# Foyer ceilings?



## dirtyhand (Mar 3, 2010)

New here, and I already have a question....
Whats everybody doing about two story foyer lights and "great room" fans? I'm mostly interested in hearing from other one man crews. What are you doing, building scaffolding, dragging 16' ladders through houses? Anybody ever try pulling a little vertical lift into a house?


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

Yea, I know.... every cries about it being aluminum.


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## RIVETER (Sep 26, 2009)

dirtyhand said:


> New here, and I already have a question....
> Whats everybody doing about two story foyer lights and "great room" fans? I'm mostly interested in hearing from other one man crews. What are you doing, building scaffolding, dragging 16' ladders through houses? Anybody ever try pulling a little vertical lift into a house?


Are you talking rough in...or trim out?


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## dirtyhand (Mar 3, 2010)

I bought that sam skyscraper ladder but find it tricky to move and set up alone. It's also a bit twitchy when up high. are you a lone wolf 480 or do you have extra hands?


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

dirtyhand said:


> I bought that sam skyscraper ladder but find it tricky to move and set up alone. It's also a bit twitchy when up high. are you a lone wolf 480 or do you have extra hands?


 
I haul it and set it up solo.


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## dirtyhand (Mar 3, 2010)

RIVETER said:


> Are you talking rough in...or trim out?


 Most of the calls I get involving the high ceilings are simple fan/fixture changeouts.


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## Dennis Alwon (May 9, 2009)

I don't want to tell you what I do because I will get hell from everyone.  I have had people look up at me and say "You're f....ing nuts". Well maybe but I think what I did was pretty safe--Osha may not.

I almost bought a 16' ladder but it weighs so much you need two people to get it off the truck then you need the room to open it up in the house. I guess one like Ken shows is a good to go. 

The problem is foyers where the stairs are in the way.


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## dirtyhand (Mar 3, 2010)

480sparky said:


> I haul it and set it up solo.


 I'm curious about your set-up process, Do you extend it laying down then walk it up and open or do you open it short and raise it?


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## RIVETER (Sep 26, 2009)

Dennis Alwon said:


> I don't want to tell you what I do because I will get hell from everyone.  I have had people look up at me and say "You're f....ing nuts". Well maybe but I think what I did was pretty safe--Osha may not.
> 
> I almost bought a 16' ladder but it weighs so much you need two people to get it off the truck then you need the room to open it up in the house. I guess one like Ken shows is a good to go.
> 
> The problem is foyers where the stairs are in the way.


Dennis, as long as there is no other person who cares whether you live or die, and you have workman's compensation, I say GO FOR IT. That safety crap just slows you down.


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## RIVETER (Sep 26, 2009)

dirtyhand said:


> Most of the calls I get involving the high ceilings are simple fan/fixture changeouts.


That, to me makes a difference. I probbly would rent a scaffold. They are cheap enough.


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## dirtyhand (Mar 3, 2010)

RIVETER said:


> That, to me makes a difference. I probbly would rent a scaffold. They are cheap enough.


 That's one thing I haven't tried on my own yet. I figure by time I pick-up, set-up, change fixture, tear down, return scaf.. how much could I charge people to make it worth it. Not that I ever have but I imagine droping a scaff section on tile or hardwood could end bad. I've been looking into the small vertical lifts like genie (found a few reasonable$) with that and a small ramp to get up the 1-2 steps at a front door I think the time spent on site would be greatly reduced. Has anyone tried that? They weigh about 700-800lbs plus me so that could be a concern ( Dont want to end up in a basement)


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## RIVETER (Sep 26, 2009)

dirtyhand said:


> That's one thing I haven't tried on my own yet. I figure by time I pick-up, set-up, change fixture, tear down, return scaf.. how much could I charge people to make it worth it. Not that I ever have but I imagine droping a scaff section on tile or hardwood could end bad. I've been looking into the small vertical lifts like genie (found a few reasonable$) with that and a small ramp to get up the 1-2 steps at a front door I think the time spent on site would be greatly reduced. Has anyone tried that? They weigh about 700-800lbs plus me so that could be a concern ( Dont want to end up in a basement)


I have rented scaffolds. They are not that troublesome,(baker type), but even if they were just charge the time. Being honest on the job means NOT just to the customer...It means to YOURSELF as well.


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## Dennis Alwon (May 9, 2009)

By the time you drive to get the scaffold, set it up and bring it back you've lost half a day to hang one fan. Egads.


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## MDShunk (Jan 7, 2007)

Dennis Alwon said:


> By the time you drive to get the scaffold, set it up and bring it back you've lost half a day to hang one fan. Egads.


You must be slow. I own 4 bucks high and a set of wheels. I can set that much up in 20 minutes and tear it down in 10. I don't often have a need to setup scaffold in a house. I just very carefully maneauver a ladder, most of the time. Makes for quicker work.


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## egads (Sep 1, 2009)

As the person being hired to work in a vaulted space, you are not the one who designed it. Or the one who bought it. You just now have to work there. If that costs extra (and it does) so what?


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

dirtyhand said:


> I'm curious about your set-up process, Do you extend it laying down then walk it up and open or do you open it short and raise it?


Up to 16', I extend it on the ground / floor and can stand it up. Anything higher, I need a wall or something to walk it up.


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

MDShunk said:


> You must be slow. I own 4 bucks high and a set of wheels. I can set that much up in 20 minutes and tear it down in 10. I don't often have a need to setup scaffold in a house. I just very carefully maneauver a ladder, most of the time. Makes for quicker work.


 
He said, "by the time you drive to get" and "take it back." You gotta charge windshield time. 


Unless you carry all that scaffolding with you.


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## RIVETER (Sep 26, 2009)

Dennis Alwon said:


> By the time you drive to get the scaffold, set it up and bring it back you've lost half a day to hang one fan. Egads.


I have them delivered.


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## 220/221 (Sep 25, 2007)

You can handle an aluminum 16' A frame ladder by yourself. That will take you comfortably to 20'................. 23' in a pinch :jester:


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## Badabing (Jun 4, 2009)

In all the houses I've done, only 1 foyer did we have to use scaffolding, and that was set up by the contractor. Every other house we would install an Alladin Light lift. Makes life easier for installing those huge fixtures with all the crystals and bulbs and fancy things hanging off of them. As for great rooms (lots more room to open a ladder) we would use our 16' ladder. Usually took 2 people to move / open it up so we wouldnt hit anything. Great rooms always had a fan, so it was easy to put it together on the ground and bring it up and just hang the downrod and wire it up and be done with it.


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## Shockdoc (Mar 4, 2010)

I have found the extension ladder to suit fine for some applications, the 16 ft A frame for others.


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## MDShunk (Jan 7, 2007)

Shockdoc said:


> I have found the extension ladder to suit fine for some applications, the 16 ft A frame for others.


I keep a set of really clean, nearly new ladder mits in a ziplock bag purposely to use an extension ladder indoors. Had to use them recently to put power to an overhead projector screen in a Masonic Lodge meeting room. Beats getting smudge marks on the wall from the "outdoors" set of ladder mits. The thing that sucked most was that it was a rainy day, and I had to carry my ladder in the entry way and wipe it dry with paper towels first.


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## Shockdoc (Mar 4, 2010)

MDShunk said:


> I keep a set of really clean, nearly new ladder mits in a ziplock bag purposely to use an extension ladder indoors. Had to use them recently to put power to an overhead projector screen in a Masonic Lodge meeting room. Beats getting smudge marks on the wall from the "outdoors" set of ladder mits. The thing that sucked most was that it was a rainy day, and I had to carry my ladder in the entry way and wipe it dry with paper towels first.


Ditto on the mitts, probably one of the greatest inventions derived from wrapping a rag around it. I see alot of foam stucco structures that also call for the mitts.:thumbup:


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## LGLS (Nov 10, 2007)

Shockdoc said:


> Ditto on the mitts, probably one of the greatest inventions derived from wrapping a rag around it. I see alot of foam stucco structures that also call for the mitts.:thumbup:


All those foam stucco sided buildings are going to lead to a lot of work in the near future... 

Man is that stuff cheezy or what?


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## B4T (Feb 10, 2009)

LawnGuyLandSparky said:


> All those foam stucco sided buildings are going to lead to a lot of work in the near future...
> 
> Man is that stuff cheezy or what?


A lot depends if they used a building paper under the foam that was rated for Stucco


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## Shockdoc (Mar 4, 2010)

LawnGuyLandSparky said:


> All those foam stucco sided buildings are going to lead to a lot of work in the near future...
> 
> Man is that stuff cheezy or what?


 I recently worked on the interior of one while the stucco was being applied. I tried to sell a service upgrade during that time. The homeowner called me back a year later now wanting it. Needless to say the stucco company needed to return since they covered the entire existing service inside the stucco. I've seen another one where the contractor buried a 400 amp point of connection under a fake stucco facade, all one can see was the triplex drop disappearing through the wall. This is what these mid high end Long Island homes are getting. Bring back clapboard !


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## Forgery (Mar 6, 2010)

Are you guys talking about EIFS/Dryvit?


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## LGLS (Nov 10, 2007)

Shockdoc said:


> I recently worked on the interior of one while the stucco was being applied. I tried to sell a service upgrade during that time. The homeowner called me back a year later now wanting it. Needless to say the stucco company needed to return since they covered the entire existing service inside the stucco. I've seen another one where the contractor buried a 400 amp point of connection under a fake stucco facade, all one can see was the triplex drop disappearing through the wall. This is what these mid high end Long Island homes are getting. Bring back clapboard !


I priced this stucco for a rental, then in Mass on vacation I chatted up some guys who were doing a high-end custom cedar shake job on a cape, they were cheaper...

This spray-on-to-styrofoam deal is a piss-poor process, but a moneymaker for scam artists and chimmney sweep services...


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## VersaJoe (Nov 19, 2009)

LawnGuyLandSparky said:


> All those foam stucco sided buildings are going to lead to a lot of work in the near future...
> 
> Man is that stuff cheezy or what?


 
No actually, it's not cheesy at all. I did my whole house in stucco and it's one of the best, maintenance free exteriors money can buy.


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## Tom Neighbarger (Feb 5, 2010)

its not easy to set up a 16' ladder, but it is possible. i carry the ladder in the house then take a piece of ply wood and set it up on a wall so i can walk the ladder upright against the wall. then just grab one leg of the ladder and walk away from the wall until the ladder opens. once that is done i put a cloth under each leg of the ladder and it will slide around into position farely easy. good luck


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## Mike_586 (Mar 24, 2009)

Tom Neighbarger said:


> its not easy to set up a 16' ladder, but it is possible. i carry the ladder in the house then take a piece of ply wood and set it up on a wall so i can walk the ladder upright against the wall. then just grab one leg of the ladder and walk away from the wall until the ladder opens. once that is done i put a cloth under each leg of the ladder and it will slide around into position farely easy. good luck


I do the same thing. Much prefer aluminum. I'm not into hernias and the super heavy duty fiberglass ones are a bit of a bear to wrestle alone in a house that's occupied.

Or maybe I just need more exercise.


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## Shockdoc (Mar 4, 2010)

What do you think of electricians who use a aluminum ext ladder for live service upgrades ? I know of one, it just appears unnatural ( and unsafe).


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## captkirk (Nov 21, 2007)

I use a double sided 16 footer. I just wish I got an aluminum one.


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## Forgery (Mar 6, 2010)

Shockdoc said:


> What do you think of electricians who use a aluminum ext ladder for live service upgrades ? I know of one, it just appears unnatural ( and unsafe).


What's the difference? 

What's the difference between an aluminum ladder bridging the gap between you and the ground vs. you standing on the ground yourself?

This thread opens up a whole new issue as well. When talking about using a ladder in the foyer everyone wants it to be fiberglass. But if you setup a baker scaffold it's perfectly OK for it to be steel.


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## Tom Neighbarger (Feb 5, 2010)

Shockdoc said:


> What do you think of electricians who use a aluminum ext ladder for live service upgrades ? I know of one, it just appears unnatural ( and unsafe).


 that's nuts! :no: i personally like making it home everyday after work!


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## Shockdoc (Mar 4, 2010)

Forgery said:


> What's the difference?
> 
> What's the difference between an aluminum ladder bridging the gap between you and the ground vs. you standing on the ground yourself?
> 
> This thread opens up a whole new issue as well. When talking about using a ladder in the foyer everyone wants it to be fiberglass. But if you setup a baker scaffold it's perfectly OK for it to be steel.


I tied in a parallel 400 amp commercial service 20 years ago on a aluminum ext ladder. It's all we had available that day, guys thought I was nuts for carrying that out. I don't mind living dangerously once in a while. I still remember those old heavy wooden ladders that my employers felt were cheaper than the glass ones, don't even see them around anymore.


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## Mr. Sparkle (Jan 27, 2009)

I see nothing wrong at all with choosing to purchase an aluminum 16 footer due to portability, on the rough there is no power and on the finish you know where the breaker is..... I personally have 2 tiers of baker scaffold I use if need be, if it's a finish I put cardboard on the floor and sometimes a dropcloth over that.


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