# Mitsu VFD question



## JRaef (Mar 23, 2009)

happytriger2000 said:


> Hi,
> I have a Mitsubishi FR A740 Inverter + a HSD spindle motor ( spec: http://www.hsdusa.com/viewdoc.asp?co_id=452) all wired up, using the current factory default setting on FR740 I test run the spindle, it did turn but not smoothly and there was sound coming out from the spindle. I was told that the parameters wasn't set correctly, as a new user to Mistu inverter is there anyone familiar with this inverter who can give me some tips on quick start setup?
> More info. on HSd spindle:
> http://i1220.photobucket.com/albums/dd459/happytriger2000/Spindle- Inverter/HSDinfo.jpg
> Thanks,


Well, I no longer have my Mitsi manuals and I'm too lazy to dig one up, but right off the top I see one big problem based on your post.

You have a motor designed for 380V 400Hz operation, then you say you have the VFD set to factory defaults. The factory defaults will be 50 or 60Hz, depending on whether it was made for the US market or not. You need to program the drive to reach 380V at 400Hz.


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## jontar (Oct 11, 2009)

if you have a second drive at the site, just copy and paste the parameters from that drive to the new drive and it should be good to go, if not its not going to be a simple start up if your asking questions here without telling us more details,


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## jontar (Oct 11, 2009)

sorry didn't see you had links, parameter 1-9 are the most important, the ones, that I can think of, off the top of my head parameter 7 is max freq, 9 is fla, and another in that range is service voltage. You may have to adjust the PWM parameters and the PID parameters, can you load a picture or 2 of the install and the motorname plate, I'll look tomorowo at work for the manuals and try to get back to you.


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## happytriger2000 (Jun 7, 2012)

Thank you all for your support.

My current PR setups:

Pr 0 = 3
Pr 1 = 400
Pr 2 = 0
Pr 3 = 60
Pr 4 = 60
Pr 5 = 30
Pr 6 = 10
Pr 7 = 5
Pr 8 = 5
Pr 9 = 15

what should Pr 71 be??

thx


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## happytriger2000 (Jun 7, 2012)

jontar said:


> if you have a second drive at the site, just copy and paste the parameters from that drive to the new drive and it should be good to go, if not its not going to be a simple start up if your asking questions here without telling us more details,


Hello Jontar,
I don't have a second drive, this is my 1st FR A740.
I will try provide as much info as I can, all the info provided so far by HSd.it was this:
http://i1220.photobucket.com/albums/dd459/happytriger2000/Spindle- Inverter/HSDinfo.jpg
and FR A740 pdf:
http://www.allied-automation.com/pdf/A700 Basic Manual.pdf
and couple of emails reply from HSD Italy which I think it might be the answer, maybe.
HSD:
"Since the spindle is a 4 poles I hope that the inverter you have is a 800Hz inverter otherwise if it is 400Hz it will not be enough for the spindle ES925."

FRA740 provides 400Hz max. but despite this it should still be able to spin at low speed, correct?

Here is a link of the video we took earlier:
http://s1220.photobucket.com/albums/dd459/happytriger2000/Spindle-%20Inverter/?action=view¤t=VIDEO0283.mp4
I don't know how to describe the sound, I can tell is not right.


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## JRaef (Mar 23, 2009)

Let me try this again.

A motor is designed around a specific ratio of voltage and frequency, a V/Hz ratio. In order for it to produce the designed torque, that ratio must be maintained.

You have a motor that has been designed, according to its nameplate, for 380V 400Hz. That is a *V/Hz ratio of .095:1*.

By setting your VFD to facory defaults, you have the VFD putting out Line Voltage (whatever that is, you never said) at the value in PR3 so 60Hz. Base motor voltage must be programmed in PR19, you made no mention of that, which means you do not understand the manual. 

So let's say your line voltage is 480V (PR19 = 480). That means that at 60Hz the VFD will put out 480V and therfore you will have a *V/Hz ratio of 8:1*

*Motor is looking for 0.95:1, you are delivering 8:1.*

*You are delivering 842% more voltage than the motor is designed to accept at any given frequency, *although in reality it will maximize at the line voltage at 47Hz, which is only 12% speed for that motor. But still, at any given speed commend, you are going to be saturating that motor. You will burn it up.

You must, at a MINIMUM, set PR3 = 400 and set PR19 = 380 so that the output of the drive matches the motor nameplate. But there is a lot more to this than just those parameters, the drive must be tuned to that motor. 

Mitsi drives are not the easiest to learn, but they are very good drives with very good capabilities. Please read the manual thoroughly. I recognize that it is difficult to understand, I have issues with it myself and I have been programming drives for 30 years. But a thorough understanding of EVERYTHING that needs to be programmed is essential here, nothing in the "factory default" settings is going to be applicable. If you still don't grasp the concept I pointed out above, then perhaps you need to acknowledge that you are in over your head. High speed spindle drive programming is not something for a novice to undertake, it is well beyond a simple application. 

And don't expect any meaningful help from the spindle motor people, they have already given you a bogus answer, which indicates they have no idea what they are doing either.


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## happytriger2000 (Jun 7, 2012)

JRaef said:


> Let me try this again.
> 
> A motor is designed around a specific ratio of voltage and frequency, a V/Hz ratio. In order for it to produce the designed torque, that ratio must be maintained.
> 
> ...


JRaef,
Thank you for your explanation, very useful.
'You have a motor that has been designed, according to its nameplate, for 380V 400Hz. That is a *V/Hz ratio of .095:1*.'
Is it 0.095 or 0.95?, 380V/400hz = 0.95

About the line voltage, there's a transformer converts 220VAC to 380VAC 3phase, so Pr19 = 380 and Pr3 = 400. I will change the Pr3 to 400.

Mentioned by Jontar, Pr 0-9 are the most important, if I had them set correctly would I be able to see the motor spin? or there are more settings to do?

Thanks


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## JRaef (Mar 23, 2009)

PR9 is important because that is what protects the motor from overload. That is the equivalent of an overload relay. But it has nothing to do with the operation of the drive. If you plan to run it in S1 (Continuous) mode, then set that to 15.4A, the current on the nameplate.

Yes that was supposed to be 0.95, not .095. I got it correct later in the post.

Yes there are other things you need to program. Can you call your Mitsubishi supplier for help perhaps? I like to help when I can but I have a job that I need to keep doing...


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## happytriger2000 (Jun 7, 2012)

Here is an update on PR:
Pr 0 = 1
Pr 1 = 400
Pr 2 = 0
Pr 3= 400
Pr 4= 60
Pr 5 = 30
Pr 6 = 10
Pr 7 = 13.7
Pr 8 = 13.7
Pr 9 = 15
Pr 18 =400
Pr 72 = 7
Pr 77 = 2

and the result was better than before but the noise still there:
http://s1220.photobucket.com/albums...e- Inverter/?action=view&current=M4V05006.mp4

Nameplate:










The distributor's technician came to my shop this morning and did the settings above for me...


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## happytriger2000 (Jun 7, 2012)

Problem solved!!! Spinning swiftly + high pitch sound,


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