# Ohms law



## eddy current (Feb 28, 2009)

Just wait until they add inductors and capacitors and you need trig to figure it out!!

Any class you take in any subject will cover things you don’t need, it’s just how education works.

Here’s an Ohms law question for you @Switchgear277. Guys, please let the apprentices try and answer first.

You have a baseboard heater rated at 3500w, 240 volts. What would the amperage be if you fed it with only 120 volts?


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## Bird dog (Oct 27, 2015)

Some in the class will need to know it later in their career. You don't want classes that will teach you just what you need to know now because others who know more will pass you up. Also, it expands your mind, so, when other topics come up that you do need to know, you can grasp them.


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## Switchgear277 (Mar 18, 2017)

3500w/ 120v = 29.166amps 
But that seemed to easy I’m shure theirs more to it .

30 amp ocp 
10 awg


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## eddy current (Feb 28, 2009)

Switchgear277 said:


> 3500w/ 120v = 29.166amps
> But that seemed to easy I’m shure theirs more to it .
> 
> 30 amp ocp
> 10 awg


There is and your answer is wrong.

Here’s a hint. You wouldn’t get 3500 w unless it was fed with the rated voltage. 
This is why understanding ohms law is important


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## MotoGP1199 (Aug 11, 2014)

Switchgear277 said:


> 3500w/ 120v = 29.166amps
> But that seemed to easy I’m shure theirs more to it .
> 
> 30 amp ocp
> 10 awg


HINT: First calculate what the resistance is at the rated voltage. Then do the math for the new "actual" voltage. Hmm....... Maybe this ohms law is needed.


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## paulengr (Oct 8, 2017)

If you do controls especially substation relaying or voltage drop you will use it all the time to the point where you don't even think about it anymore. Also even if you don't do the calculations you will constantly use the concept.

An example. A car shredder motor (3500 HP) had 2 sets of brushes, half once grade of carbon and half another (not typically used) grade. After repairing some damage to the slip ringa, the shop replaced the brushes with the typical grade. Brush wear went way up. If you're not used to brushed motors, the brushes have a certain current density (amperes per square inch) they work best at. Outside that range wear gets very high, both above and below rating.

I asked a simple question...What is the difference in resistance? Turns out the nonstandard brush resistance is about 10 times higher so as per Ohms law it wasn't doing anything. Removing half the brushes fixed the current denaity.

I didn't do the calculation, just applied the concept.

There are also rules that violate the rules. Like a common rule of thumb for estimating transformer size is to use 1 HP = 1 kVA. The real calculation involves power factor or efficiency which you usually don't know or a range of locked rotor amps, and diversity which again you won't know. If there are 4 or more motors for say an MCC though you can just add HP and kVA together to estimate needed kVA. Pretty simple and it works for most industrial cases.

The real calculation involves HP x 0.746 x diversity then take the largest motor and add the LRA - FLA then multiplying by 1.732 x Volts and adding, then divide by the assumed power factor to get close to kVA required (often uses 0.85). Oh and add resistive loads and use tables in NEC for typical residential loads. Did I mention this stuff can make your head hurt.

Sent from my SM-T350 using Tapatalk


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## Switchgear277 (Mar 18, 2017)

7.291 amps

240square/3500= 16.457r
120/16.457r= 7.291


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## Switchgear277 (Mar 18, 2017)

Ok understood I’ll stay in my lane and keep learning the ohms law


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## Wirenuting (Sep 12, 2010)

Switchgear277 said:


> and keep learning


I've been learning for 38 years and still learn new things here everyday. 
Your never to old to learn...

Your only to old to remember were you left your car keys.


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## macmikeman (Jan 23, 2007)

I'll answer the guys question honestly. Been working with wires and wire nuts and electrical metering / test equipment for forty two years. The math that I use constantly is Materials +labor+overhead+profit+tax. With a few exceptions, the rest of the math can be looked at from tables found in books. (or Googled) What your class should be teaching you is how to deal with motor nameplates that are worn down or worse, the printed type , not stamped that have been wiped off and you cannot read any of the information on them but you are standing there being asked to fix or replace something.


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## Wiresmith (Feb 9, 2013)

the curriculum looks spectacular on paper to people that do not do the work we do, have not in a long time and don't do it any longer for a reason, or do it and just play along acting like they know something. i went through a union apprenticeship(there is a core curriculum for most locals) and i think it was a complete joke/waste of time/fraud. you have 6 years in, have you considered taking the journeyman exam and skipping the program?


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## eddy current (Feb 28, 2009)

Wiresmith said:


> the curriculum looks spectacular on paper to people that do not do the work we do, have not in a long time and don't do it any longer for a reason, or do it and just play along acting like they know something. i went through a union apprenticeship(there is a core curriculum for most locals) and i think it was a complete joke/waste of time/fraud. you have 6 years in, have you considered taking the journeyman exam and skipping the program?


Not sure what your license test is like but ours does not have too much on stuff learned from a job site, unless you do a lot of service work. The license test up here ( the red seal) has questions exactly as I posted plus questions on controls, high voltage, communications, safety........

You would not pass with on the job experience only.


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## Switchgear277 (Mar 18, 2017)

Wiresmith said:


> the curriculum looks spectacular on paper to people that do not do the work we do, have not in a long time and don't do it any longer for a reason, or do it and just play along acting like they know something. i went through a union apprenticeship(there is a core curriculum for most locals) and i think it was a complete joke/waste of time/fraud. you have 6 years in, have you considered taking the journeyman exam and skipping the program?


I took the jw exam and the best I did was able to pass the two years of labor history they could of put me in 
2nd year bc I scored as 2nd year but would’ve had to wait for a spot to free up .

So I decided to jump right in as a first year apprentice bc I didn’t want the chance to pass by .

I have actually learned a lot in school as a first year apprentice 
That I never New with 6 years in .

Four point saddles with two 9o,s 
One stick of pipe plus added the shrink .
. Gain and 90,s with rmc 
Charting a chigaco bender.
. Segmented bending formulas .
. Some voltage drop 

And I think it’s a plus bc I wanted 
To go through all 5 years of schooling so I can say I went through the hole ibew apprentiship.

So I’m glad we’re I’m at and don’t think the entire schooling lessons are a waist it just seems like they focus a lot on some things that 
Have no relation to the feild for long periods of times . Like dc batteries ,

And the ohms law ckts for mounths
But all in all I think so far the schooling is top notch . 

It’s alittle fast pace and hard to remember everything we go over 
But I’m deff glad I started at first year and will have all 5 years of schooling it just gets frustrating 

Learning some things that have little relation to the feild . But that’s a part of learning. Expanding your mind etc .

And also I’m not a good test taker 
I’m more of a hands on kind of guy .
So I’m just letting it ride and taking each year as it comes .


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## Wiresmith (Feb 9, 2013)

eddy current said:


> Not sure what your license test is like but ours does not have too much on stuff learned from a job site, unless you do a lot of service work. The license test up here ( the red seal) has questions exactly as I posted plus questions on controls, high voltage, communications, safety........
> 
> You would not pass with on the job experience only.


you wouldn't pass the test here with only on the job experience either, but you also wouldn't pass it with the training through the apprenticeship either, you get a heads up of whats on it and study the material


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## Switchgear277 (Mar 18, 2017)

Very true


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## Roger (Jul 7, 2007)

Switchgear277 said:


> Am I wrong is ohms law a very important part of electrical and the learning process .


Knowing theory is the difference in being an Electrician or being a life long run of the mill installer.

Do you want to just run pipe and put wires in them or understand why you are doing it the way you are doing it?

Roger


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## Rora (Jan 31, 2017)

You may not actually use Ohms law all that much, but the equation represents a fundamental concept that is important to learn on your journey to understanding how electricity behaves intuitively.

It's very difficult to teach people an intuition for something invisible like electricity, so they teach you the fundamentals and hope it will somehow "click" for each person at some point. Ohms law will help you understand concepts that _are_ useful on the job, like voltage drop, resistive load on a circuit, etc.

Example, why does a short circuit trip the breaker? It's a parallel current path that drops the circuit resistance, which raises the amperage above the breaker limit. To someone who has no experience, Ohm's law can help them prove/understand why this happens.


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## Wiresmith (Feb 9, 2013)

but months of ohms law? first year


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## Switchgear277 (Mar 18, 2017)

Understood thanks for the replies


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## macmikeman (Jan 23, 2007)

Rora said:


> Example, why does a short circuit trip the breaker? It's a parallel current path that drops the circuit resistance, which raises the amperage above the breaker limit. To someone who has no experience, Ohm's law can help them prove/understand why this happens.



And that is the reason they call it a parallel current path that drops the circuit resistance which raises the amperage above the limit the circuit breaker allows and so it trips. 

NOT. They call it a short circuit. Because actually it is right to the point and even the reta-rded millennial youtube generation can understand that. The math is not even significant to 99.9 % of working electricians, who know what is going on in a short circuit event, and how to prevent such a wondrous thing. Electricians *do need* to know how to prevent overloading circuits and electrical gear. That is done with simple math. Like addition and division. That's most of it. And don't forget to *Charge Large*.


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## macmikeman (Jan 23, 2007)

Roger said:


> Knowing theory is the difference in being an Electrician or being a life long run of the mill installer.
> 
> Do you want to just run pipe and put wires in them or understand why you are doing it the way you are doing it?
> 
> Roger


I love it when I see guys giving me this bullchit. What is really important is you know your codes, don't " SHORT CIRCUIT" them, do nice clean installation jobs, no stuffing the conduit, no splice in the conduit, don't nick the wire, wear appropriate ppe , turn off the source and lock it out before working , and above all else be careful out there , we want you to be going home safe and sound tonight. Anybody putting down people who do installation work is a true real moron, regardless of what he pretends to know math wise while he pontificates at Mike Holt with all the other blowhards.


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

Two years after finishing an apprenticeship the average to above average electrician can't tell you the amperage of a 75kva 480 delta to 208/120 wye transformer when you tell him the primary and secondary current.


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## pjholguin (May 16, 2014)

Your thoughts are so far off...I use what I learned in my first year all the time. The training you are receiving is giving you a solid foundation to start off with. :vs_cool:




Switchgear277 said:


> I took the jw exam and the best I did was able to pass the two years of labor history they could of put me in
> 2nd year bc I scored as 2nd year but would’ve had to wait for a spot to free up .
> 
> So I decided to jump right in as a first year apprentice bc I didn’t want the chance to pass by .
> ...


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## bostonPedro (Nov 14, 2017)

brian john said:


> Two years after finishing an apprenticeship the average to above average electrician can't tell you the amperage of a 75kva 480 delta to 208/120 wye transformer when you tell him the primary and secondary current.


True but it is the same in any educational environment. If you dont use what you were taught over time you start to to forget. I used to know Latin and could actually speak it but who the hell would I speak a dead language to enough to be able to retain what I learned so I hardly remember any of it now


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## macmikeman (Jan 23, 2007)

bostonPedro said:


> True but it is the same in any educational environment. If you dont use what you were taught over time you start to to forget. I used to know Latin and could actually speak it but who the hell would I speak a dead language to enough to be able to retain what I learned so I hardly remember any of it now


When I was a wee little booby tyke I could speak wee little booby tyke talk in French. Not now...... Do Canadians need to know French absolutely perfect?
No, the majority of the country has Engrish speaking people. Does not being bilingual mean they are not real Canadians? ( This , ladies and gentilemen , is a perfect example of stainless steel razor sharp tinking that a macmikeman can output when someone says something like how conduit installer's or residential sparks are not real electricians. MY ASS THEY AIN'T.


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## Wiresmith (Feb 9, 2013)

pjholguin said:


> Your thoughts are so far off...I use what I learned in my first year all the time. The training you are receiving is giving you a solid foundation to start off with. :vs_cool:


are you a designer/engineer now? or what is it that you use, in a local that runs conduit i absolutely believe they should learn conduit if that's what you were taught 1st year


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## Wiresmith (Feb 9, 2013)

i think we should learn the math side, but honestly that should be more of a voluntary journeyman class(if someone doesn't care about that type of stuff its going in one ear and out the other), and the majority of the people in the trade today don't need to be proficient in it. i think apprentices should learn the 99% of the work we actually do and get f*in awesome at it in the classroom instead of wasting time on related information. when you see journeyman in the field being barely proficient in the basics *WE NEED TO SPEND MORE TIME ON THE BASICS* before we teach them how to split an electron

looks great on paper, looks like sh*t where the rubber meets the road


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## Switchgear277 (Mar 18, 2017)

I totally agree most of what we learned is engineering and theroy 
When most of the kids in the class can’t make a splice ..

But I do think it’s important to learn theory and ohms law not just 
For mounths on end


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## Wiresmith (Feb 9, 2013)

Switchgear277 said:


> I totally agree most of what we learned is engineering and theroy
> When most of the kids in the class can’t make a splice ..
> 
> But I do think it’s important to learn theory and ohms law not just
> For mounths on end


i agree. my experience was similar to yours. i thinks its okay to go over it for like 2 classes first year and come back to later on in apprenticeship. you shouldn't put the cart before the horse. i was working with one of the guys i topped out with just after we topped out, i had to look at some fire alarm devices he terminated, instead of using the rip cord he ringed the jacket and nicked conductor insulation on some. i thought about it and we never went over that in the apprenticeship. you can say he should have asked to be shown, but you don't know what you don't know, he stripped the jacket like he would insulation why wouldn't he? that's what he know's (we are predominately an industrial local, he only ever worked industrial through program (never touched romex/catV))


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## pjholguin (May 16, 2014)

I am a controls electrician at UPW/AWN facility. I concur with you totally about the hands on need during a first year...and yes.:vs_cool:



Wiresmith said:


> are you a designer/engineer now? or what is it that you use, in a local that runs conduit i absolutely believe they should learn conduit if that's what you were taught 1st year


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## Lone Crapshooter (Nov 8, 2008)

As a former apprenticeship instructor we must realize that we are training BLUE COLOR CRAFTSAMAN and not engineers. There are some aspects of the trade that do require a lot of heavy duty math electrical testing and protection and control being the 2 that come to my mind. The average electrician is not going to do ether. If a electrician wants to persue that type of work maybe there should be a upgrade class that they could take.
The day to day work a commercial / industrial electrician does a good understanding of general math is all that is needed.

LC


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## Pete E (Jan 2, 2018)

Its strange viewing an argument like this...I'm not a qualified electrician, but rather time serviced/qualified on telecoms, but the electrical theory is the same.

I notice on here there is an under current (excuse the pun!) of whats a "real" electrician and in some quarters, the folks who do residential work seem to be treated as the red headed step child. That's often the same in the UK as well.

Now I don't know about any of the codes in the US, but if we look at a typical res job in the uk, a good spark needs to know Ohms Law second nature. Imagine a customer wants a supply taken from his house out to a small work shop at the bottom of the garden.

Your spark has to design that circuit so its safe, meets the customers requirements, and meets "code"..

He will start with the potential load to give an idea how much current draw there is likely to be, work out the length of the cable run and its location, what size cable will be able deliver the current safely and not suffer adverse voltage drop, does the cable need to be "derated" for any reasons. 

Then there is all the earthing side, the resistances of the earths, what size and type of earth is required to meet code ect..

Plus you have to consider how its going to be linked into the existing house electrics...Is it going to be a new circuit or linked into an existing cct? Depending on that you have a load of other factors to consider.

Essex on here will probably remind me of even more stuff that needs to be taken into consideration/calculated. 

The point is, that a large part of this is all based on Ohms Law and having a decent grasp of math and that's for an electrician doing the most basic bread and butter aspect of the work.


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## eddy current (Feb 28, 2009)

Drilling ohms law into you is important IMO. 

Commercial guys are not smarter than residential guys, it depends on the type of actual work you do. I have worked with many commercial electricians who I would not let wire anything in my house or buisiness. If your on a big job for many, many years, following a print or just doing whatever the Forman asks of you, it is easy to forget the basic stuff (like ohms law and code) and become an assembly line worker with Zero trouble shooting skills. 
Then your neighbor our asks you to wire his new shop in the garage, gives you the wattage of all the equipment he plans on having in there and your lost.


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## splatz (May 23, 2015)

I agree that Ohms law is fundamental but the OP is talking about series / parallel combination circuits that are common in electronics but almost never come up in electrical work. I think covering those very briefly is necessary but after that it's a waste, that time could be spent better. 

The two things that you really need to understand as series - parallel circuits are multiwire branch circuits sharing a neutral, and how when the neutral is open they turn into 240V series - parallel circuits. Once you understand that it's easy to see that the Edison three wire distribution servicing most households in the US, is really just one big MWBC, and an open neutral there is going to be big trouble, with some additional complications that aren't involved in the branch MWBC.


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## Pete E (Jan 2, 2018)

splatz said:


> I agree that Ohms law is fundamental but the OP is talking about series / parallel combination circuits that are common in electronics but almost never come up in electrical work. I think covering those very briefly is necessary but after that it's a waste, that time could be spent better.
> 
> The two things that you really need to understand as series - parallel circuits are multiwire branch circuits sharing a neutral, and how when the neutral is open they turn into 240V series - parallel circuits. Once you understand that it's easy to see that the Edison three wire distribution servicing most households in the US, is really just one big MWBC, and an open neutral there is going to be big trouble, with some additional complications that aren't involved in the branch MWBC.


Least you guys don't have to worry about ring circuits!:laughing:


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## Bird dog (Oct 27, 2015)

Pete E said:


> Least you guys don't have to worry about ring circuits!:laughing:


And whole house GFCIs (RCDs on the main breaker). :vs_laugh:


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## Pete E (Jan 2, 2018)

Bird dog said:


> And whole house GFCIs (RCDs on the main breaker). :vs_laugh:


Your GFCI's are at the outlet then?


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## Bird dog (Oct 27, 2015)

Pete E said:


> Your GFCI's are at the outlet then?


Either a GFCI receptacle or a GFCI branch circuit breaker that feeds receptacles. There are exceptions like swimming pool panels or hot tubs.


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## Pete E (Jan 2, 2018)

Bird dog said:


> a GFCI branch circuit breaker that feeds receptacles. There are exceptions like swimming pool panels or hot tubs.


That sounds like our RCBO's, (a combined RCD and MCB) which are fitted one per circuit, so no sharing of RCD's on the board...

They are not compulsory yet, but its moving that way. If I was having a new board fitted, I'd certainly want to change from my current dual RCD set up to one that used multiple miniature RCBO's..

The only downside I can see to them is cost as they work out quite a bit more expensive..


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## QMED (Sep 14, 2016)

When I went through my initial training they were teaching us crap like how to calculate the impedance of tank circuits which I have never done since. The most useful training we got was using schematics and a multimeter to troubleshoot basic circuits and controls. 

I went to a school for a radar system that consisted of a huge room full of equipment. They had the actual full size system in one single room with all of the antennas outside. Training consisted of going over the theory and schematics of each subsystem in the classroom and then walking down the hall to the mockup and going over everything we learned in the classroom with the schematics on the table next to us. There were only 6 people in the class and we had 2 very good instructors. 

The system had all sorts of ingenious ways to insert faults; bad board components/solder traces, hidden switches, burned out lights, faulty magnetrons, and a ton of other things. Sometimes they would do simple things like disconnect a few fans and see if you noticed or actually intentionally burn some components to teach you the smell. Sometimes they did simple **** like shut off a few breakers and laugh while you mess with waveforms on your oscilloscope haha. The instructors were great and would never accept a fix unless you could show them either physically or on the schematic. And if you couldn't "show you're work", or show some logical way to arrive at your conclusion(like Fridays when we had important drinking to do and someone gave you the fault) you were sent out and another fault was inserted lol.

I don't personally get much from a lot circuit calculations, reason is you forget all but the most basic stuff or at least I do haha. Best thing you can do is get some components and start making basic circuits on your own to really teach yourself, seeing is believing. All the series and parallel circuits that they're having you calculate are easy to make with some very cheap components. Just keep the voltage low and use fuses haha. I've been able to buy 50/51 relays on eBay for like $20 that were probably state of the art when they were installed at my work and are now worthless which is good for me to mess with.

What you want is to be able to understand/construct the circuit in question intuitively, sometimes they're teaching you something in class and it doesn't quite make sense, hold on to that knowledge because eventually you will see/hear something and it will click. Sometimes you just need a slightly different "angle" to get it.


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## Rique Escamilla (Oct 28, 2017)

knowing how to do ohms law, thevins theorum,votage analysis, and calculating voltage drops builds a good foundation imo.


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## Lone Crapshooter (Nov 8, 2008)

I have been a licensed electrician for 44 years and have never had to use thevins theorum.
When the phone rings at 2:15 in the morning they are not going to ask if you can work thevins theorum . You can take that to the bank. The contractor is not going to care ether and anytime spent studying such in a apprenticeship class is a waste of both the students and teachers time.
We are training BLUE COLOR CRAFTSMEN not engineers

LC


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## Wiresmith (Feb 9, 2013)

i agree in learning ohms law as a first year apprentice, just not months worth. just learn basic ohms law first year, i think only a few classes on it would suffice first year


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## Lone Crapshooter (Nov 8, 2008)

Wiresmit is exactly correct.

LC


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

I prefer to think of it as more of a suggestion than a law.


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## Rique Escamilla (Oct 28, 2017)

Lone Crapshooter said:


> I have been a licensed electrician for 44 years and have never had to use thevins theorum.
> When the phone rings at 2:15 in the morning they are not going to ask if you can work thevins theorum . You can take that to the bank. The contractor is not going to care ether and anytime spent studying such in a apprenticeship class is a waste of both the students and teachers time.
> We are training BLUE COLOR CRAFTSMEN not engineers
> 
> LC


 im jk man but exactly i had to learn it in my class for my electrical engineers degree. i agree with you 100%


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## Lone Crapshooter (Nov 8, 2008)

At that level you should but for the blue collar it just is not necessary.

LC


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## eddy current (Feb 28, 2009)

Maybe we should dumb the trade down completely. Who needs theory at all? Teach people to just run conduit and call them conduit installers. Then teach others to only pull wire and call them wire pullers. No need for electricians at all, just teach different people only what is required for each aspect of our job and split our profession up into many smaller tasks. Hell on a big job think of the money that can be saved with only one electrician and a bunch of minimum wage wire pullers, conduit installers, receptacle installers, light fixture installers etc. I bet they won’t even have to speak English!


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## Lone Crapshooter (Nov 8, 2008)

Absolutly not dumbing down the trade is not the answer. We all need to know theory but we need to know pratcial theory that we can apply to our daily work and leave the engineering theory for the engineers. Don't burden me with something that I will never use.
The trade is changing so fast and and every thing is computer based perhaps the wiring of computer network might be a good thing to add to a apprenticeship program.

Something else to think about is adding process automation and instrumentation to apprenticeships rather than a upgrade post apprenticeship class. that could be easly tied into building automation.

Just something to think about.

LC


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## macmikeman (Jan 23, 2007)

I have a certain electrical theory. There is a certain office building I keep getting calls to go add stuff or remodel stuff. Every single floor I looked above the ceiling tile was a jackass yess and full of mc just laying on the ceiling with zero support to any of it for the full length panel to outlets and this building takes up a whole city block. My theory is that if I ever find out who did that they are gonna be needing to get new tires for their vehicle , and not just once, many times. 
That's my electrical theory. My other theory involves sugar and gas tank. Both are electrically related calculations.


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## Wiresmith (Feb 9, 2013)

eddy current said:


> Maybe we should dumb the trade down completely. Who needs theory at all? Teach people to just run conduit and call them conduit installers. Then teach others to only pull wire and call them wire pullers. No need for electricians at all, just teach different people only what is required for each aspect of our job and split our profession up into many smaller tasks. Hell on a big job think of the money that can be saved with only one electrician and a bunch of minimum wage wire pullers, conduit installers, receptacle installers, light fixture installers etc. I bet they won’t even have to speak English!


the union has already put this into action its called the ce/cw program


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## eddy current (Feb 28, 2009)

Wiresmith said:


> the union has already put this into action its called the ce/cw program


Also there is the “right to work”. I think politicians are responsible for that though.

Thankfully neither of those has come up to Canada............yet lain:


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## Wiresmith (Feb 9, 2013)

eddy current said:


> Also there is the “right to work”. I think politicians are responsible for that though.
> 
> Thankfully neither of those has come up to Canada............yet lain:


are you union, if so do you know of the ce/cw program being used up there much


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## eddy current (Feb 28, 2009)

Wiresmith said:


> are you union, if so do you know of the ce/cw program being used up there much


No CE/CW In my local. I can only speak for Ontario, not sure about other provinces but I don’t think any of Canada has it.


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## LARMGUY (Aug 22, 2010)

eddy current said:


> Maybe we should dumb the trade down completely. Who needs theory at all? Teach people to just run conduit and call them conduit installers. Then teach others to only pull wire and call them wire pullers. No need for electricians at all, just teach different people only what is required for each aspect of our job and split our profession up into many smaller tasks. Hell on a big job think of the money that can be saved with only one electrician and a bunch of minimum wage wire pullers, conduit installers, receptacle installers, light fixture installers etc. I bet they won’t even have to speak English!


Too late. It's already being done that way here. :sad:


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## emtnut (Mar 1, 2015)

Y'all know if we dumb down the trade, no one will ever become a plumber ..... That's a chitty thought :biggrin:


Maybe they pound the ohm's law a lot, but the OP couldn't answer the question in post #2 :wink:


And curious ... Is Thevins theorem anything like Thevenin's Theorem ?? :devil3:


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