# Workkeys test



## John Valdes (May 17, 2007)

I have no idea as to what you are asking Flash.
There are other guys from the GREAT state of California around this forum. Hopefully they understand your question and can help you.
By the way. Why are you interested in this trade?


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## Flashmasterson (Jul 29, 2018)

Ok I'll seek them out. 'Looking to move to Oregon though, btw. But I'll do the test in CA.

I'm interested because it's something that'll challenge me intellectually, it can't be replaced by automation, it has many sub branches of work (it's versatile), labor is protected if I join the Union, and it directly serves a corner stone of modern civilization.


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## John Valdes (May 17, 2007)

Great response. I imagine you will be successful in any profession you choose.


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## Flashmasterson (Jul 29, 2018)

Oh I meant the National Career Readiness Certification test


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## joebanana (Dec 21, 2010)

What is this "application test" you speak of? If you meant the NCRC why didn't you just say so in the first place? There's no shame in that. Unless you're embarrassed for some past indiscretions. Or, present ones. 

Being from the grate[sic] state of Cali. that John referenced, I have no idea what you're talking about either.

Do you have any experience in the electrical field? Are you looking into local 441? Or a non-union apprenticeship?
Have you explored the CW/CE program? Or, have you gone through the examining board interview already?
Leave it to this backward state to come up with something as stupid as a "career readiness" certification, and the accompanying test. How much did that cost?


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## wildleg (Apr 12, 2009)

he has no exp, read his profile.

apparently, this is the certification of which he speaks, which is put out by ACT: http://www.act.org/content/act/en/products-and-services/workkeys-for-educators/ncrc.html

ACT is promoting this as a way to hire (entry level ?) employees who are qualified (?) to enter the workforce. It seems that it proves that they can read. I suppose, in an era where one can't entirely rely on a high school diploma that they can, in fact read, that it might be a good thing.

not sure, though.


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## Flashmasterson (Jul 29, 2018)

wildleg said:


> he has no exp, read his profile.
> 
> apparently, this is the certification of which he speaks, which is put out by ACT:
> 
> ...



It's a generalized test to evaluate some understanding of math in possible work-related contexts, ability to compare data from different graphs, and something called "Workplace Documents".


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## joebanana (Dec 21, 2010)

wildleg said:


> he has no exp, read his profile.
> 
> apparently, this is the certification of which he speaks, which is put out by ACT: http://www.act.org/content/act/en/products-and-services/workkeys-for-educators/ncrc.html
> 
> ...


 What "profile"? Rather disappointing.
As a follow up, WTF is ACT? Besides a scam? If you have to be trained on how to perform menial tasks, ie. customer service, and interacting with coworkers in a "team" environment, without getting fired on your first day, maybe dog walking is a better career choice. 

I thought this site was for experienced electrical trades people with at least some actual hands on the tools time.
oy-vey.


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## wildleg (Apr 12, 2009)

ACT is a company that has put out tests for college entrance, similar to SAT testing, for many years.


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## daveEM (Nov 18, 2012)

joebanana said:


> What "profile"? Rather disappointing.
> As a follow up, WTF is ACT? Besides a scam? If you have to be trained on how to perform menial tasks, ie. customer service, and interacting with coworkers in a "team" environment, without getting fired on your first day, maybe dog walking is a better career choice.


It might be OK. Some might usually interact with others with an AK47. They would have to be retrained.


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## wildleg (Apr 12, 2009)

It is funny what you come across in life.

We did a couple hotels for a GC, and one of the sup's had a kid he was trying to get in a trade. The kid stopped by the job and gave me his resume, which he was quite proud of. He had worked at Macdonald's for a while, and then at a funeral home for a couple years. We needed help at the time, so I hired him. Sometime during the first week (also his last week), I gave him a box and a drywall saw, and drew a rectangle on a wall and told him to cut a hole for that box. .. Well.... I came back, and there's a hole, but nowhere near where I drew it. It was hilarious... I gave him some gruff, and next thing you know this kid is in my face. Unknown to him, I gave him a huge amount of slack (ie did not fire him on the spot). Was very very funny, but, he just wasn't ready to be told what to do I guess.

Anyhow, you never really know what you are getting. I've had drunks and drug addicts that were great workers, until they got stupid, and really smart people who weren't worth a box of rocks. These tests don't tell you much, and I don't know if any test really tells you much. 

Hiring and firing is just a cost of doing business. The proof is in the pudding.


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## joebanana (Dec 21, 2010)

wildleg said:


> It is funny what you come across in life.
> 
> We did a couple hotels for a GC, and one of the sup's had a kid he was trying to get in a trade. The kid stopped by the job and gave me his resume, which he was quite proud of. He had worked at Macdonald's for a while, and then at a funeral home for a couple years. We needed help at the time, so I hired him. Sometime during the first week (also his last week), I gave him a box and a drywall saw, and drew a rectangle on a wall and told him to cut a hole for that box. .. Well.... I came back, and there's a hole, but nowhere near where I drew it. It was hilarious... I gave him some gruff, and next thing you know this kid is in my face. Unknown to him, I gave him a huge amount of slack (ie did not fire him on the spot). Was very very funny, but, *he just wasn't ready to be told what to do I guess.*
> 
> ...


 Or didn't understand what he was told. Whats with kids these day's? When you've got a whole generation that's confused about which gender they are, and are constantly distracted by "social media", how can you expect them to follow directions, and complete tasks correctly?
We can't even refer to them as "he", or "she" without facing a lawsuit.
The future is bleak.


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## Flashmasterson (Jul 29, 2018)

joebanana said:


> Or didn't understand what he was told. Whats with kids these day's? When you've got a whole generation that's confused about which gender they are, and are constantly distracted by "social media", how can you expect them to follow directions, and complete tasks correctly?
> We can't even refer to them as "he", or "she" without facing a lawsuit.
> The future is bleak.


The future is not bleak on that front. It's looking good, but only for the people who are willing to wake up. You see that one "kid" cut a hole in the wrong place in a wall and that inspires a sweeping generalization about "kid's" gender and social media? Strange.

Also this forum is about electricians and electric work so let's keep it that way.


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

Flashmasterson said:


> The future is not bleak on that front. It's looking good, but only for the people who are willing to wake up. You see that one "kid" cut a hole in the wrong place in a wall and that inspires a sweeping generalization about "kid's" gender and social media? Strange.
> 
> Also this forum is about electricians and electric work so let's keep it that way.


I was never one to say this generation was.....Whatever, Hell my generation had long hair and many were seen as lazy potheads by other electricians, and they were afraid the trades were shot if we were the future of the trade. 

BUT I can tell you if you want to make it in the trades, you need a strong back, common sense a little bit of mechanical ability and a willingness to follow orders and work. Hell a high school diploma is hardly necessary if you want to work hard and learn.

Anything beyond that is BS at an entry level.

I can tell you there is a certain percentage of your generation the so-called snowflakes AKA pussies that really need to grow a set. We had the same pussies when I was a helper many became teachers and college professors.


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## Flashmasterson (Jul 29, 2018)

brian john said:


> I was never one to say this generation was.....Whatever, Hell my generation had long hair and many were seen as lazy potheads by other electricians, and they were afraid the trades were shot if we were the future of the trade.
> 
> BUT I can tell you if you want to make it in the trades, you need a strong back, common sense a little bit of mechanical ability and a willingness to follow orders and work. Hell a high school diploma is hardly necessary if you want to work hard and learn.
> 
> ...


Alright man, well, instead of *****-footing around with our opinions about entire generations of people. How about we both "grow a set" and talk about what this thread began as; an attempt at a constructive conversation about getting started in this career:

Who has advice on ways to study for the NCRC? Applied Mathematics, Graphic Literacy, Workplace Documents, Reading for Information, Applied Technology. The more specific the better.


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## nrp3 (Jan 24, 2009)

I’ll skip the generational differences and just ask what do need the test for? Which employers are asking for this? Enlighten us. I live under a rock and this is the first I’ve heard of this or the other test you were asking about. We want to know whether this has any value, serves any purpose other than taking your money and time. That’s why we’re skeptcal. Just cause we’re older doesn’t mean we haven’t seen a few things in our time.


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

Flashmasterson said:


> Alright man, well, instead of *****-footing around with our opinions about entire generations of people. How about we both "grow a set" and talk about what this thread began as; an attempt at a constructive conversation about getting started in this career:
> 
> Who has advice on ways to study for the NCRC? Applied Mathematics, Graphic Literacy, Workplace Documents, Reading for Information, Applied Technology. The more specific the better.


My firm hires a fair number of young men and women, the last thing we want or need is a new hire with an attitude. 

Ask yourself, do I have an attitude that a prospective employer might see you as a problem child. 

Having said that does it matter you just missed the point of my post which means you are set in what you want for an answer or are dense as a pile of granite?


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## Flashmasterson (Jul 29, 2018)

Thanks for your professionalism. Good luck with your firm.


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## splatz (May 23, 2015)

Flashmasterson said:


> The future is not bleak on that front. It's looking good, but only for the people who are willing to wake up.


As others mentioned, ever generation is annoyed by every other, and usually each is at least partly right. 

Things like a green as grass pup, explaining the world to people with years or decades of actually living in it and making it go forward, telling them about how they need to wake up - that's one of the things I find annoying about this current generation hitting the work force this last few years. 

This is what happens when you tell all kids they are all special and awesome and perfect snowflakes, no matter what. Sheltering them like emotional veal for 18-25 years, then trying to get them to work. You have to spend a lot of time explaining to them that they are not perfect, takes a long time to sink in.


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

Flashmasterson said:


> Thanks for your professionalism. Good luck with your firm.


34 years 50 IBEW members working strong, I'll do OK.


BUT you still missed my point, this test you are asking about AT THIS TIME seems to me to be a waste. Use your time, money and energy wisely and try to get some pre-schooling to help you in the trade.


FROM WHAT I HAVE READ, the SAT test are being pushed aside by some universities which is a revenue loss for this firm and I would think as they see a push for more entering the trades they are trying to get in on some easy cash, that you could better spend elsewhere.


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## nrp3 (Jan 24, 2009)

If you have a high school diploma, that’s a good start. If not work on it. The first year of apprentice class here (non union) was a lot of math review. This was mostly basic math and some algebra to help prep you for working basic electrical formulas. I don’t recall much trig or geometry. Plenty of resources for brushing up on math.


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## Flashmasterson (Jul 29, 2018)

brian john said:


> 34 years 50 IBEW members working strong, I'll do OK.
> 
> 
> BUT you still missed my point, this test you are asking about AT THIS TIME seems to me to be a waste. Use your time, money and energy wisely and try to get some pre-schooling to help you in the trade.
> ...


The NCRC looks like a big waste of time and money to me too, much like the SAT. The problem is that the local I'm aiming for requires it before an apprenticeship can begin. If I had it my way I'd be in a union schooling program and shadowing a union pro on the job ASAP.


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## nrp3 (Jan 24, 2009)

Ok, that sounds legit, if you want in there, and that's something they require, I guess you need to do it.


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