# Hallway light and living room light tied to the same light switch?



## FrunkSlammer (Aug 31, 2013)

Oh this is going to be a good one!

I'm going to pop some popcorn.


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## Soviet Hawk (Apr 19, 2014)

Bring me some advil?


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## Soviet Hawk (Apr 19, 2014)

The only thing I can think of is if I tried tracing the wire and splice it in if it's not connected. I don't know if that's to code though or the chances of it starting a fire.


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## Mich drew (Mar 3, 2013)

First I would figure out why a white wire instead of the bare grounds in the box is tied to the ground screw. Maybe the homeowner who wired it thought it was a 4 way.


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## BababooeyHTJ (May 31, 2013)

Lol 

Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)




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## Legacyelectric (Sep 9, 2012)

Looks like a BRAND new 3way I there to me.


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## Legacyelectric (Sep 9, 2012)

No way were going to figure this out without being there with a meter I don't think. Looks like you've got a hot landed under a traveler screw on the device though. And that 3 way has never been screwed into that box.


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## tesco (Feb 17, 2012)

What's the problem? What isn't working?

Take that white off the switch and bond it properly.

edit: Missed the traveller being on the common screw.


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## Legacyelectric (Sep 9, 2012)

And, your black traveler is wrapped the wrong way under the screw.


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

Soviet Hawk said:


> So helping a friend out with some electrical and his hallway 3-way switch is also tied into his living room 3 way. I am a new electrician so this would be my first time running into this problem but I didn't think you should/could tie two 3-way together. Looking for advice on maybe what to test or how this should be done. Below is a picture of the switch that is supposed to control both 3-way circuits.
> 
> *Please note I didn't do any wiring yet, I took off the cover and this is what I found*...........


Silly me, but I *always* install pairs of 3-ways tied to each other. That's the entire reason they exist.... to be tied to each other in pairs.

Looks like someone who doesn't understand how 3-ways work tried to install new switches, totally screwed it up, and now is asking a friend to bail him out.


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## sammt (May 11, 2014)

Also looks to me like the power is accidentally on a traveller screw. the power is supposed to be on the black screw. If you are patient you could look up online the several ways 3ways can be wired. The whites need to be wire nutted together and not connected to the switch and then swap the blacks around so you have power on the common. might burn up the fixture though if that isn't correct wiring.


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## Legacyelectric (Sep 9, 2012)

Id bet money the black and red in the 3 wire are the travelers. The white in the three wire may have been sending a switch leg to the other 3way switch, or it's a neutral. I'd bust it all out and put a meter on it to see what's what. No telling what's been swapped around.


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## sammt (May 11, 2014)

and ground the switch properly


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## AllWIRES (Apr 10, 2014)

FrunkSlammer said:


> Oh this is going to be a good one!
> 
> I'm going to pop some popcorn.


:thumbup:


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## FrunkSlammer (Aug 31, 2013)




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## AllWIRES (Apr 10, 2014)

I just laughed out loud. :laughing:


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## wendon (Sep 27, 2010)

Nice job of wrapping the bootleg stranded ground under the screw though! 
Conductor fill might be a concern too.


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## Wirenuting (Sep 12, 2010)

Boot leg ground? 


Who's the communist "s&/t" twinkle toed "male chicken" suker who sighed his own death warrant? Nobody huh,, the fairy "gosh darn" godmother did it. Out "friggin" standing, I will PT you all until you die. I'll PT you until your "out end" is sukin butter milk.


edit, please pass the pop corn.


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## Soviet Hawk (Apr 19, 2014)

Took me a while to test through everything I could think of but in the end it wasn't two 3-way switches tied in together. I had to do a bit of re arranging and figuring out which wire was the traveler but Legacy was right on the travelers. That stranded white wire was a ground, so I took that off and replaced it with a proper ground wire. 

Wendon can you explain by what you mean "bootleg ground" please?


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

Soviet Hawk said:


> ...........Wendon can you explain by what you mean "bootleg ground" please?


Using the neutral as a ground by attaching the ground terminal to the neutral conductor.


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## Soviet Hawk (Apr 19, 2014)

This is pretty much how I figure the lighting works in that house


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## Soviet Hawk (Apr 19, 2014)

Oh it was not a bootleg ground, was just a chunk of stranded going to ground instead of using a bare wire they just grabbed a piece of scrap


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

Soviet Hawk said:


> This is pretty much how I figure the lighting works in that house



What's wrong with it? Did it work differently before someone installed the new switches? Or did it function that way before?

There's nothing in the NEC that prohibits wiring lights they way shown in the image.


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## Legacyelectric (Sep 9, 2012)

480sparky said:


> Using the neutral as a ground by attaching the ground terminal to the neutral conductor.


On a 3way switch?


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## Big John (May 23, 2010)

480sparky said:


> ...There's nothing in the NEC that prohibits wiring lights they way shown in the image.


 I haven't been following this thread, but it depends where the hot is connected in that picture.

If he's hooking to the common between those two 3-ways then that means he's got a parallel conductor violation.


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## Legacyelectric (Sep 9, 2012)

Big John said:


> I haven't been following this thread, but it depends where the hot is connected in that picture. If he's hooking to the common between those two 3-ways then that means he's got a parallel conductor violation.


The hot appeared to be at the switch location In one of the images. Could also have been two switch legs pig tailed as there are two fixtures. But I assumed it was the hot. 

I'm not sure I understand hooking the hot to the common causing a parallel conductor issue? You could break the three wire at a fixture and dead end both three ways if the hot was at the fixture location correct?


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

Legacyelectric said:


> On a 3way switch?


The question was about the meaning of 'bootleg grounds'.... not 3-way switches.


And what would prevent a hack from hooking the neutral up to the switch's grounding terminal?


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## Legacyelectric (Sep 9, 2012)

480sparky said:


> The question was about the meaning of 'bootleg grounds'.... not 3-way switches. And what would prevent a hack from hooking the neutral up to the switch's grounding terminal?


I gotcha. Sorry! I saw the pic you posted and had 3way on the brain.


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