# Check out this poster from a retail store...



## SparkYZ (Jan 20, 2010)

I came across this poster at the large (very large) retail store remodel I'm working on....

Thoughts?

I'm not going to mention the store name, I'm sure you can figure it out due to the color scheme....


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## RIVETER (Sep 26, 2009)

Everything on that poster is a true statement. What is purposely left out is that the union can and will attempt to aid you when your rights as a worker are in jepardy. A lot of times that will involve just about everything on the poster.


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## JohnR (Apr 12, 2010)

yeah that little daisy in the corner says it all.

Sounds like a poster saying


*We hate the idea of our employees going union, 
and are scared that you will. 
Besides that, consider this a veiled threat 
that we will fight to the end 
on this point*​


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## Bkessler (Feb 14, 2007)

JohnR said:


> yeah that little daisy in the corner says it all.
> 
> Sounds like a poster saying
> 
> ...


Sounds like the poster is saying,

unions suck and are a huge reason that everything in the U.S. is made in china, have contributed to the fall of the US auto industry and continue to be a thorn in the side of 92% of the workforce.


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## SparkYZ (Jan 20, 2010)

I dont mean to start a debate. I am not, nor do I think I will be in the near future, in the IBEW. 

I just find it hilarious that this company put this poster up, and put it in a nice case behind glass, right above the jobclock...


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## Frasbee (Apr 7, 2008)

All this says is Big Corporate hates Big Business because it makes it more difficult for them to exploit the little guy.


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

Frasbee said:


> All this says is Big Corporate hates Big Business because it makes it more difficult for them to exploit the little guy.


 
Or maybe it means Big Corporate hates Big union because it makes it more difficult for them to operate a business without headaches.


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## Bob Badger (Apr 19, 2009)

Frasbee said:


> All this says is Big Corporate hates Big Business because it makes it more difficult for them to exploit the little guy.



That is funny, I never knew we are not allowed to quit and find other work.


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## RIVETER (Sep 26, 2009)

Bob Badger said:


> That is funny, I never knew we are not allowed to quit and find other work.


Well, unions can't protect you from everything. My boss just came by and chewed me out for something I didn't even do......My job.


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## jwjrw (Jan 14, 2010)

SparkYZ said:


> I came across this poster at the large (very large) retail store remodel I'm working on....
> 
> Thoughts?
> 
> I'm not going to mention the store name, I'm sure you can figure it out due to the color scheme....


 

:lol::laughing:

I love it!!


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## millerdrr (Jun 26, 2009)

Virtually every large retailer I've been in has a flip chart for what to do in case of emergency. They have a page for hurricane, robbery, lost child...and union contact.


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## slickvic277 (Feb 5, 2009)

SparkYZ said:


> I came across this poster at the large (very large) retail store remodel I'm working on....
> 
> Thoughts?
> 
> I'm not going to mention the store name, I'm sure you can figure it out due to the color scheme....



This poster is border line illegal. To bad the law makers in this country don't give a flying f*ck about the working class. What do you think would happen if an employee put up a poster that said,

Union's will bargain collectively for hire wages.
Union's will offer legal advise and representation if needed.
Union workers on average make 25% more then there non-union counterparts.
You have the RIGHT to VOTE for a union. 
It's YOUR choice.

I wonder what would happen then. This is clearly a double standard.
Yeah, I know. Union's are the bad guys. Poor Walmart would go under if there employees were unionized. 




Bkessler said:


> Sounds like the poster is saying,
> 
> unions suck and are a huge reason that everything in the U.S. is made in china, have contributed to the fall of the US auto industry and continue to be a thorn in the side of 92% of the workforce.


keep listening to Rush Limbaugh. I know, I know, your opinions are facts and I'm just brainwashed. You tea baggers all sound like broken records.
You just keep repeating the same stupid sh*t over and over again. Do you ever have anything new to say?

Unions are not the reason why the auto industry failed. Horrible management and absurd CEO salaries and bonuses. The CEO of GM maid 400 times more then the average auto worker. When union membership was near 40% in this country the gap was much smaller. More like 40 times the average worker.

This country thrived before outsourcing, tax brakes for off shoring factories, weaker labor laws, and corporate greed.

Unions or not, Chinese slave labor was coming to an industry near you no matter what. Even with out unions a free and democratic society can not compete with slave labor ran by communist rule.

Once upon a time you could get a decent paying job, with a pension, health care, and be treated with decency in this country. Now every single day that goes by this reality is becoming more and more scarce.

Thanks to dirty politicians and people like you. Congratulations you've done a fine job destroying the middle class.




Bob Badger said:


> That is funny, I never knew we are not allowed to quit and find other work.


That's funny, I never new that the work place was a dictatorship and the labor has no say in anything. 


Next all the contractors will jump down my throat about "I took the risk", "It's my business", "It's my money", It's mine", "It's mine".....blah, blah blah.

Well like it or not, the labor force in this country has rights.These rights are a cost of being in business, you new this before you signed up. No one forced you to become a "boss".


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## millerdrr (Jun 26, 2009)

slickvic277 said:


> Next all the contractors will jump down my throat about "I took the risk", "It's my business", "It's my money", It's mine", "It's mine".....blah, blah blah.


Also, were it not for the existence of larger businesses, smaller startups wouldn't have such a high failure rate.

Larger players have a reduced level of overhead on a per job basis. They can afford business expenditures which lead to greater deductions. Warren Buffett made headlines when he said something is wrong with a system where he paid 17% on forty billion, while his secretary paid 30% on forty thousand. Supply house too expensive? Buy out a one man shop and get his inventory. Eliminate him, hire him at a fraction of his value, raise your own prices, skim the difference while doing zero work.

The business management work force (including myself) contributes absolutely nothing to the US citizen. They don't provide jobs for anyone other than themselves. They function solely as a middle man between the work force and the consumer.

Saying "don't join a union" is a bit like saying "don't hire a lawyer when a customer won't pay you". Apples to apples...


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## crazyboy (Nov 8, 2008)

slickvic277 said:


> This poster is border line illegal. To bad the law makers in this country don't give a flying f*ck about the working class. What do you think would happen if an employee put up a poster that said,


Just curious what law this would be breaking to make it illegal?


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## TOOL_5150 (Aug 27, 2007)

I am putting $5 on that the pic was taken in a wal-mart

~Matt


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## Bkessler (Feb 14, 2007)

slickvic277 said:


> What do you think would happen if an employee put up a poster that said,
> 
> Union's will bargain collectively for hire wages.
> Union's will offer legal advise and representation if needed.
> ...


absolutely nothing.


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

crazyboy said:


> Just curious what law this would be breaking to make it illegal?


I'll suggest the First Amendment.:laughing:


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## crazyboy (Nov 8, 2008)

480sparky said:


> I'll suggest the First Amendment.:laughing:


They're exercising the First Amendment. :001_huh:


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## Jlarson (Jun 28, 2009)

My only question is are these sold in stores because I have to have one.


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

crazyboy said:


> They're exercising the First Amendment. :001_huh:



To many, that's illegal.


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## Charlie K (Aug 14, 2008)

Only 8% are Union. So why are the Non-union so fcking scared?

Charlie


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## Bob Badger (Apr 19, 2009)

Charlie K said:


> Only 8% are Union. So why are the Non-union so fcking scared?
> 
> Charlie




Yeah we are all shaking in our boots. :laughing:


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

Charlie K said:


> Only 8% are Union. So why are the Non-union so fcking scared?
> 
> Charlie


We don't want our trucks keyed, tires slashed, or find a horse's head in our bed in the morning.

Oh, wait...........the horse-head thing is mafia, isn't it?


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## Brother Noah1 (Mar 23, 2010)

As long as a person does not strive for a better way of life this poster is correct. If people do not try to better them self then the union will not There have been many discussions on this board about the wrong doings of the unions such as strikes which only a few locals even have in their contracts(for the most part a myth from the past).
The adage I have used "if you look for black you will find black" describes this issue to me.We in the union have problems just as all humans have, but there are those small things that I enjoy that I did not working non union(good retirement package)(most of the time, backing from the hall if you are wronged by the contractor)(educational opportunities)(for the most part reliable health insurance) this is but a few advantages I see for the $300 a year I pay in dues and maybe $2000 a year in assessments(all tax deductible). Yes it is true that I usually only work 7-10 months a year and I only make $60,000-$100,000 for the last 8 out of ten years.I think I will be able to make do without the help of the union as this sign want all who read to believe.


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## TOOL_5150 (Aug 27, 2007)

"Brotherhood" just sounds gay.

~Matt


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

Brother Noah said:


> As long as a person does not strive for a better way of life this poster is correct. If people do not try to better them self then the union will not ........



So...... go union or you're automatically a slacker?


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## Charlie K (Aug 14, 2008)

TOOL_5150 said:


> "Brotherhood" just sounds gay.
> 
> ~Matt[/quote
> 
> ...


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## Bob Badger (Apr 19, 2009)

Brother Noah said:


> There have been many discussions on this board about the wrong doings of the unions such as strikes which only a few locals even have in their contracts(for the most part a myth from the past).


Yeah now they know just to work as slow as snails and vandalize the job. 

That way they get paid and screw the company. 





> The adage I have used "if you look for black you will find black" describes this issue to me.We in the union have problems just as all humans have, but there are those small things that I enjoy that I did not working non union(good retirement package)(most of the time, backing from the hall if you are wronged by the contractor)(educational opportunities)(for the most part reliable health insurance) this is but a few advantages I see for the $300 a year I pay in dues and maybe $2000 a year in assessments(all tax deductible). Yes it is true that I usually only work 7-10 months a year and I only make $60,000-$100,000 for the last 8 out of ten years.I think I will be able to make do without the help of the union as this sign want all who read to believe.


Some people need to have their hand held, other men make their own way.


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## TOOL_5150 (Aug 27, 2007)

Charlie K said:


> TOOL_5150 said:
> 
> 
> > "Brotherhood" just sounds gay.
> ...


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

TOOL_5150 said:


> :laughing:
> 
> BTW, Learn to quote.
> 
> ~Matt



Kin ewe lurn dat in da onion?:whistling2:


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## TOOL_5150 (Aug 27, 2007)

480sparky said:


> Kin ewe lurn dat in da onion?:whistling2:


HAHAHA :thumbup:

~Matt


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## Big John (May 23, 2010)

"All generalizations are wrong, including this one."

I'm so sick of hearing statements about how "All non-union guys do Y" and "All union guys do Z." It's asinine, and most of the people on this forum are too smart to really believe crap like that.

I've been on both sides of the fence, union and non. I've seen non-union bosses force their guys to do unpaid work for threat of being fired.
I've seen union guys damage property on non-union jobs.
Both sides have their assholes, it doesn't mean that everyone fits that mold.

Some unions are broken, and have too much power for their own good. However, Walmart would be a fantastic place for a union. Many of the people working in that store can barely afford to buy the stuff they sell. Benefits? Not with the rate of turnover that place sees. And that company has a well-documented history of really shady labor practices. Why is the stuff cheap? Because they cut costs wherever they can and any business man knows that labor is your biggest expense.

Let's try and have a civil discussion, huh?

-John


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## CFL (Jan 28, 2009)

Brother Noah said:


> We in the union have problems just as all humans have, but there are those small things that I enjoy that I did not working non union(good retirement package)(most of the time, backing from the hall if you are wronged by the contractor)(educational opportunities)(for the most part reliable health insurance) this is but a few advantages I see for the $300 a year I pay in dues and maybe $2000 a year in assessments(all tax deductible). Yes it is true that I usually only work 7-10 months a year and I only make $60,000-$100,000 for the last 8 out of ten years.I think I will be able to make do without the help of the union as this sign want all who read to believe.


I have no retirement package, I'm wronged by my boss consistently, I have paid for all of my education, I pay $500.00 per month for health insurance, I work 6-7 days a week, and earn less than $60,000 a year. I'm crying the blues, but I don't want the union's help.


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## Hacker (Aug 24, 2010)

Bob Badger said:


> Some people need to have their hand held, other men make their own way.



Oh Bob. You're so predictable.


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

Big John said:


> ........ Many of the people working in that store can barely afford to buy the stuff they sell. Benefits? Not with the rate of turnover that place sees. And that company has a well-documented history of really shady labor practices. Why is the stuff cheap? Because they cut costs wherever they can and any business man knows that labor is your biggest expense...........





Made me think of this:


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## Overclocked (Aug 23, 2010)

Bob Badger said:


> Some people need to have their hand held, other men make their own way.


That's a very insulting generalization.

If someone came and said how all non-union workers were stupid and low paid and rats and all that other crap, everyone would jump on them and say how wrong it is to make such generalizations.


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## TOOL_5150 (Aug 27, 2007)

Overclocked said:


> That's a very insulting generalization.
> 
> If someone came and said how all non-union workers were stupid and low paid and rats and all that other crap, everyone would jump on them and say how wrong it is to make such generalizations.


People DO say all that, but see, we dont let it bother us.

~Matt


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## Widestance_Politics (Jun 2, 2010)

The employees of Wal-Mart would have a tough enough time signing their name to an agreement, let alone read and understand it.....I'm sure the IBEW won't mind to continue wiring the building for them tho....I would guess that the same sign hangs in every Home Depot, McDonalds, Lowes, and Denny's....as long as the person clocking that ticket is satisfied with their situation....who cares?


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## Overclocked (Aug 23, 2010)

TOOL_5150 said:


> People DO say all that, but see, we dont let it bother us.
> 
> ~Matt


When? Where is it said?

I'm willing to bet if it has been said, 10 people jumped all over the person who said it.


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

Charlie K said:


> Only 8% are Union. So why are the Non-union so fcking scared?
> 
> Charlie


Not scared, proactive!


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

Overclocked said:


> When? Where is it said?
> 
> I'm willing to bet if it has been said, 10 people jumped all over the person who said it.


Ask most open shop electricians that have had any of contact with union electricians in their day to day work.

I agree with Noah about the advantages of union BUT all the open shops I work for, few of the guys complain, and when I have tried to recruit men (from the top open shop men I see)*1, most tell me they are content where they are even when I explain the wages and benefits. Many dislike the union because of the way they were treated by union men others dislike the thought of only working part time, which is a myth around here. 

*1-To my open shop customers that may be reading this, I did not try to recruit any of YOUR GUYS. :no::no::no:


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## Brother Noah1 (Mar 23, 2010)

Bob Badger said:


> Yeah now they know just to work as slow as snails and vandalize the job.
> 
> That way they get paid and screw the company.
> 
> ...


When I wrote my last post I had also wrote the fact that I believe in you get what you earn in life.Just a fact That I advocate to all employees to work your butts off and be productive in order for the contractor makes money and is able to bid and work more jobs therefore hire in the future. I erased it because I only wanted to get a point across that the board is right it will not help you if you do not aspire to be union. I guess I gave more credit than what was due as far as intellect. No I am not saying that you can not be happy and resourceful and fruitful in life working non union (I will attribute that to an elementary thinking person who thrives on stirring BS) When ever a negative campaign is run, ask yourself why the smear tactic? Who will loose or gain from the slur? We do need each other in today's world(union and non union) without competition one would be overcome with the greed for either power and or the dollar bill. Now naysayers do what you do, lets hear it. Bob I thought you had your anxieties under control.


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## millerdrr (Jun 26, 2009)

brian john said:


> Ask most open shop electricians that have had any of contact with union electricians in their day to day work.


We frequently hire local licensees, often union, so we stay legit on our projects. My guys like to put the unions down, for being slow. What they can't seem to understand is, they have been doing nothing but installing fluorescent T8s in Lowes for years. OF COURSE, they are going to be faster than the union. We don't even need the blueprint. We know every single light and receptacle, including the right elevation above the floor, by the name of the bay and the products in the shelf. Its practically a production line.

I usually just ask my guys if they could hook up the generator out back.


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## miller_elex (Jan 25, 2008)

Wal-Mart cleaned Main Street's clock.

Smaller chains could not compete with mega-business.

I believe we are worse off for it.

Where are we headed now? Maybe we'll think the script for IDIOCRACY was written by a time-traveler.


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## Bob Badger (Apr 19, 2009)

Bob Badger said:


> Some people need to have their hand held, other men make their own way.





Overclocked said:


> That's a very insulting generalization.


Explain how stating a fact is insulting?




> If someone came and said how all non-union workers were stupid and low paid and rats and all that other crap, everyone would jump on them and say how wrong it is to make such generalizations.


First off that crap is all over this forum. :laughing:

Second how is simply saying _'some people like to meet life on their own and some don't.'_ anything at all like calling someone stupid, low paid rats?

If you feel insulted because you have decided to get the help of the union that is something you need to work out with yourself. :thumbsup:


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## 10492 (Jan 4, 2010)

Right now I am tooo busy to tear the Union hypocrites a new one, but don't fret. I have some time tommorrow.:thumbsup:

I can only hope this thread stays open long enough for me to respond later.

One quick thought for Brother Noah, Many of us have been on both sides of this fence, in fact, some of us have been the providers of that fence.

The Employer or business owner.

Have any of you Union guys been there yet?

Talk to the hypocrites later.


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

Dnkldorf said:


> The Employer or business owner.
> 
> Have any of you Union guys been there yet?
> 
> .


As I have posted in the past I have worked with several "brothers" that were real union lawyers when a member of the IBEW, throwing the rat, scab term at many a hard working open shop worker. When they started their own business some of them went open shop another guy I know was a real ball buster, skirting rules where he can, several also that went IBEW were not paying the men's benefits. Real promoters of the organization they touted so heavily when they were members.

I think SOME of the die hard's fit this same profile because they are not really concerned about the "workers" as they are joiners or are only really concerned for what is BEST for them at the moment.

JUST BECAUSE I THINK THIS IS SO DAMN FUNNY
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yi3erdgVVTw&feature=search

In my experience SOME union members has done more damage to the IBEW than any campaign by the ABC or any open shop organization could ever do. Until these stock in the past fools can get off their high horse's and realize that open shop men are as good and in many cases better workers and electricians, that not all open shops take advantage of their employees and that most of the union loud mouths are usually lousy electrician, will the IBEW ever possibly start to grow.

As for Bob's B. attitude for being a self promoter and not needing the IBEW, I know quite a few open shop men that feel this way. They see the union as a protection hole for slackers and lazy bums and in some cases they are right. It is not the open shop mens job to change their mind, but up to the IBEW to do a better job of selling the "union" and the name callers and kool aid drinkers do NOTHING to change this attitude.


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## Brother Noah1 (Mar 23, 2010)

Dnkldorf said:


> Right now I am tooo busy to tear the Union hypocrites a new one, but don't fret. I have some time tommorrow.:thumbsup:
> 
> I can only hope this thread stays open long enough for me to respond later.
> 
> ...


 I have never aspired to be either a union and or non union contractor ( being open I do not want the head aches) I do not consider myself a hypocrite though.My personal desire is for ALL workers to get what they deserve.I advocate for those said workers to give a good days work for the pay they receive,help the contractor earn money in order to stay in business, then maybe the process of bidding then hiring can start all over again.
Bob again I have seen abuse as you speak of by both sides(okay more so in the union sector) but not in some time.I see the issue that you pointing a finger at is a personal issue not a union or non union one
This sign instills hate just as some of the political ads that run on right or left wing sites that take facts, twist and tweak to slander another in order to get other mad at whom ever.It has no productive and or good effect on anyone. We are all man and women trying to earn a living no matter if we are the owner or a mere labor. The practice of slander is just negative, okay naysayers go for it.I realize that the union is also guilty of this same offense, but I do not agree with it.


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## sbrn33 (Mar 15, 2007)

Overclocked said:


> That's a very insulting generalization.
> 
> If someone came and said how all non-union workers were stupid and low paid and rats and all that other crap, everyone would jump on them and say how wrong it is to make such generalizations.



Uh, union people say this almost every time they open their mouths. That's one of the main reason for all the polarity.


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## Brother Noah1 (Mar 23, 2010)

sbrn33 said:


> Uh, union people say this almost every time they open their mouths. That's one of the main reason for all the polarity.


 By your post you demonstrate exactly what I have been posting about the negative myths and in your case you posted an out right lie. I know not where you linger to hear the trash you speak of but there is a better life out there with a better class of people(not union or non union) but good hearted people who enjoy being productive with their lives.You essentially did what your complaint was about by putting union people into one general bundle of jerks. Just because they are a member in good standing does not mean they will be evil or mean or nice or that they spew slander against others for a bias taunt. Thank you for your post.


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

Brother Noah said:


> By your post you demonstrate exactly what I have been posting about the negative myths and in your case you posted an out right lie. I know not where you linger to hear the trash you speak of but there is a better life out there with a better class of people(not union or non union) but good hearted people who enjoy being productive with their lives.You essentially did what your complaint was about by putting union people into one general bundle of jerks. Just because they are a member in good standing does not mean they will be evil or mean or nice or that they spew slander against others for a bias taunt. Thank you for your post.


Noah these are not myths, I have worked on plenty of jobs that have both contractors, the open shop guys try to get along with everyone, or at a minimum ignore the union guys that cause problems but there always seems to be *one* "brother" that cannot keep his mouth shut.

I have yet to see the open shop guys start problems. I have told the story before how a "brother " trashed one of my trucks. Cost him his job and had I brought him up on charges at the hall he would have gotten in more trouble. See the fool did not bother to find out I am union. His excuse is we have no union stickers on out trucks. Myself I figured I paid for the trucks I'll paste on them what I want.

How many open shop men picket union jobs? How many union men have picketed open shop projects? At one point our local had a deal were twice a year you had to pull picket duty. They no longer do this as I THINK they found it counter productive.


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## Bob Badger (Apr 19, 2009)

Brother Noah said:


> By your post you demonstrate exactly what I have been posting about the negative myths and in your case you posted an out right lie.



You are calling me a liar you no good piece of pigeon crap?

You have no idea what I have seen with my own eyes so just shut the hell up about what you do not know about.


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## millerdrr (Jun 26, 2009)

For what its worth, we NEVER have union issues. Very seldom, one of my guys will start to do something and a union guy onsite will say "You're taking our work", but it always ends there. Say that to me, and my toolbelt hits the floor. Have at it, bud. These jobs we do are all essentially salaried.


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## Bob Badger (Apr 19, 2009)

millerdrr said:


> For what its worth, we NEVER have union issues.


And I believe you, each area is very different.


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## millerdrr (Jun 26, 2009)

Bob Badger said:


> And I believe you, each area is very different.


Indeed. Our last union job was in the boondocks of Minnesota. Most are in the Illinois/Indiana area. Ironically, all of our jobs I remember in New York and the New England area, we didn't have union assistance. 

New Hampshire was quite ANTI union, which we found weird. Same with Seattle. Ex union guys, very anti union.

A store in Delaware had some union picketeers against the carpentry crew, but that had nothing to do with us. The carpenters got hammered in a bar the first night and ticked off some locals. Out came the blow up rat. Strange thing is, I hardly consider store setup carpenters to be "carpenters". They take a desk off of a pallet and set it on the floor. They build pegboards for merchandise. That's the extent of the carpentry work.:laughing:


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## gold (Feb 15, 2008)

I'm just saying


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## Brother Noah1 (Mar 23, 2010)

Bob Badger said:


> You are calling me a liar you no good piece of pigeon crap?
> 
> You have no idea what I have seen with my own eyes so just shut the hell up about what you do not know about.


 Bob do you kiss momma with that potty mouth? Just as I do not know what your eyes have seen you do not have a clue to what comes out of mine or almost one million IBEW members mouth BOB. By the way that post was in reference to someone besides yourself but I guess when hate grabs your inner soul the facts can be skewed. So now you spew hateful words towards another person for your misunderstanding that would be normal to incite more anger(really Bob you wish to incite anger?) What I do know is we are all humans who at times act absurd toward one another for a bias(WHY)


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## Brother Noah1 (Mar 23, 2010)

gold said:


> I'm just saying


 Good post Gold, it shows self pride and I see no negative slurs. I even see the irony of the cat. Thank you for a positive post


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

gold said:


> I'm just saying


Now that's funny I do not care who you are!


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## Charlie K (Aug 14, 2008)

Dnkldorf said:


> Right now I am tooo busy to tear the Union hypocrites a new one, but don't fret. I have some time tommorrow.:thumbsup:
> 
> I can only hope this thread stays open long enough for me to respond later.
> 
> ...


Yes I have. It has been a while but in the late 70's and early 80's I was a partner in a union shop. We started out non union and signed an agreement with the Steamfitters after about 1 year. Shortly after we signed with the IBEW. We did this because we mainly were subs of Mechanical contractors. Our Co. grew quickly and we put more trucks and people on the street. We also took in more partners as we grew. I felt uncomfortable with things and got out in 81. We grew too fast and I left in 82. The company went out of buisness in 85. It closed because of a lack of capital and bad management. Several smaller shops were spawned off and they are around today. I chose to work with my tools. I have been a Project Manager and a General Foreman for several large and mid sized firms. I was going to take a disability retirement 5 years ago due to an injury. After notifying my hall of my intentions I had several offers to estimate, manage projects and purchasing agent. I took the estimating job and was able to go back with my tools after a year of physical therapy. When the weather does not cooperate with my legs I go in the office. Yes all the time I was a card carrying IBEW member. I would not work any other way.

Charlie:whistling2::whistling2:


----------



## slickvic277 (Feb 5, 2009)

crazyboy said:


> Just curious what law this would be breaking to make it illegal?


Well it really depends. If there is an active campaign amongst the employees to organize this could be most definitely a violation of the NLRB. It could be considered a threat and a violation of protected concerted activities.

Anyone who thinks the infractions of these rights are not a big deal legally, has never had an NLRB fine issued to them. 





Bkessler said:


> absolutely nothing.


If you really, really, really believe that, well you sir are a fool.
Hundreds of people every year are illegally fired just for mentioning the word "union" in the work place. This is a fact.




480sparky said:


> I'll suggest the First Amendment.:laughing:


Out of all the people here, you are the one guy that I think is full of the most B.S. You come off like a total fraud. I mean, how many union members are in "corn patch" USA anyway?

Quick, Google me an answer.


Anyone who doubts the severity of violating rights of employees as described by the NLRB call your local branch and ask for examples of possible fines. 

http://www.nlrb.gov/Workplace_Rights/i_am_new_to_this_website/what_are_my_rights.aspx


----------



## Bkessler (Feb 14, 2007)

slickvic277 said:


> If you really, really, really believe that, well you sir are a fool.
> Hundreds of people every year are illegally fired just for mentioning the word "union" in the work place. This is a fact.
> 
> 
> ...


If any one else was calling me a fool I'd be concerned, but it's just you:laughing:


----------



## slickvic277 (Feb 5, 2009)

Bkessler said:


> If any one else was calling me a fool I'd be concerned, but it's just you:laughing:



That was a well, thought out, and educated rebuttal. Well done.


----------



## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

slickvic277 said:


> Out of all the people here, you are the one guy that I think is full of the most B.S. You come off like a total fraud. I mean, how many union members are in "corn patch" USA anyway?
> 
> Quick[/URL]


480 SERIOUSLY, that is the last person I would accuse of being full of B.S.!!!! and there are quite a few of us that are full of malarkey *1 on this forum.

*1 Circa 1950?

I also feel some of the labor laws violate free speech.


----------



## slickvic277 (Feb 5, 2009)

brian john said:


> 480 SERIOUSLY, that is the last person I would accuse of being full of B.S.!!!! and there are quite a few of us that are full of malarkey *1 on this forum.
> 
> *1 Circa 1950?
> 
> I also feel some of the labor laws violate free speech.



Not when it comes to electrical knowledge and things like that. But when it comes to the union topic I really feel he makes up much of his posts.

Everyone is entitled to there opinion and this is a great forum to express that opinion but I don't believe his (480) union banter for a second.

But that's cool. It makes for interesting "discussion".:thumbup:


----------



## Brother Noah1 (Mar 23, 2010)

I understand that many have had hardships with those damn union people discriminating against them in their life, even Brian(a union member has spoke of abuse he witnessed by union members) but what has been shown on this thread is a biased slant against the union people as a whole no matter what attempts to bring good over evil to this thread it somehow gets spun into a fabrication of hostility.Is this just an insecurity trying to get out of the closet or maybe a futile attempt at morals and scruples? Yes there have been some wrongs from many in the past, we are all in the construction field, some of us who survive by plying the trade. So why is all this effort being used to anger each other instead of mending wounds to make all our lives less complicated. Are we as a majority just happy being at war instead of working towards peace? Okay time for the bombs and missiles from the naysayers.


----------



## Bkessler (Feb 14, 2007)

slickvic277 said:


> That was a well, thought out, and educated rebuttal. Well done.


I know to let a baby cry out their problems, I am not trying to get you to change your mind. I just think your full of ****.


----------



## slickvic277 (Feb 5, 2009)

Bkessler said:


> I know to let a baby cry out their problems, I am not trying to get you to change your mind. I just think your full of ****.



About what?

You make things up as you go along, or so it seems. Please PROVE me wrong.


----------



## Bob Badger (Apr 19, 2009)

slickvic277 said:


> Please PROVE me wrong.



Vic I think I can. 


No one, and I mean not one person is fired for talking about going union, that is illegal.


























They are always let laid off, let go, fired for any other reason but that. :laughing:


----------



## Bkessler (Feb 14, 2007)

slickvic277 said:


> About what?
> 
> You make things up as you go along, or so it seems. Please PROVE me wrong.


Prove, that if I were to mention the "U" word I'd be fired? Sure, 

you'll feel better after a nap.


----------



## slickvic277 (Feb 5, 2009)

Bob Badger said:


> Vic I think I can.
> 
> 
> No one, and I mean not one person is fired for talking about going union, that is illegal.
> ...



Touche


----------



## slickvic277 (Feb 5, 2009)

Bkessler said:


> Prove, that if I were to mention the "U" word I'd be fired? Sure,
> 
> you'll feel better after a nap.



Leave the conversation to the adults. You lack the proper level of articulation to participate.


----------



## Bkessler (Feb 14, 2007)

slickvic277 said:


> Leave the conversation to the adults. You lack the proper level of articulation to participate.


With pleasure.


----------



## slickvic277 (Feb 5, 2009)

Bkessler said:


> With pleasure.



Thanks:thumbsup:. Hey when you get a little older you can hang out with the grown ups:laughing:


----------



## Bkessler (Feb 14, 2007)

slickvic277 said:


> Thanks:thumbsup:. Hey when you get a little older you can hang out with the grown ups:laughing:


It's funny that i pointed out your pouting like a baby and you tell me to grow up.( how juvenile) And what you would like "proof" of is laughable at best. Why don't you prove that the unions didn't ruin the U.S. automotive industry. Or better yet prove they are only 8% of the workforce because 92% of the workforce think the union's are made up of primarily a bunch of crybaby's who can't speak up for themselves. Go ahead and prove it.


----------



## slickvic277 (Feb 5, 2009)

Bkessler said:


> It's funny that i pointed out your pouting like a baby and you tell me to grow up.( how juvenile) And what you would like "proof" of is laughable at best. Why don't you prove that the unions didn't ruin the U.S. automotive industry. Or better yet prove they are only 8% of the workforce because 92% of the workforce think the union's are made up of primarily a bunch of crybaby's who can't speak up for themselves. Go ahead and prove it.


After dinner.


Ok. dinners done.

Ford's CEO's excess in pay while the company loses millions of dollars.
http://money.cnn.com/2007/04/05/news/companies/ford_execpay/

GM's CEO's excess in pay while that company lost millions of dollars.
http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSN2534738420080425

Here's some of the corporate salaries while the companies posted record losses.
http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/auto-industry-executive-compensation-rankles-and-for-good-reason/

Here's more of there arrogant waste.
http://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/WallStreet/story?id=6285739&page=1

You can Google your way to wisdom or insanity with these dollar amounts.
But wanna be's like yourself defend these greedy monsters under the guise of "capitalism", "sacrifice", and "hard work".

Doesn't your Merit philosophy get blown out of the water when you protect the practice of these people. I thought your pay was based on your merit. If that was the case, the people who ran and who were ultimately responsible for the success of these companies would have been canned and maybe even locked up. I mean, millions of dollars in salary while the company your responsible for posts hundreds of millions of dollars in losses.

:laughing: Yeah, that's some real talent there.

these chief executive officers were in charge of the businesses financial well being. And they ran them into the ground, point blank.


The UAW has made concessions. Where's the concessions from the super wealthy?
http://www.cnn.com/2009/POLITICS/04/26/money.uaw.chrysler/
http://www.foundrymag.com/frontpage/news/86079/uaw_concessions_keep_navistar_foundry_open
http://www.rrstar.com/belvidere/x126918304/Belvidere-Chrysler-workers-vote-on-concessions

But did the people at the top who are ultimately responsible for the success of the industry take pay cuts, salary freezes, reduced benefits??

Of course not, They got dopes like you to protect them.:thumbup:Good job!!
I hope one day that I can get millions of dollars for doing basically nothing productive at all. Now that's living the American Dream.:thumbsup:


People like you like to throw the word "entitled" around. Your right, there's a whole lot of "entitlement" going on.


----------



## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

​


----------



## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

Brother Noah said:


> I understand that many have had hardships with those damn union people discriminating against them in their life, even Brian(a union member has spoke of abuse he witnessed by union members) but what has been shown on this thread is a biased slant against the union people as a whole no matter what attempts to bring good over evil to this thread it somehow gets spun into a fabrication of hostility.


As I have stated this comes from being called names and having their work demeaned by SOME union members, it forms a basis to dislike a whole group from the actions of a few or the group operating with a group mentality.



> Is this just an insecurity trying to get out of the closet or maybe a futile attempt at morals and scruples? Yes there have been some wrongs from many in the past, we are all in the construction field, some of us who survive by plying the trade. So why is all this effort being used to anger each other instead of mending wounds to make all our lives less complicated. Are we as a majority just happy being at war instead of working towards peace? Okay time for the bombs and missiles from the naysayers.


Because men are men and take a dislike to being seen as second class citizens which is how some open shop men feel they have been treated. It is a legitimate argument and one the IBEW should address.

The open shop men could make better wages and bennies, and the union could benefit from additional members, BUT the union has to take the steps to right the wrongs of the past and present, the open shop men will continue to go along with their lives either way.


----------



## Charlie K (Aug 14, 2008)

brian john said:


> As I have stated this comes from being called names and having their work demeaned by SOME union members, it forms a basis to dislike a whole group from the actions of a few or the group operating with a group mentality.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
Brian, I try to treat them with kindness. I have been on several jobs where there were nounion sparkies that needed to use my threader or bender and I never had an issue. In fact talked to them off the job and a few have made the move to the local. One is working for us now. We all put our pants on the same way.

Charlie


----------



## RIVETER (Sep 26, 2009)

Charlie K said:


> Brian, I try to treat them with kindness. I have been on several jobs where there were nounion sparkies that needed to use my threader or bender and I never had an issue. In fact talked to them off the job and a few have made the move to the local. One is working for us now. We all put our pants on the same way.
> 
> Charlie


Why were they OFF to begin with?


----------



## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

Charlie K said:


> Brian, I try to treat them with kindness. I have been on several jobs where there were nounion sparkies that needed to use my threader or bender and I never had an issue. In fact talked to them off the job and a few have made the move to the local. One is working for us now. We all put our pants on the same way.
> 
> Charlie


And that is how we win with open shops and at a minimum pick the best for membership


----------



## Brother Noah1 (Mar 23, 2010)

Thank you Brian for your post, I do understand the hostility from the past but when has the past been long enough? Do we that hold a union ticket owe the great great grand kids of a non union worker a full living, room and board because they were not allowed in the IBEW or someone spoke down to them? We have respectable people on this board who are acting juvenile.I look forward to the time when we actually try to work together for a mutual interest of all our welfare's. It sounds as if you are good at what you do(an electrical contractor) who happens to be union which takes funds out of your pocket(kudos) and even though we have agreed on very little I do respect your efforts.I see where Bob has said NO ONE would let you go because you spoke the word of the Union, that is another untruth Bob (I have been fired for not only speaking of unions but of having union affiliation)1993 the contractor lost in state and federal court. Again why should we argue about things that happened to us in the past by other people???


----------



## Bob Badger (Apr 19, 2009)

Brother Noah said:


> Bob do you kiss momma with that potty mouth? Just as I do not know what your eyes have seen you do not have a clue to what comes out of mine or almost one million IBEW members mouth BOB. By the way that post was in reference to someone besides yourself but I guess when hate grabs your inner soul the facts can be skewed. So now you spew hateful words towards another person for your misunderstanding that would be normal to incite more anger(really Bob you wish to incite anger?) What I do know is we are all humans who at times act absurd toward one another for a bias(WHY)



I do not hate all union members, I do _hate_ you and your opinions. :thumbsup:

I think you are just a typical union loud mouth, can you point out any posts where you actually tried to help someone with an electrical question? 

How about any thread you have posted in that was not specifically about the union?

I help anyone that asks a question here, does not matter to me if they are union or non-union. If I can help them with their code, wiring or other questions I do.

How about you? I think you should take a long look in the mirror. 

All you do here at this forum is spew hate towards myself and all other merit shop workers.

So which one of us has 'hate grabbed the soul of'?


----------



## Bob Badger (Apr 19, 2009)

Brother Noah said:


> I do understand the hostility from the past but when has the past been long enough?


The past?

Everything Brian mentioned still happens in my area. 






> Do we that hold a union ticket owe the great great grand kids of a non union worker a full living, room and board because they were not allowed in the IBEW or someone spoke down to them?


I, along with all merit shop works have been talked down to on this very forum many times in the last month.

So drop this BS that it is in the past. 




> We have respectable people on this board who are acting juvenile.I look forward to the time when we actually try to work together for a mutual interest of all our welfare's.


If you are that concerned with helping all of us why is it the only posts you make are about union issues?




> Bob has said NO ONE would let you go because you spoke the word of the Union, that is another untruth Bob (I have been fired for not only speaking of unions but of having union affiliation)


Ahh ... Noah .... you either did not read my whole post or you are too blinded in your prejudice of me to really see what I said.

My post was pointing out that no company is going to say 'You are fired for being pro-union' they are going to find some other reason to put down as the reason. Slick Vic knew what I was saying.

I know for a fact people do lose their jobs for trying to bring unions in. It is wrong and it should not happen but I would never say it does not happen.


----------



## 10492 (Jan 4, 2010)

slickvic277 said:


> This poster is border line illegal.


Not even close.



slickvic277 said:


> To bad the law makers in this country don't give a flying f*ck about the working class.


I'll get back to this. 




slickvic277 said:


> What do you think would happen if an employee put up a poster that said,
> 
> Union's will bargain collectively for hire wages.
> Union's will offer legal advise and representation if needed.
> ...


He can put that poster up in his home, his car, and even have it embroidered on his tighty whiteys if he wants.:thumbsup: Clearly the business location is not his property and he has no right to post anything there the property owners don't want. Why can't you see this? Your smarter than that mess you just wrote. Here is where you started downhill.




slickvic277 said:


> I wonder what would happen then. This is clearly a double standard.
> Yeah, I know. Union's are the bad guys. Poor Walmart would go under if there employees were unionized.


STFU. Utter nonsense. Your picking up speed. Slow down.:001_huh:





slickvic277 said:


> keep listening to Rush Limbaugh. I know, I know, your opinions are facts and I'm just brainwashed. You tea baggers all sound like broken records.
> You just keep repeating the same stupid sh*t over and over again. Do you ever have anything new to say?


 
CRASH.......you pulled the politics card. :bangin: 



Blame it all on people who have never held office in Washington, yet above you posted this:



slickvic277 said:


> To bad the law makers in this country don't give a flying f*ck about the working class.


 
Not looking god for you vic.


----------



## Bkessler (Feb 14, 2007)

Bob Badger said:


> T
> 
> I know for a fact people do lose their jobs for trying to bring unions in. It is wrong and it should not happen but I would never say it does not happen.


I think you should be able to fire someone for any reason you want. If I had a company and an employee tried to unionize it, they'd be gone for one reason or another. No fat people either, I could care less about color/religion, I might discriminate against short people too. There so angry, brings down morale.


----------



## Bob Badger (Apr 19, 2009)

Bkessler said:


> I think you should be able to fire someone for any reason you want.


I do not disagree with you but that ship has sailed, the law says you can't fire employees for organizing and I expect a business to follow the laws even if I think the law may be wrong.


----------



## TOOL_5150 (Aug 27, 2007)

Bkessler said:


> I think you should be able to fire someone for any reason you want. If I had a company and an employee tried to unionize it, they'd be gone for one reason or another. No fat people either, I could care less about color/religion, I might discriminate against short people too. There so angry, brings down morale.


I agree

Damn, Guess ill never work for you.


~Matt


----------



## Bob Badger (Apr 19, 2009)

TOOL_5150 said:


> I agree
> 
> Damn, Guess ill never work for you.
> 
> ...



You are a fatty?

Funny you do not type like a fatty. :laughing:


----------



## TOOL_5150 (Aug 27, 2007)

Bob Badger said:


> You are a fatty?
> 
> Funny you do not type like a fatty. :laughing:


Well, I am not skinny, thats for sure. I enjoy beer too much. :thumbsup:


How would a fatty type?:blink::laughing:

~Matt


----------



## Bkessler (Feb 14, 2007)

Bob Badger said:


> I do not disagree with you but that ship has sailed, the law says you can't fire employees for organizing and I expect a business to follow the laws even if I think the law may be wrong.


I wonder what wal mart does?


----------



## Bkessler (Feb 14, 2007)

TOOL_5150 said:


> Well, I am not skinny, thats for sure. I enjoy beer too much. :thumbsup:
> 
> 
> How would a fatty type?:blink::laughing:
> ...


you should put BBE in your profile.:laughing:


----------



## TOOL_5150 (Aug 27, 2007)

Bkessler said:


> you should put BBE in your profile.:laughing:


Im not looking to hook up with anyone on this site, Ill stick to what I have in my profile.:thumbsup:

~Matt


----------



## Widestance_Politics (Jun 2, 2010)

I expect fatties to fall under the equal opportunity laws in the near future......I have been seriously considering inventing a fiberglass stepladder that can withstand a 600 pnd load.....that way I don't have to listen to the tired excuse of so and so can't climb a ladder because of his "football knees"....


----------



## TOOL_5150 (Aug 27, 2007)

Widestance_Politics said:


> I expect fatties to fall under the equal opportunity laws in the near future......I have been seriously considering inventing a fiberglass stepladder that can withstand a 600 pnd load.....that way I don't have to listen to the tired excuse of so and so can't climb a ladder because of his "football knees"....


LOL god damn. That is past fat, that obese. If you got someone that weighs more than 300 pounds, thats a health risk youre taking on.

~Matt


----------



## 10492 (Jan 4, 2010)

TOOL_5150 said:


> LOL god damn. That is past fat, that obese. If you got someone that weighs more than 300 pounds, thats a health risk youre taking on.
> 
> ~Matt


Not to mention a possible WC claim in the making.


----------



## slickvic277 (Feb 5, 2009)

slickvic277 said:


> After dinner.
> 
> 
> Ok. dinners done.
> ...


Here ya go.


----------



## 10492 (Jan 4, 2010)

slickvic277 said:


> Here ya go.


That's all you got?


----------



## slickvic277 (Feb 5, 2009)

*Dnkldorf*;


> Not even close.


I explained it. Just because you don't agree with it doesn't make it true.:no:




> I'll get back to this.


Don't keep me waiting honey. 






> He can put that poster up in his home, his car, and even have it embroidered on his tighty whiteys if he wants.:thumbsup: Clearly the business location is not his property and he has no right to post anything there the property owners don't want. Why can't you see this? Your smarter than that mess you just wrote. Here is where you started downhill.


Seemed pretty spot on to me.





> CRASH.......you pulled the politics card.


Never said anything about politics. But I've heard Rush before and this guy sounds like a disciple.





> Blame it all on people who have never held office in Washington, yet above you posted this:


No, I blame the sheep that follow political personalities blindly. Rush has millions of loyal sheep in his flock. Scary aint it.:blink:





> Not looking god for you vic.


I dunno. thinks always look good from my side.:thumbsup:


----------



## slickvic277 (Feb 5, 2009)

Dnkldorf said:


> That's all you got?



HAHA!! No everything in the BLUE BOX. Here I'll post it again

Ford's CEO's excess in pay while the company loses millions of dollars.
http://money.cnn.com/2007/04/05/news.../ford_execpay/

GM's CEO's excess in pay while that company lost millions of dollars.
http://www.reuters.com/article/idUSN2534738420080425

Here's some of the corporate salaries while the companies posted record losses.
http://www.thetruthaboutcars.com/aut...r-good-reason/

Here's more of there arrogant waste.
http://abcnews.go.com/Blotter/WallSt...6285739&page=1

You can Google your way to wisdom or insanity with these dollar amounts.
But wanna be's like yourself defend these greedy monsters under the guise of "capitalism", "sacrifice", and "hard work".

Doesn't your Merit philosophy get blown out of the water when you protect the practice of these people. I thought your pay was based on your merit. If that was the case, the people who ran and who were ultimately responsible for the success of these companies would have been canned and maybe even locked up. I mean, millions of dollars in salary while the company your responsible for posts hundreds of millions of dollars in losses.

:laughing: Yeah, that's some real talent there.

these chief executive officers were in charge of the businesses financial well being. And they ran them into the ground, point blank.


The UAW has made concessions. Where's the concessions from the super wealthy?
http://www.cnn.com/2009/POLITICS/04/....uaw.chrysler/
http://www.foundrymag.com/frontpage/...r_foundry_open
http://www.rrstar.com/belvidere/x126...on-concessions

But did the people at the top who are ultimately responsible for the success of the industry take pay cuts, salary freezes, reduced benefits??

Of course not, They got dopes like you to protect them.:thumbup:Good job!!
I hope one day that I can get millions of dollars for doing basically nothing productive at all. Now that's living the American Dream.:thumbsup:


People like you like to throw the word "entitled" around. Your right, there's a whole lot of "entitlement" going on.


----------



## TOOL_5150 (Aug 27, 2007)

Dnkldorf said:


> Not to mention a possible WC claim in the making.


Yeah thats what I meant.

~Matt


----------



## 10492 (Jan 4, 2010)

Vic, what do you drive?

Ford, GM? Toyota?

What do all the Union folks drive, Ford, GM?

If you are unhappy with CEO pay of these companies, why buy their product?

Secondly, the Board of Directors define, and approve the CEO pay. 
Not Washington. 
Usually the BOD are made up of people who own the majority of the companies stock. They have the most on the line with the company. Not the worker. If the company fails, the Board is hit hardest financialy.

Surely you can see that if you own the majority of something, you should have the say on what goes on, not someone with no financial interest in your company.


----------



## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

Dnkldorf said:


> Vic, what do you drive?
> .............erest in your company.



BTW, 1K posts!!!

Dnkldorf 
Bully Hater

Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: PA
Posts: *1,000*


----------



## 10492 (Jan 4, 2010)

480sparky said:


> BTW, 1K posts!!!
> 
> Dnkldorf
> Bully Hater
> ...


I gave myself 600 before I got booted.


----------



## Brother Noah1 (Mar 23, 2010)

Bob Badger said:


> I do not hate all union members, I do _hate_ you and your opinions. :thumbsup:
> 
> I think you are just a typical union loud mouth, can you point out any posts where you actually tried to help someone with an electrical question?
> 
> ...


 So if I do not help others with electrical question and answers and do not act like Bob then I am that union azzhole? I do like you Bob although you show signs of psychosis.I have seen where you have actually been polite on your post Bob and then I have read where you act like a spoiled child who just got their hand spanked for being a bad boy.
Why am I to post on something besides union(would that make me more of a man like you?) You know I have on a rare occasion I have peeked at other issues on this board, but this is but one of nine sites I visit regular, besides the wife says that I do have more to life than to converse on the web.Bob there is still hope just make sure you keep your appointments, I am sure you will be okay.I hope we are still on for Labor day, I will bring the wine.


----------



## 10492 (Jan 4, 2010)

Brother Noah said:


> I will bring the wine.


Who drinks wine?

You watch figure skating too?:laughing:


----------



## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

Brother Noah said:


> So if I do not help others with electrical question and answers and do not act like Bob then I am that union azzhole?


In the realms of forums how you are perceived is based on your knowledge or perceived lack of knowledge. Typically (for me) those that post a lot here but seldom to never show in the REAL topic sections are not very good, knowledgable electricians. I could be dead wrong but since this section was started, for the most part this belief has been proven out.




> Why am I to post on something besides union(would that make me more of a man like you?) You know I have on a rare occasion I have peeked at other issues on this board, but this is but one of nine sites I visit regular, besides the wife says that I do have more to life than to converse on the web.Bob there is still hope just make sure you keep your appointments, I am sure you will be okay.I hope we are still on for Labor day, I will bring the wine.


I have bumped heads with Bob a few times over attitudes, but when it comes to the NEC and electrical issues he is either very knowledgable, capable of doing quick NEC searches or able to BS a good line. And PLEASE there is no way in hell I'd defend him, just my 2 cents.


----------



## gold (Feb 15, 2008)

I'm just saying ...


----------



## Bob Badger (Apr 19, 2009)

Brother Noah said:


> So if I do not help others with electrical question and answers and do not act like Bob then I am that union azzhole? I do like you Bob although you show signs of psychosis.I have seen where you have actually been polite on your post Bob and then I have read where you act like a spoiled child who just got their hand spanked for being a bad boy.
> Why am I to post on something besides union(would that make me more of a man like you?) You know I have on a rare occasion I have peeked at other issues on this board, but this is but one of nine sites I visit regular, besides the wife says that I do have more to life than to converse on the web.Bob there is still hope just make sure you keep your appointments, I am sure you will be okay.I hope we are still on for Labor day, I will bring the wine.


_You don't have to do anything,_ keep on doing what you are doing if that is what suits you.

But it certainly shows you are nothing but a hypocrite when you say you want us to help each other. You seem to have no interest in the trade, your only interest seems promoting the union.

You waste your time with long winded posts about how I am full of hate while I am helping anyone in the trade when they ask a question. :whistling2:


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## TOOL_5150 (Aug 27, 2007)

gold said:


> I'm just saying ...


This thread could "use flushing again"

~Matt


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## RIVETER (Sep 26, 2009)

Maybe I can tip toe in and then back out. I personally don't like the bashing...either way. I am union and I most likely won't change. However, my union experience has been greatly enhanced by either a poster on this forum or, something on this forum gets me to research it. I think that we need to realize that we are not going to change each others minds, we need to live our lives, enjoy our careers, and just not rag on each other. There are only just a few, here, that I would not like to share a table with at the forum picnic this year.:thumbsup:


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## Widestance_Politics (Jun 2, 2010)

Dnkldorf said:


> Vic, what do you drive?
> 
> Ford, GM? Toyota?
> 
> ...


FWIW I just sold my A-B rig that I have had for 8 years....an 87 Nissan Sentra that I got from a local auction.....just cuz you are in the Union it doesn't mean you HAVE to buy American....I try to buy American in some areas, but when it comes to my vehicle, I'm going for economy not pride....I haven't had a car payment since 99'....I dig it....


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## millerdrr (Jun 26, 2009)

Dnkldorf said:


> Usually the BOD are made up of people who own the majority of the companies stock. They have the most on the line with the company. Not the worker. If the company fails, the Board is hit hardest financialy.
> 
> Surely you can see that if you own the majority of something, you should have the say on what goes on, not someone with no financial interest in your company.


I disagree. None of the officers would spend their last dime to save their company. That's why people form corporations: to shelter personal assets from business risk.

The workers have no backup plan. Company goes under, they have no choice but to seek other employment. 

A third of the country is under-employed. No matter how much fiscal discipline they use, they are still going to be broke. Given that job markets have always been tight for high-paying blue collar work, I would say that union auto workers have far more on the line, than an executive who probably sits on multiple boards and could get a new job with a phone call, or simply retire on the spot as a very wealthy man.


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## Brother Noah1 (Mar 23, 2010)

Bob Badger said:


> _You don't have to do anything,_ keep on doing what you are doing if that is what suits you.
> 
> But it certainly shows you are nothing but a hypocrite when you say you want us to help each other. You seem to have no interest in the trade, your only interest seems promoting the union.
> 
> You waste your time with long winded posts about how I am full of hate while I am helping anyone in the trade when they ask a question. :whistling2:


 Am I a hypocrite or am I only interested in promoting the union? Or maybe you are caught telling another lie? Wine is a reference to the bible (Noah had a problem with the grapes) Brian I appreciate your thoughts and you could be right(I will admit I do not spend enough time and effort teaching others what I have been taught) but your logic could be compared to the logic that all union people work slow as snails and vandalize the job. Bob if you are searching for weakness maybe it is I have such a kind heart.Why would anyone go by the name of Duracell? I hear the inner harbor is aglow this time of year, Labor day is around the corner.


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## gold (Feb 15, 2008)

millerdrr said:


> I disagree. None of the officers would spend their last dime to save their company. That's why people form corporations: to shelter personal assets from business risk.
> 
> The workers have no backup plan. Company goes under, they have no choice but to seek other employment.
> 
> A third of the country is under-employed. No matter how much fiscal discipline they use, they are still going to be broke. Given that job markets have always been tight for high-paying blue collar work, I would say that union auto workers have far more on the line, than an executive who probably sits on multiple boards and could get a new job with a phone call, or simply retire on the spot as a very wealthy man.


Yea no kidding. I say if you make over 100k a year the gubbamint should take yo money and give it away to people making less.

Fair is fair we should all make the same amount. Do you know how many walmart employees we could supplement with one CEO salary?

</SARCASM>


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## miller_elex (Jan 25, 2008)

Dnkldorf said:


> Who drinks wine?
> You watch figure skating too?:laughing:


Ever attend an AA meeting?

and 'NO.' But I might watch women's gymnastics now and again.


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## miller_elex (Jan 25, 2008)

480sparky said:


> BTW, 1K posts!!!
> 
> Dnkldorf
> Bully Hater


Is there a prize for 1,000 blasts of hot air? I'll need you when my furnace sh1ts the bed.


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## captkirk (Nov 21, 2007)

yea this isnt going anywhere good.... Why do we keep rehashing this old debate.....I think in all the years ive been comming to these sites Im not sure anyone has changed anyone's mind about this topic.


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## slickvic277 (Feb 5, 2009)

captkirk said:


> yea this isnt going anywhere good.... Why do we keep rehashing this old debate.....I think in all the years ive been comming to these sites Im not sure anyone has changed anyone's mind about this topic.



It's changed mine. I'm turning in my due's receipt tomorrow.
Then I'm calling up the first contractor I ever worked for and asking for my job back.


















:laughing::laughing::laughing::jester: Just kidding....BWAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!! That would be funny.
Good point non the less.


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## gold (Feb 15, 2008)

slickvic277 said:


> It's changed mine. I'm turning in my due's receipt tomorrow.
> Then I'm calling up the first contractor I ever worked for and asking for my job back.
> 
> .


Changed my mind too!! I'm heading down to the local tomorrow and hopping on the bench!! You can have my job vic.


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## Bob Badger (Apr 19, 2009)

Brother Noah said:


> Am I a hypocrite or am I only interested in promoting the union? Or maybe you are caught telling another lie? Wine is a reference to the bible (Noah had a problem with the grapes) Brian I appreciate your thoughts and you could be right(I will admit I do not spend enough time and effort teaching others what I have been taught) but your logic could be compared to the logic that all union people work slow as snails and vandalize the job. Bob if you are searching for weakness maybe it is I have such a kind heart.Why would anyone go by the name of Duracell? I hear the inner harbor is aglow this time of year, Labor day is around the corner.



Are you drunk on wine now?

At least that would explain the nonsense you continue to post.


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## TOOL_5150 (Aug 27, 2007)

Bob Badger said:


> Are you drunk on wine now?
> 
> At least that would explain the nonsense you continue to post.


maybe brother noah should be a preacher rather than an electrician.

~Matt


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

> The UAW has made concessions. Where's the concessions from the super wealthy?


The top 5% of wage earners pay something like 80% of all federal taxes seems like a MAJOR concession.


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## doubleoh7 (Dec 5, 2009)

The Nun's at school didn't wear panties like that.


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## millerdrr (Jun 26, 2009)

Their tax bills are 20% too low.:thumbup:

Think about it: they DO use practically everything the government offers. Sure, food stamps go to the poor, but thats a very small expenditure from the government. The federal budget is overwhelming devoured by the Pentagon and the Dept of Education. Both of those things benefit business far more than they benefit an average worker. 

I use highways for around 80k miles per year. Fedex and UPS...:whistling2:. Yet, we pay them same gas tax. Of course, their gas taxes are a business expense. In that circumstance, you could say I paid more in tax than Fedex. By myself. 

Exaggerations aside, my point is those who despise paying high taxes forget the incredible services those taxes bring to them. Airline flight from your hometown to a major hub? Subsidized. That's why your ticket was $400. Sports venue owner? You have dozens of highway patrol officers lurking nearby, all on the taxpayer dime, just so you could sell a million bucks worth of beer during the game.

Just in my home area, over the last twenty years, I have seen a county build an airport specifically for a corporation (Lowes-Wilkes County), a third runway paved at a major city (Fedex-Piedmont Triad Airport, Greensboro NC), and huge subsidies given to Dell and other corporations to move here. Lowes moved their headquarters five years later. Dell never met their promises to Kernersville and have all but shut down. Fedex didn't do as promised either.

The super-wealthy get no sympathy from me for carrying the weight of the government, when virtually every check the government writes is to benefit them. :thumbsup:


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## Bob Badger (Apr 19, 2009)

millerdrr said:


> I use highways for around 80k miles per year. Fedex and UPS...:whistling2:. Yet, we pay them same gas tax. Of course, their gas taxes are a business expense. In that circumstance, you could say I paid more in tax than Fedex. By myself.



No, you can't say that, they pay tax by the gallon of fuel they use.


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## millerdrr (Jun 26, 2009)

Bob Badger said:


> No, you can't say that, they pay tax by the gallon of fuel they use.


It's not a deductible expense, since its crucial to their operation?:001_huh:

I'll take your word for it and stand corrected.:thumbup:


----------



## 10492 (Jan 4, 2010)

millerdrr said:


> It's not a deductible expense, since its crucial to their operation?:001_huh:
> 
> I'll take your word for it and stand corrected.:thumbup:


Deductible from what?

Whatever we spend money on, comes right out of our pockets, just like you. Fuel costs are an expense of doing business. 

What Bob is implying is, I think, is that Fedex, UPS, use the most fuel, so they pay the most in fuel taxes. That is kinda they way it should be. You use it, you pay for it.


----------



## Bob Badger (Apr 19, 2009)

Dnkldorf said:


> What Bob is implying is, I think, is that Fedex, UPS, use the most fuel, so they pay the most in fuel taxes. That is kinda they way it should be. You use it, you pay for it.


Exactly.


----------



## millerdrr (Jun 26, 2009)

Dnkldorf said:


> Deductible from what?
> 
> Whatever we spend money on, comes right out of our pockets, just like you. Fuel costs are an expense of doing business.


I would've thought their tax bill would reflect the expenditures. For example, I buy one gallon and drive 25 miles. I spent about $2.50, half of which is tax. That money is gone.

They buy one gallon and drive 25 miles. They deduct $0.55/mile, so their tax bill shows an expense of $13.75. They spent $2.50, and were "given" an additional $11.25, by virtue of not having to pay that amount in corporate income tax. My 25 miles were strictly personal; I used the road as a matter of necessity. Their 25 was strictly business; they used it only to sell a service. I drove to a hospital and was charged a dollar in tax. They delivered a package for a profit and received an additional award of eleven dollars (which, coincidentally, came out of my next 11 gallons).:laughing:

I freely admit I have no tax experience, so I accept the fact that I could be way off base with that analogy. But hey, I found a link lots of you guys might be interested in.:thumbup:

http://turbotax.intuit.com/tax-tools/tax-tips/small-business/5571.html


----------



## amptech (Sep 21, 2007)

millerdrr said:


> I would've thought their tax bill would reflect the expenditures. For example, I buy one gallon and drive 25 miles. I spent about $2.50, half of which is tax. That money is gone.
> 
> They buy one gallon and drive 25 miles. They deduct $0.55/mile, so their tax bill shows an expense of $13.75. They spent $2.50, and were "given" an additional $11.25, by virtue of not having to pay that amount in corporate income tax. My 25 miles were strictly personal; I used the road as a matter of necessity. Their 25 was strictly business; they used it only to sell a service. I drove to a hospital and was charged a dollar in tax. They delivered a package for a profit and received an additional award of eleven dollars (which, coincidentally, came out of my next 11 gallons).:laughing:
> 
> ...


You also need to take in to account that UPS/FedEX are also paying wheel taxes, excise taxes and DOT permit taxes on every vehicle. You may pay some of those as a private citizen(I pay wheel tax here)but not all of them.


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## millerdrr (Jun 26, 2009)

amptech said:


> You also need to take in to account that UPS/FedEX are also paying wheel taxes, excise taxes and DOT permit taxes on every vehicle. You may pay some of those as a private citizen(I pay wheel tax here)but not all of them.


:yes:Indeed; point taken. But they can probably write off the much-higher maintenance costs and vehicle depreciation. I can't.

I understand the point that the top 10% pays 80% of the annual federal budget. I just get lost on why individually, its still on the lower middle class guy to pay 30% of his income, while the billionaire pays 15%. My point with the example was the ratio is what is unfair.

An entire industry has been created that employees people with advanced degrees to decipher the tax code. I'd pay an increase just to avoid all the paperwork, research, headache, and fretting over mistakes.


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## gold (Feb 15, 2008)

I'm just saying, you COULD kill it ...


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## millerdrr (Jun 26, 2009)

I'm just saying, not everything is as it appears on the surface.


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## gold (Feb 15, 2008)

Can you say KTT!!


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

millerdrr said:


> Exaggerations aside, my point is those who despise paying high taxes forget the incredible services those taxes bring to them. Airline flight from your hometown to a major hub? Subsidized. That's why your ticket was $400. Sports venue owner? You have dozens of highway patrol officers lurking nearby, all on the taxpayer dime, just so you could sell a million bucks worth of beer during the game.


And when I travel I pay a tax for the privedge, and from what I hear if this cash went into an airport fund it would be sufficent for airport operation BUT due to ****TY government accounting and mangaement it goes into the general fund, to be frittered away.




> Just in my home area, over the last twenty years, I have seen a county build an airport specifically for a corporation (Lowes-Wilkes County), a third runway paved at a major city (Fedex-Piedmont Triad Airport, Greensboro NC), and huge subsidies given to Dell and other corporations to move here. Lowes moved their headquarters five years later. Dell never met their promises to Kernersville and have all but shut down. Fedex didn't do as promised either.


and most likely you and the local economy benftitted from this.



> The super-wealthy get no sympathy from me for carrying the weight of the government, when virtually every check the government writes is to benefit them. :thumbsup:


WE ARE NOT TALKING SUPER WEALATHY, we are talking small business owners, we are talking (DEPENDING ON THE BOOBS IN CONGERESS) those making somewhere over 100,000-250,000 and that ain't all that much cash for those folks that support the economy. You feel $50,000. tax increase is justifiable not for the betterment of the country but so the government can piss it away is justified.

Taking money and spending down the debt, national defense OK, but the war on poverty HAS DONE NOTHING but made it worse on the poor. NO BENEFIT as we increase programs. because government grows and only sucks more.


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## Brother Noah1 (Mar 23, 2010)

Bob Badger said:


> Are you drunk on wine now?
> 
> At least that would explain the nonsense you continue to post.


 Bob bless your heart I knew you cared. No I do not drink,smoke,do drugs, strike jobs,work slow,wreck havoc on contractors as you want us to believe ALL union people are like. I have already told you my weakness is I am too kind hearted. Once you come out of the closet Bob you can start the healing process.


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## amptech (Sep 21, 2007)

I have this discussion with a 30-year-old self-professing "Progressive Liberal" friend of mine concerning the gap in incomes and he believes people who make $250k plus should be taxed down to his level($45k) so everything is "fair". My response to him goes like this:
2 young men graduate high school with a 3.0 GPA. One goes to work and is not interested in anymore education. He works his way up in a company in 5 years to an income of $40k.
The other young man goes to college, accumulating student loan debt along the way. In 5 years he graduates and in 2 more years he is earning $80k. My friend thinks this is unfair. He thinks example #2 lives twice as good just because he has a piece of paper from a college. Never mind that #2 has acquired more knowledge because maybe #1 also acquired area specific knowledge as well. But #2 accumulated debt while investing in his future with the expectation of earning more to be able to retire that debt.
My friend's response is, "he won't have to pay that debt forever, then he'll be on easy street and that's not fair." My thinking is if there are no rewards or incentives for applying yourself, then how long before people stop applying themselves? Then you won't have the big earners to tax in order to fund everyone else. If you think I'm off-base, just do a little research into the agriculture policies of the USSR between 1950-1970. It didn't take long to become unsustainable. I think CEO salaries are ridiculous too. So are professional athlete's salaries. But I'm not ready for the government to tell us how much money we can make before they start punishing us.


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## Bob Badger (Apr 19, 2009)

Brother Noah said:


> Bob bless your heart I knew you cared. No I do not drink,smoke,do drugs, strike jobs,work slow,wreck havoc on contractors as you want us to believe ALL union people are like.


Show me one place I have said 'all'?

Seriously show me because that is something I have never said.

What I have talked about is things that I have seen with my own eyes.

Your answer to that is to twice call me a liar which is something no one does in person to me. Not because I am intimidating but because I am not a liar, I am actually know to have a high level of integrity. 




> I am too kind hearted. Once you come out of the closet Bob you can start the healing process.


What part of calling me gay or calling people who you do not know 'liars' is 'kind hearted'?


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

Life ain't fair, if it was 2 year olds would not get cancer, good does not always win over evil, bad people do not always get theirs in the end. That's life.

I feel poor should pay some taxes, if you do not pay something into the general fund you have no vested interest on how this is spent. 

I pay a LOT of taxes and the guy making 80,000.00 pays a lot more that his buddy making 40,000.00. If I made the same as my workers where is my incentive to be an owner and risk my capital.

Amptech tell your friend he is a idiot it worked so well in the dead commie countries, yeah lets go that route.


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## gold (Feb 15, 2008)

income tax in general is a bad idea. We should be taxed on what we consume instead. Spend more your taxed more, spend less your taxed less. Not a perfect solution I know, it may need to be supplemented by taxing savings when budget requirements arent met. First we need to correct spending habbbits and repeal Davis and Baccon. Tighten our laws on lobbyist and campaign contributions.

Pot Stirred?


----------



## Brother Noah1 (Mar 23, 2010)

Bob Badger said:


> Show me one place I have said 'all'?
> 
> Seriously show me because that is something I have never said.
> 
> ...


I only returned your volley Bob, see you have also called me a liar but I am not upset because I know that you were not with me and vice versa when these said incidents happened or did not. I only meant that you come out of the closet as a nice guy not a gay guy Bob as an example of you pointing a finger when you were clueless. As far as your technicality of all, okay you may win this minor issue(anything to make you happy Bob) Life is too short to fight and argue over such minor issues.


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## RIVETER (Sep 26, 2009)

Can you guys "electronically" kiss and make up. You both have good things to say.:thumbsup:


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## Bob Badger (Apr 19, 2009)

Brother Noah said:


> I only returned your volley Bob, see you have also called me a liar


Have I?

Can you bring that quote up where I said you where a liar?









> but I am not upset because I know that you were not with me and vice versa when these said incidents happened or did not. I only meant that you come out of the closet as a nice guy not a gay guy Bob as an example of you pointing a finger when you were clueless. As far as your technicality of all, okay you may win this minor issue(anything to make you happy Bob) Life is too short to fight and argue over such minor issues.


What the heck did you just try and say?


----------



## Bob Badger (Apr 19, 2009)

RIVETER said:


> Can you guys "electronically" kiss and make up. You both have good things to say.:thumbsup:



No, it is not going to happen.

I just plain do not like Noah, I might if he had more dimensions than being a union parrot but he chooses otherwise which is his right. It's a free country and I am free not to like everyone.:thumbsup:


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

gold said:


> income tax in general is a bad idea. We should be taxed on what we consume instead. Spend more your taxed more, spend less your taxed less. Not a perfect solution I know, it may need to be supplemented by taxing savings when budget requirements arent met. First we need to correct spending habbbits and repeal Davis and Baccon. Tighten our laws on lobbyist and campaign contributions.
> 
> Pot Stirred?


 
Problem, is some in Congress want a VAT and income not either or. BUT BOTH.

They only want .5% VAT at this time, oh yeah it will soon be 10%-20% like the UK.

We get little value form or federal government.


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## RIVETER (Sep 26, 2009)

Bob Badger said:


> No, it is not going to happen.
> 
> I just plain do not like Noah, I might if he had more dimensions than being a union parrot but he chooses otherwise which is his right. It's a free country and I am free not to like everyone.:thumbsup:


I am a union guy...and I like you.(Professionally, of course):thumbsup:


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

RIVETER said:


> Can you guys "electronically" kiss and make up. You both have good things to say.:thumbsup:


Nah, they are going to bump pee-pees:001_huh::001_huh::001_huh:


----------



## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

RIVETER said:


> I am a union guy...and I like you.(Professionally, of course):thumbsup:


And now you want in on their meeting?


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## amptech (Sep 21, 2007)

gold said:


> income tax in general is a bad idea. We should be taxed on what we consume instead. Spend more your taxed more, spend less your taxed less. Not a perfect solution I know, it may need to be supplemented by taxing savings when budget requirements arent met. First we need to correct spending habbbits and repeal Davis and Baccon. Tighten our laws on lobbyist and campaign contributions.
> 
> Pot Stirred?


A "consumption tax" is basically what the proposed "Fair Tax" is. The Progressive Left hates the Fair Tax plan and all other consumption taxes in general calling them a tax only on the poor. As if poor folks are the only ones buying anything. Make sense out of that line of thought; Poor people would suffer the most because they buy more than rich people. I don't get that at all. The Fair Tax is not perfect by any means but I think it is an idea in the right direction. A national sales tax like what **** Luger proposed a few years ago is another idea worth exploring. Something that exempted groceries like state sales taxes do. 
I have no problem with the idea of paying taxes or user fees to fund roads, fire depts., police, schools and other similar services. The problem is a large percentage of the taxes collected are squandered elsewhere and do not benefit the public good but rather a select few.


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## Brother Noah1 (Mar 23, 2010)

Bob Badger said:


> Have I?
> 
> Can you bring that quote up where I said you where a liar?
> 
> ...


 Wait a minute Bob I just posted that you won on a technicality and I gave way for your gloating but instead you sling your slurs of me lacking dimensions but you have a problem even understanding English. Actually what was meant was that neither one of us told a lie on purpose,you were speaking of your personal experience but placed a present time line on its effect so I could not resist to temptation to let you know that you lied on occasion just as I have.Bob it was not done with malice but we become complacent in our every day world we do not consider all that our word might effect by words and or actions.Although you are right to a small extent (I am glad that I am union and that there are unions) it does not consume my life and hey I even piss off (those damned old union people) with my thoughts and post (so you are not that special in that department)Bob you should know by your experience within the IBEW we have guidelines that are not always adhered by all union personnel. Brian the bumping pee pees is funny but we are sure Bob would loose that one also, yeah the way I heard it he got caught once streaking and was charged with minor possession(ONLY A JOKE)


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## doubleoh7 (Dec 5, 2009)

The Nun's at school didn't wear panties like that.


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

doubleoh7 said:


> The Nun's at school didn't wear panties like that.


You wearing patten leather shoes again, you perv.


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## doubleoh7 (Dec 5, 2009)

brian john said:


> You wearing patten leather shoes again, you perv.


 
Just trying to throw a curve ball into the mx from out in left field. Maybe derail this whole thing into another direction.:laughing:

The only patent leather I wear is my g string.


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## gold (Feb 15, 2008)

amptech said:


> A "consumption tax" is basically what the proposed "Fair Tax" is. The Progressive Left hates the Fair Tax plan and all other consumption taxes in general calling them a tax only on the poor. As if poor folks are the only ones buying anything. Make sense out of that line of thought; Poor people would suffer the most because they buy more than rich people. I don't get that at all. The Fair Tax is not perfect by any means but I think it is an idea in the right direction. A national sales tax like what **** Luger proposed a few years ago is another idea worth exploring. Something that exempted groceries like state sales taxes do.
> I have no problem with the idea of paying taxes or user fees to fund roads, fire depts., police, schools and other similar services. The problem is a large percentage of the taxes collected are squandered elsewhere and do not benefit the public good but rather a select few.


I could get behind the fair tax if it was collected and used on a state level with fed oversight. But that would require massive deregulation and a tremendous reduction in the size of the federal government. I bet we could get the same services we have now with a %20 tax even if we susidised low income households and very small businesses with a tax exemption. 

But all these overpaid under worked union guys would need to take a pay cut. :jester:

Rush/Beck 2012!!!:yes::yes:

Pot stirred?


----------



## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

doubleoh7 said:


> Just trying to throw a curve ball into the mx from out in left field. Maybe derail this whole thing into another direction.:laughing:
> 
> The only patent leather I wear is my g string.


I got it..... first time, BUT you are still a PERVERT:2guns::cursing: :thumbsup:


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## Bob Badger (Apr 19, 2009)

Brother Noah said:


> Wait a minute Bob I just posted that you won on a technicality and I gave way for your gloating but instead you sling your slurs of me lacking dimensions but you have a problem even understanding English. Actually what was meant was that neither one of us told a lie on purpose,you were speaking of your personal experience but placed a present time line on its effect so I could not resist to temptation to let you know that you lied on occasion just as I have.Bob it was not done with malice but we become complacent in our every day world we do not consider all that our word might effect by words and or actions.Although you are right to a small extent (I am glad that I am union and that there are unions) it does not consume my life and hey I even piss off (those damned old union people) with my thoughts and post (so you are not that special in that department)Bob you should know by your experience within the IBEW we have guidelines that are not always adhered by all union personnel. Brian the bumping pee pees is funny but we are sure Bob would loose that one also, yeah the way I heard it he got caught once streaking and was charged with minor possession(ONLY A JOKE)


Does you computer have an enter key? That is a bitch to read.

Lets try it this way





Brother Noah said:


> Wait a minute Bob I just posted that you won on a technicality and I gave way for your gloating but instead you sling your slurs of me lacking dimensions but you have a problem even understanding English.
> 
> Actually what was meant was that neither one of us told a lie on purpose,you were speaking of your personal experience but placed a present time line on its effect so I could not resist to temptation to let you know that you lied on occasion just as I have.
> 
> ...



Naw, it did not help, it still makes no sense.


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## slickvic277 (Feb 5, 2009)

gold said:


> Rush/Beck 2012!!!:yes::yes:


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## gold (Feb 15, 2008)

slickvic277 said:


>


 
HAHAHA
Vic your the last one I expected to bite on that!!


----------



## slickvic277 (Feb 5, 2009)

gold said:


> HAHAHA
> Vic your the last one I expected to bite on that!!



HAHAHAHAH!!! I couldn't help it. It's uncontrollable. As soon as I see "Rush" I start dry heaving.:yes::jester:


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## doubleoh7 (Dec 5, 2009)

brian john said:


> I got it..... first time, BUT you are still a PERVERT:2guns::cursing: :thumbsup:


 
Yes, yes I am.


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## gold (Feb 15, 2008)

Quick someone start a thread about ripping off old ladies so we forget about this one!!


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## miller_elex (Jan 25, 2008)

slickvic277 said:


> uncontrollable. As soon as I see "Rush" I start dry heaving.:yes::jester:


Did someone say Rush? 

Get a lance! I get first poke at the boil on his butt!

Didn't Beck get a huge infected boil on his butt too?

Coincidence or not, they are 'Butt' brothers!

GOD has a sense of humor after all


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## gold (Feb 15, 2008)

_halp!!! Halp!!! _


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## doubleoh7 (Dec 5, 2009)

I suspect that Beck is using cocaine. No, I am not kidding. He exhibits many of the characteristics.


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## gold (Feb 15, 2008)

doubleoh7 said:


> I suspect that Beck is using cocaine. No, I am not kidding. He exhibits many of the characteristics.


Nancy Pelosi is a transvestite.


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

doubleoh7 said:


> I suspect that Beck is using cocaine. No, I am not kidding. He exhibits many of the characteristics.


Coke heads and religious fanatics exhibit the same character flaws.

While I think Beck has some good points I cannot watch him.


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## doubleoh7 (Dec 5, 2009)

brian john said:


> Coke heads and religious fanatics exhibit the same character flaws.
> 
> While I think Beck has some good points I cannot watch him.


 
He does exhibit a religious fanaticism for the Republican party. Sorry, but I just don't buy into Republican=good, Democrat = bad stuff anymore. Republicans and Democrats = bad.


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## RIVETER (Sep 26, 2009)

doubleoh7 said:


> He does exhibit a religious fanaticism for the Republican party. Sorry, but I just don't buy into Republican=good, Democrat = bad stuff anymore. Republicans and Democrats = bad.


He is well intentioned and I sometime change the channel because I feel myself becoming depressed, but, overall he is right on target. AND, he doesn't like all republicans or democrats...he is an Independent, and cares for our nation and cannot understand why the vast GREAT silent majority won't stand up and be vocal.


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

RIVETER said:


> H..he is an Independent, and cares for our nation and cannot understand why the vast GREAT silent majority won't stand up and be vocal.



The few times I watched his show he showed disdain equally for Dem.s and Rep.s, he seems to be a constitutionalist, which seems hard to fault.

Example Bloomberg says the Muslims have a constitutionally right to build a mosque (WHICH THEY DO), yet feels no one should be able to own a firearm.

SEEMsTO BE ANOTHER A**HOLE hypocrite?

HMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMMM


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## amptech (Sep 21, 2007)

doubleoh7 said:


> He does exhibit a religious fanaticism for the Republican party. Sorry, but I just don't buy into Republican=good, Democrat = bad stuff anymore. Republicans and Democrats = bad.


You can't think that of Beck based on what he says because he rips republicans with the same fervor as he does democrats. He slams republican presidents all the way back to Teddy Roosevelt. 
I can't stand to watch Beck but I do enjoy reading some of his books. I don't like Rush at all. What ever valid points he may have had are completely lost in his over-the-top flat out hate for anyone who disagrees with his point of view. He is nothing but the other side of the same coin.


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