# Changing company's as an apprentice



## Apprentice24 (Jul 8, 2018)

Hello,

I'm new to the forum, although I have read a few feeds on here in the past.

I am a non-union 3rd year apprentice. I have had good grades through my school thus far and have progressed in the field alot. When I started out with the company I'm with, I was out of a job and took the first offer they gave me. 

I am now one of if not the top apprentice in the company (not my words) yet I have not started making a whole lot more than when I started. 

A journeyman from another company has been telling me that his company is hiring and that I would make more money. 

The foreman I've been working with for the past couple years have given me A lot more responsibility than all the other apprentices and in some cases, they have had other apprentices work under me on some projects.

I am going to have to leave the company im with after I am done with school because my fiance and I are moving hours away and I could not make the drive everyday 

At what point does the experience im getting by having more responsibility out-weigh the pay. Also how would company's look at me if i changed company's after I get my journeymens.


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## zack.vernon (Jun 30, 2018)

Consider other options like what the benefits are like, working hours, good or bad co-workers, Does the boss care if you leave 15 minutes early at the end of the day for a DR app.. Things like that. 
If you are taking more responsibility then other apprentices and still making the same wage, I would leave.

Just my 2 cents


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## Wirenuting (Sep 12, 2010)

Welcome to ET.
Lease take the time to finish filling out your profile


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## MDShunk (Jan 7, 2007)

Changing jobs is a huge stressor. I'm not sure I'd want to change jobs so close to finishing an apprenticeship only to have to do it all over again after marriage.

Changing jobs- you're the new guy all over again. You don't get the esteem or responsibility for being 'top dog', even if you are smarter/better than the other guys. That takes a long time to build back up to.

The devil you know is better than the devil you don't know. Right now, it seems like you get on well at the current place, pay withstanding. You may trade better pay for miserable coworkers and miserable management and miserable working conditions. Hard to tell.

I guess if I was you, I'd ask myself a couple questions: Before I learned that outfit 'B' paid more, was I generally happy here? Do I really need more pay, or is it just something I think I need? 

Better pay is on the horizon for you anyhow after you get your journeyman's cert/license. Do you really want to upset the apple cart at this very moment to chase a couple bucks? Maybe you do. Maybe you don't. Maybe just go for an interview and collect more information and see how answers start revealing themselves to you.


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## trentonmakes (Mar 21, 2017)

Keep in mind also,you already gained the experience, switching to a new company may put that experience to the test.
Be prepared to potentially take on more responsibilities.



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## matt1124 (Aug 23, 2011)

Why are you moving so far away? Sounds like you’re doing well there, get your jman card and keep moving up in the company.


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## 99cents (Aug 20, 2012)

I finished my apprenticeship with a blend of residential, commercial and industrial experience. I was with four different companies. A guy who sticks with one company throughout his apprenticeship isn't doing himself any favors.

A contractor who pays chit wages and has apprentices working under a third year is hack. There are apprentice/ journeyman ratios for a reason. Move on.


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## splatz (May 23, 2015)

You leave out some details, how long would you plan on staying with the other company before moving away? Are you going to have your license when you leave? How much more money? Raise take effect right away or after a probation period or other bull****? 

First off: change is good for learning new things in new places but the thing you learn here might be you can't trust people's promises. You might get there and find out it's not like they said it would be. 

Do you think they'll bring you right in supervising other apprentices, and if so, do you think that will go over well with the apprentices that are already there?


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## lighterup (Jun 14, 2013)

OP mentions "school" and "grades" and "non union".
This is telling me that the company he works for may be fronting
money for a non union apprenticeship program. 

2 questions...is this apprenticeship the *ABC program* 
(the state certified one)? If so there are supposed to be 
step increases in hourly rate with each year in these state
certified programs. (OP said he hasn't seen any raise in 
3 years.)

did Op sign an agreement to stay on for x amount 
of years?..and don't just say 'no' on a knee jerk reaction.
Think hard...(Op said he snapped up 1st job that came along
maybe the paperwork was flying in as he hastily agreed 
to work there...._sign here ...sign here ..annnd here)_

Most companies do not pay for an apprentice to go to 4 years of school
and then just walk away Scot free without completing their indentured 
servitude for x amount of years as a J man (lest they pay back the 
tuition for school).

Also , in a certified apprenticeship like ABC , company is supposed 
to have apprentices working under a J man and not acting as a J man
with no J man around.

I would say 99's comment is right if this company is as hack as it sounds
but Op better understand...if he signed an agreement with financial percussion's
tsktsktsk.


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## John Valdes (May 17, 2007)

What do the journeyman make at this current company?
I understand its non-union so you may not know. But I would find out.


Oh ...Welcome to Electrician Talk.


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## Rora (Jan 31, 2017)

Apprentice24 said:


> At what point does the experience im getting by having more responsibility out-weigh the pay. Also how would company's look at me if i changed company's after I get my journeymens.


That is really the crux of the question, because there is a point that employees transition from a cost of training to someone who is paid for the value they produce. If the Canadian apprenticeship regulations that say 4th year apprentices don't count towards the j-man:apprentice ratio restrictions imply anything, it's that you are probably nearing that point.

Up until now, you've thought of yourself as someone that employers need to take a risk on. A new apprentice is not an island who can be sent out and solve problems without help a significant majority of the time, but as a j-man, even a 4th year who is only finalizing their experience to become a j-man, you're the person who people may consider calling for that help. You need to start making the transition to thinking of yourself as someone that companies consider competent, and therefore expected to produce value in a well-rounded fashion.

The situation you described is a bit messy, because you're looking at your future and a potential new job in a stage where you're transitioning from trainee to self-sufficient worker. You're coming face to face with negotiation of your wage/rate which is something that typically occurs to J-man/value producers, so it's tempting to negotiate for a better pay. However, you may want to consider that you might be selling (out) yourself short.

Here's a better way to look at it: if you move to this new company, would you, as a future J-man, enjoy working at this company, would you want to stay? Is it in line with work-life balance considerations like where you live, commute, etc. As you say, you took the job you have now as "the first offer you got"... you're nearing a state where you have more negotiating power as a value-producer, and you should adjust your negotiations accordingly.

In other words, you may want to consider whether it's worth making a move now for more money, or whether you might just wait until you've got a ticket and look for jobs that have the full suite of what you're looking for long-term, and how this potential opportunity lines up with that.


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## TGGT (Oct 28, 2012)

Apprentice24 said:


> Hello,
> 
> I'm new to the forum, although I have read a few feeds on here in the past.
> 
> ...


They made you a strawboss. All the responsibility with no pay. You're just the foreman's bitch.

You should take the other job and make more money with less responsibility. 

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## active1 (Dec 29, 2009)

Unless your in the union or receiving prevailing wage there will always be a teeder totter of pay vs value to the company.

On the low end there is a saying working only enough to keep your job while the company is paying just enough to keep the workers showing up.

Don't get me wrong, I'm all about getting the highest pay.
It's also wise to look at it from both sides.

A slightly lower pay vs work done makes you a good value to the company.
In this case the company may be much more flexible on other things.
Such as requests for certain work days or hours.
More forgiving on mistakes & minor company issues.
They may be retained longer if work gets slow.

On the other side you're paid more than worth in work output.
Most companies are stuck because it's a bad practice to reduce wadges.
So they pay the higher wadge to get the jobs done.
But when the work gets caught up, mistakes happen, your late, don't do the paperwork correctly, the overpaid is the 1st to go.
A person can make a living as an overpaid. Bouncing from job to job.
But they also carry a lot of stress.


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