# Above ground fuel dispensing



## 10492 (Jan 4, 2010)

I have never been involved with fuel dispensing, and could use some advice.

This is what I've got. 3 above ground tanks. One gasoline, the one on the far left. The other two, on the right of the generator, are diesel, one for road use, and one for off road use. The diesel tanks I am not to worried about, as they are not classified. I think the only thing I need to do to them, is bond the tanks together.
































They want the standby generator out of there, and install permanent electric from the building. I plan on cutting up the asphalt and concrete pads, digging down 10" and laying RMC from the building to a pedestal attached to the knee wall behind the tanks, as close as I can to the diesel tank. I plan on covering the RMC with 2 or 3" of concrete, tape, fill and patch the asphalt. 
On the building, 75' away, installing a mushroom disconnect. From there I plan on installing a seal, then go underground, and pop up on the knee wall with some strut. Another seal on the RMC at the pedestal 18" above ground, and into a 3Gang EX-proof box for some switches with motor starters.....each pump is 1/3 HP. The gas dispensor is the only one I need to be careful about. I plan on coming out of the one switch with RMC along the wall. Out of the Switch gang box with another seal, over about 10' and hit a another seal, then use MI cable to the pump.

Does this sound right. 514 has me confused....

Tx.


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## McClary’s Electrical (Feb 21, 2009)

I think you got it. Keep in mind the mushroom will be required to break the grounded conductor too.


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## 10492 (Jan 4, 2010)

mcclary's electrical said:


> I think you got it. Keep in mind the mushroom will be required to break the grounded conductor too.


1. Is it correct to understand that I need a seal at the building, because I go underground of a C1D1 area?

2. If I add a light 12' in the air, I don't need to worry about it being EX proof?

3. One other Question, other than the switches for the pumps, I do not need another e-shut off (mushroom) at the pumps?


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## McClary’s Electrical (Feb 21, 2009)

Dnkldorf said:


> 1. Is it correct to understand that I need a seal at the building, because I go underground of a C1D1 area?
> 
> 2. If I add a light 12' in the air, I don't need to worry about it being EX proof?
> 
> 3. One other Question, other than the switches for the pumps, I do not need another e-shut off (mushroom) at the pumps?


 

1) IMO, yes
2) True
3) if under 100 ft, no (I'm gonna double check that distance but I remember 100)


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## hardworkingstiff (Jan 22, 2007)

Dnkldorf said:


> 1. Is it correct to understand that I need a seal at the building, because I go underground of a C1D1 area?


yes


> 2. If I add a light 12' in the air, I don't need to worry about it being EX proof?


Provided you are out of the class 1 area of the gas tank. Be sure to look at the vent influence.


> 3. One other Question, other than the switches for the pumps, I do not need another e-shut off (mushroom) at the pumps?


 You need an E-Stop within 100' of the pump,


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## 10492 (Jan 4, 2010)

Do I even need motor starters?


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## sbrn33 (Mar 15, 2007)

I would just have that sucker bored then you would have proper depth and not have to screw with the concrete much. Should cost you $750 at the most.


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## CTshockhazard (Aug 28, 2009)

Since you say your cutting up asphalt I'm going to (_dare I say it_) assume you'll need 24" of cover even for RMC with concrete encasement due to being under driveway/parking lot. If so, use the exception to save some $, the RMC/IMC only has to go 2 feet underground where you can then changeover to PVC.

Remember that the sealing fittings must be the first fitting upon emergence from grade with the exception of listed (class I, II, III) reducing bushings. Also, many sealing fittings only allow for 25% cross sectional area as opposed to the 40% allowed for conduit, hence the allowance for reducing bushings.

E-Stop has to be more than 20 feet and less than 100 feet. Location of E-Stop also must be acceptable to AHJ so if it requires running any conduit underground, I'd get a ruling _beforehand_.

Look carefully at the picture for the dispenser classified areas in 514, there's also a chart listing for the dispenser and aboveground tank. I doubt you'll be placing the starters/equipment in the classified area. The 20 foot radius is only from the ground to 18 inches up. From 18 inches above ground to the height of the dispenser you only need to be 18 inches away from it.


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## hardworkingstiff (Jan 22, 2007)

Dnkldorf said:


> Do I even need motor starters?


Those should be thermally protected motors and come with their own control (on/off) switch.

Pay attention to where you put unions. Make sure you have a union between the motor JB and the sealoff. I've seen too many 1st time guys not think about this and install (out of the JB) a nipple, an explosion proof capped 90, then a horizontal sealoff, then a union. The problem is once the sealoff gets poured, you have no way to disconnect the pump for repair/replacement.

Don't forget to look at the tank classified location, I think there is 10' from the tank in there somewhere.


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## McClary’s Electrical (Feb 21, 2009)

Dnkldorf said:


> Do I even need motor starters?


 
With the pumps in that picture, NO


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## Shockdoc (Mar 4, 2010)

Watch out, I backed that Ryder truck there yesterday.


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## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

I don't have a code ref, but would imagine a _running_ genny in the middle of those fuel pumps just a tad concerning to your local fire marshal Dnkl

this brings more Q's that A's from me....

does the gear for it install in the pump zone(s) ?

If in fact it serves the pump(s) , would the e-stop shut it down as well?

~CS~


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## 10492 (Jan 4, 2010)

CT, I did forget about the 24" for parking lots, which actually brings up more problems around here now-a-days. The building codes now call for seepage pits to reduce flooding. They are only like 1' under the parking lot asphalt. I can't even imagine how you would get pipe down 24" without hitting them. This particular place, I highly doubt has them under the lot, as it was built maybe 40 yrs ago.

Steve, I would imagine the FM knows about it. He does yearly inspections at the place.


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## frenchelectrican (Mar 15, 2007)

chicken steve said:


> I don't have a code ref, but would imagine a _running_ genny in the middle of those fuel pumps just a tad concerning to your local fire marshal Dnkl
> 
> this brings more Q's that A's from me....
> 
> ...


P.S.

If you did read the first part what he say the generatour is being removed so will be using hardwired set up.

But for other question the other guys did hit the nail on head and I am sure there may be a local adment added to the codes so Dnkldorf will know more details on this one.

I know in state of Wisconsin do not allow any PVC for fuel dispenders units at all so only run in rigid steel conduit and of course 24 inch down.

Merci,
Marc


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