# Smurf Tube



## John Maiorano

This is a new one for me. Have always seen it but do no know a whole lot about it. It is my understanding that it is a flexible conduit for low voltage meaning speaker, Cat 5 etc not temporary power installations etc. Anyone have any ideas?


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## Speedy Petey

See NEC 362.10 & 362.12. Uses permitted and no permitted.
While strictly regulated there is no problem with using it for line voltage wiring.


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## electricalperson

in my vacation to bermuda, i noticed this is pretty much the only wiring method they use in those stone buildings. i love using smurf tube and think its great.


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## Bkessler

I worked in USVI for a year and used smurf for everything, here in socal I have used it in concrete in a all concrete highschool football stadium. I think the stuff is great as well.


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## nap

it sucks when it is cold and pulling it through steel studs sucks equally.


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## electricalperson

nap said:


> it sucks when it is cold and pulling it through steel studs sucks equally.


so does pulling MC through steel studs. especially the 250 foot coils of it. i dont think they make a reverse wound little coil. when i buy 1000 foot rolls of MC i make sure its reverse wound. thats probably the standard now anyway


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## gilbequick

electricalperson said:


> so does pulling MC through steel studs. especially the 250 foot coils of it. i dont think they make a reverse wound little coil. when i buy 1000 foot rolls of MC i make sure its reverse wound. thats probably the standard now anyway


You can get 250' rolls reverse wound. I can't understand why that isn't the way it is sold normally.


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## Kevin J

The "blue smurf tube" is called ENT and it works good if used for the right applications. The one downside is that it is not UV resistant, which means you cant use it if it will be exposed to sunlight.


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## nolabama

i used it in a stone building - works fine - has a pita memory


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## electrician1957

I love ENT.


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## nap

electrician1957 said:


> I love ENT.


Yousa crazy!!


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## Jeff000

Is this smurf tube like coreline? gray or blueish plastic flexible pvc pipe, made by Ipex (the stuff we use anyways).
If yes then I love it, and we use a LOT of it, I have personally put 140k feet of it down.


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## macmikeman

I've used it for years now. Just remember the limitations on it. Not for exposed work, not for sunlight exposure( the first one seems to me to sort of negate the second one don't you think?) Not to be in direct contact with soil. I use it on second floor and above slabs alot. Also for feeding kitchen islands on grade floor when there is a gravel layer above the soil. The fishtape will sometimes hang up a bit when pushing thru.


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## manchestersparky

In the jurisdiction I work for I'm seeing a ton of that gray flex made by IPEX. It seems all the larger EC's around here are installing it in their concrete slabs. Saves a ton time on slab work. I'm also seeing pvc coated mc cable being used in the slabs.

I myself have never used the stuff. I have spent some time on one job site with a very intelligent electrical contractor discussing these two items. They are approved for concrete encasement and I can see the advantages to using them the way these EC's are. I even spent some time talking with another electrician who works in a different part of the state. They still use schedule 40 pvc for slabs. I was telling them to check out the flex and pvc coated mc.


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## paul d.

just pulled some #12 (5) in 3/4 smurf about 150'-200'. took 3 of us to pull it.yes. we lubed it all the way. any of you guys got some better ideas to make it easier?? paul


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## nap

paul d. said:


> just pulled some #12 (5) in 3/4 smurf about 150'-200'. took 3 of us to pull it.yes. we lubed it all the way. any of you guys got some better ideas to make it easier?? paul


sure (but you won't like it)


EMT


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## paul d.

nap said:


> sure (but you won't like it)
> 
> 
> EMT


its in the slab. and we got miles of this sh!t to pull thru!!!! oh well.


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## nap

paul d. said:


> its in the slab. and we got miles of this sh!t to pull thru!!!! oh well.


sucks to be you.

not trying to infer you do not know what you are doing but just in case:

you do have somebody actually pushing the wire in as well, right? and I don;t mean merely feeding the wire but actively pushing the wire in.


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## Jeff000

manchestersparky said:


> I was telling them to check out the flex and pvc coated mc.


The one problem with running tec in the slab is you have to make sure no one is coring later, a lost core line is a LOT cheaper then a lost mc in the slab. It would seem the MC that you would put in the slab would be best suited to a rack, this way you can make sure it doesnt get damaged at all. 



paul d. said:


> just pulled some #12 (5) in 3/4 smurf about 150'-200'. took 3 of us to pull it.yes. we lubed it all the way. any of you guys got some better ideas to make it easier?? paul


5 #12 isnt much for a 3/4 run at all, even 6 #12 over 200 feet you can get away with one guy pushing and one guy pulling without lube even.
When you pull the coreline out on the rebar make sure its as straight as possible and tie it down enough to make sure when they are pouring the mud that it doesnt move. If its not tied down enough it will snake 12 degrees one way then 12 the other... and before you know it there is 1000 degrees of bends over the 200 feet. 
But the core line could have got stepped on and crushed a little bit too. Make sure you have someone watching, especially if its real hot or real cold.


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## paul d.

yeah nap , we had a good man feeding. and jeff i think you id'ed the problem EXACTLY. them slab guys ran the tube around , up and down, and put a " goose-neck at the stub up. i was told we used smurf because it was faster than PVC pipe. putting the string in and pulling the wire took 4 hrs. oh i forgot, the string was a bitch to get in too.


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## nap

Jeff000 said:


> When you pull the coreline out on the rebar make sure its as straight as possible and tie it down enough to make sure when they are pouring the mud that it doesnt move. If its not tied down enough it will snake 12 degrees one way then 12 the other... and before you know it there is 1000 degrees of bends over the 200 feet.
> But the core line could have got stepped on and crushed a little bit too. Make sure you have someone watching, especially if its real hot or real cold.


and that is why it is simply easier to use rigid pvc. Put it in and go on to other things. Can;t say nothing ever happens to it but you don;t have to babysit it to prevent all those possibilities.


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## Jeff000

paul d. said:


> yeah nap , we had a good man feeding. and jeff i think you id'ed the problem EXACTLY. them slab guys ran the tube around , up and down, and put a " goose-neck at the stub up. i was told we used smurf because it was faster than PVC pipe. putting the string in and pulling the wire took 4 hrs. oh i forgot, the string was a bitch to get in too.


The string is easy, use a vacuum and for the mouse use one of them produce bags from the grocery store, just ball up some of it and then tie the jet line to it, make sure its light twine other wise its harder to suck. 



nap said:


> and that is why it is simply easier to use rigid pvc. Put it in and go on to other things. Can;t say nothing ever happens to it but you don;t have to babysit it to prevent all those possibilities.


we have 100's of thousands of feet of corline in the condos i am working on right now. doing it in rigid would have really been almost impossible. 
And then the cost of rigid over coreline.
here is a pic, it was taken with about half the coreline in for that part of the slab. Getting a rod busters reel and pliers and you can pull and tie coreline very fast. And having a first year watch the pour is cheap too.


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## htneighbors

*Long Pull...*



paul d. said:


> just pulled some #12 (5) in 3/4 smurf about 150'-200'. took 3 of us to pull it.yes. we lubed it all the way. any of you guys got some better ideas to make it easier?? paul


We once had a 950' pull through 3/4" underground PVC. Pulled 4#10, THWN with a brand new 1/4" nylon rope and a pulling sock. Pulled it with a pick-up truck!  the rope broke 6 times - all outside the end of the conduit - re-tied and continued the pull. I thought sure we would stretch the wire down to about a #18AWG! 

Wire unscathed, megged fine, still in service after 7 years! Totally stupid! :stupid:


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## billdozier

weve used smurf on condos before as well no major problems. Just make sure its tied down well. wont use this stuff for much else but in my opinion its as good as pvc in a condo slab. Where are you guys doing condo work at. I miss those days. Easy great money


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## zen

last year i was doing electrical work with atms,once i had the 12 x 12 set i ran ent to the atm,,topper lights etc,i loved it,inspectors had no problem with it except for in georgetown. some of the atms had what they called a doghouse where the electrical coms and video stubbed up, the elect. to 125 amp panel which fed the topper pole lights etc. they wouldnt allow ent out the bottom of the panel to the pvc feeding topp. pole light etc.all of about 2.5 ft pieces, he said its just not good for areas subject bad weather


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## zen

another very common use around here is to put 2 spare ent runs from the panel up to the attic for future. its cheaper than 2 extra circuts that may not get used


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## Fredman

It is soo much fun to pull through... There must be a really good reason that stuff is not produced as a smooth tube like PEX pipe. :blink:

Securing?


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## lectricboy

Jeff000 said:


> The string is easy, use a vacuum and for the mouse use one of them produce bags from the grocery store, just ball up some of it and then tie the jet line to it, make sure its light twine other wise its harder to suck.
> 
> 
> 
> we have 100's of thousands of feet of corline in the condos i am working on right now. doing it in rigid would have really been almost impossible.
> And then the cost of rigid over coreline.
> here is a pic, it was taken with about half the coreline in for that part of the slab. Getting a rod busters reel and pliers and you can pull and tie coreline very fast. And having a first year watch the pour is cheap too.


I watched a recent episode of "LA Hardhats", this is almost the exact same method they used to rough in their slabs.
They seemed to have problem with it floating up. Smurf pipe never really took off around here.


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