# Color coding wires??



## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

Voltech said:


> If I have some #10's and 12's that are red and Blue, can those be phased to a different color? Anything in the NEC that would not allow this?
> 
> We found out today that we are getting a high leg system, I want to just phase my red to orange, but the EE saying that this is not allowed, and only black wires can be phased?


No he is wrong.


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## NolaTigaBait (Oct 19, 2008)

Why re-color...It can be orange or any distinguishable color.Read 230.56


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## backstay (Feb 3, 2011)

I don't see it in the code. Did he give you a ref #? It's good to ask, keeps people honest.


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## Voltech (Nov 30, 2009)

backstay said:


> I don't see it in the code. Did he give you a ref #? It's good to ask, keeps people honest.


No he would not, I told him I would put the the black wire on the hig leg "B" and phase it to orange. and use red as "A" and Blue as "C".

I just want him to show me in the code book where it says you can not phase a colored wire. you can only phase a black wire.


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## NolaTigaBait (Oct 19, 2008)

Voltech said:


> No he would not, I told him I would put the the black wire on the hig leg "B" and phase it to orange. and use red as "A" and Blue as "C".
> 
> I just want him to show me in the code book where it says you can not phase a colored wire. you can only phase a black wire.


I believe you can do that with colored wire...It think it comes into play mainly with grounded/grounding conductors...


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## jwjrw (Jan 14, 2010)

(C) Identification of Ungrounded Conductors. Ungrounded
conductors shall be identified in accordance with
210.5(C)(1), (2), and (3).
(1) Application. Where the premises wiring system has
branch circuits supplied from more than one nominal voltage
system, each ungrounded conductor of a branch circuit
shall be identified by phase or line and system at all termination,
connection, and splice points.
(2) Means of Identification. The means of identification
shall be permitted to be by separate color coding, marking
tape, tagging, or other approved means.
(3) Posting of Identification Means. The method utilized
for conductors originating within each branch-circuit panelboard
or similar branch-circuit distribution equipment
shall be documented in a manner that is readily available or
shall be permanently posted at each branch-circuit panelboard
or similar branch-circuit distribution equipment.


As far as I know you can re identify ungrounded conductors.


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## kaboler (Dec 1, 2010)

American code, colour coding isn't mandatory, unlike canadian code, which it IS mandatory.

Could be that the high leg must be phase 1? That might be in US code.


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## rlc3854 (Dec 30, 2007)

Voltech said:


> We found out today that we are getting a high leg system, I want to just phase my red to orange, but the EE saying that this is not allowed, and only black wires can be phased?


Is the EE an employee of the company? Does he set policy for the electrical system?

I have seen so many different rules applied to color coding of conductors at different companies based on conductor size,voltage and system configuration.


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## Dennis Alwon (May 9, 2009)

kaboler said:


> American code, colour coding isn't mandatory, unlike canadian code, which it IS mandatory.
> 
> Could be that the high leg must be phase 1? That might be in US code.


Here is the NEC article



> 110.15 High-Leg Marking. On a 4-wire, delta-connected system where the midpoint of one phase winding is grounded, only the conductor or busbar having the higher phase voltage to ground shall be durably and permanently
> marked by an outer finish that is orange in color or by other effective means. Such identification shall be placed at each point on the system where a connection is made if the grounded conductor is also present.


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## jwjrw (Jan 14, 2010)

kaboler said:


> American code, colour coding isn't mandatory, unlike canadian code, which it IS mandatory.
> 
> Could be that the high leg must be phase 1? That might be in US code.



The high leg has to terminate to b phase. Poco always connects to the c phase in the ct here.


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## Voltech (Nov 30, 2009)

jwjrw said:


> The high leg has to terminate to b phase. *Poco always connects to the c phase in the ct here*.


Same here, but they dont call it "C", its known as the "one on the right" here in southern MS


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## Voltech (Nov 30, 2009)

rlc3854 said:


> Is the EE an employee of the company? Does he set policy for the electrical system?
> 
> I have seen so many different rules applied to color coding of conductors at different companies based on conductor size,voltage and system configuration.


No he does not work for us, he is the field EE guy for AE. Its his call in a way, but he says it code. They are a very messed up company the way they want something done.One thing that stands out, they want the panels numbered up and down, not left to right.

L1 #1 and 22
L2 #2 and 23
L3 #3 and 24

This is the reason I believe he is so picky with colors.


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## rlc3854 (Dec 30, 2007)

Voltech said:


> No he does not work for us, he is the field EE guy for AE. Its his call in a way, but he says it code. They are a very messed up company the way they want something done.One thing that stands out, they want the panels numbered up and down, not left to right.
> 
> L1 #1 and 22
> L2 #2 and 23
> ...


Yeah, I have seen that here in s.e. Louisiana too. Was working on a new school and the panel circuit numbers seemed to be all jacked up. When we started terminating there was no rhyme or reason for color on the breakers. Because of the circuit numbering some double pole circuits didn't make any sense either.


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## B W E (May 1, 2011)

I don't have the code reference, but I know it says you cannot tape a wire smaller than #4, for (I think) the purpose of phasing. I.E. You cannot use a roll of black to run a three phase circuit, and then apply red and blue tape accordingly, unless it is #4 or larger.


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## JmanAllen (Aug 3, 2011)

B W E said:


> I don't have the code reference, but I know it says you cannot tape a wire smaller than #4, for (I think) the purpose of phasing. I.E. You cannot use a roll of black to run a three phase circuit, and then apply red and blue tape accordingly, unless it is #4 or larger.


I've never seen that any where. It does not say they even have to be color coded just marked in some way


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## B W E (May 1, 2011)

JmanAllen said:


> I've never seen that any where. It does not say they even have to be color coded just marked in some way


I was halfway right..... 250.119.... Only GEC, and it has to be green if 6 or smaller. 4 or bigger you can put green tape on a black wire.


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## JmanAllen (Aug 3, 2011)

B W E said:


> I was halfway right..... 250.119.... Only GEC, and it has to be green if 6 or smaller. 4 or bigger you can put green tape on a black wire.


Ya that's right I didnt think about that I wasn't think about anything but the phases

Sent from my iPhone using ET Forum


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## AFOREMA1 (Nov 23, 2009)

Voltech said:


> Same here, but they dont call it "C", its known as the "one on the right" here in southern MS


I didn't think southerners new right from left :laughing:


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## jhall.sparky (Jun 14, 2011)

Voltech said:


> No he would not, I told him I would put the the black wire on the hig leg "B" and phase it to orange. and use red as "A" and Blue as "C".
> 
> I just want him to show me in the code book where it says you can not phase a colored wire. you can only phase a black wire.


the problem is your installing HIS system and thats the way HE wants it.

i just smile and nodd and then do what i do best make it work.

just dont draw attention to what you think is correct.

ive had engineers tell me the KNEW they were wrong and were glad i didnt make a stink of it. 

on a side note I had to show the at&t tech how to use HIS meter no biggie just glad to help.


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## jhall.sparky (Jun 14, 2011)

jwjrw said:


> (C) Identification of Ungrounded Conductors. Ungrounded
> conductors shall be identified in accordance with
> 210.5(C)(1), (2), and (3).
> (1) Application. Where the premises wiring system has
> ...


i like pink just seems like i cant ever find it anymore>............:laughing:


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## Sparkyand1 (Aug 9, 2011)

Try 215.12 (C), I think this might help you. :thumbsup:


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## Sparkyand1 (Aug 9, 2011)

I thought it was nothing smaller than a number 8 thhn, that was not allowed to be phased.


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## Voltech (Nov 30, 2009)

My understanding of what the NEC says is, you only have to use 3 colors. Orange, Green/green with a stripe and white/grey, everything else can be what every color you want, as long as its labeled and the same throughout the system


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