# 4 Square raised cover for low voltage



## TOOL_5150 (Aug 27, 2007)

Other than a plaster ring, do I have any options for something like a 4 square raised cover that can accept keystone jacks?


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## chewy (May 9, 2010)

Do you not have PVC deepmount boxes? If our installs arent MUTOs then we use switch plates up to 8 gang as they make keystone clips for the jacks that fit the same way as a switch.


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## MDShunk (Jan 7, 2007)

Yeah, someone makes an RS cover for keystone jacks. I think I saw it in the CDW catalog. Forget the manufacturer. Your other option is to use a mud ring and a plate, like most people do, but I know that looks like azz. 

You're on to something, though. We need some more options for industrial work. Some guys use and FD body or Red Dot box so the plate doesn't over hang.


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## MDShunk (Jan 7, 2007)

Just rolling this around in my head a little...

You could use an RS cover with one or two GFCI openings, then get those adapter things that adapt a GFCI opening to keystone jack holes.


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## D-Bo (Apr 15, 2012)

MDShunk said:


> Just rolling this around in my head a little...
> 
> You could use an RS cover with one or two GFCI openings, then get those adapter things that adapt a GFCI opening to keystone jack holes.


yeah what he said. i dont know what you use but leviton has inserts of all verieties that snap into decora style plates that can be used with a gfci style raised cover. works pretty slick when you're doing 100% surface work


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## TOOL_5150 (Aug 27, 2007)

MDShunk said:


> Just rolling this around in my head a little...
> 
> You could use an RS cover with one or two GFCI openings, then get those adapter things that adapt a GFCI opening to keystone jack holes.


yeah, I came back here to post that very same thing. This will work perfect, since the receptacles are decora as well. Not sure why I was trying to over think it. :thumbsup:


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## stuiec (Sep 25, 2010)

MDShunk said:


> Just rolling this around in my head a little...
> 
> You could use an RS cover with one or two GFCI openings, then get those adapter things that adapt a GFCI opening to keystone jack holes.


 
Like 

View attachment 14699
+
View attachment 14700


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## erics37 (May 7, 2009)

TOOL_5150 said:


> yeah, I came back here to post that very same thing. This will work perfect, since the receptacles are decora as well. Not sure why I was trying to over think it. :thumbsup:


Not that the tried-and-true methods suggested wouldn't work, but if you ever do find a product like that, I'd like to know!


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## TOOL_5150 (Aug 27, 2007)

Though, a 9 port RS cover would be cool...


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## erics37 (May 7, 2009)

TOOL_5150 said:


> Though, a 9 port RS cover would be cool...


Do they make 4" square boxes with 1" KOs in the CENTER of each side?


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## TOOL_5150 (Aug 27, 2007)

not that i know of.


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## D-Bo (Apr 15, 2012)

erics37 said:


> Do they make 4" square boxes with 1" KOs in the CENTER of each side?


the only thing different ive used is 4 squares with two 3/4" ko on each side. never seen what you are looking for.


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## BBQ (Nov 16, 2010)

Sure seems like you better use a deep box, screw it run big wiremold.


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## MDShunk (Jan 7, 2007)

erics37 said:


> Do they make 4" square boxes with 1" KOs in the CENTER of each side?


Sort of. You can get a 4-11/16" box with a 1-1/4" knockout in the center, and use 4-11 RS covers. If you're putting 9 to a box, you might appreciate the 4-11's better anyhow.


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## erics37 (May 7, 2009)

D-Bo said:


> the only thing different ive used is 4 squares with two 3/4" ko on each side. never seen what you are looking for.


Well Raco makes the 4-square with 1" KOs 2 on each side. They work nice for data cables but it's kinda goofy looking with the conduit not being centered on the box.


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## TOOL_5150 (Aug 27, 2007)

BBQ said:


> Sure seems like you better use a deep box, screw it run big wiremold.


boxes are already mounted, i got "given" this job 1/4 way into it.now its my mess. i definitely exceeded pipe fill today.


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## MDShunk (Jan 7, 2007)

TOOL_5150 said:


> boxes are already mounted, i got "given" this job 1/4 way into it.now its my mess. i definitely exceeded pipe fill today.


Awesome. Gotta love it. What brainiac thought 4-squares would be a good idea for 9 network cables?


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## D-Bo (Apr 15, 2012)

erics37 said:


> Well Raco makes the 4-square with 1" KOs 2 on each side. They work nice for data cables but it's kinda goofy looking with the conduit not being centered on the box.


using regular 4 squares and punching out center kos to 1 inch would be a good job for a green apprentice to acquaint him with the subtleties of the hydraulic punch. or the slug buster if you don't like him


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## TOOL_5150 (Aug 27, 2007)

MDShunk said:


> Awesome. Gotta love it. What brainiac thought 4-squares would be a good idea for 9 network cables?


I got 12 cables in a 1" emt, 6 of which cat6e. It aint purdy, but it worked.the boss has great ideas....


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## MDShunk (Jan 7, 2007)

TOOL_5150 said:


> I got 12 cables in a 1" emt, 6 of which cat6e. It aint purdy, but it worked.the boss has great ideas....


Yeah, I'm not even sure what the right size is for 6 cat5 and 6 cat6 cables is. Probably 1-1/2". My gut is usually right on conduit fills.


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## erics37 (May 7, 2009)

D-Bo said:


> using regular 4 squares and punching out center kos to 1 inch would be a good job for a green apprentice to acquaint him with the subtleties of the hydraulic punch. or the slug buster if you don't like him


That leads to the problem of taking the adjacent KOs out with the center one by accident, plus the center KOs are usually set too far back to punch it out to 1" and still be able to get a locknut on there easily.

But indeed, it does work :thumbup:


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## MDShunk (Jan 7, 2007)

erics37 said:


> That leads to the problem of taking the adjacent KOs out with the center one by accident, plus the center KOs are usually set too far back to punch it out to 1" and still be able to get a locknut on there easily.
> 
> But indeed, it does work :thumbup:


You can get blank 4-squares. I think Garvin makes them. Maybe others too. Used them on cord drops before, where they were concerned about extra knockouts getting pushed in.


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## MDShunk (Jan 7, 2007)

http://www.garvinindustries.com/Ele...oxes/4-deep-with-Conduit-Knockouts/52191-BLNK


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## MDShunk (Jan 7, 2007)




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## erics37 (May 7, 2009)

Damn, that's so blank it doesn't even have screw holes. It's a 4-square virgin.


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## user4818 (Jan 15, 2009)

I think the blank 4" squares are for Chicago's plenum ceiling code.


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## D-Bo (Apr 15, 2012)

MDShunk said:


> http://www.garvinindustries.com/Ele...oxes/4-deep-with-Conduit-Knockouts/52191-BLNK


holy mackrel. i had no idea...


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## MDShunk (Jan 7, 2007)

Peter D said:


> I think the blank 4" squares are for Chicago's plenum ceiling code.


I'm pretty sure you're right. Garvin serves the Chicago marketplace heavily.


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## MDShunk (Jan 7, 2007)

erics37 said:


> Damn, that's so blank it doesn't even have screw holes. It's a 4-square virgin.


But I've found you can Ramset them onto a block wall, no problem. :thumbsup:


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## BBQ (Nov 16, 2010)

MDShunk said:


> Yeah, I'm not even sure what the right size is for 6 cat5 and 6 cat6 cables is. Probably 1-1/2". My gut is usually right on conduit fills.


Don't some of the standards limit it to like four cables per raceway or some such thing?


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## erics37 (May 7, 2009)

BBQ said:


> Don't some of the standards limit it to like four cables per raceway or some such thing?


I hope not, I've seen hundreds of Cat 5e and Cat 6 cables jammed into 4" pipes.


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## user4818 (Jan 15, 2009)

MDShunk said:


> I'm pretty sure you're right. Garvin serves the Chicago marketplace heavily.


Yeah, Garvin also makes 4" squares with punched knockouts but no screw holes. I had never seen or heard of such a thing until I read their catalog.


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## user4818 (Jan 15, 2009)

erics37 said:


> I hope not, I've seen hundreds of Cat 5e and Cat 6 cables jammed into 4" pipes.


Cool story, bro.


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## BBQ (Nov 16, 2010)

Peter D said:


> Yeah, Garvin also makes 4" squares with punched knockouts but no screw holes. I had never seen or heard of such a thing until I read their catalog.



:nerd::nerd::nerd::nerd:


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## BBQ (Nov 16, 2010)

erics37 said:


> I hope not, I've seen hundreds of Cat 5e and Cat 6 cables jammed into 4" pipes.


I only see that for short runs, like a sleeve between floors without bends 


I am thinking the same standards that keep us to two 90s max.


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## MDShunk (Jan 7, 2007)

BBQ said:


> Don't some of the standards limit it to like four cables per raceway or some such thing?


Hmmmm.... jogs my memory about an old BICSI standard. I've seen 4" conduits pretty full for the "home run pipe" to IDF's plenty of times.


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## user4818 (Jan 15, 2009)

BBQ said:


> :nerd::nerd::nerd::nerd:


I can't deny it. :laughing::laughing:


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## erics37 (May 7, 2009)

BBQ said:


> I only see that for short runs, like a sleeve between floors without bends
> 
> 
> I am thinking the same standards that keep us to two 90s max.


Ohhhh I see now. I think you're a bit mixed up on this one. You're thinking of the 4" pipe that the phone company demands be installed with a pull string in it for their one single 25-pair cable.


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## Ty Wrapp (Aug 24, 2011)

erics37 said:


> Ohhhh I see now. I think you're a bit mixed up on this one. You're thinking of the 4" pipe that the phone company demands be installed with a pull string in it for their one single 25-pair cable.


I wish...The Engineers around here won't put in a 25 pr. They spec the job to be fed with drops and 1 inch conduit. You're lucky if you can get enough drops in for the service requirements.


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## chewy (May 9, 2010)

MDShunk said:


> Yeah, I'm not even sure what the right size is for 6 cat5 and 6 cat6 cables is. Probably 1-1/2". My gut is usually right on conduit fills.


Its usually dependent on manufacturers specifications, for a network to get a Cat6A certification for instance, the trunking and droppers etc has to be rated Cat6A and no more than 24 cables on a catenary wire in the ceiling etc etc. In saying that what they don't know generally doesn't hurt them.


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## MDShunk (Jan 7, 2007)

chewy said:


> Its usually dependent on manufacturers specifications, for a network to get a Cat6A certification for instance, the trunking and droppers etc has to be rated Cat6A and no more than 24 cables on a catenary wire in the ceiling etc etc. In saying that what they don't know generally doesn't hurt them.


Kinda mirrors my thoughts on design specs too. As long as it certifies in the end, who cares. I try to follow all the specs I know about, but sometimes I'll run afoul of one out of ignorance or sometimes choice.


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## BBQ (Nov 16, 2010)

erics37 said:


> Ohhhh I see now. I think you're a bit mixed up on this one. You're thinking of the 4" pipe that the phone company demands be installed with a pull string in it for their one single 25-pair cable.


:no:


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## Jim Port (Oct 1, 2007)

When you need the extra volume just use one of these.

http://www.garvinindustries.com/Electrical-Junction-Boxes/6-Square-Junction-Boxes


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