# 2008 Code Changes



## gilbequick (Oct 6, 2007)

OK, for all of you guys out there that have taken some 2008 NEC classes, would you be so kind to enlighten us out here that aren't quite up to speed on the changes. What's changing for the 2008-2010 codes? 

Only thing I've heard mention of so far is that in residential everything is going to be arc fault protected. Is this true?


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## raider1 (Jan 22, 2007)

gilbequick said:


> OK, for all of you guys out there that have taken some 2008 NEC classes, would you be so kind to enlighten us out here that aren't quite up to speed on the changes. What's changing for the 2008-2010 codes?
> 
> Only thing I've heard mention of so far is that in residential everything is going to be arc fault protected. Is this true?


Yes AFCI on most 120 volt 15 and 20 amp circuits.

Tamper resistant receptacles will be required in dwelling units.

All 120 volt 15 and 20 amp receptacles in garages and basements need to be GFCI protected.

All multiwire branch circuits are required to have a means to disconnect all conductors of the circuit simultaneously.

I will post some later.

Chris


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## gilbequick (Oct 6, 2007)

Wow, tamper resistant receptacles. Sounds like the cost of business is on the upswing. 



> All multiwire branch circuits are required to have a means to disconnect all conductors of the circuit simultaneously.


So the breaker isn't good enough anymore?


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## raider1 (Jan 22, 2007)

gilbequick said:


> Wow, tamper resistant receptacles. Sounds like the cost of business is on the upswing.
> 
> 
> So the breaker isn't good enough anymore?


A multiwire branch circuit must have the two or more ungrounded conductors of the circuit disconnected together, such as using a 2 pole breaker or 2 single pole breakers using an identified handle tie.

Chris


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## gilbequick (Oct 6, 2007)

Ok ok, gotcha. Thanks that makes sense.

Any other changes to look out for?


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## raider1 (Jan 22, 2007)

There are a lot of changes.

Here are a couple more:

250.94 Bonding for other systems, has been changed to require some specific terminals for intersystem bonding here is what the 2008 NEC says:


> *250.94 Bonding for Other Systems.​*​​An intersystem
> bonding termination for connecting intersystem bonding
> and grounding conductors required for other systems shall
> be provided external to enclosures at the service equipment
> ...




Also 250.8 has been changed to prohibit wood screws, heres what it says:



> *
> 250.8 Connection of Grounding and Bonding Equipment.
> (A) Permitted Methods. *Grounding conductors and bonding
> jumpers shall be connected by one of the following
> ...




I teach classes on code changes and I have 2, 8 hour classes to cover all the changes to the 2008 NEC.

Chris​


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## rbj (Oct 23, 2007)

raider1 said:


> There are a lot of changes.
> 
> Here are a couple more:
> 
> ...


Good stuff Chris. Anything about shared neutrals for residential? That should be a biggie for the solar guys doing retro and any circuit extensions with AFCI's in the BC.


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## JohnJ0906 (Jan 22, 2007)

Just got my '08 yesterday!

I pre-ordered in May - cost $57 for the spiral including S/H. Thought that was a good price.

Of course, it would have been cheaper if the boss would pay for it.....


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## raider1 (Jan 22, 2007)

JohnJ0906 said:


> Just got my '08 yesterday!
> 
> I pre-ordered in May - cost $57 for the spiral including S/H. Thought that was a good price.
> 
> Of course, it would have been cheaper if the boss would pay for it.....


I got mine for free due to the fact that I teach at the local Tech school.:cool2: 

Chris


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## JohnJ0906 (Jan 22, 2007)

raider1 said:


> I got mine for free due to the fact that I teach at the local Tech school.:cool2:
> 
> Chris


Do you teach electricians, or guys just getting in the trade.

I was just wondering about the "tech school"

Pretty cool, either way though.


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## raider1 (Jan 22, 2007)

JohnJ0906 said:


> Do you teach electricians, or guys just getting in the trade.
> 
> I was just wondering about the "tech school"
> 
> Pretty cool, either way though.


I teach the electrical apprenticeship program, as well as continuing education for jouneyman electricians at the local technology college.

Chris


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## gilbequick (Oct 6, 2007)

I've got the 2005 code book. Would it be good enough just to pick up this one: http://www.constructionbook.com/nec-2008-analysis-of-changes-spiral-361014/nec-code-2008/
I'm thinking this would be more helpfull overall. Reccomendations?


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## Roger123 (Sep 23, 2007)

gilbequick said:


> I've got the 2005 code book. Would it be good enough just to pick up this one: http://www.constructionbook.com/nec-2008-analysis-of-changes-spiral-361014/nec-code-2008/
> I'm thinking this would be more helpfull overall. Reccomendations?


Seems like you will need two books to carry around if you buy that. The 2008 NEC has all changes in gray highlighted.


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## Roger123 (Sep 23, 2007)

Sorry, duplicate


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## raider1 (Jan 22, 2007)

gilbequick said:


> I've got the 2005 code book. Would it be good enough just to pick up this one: http://www.constructionbook.com/nec-2008-analysis-of-changes-spiral-361014/nec-code-2008/
> I'm thinking this would be more helpfull overall. Reccomendations?


The book that you have linked to is a very good book to help you understand the changes to the 2008 NEC, but as Roger pointed out it is not the 2008 NEC. You will still need to buy a 2008 NEC.

Chris


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## Andy in ATL (Aug 17, 2007)

Mike Holt also has an excellent code changes book. I like the pictures! :whistling2:


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## raider1 (Jan 22, 2007)

Andy in ATL said:


> Mike Holt also has an excellent code changes book. I like the pictures! :whistling2:


I agree, Mike Holt's books are really good. 

Pictures are good.:thumbup: 

Chris


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## gregg robert (Oct 25, 2007)

i got my new code book and noticed a lot of gray areas:laughing: bada boom


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## gilbequick (Oct 6, 2007)

gregg robert said:


> i got my new code book and noticed a lot of gray areas:laughing: bada boom


Half of every code book ever made is a gray area!


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## gregg robert (Oct 25, 2007)

gilbequick said:


> Half of every code book ever made is a gray area!


its a joke .. (bada boom get it lol) you know all code changes are high lighted in gray i just thought that was funny .. sorry bad joke i guess gregg


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## gilbequick (Oct 6, 2007)

I know I know....mine was a joke also. The book is supposed to be somewhat user friendly but it seems like sometimes the code gurus want it to be as confusing as possible.


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## bobelectric (Feb 24, 2007)

raider1 said:


> I got mine for free due to the fact that I teach at the local Tech school.:cool2:
> 
> Chris


Got mine free with an $800 code class. How about changing light fixtures to luminares?


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## rbj (Oct 23, 2007)

bobelectric said:


> Got mine free with an $800 code class. How about changing light fixtures to luminares?


"A lampholder itself is not a luminaire." NEC 2008 Luminaire defined.

My definition. Housing(electrical fixture) + lamp = luminaire 

Interestingly enough, The luminaire definition still avoids calling a lamp/fixture assembly an electrical lllumination source assembly.


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

bobelectric said:


> Got mine free with an $800 code class. How about changing light fixtures to luminares?


No, your codebook was 800 clams. The class was free. :laughing: 

Are you asking when the change was made from using the term "light fixture" to "luminaire"? If so, the definition of "luminaire" first showed up as an FPN to 410-1 in the '96. The title of Article 410 was changed in the '02 to include the international term, as well as replacing all instances of "light fixture".


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## raider1 (Jan 22, 2007)

The definition of luminaire has been added to Article 100 in the 2008 NEC.



> *
> Luminaire.​*​​A complete lighting unit consisting of a light
> source such as a lamp or lamps, together with the parts
> designed to position the light source and connect it to the
> ...




As pointed out by rbj, the definition states that a lampholder itself is not a luminaire.

Chris​


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## gilbequick (Oct 6, 2007)

So a keyless is not considered a lampholder. How does this change things? Is this just so you can't put up a bunch of keylesses to pass an inspection? It sounds like they want the fixtures that are supposed to be there be there at time of inspection.


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## raider1 (Jan 22, 2007)

gilbequick said:


> So a keyless is not considered a lampholder. How does this change things? Is this just so you can't put up a bunch of keylesses to pass an inspection? It sounds like they want the fixtures that are supposed to be there be there at time of inspection.


All the addition of the term "luminaire" to Article 100 does is to help define the term luminaire. This in itself does not add any additional requirements to the code.

The NEC does not require the installation of luminaires, just lighting outlets.

Here is what Code Making Panel #2 said in response to a purposal to require luminaires in 210.70 instead of lighting outlets:



> 2-251 Log #575 NEC-P02​​*Action: Reject
> (210.70)*​*
> *_______________________________________________________________________________________________​*Submitter:​*​​Alan H. Nadon, City of Elkhart, IN​
> *Panel Meeting Action: Reject
> Panel Statement:​*The objective of the NEC is to provide the requirement for the lighting outlet. The requirements specific to illumination are in the building code.​


Chris


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## JohnJ0906 (Jan 22, 2007)

I noticed that 125 and 250v, 15 and 20 amp receptacles (Non locking) in damp or wet locations will have to be weather resistant.

I guess they better start making weather resistant, tamper resistant receptacles and GFCIs for dwellings....


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## raider1 (Jan 22, 2007)

JohnJ0906 said:


> I noticed that 125 and 250v, 15 and 20 amp receptacles (Non locking) in damp or wet locations will have to be weather resistant.
> 
> I guess they better start making weather resistant, tamper resistant receptacles and GFCIs for dwellings....


Yes, and I wonder how much they will cost. 

Chris


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## CAMINOGUY1 (Oct 12, 2007)

*question about tamper proof recept.*

Section 406.11 does this mean if we change out a recepticle in someone's bedroom say, it has to be tamper proof ?


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## Idaho Abe (Nov 28, 2007)

*406.11*

Yes you would have to change receptacles if the bathroom were being remodeled.


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## Celtic (Nov 19, 2007)

There is lots of "free" information on the web:








* Code Changes 2008

*


> Code Changes 2008
> Nov 1, 2007 12:00 PM, By Mike Holt, NEC Consultant
> The top 25 revisions to this edition of the NEC


Buying a book offers some additional insights and is a lot easier to hump around than a computer :laughing:


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## JohnJ0906 (Jan 22, 2007)

Anyone taking a course on the changes?

I'm taking this one - http://www.clsevents.net/

For a bonus, guess which picture (at the bottom of the flyer) is me. :whistling2: (Taken at a grounding/bonding seminar I attended in March)


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## Celtic (Nov 19, 2007)

JohnJ0906 said:


> For a bonus, guess which picture (at the bottom of the flyer) is me. :whistling2: (Taken at a grounding/bonding seminar I attended in March)


The 6th picture from the left(2nd from the right)...there is a guy way in the back..you can almost see the "ZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzzz" bubble over his head....that you?


================================================================VVVVVVVVVVVVV===========













:laughing:


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## JohnJ0906 (Jan 22, 2007)

Celtic said:


> The 6th picture from the left(2nd from the right)...there is a guy way in the back..you can almost see the "ZZZZZzzzzzzzzzzzzzz" bubble over his head....that you?
> 
> 
> ================================================================VVVVVVVVVVVVV===========
> ...


I'm the guy in the center.... :laughing:

Not really. (That's Mike Holt) I'm the 3rd from the left. (Baseball hat and glasses)

I look a little zoned out... must have been right after lunch.... :whistling2:


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## Celtic (Nov 19, 2007)

JohnJ0906 said:


> I look a little zoned out... must have been right after lunch.... :whistling2:


I think we all go off to "our special place" during some of these sessions ~ no matter whom the speaker is :laughing:


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## muzafferz (Dec 29, 2007)

where did you read tamper proof receptacle requirements


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## rbj (Oct 23, 2007)

muzafferz said:


> where did you read tamper proof receptacle requirements


Hi Muzafferz, 

Check Art.406.11, which refers to 'receptacles in all areas specified in [210.52].' MH's ECM writing (note 17) did not include this important portion that does have a leeway for at least 6 areas where Tamper Resistant receptacles are not mentioned or "specified". This is a biggie in residential installation$ omissions to be verified by AHJ. rbj


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## bobelectric (Feb 24, 2007)

How are Mike Holt's classes?


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## JohnJ0906 (Jan 22, 2007)

bobelectric said:


> How are Mike Holt's classes?


The one I took last year (Grounding vs Bonding) was excellent. He is the best instructor I have had.

The cost is a little steep, but, IMO, worth it.


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