they havs never once mentioned this to us.


I've messed with a bunch of it. Other than the 15 minutes of coughing up blood every morning, I haven't noticed any problems from it :laughing:


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## Black Dog (Oct 16, 2011)

bkmichael65 said:


> I've messed with a bunch of it. Other than the 15 minutes of coughing up blood every morning, I haven't noticed any problems from it :laughing:


My wife says "That's Gross, Go outside and do that":laughing:


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## dielectricunion (Nov 29, 2012)

My scrap yard pays a lower rate for asbestos insulated stuff, but they still take it


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## glen1971 (Oct 10, 2012)

I know that asbestos can also be found in older conduit seals in the fibre used to pack them.. If we are asked to remove them the whole seal and a section of pipe on each end comes out intact or it is sampled and analyzed first..


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## Mich drew (Mar 3, 2013)

When I was a little kid in the early 60's, childrens pajamas contained asbestos.
Asbestos was in floor tiles,roofing tiles, siding, brake pads,wire insulation, some wallbording, etc. etc....
It was a miracle material used in all sorts of applications. Somehow those of us from that era are still around. Don't sweat it so much. Try to limit your future exposure.


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## MHElectric (Oct 14, 2011)

Mich drew said:


> When I was a little kid in the early 60's, childrens pajamas contained asbestos.
> Asbestos was in floor tiles,roofing tiles, siding, brake pads,wire insulation, some wallbording, etc. etc....
> It was a miracle material used in all sorts of applications. Somehow those of us from that era are still around. Don't sweat it so much. Try to limit your future exposure.


Well that's some comforting news.


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## bobelectric (Feb 24, 2007)

Talk to a Union insulator.


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## Morales95 (Jan 15, 2015)

There are three types of asbestos used in commercial applications, but for electrical applications*crocidolite, or "blue" asbestos, had properties that made it an especially effective insulator, and enormous quantities of crocidolite-based electrical insulation was produced and applied to residential and commercial wiring, power lines, and the power generation and transmission facilities of the major utility companies.

Read more:*http://www.mesothelioma.com/asbestos-exposure/products/wiring-insulation/#ixzz3P8PZXQGq real good information


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## wendon (Sep 27, 2010)

Most of the stuff I've seen is the old cloth covered romex with a white braided coating of the fiber over a thermoplastic coating. Is that why "cough" "cough" when you try to remove the fiber, you see little fuzzies floating in the air "hack" "hack" ?


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## Cl906um (Jul 21, 2012)

I wouldn't worry as much about wire insulation as much as having drilled through old popcorn finished ceilings, and pushing up old ceiling tiles. Crawling on mill pipes running wires, pipes, and cable trays with covering worn off. What kills me, is that it doesn't show up on X-rays for 7 years.


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## LARMGUY (Aug 22, 2010)

Elemento1991 said:


> Hey guys I have a question about the older style cloth wire. Last year I was on a gig for about 5-6 months where we were swapping out old fuse block panels in a museum. The wires were the old cloth style of insulation. They were brittle and when bent the insulation would crack or break. Also when burnt the insulation didn't burn off entirely and left a very brittle white coating that was almost like a dust. Don't ask how I know I just do.
> 
> So anyways about two or three months after the fact someone said we could have been working with asbestos insulation the whole time. Does anyone know if there's truth to this?






 
Dis guy is always interrupting my TV watching with his 18 Billion dollar Mesothelioma trust fund for those who have the disease from being exposed to asbestos in the past.


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## JRaef (Mar 23, 2009)

In my 20s, I worked 2 summers for a company that serviced and rebuilt sterilizers for hospitals, labs, etc. and most of them had asbestos insulation on them. When the scare first started, we got a lot of contracts to "seal" the insulation with this cloth/rubber combination, sort of like fiberglass layup. But in working on them, we were always disturbing the asbestos and inhaling it. 35 years later, I don't have any lung issues or problems. 

That said, a friend of my brother, 10 years older than me, worked for the State for 25 years in an old office building that was later found to have air ducts in the HVAC system that were MADE OF sheets of asbestos. He has mesothelioma and is about to die of it, having been suffering from it for the past 20 years. He is going to die rich, for whatever that's worth, but way too young (68).

My point is, confirmed by my doctor when I asked, is that there is very little evidence that short term exposure causes mesothelioma, even though, as he pointed out, the asbestos fibers are likely there in my lungs still, because they never break down. But as he put it, there is a LOT of crap that gets trapped in our lungs, 99.9999% of which will still be there in 10,000 years if some archeologist digs us up. Our lungs can handle that, up to a point. The problem is, the constant barrage people get from long term exposure, day in, day out, overwhelms our body's ability to encapsulate it and render it harmless (or less harmful). Then on top of that, smoking, which nearly 90% of people in the 40s through 60s did, added the nice sticky tar to trap even more crap in there and compromise the entire system. 

One project with a few fibers is not going to kill you, at least not before something else does...


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## dmxtothemax (Jun 15, 2010)

Just because you touched asbestos doesn't mean you gunna die a horrible death tomorrow ! It just means it's possible, 
and even then the chances are still very low.
So don't panic!
Be aware of what it looks like, 
and minimise exposure where possible,
But being an electrician chances are
you are going to come into contact with it from time to time.
Again doesn't mean your gunna die.
A bit of common sense
and you will probably die from something else
in the mean time.

View attachment 45025


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## Podagrower (Mar 16, 2008)

Mich drew said:


> When I was a little kid in the early 60's, childrens pajamas contained asbestos.
> Asbestos was in floor tiles,roofing tiles, siding, brake pads,wire insulation, some wallbording, etc. etc....
> It was a miracle material used in all sorts of applications. Somehow those of us from that era are still around. Don't sweat it so much. Try to limit your future exposure.


There was a pretty awesome program I watched about the way Cubans keep cars on the road (Detroit steel, Argentine, Russian). They talked with a guy that resurfaced brakes and clutches. He had his own compound, including asbestos of course, that he molded to the brake shoe/pad/clutch metal. Baked it in an oven to cure it, and then sanded it smooth. No dust mask, no respirator, nothing. On the one hand I was in awe, because it didn't matter if the metal was bent or warped since he was sanding it level, but on the other hand, baking asbestos in the same oven you make dinner in and standing there in a cloud of asbestos dust.


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## piette (Feb 7, 2008)

How much vermiculite insulation have we all dealt with? Asbestos in that as well. My company is certified for asbestos O&M, so we are legal to work in attics or walls containing vermiculite or any other asbestos containing product. In WI, not sure about any other state, it is one hell of a large fine (up to $25,000) if you are caught in a vermiculite attic without proper containment, suits, full face masks, and negative pressure in the attic (or disturbing any other type of asbestos). 

Setting up the containment and negative pressure is a pain in the ass, but the state contracts we have require it and those are worth way more than a little plastic and tape and crap.


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