# Counterfeit breakers



## erics37 (May 7, 2009)

I bet they're just molded case toggle switches. No over current elements at all :laughing:


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## MDShunk (Jan 7, 2007)

erics37 said:


> I bet they're just molded case toggle switches. No over current elements at all :laughing:


Hard to say. This particular company even has entire counterfeit panels on their site. The CH ones I saw were modeled after a 30-year old, obsolete CH design. I have some counterfeit square d breakers from the Scott Electric recall several years back. I should start getting samples from these Chinese guys as they show up. Seems like it would be a neat collection. Never thought about it before. So many missed opportunities now.


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## erics37 (May 7, 2009)

It would be interesting to dissect a normal breaker and its counterfeit analog and see what the differences are.


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## MDShunk (Jan 7, 2007)

Sorta what I was thinking


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## niteshift (Nov 21, 2007)

Chinese products pretty much suck. Always did hopfully they always will.

Competition in the market place from lowest quality to highest breeds imitation. Chinese made is not a good thing. 
They use chemicals that have been banned/outlawed in making their products, they put the chit in food products. 
Like your idea about the collection. I collect machine name plates. Not many yet.


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## Amish Electrician (Jan 2, 2010)

Let us know what you find when you open an AFCI. I wouldn't be surprised to learn that the 'test' button was just an 'off' switch.


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## Zog (Apr 15, 2009)

erics37 said:


> It would be interesting to dissect a normal breaker and its counterfeit analog and see what the differences are.


Usually not much, what often happens is the OEM contracts a plant in China to make a certian number of a specific breaker, after that run is complete they open bidding for another batch. So lets say a plant in India wins the next contract, now you have a factory in China all set up with equipment and people to make a specific breaker. Often they just keep making them, but without the oversight of them OEM, so they may or may not substitute lower quality materials, and/or lower QA standards, etc..

These breakers, made in the same plant bu the same people as the "real" ones end up on the market and are considered "counterfiet". Often these are identical to the real ones and the best way to tell is by the source of purchase, and if the price is too good to be true. OEMs are starting to use some high tech methods to ID real ones, such as hologram stickers and chips planted that can be scanned to authenticate.


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## Big John (May 23, 2010)

The other day I went to get some Square D breakers and the damn supply-house's stock was a bunch of no-name breakers. They look exactly like Square D, and they were advertised as an acceptable replacement. 

I wouldn't quite call them "counterfeit" because nobody was trying to pretend they were a Square-D product. But after reading Zog's description, it makes me wonder if that's not exactly where they came from: Extra runs from a real "Square D" plant.

-John


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## Forsythe (Feb 6, 2012)

To my knowledge, QO breakers are still made in the US & Mexico and not sure if they still make them over in Scotland or not. Even if they advertise for use in SqD panel, SqD and UL won't approve. 

Part number SK5471M is a QO-AFI breaker with one side clear to see inside rather than waste time breaking one apart. Not sure if you can "order" per se, so talk to local rep about getting a sample. 

SK5471F is a QO120 with one side clear for a standard breaker. Runs around $15-20, I think.


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## Zog (Apr 15, 2009)

Stumbled across this today

http://ebookbrowse.com/dec2011-schneider-electric-pr-pdf-d294095349


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## 8V71 (Dec 23, 2011)

We have a UL inspector visit every so often and they want us to keep component packaging and boxes around so they can inspect the hologram seals with their special viewer. Even the UL label is being counterfeited......sad chit.


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