# Arc fault and lighting circuits.



## kjw444 (Jan 14, 2008)

My company does it all the time. The only problems I have heard of are from fans.


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## ralph (Apr 6, 2008)

All things in that bedroom that are 120 volt, including lights , must be arc fault.


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## threewire (Jan 28, 2008)

Have never had a problem.


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## waco (Dec 10, 2007)

I've had problems with multiwire circuits and mixed-circuit light switch boxes with the grounds tied together, especially involving three or four way switching. It's a mess.

I've had some inspectors accept arc faults on receptacles and not on the lighting "outlets." I think they're ahead of the curve.


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## kjw444 (Jan 14, 2008)

The code states "outlets" so you could argue that a light or a switch is not an outlet. 210.12 b


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## Mountain Electrician (Jan 22, 2007)

Inspector here requires receps, not lights. Plus, as of now Maine isn't adopting the part of the '08 code requiring arc-fault throughout the house. Bedrooms only.


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## waco (Dec 10, 2007)

I know what the code says, but I also know local jurisdictions can select what they want to use. Since arc faults were sold to overcome the hazards of extension cord failures, it makes no sense to require them where nothing can be plugged-in.

But money talks.


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## yankeewired (Jul 3, 2008)

Hmmm. sounds like MASS is once again the first to adopt / implement code advances. When I travel to various parts of the US I often see electrical practices just being adopted that I have been required to follow years before. 2005 NEC required all circuits supplying outlets in bedrooms to be AFI protected.This means receptacles, switches,lighting,smokes ect. Now in 2008 this requirement has expanded to "habitable rooms" and combination type AFI circuit breakers are now also needed. When adding a receptacle or light or whatever in an exsisting dwelling unit from an exsisting circuit you are not required to provide AFI protection.


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## ralph (Apr 6, 2008)

kjw444 said:


> The code states "outlets" so you could argue that a light or a switch is not an outlet. 210.12 b


Art 100 
definition- outlet
A point on the wiring system at which current is taken to supply utilization equipment.

Maybe im over the top , but i would consider that a switch will supply the light at some point. The light takes current . I AF all of it.


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

ralph said:


> Art 100
> definition- outlet
> A point on the wiring system at which current is taken to supply utilization equipment.
> 
> Maybe im over the top , but i would consider that a switch will supply the light at some point. The light takes current . I AF all of it.


The switch-as-an-outlet argument has been discussed preciously. I think the majority agree it's not an outlet.


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## Idaho Abe (Nov 28, 2007)

*Afci*

My jurisdiction, like the St of Idaho, requires AFCI for Bedrooms and not the entire house. We have had prblems with motor driven appliances, i.e. vaccuums, some older whole house vacuum systems, and older brush type motors. Also some of the energy saving CFL bulbs would trip the AFCI.


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## JohnJ0906 (Jan 22, 2007)

Idaho Abe said:


> Also some of the energy saving CFL bulbs would trip the AFCI.


I have not experienced this, but I will keep it in mind. Thanks Abe.


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## JohnJ0906 (Jan 22, 2007)

kjw444 said:


> The code states "outlets" so you could argue that a light or a switch is not an outlet. 210.12 b


You can argue the switch, but not the light. That is certainly an outlet.


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## ralph (Apr 6, 2008)

All right .fine 
make sure the light is arc fault protected, but dont worry about the switch.
Good luck .


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## kawaikfx400 (Jul 14, 2008)

I'm from southeast mass and we have to arc fault everything thats not GFI protected or an appliance. At least we do to make inspectors happy. We do mostly new construction but on service changes and what not most inspectors do not require arc faults on existing work.


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## Greg (Aug 1, 2007)

kjw444 said:


> The code states "outlets" so you could argue that a light or a switch is not an outlet. 210.12 b


Article 100 definitions states; *Outlets.* A point on the wiring system at which current is taken to supply utilization equipment.

*Utilization Equipment.* Equipment that utilizes electric energy for electronic, electromechanical, chemical, heating, lighting, or similar purposes.

So by definition, lights, receptacles, and ceiling fans in a bedroom go to the ARC fault circuit.

What most people think of an outlet is actually a receptacle.


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## cbr600rrnut (Jul 25, 2008)

Up here in Canada we have been installing AFI's for some time now. The code states that all bedroom recepticles must be AFI protected but not lights. It is allowabe to protect other recepticles (non bedroom) and lights on a AFI circuit as well but the Canadian code states, never connect a smoke detector to an AFI cct.

Cheers


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## waco (Dec 10, 2007)

I don't care about the "outlet" argument. Smoke detectors are connected to "outlets," and I've heard others say to not put them on arc fault breakers.

What I do care about is the ridiculously high cost of the breakers versus their original "sell" which was cord failures in bedrooms, especially extension cords.


I just got a reading today from a county supervisor inspector and he said arc faults are required exactly as stated in the code, ignoring the words that amount to "...and so on."

Some houses would require seven or eight hundred dollars worth of breakers! That's a hard sell, but easy enough to avoid -- just don't pull a permit.

Bad situation.


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## SparkyNut (Oct 27, 2012)

Can you install a GFI receptacle on an ARC fault protected circuit such as a bath vanity?


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