# Scared to become an Apprentice



## BadJkWorst

Excuse the rough post lol, didn't realize that you couldn't go back to edit


----------



## AmishCountrySparky

Ummmmm.....if someone is continually getting shocked they are most likely doing something wrong. Always take the proper safety precautions. If you do this for years, yes you will most likely get shocked at some point. If it's a regular occurrence your doing something wrong and not working safely. I've been doing this for 4 years and have never neen shocked on the job. Ive been shocked doing work at home and just being too lazy to turn stuff off.......and when i was a youngster and shoved paper clips and forks into receptacles.

Having a carpentry background should give you a quicker transition into the mechanical side of things.


----------



## Otterinaround

*How do you like splinters?*



BadJkWorst said:


> Hey everybody new guy here, I'm currently 25 and working as a carpenter and I really love what I do but in about a month I'll be in a position where I might be able to start as apprentice in my local.
> 
> So I'll get right down to the issue here, from what I've seen and heard getting electrocuted maybe even in a minor way just seems like part of the job. For example I saw a guy wiring a box or something (? not sure what i saw tbh) either way he had some exposed wires and was connecting them or something and I will never forget he kept going, owww owww owww everytime he had to touch the wire.
> 
> It seems even when I'm on youtube guys who clearly known their trade very well have the same issue where they are ( connecting wires or something? , again im not really sure what im looking at but I can link it if it helps) doing their thing and still getting shocked.


Nobody gets out of life... alive 
But with any trade there are dangers. 
Doctors could get infected with deadly viruses or even cancer with just one slip of the needle. :sad:
Carpenters can have body parts taken off by mills and blades ( it gets pretty messy when your overall strap drags you into a planer). I won't even mention what a slip on the scaffold can do to your love life....:crying:
Plumbers can get into really $hitty situations dealing with infected.... well you guessed it... :wink:
So all trades have issues. :biggrin:

From the massive pile of research I have done second guessing myself and my decision regarding this career. :glasses:

I will say I've promised never to trust a wire, until I've got a meter on it, and that like in special ops....SLOW is FAST and FAST is SLOOOOW (as in going fast will end up slowing you down as hospital bills/ broken items (yours or a customers)/ funerals... are expensive).



BadJkWorst said:


> Are mini shocks just a inevitable part of the job? Will somebody with more skill never be shocked? Does a commercial wireman deal with wires so powerfull that they can kill? Random question but do you go into crawlspaces( i hate them and borderline refuse:vs_mad:??? Guys any relevant info or usefull storys etc would be greatly appreciated



Confined spaces are relative... It only feels like the closest tiniest spot until you're in the next tiny little spot.:vs_whistle::vs_laugh:


----------



## Pete E

BadJkWorst said:


> Hey everybody new guy here, I'm currently 25 and working as a carpenter and I really love what I do but in about a month I'll be in a position where I might be able to start as apprentice in my local.
> 
> So I'll get right down to the issue here, from what I've seen and heard getting electrocuted maybe even in a minor way just seems like part of the job. For example I saw a guy wiring a box or something (? not sure what i saw tbh) either way he had some exposed wires and was connecting them or something and I will never forget he kept going, owww owww owww everytime he had to touch the wire.
> 
> It seems even when I'm on youtube guys who clearly known their trade very well have the same issue where they are ( connecting wires or something? , again im not really sure what im looking at but I can link it if it helps) doing their thing and still getting shocked.
> 
> Are mini shocks just a inevitable part of the job? Will somebody with more skill never be shocked? Does a commercial wireman deal with wires so powerfull that they can kill? Random question but do you go into crawlspaces( i hate them and borderline refuse:vs_mad:??? Guys any relevant info or usefull storys etc would be greatly appreciated


My background is mostly low voltage telecoms stuff, but I have also worked quite a bit on resi mains (240v over here) and no you should not be getting shocked. 

There are lots of safety protocols in place to prevent this with the primary one is that unless there is exceptional circumstances you should not be working live and certainly not as an new starter apprentice. 

People tend to get shocks when they are careless or too lazy to go switch off the power, or they turn something off, but don't prove the circuit dead.

That said as an apprentice you're very much in the hands of the people you work for or with...Hopefully you will be placed with decent people who teach and follow the safety rules,, not some lazy arsed sh1t who is always taking short cuts...


----------



## adamclark52

All I can do is back up the guys who said that if you're getting shocked frequently you're doing something wrong. 

It's a part of the job but it's a hazardous part that we do our best to avoid. Me personally I don't even work on 120V live. I have too much other good stuff in my life to risk it to be a cowboy. If I'm working on 347V I shut off an entire grouping if I'm working on it (if I'm working on a three-phase system and I'm working on circuit 5 I shut off circuits 1 and 3 as well, I am just hoping that the guys before me balanced the neutrals and phasing right).

As a carpenter the best thing I can compare it to for you is it's as much a part of our job as missing a nail and hitting your thumb with your hammer is to you. But (no offence) any electrician who knows what he's doing would have that happen less often that a carpenter hitting his or her thumb.


----------



## cabletie

One of my top three near death experiences involved getting shocked in a dirt crawl space. I'm not sure if that helps.......


On a funnier note, I was working in a crawl space infested with what we call cave crickets or camel crickets. Once you see one, they'll be hundreds. There half spider half cricket. 

So the carpenter tells me they hate loud noises. They'll head the other way when they hear it. Not what I ever noticed. He gives me a block of wood and says "when you see them, smack the wood on the crawl space floor, they'll head the other way". So I go in and when I start to see them around me, I start smacking the wood. Well the whole crawl space comes alive with them jumping around, and when the pack gets closer, I start to scream. At that moment the carpenter unplugs my drop light......

Ahh good times!


----------



## MDShunk

For years I used to get these monthly emails an ET user hooked me up with that listed reported electrician deaths and injuries. Most deaths were caused by falls from a height, and most of those falls were 8 feet or less. That risk exists in almost every building trade.


----------



## paulengr

Most of the work I do is 208 V MINIMUM and often 4160, 12,470 and so on. Let’s put it this way...I’m way beyond touching it. If I get close, it will arc over and get me. And from around 50-150 V there is a slight chance that it is lethal but above that the odds are not in your favor and if it is the internal cooking/burning you will get will leave you with an injury that can’t be detected by medical science and will never heal. Then there’s arc flash...the heat from an arc. It’s worst around 330 or 480 and gradually the hazard let’s up but if you get caught NEAR an arc it will send you to the burn unit for months or the morgue.

99.9% of the time electrical work is not so bad. A lot less injuries than say carpenters. But when something does happen other than getting a cut from a wire, sheet metal, or a razor knife once in a while, it’s clean and dry work mostly (because dirt ad water cause a lot of problems with the equipment and increase risks to you). But when it’s bad, it’s really, really bad.

You can’t see electricity and that’s the biggest problem. You need to get up close and personal with your enemy and make sure it’s not anywhere you will be before you start working. And if the situation changes you stop and verify all over again. Work habits are what keep you alive even when some A hole is breathing down your neck about getting it done. Since sparkies are the first trade to arrive to shut down and disconnect everything before anyone else does anything, and they do all the startup stuff they’re the last to leave, so no matter which trade got behind, sparkies are supposed to wave a magic copper wand and fix the schedule issue so you are always “behind” even if you haven’t started the job yet!

Also materials for carpenters and mechanics are cheap...like 10% of the job. Electrical is more like 60%, and they pay more for what’s between your ears than whether or not you have a strong back.

So yeah it CAN be very dangerous but you have the power and right to shut off Power almost always. If they won’t do it, drop a dime and the attitude will change very fast. That doesn’t mean you never work live but when you do there are methods and tools for it.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## chicken steve

cabletie said:


> One of my top three near death experiences involved getting shocked in a dirt crawl space. I'm not sure if that helps.......
> 
> 
> On a funnier note, I was working in a crawl space infested with what we call cave crickets or camel crickets. Once you see one, they'll be hundreds. There half spider half cricket.
> 
> So the carpenter tells me they hate loud noises. They'll head the other way when they hear it. Not what I ever noticed. He gives me a block of wood and says "when you see them, smack the wood on the crawl space floor, they'll head the other way". So I go in and when I start to see them around me, I start smacking the wood. Well the whole crawl space comes alive with them jumping around, and when the pack gets closer, I start to scream. At that moment the carpenter unplugs my drop light......
> 
> Ahh good times!












:vs_shocked:
~CS~


----------



## eddy current

As an electrician you will work at heights, and in attics/crawl spaces. Now some more than others depending on the type of electrical you do of course.

The more you understand about electricity, the less likely you will get shocked as well. You learn to respect it.


----------



## canbug

Lets put it this way, The trades are much safer now then in 1985 when I started. My first bigger job was at a K-Mart reno. I swear I would get a shock every morning just to wake up. We didn't use lock outs and if we turned off a breaker and labeled "men working" the girls would turn everything back on within 5 minutes. 
I would have to honestly say that I haven't been shocked at work for 10-12 years.
Isolation forms, lock out, tag out, test before you touch, PPE.
Much more safety awareness now.

Tim.


----------



## Going_Commando

Thankfully the old days of working live all the time are dying. I do it way more than I should, earlier than I should have, but thats how I came up. Its been probably a year or more since the last time I got shocked. It is easier and more efficient to shut stuff off than to work live in a lot of cases. 

Anyway, troubleshooting you pretty much have to do with power on so you can see what isn't working, and test stuff to see where failed components may be. You learn to be careful. The IBEW will teach you the right way to do things, and do it the way they say. Good contractors will supply you with the tools, gear, and equipment you need to stay as safe as possible. If you do commercial construction and whatnot, I dont imagine there is too much live work involved anyway.


----------



## joebanana

Actual electrician's don't work hot. We just don't. There's (almost) never a need to. And there are procedures we follow to prevent it.
That dude that "kept getting shocked", was it this guy?




He's not a real electrician.


----------



## canbug

He makes me laugh but I'm not sure how he is still alive.

Tim.


----------



## adamclark52

joebanana said:


> Actual electrician's don't work hot. We just don't. There's (almost) never a need to. And there are procedures we follow to prevent it.
> That dude that "kept getting shocked", was it this guy?
> https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_Pmfr5CGDKY
> He's not a real electrician.


Seriously, there's no way that guy is for real. I mean not even really some amature online "how-to" guy. He has to be a comedian with some knowledge of video editing software.


----------



## bostonPedro

Getting shocked all the time is not normal and is more an indictment on that person ie they are a ****ty electrician. 
All trades have safety issues. 
Carpentry should help you as you should be somewhat mechanically inclined which many younger people are not anymore


----------



## lighterup

OP

I believe in 20 years I have had (2) serious 
incidents and one minor (ooops)...I blew up 
my Kline Linesman pliers.

Someone you see keeps getting lit up??
There's something just not right about that.


----------



## telsa

Wiring should be safer than a buzz-saw, I should think.


----------



## BadJkWorst

Wow coming home to this is such a nice suprise, thanks everybody. Not only are you guys very helpfull and informative but man that half spider half cricket story was the laugh of the day for me. Thanks for asking all the questions you guys, the main thing for sure was being worried about the smaller shocks being a regular part of the trade and it seems like that was as somebody said a "cowboy" issue with people taking a shortcut so I'm glad I can totally avoid that. As far as the big shock or falling yeah its something that comes with every trade but definitely being shocked on a extension ladder would always be on my mind and something I would always hate to do. Also Telsa you mentioned that wiring is safer than a buzzsaw, I also noticed in the union hall they had a cabinet with all the hand/power tools you use on the job and I saw that actually used hand hacksaws. Dont alot of Electricians use circular saws and are you not supposed to be using recipricating saws?? That would be intresting if theres something I'm missing there because I do enjoy my powertools


----------



## telsa

Think bandsaws.

Cordless, these days.


----------



## BadJkWorst

It should be timestamped but if for whatever reason it's not the time should be set to 4:08 . For those who wanted the example. From what I now think I understand this is happening because he is working live because he shouldn't be.


----------



## Pete E

Think of the hacksaw as a backup *you provide* or something you use for very quick jobs...From what I have read here, powertools are supposed to be provided by the company you work for and can therefore be of lets say "variable quality" depending if they are abused. 

Some one else will explain the pro's and cons of buying you're own power tools as I gather doing so might cause ripples with the other guys where you work but being a Brit its not an area I have any experience with...


----------



## Going_Commando

What's a hacksaw?


----------



## canbug

You will use your hacksaw. 
It has it's place where digging out a power tool just isn't worth the time. Think small cuts or cutting into something like TECK cable. you make a couple of cuts and then look to see how deep you are, couple more cuts and check again. That kind of work.

Tim


----------



## MechanicalDVR

telsa said:


> Think bandsaws.
> 
> Cordless, these days.


For one or two small cuts it isn't worth bringing it out.


----------



## joebanana

lighterup said:


> OP
> 
> I believe in 20 years I have had (2) serious
> incidents and one minor (ooops)...I blew up
> my Kline Linesman pliers.
> 
> Someone you see keeps getting lit up??
> There's something just not right about that.


If there's anybody who _doesn't_ have the #12 "stripping notch" in an old pair of lines, or *****, they're not a serious spark chaser, or haven't been doing it long enough. :biggrin:


----------



## MechanicalDVR

joebanana said:


> If there's anybody who _doesn't_ have the #12 "stripping notch" in an old pair of lines, or *****, they're not a serious spark chaser, or haven't been doing it long enough. :biggrin:


LMAO, if that isn't the truth.


----------



## joebanana

MechanicalDVR said:


> For one or two small cuts it isn't worth bringing it out.


Except when it comes to uni-strut. I'd walk clear across a job-site for the porta-band before I'll EVER try cutting it with a hacksaw......again.
(especially with an EMT (fine tooth)blade)


----------



## MechanicalDVR

joebanana said:


> Except when it comes to uni-strut. I'd walk clear across a job-site for the porta-band before I'll EVER try cutting it with a hacksaw......again.
> (especially with an EMT (fine tooth)blade)


Oh you Cali guys.........

A little hard work builds character.


----------



## joebanana

MechanicalDVR said:


> Oh you Cali guys.........
> 
> A little hard work builds character.


But, isn't that the whole point of power tools, to "build" stuff?
"Smarter, not harder". Besides, if I spent the money on a tool, I'm going to use the hell outa it.
And when doing warehouses, the walk can be more work than the actual work.


----------



## Rora

I've farmed a few sparks, every time it's happened, it's a combination of not having complete knowledge of what equipment is connected and pressure from operating staff not to turn off everything. Turned off only the relevant breakers and it's something either unlabeled, mislabeled, or otherwise on it's own circuit. I'd imagine many mishaps have the same contributing factors, either a lack of information required to disconnect the proper circuits and/or someone trying to avoid the inconvenience of shutting stuff down.

The problem really stems from a lack of common knowledge about electrical theory and a lack of respect for the lives of those who work on electrical systems. As far as many people are concerned, electricity is invisible magic and the chance that a tradesman could get electrocuted is worth the risk of keeping the lights on.

I don't see this changing any time soon, so it's a good idea to develop the social engineering skills required to keep from getting fried.


----------



## MechanicalDVR

joebanana said:


> But, isn't that the whole point of power tools, to "build" stuff?
> "Smarter, not harder". Besides, if I spent the money on a tool, I'm going to use the hell outa it.
> And when doing warehouses, the walk can be more work than the actual work.


Not to bust your balls but if a guy I was paying would rather walk all the way out to a truck for a saw for one cut when a hacksaw could have been used he'd be doing another kind of walk.


----------



## joebanana

MechanicalDVR said:


> Not to bust your balls but if a guy I was paying would rather walk all the way out to a truck for a saw for one cut when a hacksaw could have been used he'd be doing another kind of walk.


It was purely hypothetical. I've been doing this long enough to know what I'll need, to have it on hand, and wouldn't be doin' the "new guy stroll" for one cut.
(I'd send the new guy) :vs_laugh:


----------



## MechanicalDVR

joebanana said:


> It was purely hypothetical. I've been doing this long enough to know what I'll need, to have it on hand, and wouldn't be doin' the "new guy stroll" for one cut.
> (I'd send the new guy) :vs_laugh:


I've just seen to many guys that run out tot their ride everytime they need a tool.


----------



## eddy current

MechanicalDVR said:


> I've just seen to many guys that run out tot their ride everytime they need a tool.


Or the guy who uses the hydraulic bender for 3/4” EMT :vs_mad:


----------



## MechanicalDVR

eddy current said:


> Or the guy who uses the hydraulic bender for 3/4” EMT :vs_mad:


LOL, I fired that guy!


----------



## joebanana

MechanicalDVR said:


> I've just seen to many guys that run out tot their ride everytime they need a tool.


I know what you're sayin'. And I'm kinda a hard-azz on "being prepared to work" myself. 
I lost count on how many times I've had to tell people (new or otherwise) to PLAN your work, and it frustrates the poop outa me having to tell people who should KNOW BETTER.
Almost as bad as people who line up for the bender.


----------



## MechanicalDVR

joebanana said:


> I know what you're sayin'. And I'm kinda a hard-azz on "being prepared to work" myself.
> I lost count on how many times I've had to tell people (new or otherwise) to PLAN your work, and it frustrates the poop outa me having to tell people who should KNOW BETTER.
> Almost as bad as people who line up for the bender.


Have you noticed that the same guys that need to run out the the vehicle are also the guys that smoke and live on their phones?


----------



## joebanana

MechanicalDVR said:


> Have you noticed that the same guys that need to run out the the vehicle are also the guys that smoke and live on their phones?


Smokers don't bother me, as long as they can smoke and work at the same time. If not, that's what break time is for. It's the friggin iphone guy's who try to hide behind stuff, up ladders, or live in the blue room to do, whatever it is they do with those______things.


----------



## MechanicalDVR

joebanana said:


> Smokers don't bother me, as long as they can smoke and work at the same time. If not, that's what break time is for. It's the friggin iphone guy's who try to hide behind stuff, up ladders, or live in the blue room to do, whatever it is they do with those______things.


I hear ya, the phone/text thing annoys me badly.


----------



## carte73

*Never get complacent.*

I'm just starting out in this field, actually still going through school. But what my first career taught me, which was an Aviation Structural Mechanic working on the flight deck in the World's finest Navy, one of the most dangerous work places in the world to work. Was, always be prepared, keep your head on a swivel, NEVER get complacent, and know your seven P's. Prior, Proper, Planning, Prevents, Piss, Poor, Performance. And the one thing that my teacher Mr. Rivera drives home, first thing you do before any job is "THINK”. Respect what you’re working on, never be scared of it and you'll be fine.


----------

