# Mini-splits for a hotel



## splatz (May 23, 2015)

How many rooms?


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## MikeFL (Apr 16, 2016)

Off the top of my head, just under 40 rooms.

I think it had 40.

I'm combining 2 to make a full ADA room.

And also adding a passenger elevator which only takes a chunk of one room and the rest is common area. So that might combine 2 rooms. 

Don't need to finalize what model numbers are but need at least some guidance on what loads will be so we can do the load calc for the building. Figured I'd find the preferred brand/ series and go from there. Pick what I think we'll use and go one size bigger for the load calc.


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## splatz (May 23, 2015)

I have a few HVAC shops for customers. They love Mitsubishi and Fujitsu, I think Mitsubishi Mr. Slim was the first one that really caught on. 

I would think you want heat too ... take that into consideration. 

Do you have a spot for all those compressors?


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## MikeFL (Apr 16, 2016)

The other side of the wall. 
That being said, I'd guess they could be package units as well. 
Typical hotel setup.
This place has never had A/C.
The units will have heat.


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## splatz (May 23, 2015)

MikeFL said:


> The other side of the wall.
> That being said, I'd guess they could be package units as well.
> Typical hotel setup.
> This place has never had A/C.
> The units will have heat.


The mini splits are nice and quiet on the inside, the compressor noise is on the outside and the fans are all really nice and quiet. 

If you have three rooms one over the other, I would think you could have one big compressor for three rooms with the lines going up the side, that might come out looking OK. Maybe put the indoor units over the windows... that seems like about as easy an install as you're going to get.


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## splatz (May 23, 2015)

As for the controls, I'd make the selections in this order 

local distributor 
software 
thermostats 
mini splits 

In other words, I'd start with reputable local dealers, because the best system out there will suck if they don't perform. And, it doesn't matter how good they are if they are out of the price range. 

Make a list of features you want, now and possibly in the future. If you can get a good flexible building controls system you can add a lot to it, there is some value in having everything in one system. For example, you might want notifications if there is water on the floor in the basement, high temperature in the restaurant's walk in coolers, etc. etc.


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## MikeFL (Apr 16, 2016)

He'll build the BMS system from scratch. The equipment just needs some way to communicate.


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## splatz (May 23, 2015)

MikeFL said:


> He'll build the BMS system from scratch. The equipment just needs some way to communicate.


That's pretty ambitious but I bet it could be a really nice project! 

Just spitballing ...

I'd want a dead simple thermostat for the guests to use. I mean like a classic round style. I don't want to make a new daily task explaining to guests how to use the fancy thermostat. I'd run all those wires to a control panel on each floor. 

I'd want to select mini splits that work with standard, basic thermostats, and run wires from the inside units on the mini splits to the control panel on each floor as well. 

The control logic should not be too too bad. Any PLC can handle it. The part that will be harder to roll your own is the interface to the front desk. You basically need a network based HMI. That might be what drives the choice of PLC. I would not want Wonderware or etc. at the front desk computers, there are better ways. 

I'll give you a hint from a humble man. Or I should say humbleD man. Get relays that allow for HOA at the control panel. Put relays in so that the NCs just connect the thermostats directly to the mini splits, so the heating and cooling functions with the room thermostats if the controls are down. Open the relays to override the room thermostats with the central control.


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## MikeFL (Apr 16, 2016)

He already has quite a network in the city block he owns. From cash management in real time to the video (100+ cameras) and access control points, flow monitors on water mains, etc.., all of that was built from scratch. One of his guys has a software engineering degree and they're always making this do that and so on. 

So I guess it really does boil down to the t-stats. 

I'm not hearing you say stay away from this brand or that brand. Maybe someone else will come along...


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## Missouri Bound (Aug 30, 2009)

splatz;5273106
Do you have a spot for all those compressors?[/QUOTE said:


> Yeah.....THIS!!:001_unsure:


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## MTW (Aug 28, 2013)

Around here I see Mitsubishi installed the most, followed by Fujitsu and LG. 

A few weeks back I helped install and wire some Fujitsu units (without a permit, of course :shifty. They were easier to install than the GREE unit I installed a few years ago, at least the inside unit was.


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## MikeFL (Apr 16, 2016)

This one is made in TN and comes with front desk management interface.
Under $1k/ unit.

https://www.acwholesalers.com/Amana...MItJ--sqK75gIVGI7ICh1bnQsnEAQYASABEgIRzPD_BwE


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## Missouri Bound (Aug 30, 2009)

MikeFL said:


> This one is made in TN and comes with front desk management interface.
> Under $1k/ unit.


Plan on renting a crane? Seems like a mini-split would be much easier to install if you have a place for the compressor. And you can get a mini split that handles 4 zones. Might be worth the extra $$$ on equipment instead of labor and rental costs.
And no cutting holes in the wall.


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## splatz (May 23, 2015)

MikeFL said:


> This one is made in TN and comes with front desk management interface.
> Under $1k/ unit.
> 
> https://www.acwholesalers.com/Amana...MItJ--sqK75gIVGI7ICh1bnQsnEAQYASABEgIRzPD_BwE


inexpensive, low maintenance; 
noisy, huge hole in the wall to install


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## mofos be cray (Nov 14, 2016)

MikeFL said:


> This one is made in TN and comes with front desk management interface.
> Under $1k/ unit.
> 
> https://www.acwholesalers.com/Amana...MItJ--sqK75gIVGI7ICh1bnQsnEAQYASABEgIRzPD_BwE





splatz said:


> MikeFL said:
> 
> 
> > This one is made in TN and comes with front desk management interface.
> ...


I wired these up in a hotel up here. It is a big hole. They just hired a carpenter to do the framing because we were doing 20 of them. If put them in under the window its pretty simple because no need to install a header.


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## splatz (May 23, 2015)

mofos be cray said:


> I wired these up in a hotel up here. It is a big hole. They just hired a carpenter to do the framing because we were doing 20 of them. If put them in under the window its pretty simple because no need to install a header.


The framing would not be hard as long as there's room under the window, you're probably just removing some or all of the cripple studs and framing around the through-the-wall sleeve. Of course there's all the flashing and etc. to make it water tight. 

With the mini split compressors, you would only have to run power to the disconnects along the outside wall, with the through-wall units, you have to run the power to every room. Depends on the building but I bet this is another point in favor of mini-spits.


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## MikeFL (Apr 16, 2016)

Exterior wall section is 12" block at all the guest rooms.
Easy install.


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## VELOCI3 (Aug 15, 2019)

Why not run chilled water for the AC and hot water for the heat. Or just chilled water and rev cycle plus electric for the heat. That many rooms would lend itself to a single RTU


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## MikeFL (Apr 16, 2016)

Because occupancy is not consistent. And any problem in one place is local to that place.


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## macmikeman (Jan 23, 2007)

Mitsubishi #1. Fujitsu #2. Sanyo #3. 

This is from having done thousands of them in residential and commercial installs in the last forty years, this state pioneered them way long time before they caught on in the mainland. I got 20 years out of my own Mitsubushi splits, actually one of the bedroom ones is original and still pooping out cold air just fine , but the bearings on the compressor are a bit noisy so next year it's getting replaced too. 

20 years of service is a pretty good machine. I never had to have a repair on any during that time period. 7 of them at my house. All single zones. They make up to 4 zone models so you could knock out 4 hotel rooms with a single compressor mounted in the middle of the 4 rooms , ten compressors for 40 rooms . It won't look too horrible that way.


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## sbrn33 (Mar 15, 2007)

I can tell you what not to get. Goodman. I just switched my new one out for a Mitsubishi which is much better. 
On this size of job I would have it designed because you probably only need 10 outdoor units and then zone the inside ones.


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

Is noise really an issue in a hotel room?

Mini splits are awesome for comfort and noise, however they are expensive and require extra logistics for linesets and condensing units. For a hotel room, the packaged units works great.


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## nrp3 (Jan 24, 2009)

I like my Mitsubishi that I have. The heat works pretty good too.


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## MikeFL (Apr 16, 2016)

We're going with PTAC's just like much of the hotel industry. 

As someone who stays in hotels often I prefer a PTAC. I have 100% control of the system so long as I'm in the room, and it does what I tell it to do.


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

MikeFL said:


> We're going with PTAC's just like much of the hotel industry.
> 
> As someone who stays in hotels often I prefer a PTAC. I have 100% control of the system so long as I'm in the room, and it does what I tell it to do.


I think this is the best bet. Run a cable to each unit and done. Cheap and effective.


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## MikeFL (Apr 16, 2016)

And if there's a problem with a unit just swap it for another and take it off to the shop instead of working on it in the guest room. This guy owns refrigeration equipment 50 years old.


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