# Permit? who needs that?



## jwjrw (Jan 14, 2010)

So I go to a new house today to look at a basement apartment that is trimmed out but nothing working. I find a 225 amp ch cut ham in garage that has 2 twins. It also was a straight 42 (no twins allowed).
I find a 8/16 br cut ham outside with all the wires not hooked up.
I hook them up and find 1 counter top outlet not gfi and somehow somewhere tied to the line side of a gfi because it wouldnt trip. 
I installed a gfi there fixed a three way switch. 

This is a million plus house just finished and he paid someone to do the wiring(basement wiring) but moved up north before it was trimmed out (I guess because it took 5 mins to hook up breakers). Had #14 wire in what I would say was dining room. Was almost done to code but not code compliant.

Anyway I hand him a bill for $155 and he looks worried. I said thats 2 hours labor (we were there 2 hours took 20 minutes to figure out gfi in 3rd floor bath was also for basement)and 1 twin br 20a. He says can I mail it to you in a few days. I say sure he was referred to me by another customer/Gc. I think ill get my money just surprised me he didnt think he would need a few hundred ready for this.:whistling2:


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## RIVETER (Sep 26, 2009)

*who needs that*

A lot of customers are like that. He probably thought you would not charge that much. Even though I am an electrician, I've taken a lot of appliance calls. Once a lady called and her freezer was not FREEZING. I was there for a couple of minutes till I noticed her electric bill caught in the condensor fan. I pulled it out and said $50.00, please. She started yelling that she couldn't believe I'd charge for something like that. You have to let them know up front that there will be a charge just for showing up.


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## slickvic277 (Feb 5, 2009)

People are crazy.I had a friend of a friend's mom want a new service on her rental property installed,no big deal right.She wanted the 100 amp service taken out and wanted a 200 amp installed,so I go look at it give her a price of $1200(which is the going rate around these parts,maybe even a little on the cheap side.)She just stares at me with a look on her face of utter horror and then says to me and I quote "I want to get the job done but I just don't want to pay for it."Needles to say the service up grade never happened.:laughing::laughing::laughing:


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## jwjrw (Jan 14, 2010)

RIVETER said:


> A lot of customers are like that. He probably thought you would not charge that much. Even though I am an electrician, I've taken a lot of appliance calls. Once a lady called and her freezer was not FREEZING. I was there for a couple of minutes till I noticed her electric bill caught in the condensor fan. I pulled it out and said $50.00, please. She started yelling that she couldn't believe I'd charge for something like that. You have to let them know up front that there will be a charge just for showing up.


He was referred to me by a customer/gc and I was just going to give an estimate for what he needed. I had to start looking to see what he needed(now its a service call) and should of said we charge blah blah but 
it was a strange situation I didnt know what was done or how and was trying to see what I had to do to tell him how much it would be. 
On a person out of the blue the 1st thing out of my mouth is I charge 85 for a service call and 65 hour per hour after the first for t/s but I was going there to give an estimate..... I should of said when I saw what was happening how much but I didnt. I do think he will pay just kinda surprized he didnt ask how much if he didnt have cash. Of course that goes both ways:laughing: I could of told him:thumbup:


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## RIVETER (Sep 26, 2009)

*who needs that*

I've been there.


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## jwjrw (Jan 14, 2010)

slickvic277 said:


> People are crazy.I had a friend of a friend's mom want a new service on her rental property installed,no big deal right.She wanted the 100 amp service taken out and wanted a 200 amp installed,so I go look at it give her a price of $1200(which is the going rate around these parts,maybe even a little on the cheap side.)She just stares at me with a look on her face of utter horror and then says to me and I quote "I want to get the job done but I just don't want to pay for it."Needles to say the service up grade never happened.:laughing::laughing::laughing:


Heck I want alot of things that I too dont wont to pay for!


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## Grimlock (Aug 4, 2009)

You don't need a permit with one of these babies:

(I'm going into mass production, anyone interested?)

They're going for $.75 a sq ft..

Or we can do it per device...

Your choice.


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## slickvic277 (Feb 5, 2009)

jwjrw said:


> Say you usally price your remodel cans at 125 per can as l



Yae that was like 4 or 5 years ago too,that lady is loaded$$$ but now I know why............doesn't like to part with it!


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## jwjrw (Jan 14, 2010)

slickvic277 said:


> Yae that was like 4 or 5 years ago too,that lady is loaded$$$ but now I know why............doesn't like to part with it!


 
I met and do lots of work for a guy that has lots of rentals and a strip mall. He spends money fixes them up tile kitchen etc. Small places mostly 2/3 bedroom houses.
His dad however owns many many many things and wont spend a dime. I had to hook the OUTSIDE LIGHT ON THE BUILDING (on side of building) to the rent a centers box when they moved in cause he shouldnt have to pay for that.
Got very upset when someone left 4 lights on one night and couldn't get in to shut them off. So tight he squeaks when he walks:laughing:


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## 10492 (Jan 4, 2010)

slickvic277 said:


> She wanted the 100 amp service taken out and wanted a 200 amp installed,so I go look at it give her a price of $1200(which is the going rate around these parts,maybe even a little on the cheap side.)


 
This is why I don't do residential service.

I can't compete against people like you.


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## Grimlock (Aug 4, 2009)

Dnkldorf said:


> This is why I don't do residential service.
> 
> I can't compete against people like you.


Service change outs in my area go for around $2000 but varies based on the project. Can go as high as $3000 if there is a panel relocation. For a simple meter base and riser its around $1200.


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## slickvic277 (Feb 5, 2009)

Dnkldorf said:


> This is why I don't do residential service.
> 
> I can't compete against people like you.



Don't worry dude I don't either.It was a "side job" that I didn't do and I gave that price because it was a buddies mom,besides that was back when I needed side work.
You shouldn't have a problem doing residential,aren't you the guy who says you can get help for $9per hour.At that price you should be able to get any job you want.


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## 10492 (Jan 4, 2010)

Grimlock said:


> Service change outs in my area go for around $2000 but varies based on the project. Can go as high as $3000 if there is a panel relocation. For a simple meter base and riser its around $1200.


 
From a licensed, insured EC, who pays taxes and overhead, or from a Union side jobber who pays no taxes,no anything?


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## slickvic277 (Feb 5, 2009)

Dnkldorf said:


> From a licensed, insured EC, who pays taxes and overhead, or from a Union side jobber who pays no taxes,no anything?



Cut me a brake,what does union have anything to do with it?So you mean to tell me before you were out on your own or when things were a little slow you didn't do any side work,get real.


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## 10492 (Jan 4, 2010)

slickvic277 said:


> Cut me a brake,what does union have anything to do with it?


Gee, I dunno.....maybe your taking food away from someone elses baby's mouth.


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## slickvic277 (Feb 5, 2009)

Dnkldorf said:


> Gee, I dunno.....maybe your taking food away from someone elses baby's mouth.
> 
> And you call us rats?



Who's taking food from anyone?Maybe if you paid your guy's more then $9 per hour they wouldn't have to go out on there free time and under cut you to get side work.Stop your bitching,you really think someone out doing a residential service as a side job is major competition to legit EC.
Actually now that I'm union I don't need to do side work anymore,outside of a few favors for family members and friends I find "side work" annoying and a waste of my free time.And just for the record I never called anyone on this forum a rat.Find one post,I dare you.

You seem like the typical EC that I have worked for,treat your guy's like ****,pay them ****,nobody deserves to make money besides you and when someone goes out and makes a buck other then you there cuttin you out.
I don't think there's one successful,serious,worth working for,EC union or not who is worried about competing with some kid doing side work.
If your really worrying about competing with guy's doing side work then I feel sorry for you,things must be really slow,hopefully things pick up for you soon.

Oh yae, you never answered my question,so you never did any side work,ever?


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## 10492 (Jan 4, 2010)

slickvic277 said:


> Oh yae, you never answered my question,so you never did any side work,ever?


Yup, I think a total of 2.

Then I became legit and pay my fair share.

Anytime you would like to learn the truth about employers and employees first hand, then just quit your brother hood, mortage your house, become legit and put your name on the door.


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

slickvic277 said:


> Who's taking food from anyone?Maybe if you paid your guy's more then $9 per hour they wouldn't have to go out on there free time and under cut you to get side work.Stop your bitching,you really think someone out doing a residential service as a side job is major competition to legit EC.
> Actually now that I'm union I don't need to do side work anymore,outside of a few favors for family members and friends I find "side work" annoying and a waste of my free time.And just for the record I never called anyone on this forum a rat.Find one post,I dare you.
> 
> You seem like the typical EC that I have worked for,treat your guy's like ****,pay them ****,nobody deserves to make money besides you and when someone goes out and makes a buck other then you there cuttin you out.
> ...


Ah yes. Another brain has been washed.


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## slickvic277 (Feb 5, 2009)

Dnkldorf said:


> Yup, I think a total of 2.
> 
> Then I became legit and pay my fair share.
> 
> Anytime you would like to learn the truth about employers and employees first hand, then just quit your brother hood, mortage your house, become legit and put your name on the door.



I know plenty about employee,employer relationships my half a dozen or so nlrb hearing pretty much confirm that,my first hand experience with "employers like you have been varied,bounced checks,chasing the boss around on friday to get paid,told to take cash for the week end and like it,or when threatening letters addressed to my wife were sent to my house when I organized,and I have thought about doing it on my own,but if I do I'll be union and pay the rate.


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## slickvic277 (Feb 5, 2009)

480sparky said:


> Ah yes. Another brain has been washed.



Who's brainwashed?I speak from my own experience.And the part about him paying $9 per hour wasn't made up,he said it on another post..


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## LGLS (Nov 10, 2007)

slickvic277 said:


> Who's taking food from anyone?Maybe if you paid your guy's more then $9 per hour they wouldn't have to go out on there free time and under cut you to get side work.Stop your bitching,you really think someone out doing a residential service as a side job is major competition to legit EC.
> Actually now that I'm union I don't need to do side work anymore,outside of a few favors for family members and friends I find "side work" annoying and a waste of my free time.And just for the record I never called anyone on this forum a rat.Find one post,I dare you.
> 
> You seem like the typical EC that I have worked for,treat your guy's like ****,pay them ****,nobody deserves to make money besides you and when someone goes out and makes a buck other then you there cuttin you out.
> ...


Vic, you're my new best friend!


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## 10492 (Jan 4, 2010)

slickvic277 said:


> I know plenty about employee,employer relationships my half a dozen or so nlrb hearing pretty much confirm that,my first hand experience with "employers like you have been varied,bounced checks,chasing the boss around on friday to get paid,told to take cash for the week end and like it,or when threatening letters addressed to my wife were sent to my house when I organized,and I have thought about doing it on my own,but if I do I'll be union and pay the rate.


You sound like a real keeper.

Again, put your name on the door and learn the truth if it's so easy.


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## slickvic277 (Feb 5, 2009)

Dnkldorf said:


> You sound like a real keeper.
> 
> Again, put your name on the door and learn the truth if it's so easy.



I must be a keeper,I never been laid off(I'm only out now because I had shoulder surgery)and the last EC I worked for found me a job when he was slow,just so he could keep me when he got busy again.But whatever your in business for yourself now and you know everything so I'll stop arguing with you and I'll continue to be "brainwashed"............


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## BIGRED (Jan 22, 2007)

Dnkldorf said:


> This is why I don't do residential service.
> 
> I can't compete against people like you.


Yo Vic, give me your #, when I get a 200 amp service, I will call you and make $800 to $1,200 for doing nothing. For a 200 amp service in Philly/Suburbs I try to get about 2 to 2500. One company downtown is charging about 3 to 3500, another big company, which all of you guys from the Philly area know, is charging 6 to 7 grand.

I should have read all of the posts first.


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## slickvic277 (Feb 5, 2009)

BIGRED said:


> Yo Vic, give me your #, when I get a 200 amp service, I will call you and make $800 to $1,200 for doing nothing. For a 200 amp service in Philly/Suburbs I try to get about 2 to 2500. One company downtown is charging about 3 to 3500, another big company, which all of you guys from the Philly area know, is charging 6 to 7 grand.
> 
> I should have read all of the posts first.


Dude,READ THE ENTIRE POST.I don't roll around Philly working for free,you want me to work for you it's gonna cost you $75 an hour and thats just to brake even and cover my package.Then I'll do all the service work you want,douchebag.


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## Magnettica (Jan 23, 2007)

slickvic277 said:


> Dude,READ THE ENTIRE POST.I don't roll around Philly working for free,you want me to work for you it's gonna cost you $75 an hour and thats just to brake even and cover my package.Then I'll do all the service work you want,douchebag.


Nah, small business owners are better off with folks like you riding the pine. Eventually you'll be one of us though. It just takes awhile to figure out that the union is just wasting your time and that if you don't have a cousin Vinny who owns a company you'll always be on the list waiting to go back to work.


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## user4818 (Jan 15, 2009)

LawnGuyLandSparky said:


> Vic, you're my new best friend!


Birds of a feather flock together.


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## slickvic277 (Feb 5, 2009)

Magnettica said:


> Nah, small business owners are better off with folks like you riding the pine. Eventually you'll be one of us though. It just takes awhile to figure out that the union is just wasting your time and that if you don't have a cousin Vinny who owns a company you'll always be on the list waiting to go back to work.



Never been on that list,just more anti-union propaganda from the nay-sayers"your always out of work,you gotta know somebody to stay busy,bla,bla,bla.."Nope,not for me,I'm fine just were I'm at.I'll continue to work union make high wages,have health insurance for me and my family and oh,I get to retire and collect a pension and an annuity.I worked non-union,open shop,merit,whatever you want to call it and from MY experience those shops spread just as much propaganda that you all claim the union does.So you guys have your experiences with the union and I have had mine with,greedy,sneaky,dis-honest contractors.

I have chased contractors down for my money,been denied overtime,had checks bounced,been threatened,all because I refused to be bullied into excepting less then what I'm worth.I've seen contractors forget about guy's when there busted up and hurt,to old or crippled to work any more,I'll pass thank you.

I'll tell you what my union does for me.I had shoulder surgery,My workers comp claim was denied(because I tried to do right by the contractor),so my local got me a lawyer,carried me and my families health care until I'm back to work and provided me with a disability check.

I wonder how many open shop EC's would helped me out when I needed it......

But yae,I'm wasting my time and I'm brainwashed.


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## 10492 (Jan 4, 2010)

slickvic277 said:


> .So you guys have your experiences with the union and I have had mine with,greedy,sneaky,dis-honest contractors.


 
Vic, some of us have been on both sides of the fence.

I got tired of working, doing the best job I could, educating myself so I can do more,........just to be teamed up with some terd like you who knows nothing, but can always find a better way to NOT do a job, rather than get it done.

And I could never get paid anymore than terds like you, thanks to the Union regs and pay grades.


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## slickvic277 (Feb 5, 2009)

Dnkldorf said:


> Vic, some of us have been on both sides of the fence.
> 
> I got tired of working, doing the best job I could, educating myself so I can do more,........just to be teamed up with some terd like you who knows nothing, but can always find a better way to NOT do a job, rather than get it done.
> 
> And I could never get paid anymore than terds like you, thanks to the Union regs and pay grades.



Your not the only one who has been on both sides of the fence,and as far as being a "terd" no one I have ever worked for union or not as ever questioned my work ethic,I'm on time every day ready to put in 8 for 8 and I rather keep myself busy then try to escape the work but the difference between me and you is I don't need to pat myself on the back for it.


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## slickvic277 (Feb 5, 2009)

Dnkldorf said:


> Vic, some of us have been on both sides of the fence.
> 
> I got tired of working, doing the best job I could, educating myself so I can do more,........just to be teamed up with some terd like you who knows nothing, but can always find a better way to NOT do a job, rather than get it done.
> 
> And I could never get paid anymore than terds like you, thanks to the Union regs and pay grades.



So,you were once union?The pay scale and the benefits were good for you but not your own employees huh?It's guy's like you that have left a very sour taste in my mouth when it comes to contractor's but I must apologize to all the good EC's who treat there men right.I know you's exist but when I was a bit younger and a little more impressionable,I was exposed to the bad ones.Took me along time to realize your all not like Dnkldrf,but for every good EC there's ten Dnkldrf's.


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## 10492 (Jan 4, 2010)

slickvic277 said:


> So,you were once union?The pay scale and the benefits were good for you but not your own employees huh?It's guy's like you that have left a very sour taste in my mouth when it comes to contractor's but I must apologize to all the good EC's who treat there men right.I know you's exist but when I was a bit younger and a little more impressionable,I was exposed to the bad ones.Took me along time to realize your all not like Dnkldrf,but for every good EC there's ten Dnkldrf's.


You need to pay attention, and quit flapping your gums.

Ex-steelworker
Ex-teamster


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## jwjrw (Jan 14, 2010)

Please close my thread. If I wanted to hear this Union crap I would move up north to some god forsaken cold as heck place. 
Pm each other I dont want to hear this s***!:thumbsup:


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

jwjrw said:


> ....... I would move up north to some god forsaken cold as heck place. .............


 
Who says it's cold up here?


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## jwjrw (Jan 14, 2010)

480sparky said:


> Who says it's cold up here?


 
Not me I dont see 10feet of snow in the background:whistling2:!


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## LGLS (Nov 10, 2007)

jwjrw said:


> Not me I dont see 10feet of snow in the background:whistling2:!


When you see snow that means it's warm.


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

jwjrw said:


> Not me I dont see 10feet of snow in the background:whistling2:!


 
It can get too cold to snow.


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## jwjrw (Jan 14, 2010)

480sparky said:


> It can get too cold to snow.


Believe it OR NOT I am aware of snow, tempertaure and all that stuff you up north types go thru.....:jester::laughing:


Always trying to show how much LEARNING you got!!!!!!:laughing:


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

jwjrw said:


> Believe it OR NOT I am aware of snow, tempertaure and all that stuff you up north types go thru..... .............


 
I'm glad you're _*aware* _of it.


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## jwjrw (Jan 14, 2010)

480sparky said:


> I'm glad you're _*aware* _of it.


Now Im jealous also....... You have one of them plow things....
The mayor says we are world class and we dont have a plow(just fancy trains) so when we get an inch of snow or ice the world ends as we know it!:laughing::laughing:


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## BuzzKill (Oct 27, 2008)

Peter D said:


> Birds of a feather flock together.





480sparky said:


> Ah yes. Another brain has been washed.


yep:no:


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## BIGRED (Jan 22, 2007)

slickvic277 said:


> Dude,READ THE ENTIRE POST.I don't roll around Philly working for free,you want me to work for you it's gonna cost you $75 an hour and thats just to brake even and cover my package.Then I'll do all the service work you want,douchebag.


Your right, I only read a couple of posts, but I edited my post saying that I should have read all posts. No need to call me a douchebag though.


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## slickvic277 (Feb 5, 2009)

BIGRED said:


> Your right, I only read a couple of posts, but I edited my post saying that I should have read all posts. No need to call me a douchebag though.



Your right,I noticed you edited that after I made that post.I apologize.


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## RIVETER (Sep 26, 2009)

*Permit*



slickvic277 said:


> I must be a keeper,I never been laid off(I'm only out now because I had shoulder surgery)and the last EC I worked for found me a job when he was slow,just so he could keep me when he got busy again.But whatever your in business for yourself now and you know everything so I'll stop arguing with you and I'll continue to be "brainwashed"............


I used to be a KEEPER...a couple of times. Once, as an apprentice, I was wiring basements of friends of his, and picking beans off the vines on his garage when work was slow. Another time I was actually told by a female apprentice that We BOTH, were keepers. I asked how she knew and she said that we really worked well together and the BOSS was noticing. Later that day when I told her she was cutting half inch conduit wrong...somehow my check came early. I spent the rest of the day driving and counting telephone poles. Ever happen to you?


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## Loose Neutral (Jun 3, 2009)

Jealousy sucks. Why is it that every non union contractor thinks they are the only ones that can do resi work. It's all fair game out there.


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## Shado (Jan 1, 2009)

Loose Neutral said:


> Jealousy sucks. Why is it that every non union contractor thinks they are the only ones that can do resi work. It's all fair game out there.


I guess the same as union thinks they are the only ones that can do commercial....

Yep....it is all fair game out there....:thumbsup:


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## GlennB (Feb 6, 2010)

Chinese guy calls me out of the blue needing a licensed electrician to wire up his hood exhaust, ansul system, walk-in coolers etc. I gave him my price and this is what he said, "You price that too tall." I came down about seven hundred dollars and told him if I come down he has to give me free lunch for awhile but no specific timeline. He said, "That no problem you bring your family." The job is finished, they're up and running and I took my family on opening night, we order our food and he said, "For you first time 50% off." So now I'm going back to charge him for the extras I was nice enough to let slide. On the flip side he did pay one third up front and closed out on the day I finished, all in cash which was different.


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## RIVETER (Sep 26, 2009)

*Permit*



GlennB said:


> Chinese guy calls me out of the blue needing a licensed electrician to wire up his hood exhaust, ansul system, walk-in coolers etc. I gave him my price and this is what he said, "You price that too tall." I came down about seven hundred dollars and told him if I come down he has to give me free lunch for awhile but no specific timeline. He said, "That no problem you bring your family." The job is finished, they're up and running and I took my family on opening night, we order our food and he said, "For you first time 50% off." So now I'm going back to charge him for the extras I was nice enough to let slide. On the flip side he did pay one third up front and closed out on the day I finished, all in cash which was different.


If you were able to come down $700.00 and still make profit...then you probably didn't have a CHINA MAN'S chance of getting the job in the first place.


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## GlennB (Feb 6, 2010)

I never said how much the total job cost was; I made out just fine, I came out at 48% net. I anticipated his China Man tactics and cushioned it the first time.


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

GlennB said:


> I never said how much the total job cost was; I made out just fine, I came out at 48% net. I anticipated his China Man tactics and cushioned it the first time.


 
So all you accomplished is saying ,"I was ripping you off to start with".


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## GlennB (Feb 6, 2010)

Uh no, I was giving a price for my service and my price goes up when I know the customer is going to be high maintenance. You never hiked your price because you didn't want the job?


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

GlennB said:


> Uh no, I was giving a price for my service and my price goes up when I know the customer is going to be high maintenance. You never hiked your price because you didn't want the job?


 
Uh, yes. The instant you lowered your price, that told the customer you were making too much money on the job.

If's it going to be a royal pain, yes, I calculate in a PITA factor. But I never hike up my price because I don't want a particular job..... I just tell them I'm not interested.


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## GlennB (Feb 6, 2010)

Like I said before you don't know the total cost of the job or the complete work scope. I gave him top price and we negotiated down that's how sales work. Percentage wise it was a small amount to come down and it did not tell the customer I was making too much.
He just wanted to feel like he was getting a deal no matter what my first bid was.


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

GlennB said:


> Like I said before you don't know the total cost of the job or the complete work scope.


Makes absolutely no difference. I could care less if it was a $100 job or a $10mil project.



GlennB said:


> I gave him top price and we negotiated down that's how sales work.


No. Sales should be based on your experience, trustworthyness, capabilities, etc. NEVER based on price. If you're trying to sell your jobs on price alone, you must work for Wal-Mart Electric.



GlennB said:


> Percentage wise it was a small amount to come down and it did not tell the customer I was making too much.


Well, DUH!







That's a no-brainer!



GlennB said:


> He just wanted to feel like he was getting a deal no matter what my first bid was.


So now you've conditioned yet _another_ customer that thinks we can _all_ come down on our prices if they start hammering away at us.

Thank you very much.


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## EDC (Feb 8, 2010)

Dnkldorf said:


> This is why I don't do residential service.
> 
> I can't compete against people like you.


I'm sorry if I am wrong, but weren't you the guy who 4-5 years ago was blasting electrician on internet forums for charging -too much-?


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## EDC (Feb 8, 2010)

480sparky said:


> But I never hike up my price because I don't want a particular job..... I just tell them I'm not interested.


I'm surprised to hear you say that.

You're supposed to hike up your price to the point in which you would be happy to do that job. Every once in a while you will get it, and when it happens it's like winning the lottery.


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

EDC said:


> I'm surprised to hear you say that.
> 
> You're supposed to hike up your price to the point in which you would be happy to do that job. Every once in a while you will get it, and when it happens it's like winning the lottery.


Yes, there are some jobs I figure in a PTIA factor. But there are some jobs I am just plain flat-out not interested in taking on. 

It's like on TV or in the movies when an angel appears on one sholder, and a devil on the other. They take turns debating the issue for your benefit.

Only in some cases, there ain't no angel.


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## EDC (Feb 8, 2010)

Magnettica said:


> Nah, small business owners are better off with folks like you riding the pine. Eventually you'll be one of us though. It just takes awhile to figure out that the union is just wasting your time and that if you don't have a cousin Vinny who owns a company you'll always be on the list waiting to go back to work.


Honestly, what you said is just as bad as all the union propaganda.

Not everyone will go into business for themselves. For every person that does, there are dozens of people who stick to working with their hands as employees- both union and non union.

And for you to say that union workers are all destined to always be out of work while non union workers aren't is just wrong. It's biased propaganda.


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## GlennB (Feb 6, 2010)

You probably payed retail on the last vehicle you purchased, I mean you should right a lot of skill went into the production of it.


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

GlennB said:


> You probably payed retail on the last vehicle you purchased,..........


I sure did. I bought it at a dealer.


I just didn't pay _sticker_.




GlennB said:


> .....I mean you should right a lot of skill went into the production of it.


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## GlennB (Feb 6, 2010)

So you talked them down on the price. My point exactly.


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## EDC (Feb 8, 2010)

GlennB said:


> So you talked them down on the price. My point exactly.


Some things in life are like that. Car sales, house sales, flea markets.

Other things aren't like that, and it's completely inappropriate to even ask. Would you walk into a restaurant and talk them down on the price of your food?


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

GlennB said:


> So you talked them down on the price. My point exactly.


Because the truck I bought is the exact same truck the other dealers sell. There's no difference between them. OK, that's not true. The little sticker on the tailgate would be different. But other than that, it would be the exact same truck save for the VIN.

Are you saying you're the same as every hack and wanna-be electrician out there?


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

EDC said:


> .......... Would you walk into a restaurant and talk them down on the price of your food?


 
Yeah...... Try that, see what happens.


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## RKRider (Feb 7, 2010)

480sparky said:


> you must work for Wal-Mart Electric.



Hey! If I'm doing a remodel in a Wal-mart store right now, does that mean I work for Wal-mart electric?


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

RKRider said:


> Hey! If I'm doing a remodel in a Wal-mart store right now, does that mean I work for Wal-mart electric?


 
No.. you're an employee of an EC who has been hired as a subcontractor by a GC employed by Wal-Mart.

(And if it's a Wal-Mart to a Super Wal-Mart conversion........ you have my deepest sympathies.)



















Unless you volunteer to work for less per hour.......... then yes, you'd be working for Wal-Mart Electric. :laughing:


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## EDC (Feb 8, 2010)

To throw a wrench into your conversation, Walmarts around here are done union :laughing:


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