# Switch locked out...still shocked.



## RIVETER (Sep 26, 2009)

I know that this is an unusual post/thread. But has anyone been shocked, even with the disconnect turned off and locked out?


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## EDM (Nov 3, 2009)

RIVETER said:


> I know that this is an unusual post/thread. But has anyone been shocked, even with the disconnect turned off and locked out?


Of course, anything from capacitors to bastard splices down the line.

What does this have to do with union topics?


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## nolabama (Oct 3, 2007)

No I have not, and the only situation I can see where this would happen is if the circuit was feed from two directions. Highly unlikely.


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## nolabama (Oct 3, 2007)

EDM said:


> Of course, anything from capacitors to bastard splices down the line.
> 
> What does this have to do with union topics?


I stand corrected - did not consider capacitors.


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

Not when the circuit was off and locked, but *power to the building turned off:*











Large wires are the mains coming in. Go figure.










Probably some rat wired it.


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## cdnelectrician (Mar 14, 2008)

Wouldn't you test the circuit in question even if the switch is locked out before putting your hands anywhere near it?


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## cdnelectrician (Mar 14, 2008)

480sparky said:


> Not when the circuit was off and locked, but *power to the building turned off:*
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 How did this happen????


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## RIVETER (Sep 26, 2009)

*locked out...still shocked*



EDM said:


> Of course, anything from capacitors to bastard splices down the line.
> 
> What does this have to do with union topics?


I am really into the safety at our plant. Sharing experiences could possibly enlighten others as to the possibilities that seem impossible. That's all.


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## EDM (Nov 3, 2009)

RIVETER said:


> I am really into the safety at our plant. Sharing experiences could possibly enlighten others as to the possibilities that seem impossible. That's all.


All I am saying is that you should have put it in one of the electrical forums.


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## RIVETER (Sep 26, 2009)

*Locked out...still shocked*



EDM said:


> All I am saying is that you should have put it in one of the electrical forums.


Maybe you are right. Have you ever experienced a situation such as this?


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## nolabama (Oct 3, 2007)

This is not in the safety forum?
480 - barring a rat wiring the house, how did this happen?


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## EDM (Nov 3, 2009)

RIVETER said:


> Maybe you are right. Have you ever experienced a situation such as this?


Such as what?


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## RIVETER (Sep 26, 2009)

*locked out...still shocked*



nolabama said:


> This is not in the safety forum?
> 480 - barring a rat wiring the house, how did this happen?


It seems simple enough to me now but when it occurred it seemed a bit strange.
I was working on an underground sump pump at a power house. It was a pit out in the open. The service drop was about 100 yards from the pit; rest of the way...underground. I turned the disconnect at the drop, off and locked it out. At the pit I was getting ready to verify that the supply was, indeed OFF.
Somehow my knuckle contacted the line side of the maint. disconnect and I felt a definite shock. I brought my simpson meter over to measure. On the line side of the maint. disconnect, I had something like 80 volts on the A phase...95volts...on the B phase, and 95volts on C phase.
I went over to the service drop and opened the disconnect that I had previously LOCKED OUT. It turned out to be a FUSED disconnect. Some water trickled out but what I noticed was the large amount of condensation all over the inside of the disconnect, including the fuses.
I measured the LOAD side of THAT disconnect and the voltages were the same as before...with it locked out.
The moisture had become a Path, of sorts with very low current carrying capabilities, but a good shock.


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

cdnelectrician said:


> How did this happen????





nolabama said:


> This is not in the safety forum?
> 480 - barring a rat wiring the house, how did this happen?


It was in a duplex, and the meter was pulled for the one side I was replacing the panel in. I can only assume there was a circuit that was tied into both panels so both tenants paid their half for the house lighting.

I didn't want to bother finding out, so I just capped off the hot and left it in the new panel.


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## RIVETER (Sep 26, 2009)

*locked out...still shocked*



cdnelectrician said:


> Wouldn't you test the circuit in question even if the switch is locked out before putting your hands anywhere near it?


Absolutely!


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## nolabama (Oct 3, 2007)

480sparky said:


> It was in a duplex, and the meter was pulled for the one side I was replacing the panel in. I can only assume there was a circuit that was tied into both panels so both tenants paid their half for the house lighting.
> 
> I didn't want to bother finding out, so I just capped off the hot and left it in the new panel.


Well, clearly no union man wired that duplex.
I once had a carpenter tell me the first thing he does when renting a new apartment is to turn all the breakers off and see if any outlets are still hot. If he found one he would run an extension cord to his fridge. :laughing:


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## RIVETER (Sep 26, 2009)

*locked out...still shocked*



nolabama said:


> Well, clearly no union man wired that duplex.
> I once had a carpenter tell me the first thing he does when renting a new apartment is to turn all the breakers off and see if any outlets are still hot. If he found one he would run an extension cord to his fridge. :laughing:


He WOOD.


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## EDM (Nov 3, 2009)

nolabama said:


> Well, clearly no union man wired that duplex.
> I once had a carpenter tell me the first thing he does when renting a new apartment is to turn all the breakers off and see if any outlets are still hot. If he found one he would run an extension cord to his fridge. :laughing:


I had a friend who did the EXACT same thing, only he ran a cord to his window air conditioner and blasted it at 65 degrees 24/7 for the whole first month he was there (it was August).

His bill was over $400 (it's usually around $100 for that time of year in his size place).

We found out that altho that receptacle wasn't fed from the panel in his unit, it was fed from a panel downstairs that was on his meter and covered some of the circuits in his unit.


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## cdnelectrician (Mar 14, 2008)

EDM said:


> I had a friend who did the EXACT same thing, only he ran a cord to his window air conditioner and blasted it at 65 degrees 24/7 for the whole first month he was there (it was August).
> 
> His bill was over $400 (it's usually around $100 for that time of year in his size place).
> 
> We found out that altho that receptacle wasn't fed from the panel in his unit, it was fed from a panel downstairs that was on his meter and covered some of the circuits in his unit.


 
Hahahaha oh sh!t


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## drsparky (Nov 13, 2008)

I worked on a house that once belonged to a "wise guy", it had 20 two lamp flood lights with motion sensors covering the perimeter of the house. The new home owner wanted to remove them because they were ugly. I followed the conduit to the panel, shut off the breaker and they were still hot. I followed the conduit around the house and found the second panel. The security lights were fed from two panels both using breaker #1. I guess he was afraid of getting “whacked”.


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## nolabama (Oct 3, 2007)

rat test

pass


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## MF Dagger (Dec 24, 2007)

I didn't get shocked but I blew up a pair of ***** on a house that we had the meter pulled to once a long time ago. It was a single family home but at one point in the past it had been connected to the house next door by a tunnel that was bricked off and had stuff built in front of it.


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## user5941 (Mar 16, 2009)

I have seen a 3 phase disconnects that will leave a phase on that is why in UNION safety training you are taught to check the circuit before touching it.


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## EBFD6 (Aug 17, 2008)

rewire said:


> I have seen a 3 phase disconnects that will leave a phase on that is why in UNION safety training you are taught to check the circuit before touching it.


Wow, you union guys are really smart. No, rat worker would ever think of that. Plus I can't afford a meter on my minimum wage paycheck, and my boss won't supply one because if something happens to me he can just send one of my backstabbing rat co-workers to finish the job. Just as long as we don't interrupt him counting all of his money he made by taking advantage of us non-union dummies.:whistling2:


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

rewire said:


> I have seen a 3 phase disconnects that will leave a phase on that is why in UNION safety training you are taught to check the circuit before touching it.


Weird. I've seen the same thing happen on both single-phase and three-phase disconnects. I guess union electricians only work on three-phase stuff.

Maybe I should join the union so I can become smart. 

If I join the union, will I need to supply my own brain, or will one be provided for me? 

If I need to supply my own, anyone know where I can get one? :blink: Do they have them at the supply house, or do I need to order one on-line? How much are they?:laughing:

Or, should I just get in the habit of pulling one of those knives out of my back and use it to short out a circuit to make sure it's off?


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## nolabama (Oct 3, 2007)

Boy I wish I could afford me some union safety class. I gotta get by with common sense and teaching myownself. And with Zog as my saftey man i dont feel to bad.


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## user5941 (Mar 16, 2009)

nolabama said:


> Boy I wish I could afford me some union safety class. I gotta get by with common sense and teaching myownself. And with Zog as my saftey man i dont feel to bad.


 Well somebody has to be in the what not to do videos


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## nolabama (Oct 3, 2007)

rewire said:


> Well somebody has to be in the what not to do videos


and that guy will be me for my photo i put up in another thread


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## MF Dagger (Dec 24, 2007)

rewire said:


> I have seen a 3 phase disconnects that will leave a phase on that is why in UNION safety training you are taught to check the circuit before touching it.


Is that before or after they teach you how to be an arrogant prick to everyone not in the union?


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## bobelectric (Feb 24, 2007)

Howzabout guys barehanding a charged cable on a shut down? Power off,nobody drained cable.


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## william1978 (Sep 21, 2008)

Why is this in the union section?


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

william1978 said:


> Why is this in the union section?


Because........... you can never get shocked in the union?:laughing:


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## william1978 (Sep 21, 2008)

480sparky said:


> Because........... you can never get shocked in the union?:laughing:


 Only rat's huh?


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## william1978 (Sep 21, 2008)

nolabama said:


> rat test
> 
> pass


 :laughing:


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## RIVETER (Sep 26, 2009)

*Switched lock out----------*



william1978 said:


> Why is this in the union section?


Can't totally explain why; ask something about unions.


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## william1978 (Sep 21, 2008)

rewire said:


> I have seen a 3 phase disconnects that will leave a phase on that is why in UNION safety training you are taught to check the circuit before touching it.


 Isn't that just common sense?


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## william1978 (Sep 21, 2008)

480sparky said:


> If I need to supply my own, anyone know where I can get one? :blink: Do they have them at the supply house, or do I need to order one on-line? How much are they?:laughing:


 Check Walmart they still had a few left the last time I looked.:whistling2:


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## william1978 (Sep 21, 2008)

nolabama said:


> and that guy will be me for my photo i put up in another thread


 2x12 and some ladders????:laughing:


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## RIVETER (Sep 26, 2009)

*Locked out..still shocked*



william1978 said:


> Isn't that just common sense?


To us, OLDER guys, it does seem like common sense to check for voltage after locking out. But, the bottom line for a person who goes through life turning the light switch off and the light goes out...turning off the range, and it quits cooking...turning off the ignition switch, and the cars dies,it is not JUST A COMMON SENSE thing. It has to be TAUGHT...and TAUGHT again until it becomes second nature.


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

william1978 said:


> Isn't that just common sense?


 
Yeah, but only for 3-phase discos when worked on by union electricians. Us poor, stupid rats check single-phase discos as well.:tongue_smilie:


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## william1978 (Sep 21, 2008)

RIVETER said:


> To us, OLDER guys, it does seem like common sense to check for voltage after locking out. But, the bottom line for a person who goes through life turning the light switch off and the light goes out...turning off the range, and it quits cooking...turning off the ignition switch, and the cars dies,it is not JUST A COMMON SENSE thing. It has to be TAUGHT...and TAUGHT again until it becomes second nature.


You can't teach common sense. It doesn't matter if you are old or young, Union or RAT.


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## RIVETER (Sep 26, 2009)

*Locked out ...still shocked*



william1978 said:


> You can't teach common sense. It doesn't matter if you are old or young, Union or RAT.


You are right, common sense probably cannot be taught. But safety rules can be.
By the way, this union/rat, thing even though I don't engage it, you guys have, at least established lines of communication. If I did not like someone I wouldn't bother.
You possibly have something in common...like a family to support.


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## mattsilkwood (Sep 21, 2008)

What the hell did I miss? If you union guys have to teach someone to check for power before you go poking around in something, then I don't want you working anywhere around me. I bet you guys never hit your finger with a hammer either huh.


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## nolabama (Oct 3, 2007)

william1978 said:


> 2x12 and some ladders????:laughing:


It was three ladders I'll have you know. If you would like something that really works put in a pic like the one of me and some other stupid acts and when the guys are laughing start rolling with ones from your own shop and see how many of the guys think safety is a laughing matter then.(thats a run on sentence spellin natzies)


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## RIVETER (Sep 26, 2009)

*Locked out...still shocked*



mattsilkwood said:


> What the hell did I miss? If you union guys have to teach someone to check for power before you go poking around in something, then I don't want you working anywhere around me. I bet you guys never hit your finger with a hammer either huh.


Come on Matt...by the way, glad to hear from you again. When you are training youngsters,early 20s, I KNOW that you think of their safety...and I know that you train them how to work safely.


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

nolabama said:


> ...... spellin natzies)


Nazis.


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## RIVETER (Sep 26, 2009)

*Locked out...still shocked*



mattsilkwood said:


> What the hell did I miss? If you union guys have to teach someone to check for power before you go poking around in something, then I don't want you working anywhere around me. I bet you guys never hit your finger with a hammer either huh.


Hey Matt, I think that I've finally gotten this PMing thing figured out. The results are in about the PF thing I'll let you know later privately.


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## william1978 (Sep 21, 2008)

Shhhhh. It is top secret.


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## bobelectric (Feb 24, 2007)

cdnelectrician said:


> Wouldn't you test the circuit in question even if the switch is locked out before putting your hands anywhere near it?


 It's pretty light in there for the electric being off. I don't see any flash shadow from a camera!


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## rdr (Oct 25, 2009)

bobelectric said:


> It's pretty light in there for the electric being off. I don't see any flash shadow from a camera!


Never tapped a temporary off the meter can to run some work lights? Just my speculation.....


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## traveler (Sep 15, 2009)

Yep. Was working in a heat plant as a first year cubbie. The JW killed all the power to the building, I was working on a ladder and bit into a neutral with my strippers....got a nice jolt. 

The JW did some tracing, and there was a small conduit entering the building from an adjacent building. They brought the power for that circuit over from the other building.

On a military base. Must have been someone's great idea. 

~Joe


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