# spray foam



## MDShunk (Jan 7, 2007)

No problem. Put a sharp point on fish sticks and go to town. A little bit tougher than fiberglass insulated stud bays, but well within the realm of possibility. I've fished in walls that had solid blocks of that blue foam cut for each stud bay, and it still went fine. Just takes more muscle.


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## kielarsp (Apr 9, 2009)

It's possible, Just like theses S.I.P. homes. You have to fish everything. One way to do this is to first cut in your box, plumb a line to the cieling to drill the top plate. place a piece of tin in the box opening. Drill a 1" hole in plate. Now I heat up a 3/4" ballbearing and drop it down the hole. This takes some time but well worth the smell.


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## MDShunk (Jan 7, 2007)

kielarsp said:


> It's possible, Just like theses S.I.P. homes. You have to fish everything. One way to do this is to first cut in your box, plumb a line to the cieling to drill the top plate. place a piece of tin in the box opening. Drill a 1" hole in plate. Now I heat up a 3/4" ballbearing and drop it down the hole. This takes some time but well worth the smell.


Now that right there is one cool trick. Thanks. 

Does a heated ball bearing make it all the way from the top plate to a receptacle opening? Or, would you have to hang it from something to retrieve it from time to time and heat it back up?


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## kielarsp (Apr 9, 2009)

I fished a 10' wall It took about ten minutes to melt it way trough. the key is the piece of tin in the box. When the hot ball of hell reaches the tin it rolls into a bucket of water.


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## Widestance_Politics (Jun 2, 2010)

kielarsp said:


> I fished a 10' wall It took about ten minutes to melt it way trough. the key is the piece of tin in the box. When the hot ball of hell reaches the tin it rolls into a bucket of water.


I have never fished a wire into a spray-foamed wall, but can't you just use a flex bit? Admittedly not as fun as a heated ball-bearing sounds, but still efficient?


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## MDShunk (Jan 7, 2007)

Widestance_Politics said:


> I have never fished a wire into a spray-foamed wall, but can't you just use a flex bit? Admittedly not as fun as a heated ball-bearing sounds, but still efficient?


Probably, but it's too difficult to gauge if you're in the center of the stud cavity (front to back) or not. To effectively use a flex bit, you really need the advantage of being able to wag it front to back in the stud cavity to see if you're in the center. I can see a guy drilling through the outside of the house or out through the drywall if he tried drilling a channel in spray foam. It's quite likely also the just "thread" into the block of foam rather than drilling.

Hey, give it a shot. I'm just picturing a train wreck, is all .


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## Widestance_Politics (Jun 2, 2010)

MDShunk said:


> Probably, but it's too difficult to gauge if you're in the center of the stud cavity (front to back) or not. To effectively use a flex bit, you really need the advantage of being able to wag it front to back in the stud cavity to see if you're in the center. I can see a guy drilling through the outside of the house or out through the drywall if he tried drilling a channel in spray foam. It's quite likely also the just "thread" into the block of foam rather than drilling.
> 
> Hey, give it a shot. I'm just picturing a train wreck, is all .


I can see your point, I assume that a guy would go slowly and notice the difference when his bit went from foam to a more solid object like sheet rock or stud....however, I have witnessed the "balls to the wall" type of guy drill through a finished wall with no insulation whatsoever.....with the efforts to go green, this is a good question as I can see having to deal with many unusual types of insulation in the future.....


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## s.kelly (Mar 20, 2009)

Cool, thanks for the tips all, and I am glad to hear it is not as bad as I was imagining.


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## kielarsp (Apr 9, 2009)

I too was a skeptic of the ball of friary hell. We tested it out on a scrap window opening I was amazed the time it took to melt to my opening. The nice part about doing it this way is little mess.


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

I've never tried it, but I've heard PVC glue will dissolve the foam. Pour it into the hole above the box and let gravity to it's thing.


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## Electric Al (Mar 13, 2010)

kielarsp said:


> It's possible, Just like theses S.I.P. homes. You have to fish everything. One way to do this is to first cut in your box, plumb a line to the cieling to drill the top plate. place a piece of tin in the box opening. Drill a 1" hole in plate. Now I heat up a 3/4" ballbearing and drop it down the hole. This takes some time but well worth the smell.


 What guides the hot ball towards the box ??? :001_huh:


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

Electric Al said:


> What guides the hot ball towards the box ??? :001_huh:



Gravity.


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## Bob Badger (Apr 19, 2009)

kielarsp said:


> It's possible, Just like theses S.I.P. homes. You have to fish everything. One way to do this is to first cut in your box, plumb a line to the cieling to drill the top plate. place a piece of tin in the box opening. Drill a 1" hole in plate. Now I heat up a 3/4" ballbearing and drop it down the hole. This takes some time but well worth the smell.


This is so cool I want to find some place to try it. :thumbsup:


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## John Valdes (May 17, 2007)

I just cannot see the ball bearing dropping straight down. Seems like it would drift away from the plumb line. Sounds good, but I am not sure it would really work. Also sounds like it would take way to much time.

If you have your hole drilled in the top plate and its plumb with the box, it would be much easier and faster with a stick. Maybe heat the tip some or find an attachment that could be heated red hot?

New invention. Propane fired tip for "fish stix". Burn right through

*WHY AREN'T YOU GUYS AT WORK?*


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## william1978 (Sep 21, 2008)

Bob Badger said:


> This is so cool I want to find some place to try it. :thumbsup:


 I can see Bob now trying to explain this to his wife why he has the wall opened up in his house this weekend and filling it with foam.:jester:


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## william1978 (Sep 21, 2008)

kielarsp said:


> It's possible, Just like theses S.I.P. homes. You have to fish everything. One way to do this is to first cut in your box, plumb a line to the cieling to drill the top plate. place a piece of tin in the box opening. Drill a 1" hole in plate. Now I heat up a 3/4" ballbearing and drop it down the hole. This takes some time but well worth the smell.


 I like this trick.:thumbsup:


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## Electric Al (Mar 13, 2010)

william1978 said:


> I like this trick.:thumbsup:


Just a couple of questions? #1 will foam catch on fire?

#2 any Toxic fumes?


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## william1978 (Sep 21, 2008)

Electric Al said:


> Just a couple of questions? #1 will foam catch on fire?
> 
> #2 any Toxic fumes?


 I take it that it hasn't happened to *kielarsp.*


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## MDShunk (Jan 7, 2007)

Electric Al said:


> Just a couple of questions? #1 will foam catch on fire?
> 
> #2 any Toxic fumes?


It probably can catch on fire, but not likely from a hot ball bearing. I'm sure the fumes are toxic, but it's not like you're standing there huffing them. 

I know that when we built little office shacks on factory floors, they used special "melt out" ceiling tile (which were just styrofoam) so that they didn't have to run the sprinkler lines down to the office shacks.


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## william1978 (Sep 21, 2008)

MDShunk said:


> I know that when we built little office shacks on factory floors, they used special "melt out" ceiling tile (which were just styrofoam) so that they didn't have to run the sprinkler lines down to the office shacks.


 How long ago was that? I'm sure that is not legal anymore.


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## MDShunk (Jan 7, 2007)

william1978 said:


> How long ago was that? I'm sure that is not legal anymore.


emmm... late 90's, early 2000's.


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## william1978 (Sep 21, 2008)

MDShunk said:


> emmm... late 90's, early 2000's.


 Can you still do that?


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## kielarsp (Apr 9, 2009)

fumes are bad but little mess to clean up. The other thing is you can reseal the hole with Foam. I would highly recommend this approach with all the green home building going on.


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## MDShunk (Jan 7, 2007)

william1978 said:


> Can you still do that?


Beats me. I just wired the thing. Only trouble I had was starting a 240V window shaker air conditioner with 208. Needed to add a little buck-boost, on my dime, since it was bid work. All I know is that it was inspected by the AHJ and Factory Mutual.


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## Fredman (Dec 2, 2008)

kielarsp said:


> It's possible, Just like theses S.I.P. homes. You have to fish everything. One way to do this is to first cut in your box, plumb a line to the cieling to drill the top plate. place a piece of tin in the box opening. Drill a 1" hole in plate. Now I heat up a 3/4" ballbearing and drop it down the hole. This takes some time but well worth the smell.



look out for PEX lines!.
(Cross-linked polyethylene. PEX tubing is commonly used for hydronic radiant floor heat, but increasingly also used for water supply lines.)


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## MDShunk (Jan 7, 2007)

Fredman said:


> look out for PEX lines!.
> (Cross-linked polyethylene. PEX tubing is commonly used for hydronic radiant floor heat, but increasingly also used for water supply lines.)


You're probably pretty safe on an exterior wall, at least in the northeast. They try real hard not to put plumbing in the outside walls if there's another choice. They'd generally be a stub up at each fixture anyhow, and not really too much running horizontally through the studs.


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## Fredman (Dec 2, 2008)

MDShunk said:


> You're probably pretty safe on an exterior wall, at least in the northeast. They try real hard not to put plumbing in the outside walls if there's another choice. They'd generally be a stub up at each fixture anyhow, and not really too much running horizontally through the studs.


Right although it is possible. Just another thing to keep in mind.

Interesting though: The last luxury house I did in Minnesota used a very dense "closed cell" foam on the outside walls but they only built up about a 2" thickness against the outside sheathing and left the rest of the wall cavity empty. I asked one of the spray foam guys why they did it this way. He told me the open air space next to the Icynene is part of the system. He said *air* is the best insulator -used with their product of course- as long as the wall cavity is sealed tight and that air pocket is not able to move.

The only time I've seen a wall completely filled was a privacy wall located between two bedrooms. Pretty rare.


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## Electric Al (Mar 13, 2010)

I remember government grants to have your home insulated with sprayed UREA FORMALDEHYDE. Then 2 or 3 years later, government grants to have it removed because it was carcinogenic. No Bull !


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