# Magnetic Insulated Nutdrivers



## knowshorts (Jan 9, 2009)

Does anyone make them? I've checked the Klein, Wiha, and Cementex websites and cant seem to find anyone who makes them. Specifically looking for a 5/16 magnetic tip insulated nutdriver.


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## gilbequick (Oct 6, 2007)

Klein makes them (or did at one time very recently), in all sizes. Be careful though, if you get something in the end shallow enough that it doesn't stick out good GRIEF you're in for a treat trying to get that SOB out.


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## mattsilkwood (Sep 21, 2008)

Sounds like you are putting in cutler hammer breakers.


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## knowshorts (Jan 9, 2009)

Got a part number? 

I was thinking back a few years ago. Was installing a 277 volt breaker. Breaker screw was loose fitting like the Seimens BL series. Screw was a combo type. Taped screw to 10 in 1. Tightened screw and bit pulled out of 10 in 1. Left dangling. Very little insulation material between phases. Tried to retrieve bit with needle nose, but it was worse than a real life game of Operation. Couldn't get the balls to stick it in, so I eventually shut down the whole panel.


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## william1978 (Sep 21, 2008)

I got the 5/16 and 1/4 and I love them. I have not had any problems with mine yet and have had them for about 5 years.


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## william1978 (Sep 21, 2008)

mattsilkwood said:


> Sounds like you are putting in cutler hammer breakers.


 That what I thought also. The 5/16 is perfect for installing breakers in a Cutler Hammer panel.


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## Toronto Sparky (Apr 12, 2009)

Why not just use one of those screw drivers with the 1/4" drive and put a 5/16 tip in it?


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## william1978 (Sep 21, 2008)

Toronto Sparky said:


> Why not just use one of those screw drivers with the 1/4" drive and put a 5/16 tip in it?


 I have done that, but that 5/16 chuck is just another piece that could fall off and I would not want that in a hot panel.


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## william1978 (Sep 21, 2008)

knowshorts said:


> Does anyone make them? I've checked the Klein, Wiha, and Cementex websites and cant seem to find anyone who makes them. Specifically looking for a 5/16 magnetic tip insulated nutdriver.


Here you go.http://lmgtfy.com/?q=Magnetic+Insulated+Nutdrivers


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## william1978 (Sep 21, 2008)

Here is the whole set insulated. Kinda expensive, but if you need them you need them. http://www.mytoolstore.com/klein/kln08.html


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## knowshorts (Jan 9, 2009)

Maybe you guys are misunderstanding me. I'm looking for a magnetic tip nutdriver that is insulated. Not cushion gripped, but rated at 1000 volts.


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## oldtimer (Jun 10, 2010)

knowshorts said:


> Maybe you guys are misunderstanding me. I'm looking for a magnetic tip nutdriver that is insulated. Not cushion gripped, but rated at 1000 volts.


 It might be my imagination, but I always thought that magnetic screwdrivers etc, seem to pull toward live bus. Is it just imagination ?? :blink:


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## william1978 (Sep 21, 2008)

knowshorts said:


> Maybe you guys are misunderstanding me. I'm looking for a magnetic tip nutdriver that is insulated. Not cushion gripped, but rated at 1000 volts.


This was found on the link on post #10. http://www.mytoolstore.com/klein/33523.html

All you had to do with both of the links I give you was look and read just a little bit to find what you are looking for. At this moment I don't know if you should be in hot panels.


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## knowshorts (Jan 9, 2009)

william1978 said:


> This was found on the link on post #10. http://www.mytoolstore.com/klein/33523.html
> 
> All you had to do with both of the links I give you was look and read just a little bit to find what you are looking for. At this moment I don't know if you should be in hot panels.


I'm not seeing it. Maybe it's my phones browser, but I did not see on that link you posted, but I did not see "magnetic" 1000 volt drivers. I have the set you linked to, just wondering if they make those in magnetic.


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## william1978 (Sep 21, 2008)

knowshorts said:


> I'm not seeing it. Maybe it's my phones browser, but I did not see on that link you posted, but I did not see "magnetic" 1000 volt drivers. I have the set you linked to, just wondering if they make those in magnetic.


 Sorry. I misunderstood you. I looked again and like you said I don't see them either.


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## mattsilkwood (Sep 21, 2008)

oldtimer said:


> It might be my imagination, but I always thought that magnetic screwdrivers etc, seem to pull toward live bus. Is it just imagination ?? :blink:


 Most of the bus I've ever seen was copper or aluminum, so no magnetism.
There may well be some steel bus out there but I've never seen it.


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## william1978 (Sep 21, 2008)

mattsilkwood said:


> Most of the bus I've ever seen was copper or aluminum, so no magnetism.
> There may well be some steel bus out there but I've never seen it.


 Same here. I haven't seen any steel bus either.


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## mattsilkwood (Sep 21, 2008)

william1978 said:


> That what I thought also. The 5/16 is perfect for installing breakers in a Cutler Hammer panel.


Here's a little trick I learned. Wrap the end of your nutdriver with 1 wrap of 33. Leave enough so that it will fold over into the hole and then fold it over into the hole. The little 5/16 screw will fit very tight, tight enough that you can bang it around and not worry about it falling out.

That's if you are working in a hot panel, which I know none of us ever do.:whistling2:


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## william1978 (Sep 21, 2008)

mattsilkwood said:


> Here's a little trick I learned. Wrap the end of your nutdriver with 1 wrap of 33. Leave enough so that it will fold over into the hole and then fold it over into the hole. The little 5/16 screw will fit very tight, tight enough that you can bang it around and not worry about it falling out.
> 
> That's if you are working in a hot panel, which I know none of us ever do.:whistling2:


 Nice trick. And I would never work in a hot panel.:laughing:


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## Toronto Sparky (Apr 12, 2009)

I've always been a fan of Xcelite nut drivers.. 


http://www.all-spec.com/products/Xcelite/Tools|Drivers|TOL-2B/


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## oldtimer (Jun 10, 2010)

mattsilkwood said:


> Most of the bus I've ever seen was copper or aluminum, so no magnetism.
> There may well be some steel bus out there but I've never seen it.


Must be my imagination. :surrender:


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## Widestance_Politics (Jun 2, 2010)

I used to do a lot of work for Micron Elecrtonics who operated 24 hours a day, and it wasn't feasible to shut down when changing breakers. So I found myself changing bolt-on breakers in GE MDP's once in a while. Lots of exposed bus and very little room for error...probably the spookiest thing I have done as an electrician. Anyhow we used an insulated nut driver, and a straight insulated magnetic retrieval tool to control the bolt.....as far as I know there is no such thing as an insulated/magnetic/nut driver....perhaps it is too hard to keep metal shavings from collecting in the end? Who knows?......


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## Big John (May 23, 2010)

knowshorts said:


> ...Taped screw to 10 in 1. Tightened screw and bit pulled out of 10 in 1. Left dangling....


It's because of that possibility that I'll never use a 10-n-1 in anything hot. The last thing I want to hear is the sound of a #2 phillips bit clattering into the buswork. :icon_eek:

_Knowshorts,_ 
If you can't find a real insulated nut driver, I'd take a regular Klein magnetic nut driver and put three or four coats of PVC dip on it. I'd never count on that for shock protection (that's why you have insulated gloves, right? :whistling2 But it might well save you from an arc flash if you accidentally drop it.

-John


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## knowshorts (Jan 9, 2009)

Before I started purchasing _real_ insulated tools, I had an assortment of drivers, long magnetic bits, allens and sockets that I dipped in a few coats of liquid plastic. It worked fine, but just looking for better now.


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## mattsilkwood (Sep 21, 2008)

33 is good for 600v a wrap.:whistling2:


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## 76nemo (Aug 13, 2008)

knowshorts,

I just stuck my neck out for you. I tried calling Cementex, Wiha, Grainger, Mitchell, Specialized, and Miller. Nobody seems to have any clue as to what other direction to go in. The rep from Miller said I/you would not find them on the market magnetized. 

I never believed in the PVC dip, although I have taped and heatshrank quite a few tools. Now to add to that, I had protected insulated gloves, rated footwear, and an insulating mat backing me up. I won't suggest working in a hot panel as we never do:whistling2:, but it appears what you're specifically looking for is not readily available.

The lead rep from Specialized is supposed to call me tomorrow. If he knows something we don't or can't find, I will post then.


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## knowshorts (Jan 9, 2009)

Nemo,

I appreciate it. I like the heat shrink idea. 

I am usually good at finding what I am looking for. This now goes down as number 2 of things I couldn't find. The 1st, I gave up years ago. A full size version of that chick in Total Recall.


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## Bob Badger (Apr 19, 2009)

Not like I have never installed a breaker in a hot 480 panel but stuff can happen.


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## electro916 (Jan 16, 2009)

knowshorts said:


> Nemo,
> 
> I appreciate it. I like the heat shrink idea.
> 
> I am usually good at finding what I am looking for. This now goes down as number 2 of things I couldn't find. The 1st, I gave up years ago. A full size version of that chick in Total Recall.


I heat shrink my screwdriver shafts all the time, As far as CH bolt ins, I have a 6" shaft 5/16" magnetic nut-driver with heat shrink, and I WEAR GLOVES, and also I only do this if its 208/240 never 480.


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## John Valdes (May 17, 2007)

oldtimer said:


> It might be my imagination, but I always thought that magnetic screwdrivers etc, seem to pull toward live bus. Is it just imagination ?? :blink:


It's possible the nuts are steel but the bus is either Cu or AL. :thumbsup:



mattsilkwood said:


> Here's a little trick I learned. Wrap the end of your nutdriver with 1 wrap of 33. Leave enough so that it will fold over into the hole and then fold it over into the hole. The little 5/16 screw will fit very tight, tight enough that you can bang it around and not worry about it falling out.
> 
> That's if you are working in a hot panel, which I know none of us ever do.:whistling2:


I tape the screw into the nut driver as it will pull loose once you start the threads. One layer of 33. They really cannot fall out this way. A couple extra minutes seems nothing compared to a flash burn or worse.



Widestance_Politics said:


> I used to do a lot of work for Micron Elecrtonics who operated 24 hours a day, and it wasn't feasible to shut down when changing breakers. So I found myself changing bolt-on breakers in GE MDP's once in a while. Lots of exposed bus and very little room for error...probably the spookiest thing I have done as an electrician. Anyhow we used an insulated nut driver, and a straight insulated magnetic retrieval tool to control the bolt.....as far as I know there is no such thing as an insulated/magnetic/nut driver....perhaps it is too hard to keep metal shavings from collecting in the end? Who knows?......



Same here. In industrial work there are times when you just cannot shut down a complete panel. Even shutting down individual circuits could cause serious issues for the product and several hours of restart time. I have always used extreme caution when I worked anything hot. And yes, I have had several close calls. I got to the point where I would interfere with the process just to avoid the possibility of an accident. This was not well received by the management and the production associates.
Once I shut down an extrusion line about 50' short of a 5000' roll of plastic gas line. Ruined the whole roll. That was one time I overreacted because a 500 HP DC motor had lost a bearing and the armature was dragging the field coils.
There is a time and a place to make a stand. That was not one of them.


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## Bob Badger (Apr 19, 2009)

John Valdes said:


> In industrial work there are times when you just cannot shut down a complete panel.


That way of thinking is coming to an end. 





> Even shutting down individual circuits could cause serious issues for the product and several hours of restart time..


No issues that money cannot solve.

As long as electricians keep agreeing to work it hot nothing will change.

My life is worth more to me than factories production quotas and I bet your is too.


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## Toronto Sparky (Apr 12, 2009)

Here in Canada you are required to wear a full body suit and face shield if you have to work on panels live.


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## Big John (May 23, 2010)

Toronto Sparky said:


> Here in Canada you are required to wear a full body suit and face shield if you have to work on panels live.


 That applies here as well. But we also have rules that restrict hot-work to begin with.

A lot of folks who ignore the restrictions also ignore the rules for PPE.

-John


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## Johnsp117 (Oct 5, 2021)

oldtimer said:


> It might be my imagination, but I always thought that magnetic screwdrivers etc, seem to pull toward live bus. Is it just imagination ?? :blink:


As far as I understood it, magnetic drivers shouldn't be used in a live panel because it disrupts the intended path for electrical current.


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