# AFCI Issue



## pcal (Mar 21, 2011)

I was on a job-site working at a home that was built in 2009 with GE AFCI breakers. Here is the issue, I can't seem to figure out. The livingroom and bedroom are on 2 sep. circuits - both AFCI. If the TV is on in the livingroom, and the homeowner switches on the light in the bedroom (dimmer/fan control slider), it trips the breaker in the livingroom. Keep in mind that these are 2 completely independent lines. Pulled all the outlets, recessed cans - no issues, check neutrals at the panel - no issues. Swap out AFCI for standard 15AMP - does not trip. TV is new, draws less than 1 AMP. What kills me is the fact that the bedroom light trips the other line. (Yet, bedroom arc-fault does not trip). Also changed the AFCI to make sure the breaker was not bad - new one trips too. Any insight?

Thx!


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## Big John (May 23, 2010)

My first thought is mixed neutral between the two circuits and maybe the tripping AFCI is working properly, but the holding AFCI isn't? First thing I'd do is swap that one out as well and see what happens.

-John


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## ichimo23 (Nov 30, 2009)

Check your neutrals. If you were an electrician, that's the first thing you would have done....


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## pcal (Mar 21, 2011)

Hi John,

Thx for the reply. I thought the same. No mixed neutrals and I changed both afci's. Its baffling.


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## pcal (Mar 21, 2011)

Thx for the reply ichimo. If you read the initial post, you would see that I did. Thx for for the sarcastic jab too.


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## Big John (May 23, 2010)

This only happens when the TV is on...? I'd unplug the TV and put a lamp in it's place. See if that also causes a trip. That would help rule out some hocus-pocus like electronic interference. I would also lift the hot, neutral, and ground on the holding AFCI and see if you measure voltage on either one of those when loads on the tripping AFCI circuit are activated.

-John


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## ichimo23 (Nov 30, 2009)

Sorry for the jab, couldn't resist. You weren't explicitly clear in the initial post that you checked ALL the neutrals. The fact that the issue is occurring in adjacent rooms should be a big clue to where the problem most likely is (and it's not in the panel). If you absolutely rule out that there are not any neutrals from 'the other' circuit intermingled (and perform the troubleshooting that John suggested), with no luck; I would then swap out the tripping AFCI with a new (eg 'modern') combination type.


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

pcal said:


> I was on a job-site working at a home that was built in 2009 with GE AFCI breakers. Here is the issue, I can't seem to figure out. The livingroom and bedroom are on 2 sep. circuits - both AFCI. If the TV is on in the livingroom, and the homeowner switches on the light in the bedroom (dimmer/fan control slider), it trips the breaker in the livingroom. Keep in mind that these are 2 completely independent lines. Pulled all the outlets, recessed cans - no issues, check neutrals at the panel - no issues. Swap out AFCI for standard 15AMP - does not trip. TV is new, draws less than 1 AMP. What kills me is the fact that the bedroom light trips the other line. (Yet, bedroom arc-fault does not trip). Also changed the AFCI to make sure the breaker was not bad - new one trips too. Any insight?
> 
> Thx!


You have too check all the splices by removing wire nuts if the splices come apart when you remove the wire nuts then you have found the problem Afci breakers are made to detect the work of lazy careless Electricians that do not twist their wires together to make a good solid splice first before installing wire nuts ..

Check all the switches and receptacles see if they tighten the screws...


Welcome to the forum enjoy the fun..:thumbup::thumbup:


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## ichimo23 (Nov 30, 2009)

Oh, and start your checking at the receptacle outlet that powers the TV


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## pcal (Mar 21, 2011)

Thx for the reply, the rooms are on 2 different floors. No intermingling neutrals, and it had only happened with the TV on. I did plug something else in the outlet removed the tv and no tripping. Must be the tv. Just can't figure why a switch on a completely different circuit would cause the trip.


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## Jason8n (Jan 24, 2011)

dang arc faults...


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## ichimo23 (Nov 30, 2009)

So the breaker holds with the TV on, but opens when you turn on a switch in a different room, on a verified independant circuit? 

I get the feeling i've been trolled by a 1,000+ or banned poster who is bored on a Sunday night.....


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## Roger123 (Sep 23, 2007)

pcal said:


> No intermingling neutrals,


How did you verify that?


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## I_get_shocked (Apr 6, 2009)

Roger123 said:


> How did you verify that?


how about turning off the breaker, finding the corresponding neutral, lifting it and measuring between the neutral conductor and the neutral bus? if you get 120, then you are returning on the wrong path


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## French ICC (Mar 21, 2011)

*I'm interrested in your problem*



pcal said:


> I was on a job-site working at a home that was built in 2009 with GE AFCI breakers. Here is the issue, I can't seem to figure out. The livingroom and bedroom are on 2 sep. circuits - both AFCI. If the TV is on in the livingroom, and the homeowner switches on the light in the bedroom (dimmer/fan control slider), it trips the breaker in the livingroom. Keep in mind that these are 2 completely independent lines. Pulled all the outlets, recessed cans - no issues, check neutrals at the panel - no issues. Swap out AFCI for standard 15AMP - does not trip. TV is new, draws less than 1 AMP. What kills me is the fact that the bedroom light trips the other line. (Yet, bedroom arc-fault does not trip). Also changed the AFCI to make sure the breaker was not bad - new one trips too. Any insight?
> 
> Thx!


Hello, I'm very interrested in your problem, because I'm an active member of the new advide-efva association. Can you send the wiring diagrams of both circuits? Thanks, Best regards, French ICC


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## Ranger2001 (Jan 12, 2011)

for what is worth, I try a 2-pole switch, switching the neutral at the smae time.

You might also check to see if the AFCI has been re-call by the MFG.


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## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

good point

another might be what version afci it is

aren't we on version #3 now?

~S~


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## maulick (Apr 2, 2011)

Obviously none of us knows your situation exactly. But have you checked polarity of everything. I feel the one person above was on the right track in trying to understand the return path. Else a ground loop would have the same effect. ( we all know how hard those are to find.


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## rodman67 (Apr 2, 2011)

I have had this problem happen to me on more than one occasion. It always resulted in the two seperate circuits neutrals being tied together. and on one occasion it was a loose neutral in the light.


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