# 20's house K&T rewire



## guitarchris (Jan 16, 2009)

I looked at a house to do a complete k&T gut and re-wire of a 20's era 2 story house. I had a typical layout, partial standing room only basement with decent crawl under the rest. Attic is great once you get up there. Hip roof (yuck). 
3 bedrooms upstairs and a bathroom. I was planning on having the baseboards removed on the 2nd floor and drilling around once fished down from attic for recs. fan and dual switching in each. Smokes all the way around. large up stairs hall. planning on a sub panel up there for my branch circuits.
Downstairs in typical walk in the front with foyer with parlor and living room on each side. Bedroom behind living room. Lights, switching and recs to taste. Home owner will have paths I choose cut out for drilling, box mounting or whatever else I want. So I factored some time cutting some holes as needed......because they won't all be where I said or need them.

The rear of the house is a 2 story, old, addition that will be gutted to the studs. this should be as close to new construction as you can get from a 30's-40's addition. At least it will be opened up. This addition will include a bathroom off the downstairs bedroom, porch, Full Kitchen and pantry, formal dining room and powder room.

The service is a 200A 20/40 mpc.and we would have to either take the main range fuse circuits to the outside or set a sub panel. Assume gas appliances, two furnaces, WH and gas range

I've done several houses like this and THOUGHT I had a good handle on pricing something like it. I haven't had a ton of time to put it together and so it's been on my desk for a week. Yesterday I got a call from another EC who is a one man/ part timer who said he landed this job. He didn't know I'd looked at it until then. His wife's health took a nasty turn and so he was going to have to turn it over to someone who could knock it out. I was ready to move on it until he laid his price on me! it was way over half the educated guesstimate I had in my head, really 1/3 the price!!! I didn't immediately turn him down as I couldn't talk much when he called. But, dang, either I'm way off (high) or he's way low. I've been there done that....but so has he! You have to have a CYA factor on a reno like that! 

With what I just laid out, where would you guys be. If your locality isn't in your profile state where you are.....Ca is going to be much different $ that here in NC. Once I get a few replies I chime in with mine and his numbers.


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## RePhase277 (Feb 5, 2008)

Here in sunny Alabama, just by what you describe and fishing a bunch of walls, and probably lathe and plaster walls if it's from the 20s,... I'd be near $20k, maybe under, maybe over depending on exact circumstances.


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## telsa (May 22, 2015)

A ninety-year old house needs to be taken down to the studs -- EVERYWHERE.

Pop in some old episodes of This Old House to see why.


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## Majewski (Jan 8, 2016)

Man I think 20-60k. Depends on a lot of core variables only the do-er can know.....


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## lightman (Oct 14, 2015)

A friend just got an estimate on his house which is close to what you are describing and it was 15k. The service entrance equipment is pretty new and will be kept and does not include fixtures. This is in Arkansas.


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## MechanicalDVR (Dec 29, 2007)

$20k sounds good, in Virginia.


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## Switched (Dec 23, 2012)

Mech... How long would you spend on that?

2 weeks?
3 weeks?


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

I wouldn't touch it unless they were willing to do T&M @ $200/hr per man or they were willing to open all the walls completely.


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## MechanicalDVR (Dec 29, 2007)

Switched said:


> Mech... How long would you spend on that?
> 
> 2 weeks?
> 3 weeks?


I'd say 12-14 days for 2 guys.


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## Majewski (Jan 8, 2016)

MechanicalDVR said:


> I'd say 12-14 days for 2 guys.


Yeah... IF all the obstructions were outta the way and needed materials on site...


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## MechanicalDVR (Dec 29, 2007)

Majewski said:


> Yeah... IF all the obstructions were outta the way and needed materials on site...


One room per day and a little extra time for finishing up.


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

Cutting old plaster with wood lath neatly isn't easy and it's very dusty. There will be a HUGE time difference between cutting neat channels and bashing holes with your hammer.

There are so many variables that everything needs to be locked in. These are situations that I just don't like, which is why I would only do it with a high T&M rate or only if they opened the walls and I can do it as new work.


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## 350X (May 20, 2016)

I agree at 15-20k and cleaned out to the studs here in Idaho. 
Most people doing these don't have what I'd require. It's just NOT in the budget. There is always someone willing to just "get 'er done. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## LGLS (Nov 10, 2007)

telsa said:


> A ninety-year old house needs to be taken down to the studs -- EVERYWHERE.
> 
> Pop in some old episodes of This Old House to see why.


Telsa is right. It's not just the ancient wiring. It's the insulation, plumbing, cast iron drains, lack of fire blocking, dysfunctional windows. Gut the place to the bare bones is the way to go.


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## MechanicalDVR (Dec 29, 2007)

LawnGuyLandSparky said:


> Telsa is right. It's not just the ancient wiring. It's the insulation, plumbing, cast iron drains, lack of fire blocking, dysfunctional windows. Gut the place to the bare bones is the way to go.


If only 1/6th of that list involves wiring there is little reason to focus on it.


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## RePhase277 (Feb 5, 2008)

Yeah, I don't care if the customer wants to open the walls as long as he's willing to pay. I don't care about the plumbing or insulation problems... because they aren't my problems.


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## Switched (Dec 23, 2012)

I do quite a few of these every year, every single one the walls are staying up on. 

I've made quite a good system through trial and error and have become quite efficient at doing rewires on older homes and have zero issues with he walls staying intact.

The people who are doing these in our area have money, but typically not enough to gut the entire home from top to bottom and redo everything in it. Most of the time we are the only contractor doing any work, besides the plaster and paint guys.

They are a PITA though, so make sure you cover all bases and charge good money for it.


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## Jack Legg (Mar 12, 2014)

MechanicalDVR said:


> One room per day and a little extra time for finishing up.


I approach these the same way, one room a day.
Pretty much anything can go wrong and we can still complete a room a day


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## telsa (May 22, 2015)

Leaving the walls on in such an old re-hab is bad economics -- for the owner.

But fighting the issue... it's not the hill I'm willing to die on.

Don't be surprised if the old wood is hard as nails to drill through.

Balloon construction -- with its lack of fire block -- is greatly to your advantage.

However, risk is always high when you're fishing forever.

Special attention needs be made for EXTRAS... as the owner will surely 'adjust his thinking' as the project proceeds. 

Noob re-habbers figure that such is customary and ordinary -- and on YOUR dime.

Not quite. :no:


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## canbug (Dec 31, 2015)

Is the other guys wife really sick or did he figure out he was low. Stick to your price if it turns out to be your job. 

Tim.


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## sbrn33 (Mar 15, 2007)

I would be $20K also. Bout $15K labor the rest in materials.


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## guitarchris (Jan 16, 2009)

The other guy was at $12k. My educated guesstimate was $25-30. Apparently the scope has changed, so I'm going to go back to look at it agian. I've done quite a bit of these and they can be enjoyable or HELL, depending on how much the house is willing to work with you (or against you!).
I did one last year that didn't need a service or any bathroom or kitchen work. It came in a touch above $15k.....

I can't go by until next week to do a better look around. I'll update you guys.


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## Switched (Dec 23, 2012)

$12k!

Let him know when he is ready to go I an set him up doing these one after another for that price!

Keep us posted and I hope you sell it closer to your $30k mark!


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## Next reincarnated (Feb 5, 2017)

$14/15/sq ft minimum


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## NJ Contractor (Nov 12, 2016)

We do this all the time on a time and materials basis. We typically cut a channel in the walls and ceiling to allow us to drill the framing and fish the wires. 

As a General Contractor, we also offer patching and painting which is estimated after the electrical work is complete.


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## sbrn33 (Mar 15, 2007)

I always look at it this way. That is probably a 1200 sq ft house. In this day and age even new construction would be $13K.


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## Switched (Dec 23, 2012)

NJ Contractor said:


> We do this all the time on a time and materials basis. We typically cut a channel in the walls and ceiling to allow us to drill the framing and fish the wires.
> 
> As a General Contractor, we also offer patching and painting which is estimated after the electrical work is complete.


Every area is different and it is amazing how each state and locality are so widely out of sync.

Here in Cali... You are not allowed to do T&M on a rewire, anything that will be over $750.00 (I may be off by a few dollars) is required to be provided with an estimate.

Also, General Contractors are not allowed to perform solely electrical work, unless they are performing a total of 3 trades, with the primary being framing or carpentry. So typically, they are not allowed to do something like a rewire or repipe project. If they also carry a valid electrical contractors license... Then they can do it.


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## NJ Contractor (Nov 12, 2016)

Switched said:


> Here in Cali... You are not allowed to do T&M on a rewire, anything that will be over $750.00 (I may be off by a few dollars) is required to be provided with an estimate.


Interesting...I never knew that. 



> Also, general contractors are not allowed to perform solely electrical work, unless they are performing a total of 3 trades, with the primary being framing or carpentry. So typically, they are not allowed to do something like a rewire or repipe project. If they also carry a valid electrical contractors license... Then they can do it.


In NJ, General Contractors cannot perform electrical work but can subcontract to a licensed electrical contractor. I hold a NJ Electrical Contractors License.


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## Switched (Dec 23, 2012)

NJ Contractor said:


> Interesting...I never knew that.
> 
> 
> 
> In NJ, General Contractors cannot perform electrical work but can subcontract to a licensed electrical contractor. I hold a NJ Electrical Contractors License.


We all have these presumptions about what "Is right" or what is a "Good business model", yet the area we live and work really does dictate a lot about how we can legally perform our business functions.


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