# Confidence.



## kaboler (Dec 1, 2010)

We recently hired a 3rd year apprentice at our job, and he doesn't have a service van and he's not confident enough to do jobs on his own.

The point? What good is he to have around.

I like him a lot, a lot, and what I really want to do is build up his confidence. He feels that everything he does will be hack, if he's not directly directly supervised by a journeyman.

I was talking to my journeyman about it today, and he said personally, he didn't do any work on his own until he was a journeyman for 2 years, and that it's the norm. I'm more of an exception to the rule.

But at our company, performance is such a key thing, I fear he'll be out of a job in a few months.

What do I do to build up his confidence? What do I say?

Keep in mind that I don't have the power to give him a van, nor give him work. I haven't really seen his workmanship either, but he's young and not confident.

What do I do?

I'd also like to hear what it was that gave you confidence as your ability as an electrician, and stories and such.

This thread isn't really about my ego, so please, refrain from yapping about my attitude, because I've heard it before and I don't care. I think the young guy is a good christian, so keep that in mind.

I got confident from when I realized that electrical work is much like any kind of work. Even the most complex job, once broken down into little pieces, is simple enough. Plan, plan plan!!!!! I think electrical work is easy, but the planning is the hard part.


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## McClary’s Electrical (Feb 21, 2009)

kaboler said:


> We recently hired a 3rd year apprentice at our job, and he doesn't have a service van and he's not confident enough to do jobs on his own.
> 
> The point? What good is he to have around.
> 
> ...


 


LEAVE HIS CONFIDENCE ALONE!!! 

Confidence should come from experience, and feeling comfortable. 

This FALSE confidence that you portray is dangerous, naieve, and down right silly. You are gonna be lucky if you make it though your apprenticeship without killing yourself, or blowing something up.


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## MF Dagger (Dec 24, 2007)

There is nothing wrong with him wanting to be supervised. That's how it should be. You should be directly supervised also no matter how much you puff your chest up.


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## kaboler (Dec 1, 2010)

If you can name something that an electrician does that you think I require direct supervision, post, and I'll let you know if I've done it unsupervised already.
Not including changing a lightbulb.


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## stuiec (Sep 25, 2010)

I think I know what you are trying to do. My advice is leave him alone. Let him learn his way. He will become confident, or he won't - treat him with respect, its really none of your business.


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## Big John (May 23, 2010)

I can perform brain surgery unsupervised without having the first clue what the hell I'm doing.

-John


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## kaboler (Dec 1, 2010)

stuiec said:


> I think I know what you are trying to do. My advice is leave him alone. Let him learn his way. He will become confident, or he won't - treat him with respect, its really none of your business.


You could be right. Do I really care that much? A little. I like to inspire.


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## kaboler (Dec 1, 2010)

Big John said:


> I can perform brain surgery unsupervised without having the first clue what the hell I'm doing.
> 
> -John


I wouldn't compare brain surgery (11 years+ university in canada) to electrical work (4 years trade school in canada).


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## Jmohl (Apr 26, 2011)

kaboler said:


> If you can name something that an electrician does that you think I require direct supervision, post, and I'll let you know if I've done it unsupervised already.
> Not including changing a lightbulb.


Hey Commercial guys, Kablower needs to look at a set of your prints so he can estimate it for you. He will undoubtably do a better job than your jman estimator who's been doing it for years.....Only million dollar projects and up please.


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## Frasbee (Apr 7, 2008)

The more I was let alone to do things on my own, the more confident I've become. Once you're experienced enough, you don't have to worry about what someone else would do, or how they'd like it done. You stop looking for validation and do the best you can with what you have, (knowledge/tools). My best teacher has been experience.


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## Jmohl (Apr 26, 2011)

Frasbee, there is a fine line between confidence and being a full blown douche bag. Kowblower jumped way over that line a looooooong time ago. To hear him tell it, he should just be able to sit for and EC license now. No need to apprentice for the next four years, he already knows all.


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## kaboler (Dec 1, 2010)

Jmohl said:


> Hey Commercial guys, Kablower needs to look at a set of your prints so he can estimate it for you. He will undoubtably do a better job than your jman estimator who's been doing it for years.....Only million dollar projects and up please.


Thanks mole! But I don't even know the price of a 1/2" pvc LB. But, For million dollar projects, I can safely say I'd bid at least a million. TY!!!!! WINNING!!!


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## kaboler (Dec 1, 2010)

Frasbee said:


> The more I was let alone to do things on my own, the more confident I've become. Once you're experienced enough, you don't have to worry about what someone else would do, or how they'd like it done. You stop looking for validation and do the best you can with what you have, (knowledge/tools). My best teacher has been experience.


Right on, especially since everyone has their own way of doing it correctly, when in the end, 80% of work done by everyone is just fine.

As long as it's safe. People and equipment.


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## Jmohl (Apr 26, 2011)

Compared to you Kornholer, Charlie Sheen is completely normal. Vinegar breath......


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## kaboler (Dec 1, 2010)

Jmohl said:


> Frasbee, there is a fine line between confidence and being a full blown douche bag. Kowblower jumped way over that line a looooooong time ago. To hear him tell it, he should just be able to sit for and EC license now. No need to apprentice for the next four years, he already knows all.


I haven't had to worry about power factor, and I haven't hooked up a capacitor bank, but that's about it. I've already done most everything.

I imagine I could hook up a capacitor bank too. Just waiting on the opportunity!!!


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## kaboler (Dec 1, 2010)

Jmohl said:


> Compared to you Kornholer, Charlie Sheen is completely normal. Vinegar breath......


You're the cornhole I was cornholing. Sorry about my breath while doing so!!!!!


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## Demac (Apr 28, 2010)




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## Chris1971 (Dec 27, 2010)

kaboler said:


> If you can name something that an electrician does that you think I require direct supervision, post, and I'll let you know if I've done it unsupervised already.
> Not including changing a lightbulb.


You need supervision when you open your mouth or post on this forum....did you read the rules for this forum? It's for professionals!:thumbsup:


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## jza (Oct 31, 2009)

kaboler said:


> I wouldn't compare brain surgery (11 years+ university in canada) to electrical work (4 years trade school in canada).


You spent four years in trade school?

Dude most Canadians spend less than a year, spread over into 3 separate sessions.


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## kaboler (Dec 1, 2010)

jza said:


> You spent four years in trade school?
> 
> Dude most Canadians spend less than a year, spread over into 3 separate sessions.


haven't gone to school yet.


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## kaboler (Dec 1, 2010)

Chris1971 said:


> You need supervision when you open your mouth or post on this forum....did you read the rules for this forum? It's for professionals!:thumbsup:


Most of you aren't very professional. You've turned my normal thread about confidence into a personal attack.

Anyway, I'm going to take off. I'll be back to read a few more professional posts, and the 80% of the other posts, I'll laughingly reply to.


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## kaboler (Dec 1, 2010)

Something tells me I'll be getting a warning soon for defending myself. Don't bother moderator! I'll stop feeding the trolls.


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## Hippie (May 12, 2011)

kaboler said:


> We recently hired a 3rd year apprentice at our job, and he doesn't have a service van and he's not confident enough to do jobs on his own.
> 
> The point? What good is he to have around.
> 
> ...


What a ludicrous, arrogant, idiotic post. You can't even figure out how to run 1/2" PVC in a ditch, and you talk like you invented the trade. If your shop has you on your own they are probably the worst hack outfit around and true quality work is something neither you nor anyone else there knows anything about, a good example being the wooden shed you guys built over a service that you posted pics of. Any monkey can wire a light, what do you know about sizing, load calcs, troubleshooting controls? There's so much stuff in this trade that you have no clue about your brain would fizzle trying to understand 10% of it. Worry about your own education instead of misleading others.


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## MF Dagger (Dec 24, 2007)

kaboler said:


> If you can name something that an electrician does that you think I require direct supervision, post, and I'll let you know if I've done it unsupervised already.
> Not including changing a lightbulb.


Anything I can name you have probably screwed up.


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## RIVETER (Sep 26, 2009)

Big John said:


> I can perform brain surgery unsupervised without having the first clue what the hell I'm doing.
> 
> -John


I know how to replace a knee, and can do it on my own. Should I help this young orthopedic surgeon out because he is new here? I am rare cause I picked it up quick on the internet.


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## JmanAllen (Aug 3, 2011)

I can't say much about how to build someone's confidence My whole apprenticeship was JM and contractors trying to make me lose my confidence, they called it cockyness lol, so I can't say it's wrong for an apprentice to be a little cocky cause I know I was. But be ready to have them tear you apart when you do mess up

Sent from my iPhone using ET Forum


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## RIVETER (Sep 26, 2009)

JmanAllen said:


> I can't say much about how to build someone's confidence My whole apprenticeship was JM and contractors trying to make me lose my confidence, they called it cockyness lol, so I can't say it's wrong for an apprentice to be a little cocky cause I know I was. But be ready to have them tear you apart when you do mess up
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using ET Forum


Good advice.


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## RIVETER (Sep 26, 2009)

kaboler said:


> I haven't had to worry about power factor, and I haven't hooked up a capacitor bank, but that's about it. I've already done most everything.
> 
> I imagine I could hook up a capacitor bank too. Just waiting on the opportunity!!!


Now, that hurts....


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## Frasbee (Apr 7, 2008)

Jmohl said:


> Frasbee, there is a fine line between confidence and being a full blown douche bag. Kowblower jumped way over that line a looooooong time ago. To hear him tell it, he should just be able to sit for and EC license now. No need to apprentice for the next four years, he already knows all.


I was just replying to this from the original post:


> I'd also like to hear what it was that gave you confidence as your ability as an electrician, and stories and such.


Thought it was a reasonable question, or RFI.


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## IBEW191 (Apr 4, 2011)

Lets see some of your pipe racks, MCCS you built, how about a control circuit and tell us how what were looking at works. You want respect lets see your stuff man! Confidence comes with time in the trade, when you get assigned your project t and you can do it without f-ups. Your really setting yourself up for failure here man cause your gonna run across stuff that you think you know and can tackle but when you get so far someones gonna burst your bubble. I grantee you chould not last one quarter of a day doing what 80% of these guys on this forum do all day! In time yes, but you just arnt that good, NOBODY IS!


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## JmanAllen (Aug 3, 2011)

I got my confidence from just being so damn good. Lmao. 1st day doing electric work boss showed me how to bend a offset and a 90 after that he told me to pipe a room together and he would be in the other room if I need help. Got to a point where I needed a saddle and bent an almost perfect 4 point with out any help. He came in seen it and asked if the other guy bent it for me. 
Got my confidence as a foreman because I was put in charge of a commercial job right after I sent the paper work in to get approved to take the JM test. Then walked an inspector thru before I had tested and haven't failed an inspection yet knock on wood

Sent from my iPhone using ET Forum


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## RIVETER (Sep 26, 2009)

JmanAllen said:


> I got my confidence from just being so damn good. Lmao. 1st day doing electric work boss showed me how to bend a offset and a 90 after that he told me to pipe a room together and he would be in the other room if I need help. Got to a point where I needed a saddle and bent an almost perfect 4 point with out any help. He came in seen it and asked if the other guy bent it for me.
> Got my confidence as a foreman because I was put in charge of a commercial job right after I sent the paper work in to get approved to take the JM test. Then walked an inspector thru before I had tested and haven't failed an inspection yet knock on wood
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using ET Forum


I wish more of us were like you.


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## JmanAllen (Aug 3, 2011)

RIVETER said:


> I wish more of us were like you.


Ya but then I wouldn't stand out as such an ace lol. 

I'm really not all that cocky I say most of the cocky stuff as a joke

Sent from my iPhone using ET Forum


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## RIVETER (Sep 26, 2009)

JmanAllen said:


> Ya but then I wouldn't stand out as such an ace lol.
> 
> I'm really not all that cocky I say most of the cocky stuff as a joke
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using ET Forum


I get it. That's cool.


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## McClary’s Electrical (Feb 21, 2009)

JmanAllen said:


> I got my confidence from just being so damn good. Lmao. 1st day doing electric work boss showed me how to bend a offset and a 90 after that he told me to pipe a room together and he would be in the other room if I need help. Got to a point where I needed a saddle and bent an almost perfect 4 point with out any help. He came in seen it and asked if the other guy bent it for me.
> Got my confidence as a foreman because I was put in charge of a commercial job right after I sent the paper work in to get approved to take the JM test. Then walked an inspector thru before I had tested and haven't failed an inspection yet knock on wood
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using ET Forum


 

Anybody wanna bow down and pray to this guy?


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## RIVETER (Sep 26, 2009)

mcclary's electrical said:


> Anybody wanna bow down and pray to this guy?


I think he was just kidding. There is no way that he could be as good as me........and, of course...you.


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## McClary’s Electrical (Feb 21, 2009)

RIVETER said:


> I think he was just kidding. There is no way that he could be as good as me........and, of course...you.


 


Damn I thought I finally found a real God.


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## RIVETER (Sep 26, 2009)

mcclary's electrical said:


> Damn I thought I finally found a real God.


It happens. There are those out there who really do know a lot and think that they know "MORE". We, with our experience and knowledge just stand back and hope that they listened.


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## JmanAllen (Aug 3, 2011)

RIVETER said:


> I think he was just kidding. There is no way that he could be as good as me........and, of course...you.


Well ya maybe not as good as you. Riveter 

So maybe just a Demi god right now

Sent from my iPhone using ET Forum


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## goose134 (Nov 12, 2007)

You want to build your guy's confidence? Put him on another crew. With a journeyman who will teach him.


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## crosport (Apr 4, 2010)

It's not in an apprentice job description to boost the confidence of other apprentices.That's his business not yours.Leave him alone!Everybody has their own learning curves.Some take longer to learn but learn better than someone who does it once and feel they're an immediate expert.


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## oldtimer (Jun 10, 2010)

kaboler said:


> Something tells me I'll be getting a warning soon for defending myself. Don't bother moderator! I'll stop feeding the trolls.


 You would have no need to defend yourself, if you were anywhere near as intelligent as you think you are!

GROW UP. :thumbdown:

Harry; Do you still think we need to give this guy a break?


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

mcclary's electrical said:


> LEAVE HIS CONFIDENCE ALONE!!!
> 
> Confidence should come from experience, and feeling comfortable.
> 
> .


I have worked with a few long time electricians that have no confidence.

Depends on the personality.


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