# Cadweld...



## Demac (Apr 28, 2010)

So about three hours ago, I was watching this wonderful event unfold. Another apprentice recorded it...


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## piperunner (Aug 22, 2009)

Real safe was this your job or what?

Looks like the load is old or has been wet or damp lucky for him ! Thats a smokeless mold you have there when you lite it off no smoke comes out . 

Tell them guys theres a new remote unit sold today its a lot better then getting in the ditch with it .

Be safe was kinda funny been there !


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## wsntme (Feb 23, 2011)

What a wonderful idea. Nice PPE to boot. Good for a chuckle, thanks for sharing.


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## mattsilkwood (Sep 21, 2008)

I'll second that on the remote igniter. A propane torch works pretty good too.


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## mikeh32 (Feb 16, 2009)

Lol! 

I use a torch, but I got to try out one of those remote units at school too.


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## piperunner (Aug 22, 2009)

mikeh32 said:


> Lol!
> 
> I use a torch, but I got to try out one of those remote units at school too.


We kinda torch the mold inside before you load it ! heat it warm first it gets the water or damp out you get a better shot with a pre- warm mold .Like the pre sealed loads nice


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## erics37 (May 7, 2009)

I like how the camera guy started cracking up.

I've had a similar thing happen to me, but worse. That's a story for a different thread, though...


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## drsparky (Nov 13, 2008)

Moron's.


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## erics37 (May 7, 2009)

drsparky said:


> Moron's.


.... says the guy who put a possessive apostrophe in a word that was supposed to be just plural :laughing:


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## drsparky (Nov 13, 2008)

erics37 said:


> .... says the guy who put a possessive apostrophe in a word that was supposed to be just plural :laughing:


Let me repost.
Morons.:jester:


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## captkirk (Nov 21, 2007)

erics37 said:


> .... says the guy who put a possessive apostrophe in a word that was supposed to be just plural :laughing:


 LOL ...... nice burnnnnnnnnnnnnnn's....:laughing: ugh i mean burn..


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## erics37 (May 7, 2009)

drsparky said:


> Let me repost.
> Morons.:jester:


:thumbsup: There ya go!


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## Demac (Apr 28, 2010)

If you listen real careful you can hear me at the 1:02 mark asking if the guy had recorded all of it. Notice how distant I sound? I figured someone should be left to tell the story.:thumbsup:

It was old loads from the shop, and they sent them without any way to ignite them. As luck would have it, that was the only one we could get to fire before it was time to head home, so we ended up burying the wire and will have to dig it up tomorrow and try again. They're also sending more loads from the shop, but I'm guessing they'll be old too.


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## Rockyd (Apr 22, 2007)

Maybe you guys have been lucky and never had a mold blow out?

Molds need to be cooked out in the morning so they are 100% dry.

So should the wire your going to shoot.

Everything should be clean. Wire wheel in a drill works well. 
keep the mold clean... molds are good for 50 to over a 100 shots, as long as you use wire toothbrush.

If a mold "pukes" the stuff coming out is over 2000 degrees, and burns right through boots. If a shot is questionable, I put a shovel on top, and apply pressure. 

Quit being stupid when igniting charge. Get a spark gun. Gun is ten times better than a torch. Better yet, get thew new electric shot ones...ten times easier, and faster.

Shot hundreds of cadwelds...watching that video, you guys are accidents looking for a place to happen.

This looks like a wet mold shot -
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Na3He1MNMnk


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## erics37 (May 7, 2009)

Okay fine here's my story.

Back when I was a 1st-term apprentice, I was working out at a pulp mill on a brand new steam turbine generator building. We had recently installed a bunch of galvanized cable tray in the main switchgear room. Specs called for a 4/0 bare copper ground ring to be run in all the cable tray, with 2/0 taps going down to all the gear and cabinets and so forth. So there were some spots where we had to T-tap 4/0 to 4/0, and some spots where we had to T-tap 4/0 to 2/0.

The journeyman I was working with had me up on the ladder doing all the Cadwelds. I'd set up, do one, and then move to the next one while he prepped the next mold and shot and everything. Unfortunately, he was a lazy bum of a JW and spent most of the time chatting and was barely paying attention to what I was doing.

So I was getting a 4/0 to 2/0 tap all ready to go; conductors cut to length. I hollered down for the T-mold and he handed one up to me. This was like the 10th weld in a row, so we kind of had a system down. Now because he wasn't paying attention, he went ahead and handed me the 4/0 to 4/0 mold instead of the 4/0 to 2/0 one. I had 10 successful welds in a row, so I made the mistake of not even looking at the mold to make sure it was the right one.

Got it all set, lit it off, and it just started spewing molten crap out of the 2/0 side. I barely dodged it, but some splattered on my ladder and melted partway through. More of it got on the floor and hardened into pellet things.

Definitely a close call. I was pissed (even though it was partly my fault for not looking).


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## fraydo (Mar 30, 2009)

While doing ground ring for cell sites we ran out of the proper shots for the work we were doing. The guy that hired us was there and decides to mix two different types of shots to "custom make" what we needed. Something inside of me screamed mad scientist and caused me to put some distance between us. Good thing I did 'cause that guy sure wasnt Mr Wizard!


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## thegoldenboy (Aug 15, 2010)

I've only done Cad welding a couple of times. My former shops kit consists of all the molds, shots, and spark gun in a plastic tub. When one guy gets done with it, they just throw it on the shelf until the next guy needs it. By the time I used it the first time we couldn't get the damn thing to work so my lead guy took and cut the end off an extension cord and used that as our igniter. It worked but the shop didn't care to hear our concerns about the level of maintenance that kit received. Just before they laid off half of the crew they were addressing whether or not to invest in a new system.


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## Demac (Apr 28, 2010)

Rockyd said:


> Maybe you guys have been lucky and never had a mold blow out?
> 
> Molds need to be cooked out in the morning so they are 100% dry.
> 
> ...


I appreciate the concern Rockyd, I really do. I'm going to choose my words carefully here because I never know who's reading...

I am a first year apprentice that _isn't_ your average dumb 18 year old kid living with mom and dad. I'm new to electrical work, and soak up any advice I can find on here, but I'm not new to _work_ and I like to think I have a decent amount of common sense. 

In a thread I posted a couple months ago one of the comments from MDShunk, spoken generally and not aimed specifically at me, was that it annoyed him when apprentices questioned the actions or work of a journeyman. I kind of took that to heart, as he's right, its not my place to question or second guess the _electrical_ work that any journeyman does. However, once its outside the realm of electrical work its fair game.

In the little video I posted, I tried to avoid falling into that trap that MDShunk referenced. Its not my place to say anything. However, in light of your post, I will say that most of what you listed was stuff that ran through my mind as well, and thats also why I kept my distance. When I'm in charge, I can dictate how things are done. Until then, I can only keep myself safe, and casually mention my concerns if anyone else will listen. Most of the time they don't.

I hope none of that came across offensively, it wasn't intended to be.


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## oldtimer (Jun 10, 2010)

Demac said:


> I appreciate the concern Rockyd, I really do. I'm going to choose my words carefully here because I never know who's reading...
> 
> I am a first year apprentice that _isn't_ your average dumb 18 year old kid living with mom and dad. I'm new to electrical work, and soak up any advice I can find on here, but I'm not new to _work_ and I like to think I have a decent amount of common sense.
> 
> ...


 Never be afraid to voice your opinion. It could save time and money,and possibly avoid getting hurt.

Most responsible J Men will listen. We are never too old to learn. I M O.


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## Rockyd (Apr 22, 2007)

Demac said:


> I appreciate the concern Rockyd, I really do. I'm going to choose my words carefully here because I never know who's reading...
> 
> I am a first year apprentice that _isn't_ your average dumb 18 year old kid living with mom and dad. I'm new to electrical work, and soak up any advice I can find on here, but I'm not new to _work_ and I like to think I have a decent amount of common sense.
> 
> ...


No offense taken. I have a very small scar from a cadweld burn, so perhaps i'm a bit over-sensitive on the issue. Would hope that others learn from my mistake, and not repeat those same errors.


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## McClary’s Electrical (Feb 21, 2009)

Rockyd said:


> No offense taken. I have a very small scar from a cadweld burn, so perhaps i'm a bit over-sensitive on the issue. Would hope that others learn from my mistake, and not repeat those same errors.


 

I too have been burnt cadwelding and that video make me cringe. We always have on welding gloves, spark gun, good molds, good shot. By the color of the powder on the top of your mold, he never put the fine powder on top, or the powder was wet because it it too dark colored. When I got burnt, we were installing a deta configured grid like shown in the picture, and cadwelding 1/0 to building steel. I was holding the mold and it puked out the side and a hot piece rolled down the inside of my welding gloves.


And how did they expect it to WORK, with the lid open?


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## vos (Apr 1, 2010)

Is cadwelding basically soldering for large wire?


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## RIVETER (Sep 26, 2009)

vos said:


> Is cadwelding basically soldering for large wire?


You are not really far off in that assumption but it is a little more than that. In cad welding, you are actually melting the outer portion of the steel and the ingredients that you are bringing to the mix are FUSING. The bond goes very deep into the "HOST" metal.


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## Demac (Apr 28, 2010)

vos said:


> Is cadwelding basically soldering for large wire?


I didn't know much about it, so a few days ago when I heard we'd be doing some I started doing a little research.:thumbsup:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Exothermic_welding


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## HugoStiglitz (Apr 11, 2011)

Is Caddy the only company that makes supplies for this method of welding, or are there others?


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## Rockyd (Apr 22, 2007)

HugoStiglitz said:


> Is Caddy the only company that makes supplies for this method of welding, or are there others?


There maybe others, but having done hundreds, if not thousands of shots, i can tell you that Cadweld/Erico has been always readily available, and always worked great. We even had a marginal batch of #200's they replaced wihout a hassle. Service, and availability and matter. If it's a large project, they are recognized easily in submittals.

Besides that, where would you get your "wormbox" for inside your toolbox?:whistling2: Between #15 and #500 something there for everyone.


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## mikeh32 (Feb 16, 2009)

so, why didnt you just leave a trail outside the mold?

I have to agree with the others about the lid open. 

Ive been burnt once, but seen it go right through hard hats, clothes, and other stuff. 

One fun part about cell towers, all the damn grounding


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## HugoStiglitz (Apr 11, 2011)

Rockyd said:


> Besides that, where would you get your "wormbox" for inside your toolbox?:whistling2: Between #15 and #500 something there for everyone.


Haha, they do make handy little containers.


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