# What are union wages in Alabama?



## mattd88 (Aug 3, 2013)

Anybody know what they are paying in Birmingham or Mobile?


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## J.Dunner (Apr 21, 2013)

Crap


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## mattd88 (Aug 3, 2013)

Figured, when I wanted to join they offered me 11/hr as a 1st year apprentice. I had been in the trade for almost 3 years. Just couldnt do it.


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## YeahOkay (Jun 5, 2011)

FYI - That is the same starting wage for a 1st year union apprentice in NYC as well.
It's a short term sacrifice while you learn the trade and get a better education.


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## mattd88 (Aug 3, 2013)

I went to work with another company offering a accredited apprenticeship program and made more money as well. Whats the contract labor rate for a apprentice in new york. Down here its around 30+/hr. Which means theres at least 20/hr floating around. Benefiets and retirement dont cost that much. They should atleast match what the scabs pay. We need unions here but nobody wants to join b/c of the pay.


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## mattd88 (Aug 3, 2013)

unions are supposed to be about making a fair wage. electricians are the top of the food chain when it comes to skilled labor. so why is it that the apprentices and helpers make less working union than most other skilled trades.


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## sbrn33 (Mar 15, 2007)

Electricians are the top of the food chain, but you are not an electrician yet. You are the guy that gets the electrician coffee. You may need to settle down.


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## FastFokker (Sep 18, 2012)

Just finish your apprenticeship outside the union.. then apply to join once you get your ticket. Don't join until they accept you as full journeyman.


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## 360max (Jun 10, 2011)

mattd88 said:


> Anybody know what they are paying in Birmingham or Mobile?


go to your states dept. of Labor and search 'prevailing wage', look for the county work is in, look under electrician


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## mattd88 (Aug 3, 2013)

sbrn33 said:


> Electricians are the top of the food chain, but you are not an electrician yet. You are the guy that gets the electrician coffee. You may need to settle down.


You may need to get your facts strait. I did finish, and the coffee days have been over for a while. Im just saying that the money should be better, theres no excuse for it not to be.The union is pretty much non existant in alabama and theres a reason why. The only way for anybody to make it on wages that low is if they're a kid and still live at home. A man with a family cant make it on that kind of money.


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## mattd88 (Aug 3, 2013)

alabama does not have prevailing wage laws.


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## Mulder (Sep 11, 2010)

mattd88 said:


> You may need to get your facts strait. I did finish, and the coffee days have been over for a while. Im just saying that the money should be better, theres no excuse for it not to be.The union is pretty much non existant in alabama and theres a reason why. The only way for anybody to make it on wages that low is if they're a kid and still live at home. A man with a family cant make it on that kind of money.



Make yourself invaluable. Union or not. Do more. Is your family worth it? If you can learn more, DO IT!

I am non union.


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## mattd88 (Aug 3, 2013)

Your completely right. I'm running my own jobs now and going back to college. You can never learn enough.


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## 360max (Jun 10, 2011)

mattd88 said:


> alabama does not have prevailing wage laws.


sorry to hear that


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

mattd88 said:


> I went to work with another company offering a accredited apprenticeship program and made more money as well. Whats the contract labor rate for a apprentice in new york. Down here its around 30+/hr. Which means theres at least 20/hr floating around. Benefiets and retirement dont cost that much. *They should atleast match what the scabs pay.* We need unions here but nobody wants to join b/c of the pay.


 
That is a disgusting term, for a business that is operating legally, employing workers. 

Are you working open shop?

Seems the open shops are beating the union (hard to believe) but how can you disparage them if their pay scale is better than the union.


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

mattd88 said:


> alabama does not have prevailing wage laws.


They are protecting the tax payers.

This whole post smells like a troll, in an apprenticeship, running jobs, 3 years in the trade.............Making better wages than union in Bama.

That there is a union in Bama surprises me.


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

brian john said:


> That is a disgusting term, for a business that is operating legally, employing workers.
> 
> Are you working open shop?
> 
> Seems the open shops are beating the union (hard to believe) but how can you disparage them if their pay scale is better than the union.


He miss used the term too, he should have said Kontractor.


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## Southeast Power (Jan 18, 2009)

brian john said:


> That is a disgusting term, for a business that is operating legally, employing workers.
> 
> Are you working open shop?
> 
> Seems the open shops are beating the union (hard to believe) but how can you disparage them if their pay scale is better than the union.


It could be a small suitcase local that maybe has one or two contractors or maintenance contractors.
That yellow ticket will open more doors than it will close.
I would get that proof of JATC. It is very valuable if you are considering working out of town or on a nuke.


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## Southeast Power (Jan 18, 2009)

brian john said:


> They are protecting the tax payers.
> 
> This whole post smells like a troll, in an apprenticeship, running jobs, 3 years in the trade.............Making better wages than union in Bama.
> 
> That there is a union in Bama surprises me.


So forcing people into section 8 housing, food stamps and public hospitals all of a sudden protects tax payers? Half full or half empty?


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## erics37 (May 7, 2009)

brian john said:


> They are protecting the tax payers.


Yeah, and Alabama is so much better off for it too 

If there is any place that would benefit from an organized working class, it's the impoverished, under-educated, obese South I keep reading horrid statistics about.


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## pete87 (Oct 22, 2012)

alabama does not have prevailing wage laws.[/QUOTE said:


> Is it called something else ?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


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## don_resqcapt19 (Jul 18, 2010)

mattd88 said:


> alabama does not have prevailing wage laws.


There will still be a published prevailing wage rate for the federally funded jobs that come under those rules.


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

jrannis said:


> So forcing people into section 8 housing, food stamps and public hospitals all of a sudden protects tax payers? Half full or half empty?


 
Who is forcing them and what does that have to do with Davis Bacon, I doubt the majority of ET members are union or on Davis Bacon jobs. Hands up for all the electricians in public housing. Do I hear a count?


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

erics37 said:


> Yeah, and Alabama is so much better off for it too
> 
> If there is any place that would benefit from an organized working class, it's the impoverished, under-educated, obese South I keep reading horrid statistics about.


 
And the vibrant north is doing so hot? Have you heard of Detroit and there are other cities on the brink?


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## eejack (Jul 14, 2012)

brian john said:


> That is a disgusting term, for a business that is operating legally, employing workers.


I agree. Terms like that are earned by the low of the low. Just because someone is working non union does mean they are worthy of such a disparaging remark. 

That is the most difficult concept to get across - union workers don't 'hate' non-union workers. If we hate anyone it is the contractors that destroy working conditions, work people unsafely and without regard, contractors willing to destroy families for a couple of dollars, willing to dangle scraps in front of the workforce to see who jumps up for it.

I see it on these forums all the time - workers forced to provide power tools, work strange hours, trade overtime for 'comp' time, miss out on family etc. yet they then turn around and call us entitled, lazy, thugs, whathaveyou.

We as workers really ought to find a more common ground and work on fixing the real problems.


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## robnj772 (Jan 15, 2008)

eejack said:


> If we hate anyone it is the contractors that destroy working conditions, work people unsafely and without regard, contractors willing to destroy families for a couple of dollars, willing to dangle scraps in front of the workforce to see who jumps up for it.
> .


And you know of this first hand? Or just what the brainwashing has taught you?


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

eejack said:


> I agree. Terms like that are earned by the low of the low. Just because someone is working non union does mean they are worthy of such a disparaging remark.
> 
> That is the most difficult concept to get across - union workers don't 'hate' non-union workers.


Then why do you stand outside the gate at construction sites and scream insults and obscenities at the non-union men just trying to go to work? Why do you walk slowly in front of their trucks to stop them from going in? Why do you spit on their trucks and call them despicable names? 

I've been to 164 pickets, you guys are no angels like you try to fool people into thinking.


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## mattd88 (Aug 3, 2013)

brian john said:


> They are protecting the tax payers.
> 
> This whole post smells like a troll, in an apprenticeship, running jobs, 3 years in the trade.............Making better wages than union in Bama.
> 
> That there is a union in Bama surprises me.


Read my previous post carefully. I was three years into the trade before i started my apprenticeship.


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## sbrn33 (Mar 15, 2007)

Ibtl


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## mattd88 (Aug 3, 2013)

All this thread was really about was the low wages our union guys make here in alabama. I am not a union member , but I support the union.When I need extra help on jobs we call the closest local. The job doesnt get done as fast but the work is better. Education is a serious problem around here with non-union guys. Most of the guys working non-union are smart and hard workers but you can really tell the difference when it gets past bending conduit and pulling wire.


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## dthurmond (Feb 7, 2011)

erics37 said:


> Yeah, and Alabama is so much better off for it too
> 
> If there is any place that would benefit from an organized working class, it's the impoverished, under-educated, obese South I keep reading horrid statistics about.


Better look all around the United States . This is a issue everywhere not just the south !


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## mattd88 (Aug 3, 2013)

robnj772 said:


> And you know of this first hand? Or just what the brainwashing has taught you?


I've seen it first hand.


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## robnj772 (Jan 15, 2008)

HackWork said:


> Then why do you stand outside the gate at construction sites and scream insults and obscenities at the non-union men just trying to go to work? Why do you walk slowly in front of their trucks to stop them from going in? Why do you spit on their trucks and call them despicable names?
> 
> I've been to 164 pickets, you guys are no angels like you try to fool people into thinking.


It's a well known fact 164 has small man syndrome . We worked in their territory all time, it was a joke " local 16 who???"

They have like what 164 members..... :lol:


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

mattd88 said:


> Read my previous post carefully. I was three years into the trade before i started my apprenticeship.


I did and?


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## eejack (Jul 14, 2012)

robnj772 said:


> And you know of this first hand? Or just what the brainwashing has taught you?


First hand.

Do you actually have any real world experience or do you just come into threads and act like an idiot naturally?


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## eejack (Jul 14, 2012)

robnj772 said:


> It's a well known fact 164 has small man syndrome . We worked in their territory all time, it was a joke " local 16 who???"
> 
> They have like what 164 members..... :lol:


Yeah - I have to admit - unions work best when our brother members don't constantly stab us in the back, screw over anyone they can to make an extra dollar, get on their knees to 'interview'. Guys like that cry the hardest.

You put the hood in brotherhood.


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## eejack (Jul 14, 2012)

HackWork said:


> Then why do you stand outside the gate at construction sites and scream insults and obscenities at the non-union men just trying to go to work? Why do you walk slowly in front of their trucks to stop them from going in? Why do you spit on their trucks and call them despicable names?
> 
> I've been to 164 pickets, you guys are no angels like you try to fool people into thinking.


Oh, I am sure you have spent many a day walking 164 pickets. :thumbsup:

:laughing::laughing::laughing:


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

eejack said:


> Oh, I am sure you have spent many a day walking 164 pickets. :thumbsup:
> 
> :laughing::laughing::laughing:


I have. And anyone who has been to a picket knows what I said is true, you're full of crap as usually.


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## robnj772 (Jan 15, 2008)

eejack said:


> First hand.
> 
> Do you actually have any real world experience or do you just come into threads and act like an idiot naturally?


I was in 102 way back when, have worked on both sides unlike 99.9 percent who engage in this union/ non union crap that you like to stir up.

I am a non union contractor now.

Most if the union propaganda is bull****

Just like you.


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## eejack (Jul 14, 2012)

HackWork said:


> I have. And anyone who has been to a picket knows what I said is true, you're full of crap as usually.


It depends upon the picket - we can get very nasty when needed. Way way back in the day things got ugly. 

That does not mean we call all non union electricians scab - which is what you are implying, nor does it mean we have a problem with non union electricians at all, which is also what you are getting at.

It is in the best interests of the worker, union and non union, to support the good contractors and bury the bad ones. When we end up on a picket, it is usually because of a bad contractor or end client - and not because of the workforce.

Any contractor willing to pay a decent wage and run a safe job is more than likely not getting a line.

You just want to argue because you can - but at least stop pretending you actually have even the essence of a clue. Be honest with yourself, be your own person, be genuine in your jealousy and hatred. Give in to it and let it flow over you. 

Now take a deep breath.

Slowly let it out.

Now don't you feel better


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## eejack (Jul 14, 2012)

robnj772 said:


> I was in 102 way back when, have worked on both sides unlike 99.9 percent who engage in this union/ non union crap that you like to stir up.
> 
> I am a non union contractor now.
> 
> ...


Now see, this is how I know you are just puking up stuff in this thread.

If you read my post ( which you did not ) I would be interested in seeing what I wrote that as propaganda.

Hrrm...I spoke out about using inflammatory and pejorative labels on folks.

Said we need to find common ground....yeah I can see how that is a problem.

And your response was brainwashing...

So you are a former 102 member from back in the day, but the light shone down upon you and you gave up your card and became a non union contractor - good for you. 

Do you pay your employees well or exploit them?
Do you provide safe tools and materials and expect your employees to work safely or do you look the other way when you need more 'productivity'?
Turnover?
Insurance rating?


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

eejack said:


> It depends upon the picket - we can get very nasty when needed. Way way back in the day things got ugly.
> 
> That does not mean we call all non union electricians scab - which is what you are implying, nor does it mean we have a problem with non union electricians at all, which is also what you are getting at.
> 
> ...


The fact of the matter is that you are a 1 trick pony. All you do is post to bolster the union, just like the other couple of brothers who only come out when their is a union topic (Hi Noah). Every single thing you say makes the union look 100% perfect, and you will not concede to even the slightest truth that may make the union look even slightly negative. 

In this thread you tried to put union members in a good light for not looking down on non-union workers, but that is simply not true. It's not realistic.

*Your union, your brothers, and yourself* have been to pickets and indiscriminately disparaged workers for no other reason than they weren't part of your club. You can try to cherry-coat it, but no one is going to believe it. I've been there, many members of this forum have too, standing on both sides of the fence. YOU have yelled at workers, insulted them, tried to stop them from going to work, simply because they were non-union. 

This is where you lie to cover your ass.



> Any contractor willing to pay a decent wage and run a safe job is more than likely not getting a line.


 That's another load of crap and everyone reading it knows it. It doesn't matter what the contractor is paying, if it's a job the union wants, the union will picket it.


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## eejack (Jul 14, 2012)

HackWork said:


> The fact of the matter is that you are a 1 trick pony. All you do is post to bolster the union, just like the other couple of brothers who only come out when their is a union topic (Hi Noah). Every single thing you say makes the union look 100% perfect, and you will not concede to even the slightest truth that may make the union look even slightly negative.
> 
> In this thread you tried to put union members in a good light for not looking down on non-union workers, but that is simply not true. It's not realistic.
> 
> ...


Yes, I always put the union in a positive light.

Why?

This thread is a perfect example.

I said nothing bad about anyone and yet you and Rob came in here crying about this and that.

Nothing you posted was relevant and yet here you are.

Anything I say will be twisted and perverted anyway so why make it easy, it is better for me to remain union positive since you are just gonna make it up your way anyway.

You don't want a discussion, you want a toehold. You want a soft spot to dig in your grubby little fingers. Sad really.

( rereads response - no lies - sorry to dissappoint ).


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## robnj772 (Jan 15, 2008)

eejack said:


> Now see, this is how I know you are just puking up stuff in this thread.
> 
> If you read my post ( which you did not ) I would be interested in seeing what I wrote that as propaganda.
> 
> ...


I pay and treat my guys well.

Been in business 9 years, the three guys I started with are all still with me.
These exploiting fairy tales you speak of are just fairy tales.

You are just a lying sack of ****.

You are Noah and LGLS all rolled up into one.


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## erics37 (May 7, 2009)

eejack said:


> I said nothing bad about anyone and yet you and Rob came in here crying about this and that.


Thank you.

According to the oppressed non-union guys here, all the union guys are bullies and thugs, but other than the occasional newbie that doesn't know any better, generally most of the bashing comes from the non-union side towards us. Often unprovoked as well.


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

eejack said:


> Yes, I always put the union in a positive light.
> 
> Why?
> 
> ...


 Sorry, but I just couldn't stand by and watch you outright lie like you did. 



> Nothing you posted was relevant and yet here you are.


 Do you want to go toe to toe on relevant posts? How many *electrical* posts have you made?



> Anything I say will be twisted and perverted anyway so why make it easy, it is better for me to remain union positive since you are just gonna make it up your way anyway.


 I did not twist anything, I quoted the words that you typed and I explained how they are a lie. I did so well at explaining it that you aren't even attempting to refute it. As usual, you have ignored it and are going off on different tangents. 



> You don't want a discussion, you want a toehold. You want a soft spot to dig in your grubby little fingers. Sad really.


I want you to stop lying, that's all. If you didn't lie, I wouldn't have called you out today. Don't ever try to say that union members don't have animosity towards non-union workers and say terrible things about them when you yourself have been part of so many large demonstrations proving that statement incorrect.


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

erics37 said:


> Thank you.
> 
> According to the oppressed non-union guys here, all the union guys are bullies and thugs, but other than the occasional newbie that doesn't know any better, generally most of the bashing comes from the non-union side towards us. Often unprovoked as well.


Screw you ball-boy, I've been in the union longer than you.


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## mattd88 (Aug 3, 2013)

I didnt mean to provoke anybody when i started this thread. But if you non union guys from up north came down here and worked you would quickly see my point. Oh and if you do, learn spanish before you get here.


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## uconduit (Jun 6, 2012)




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## mattd88 (Aug 3, 2013)

lmao, yep


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## erics37 (May 7, 2009)

HackWork said:


> Screw you ball-boy, I've been in the union longer than you.


:laughing:

Irrefutable logic


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## eejack (Jul 14, 2012)

HackWork said:


> Sorry, but I just couldn't stand by and watch you outright lie like you did.
> 
> Do you want to go toe to toe on relevant posts? How many *electrical* posts have you made?
> 
> ...


Occasionally you need to get out of your mother's basement and see the sun.

You have this bizarre idea that all union members are exactly the same - we all do X and Y and Z ( which is how I know you have no clue ). 

It would be like saying all non union electricians are like Cletis.
"Well Cletis uses romex connectors for bugs so all non union electricians use romex connectors for bugs".

Obviously the majority of ET is smart enough to know that is not the case.


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## eejack (Jul 14, 2012)

robnj772 said:


> I pay and treat my guys well.
> 
> Been in business 9 years, the three guys I started with are all still with me.
> These exploiting fairy tales you speak of are just fairy tales.
> ...


I am happy you treat your workers well - that is all that matters. However if you are trying to say that since you have done it therefore everyone else has done it....:laughing:

Or did we wander off into imagination land where all non union contractors pay well, provide benefits and decent hours and conditions. I apologize but it is not like the fairy tales, you cannot sit there saying "I think I can I think I can" over and over again to make daisys pop up and get the birds to chirp and turn all the companies into well run outfits like your own.


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

eejack said:


> Occasionally you need to get out of your mother's basement and see the sun.
> 
> You have this bizarre idea that all union members are exactly the same - we all do X and Y and Z ( which is how I know you have no clue ).
> 
> ...


I'm not talking about all, I am talking about *YOU*.

You said this:



eejack said:


> I agree. Terms like that are earned by the low of the low. Just because someone is working non union does mean they are worthy of such a disparaging remark.
> 
> That is the most difficult concept to get across - union workers don't 'hate' non-union workers.


Yet *YOU* have been a part of pickets in which you yelled at and insulted workers for no other reason than they are non-union. You have stood in front of their trucks, you have tried to stop them from going to work. You have harassed them. I've watched it, I've been a part of it, so don't come here and try to paint yourself in a good light as someone out to defend the worker when you yourself have done exactly what you posted saying you don't do.

So again, you can try to talk your way around it, but you are full of crap.


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

erics37 said:


> :laughing:
> 
> Irrefutable logic


Eric, you agreed with what eejack said about me (and Rob) and then went on your own rant about how bad the non-union guys here are, as if there was a correlation. I just wanted to point out that I am not non-union, I have been in the union a long time and there are many aspects of it that I have defended over the years. On the flip side, when I see someone say something that is so absolutely insane, I have to speak up. 

I've been a part of many pickets over the years, both my own union and eejack's (my sister local) and one thing that I can say for an absolute fact is that the union guys out there are most certainly making "disparaging remarks" and showing an extreme amount of hate for the workers themselves- for no other reason than they are non-union. eejack is one of those guys and he knows it. But of course he'll come here smelling like union roses saying how he is only out to help the non-union workers against the kontractors


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## hangle (Aug 18, 2010)

Wow!!! 30yrs in the electrical industry....I'm clueless. When I started I worked for $4.25 per hr often jumping ship for a .25 raise just to come back 6 months later for another .25. I was making $9.35 per hr when I decided to venture out on my own. Just wondering did anyone answer the OP, and what would you say is the typical payscale for union and non union newbies, journeyman and masters?


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

You could see the pay scale from most locals at this link: http://www.ibew.org/jobsboard/

You may have to play around with the date to get it to work.


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## hangle (Aug 18, 2010)

HackWork said:


> You could see the pay scale from most locals at this link: http://www.ibew.org/jobsboard/
> 
> You may have to play around with the date to get it to work.


 non union wages around here seem to be anchored in at 8 or 9 to learn upto about 20 to 22 for top dogs. how does that compare to other areas?


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## eejack (Jul 14, 2012)

hangle said:


> non union wages around here seem to be anchored in at 8 or 9 to learn upto about 20 to 22 for top dogs. how does that compare to other areas?


That is about right for Northern NJ non-union.


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## eejack (Jul 14, 2012)

HackWork said:


> Yet *YOU* have been a part of pickets in which you yelled at and insulted workers for no other reason than they are non-union. You have stood in front of their trucks, you have tried to stop them from going to work. You have harassed them. I've watched it, I've been a part of it, so don't come here and try to paint yourself in a good light as someone out to defend the worker when you yourself have done exactly what you posted saying you don't do.
> 
> So again, you can try to talk your way around it, but you are full of crap.


Well that makes perfect sense, you saw it therefore nothing else matters. 

How about you improve the view a bit and pull your head out of your tuckus, learn to read and reread this thread.

You seem hung up on a point that came out of your head that had nothing at all to do with this - kind of like me insisting you use a homeowner ladder because I have seen an electrician on one at some point so therefore it is true for all.

Back to my ignore pile.


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

eejack said:


> Well that makes perfect sense, you saw it therefore nothing else matters.
> 
> How about you improve the view a bit and pull your head out of your tuckus, learn to read and reread this thread.
> 
> ...


 I know for a fact that in your 30 years membership in the union you have been to pickets and you have yelled at and insulted workers for no other reason then they were nonunion. You have also watched dozens if not hundreds of your brothers doing the same exact thing. 

So when you come here and lie saying that union workers have no problem with nonunion workers, only the contractors, I am going to call you out on it. You can ignore me, but I will still be here to point out every single time that you rabidly defend the union at all costs even when they are wrong.


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## mattd88 (Aug 3, 2013)

hangle said:


> non union wages around here seem to be anchored in at 8 or 9 to learn upto about 20 to 22 for top dogs. how does that compare to other areas?


sounds close for comercial here. Add about 6 dollars an hour to to both for industrial. and 60-100 a day for travel over 60 miles


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

mattd88 said:


> sounds close for comercial here. Add about 6 dollars an hour to to both for industrial. and 60-100 a day for travel over 60 miles


matt what are you 

State Taxes
Real Estate Taxes
Cost of Housing
Gas per gallon


My point is USUALLY when wages are low so are the other items in the area.


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## J.Dunner (Apr 21, 2013)

brian john said:


> matt what are you
> 
> State Taxes
> Real Estate Taxes
> ...


That's what all rich people want the masses to believe.


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## ponyboy (Nov 18, 2012)

lots of tension in jersey tonight. you should all meet at a dennys and hash it out. I bet there's more people from jersey on here than any other state, it'd be a sweet fight. also, wtf is up with 2 winning tickets being sold in jersey? for the small size of the place you really know how to get your presence out there


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## Southeast Power (Jan 18, 2009)

HackWork said:


> I know for a fact that in your 30 years membership in the union you have been to pickets and you have yelled at and insulted workers for no other reason then they were nonunion. You have also watched dozens if not hundreds of your brothers doing the same exact thing.
> 
> So when you come here and lie saying that union workers have no problem with nonunion workers, only the contractors, I am going to call you out on it. You can ignore me, but I will still be here to point out every single time that you rabidly defend the union at all costs even when they are wrong.


30 years and I haven't been to a picket. Have I missed something?


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## Celtic (Nov 19, 2007)

ponyboy said:


> .... for the small size of the place you really know how to get your presence out there


:thumbup:


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## uconduit (Jun 6, 2012)

Someone please post a pic of an inflatable rat


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## Celtic (Nov 19, 2007)

uconduit said:


> Someone please post a pic of an inflatable raft


FIFY
:thumbsup:


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## ponyboy (Nov 18, 2012)

Celtic said:


> FIFY
> :thumbsup:


:laughing::laughing: awesome


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## mattd88 (Aug 3, 2013)

brian john said:


> matt what are you
> 
> State Taxes
> Real Estate Taxes
> ...


we have state and real estate taxes here. houseing is definatly cheaper than where you are . the average 3 br/ 2b house is about 150k. gas is only 3.20(but thats subject to change before i finish posting). doesnt matter though b/c most of our state is rural, most folks drive about a hour to work. If you own a service truck or pickup you can say thats about 200$ a week in gas. Oh and dont forget about why that 3br house is needed and little mouths to feed at home. And even public school isnt free here anymore. oh yeah and kids need clothes too...... Utilities, insurance......I could go on and on. Now take that 20 dollar an hour pay and multiply it by forty hours a week and cut taxes. Leaves you with about a 7 to 8 hundred dollar paycheck. It doesnt go far. And dont think about taking a day off, you'll be the hole. dont mention pd days b/c in construction here there are none.


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## uconduit (Jun 6, 2012)




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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

J.Dunner said:


> That's what all rich people want the masses to believe.


So you tell me taxes in Bama are as high as NY, NJ MA?

Housing?


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

mattd88 said:


> we have state and real estate taxes here. houseing is definatly cheaper than where you are . the average 3 br/ 2b house is about 150k. gas is only 3.20(but thats subject to change before i finish posting). doesnt matter though b/c most of our state is rural, most folks drive about a hour to work. If you own a service truck or pickup you can say thats about 200$ a week in gas. Oh and dont forget about why that 3br house is needed and little mouths to feed at home. And even public school isnt free here anymore. oh yeah and kids need clothes too...... Utilities, insurance......I could go on and on. Now take that 20 dollar an hour pay and multiply it by forty hours a week and cut taxes. Leaves you with about a 7 to 8 hundred dollar paycheck. It doesnt go far. And dont think about taking a day off, you'll be the hole. dont mention pd days b/c in construction here there are none.


OK where I live (well were the commoners live:no average house $450,000.00 for a townhouse, yearly taxes on the place 8,000.00 and up, most people are driving 60 - 90 minutes to work. Gas at present 3.60, food, clothing, 7.50 in tolls one way to DC, parking $135.00 a month and the rest and guess what, that 48.00 an hour goes fast.

In addition and this is true everywhere starting with the caveman, when they ran out of food or shelter they moved on, the history of our country is about people moving when times get tough where they are.


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

jrannis said:


> 30 years and I haven't been to a picket. Have I missed something?


33 years and I refused twice and that was a long time ago.


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## erics37 (May 7, 2009)

brian john said:


> OK where I live (well were the commoners live:no average house $450,000.00 for a townhouse, yearly taxes on the place 8,000.00 and up, most people are driving 60 - 90 minutes to work. Gas at present 3.60, food clothing 7.50 in tolls one way to DC, parking $135.00 a month and the rest and guess what, that 48.00 an hour goes fast.
> 
> In addition and this is true everywhere starting with the caveman, when they ran out of food or shelter they moved on, the history of our country is about people moving when times get tough where they are.


Boy, the whole "suburb" idea sure turned out to be a big frickin' mess :laughing:


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

erics37 said:


> Boy, the whole "suburb" idea sure turned out to be a big frickin' mess :laughing:


Yes, Loudoun went from a rural farm community to one of the richest and more expensive counties in the USA.

Top Ten Highest Income Counties

*1	Loudoun County, Virginia* 
$115,574
2	Falls Church City, Virginia	
$114,409
3	Fairfax County, Virginia	
$105,416
4	Los Alamos County, New Mexico	
$103,643
5	Howard County, Maryland	
$103,273
6	Hunterdon County, New Jersey	
$100,980
7	Douglas County, Colorado	
$99,198
8	Fairfax City, Virginia	
$97,900
9	Somerset County, New Jersey	
$97,440
10	Morris County, New Jersey	
$96,747


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## mattd88 (Aug 3, 2013)

No people here are smart enough not to stand for it. It also explains why mercedes,hyundai,honda, and toyota have all moved here. We also have plants that make parts for ford and volkswagon. All within the last 10 years. Were building a airbus facility too. Like wiping your ass with toilet paper? Guess where most of it comes from. Those pine 2x4 boards your house was built with prob came from here too. So those high taxes are nothing to brag about.


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## mattd88 (Aug 3, 2013)

450K would buy a buy a nice 4br on a lake here. How far do people actually travel on that 60-90min commute to work?


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

mattd88 said:


> No people here are smart enough not to stand for it. It also explains why mercedes,hyundai,honda, and toyota have all moved here. We also have plants that make parts for ford and volkswagon. All within the last 10 years. Were building a airbus facility too. Like wiping your ass with toilet paper? Guess where most of it comes from. Those pine 2x4 boards your house was built with prob came from here too. So those high taxes are nothing to brag about.


I ain't braggin I am b*tchin, my point was you have work, you could get a factory job (possibly) and you get pay comenserate with your living cost, just as wages are ALMOST comenserate with the cost of living here.

I will say and I am not sayig you are doing this. Every person that tells me they are struggling to make bills are typically (IN MY AREA) living beyond their means, iarge house 4,000-5,000 sqft, BMW, motor cycle, boat, jet skis and a decent vacation every year, camper.


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

mattd88 said:


> 450K would buy a buy a nice 4br on a lake here.


And 350K-450K is a starter house here.


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## mattd88 (Aug 3, 2013)

same here just change the bmw out with a 45 thousand dollar truck. add hunting club dues and a couple of four wheelers to the mix. I cant see how people live like that.


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## mattd88 (Aug 3, 2013)

if your smart enough to self contract and do alot of shopping around, a starter house can be built for 80 to 100k here


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

mattd88 said:


> if your smart enough to self contract and do alot of shopping around, a starter house can be built for 80 to 100k here


I have done one total gut and built two houses...I am done, next one, if there is one, is 100% subbed out.


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

mattd88 said:


> if your smart enough to self contract and do alot of shopping around, a starter house can be built for 80 to 100k here


you can't get a lot for that unless you head one hour west.


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## J.Dunner (Apr 21, 2013)

brian john said:


> OK where I live (well were the commoners live:no average house $450,000.00 for a townhouse, yearly taxes on the place 8,000.00 and up, most people are driving 60 - 90 minutes to work. Gas at present 3.60, food, clothing, 7.50 in tolls one way to DC, parking $135.00 a month and the rest and guess what, that 48.00 an hour goes fast.
> 
> In addition and this is true everywhere starting with the caveman, when they ran out of food or shelter they moved on, the history of our country is about people moving when times get tough where they are.


Guys, BJ is conveniently leaving out the part where he lives in the wealthiest county in the COUNTRY.


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## FastFokker (Sep 18, 2012)

brian john said:


> And 350K-450K is a starter house here.


And $350-450k wont even buy a house here... Tear down houses start around $550-600k.


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

J.Dunner said:


> Guys, BJ is conveniently leaving out the part where he lives in the wealthiest county in the COUNTRY.


I just got your avatar :laughing::thumbup:


You still working?


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

J.Dunner said:


> Guys, BJ is conveniently leaving out the part where he lives in the wealthiest county in the COUNTRY.


See post 77 where I explain in detail that I live in one of the wealthiest counties in the Country


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

FastFokker said:


> And $350-450k wont even buy a house here... Tear down houses start around $550-600k.



There are GCs here that buy two 1959 houses on one acre lots tear them down and put up one multi-million dollar mansion. Or the other way tear down 4 and put up 20 townhouses.

All depends on the area.


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## FastFokker (Sep 18, 2012)

If I knew I could build a house for a good price, I would do the same.. buy a tear down for $8-900k, build a nice house and sell it for closer to $2mil. Net some $2-300k. 

Right now I've got my eye on junk houses on big lots. 

Buy a crappy house on a ~15,000sqft lot for $700k. Tear the house down and subdivide the property, and sell each lot for $650k. 

Few guys around here have scored on that one. Just gotta act FAST.


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

HackWork said:


> I just got your avatar :laughing::thumbup:
> 
> 
> You still working?


DAMN Hack your world wide insight just keyed me into his avatar:thumbsup:


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