# Stapling romex...



## kevmanTA

Eldredgejason said:


> Can you use a staple gun to support romex? I am an apprentice in school right now, just incase this sounds like a dumb question. I just want to be as fast and efficient and hit the ground running when I come into the job market.


A normal staple gun.. No.

I have a GB Stapler thing that looks like a staple gun, but uses nylon/steel staples, it wasn't worth the sale price of 4.99, better off using a hammer, and the Ideal Nylon staples, much faster.


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## Shockdoc

I'm old school non insulated NM staples. Stapling goes fast if ........you sink a staple about a foot away from where it enters a span, pull it tight to opposing side, sink another staple about a foot away from where it exits span, sink staples about every 4' in between first and last.


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## Bkessler

kevmanTA said:


> A normal staple gun.. No.
> 
> I have a GB Stapler thing that looks like a staple gun, but uses nylon/steel staples, it wasn't worth the sale price of 4.99, better off using a hammer, and the Ideal Nylon staples, much faster.


I have the Arrow one and it's not bad for real tight crawlspaces. But that is it.


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## kevmanTA

Bkessler said:


> I have the Arrow one and it's not bad for real tight crawlspaces. But that is it.


The GB one is a nightmare to squeeze, and it doesn't push the staple in nearly enough, so the wire can still be moved.


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## HARRY304E

Shockdoc said:


> I'm old school non insulated NM staples. Stapling goes fast if ........you sink a staple about a foot away from where it enters a span, pull it tight to opposing side, sink another staple about a foot away from where it exits span, sink staples about every 4' in between first and last.


In mass we have to use insulated staples by code i use the ARROW T-72...http://www.amazon.com/Arrow-Wire-Cable-Staple-T72/dp/B000KLTELK


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## gilbequick

HARRY304E said:


> In mass we have to use insulated staples by code i use the ARROW T-72...http://www.amazon.com/Arrow-Wire-Cable-Staple-T72/dp/B000KLTELK


Does that one get snug enough to hold the wire from moving around?


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## RobTownfold64

I have the Arrow T-75. I like it, I've used it a lot. It usually doesn't drive the staple all the way into the romex so it's still loose a bit, but if you need it tight, just run back with your hammer and give them a tap.


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## HARRY304E

gilbequick said:


> Does that one get snug enough to hold the wire from moving around?


 Yes it does..


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## 480sparky

Arrow T75 all day long here.











But you must use special staples, though.


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## Grimlock

kevmanTA said:


> A normal staple gun.. No.
> 
> I have a GB Stapler thing that looks like a staple gun, but uses nylon/steel staples, it wasn't worth the sale price of 4.99, better off using a hammer, and the Ideal Nylon staples, much faster.


 
I rewired a house built in 1922 last summer and man I had some TIGHT crawl spaces. I bought one of those GB staple guns and it worked pretty good for that particular project, aside from jamming from time to time. For the most part I still use a hammer with standard staples. If I need to staple in a tight area and don't want to lug the hammer, staples and whatever else I need I grab the GB stapler. 

It’s an OK staple gun but there is probably something better out there.


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## KayJay

MA 334.30 allows use of listed noninsulated staples driven with a staple gun. The Arrow T75 staples are UL listed, although I don't use them very often myself.


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## 480sparky

KayJay said:


> MA 334.30 allows use of listed noninsulated staples driven with a staple gun. The Arrow T75 staples are UL listed, although I don't use them very often myself.


I don't get it. If they're UL listed and installed properly, they would first have to _disallow_ them.... _then_ they could reverse gears and allow them.


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## KayJay

480sparky said:


> I don't get it. If they're UL listed and installed properly, they would first have to _disallow_ them.... _then_ they could reverse gears and allow them.


I’m not sure I follow, but in MA, with NM cables smaller than 8/3, we have to use insulated staples. They allow noninsulated staples with those size cables only if they are listed and driven by a staple gun, like the T75. You can only use the regular noninsulated staples that are driven with a hammer on cables size 8/3 and larger NM.


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## 480sparky

KayJay said:


> I’m not sure I follow, but in MA, with NM cables smaller than 8/3, we have to use insulated staples. They allow noninsulated staples with those size cables only if they are listed and driven by a staple gun, like the T75. You can only use the regular noninsulated staples that are driven with a hammer on cables size 8/3 and larger NM.


So, if UL approves a method, MA needs to somehow approve it as well?


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## KayJay

480sparky said:


> So, if UL approves a method, MA needs to somehow approve it as well?


Well, 334.30 in the NEC doesn’t require insulated staples to be used with NM cables, but it is revised in the MA Electric Code [MEC]. Apparently it’s their way of not allowing someone to use a T50 stapler or regular noninsulated staples for this.


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## 480sparky

KayJay said:


> Well, 334.30 in the NEC doesn’t require insulated staples to be used with NM cables, but it is revised in the MA Electric Code [MEC]. Apparently it’s their way of not allowing someone to use a T50 stapler or regular noninsulated staples for this.



In short, they have to amend their rules to disallow something that's not UL listed to begin with.

Dat's da gubbamint at werk!


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## KayJay

480sparky said:


> In short, they have to amend their rules to disallow something that's not UL listed to begin with.
> 
> Dat's da gubbamint at werk!


Yeah, I suppose if someone was to use rusty nails bent over their NM cables smaller than 8/3, maybe it doesn’t matter, but if they used staples, then the rules would seem to apply.


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## electricalperson

i hate the staplers for romex. it looks like ****


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## B4T

I put around (8) insulated staples in the same hand as my hammer..

Pull tight with your left and hammer with your right.. keep the wire nice and tight..

Staple guns are for insulators and roofers..


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## 480sparky

B4T said:


> I put around (8) insulated staples in the same hand as my hammer..
> 
> Pull tight with your left and hammer with your right.. keep the wire nice and tight..
> 
> Staple guns are for insulators and roofers..


By the time you get those 8 staples in your hand, I'm done.:whistling2:


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## B4T

480sparky said:


> By the time you get those 8 staples in your hand, I'm done.:whistling2:


But is the wire nice and tight.. the way it is when the _right_ method is used.. :whistling2::laughing:


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## doubleoh7

Staples? Around here it is not unusual to see NM jobs without a single staple. Just the cable thrown around all over the place like extension cords. It is the kind of sh&t I am competing against.


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## 480sparky

B4T said:


> But is the wire nice and tight.. the way it is when the _right_ method is used.. :whistling2::laughing:


UL listed is UL listed.

The difference is I'm depositing the check, you're still bangin' purty staples in like you're gonna win an art show.


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## TOOL_5150

I just tape romex to studs and joists.

~Matt


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## gilbequick

TOOL_5150 said:


> I just tape romex to studs and joists.
> 
> ~Matt


You know, I've often wondered if that would pass an inspection as long as the spacing from the stud's edge is maintained.


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## e57

In these places requiring insulated staples - what do they use to justify that?

Where does it require a listed product to support NM cable?


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## TOOL_5150

gilbequick said:


> You know, I've often wondered if that would pass an inspection as long as the spacing from the stud's edge is maintained.


It would. :thumbsup:

1 wrap around the wire, so it will stay in the middle of the stud, then 2-3 wraps around the stud. Good to go.

~Matt


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## robnj772

I think the person making the laws in MA owns stock in an insulated staple company


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## nitro71

I'm interested in that Arrow Stapler. Does it do well on the OSB style floor joices? You can tighten your NM up on corners. I'd rather see a hair loose that to tight on it.


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## nitro71

480sparky said:


> By the time you get those 8 staples in your hand, I'm done.:whistling2:


Can you get two NM under one staple with it?


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## 480sparky

nitro71 said:


> Can you get two NM under one staple with it?



Stack 'em like anyone else does.


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## RobTownfold64

nitro71 said:


> I'm interested in that Arrow Stapler. Does it do well on the OSB style floor joices? You can tighten your NM up on corners. I'd rather see a hair loose that to tight on it.


I never tried it, but I think it would.


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## nitro71

480, hows the price of staples for that thing compare to Viking staples by the bucket? 

I'm stapling my next NM job. My thumb will thank me and it looks fast.


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