# Round Box in Exterior Brick Wall



## A Little Short (Nov 11, 2010)

I know how to cut brick out for a single gang receptacle, but I would like to know the best way to cut out for a round box for flush mount.

Customer wants lights on either side of his garage door and would prefer them be flush mounted. Would you drill out the circle like you would for a s.g. box? Or is there a better method? Please share your tricks?


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## Dennis Alwon (May 9, 2009)

I usually will cut a switch box in for the wall lights depending on the weight of the sconce. Look at 314.27(A) exception


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

Little-Lectric said:


> I know how to cut brick out for a single gang receptacle, but I would like to know the best way to cut out for a round box for flush mount.
> 
> Customer wants lights on either side of his garage door and would prefer them be flush mounted. Would you drill out the circle like you would for a s.g. box? Or is there a better method? Please share your tricks?



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Part Number 8161TR Description Siding Mounting Kits w/ Threaded Openings UPC 01899700878 Unit Pkg 1pc Standard Pkg 10pcs Country of Origin







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## A Little Short (Nov 11, 2010)

Dennis Alwon said:


> I usually will cut a switch box in for the wall lights depending on the weight of the sconce. Look at 314.27(A) exception


Will the holes for mounting the light be the same, meaning probably the metal strap?


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

HARRY304E said:


> *Siding* Mounting Blocks
> 
> 
> 
> ...




For brick?


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## McClary’s Electrical (Feb 21, 2009)

HARRY304E said:


> Siding Mounting Blocks
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
Siding blocks on brick....hhhmhmmmmm:blink:


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## McClary’s Electrical (Feb 21, 2009)

Little-Lectric said:


> Will the holes for mounting the light be the same, meaning probably the metal strap?


 

Just use the box for your splice, anchor the crossboar straight to the brick


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## oldtimer (Jun 10, 2010)

mcclary's electrical said:


> Just use the box for your splice, anchor the crossboar straight to the brick


I think you meant CROSSBAR, and I M O that is hack!


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## McClary’s Electrical (Feb 21, 2009)

oldtimer said:


> I think you meant CROSSBAR, and I M O that is hack!


 
No, it would be more hack to support it off a switch box and 6/32's. Use the switch box for the wirenut joint, but anchor the bar to the brick.


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

mcclary's electrical said:


> Just use the box for your splice, anchor the crossboar straight to the brick



Those boxes are much larger than the canopy that's going to be against them..... you think the crossbar is larger than that?


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## MechanicalDVR (Dec 29, 2007)

mcclary's electrical said:


> No, it would be more hack to support it off a switch box and 6/32's. Use the switch box for the wirenut joint, but anchor the bar to the brick.


 
So the other billion or so fixtures hung on crossbars attached with 6/32s to a box are hack?


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## McClary’s Electrical (Feb 21, 2009)

480sparky said:


> Those boxes are much larger than the canopy that's going to be against them..... you think the crossbar is larger than that?


 
Box vertical, bar horizontal.


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## McClary’s Electrical (Feb 21, 2009)

MechanicalDVR said:


> So the other billion or so fixtures hung on crossbars attached with 6/32s to a box are hack?


 

Yes......


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

mcclary's electrical said:


> Box vertical, bar horizontal.


How do you mount a round box vertical? :001_huh:


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## McClary’s Electrical (Feb 21, 2009)

480sparky said:


> How do you mount a round box vertical? :001_huh:


 

Dennis said use a switch box.. That's how we got into this conversation. A round box has 8/32's. Keep up ol man


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## Amish Electrician (Jan 2, 2010)

I haven't tried it for this specific application, but ...

This just might be a job for a multi-master with a carbide grit blade.


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## Dennis Alwon (May 9, 2009)

Little-Lectric said:


> Will the holes for mounting the light be the same, meaning probably the metal strap?


It should work fine. I usually mount it vertically but I would like to have the fixture in hand. You might also be able to use a pancake box.


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

mcclary's electrical said:


> Dennis said use a switch box.. That's how we got into this conversation. A round box has 8/32's. Keep up ol man



I'm sorry. Round boxes got thrown in there _last_, so I thought that's what we were discussing..... not the square boxes mentioned _BEFORE _the round boxes.

Is that what you call 'keeping up'?


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## Big John (May 23, 2010)

I always just used a masonry wheel on a cut-off tool to make a nice clean outline. 

Then a hammer-drill with a chisel tip to hollow it out and make minor size adjustments as need be.

-John


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## amptech (Sep 21, 2007)

Dennis Alwon said:


> It should work fine. I usually mount it vertically but I would like to have the fixture in hand. You might also be able to use a pancake box.


I have never mounted a switch box vertical in brick. Why would you? Wouldn't you be cutting into 2 bricks that way?


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## thegoldenboy (Aug 15, 2010)

4" octagon box going into brick to be flush... 4" dry core, if you have one at your disposal. Core to the depth of the box, drill out a hole somewhere for your cable to come through the back, secure it somehow given your situation.


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## Dennis Alwon (May 9, 2009)

amptech said:


> I have never mounted a switch box vertical in brick. Why would you? Wouldn't you be cutting into 2 bricks that way?


 Actually in most bricks and using a metal box you cut one brick in half and take the mortar out from the top and bottom and the box fits just fine.


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## thegoldenboy (Aug 15, 2010)

Dennis Alwon said:


> Actually in most bricks and using a metal box you cut one brick in half and take the mortar out from the top and bottom and the box fits just fine.


Shims and construction adhesives are our best friends when doing this.


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## A Little Short (Nov 11, 2010)

Dennis Alwon said:


> Actually in most bricks and using a metal box you cut one brick in half and take the mortar out from the top and bottom and the box fits just fine.


Why would it matter if it was cut horizontally or vertical?


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## thegoldenboy (Aug 15, 2010)

Little-Lectric said:


> Why would it matter if it was cut horizontally or vertical?


In your case, it wouldn't. But if you had to cut a switch into existing brick, what Dennis said could come in handy.


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## bobelectric (Feb 24, 2007)

Dennis Alwon said:


> It should work fine. I usually mount it vertically but I would like to have the fixture in hand. You might also be able to use a pancake box.


 Saw this debate on another site where the conclusion was a pan wasn't rated for exterior duty .


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## McClary’s Electrical (Feb 21, 2009)

bobelectric said:


> Saw this debate on another site where the conclusion was a pan wasn't rated for exterior duty .


 

Doesn't have to be.


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## Hippie (May 12, 2011)

I don't see how screwing the bar to the wall instead of using 6/32s is better.. Either way a single gang box will work just fine with most fixtures unless it has a very tiny back plate.. I've used them lots of time with no problems with the box showing and the bar will match the mounting holes in the box


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## Dennis Alwon (May 9, 2009)

bobelectric said:


> Saw this debate on another site where the conclusion was a pan wasn't rated for exterior duty .


Not sure I ever did that but I could see that as a valid argument. Somehow with the fixture sealed on the top I don't feel that this would be a big issue but I do understand it.


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## randomkiller (Sep 28, 2007)

thegoldenboy said:


> Shims and construction adhesives are our best friends when doing this.


 
Just use a masonary box and hydraulic cement, you're good to go.


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## randomkiller (Sep 28, 2007)

Hippie said:


> I don't see how screwing the bar to the wall instead of using 6/32s is better.. Either way a single gang box will work just fine with most fixtures unless it has a very tiny back plate.. I've used them lots of time with no problems with the box showing and the bar will match the mounting holes in the box


 
I normally put washers on 6-32s if the fixture is heavy and I don't want the crossbar to twist. If it's that big of a deal rethread the holes to 8-32s.
No sense in re engineering the wheel.


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## Cletis (Aug 20, 2010)

*nm*

just make sure you don't run deadly nm out of brick into a few of those instances above. They are not wet rated and it's not only against code but their could be a deadly fire igniting the brick, escepesially if their not on arc faults as well.


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## Cletis (Aug 20, 2010)

*P.S.*

Not that any of you would ever snub out nm to post lights on brick...:whistling2:

I use pan box with side hole punched out in case it's a rod mount fixture using center area for wire.


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## Bkessler (Feb 14, 2007)

Use the really small round metal boxes instead of the 4" ones. Done. I've done it a bunch of times.


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## bobelectric (Feb 24, 2007)

OK. The"Rock of the Marne" will find you.


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## McClary’s Electrical (Feb 21, 2009)

Dennis Alwon said:


> Not sure I ever did that but I could see that as a valid argument. Somehow with the fixture sealed on the top I don't feel that this would be a big issue but I do understand it.


 
If that were true, we would be required to run UF and FS boxes for outdoor lights.


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## randomkiller (Sep 28, 2007)

mcclary's electrical said:


> If that were true, we would be required to run UF and FS boxes for outdoor lights.


 
There is a difference in NM being run inside a wall to an exterior box and NM being run through a brick facsade. Not sure about out in hickville but in NYC there is no use of NM.


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## captkirk (Nov 21, 2007)

if the brick is soft you can probably get away with a hammer and chisle if you got the time or a round four inch hammer bit. I would also be curious if a remi grit hole saw can get it done..


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## Amish Electrician (Jan 2, 2010)

I've used the Remington carbide grit saws on brick many times ... but I haven't seen any large enough for a box.


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## McClary’s Electrical (Feb 21, 2009)

Amish Electrician said:


> I've used the Remington carbide grit saws on brick many times ... but I haven't seen any large enough for a box.


Why wouldn't the 4" fit?


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## A Little Short (Nov 11, 2010)

With all the suggestions for type/mounting of a box for the lights, I can't seem to find the best way to do it. I think what would be better would be for 1 or more of you to come down/up here to show me!:thumbup::laughing:


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