# Pool junction box



## WronGun (Oct 18, 2013)

I have a client that is going to install a concrete patio where there is a protruding pool junction box Which I am not familiar with nor' understand the design.

Long story short he wants it flush trying to come up with a strategy any suggestions ?










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## WronGun (Oct 18, 2013)

I was thinking a standard ground box with green cover , but wondering why the current box is designed this way 


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## Glock23gp (Mar 10, 2014)

Cut the conduits down and dig in a small in ground box making the lid flush with the finished concrete.

Done 

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## WronGun (Oct 18, 2013)

Glock23gp said:


> Cut the conduits down and dig in a small in ground box making the lid flush with the finished concrete.
> 
> Done
> 
> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N910A using Tapatalk




What I was thinking exactly , but was wondering why something like this protruding from the ground was installed in the first place... just wanted to make sure there wasn't a reason for it 


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## Glock23gp (Mar 10, 2014)

WronGun said:


> What I was thinking exactly , but was wondering why something like this protruding from the ground was installed in the first place... just wanted to make sure there wasn't a reason for it
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


As long as there are no hazards you or the h.o. are aware of, who could guess why anyone does anything right? 

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## 3DDesign (Oct 25, 2014)

I've seen that box before. 
To eliminate it, you could use a 4"x4"x4" PVC cover with cover. The problem is, cutting the conduit with wires in kit. You could pull the underwater light to pull the center black cord out. But then you also would have to pull the other two conduits.

I've cut PVC before by starting with a hack saw and finishing with a nylon string. Work the string back and forth until it cuts through. The string usually doesn't damage the wire. After you're 95% cut, wiggle the conduit back and forth and it will usually snap off.


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## 3DDesign (Oct 25, 2014)

WronGun said:


> What I was thinking exactly , but was wondering why something like this protruding from the ground was installed in the first place... just wanted to make sure there wasn't a reason for it
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Main reason is the box needs to be above the water level.


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## Glock23gp (Mar 10, 2014)

3DDesign said:


> I've seen that box before.
> To eliminate it, you could use a 4"x4"x4" PVC cover with cover. The problem is, cutting the conduit with wires in kit. You could pull the underwater light to pull the center black cord out. But then you also would have to pull the other two conduits.
> 
> I've cut PVC before by starting with a hack saw and finishing with a nylon string. Work the string back and forth until it cuts through. The string usually doesn't damage the wire. After you're 95% cut, wiggle the conduit back and forth and it will usually snap off.


Tubing cutter is the easiest or the green handle Greenlee ratcheting pvc cutters reaming it slow as you click it every couple turns until just before it breaks

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## telsa (May 22, 2015)

Don't touch it until you've visited the manufacturer's website.

I suspect that it was installed so that concrete could be poured around and under it.

Your photo is largely unhelpful.


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## WronGun (Oct 18, 2013)

3DDesign said:


> Main reason is the box needs to be above the water level.




So there it is , it can't be buried to grade 


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## WronGun (Oct 18, 2013)

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## WronGun (Oct 18, 2013)

Kind of sucks to have this smack in the middle of a concrete patio 


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## telsa (May 22, 2015)

WronGun said:


> Kind of sucks to have this smack in the middle of a concrete patio
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


It's close by the chain link fence.

Put a bench atop it. The owner has to sit somewhere.


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## 3DDesign (Oct 25, 2014)

That's why for years these were hidden under the diving board.


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## WronGun (Oct 18, 2013)

Fence is coming down and that concrete patio is being extended 15' which pretty much puts this in the middle , yep table will have to do 


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## 3DDesign (Oct 25, 2014)

Depending on the light, they can be ordered with up to 100 ft of cord. Run new conduit to a remote location.


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## Dennis Alwon (May 9, 2009)

You cannot use just any jb. The jb must be listed for pool lights. And yes there are minimum heights that these boxes must be installed as stated above. Don't mess with pools unless you do it correctly. It can come back and bite you.

We had a situation here in Raleigh, NC where the lifeguard got killed because of sloppy wiring


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## WronGun (Oct 18, 2013)

Exactly why I was checking , figured there had to be a reason for this ugly protrusion of a box coming from the ground 


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## trentonmakes (Mar 21, 2017)

3DDesign said:


> Main reason is the box needs to be above the water level.


That a deck box for the pool light, lights!

It has water in the conduit, why it needs to be certain height above pool.



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## trentonmakes (Mar 21, 2017)

We put a 4x4 post and attach deckbox to it then add an outlet and a switch.

We place ours next to the pool equipment pad alongside the panel.












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## MechanicalDVR (Dec 29, 2007)

I'm very surprised how many guys were unaware of the height requirement here, this is far from anything new.


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## MechanicalDVR (Dec 29, 2007)

Glock23gp said:


> Tubing cutter is the easiest or the green handle Greenlee ratcheting pvc cutters reaming it slow as you click it every couple turns until just before it breaks
> 
> Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-N910A using Tapatalk


A tubing cutter or ratchet cutter would be absolutely useless on three conduits so close together.


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## macmikeman (Jan 23, 2007)

I don't care for that particular type of pool j-box, I'm more of a brassy kind of guy.


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## MechanicalDVR (Dec 29, 2007)

macmikeman said:


> I don't care for that particular type of pool j-box, I'm more of a brassy kind of guy.


Which is also the popular route in the NJ area.


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## trentonmakes (Mar 21, 2017)

What we di with the deck boxes.
This is a small basic pool with just a couple breakers and a timer in the panel.

Ill grab some pics of the more fancier panels next time.









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## MechanicalDVR (Dec 29, 2007)

trentonmakes said:


> What we di with the deck boxes.
> This is a small basic pool with just a couple breakers and a timer in the panel.
> 
> Ill grab some pics of the more fancier panels next time.
> ...


That post looks crooked! :001_unsure:


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## telsa (May 22, 2015)

MechanicalDVR said:


> I'm very surprised how many guys were unaware of the height requirement here, this is far from anything new.


I never touched a pool in my life. So, it's new to me. 

But I had enough moxxie to inquire with the manufacturer... something that I always do when I see strange, listed, materials.


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## MechanicalDVR (Dec 29, 2007)

telsa said:


> I never touched a pool in my life. So, it's new to me.
> 
> But I had enough moxxie to inquire with the manufacturer... something that I always do when I see strange, listed, materials.


I'd figure in Cali you'd have seen and or been around many pool installs.


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## trentonmakes (Mar 21, 2017)

MechanicalDVR said:


> That post looks crooked! :001_unsure:


It probaly is! Lol

Theres just a little dirt to support it. Need to leave the trench open for inspector to do his thing....good news!!!

Trench and bonding passed👍

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## MechanicalDVR (Dec 29, 2007)

trentonmakes said:


> It probaly is! Lol
> 
> Theres just a little dirt to support it. Need to leave the trench open for inspector to do his thing....good news!!!
> 
> ...


I had to bust your chops a little or it wouldn't be me.


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## Switched (Dec 23, 2012)

MechanicalDVR said:


> I'd figure in Cali you'd have seen and or been around many pool installs.


I don't know a single EC that does pools.... I have upgraded services for a pool install, installed new sub panels, but the pool contractors always have some in-house person or damn cheap guy that does the actual pool work.


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## MechanicalDVR (Dec 29, 2007)

Switched said:


> I don't know a single EC that does pools.... I have upgraded services for a pool install, installed new sub panels, but the pool contractors always have some in-house person or damn cheap guy that does the actual pool work.


I'd also kind of figure that out there cheap ECs are a known carcinogen and would be outlawed by now!:laughing:


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## macmikeman (Jan 23, 2007)

Pool wiring - $6,000 dollars. Hurry, this price can't last for long and will have to go up due to new electrical code equal potential bonding grid requirements every stinking cycle.


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## Drsparky14 (Oct 22, 2016)

3DDesign said:


> Main reason is the box needs to be above the water level.




4" above the water level 


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## Drsparky14 (Oct 22, 2016)

3DDesign said:


> Depending on the light, they can be ordered with up to 100 ft of cord. Run new conduit to a remote location.




If you change the light to low voltage LED then you won't need that box above pool level 


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## MechanicalDVR (Dec 29, 2007)

Drsparky14 said:


> If you change the light to low voltage LED then you won't need that box above pool level


Is there any code reference for that?


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## frenchelectrican (Mar 15, 2007)

Drsparky14 said:


> If you change the light to low voltage LED then you won't need that box above pool level
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Personally I dont like that kind of idea with that.

Ya should know some inspectors will knock on your door pretty hard on that item.

Do you have something to back up that statement ?? 

I am sure you will need the pool light rated junction box no matter which type light source or voltage it is .,, ya need it anyway.


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## matt1124 (Aug 23, 2011)

I changed a pool light the other day, the juction box was flush with the concrete. Had an o-ring seal on the lid and was jam packed with duct seal.


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## Drsparky14 (Oct 22, 2016)

MechanicalDVR said:


> Is there any code reference for that?




I will look it up when I get back to the office. 


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## NDC (Jan 12, 2016)

Sleeve the wires with a piece of emt and cut away


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## Drsparky14 (Oct 22, 2016)

NDC said:


> Sleeve the wires with a piece of emt and cut away




That's really smart, I've actually never thought of that. Kudos 


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## matt1124 (Aug 23, 2011)

NDC said:


> Sleeve the wires with a piece of emt and cut away


You win. That's incredible


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## NDC (Jan 12, 2016)

Yep sleeve with EMT and use a cable saw. Quick and easy.


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## Drsparky14 (Oct 22, 2016)

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## A Little Short (Nov 11, 2010)

Drsparky14 said:


> 4" above the water level
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


It's 8" above normal water level.
4" above deck of pool


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