# Apprentice here with journeyman problems! Help!



## rscimone (Jan 10, 2015)

Hey guys,

I am in the IBEW and I just started a few months ago. I am currently working with a journeyman in houses, all residential work. The journeyman is constantly telling me to take out switches and outlets. While I try my best, he keeps on telling me he is shutting off the circuits and I keep getting hit with 120V. It went from me thinking he made a mistake, to now I think he's doing it on purpose. I use my testers now, but somehow he's flipping them BACK ON after I test it. This has happened about 6 times now and I'm starting to get very nervous. I was told that you can't argue with your journeyman when you are an apprentice, but I'm at the point of practically crying after work. This is not the only thing he does. He ruins my breakfast and lunch by throwing garbage on it, or if I bring in my own he puts wire lube all inside my bag. I am trying to man up, but how long do I deal with this? This is making me feel like I should not be in this field. I love electrical work, but I hate coming to work. It's very hard right now. I thought the union was different. I thought it was a brotherhood. I feel like I don't belong. PLEASE ADVISE!!! Thank you!

-Discouraged IBEW Union Apprentice


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## Stumped (Jan 21, 2015)

Practical jokes are one thing, and hazing is a part of apprenticeship.

But what you describe is harassment and it's time for you to be a man and put a stop to it. Once he crosses the line, there is no more apprentice/journeyman relationship to deal with, it's just two men with a problem.

You can go complain to the contractor or the hall, but then you'll make a name for yourself as a sissy and a rat. 

It's time to stand up for yourself and settle this beef. Before work starts tomorrow go up to him and have a man to man talk about how you don't find his actions acceptable and how you won't allow him to do it anymore.


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## 3D Electric (Mar 24, 2013)

Kick his ass sea bass! Or have a very blunt conversation with him. Good luck


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## JW Splicer (Mar 15, 2014)

First off, you need a lock! He needs an ass kicking! Plain and simple, you know what a joke is, and you know when a man is looking for a fight!


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## rscimone (Jan 10, 2015)

I have said something to him, time and time again. Someone else that works here mentioned to me that he does this to apprentices then when the apprentice does something about it he rats them out and they get fired. I am trying to solve this by not loosing my job, but I guess I have no choice.


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## Stumped (Jan 21, 2015)

rscimone said:


> I have said something to him, time and time again.


You didn't properly explain your grievance and the results of what would happen if he continues.



> Someone else that works here mentioned to me that he does this to apprentices then when the apprentice does something about it he rats them out and they get fired. I am trying to solve this by not loosing my job, but I guess I have no choice.


 Just about every phone out there today has a camera in it. You should have pictures of every time he threw garbage on your lunch or filled your bag with lube. You should also have video of what he says after you tell him that he turned the circuit on while you were working on it after he said it was dead and you tested it. That would make your case if he decided to rat you out for something to get you fired.


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## JW Splicer (Mar 15, 2014)

I'd talk to the hall, jatc, and contractor. Two things you never mess with are a guy's food, and stuff that can get you hurt. If someone flipped a breaker on me, it's attempted murder in my eyes.


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## Stumped (Jan 21, 2015)

JW Splicer said:


> I'd talk to the hall, jatc, and contractor. Two things you never mess with are a guy's food, and stuff that can get you hurt. If someone flipped a breaker on me, it's attempted murder in my eyes.


The problem is that the JW is going to turn it all around on the OP.

The OP says the JW turned the power on, but the JW will say he told the OP that he was going to energize the circuit but the OP touched it anyway because he never listens.

The OP says the JW filled his bag with lube multiple times, the JW says a small drop fell into the bag once during a wire pull because the OP left his bag right in the way.

You know how it goes.


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## daveEM (Nov 18, 2012)

Send your post to the union and contractor. Nothing else they will pop it on his record. then as others say kick his ass.

*But do report it*. He could kill you or the next person. Electricity is not to be fooled with.


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## Michigan Master (Feb 25, 2013)

It’s not like that everywhere; there _is_ some hazing to be expected, but it’s not malicious – sound like you got stuck with an asshole.

Intentionally turning a circuit on while someone is working on it is plain *WRONG*! That said, you are also responsible to take steps to ensure the circuit you are working on cannot be accidentally re-energized; this is accomplished though lockout/tagout (LOTO). True, someone could still intentionally remove your lock; where I work that’s grounds for instant termination. Find out how your company’s LOTO procedure works, and make sure you’re following it. Let your journeyman know that if he violates LOTO procedure by removing your lock/tag and intentionally putting you in danger that you will report it. It is actually possible for a person to die from contact with 120V.

I’d also probably start keeping my lunch locked in my truck and run out to retrieve it at break (don’t know where you’re from, but here it’s cold enough outside to be solution for another several months). Try not to allow him to get you riled up, once he sees that you are not responding to his BS it will no longer be fun for him and he'll likely lay off.


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## The_kid (Nov 4, 2014)

**** that. I can't work in that kind of condition. I hate to be a "tough guy" and talk chit over the Internet, but I would drop that guy in a heartbeat. Nobody messes with my life like that. 

I had a JW tell me to device an entire 1st floor of a house all live. About 30 receptacles. After I got hit twice and blew up my needle nose I attempted to turn the power off. he wouldn't let me, for no reason at all. So I took his spare linesmens out of the van and cut one of the wires and shorted the circuit so I could continue without the circuit being live. 

I give you props for being a man and putting up with this for the greater good of your career thus far. 

But don't let him mess with your life like that. That's a whole different story. These guys are giving you some good advice. Don't sit back and let it happen.


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## Michigan Master (Feb 25, 2013)

Forgot to add this image. This is a simple breaker lock which should be company issued, but can be purchased on it's own pretty cheaply. Most folks will have a small lockout kit so they are prepared to lockout a variety of energy isolation devices.


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## Stumped (Jan 21, 2015)

Michigan Master, the OP's journeyman would snap that crap off the breaker and throw it in the trash. The guy is clearly not just making a mistake, he is purposely harassing the OP.


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## Black Dog (Oct 16, 2011)

rscimone said:


> Hey guys,
> 
> I am in the IBEW and I just started a few months ago. I am currently working with a journeyman in houses, all residential work. The journeyman is constantly telling me to take out switches and outlets. While I try my best, he keeps on telling me he is shutting off the circuits and I keep getting hit with 120V. It went from me thinking he made a mistake, to now I think he's doing it on purpose. I use my testers now, but somehow he's flipping them BACK ON after I test it. This has happened about 6 times now and I'm starting to get very nervous. I was told that you can't argue with your journeyman when you are an apprentice, but I'm at the point of practically crying after work. This is not the only thing he does. He ruins my breakfast and lunch by throwing garbage on it, or if I bring in my own he puts wire lube all inside my bag. I am trying to man up, but how long do I deal with this? This is making me feel like I should not be in this field. I love electrical work, but I hate coming to work. It's very hard right now. I thought the union was different. I thought it was a brotherhood. I feel like I don't belong. PLEASE ADVISE!!! Thank you!
> 
> -Discouraged IBEW Union Apprentice


This guy is a *****, tell him you want this chit to stop right now! If not then it's time inflict some pain, punch him in the face and deck him, he will leave you alone after.

When asked you tell them he took the first swing and you had to defend yourself.


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## Stumped (Jan 21, 2015)

Black Dog said:


> This guy is a *****, tell him you want this chit to stop right now! If not then it's time inflict some pain, punch him in the face and deck him, he will leave you alone after.
> 
> When asked you tell them he took the first swing and you had to defend yourself.


This is good advice, but only if you do it with a thick Boston accent.


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## Michigan Master (Feb 25, 2013)

Stumped said:


> Michigan Master, the OP's journeyman would snap that crap off the breaker and throw it in the trash. The guy is clearly not just making a mistake, he is purposely harassing the OP.


I realize it is being done intentionally, but this elevates the offense, and the OP should be following LOTO anyway. 

As I said, it could still be removed, heck even if the lockout device wasn't plastic I could still easily cut the padlock with bolt cutters. However, there is a *BIG* difference between re-energizing a circuit that is simply turned off, and removing somebody else's lock/tag without properly following procedures. If there isn't a difference, the OP might want consider working somewhere safety is considered important before it's too late.


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## Stumped (Jan 21, 2015)

Michigan Master said:


> I realize it is being done intentionally, but this elevates the offense, and the OP should be following LOTO anyway.
> 
> As I said, it could still be removed, heck even if the lockout device wasn't plastic I could still easily cut the padlock with bolt cutters. However, there is a *BIG* difference between re-energizing a circuit that is simply turned off, and removing somebody else's lock/tag without properly following procedures. If there isn't a difference, the OP might want consider working somewhere safety is considered important before it's too late.


You're still not following...

The guy will throw the LOTO away and say the OP never put it on the breaker. He'll say that he warned the OP that the circuit was live. He'll say that the OP turned the circuit on himself. Etc.

Using a LOTO and keeping his lunch in his truck is a bandaid, a passive solution that will only make things worse.


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## bkmichael65 (Mar 25, 2013)

Lineman pliers to his nipples, twist, pull, repeat as necessary


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## Stumped (Jan 21, 2015)

_This is blood for blood and by the gallons. These are the old days man, the bad days, the all-or-nothing days. They're back! There's no choices left. And I'm ready for war._


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## Michigan Master (Feb 25, 2013)

Stumped said:


> You're still not following...
> 
> The guy will throw the LOTO away and say the OP never put it on the breaker. He'll say that he warned the OP that the circuit was live. He'll say that the OP turned the circuit on himself. Etc.
> 
> Using a LOTO and keeping his lunch in his truck is a bandaid, a passive solution that will only make things worse.


You seem to know the OP's journeyman pretty well... You're right, he should just punch his journeyman out, get terminated, and face assault charges; that will fix everything.


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## pete87 (Oct 22, 2012)

rscimone said:


> Hey guys,
> 
> I am in the IBEW and I just started a few months ago. I am currently working with a journeyman in house... crying after work.
> 
> -Discouraged IBEW Union Apprentice




Don't Cry Apprentice One . Invite your "J" Man to a NY Tap Dance .

There are times to use the " Ma Bell Approach " , Reach Out and Touch Some One .




Pete


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## Stumped (Jan 21, 2015)

Michigan Master said:


> You seem to know the OP's journeyman pretty well...


 I do, the OP explained the situation rather well and I have been dealing with this type of union journeyman with a chip on his shoulder for 17 years. 



> You're right, he should just punch his journeyman out, get terminated, and face assault charges; that will fix everything.


You see, I never said that, not once. Please do not misquote me.

I said he should be a man and have a man to man talk with his JW. I don't expect you, as a woman, to understand how men think. While using bandaids and allowing someone to continue to harass and abuse you might be what women do, it's not going to get him very far as a man. The name he makes for himself today will be with him the rest of his career.


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## CopperSlave (Feb 9, 2012)

The guy is being a bully. There is only one way to deal with a bully...stand up to them. I would pull him aside first thing in the morning and let him know that if my lunch gets touched, or I "accidently" get bit one more time, someone is going to bleed.
I would take an ass-whipping and lose my job before I'd let some douche like him continue to do what he is doing. And if it comes down to violence, be the firstest with the mostest.


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## eejack (Jul 14, 2012)

Tell your training director or if you have one your shop steward and the foreman.

You never have to put up with crap like that.

( personally I would beat the crap out of him and claim self defense. he has a history of bullying so open and shut case. )

edit:...so beating the crap out of the guy is probably bad advice but instead...

Go the contractor and ask for a layoff. When they ask you why, tell them you obviously pissed some JW off because he is trying to kill you, poisoning your food and turning circuits on, so it is probably safest for everyone involved if you went to another contractor.

Be pleasant about it, show concern for the JW, express an interest in finding a peaceful solution. 

Obviously everyone already knows he is a scumbag so nothing you do except for getting away from him will work. Don't fear the layoff - we all get laid off anyway.


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## The_Modifier (Oct 24, 2009)

bkmichael65 said:


> Lineman pliers to his *teeth*, repeat as necessary


Fify, :thumbup:


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## Michigan Master (Feb 25, 2013)

Stumped said:


> I have been dealing with this type of union journeyman with a chip on his shoulder for 17 years.


You know, if you've been having this problem everywhere you go, the problem might not be them… :whistling2:


Stumped said:


> You see, I never said that, not once. Please do not misquote me.


Sorry Stumpy, I forgot the part where you said he should do it in thick Boston accent. :laughing:


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## Stumped (Jan 21, 2015)

Michigan Master said:


> You know, if you've been having this problem everywhere you go, the problem might not be them… :whistling2:


 I'm not having problems.



> Sorry Stumpy, I forgot the part where you said he should do it in thick Boston accent. :laughing:


I was messing with Harry because he likes to tell military time with his Boston accent.

Are you done?


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## Jolt cola (Jul 30, 2010)

What that guy is doing is BULL****. But you should NOT kick his ass, because that would just get you kicked out of the program, or have to go in front of the committee. 

You should write down specific details of incidents you described including the dates as back up evidence and approach your apprenticeship director about this asshole. 

I am pretty sure you won't be the only one that's experienced this type of behavior from this dumbass... 

Hang in there and get that JW ticket!


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## five.five-six (Apr 9, 2013)

Stumped said:


> But what you describe is harassment and it's time for you to be a man and put a stop to it. Once he crosses the line, there is no more apprentice/journeyman relationship to deal with, it's just two men with a problem.
> 
> .


It always sounds like harassment when the apprentice tells it. Grow a pair ... Put some nolox under his cars door handle. LOL


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## papaotis (Jun 8, 2013)

as much as i like most of the advice here, i agree that it should be handled in the most delicate (legallywise) manner, but if i new someone was turning the power on to f$%^ with me, they would most certainly be hurting worse!


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## Nuzzie (Jan 11, 2012)

edit: a bit much


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## five.five-six (Apr 9, 2013)

Ramset his bags to the floor


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## rscimone (Jan 10, 2015)

I went in today and told him the deal. He blew me off and said deal with it. Flat out told me he doesn't like working with anyone, especially apprentices. He then took my toolbag an hour later and dumped all my tools on the floor. 

I took a piss in his coffee. 

Shop just called me and the steward just called me. He made all this stuff up about me. WHAT IS WRONG WITH PEOPLE!!


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## Black Dog (Oct 16, 2011)

rscimone said:


> I went in today and told him the deal. He blew me off and said deal with it. Flat out told me he doesn't like working with anyone, especially apprentices. He then took my toolbag an hour later and dumped all my tools on the floor.
> 
> I took a piss in his coffee.
> 
> Shop just called me and the steward just called me. He made all this stuff up about me. WHAT IS WRONG WITH PEOPLE!!


Just tell the steward your story, the truth nothing more, also, go to staples and buy a* 'Day at a time book'* and write down everything that goes on daily, so when you are questioned, it's all there in your book.

This ***** should get fired today on the spot after you tell the shop steward that this ***** has attempted murder on you several times, if for some reason you get fired report this guy to the Cops--Remember turning on the power with the intent of electrocuting someone is attempted murder.

A journeyman electrician should know that 120 volts will kill someone and if not he has no business being in the electrical trade at all.

If there is an electricians board in your state where this guy is licensed then also file a complaint against him, they will investigate and if it is found that he has done this to others or even they can prove that he has been doing this stuff to you, they will revoke his license and banish him from working in the electrical trade.

There is no reason that this guy should ever pick up the tools again in this trade, he belongs in jail for attempted murder.

Also; Welcome to the forum:thumbsup:


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## nternes (Sep 25, 2012)

Dude thats crazy! Ive come across some d*#khead jws but nothing in that realm of disrespect. Dealing with bs is part of the game but that guy took it way to far. That stuff should have been reported from jump street so when u finally snap and roll him up there would have been some paper trail. Ive personally seen an apprentice beat up a journeyman on a job in self defense. Guess what happend? Jw 1 aw 0. The apprentice got kicked out. We are just in a tough spot when it comes to stuff like that. They can mess up and go to another rodeo but we as apprentices can get booted from the program all together. Dont know what else to say. Shocking me on purpose once...funny haha do it again I would have knocked him on his buttocks. Daaam


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## Rollie73 (Sep 19, 2010)

When it comes to BS like this I'm the absolute worst person in the world to give advice. My fuse is incredibly short and my temper can be scary.....even to me. 
When I was an apprentice, I have lost it with a JW for similar harassing behavior but I waited until after work and when we all went for a beer after work on payday, he left the pub on a stretcher.

DISCLAIMER: Never take advice from me when the advice is pertaining on how to deal with an asshole. You will probably end up being charged with assault. I know I was.


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## dreamcrusher28 (Oct 19, 2010)

Wow. I can take a lot but not that. There would be cop cars at that job site 5 minutes after my food was messed with. Though it certainly isn't the proper way to handle it. Go to the hall instead of work tomorrow and speak to everyone there. It'll make a strong point that you couldn't even wait til after work to deal with this animal.


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## Black Dog (Oct 16, 2011)

rscimone said:


> I went in today and told him the deal. He blew me off and said deal with it. Flat out told me he doesn't like working with anyone, especially apprentices. He then took my toolbag an hour later and dumped all my tools on the floor.
> 
> I took a piss in his coffee.
> 
> Shop just called me and the steward just called me. He made all this stuff up about me. WHAT IS WRONG WITH PEOPLE!!


How did you make out today?


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## Quaigmire (Jan 19, 2015)

If you got a digital voice recorder, or smartphone, how about recording everything he does secretly? Surely video evidence would trump any story.


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## pete87 (Oct 22, 2012)

This Post Requires a POLL .





Pete


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## zman98 (Apr 7, 2014)

This is totally out of line. Part of a jw's work is teach an apprentice the trade,after you will be contributing to my pension and those after you will be the same for you.
I would go the JATC and explain what is going on.We have a no tolerance rule in my local and this sounds like harrashment.If you where a female on the job and a guy made one rude or sexual comment ,that is ground to bring him up on charges in front of the E-Board.Make sure you have your story straight,can back it up and take your blue suit to the cleaners.


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## Phatstax (Feb 16, 2014)

I would typically advise someone to apply some Klien shampoo to fix this situation. However, it sounds like you are in a bad situation and I would not want you to do anything that might jeopardize your career. 
Job sites are very dangerous places to be, there are hazards all around you. You must be very careful while working overhead to not accidentally drop hammers on peoples heads below you when they are not paying attention. Especially Estwing framing hammers, they are very heavy.


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## Phatstax (Feb 16, 2014)

I was on a job site once with a lot of horseplay. One guy was swinging a bender handle like he was babe Ruth and accidentally put it across another guys hamstrings. Looked quite painful.


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## MHElectric (Oct 14, 2011)

rscimone said:


> I took a piss in his coffee.


:laughing:


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## MHElectric (Oct 14, 2011)

We dealt with this kind of stuff all the time when I was in the army. 

I learned to *always* get in the first punch. That put a quick stop to most of it.


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## kg7879 (Feb 3, 2014)

There was an apprentice in my local who had a journeyman who would kind of tap him and others in the nuts. The apprentice told the JW to stop and also complained to his foreman.

Nothing was done about it, so the next time the JW tapped him in the nuts he called the cops and the cops arrested the JW for assault. The JW and the foreman loss their jobs.

You only have a few options. Deal with it, quit, kick his ass and risk getting arrested your self or you could call the cops because he is vandalizing your property.


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## chris856 (Jun 12, 2009)

Communicate with your training director about the issue and start keeping a daily journal.


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## Ink&Brass (Nov 6, 2013)

MHElectric said:


> We dealt with this kind of stuff all the time when I was in the army.
> 
> I learned to *always* get in the first punch. That put a quick stop to most of it.


I know that too well. You learn to have thicker skin, and if that fails, thicker knuckles. Give him a solid one to the head, deliver your lecture while he's gathering his senses, and see if he's smart enough to shut up and go back to work. It's the only language some of these asshats understand. 

I'm a patient person and revere authority, but even I can can pushed over the edge. After quick one scrap with a superior we actually got along great.
:laughing:


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## The_kid (Nov 4, 2014)

I had a mechanic that was just a miserable douche. I won't go into all of if. But one day, he threw another helper off a ladder. And later that day I broke my hand using the right angle drill. 

He refused to let me use the ice in the ice pack and forced me to continue working. Than didn't tell the owners of the company I broke my hand (even though that was company policy).

In a few weeks when I was cleared to go back to work I was cleaning out the van. I realized he was behind me, so I started throwing the scrap wire out behind me. By some sort of luck a piece of 12 wire cut on an angle stabbed him in the eye. I'm pretty sure there was some long term damage. I was so happy.


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## JW Splicer (Mar 15, 2014)

kg7879 said:


> There was an apprentice in my local who had a journeyman who would kind of tap him and others in the nuts. The apprentice told the JW to stop and also complained to his foreman.
> 
> Nothing was done about it, so the next time the JW tapped him in the nuts he called the cops and the cops arrested the JW for assault. The JW and the foreman loss their jobs.
> 
> You only have a few options. Deal with it, quit, kick his ass and risk getting arrested your self or you could call the cops because he is vandalizing your property.


 This is wierd! you don't touch nuts that aren't hangin off your own body... Come on man! I would be creeped out!


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## chewy (May 9, 2010)

kg7879 said:


> There was an apprentice in my local who had a journeyman who would kind of tap him and others in the nuts. The apprentice told the JW to stop and also complained to his foreman.
> 
> Nothing was done about it, so the next time the JW tapped him in the nuts he called the cops and the cops arrested the JW for assault. The JW and the foreman loss their jobs.
> 
> You only have a few options. Deal with it, quit, kick his ass and risk getting arrested your self or you could call the cops because he is vandalizing your property.


Thats a bit of an overreacion to call the cops, unless you are a closet homosexual and sack tapping stirs up confusing feelings for you.


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## The_kid (Nov 4, 2014)

chewy said:


> Thats a bit of an overreacion to call the cops, unless you are a closet homosexual and sack tapping stirs up confusing feelings for you.



But the guy touching other dudes balls all day isn't a little confused?


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## Bad Electrician (May 20, 2014)

Act like you were shocked and throw you hammer at him as if it was a reaction to the jolt.

Or take a pair of vice grips and catch his B*ll sac then give him a tour of the property


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## chewy (May 9, 2010)

The_kid said:


> But the guy touching other dudes balls all day isn't a little confused?


Its just a sack tap...


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## Voltron (Sep 14, 2012)

chewy said:


> Its just a sack tap...


Keep telling yourself that. :whistling2:


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## JW Splicer (Mar 15, 2014)

Careful chewy, someone might get an idea... You'll have a new job, it will probably involve balls...


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## xpertpc (Oct 11, 2012)

In grade school it starts out with just a sack tap, in high school it becomes a broomstick in the anus, by the time college comes around it is full blown pedophilia - just ask penn state, but when you hit the big leagues like the union they want to deflate your balls.

Sack tapping is just a latent sexual predators stepping stone to becoming a serial killer -


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## nternes (Sep 25, 2012)

I want to know what happened to the op


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## rscimone (Jan 10, 2015)

The JW told the stuward that I wasn't cut out for this type of work, that all I did was complain, I never listened to him, and that the union should throw me out. 
I pleaded my case with the steward. I tried to explain that I very much so like electrical work. I am ALWAYS on time. I ALWAYS want to learn, and this man does not teach me anything. I tried not to flat out call this man a LIAR, as it would not benefit me at all to try and go head on with this man because of his seniority. I explained, he treats me like a DOG and, although I do no want to jeopardize my career, I can not and will not stand for someone harassing me the way this man does. I also explained that I have many references that can attest to my work ethic if they wanted references as this is not my first job. 
When it was all said and done I was told that I am in a tough position and to try and stick it out.
So basically, I don't have a good feeling about this. I was brought to the end of the line and chances are I'm going to do something worse than piss in his coffee the next time he tries something. Now that I KNOW he's a LIAR as well, I feel like I'm backed into a corner and they won't get me away from this guy. 
If it wasn't for the fact that I have a child I need to care for I would not care about any of this. Just sad there are people like this in the world. He's not just putting my life and career in danger, but my daughter as well. This guy's knows I have a 3 yr old daughter with autism and it's so sad he's trying to ruin my life because he is bitter about his. 
Oh well, I just need to have faith maybe there's something better out there.


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## rscimone (Jan 10, 2015)

P.s. 
Thanks for those that gave advise, but because of this one man and how the system is working...it's putting a bad taste in my mouth about unions.


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## eejack (Jul 14, 2012)

rscimone said:


> I tried not to flat out call this man a LIAR, as it would not benefit me at all to try and go head on with this man because of his seniority.


You are too nice.

Call the hall, explain it to the training director. Seriously - there is something better - and the hall is there to help you. No one should ever put another person in harm's way. 

Reach out to one of your previous journeymen for assistance if you need it.


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## dreamcrusher28 (Oct 19, 2010)

Start recording audio with your phone or something. All day.


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## VoltJames (Nov 1, 2012)

Hey OP, I have been following this thread closely.

It is beyond my understanding why anyone would deliberately energize the panel while knowing someone is working on the same circuit. This is attempted murder! This JW is a scum bag!

Worse comes to worse, this company lays you off and you go back to the hall and hopefully, you'll be sent to another company with a good JW to work with. I don't know your local but I can assume that with most locals, there is practically zero wait for apprentices.

Please, take records what this guy is doing to you and record it even if it's just voice. Charge this scum bag with attempted murder!

GL and keep us posted.


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## Bad Electrician (May 20, 2014)

rscimone said:


> P.s.
> Thanks for those that gave advise, but because of this one man and how the system is working...it's putting a bad taste in my mouth about unions.


It seems the shop steward should know some history on this JW, if he is a jerk as you noted this can't be his first time there have been complaints where is the company on this, you get hurt and they are in deep doodoo.

Fake being hurt seriously next time he shocks you and see what happens.

As others have noted keep records and talk to other apprentices, get a case against this jerk.

As a company owner I would not tolerate this for a single day.


T


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## LGLS (Nov 10, 2007)

rscimone said:


> P.s.
> Thanks for those that gave advise, but *because of this one man* and how the system is working*...it's putting a bad taste in my mouth about unions*.





rscimone said:


> Hey guys,
> 
> I am in the [COLOR=blue !important][COLOR=blue !important]IBEW[/COLOR][/COLOR] and I just started a few months ago. I am currently working with a journeyman in houses, all residential work. The journeyman is constantly telling me to take out switches and outlets. While I try my best, he keeps on telling me he is shutting off the circuits and I keep getting hit with 120V. It went from me thinking he made a mistake, to now I think he's doing it on purpose. I use my testers now, but somehow he's flipping them BACK ON after I test it. This has happened about 6 times now and I'm starting to get very nervous. I was told that you can't argue with your journeyman when you are an apprentice, but I'm at the point of practically crying after work. This is not the only thing he does. He ruins my breakfast and lunch by throwing garbage on it, or if I bring in my own he puts wire lube all inside my bag. I am trying to man up, but how long do I [COLOR=blue !important][COLOR=blue !important]deal[/COLOR][/COLOR] with this? This is making me feel like I should not be in this field. I love electrical work, but I hate coming to work. It's very hard right now. I thought the union was different. I thought it was a brotherhood. I feel like I don't belong. PLEASE ADVISE!!! Thank you!
> 
> -Discouraged IBEW Union Apprentice


 I'm calling BS on this entire story.


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## Ink&Brass (Nov 6, 2013)

IslandGuy said:


> I'm calling BS on this entire story.


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## sparky970 (Mar 19, 2008)

rscimone said:


> Hey guys,
> 
> I am in the IBEW and I just started a few months ago. I am currently working with a journeyman in houses, all residential work. The journeyman is constantly telling me to take out switches and outlets. While I try my best, he keeps on telling me he is shutting off the circuits and I keep getting hit with 120V. It went from me thinking he made a mistake, to now I think he's doing it on purpose. I use my testers now, but somehow he's flipping them BACK ON after I test it. This has happened about 6 times now and I'm starting to get very nervous. I was told that you can't argue with your journeyman when you are an apprentice, but I'm at the point of practically crying after work. This is not the only thing he does. He ruins my breakfast and lunch by throwing garbage on it, or if I bring in my own he puts wire lube all inside my bag. I am trying to man up, but how long do I deal with this? This is making me feel like I should not be in this field. I love electrical work, but I hate coming to work. It's very hard right now. I thought the union was different. I thought it was a brotherhood. I feel like I don't belong. PLEASE ADVISE!!! Thank you!
> 
> -Discouraged IBEW Union Apprentice


I would punch that guy right in the rooster sucker


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## bei (Jan 21, 2009)

Rscimone, it sounds like calling the Apprenticeship Director is your best next step if being in the union is more important to you than protecting your life & health, but do so IMMEDIATELY. If the director cannot get you into a safer situation tomorrow, then it is up to you to show yourself and your family what kind of person you really are. While I like the idea of gathering evidence using phone audio/video, every day that goes by puts you at further risk.

In short, it sounds like your life is at risk and taking swift and sure action such as quitting or calling the police & filing charges is the best way to show that you truly respect yourself should the Apprenticeship Director show the same attitude of carelessness toward your safety that the Steward showed. I urge you to consider that the course of action you take over the next few days could decide your ability to support or *burden* your family far into the future. Sometimes the best way to see a situation's possibilities is to view them in the extreme. For instance:

1. Due to JW's maladjusted behavior, you get shocked working at height and fall, breaking a few vertebrae. Long hospital stay, months of rehab, 2 years of physical therapy, a lifetime of pain. A life of diminished wages due to limited physical abilities.
2. A JW-caused accident causes you to go into in a coma for an indefinite time. Lots of good "family time" there at the assisted living facility (IF your family can afford assisted living).
3. Following advise to meet violence with violence, you assault JW and accidentally cause serious and permanent brain damage. You go to jail while JW spends rest of life being spoon-fed by nursing aides. Of course, this could go the other way too, no matter what your sizes are; you could get your butt kicked with permanent injuries and JW just says you are clumsy and fell down stairs.
4. A 120-volt electrical shock damages your heart (Yes, this does happen), but damage is undetected until you collapse while vacationing in a remote area 17 years from now. You have a long travel to a poorly-outfitted medical facility in the sticks, and you are forced to retire at age 36. You live to be 70. WOW, NICE! You get to spend 2 years "working from home" below minimum wage as you jump through hoops to try to qualify for government disability. After you qualify for disability you live for another 32 years. Nice life for the wife and "Hey, sorry children, I need to take away your college savings in order to buy food and pay mortgage and medical bills".

Are the above possibilities worth the risk of putting up with an insecure sociopath who never grew up? Worth the risk of staying in an organization where those in power most certainly know your JW's MO and do not care about you because you are a beginner? Worth the *possibility* of a bright future doing what you love, and having good wages and benefits? We all risk our health and life doing everyday things, but the wiser ones tend to consider the bigger picture and decide what the risk-to-benefit ratio is, and how much control they realistically have over the outcome.

Difficulties test us. This is a great opportunity to look inside yourself and decide what kind of person you are going to be. I wish you luck and courage.


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## nternes (Sep 25, 2012)

Well......what happend?


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## Rskillz15 (Feb 3, 2015)

Well I'm sorry you are experiencing this. Not saying your wrong but could you be possibly getting hit from an unbalanced load on the neutral tied to another circuit? 

As far as the lunch. That mother 
%[email protected]!er wouldn't do that to me twice. Never let somebody mess with your food (natural instinct) 

And I would tell him once assertively you're done with his ****. If he makes fun or continues his actions. Destroy his tools, lunch, car, or anything else that makes you feel satisfied. 

And end it with an ass beating


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## Electric_Light (Apr 6, 2010)

Is this a troll thread?


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## Black Dog (Oct 16, 2011)

Electric_Light said:


> Is this a troll thread?


Nope, this Chit happens more than you know.:no:


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## Electric_Light (Apr 6, 2010)

If this is true, the journeyman has the mental maturity of a 12 year old. The food in trash thing is some childish BS. Intentionally creating hazardous working conditions borders criminally negligent and it's something that needs to be reported to HR. Someone who does that kind of thing needs to get into serious trouble or terminated.

It's going to get someone hurt or killed and the company will get in serious trouble with OSHA and the WC insurance premium is going to sky rocket.


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## eddy current (Feb 28, 2009)

Unfortunately not much ever happens to these idiots. 
I worked for a shop where the gf was the idiot pranking on the apprentices. One apprentice actually took time off for stress leave. 
Went on for years until one apprentice went to the shop practically in tears.
The hall was not told about any of it.
The gf haf a talking to and still works there. The apprentices who were the victims have all since been laid off.


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## eejack (Jul 14, 2012)

eddy current said:


> Unfortunately not much ever happens to these idiots.


They only way something happens to these wankstains is when another proper journeyman finds out about it and handles it. 

While I encourage letting the hall know deep down I understand that unless the apprentice finds a journeyman to listen and deal with it, it will continue.

My favorite method for dealing with situations involves a Lull, a couple of chains and a portajohn. It is remarkable how rugged those portajohns are.


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## Aegis (Mar 18, 2011)

rscimone said:


> Hey guys, I am in the IBEW and I just started a few months ago. I am currently working with a journeyman in houses, all residential work. The journeyman is constantly telling me to take out switches and outlets. While I try my best, he keeps on telling me he is shutting off the circuits and I keep getting hit with 120V. It went from me thinking he made a mistake, to now I think he's doing it on purpose. I use my testers now, but somehow he's flipping them BACK ON after I test it. This has happened about 6 times now and I'm starting to get very nervous. I was told that you can't argue with your journeyman when you are an apprentice, but I'm at the point of practically crying after work. This is not the only thing he does. He ruins my breakfast and lunch by throwing garbage on it, or if I bring in my own he puts wire lube all inside my bag. I am trying to man up, but how long do I deal with this? This is making me feel like I should not be in this field. I love electrical work, but I hate coming to work. It's very hard right now. I thought the union was different. I thought it was a brotherhood. I feel like I don't belong. PLEASE ADVISE!!! Thank you! -Discouraged IBEW Union Apprentice


What you've stated isn't normal. Practical jokes with the new guy should be more light hearted. Also getting hit by 120v more then once isn't a mistake, you should no longer work with this guy, he's a jerk and finds no more joy in life besides tormenting you.


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## Electric_Light (Apr 6, 2010)

eddy current said:


> Unfortunately not much ever happens to these idiots.


Because it doesn't get reported enough and people don't seek help from attorneys often enough when they maybe entitled to compensation.



Rskillz15 said:


> And end it with an ass beating


The company owner would much rather hear about it. Work place violence is like the next school shooting. Not only would the workers comp picking up the medical bill, this kind of injury do not waive them from getting sued in addition to it. They ain't got money to hire workers with DUIs or defend work place violence lawsuits. 

You throw the punch, you're fired. There are a few things the union can't get you out of and this is one of those.


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## xpertpc (Oct 11, 2012)

My only advice for now is to not give out too much information online,

There have been more than a few instances where the bully became the plaintiff in a lawsuit turning the tables on the injured because of things they said on a public forum in exasperation.

You may have said enough here for a member or causal reader to see that the forum subject is referring to them. They can then save the posts about pissing in coffee and then have you charged with some nasty crimes that you would have no defense against.

I would ask the mods to delete this thread, tho it may be too late as it has probably already been cached.


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## cat369 (Mar 10, 2015)

This is a really sticky situation, all the post make since.... When I was green on the plier's, My first jw told me I had 5 yrs! But he was cool, and later in apprenticeship I run into some real dcik weeds, and you have to pick battles, most of the time suck it up and realize in construction, no job last forever. Apprentices are not supposed to have meters, but you can carry voltage stick, tick tracer, etc. what ever you wish to call it. 
You should alway's test a circuit yourself, and treat it as if its energized. Sometimes impossible, I know, but NEVER TAKE SOME ONES WORD!!


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## aktrapper (May 28, 2013)

Dude, go to hall and tell them what's going on. Go up the food chain, they are suppose to help you. If you are afraid to help yourself then ask a buddy to come along, you need a friend. Go sign the the books, get out of the situation.
That guy needs to be fired and his card pulled. Stand up for yourself or have a brother help you. Its shaming to know that the ibew has a jw like this joker.


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## Black Dog (Oct 16, 2011)

*rscimone:*

How have you made out with this issue?


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## rscimone (Jan 10, 2015)

First of all, thank you to everyone on here that gave me genuine advice and concern on this issue. I am happy to say I've moved onto another shop. I was let go and sent right back out to another company and the guys here are great!!! What a difference it makes to be around people who give a sh!t!!! For whatever reason the other company felt I wasn't right, and it's been a blessing working with the guys I'm with for almost 2 months. Thanks again for all your help! It was truly appreciated and I'm lucky to have this app as a forum for some good solid advice in the future. God bless you all that tried to guide me! You're truly an inspiration and this will not soon be forgotten!!!! =-D


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## eejack (Jul 14, 2012)

The best thanks would be to become a good journeyman to the apprentices you will tuck under your wing in the future. Glad you found out there are good folks to work with out there.


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## chewy (May 9, 2010)

I hope you were escorted out of your first shop like this guy. https://youtu.be/pEsZkTTgydc


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## kingg360 (Mar 14, 2015)

Woop.his ass!!


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