# What size conduit?



## NoBot (Oct 12, 2019)

New 400 amp 3ø 120/208 volt service, four wire with two 200 amp 3ø sub panels.
One sub panel is about 110ft away. It will require 3-90º elbows and 1-45º.
Wire size will be 4-3/0 and 1-#4 THHN copper.
Would you run 2 1/2" EMT to 3" ?
Would you install a pull box mid way?


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## Veteran Sparky (Apr 21, 2021)

'President' of electrical outfit since 85, and your asking this?


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## NoBot (Oct 12, 2019)

Veteran Sparky said:


> 'President' of electrical outfit since 85, and your asking this?


Not President, Grand Exhalted Ruler


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## NoBot (Oct 12, 2019)

The good news, I bid this in May. Prices on material have dropped, copper about 20%. Bid it at 2 1/2" EMT. I going to run 3" PVC just to make it easier. I can afford it now.
Too many smart asses on this forum.
Yo can close this thread.


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## splatz (May 23, 2015)

If I punched it into the calculator right that's 25% fill in 2.5" conduit, should be OK. 

If this is exposed I'd put a C condulet in midway to break it up into 180 degrees of bend the first part and 135 degrees the second part. Try pulling straight through first, if it gives you trouble use the pulling point. Even if you don't pull there, still lube there. Good place for the Klein foam lube IMO.


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## Slay301 (Apr 23, 2018)

310.15b3a if they are going in the same conduit


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## kb1jb1 (Nov 11, 2017)

NoBot said:


> The good news, I bid this in May. Prices on material have dropped, copper about 20%. Bid it at 2 1/2" EMT. I going to run 3" PVC just to make it easier. I can afford it now.
> Too many smart asses on this forum.
> Yo can close this thread.


Be careful with PVC. It has a higher drag factor than EMT. I just had a hard time pulling 5 - #12 THHN through 3/4 inch PVC 125 feet and I used plenty of lube. The PVC made today is really a poor quality product. HD, Lowes, Supply houses. I have pulled 4 - 3/0 THHN copper in 2 inch without any problems but I had a cable puller. Constantly check prices. Here PVC sometimes cost more than EMT. I am also finding that Aluminum cost more than copper. 250 Aluminum needs 2 1/2 inch while 3/0 can fit in 2 inch.


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## kb1jb1 (Nov 11, 2017)

splatz said:


> If I punched it into the calculator right that's 25% fill in 2.5" conduit, should be OK.
> 
> If this is exposed I'd put a C condulet in midway to break it up into 180 degrees of bend the first part and 135 degrees the second part. Try pulling straight through first, if it gives you trouble use the pulling point. Even if you don't pull there, still lube there. Good place for the Klein foam lube IMO.


I like the idea of the C condulet as a mid point for the lube.


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## 460 Delta (May 9, 2018)

kb1jb1 said:


> Be careful with PVC. It has a higher drag factor than EMT. I just had a hard time pulling 5 - #12 THHN through 3/4 inch PVC 125 feet and I used plenty of lube. The PVC made today is really a poor quality product. HD, Lowes, Supply houses. I have pulled 4 - 3/0 THHN copper in 2 inch without any problems but I had a cable puller. Constantly check prices. Here PVC sometimes cost more than EMT. I am also finding that Aluminum cost more than copper. 250 Aluminum needs 2 1/2 inch while 3/0 can fit in 2 inch.


It’s a bit of an expensive, but you should be able to hide it on the bill, but Mule Tape won’t burn through the pvc ells like pull string will.

I have a thing about wasting wire so I also use the Mule Tape’s foot marking to order accurate cuts of wire from the SH. In my mind at least the extra expense of Mule Tape is quickly paid for in wire savings from accurate cuts from the SH. When you start trimming off excess in 3/0 size, it adds up pretty quickly.
















Gateway to Latin America


The seaside resort of Miami Beach is perhaps best




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Sorry about the weird looking link, it takes you to Ideal Mule Tape info.


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## hornetd (Oct 30, 2014)

kb1jb1 said:


> Be careful with PVC. It has a higher drag factor than EMT. I just had a hard time pulling 5 - #12 THHN through 3/4 inch PVC 125 feet and I used plenty of lube. The PVC made today is really a poor quality product. HD, Lowes, Supply houses. I have pulled 4 - 3/0 THHN copper in 2 inch without any problems but I had a cable puller. Constantly check prices. Here PVC sometimes cost more than EMT. I am also finding that Aluminum cost more than copper. 250 Aluminum needs 2 1/2 inch while 3/0 can fit in 2 inch.


That is why the code allows the use of rigid and intermediate metal conduit elbows underground so that that the pull rope will not cut through the inside of a PVC 90 and jam the pull. The elbows have to be further down than the minimum depth of bury for conduit so the trenches ended up deeper than otherwise. 

On long underground PVC runs I would sometimes put a wet vacuum / blower on each end to draw the water out of the conduit. I would then saturate a sponge with pulling lube and drag that through. It seemed to me that it helped a lot. 

Tom Horne


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## kb1jb1 (Nov 11, 2017)

460 Delta said:


> It’s a bit of an expensive, but you should be able to hide it on the bill, but Mule Tape won’t burn through the pvc ells like pull string will.
> 
> I have a thing about wasting wire so I also use the Mule Tape’s foot marking to order accurate cuts of wire from the SH. In my mind at least the extra expense of Mule Tape is quickly paid for in wire savings from accurate cuts from the SH. When you start trimming off excess in 3/0 size, it adds up pretty quickly.
> View attachment 170703
> ...


I forgot about mule tape. Nice product. A friend of mine worked for a utility and they had a 200 foot piece tangled so they chucked it. He gave it to me and I untangled it for reuse but forgot about it.


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## NoBot (Oct 12, 2019)

I appreciate everyone's contributions.
Some here don't read very well. My question was: your opinion of 2 1/2" vs 3" conduit and you would install a pull box.
First response; "'President' of electrical outfit since 85, and you're asking this?"
Another referral was a code reference to sizing conduit, as if I don't know how to do that.
It's posts like these, that I don't post or respond very often.
In Pittsburgh, we call these people "Jag Offs".
Jag Off = A term of endearment meant to infer a jerk.


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## backstay (Feb 3, 2011)

You must not have spent much time around electricians.


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## kb1jb1 (Nov 11, 2017)

I take it that it is 2 separate EMT runs. Do you have a cable puller or are you doing it by hand? Have you pulled similar runs before and did you have any problems? Some types of wire have more gripsion or drag than others. I found that the Simpull slides through very easy. As I said, I pulled the same wires into 2" EMT with 3 sweeps with out any problems but I have a cable tugger that has a force monitoring thing on it. I agree we should not disrespect our trade associates.


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## Awg-Dawg (Jan 23, 2007)

2 1/2”
No


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## NoBot (Oct 12, 2019)

backstay said:


> You must not have spent much time around electricians.


When I work for U.S. Steel in a Coke plant, I worked 3 shifts with different crews. Some crews constantly jerked the young guys around, argued, hated their jobs and couldn’t wait to hit the bar.
Other crews talked sports and about hunting & family. They got together on weekends with wives & made friends.
I decided back then which one I wanted to follow .


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## Slay301 (Apr 23, 2018)

NoBot said:


> When I work for U.S. Steel in a Coke plant, I worked 3 shifts with different crews. Some crews constantly jerked the young guys around, argued, hated their jobs and couldn’t wait to hit the bar.
> Other crews talked sports and about hunting & family. They got together on weekends with wives & made friends.
> I decided back then which one I wanted to follow .


So I see u went with fuggin with ppl u jaggoff


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## 99cents (Aug 20, 2012)

NoBot said:


> I appreciate everyone's contributions.
> Some here don't read very well. My question was: your opinion of 2 1/2" vs 3" conduit and you would install a pull box.
> First response; "'President' of electrical outfit since 85, and you're asking this?"
> Another referral was a code reference to sizing conduit, as if I don't know how to do that.
> ...


They’re just busting your ballz a little. No offence intended. I don’t think they’re jag offs when they’re hanging ceiling fans for grandma.


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## Slay301 (Apr 23, 2018)

I don’t understand how my comment was deleted it’s no worse than any other and it was obviously ment in jest.


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## 99cents (Aug 20, 2012)

Slay301 said:


> I don’t understand how my comment was deleted it’s no worse than any other and it was obviously ment in jest.


Alright, it was I undeleted but take it easy, okay?


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## 99cents (Aug 20, 2012)

I deleted your most recent post because you used my personal name, Slay. I don’t know how you got it but I value my privacy. Please respect that.


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## Slay301 (Apr 23, 2018)

99cents said:


> I deleted your most recent post because you used my personal name, Slay. I don’t know how you got it but I value my privacy. Please respect that.


Respect works both ways ight? I could say more than just your name if I wanted you’re an open book


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## 99cents (Aug 20, 2012)

Slay301 said:


> Respect works both ways ight? I could say more than just your name if I wanted you’re an open book


I’m not interested in this conversation, Slay.


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## Slay301 (Apr 23, 2018)

99cents said:


> I’m not interested in this conversation, Slay.


Neat


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## NoBot (Oct 12, 2019)

Slay301 said:


> So I see u went with fuggin with ppl u jaggoff


Well said, my motto is "Don't Jag Off a Jag Off"


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## NoBot (Oct 12, 2019)

Thanks to all for your advice and comments. We pulled the wire yesterday, it well very well. 
160 ft of 3" PVC, 2 LBs, 4-90s, with 4-3/0 & 1-#4 THHN copper.
15 ft up, through two 16" concrete walls


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