# Starlink



## gpop (May 14, 2018)

I just got the invite for starlink beta testing in our area in the next 3-6 months. (first come first served)

You-tube shows that the dish can be placed on the floor then powered up and it finds the satellites based on gps. Video is edited so there is no reference to real time. 

Some of the sites i visit have terrible cell service so im wondering if i should get the company to sign up for starlink. We would like to be able to use a laptop as a remote jumper. E.G we would like to connect a plc/hmi with the laptop then remotely take over the laptop. Sparks could do the hook up then programmer could remote in. (bootp, etc)
Has anyone got any experience with starlink. how long would it take from boot-up (dropped on the ground and plugged in) to online and ready to work?


----------



## MikeFL (Apr 16, 2016)

Should be pretty quick:

The FCC has given *Starlink* permission to launch around 12,000 satellites into orbit which operate *using* V-band *frequencies* (radio *frequencies* of 40-75GHz), rather than the more standard K-band *frequencies* (radio *frequencies* of 12-40GHz).Nov 26, 2020


----------



## Kevin (Feb 14, 2017)

gpop said:


> I just got the invite for starlink beta testing in our area in the next 3-6 months. (first come first served)
> 
> You-tube shows that the dish can be placed on the floor then powered up and it finds the satellites based on gps. Video is edited so there is no reference to real time.
> 
> ...


I have some experience with starlink already. I've installed one system, and I placed a pre-order for my mom this morning. If I remember this weekend I will put together my instructional video on the installation.

BETA testing you will be limited to where you can move the dish to. Currently it will only work at the address that you sign it up for. Once BETA testing is over supposedly you can use it anywhere but I have found conflicting information regarding if you have to let starlink know to have some minor satellite programing changes... But I digress.

From plugging in the system to boot up, it was working well within 30 minutes for my install. 

The dish comes with a 100' cord that is hardwired to the dish and non-replaceable. It seems to be a heavy duty 22AWG cable as the dish can use up to 100watts of power because not only is it a dish but rumor has it there's a heater in it and the known fact that there are 2 motors in it.

The system also comes with a basic tri-pod, a special PoE injector that powers the dish and the included router (the router is ok, but no settings on the device, apparently all cloud stuff). We are using our own router for the camera equipment because we need a VPN tunnel... But again, I digress.

I have a few short videos that I want to piece together and add voiceover to give detail on the install I did, and once that is complete I will be posting a youtube video.

I'm sure I'll have it up within the next month. I have all the equipment and tools to do it all I'm missing is the time.


----------



## paulengr (Oct 8, 2017)

Kevin said:


> I have some experience with starlink already. I've installed one system, and I placed a pre-order for my mom this morning. If I remember this weekend I will put together my instructional video on the installation.
> 
> BETA testing you will be limited to where you can move the dish to. Currently it will only work at the address that you sign it up for. Once BETA testing is over supposedly you can use it anywhere but I have found conflicting information regarding if you have to let starlink know to have some minor satellite programing changes... But I digress.
> 
> ...


The system uses spot beams. Dish Network does too that’s how they put all the local channels on the same satellite. It gives the effect of picking up signal from a local tower even though its satellite based. Theoretically they could switch you from spot to spot as you move since there is some overlap. But even if they stick with the current design like Dish you may just have to call them with the new address. Right now they only have a limited system so they are allocating limited amounts of beta testers per spot so if you move out of your designated spot it simply won’t work and Starlink is not budging on this policy until they are closer to a complete constellation.

Two problems with V Band. First is water vapor and oxygen molecules resonate at some frequencies blocking parts of the band. Second is that essentially nobody else is using it so equipment availability (manufacturers) is terrible. I’m assuming Starlink has solved the supply issues. This is what caused a lot of problems for ClearChannel when they bought up a ton of terrestrial K Band spectrum for WiMAX but found the WiMAX standard was hopelessly over complicated and that equipment costs and availability were crazy. Once 5 GHz WiFi opened up they were dead anyway. They shut it all down and eventually sold it all to Sprint.


----------



## gpop (May 14, 2018)

Kevin said:


> I have some experience with starlink already. I've installed one system, and I placed a pre-order for my mom this morning. If I remember this weekend I will put together my instructional video on the installation.
> 
> BETA testing you will be limited to where you can move the dish to. Currently it will only work at the address that you sign it up for. Once BETA testing is over supposedly you can use it anywhere but I have found conflicting information regarding if you have to let starlink know to have some minor satellite programing changes... But I digress.
> 
> ...



So that's a no go then. My dreams of mounting it on top of the van and getting 100mbs when my cell phone can not even get a signal have been dashed. 

Still getting it at the house or internet over cell tower which is about the same price but cheaper up front hardware. (i have a local cell tower near the house)


----------



## splatz (May 23, 2015)

I would guess / predict that the aiming will be quick - less than a minute - but I'd also predict that will be the least of the problems you'll have with Elon Musk's internet service  

I have had good luck with cellular equipment with external antenna. You can put a high gain antenna on a pole and 9 times out of 10 get great coverage where your phone gets **** coverage. 

I would propose an alternative: use a POTS phone line and DSL internet. I get all kinds of knee jerk abuse for this suggestion but I win the argument every single time. 

DSL is cheap and reliable enough and enough bandwidth for screen share, no problem at all. 

You can get a landline phone basically anywhere thanks to the universal service guarantees in the utility laws. The telco has to go there and they can't kill you on the cost to the curb. If there's DSL at that location, you're all set. 

If you're serious about safety, and not just bureaucratics, actual safety, shouldn't you have emergency telephones at these sites so you can call 911? So really the landline should already be there. I have found it just a huge help having landlines just so you can communicate in a non-emergency in these remote sites. 

Few will go this far, but if there's no DSL, you can still use dialup networking to get a 28k - 36k connection that's way, way too slow for modern internet, but tolerable for remote control if you know what you're doing. It's very practical for what you're describing.


----------



## Kevin (Feb 14, 2017)

gpop said:


> So that's a no go then. My dreams of mounting it on top of the van and getting 100mbs when my cell phone can not even get a signal have been dashed.
> 
> Still getting it at the house or internet over cell tower which is about the same price but cheaper up front hardware. (i have a local cell tower near the house)


It might be something that they will be doing in the future (allowing you to use it anywhere) but for better than nothing BETA, we are stuck with what they offer for now.


----------



## SWDweller (Dec 9, 2020)

splatz said:


> I would guess / predict that the aiming will be quick - less than a minute - but I'd also predict that will be the least of the problems you'll have with Elon Musk's internet service
> 
> I have had good luck with cellular equipment with external antenna. You can put a high gain antenna on a pole and 9 times out of 10 get great coverage where your phone gets **** coverage.
> 
> ...


My new house has a POTs line at the property line. However when talking to the trouble shooters that come to the area they all say yes DSL is available and your not going to like it.
At the end of the line. All of the neighbors have ether sat or direct beamed wifi. The reports of the sat is it is expensive and is so so for speed and reliability. The direct beam wifi, I have read their contract and they refuse to provide clear answers to when they can decide to throttle your connection. Also they require a 3 year contract which is unbreakable, IE leave and you still pay for the balance of the time. I am thinking of going back to a 4G hot spot like I had in NM when I was at the mine.


----------



## splatz (May 23, 2015)

SWDweller said:


> My new house has a POTs line at the property line. However when talking to the trouble shooters that come to the area they all say yes DSL is available and your not going to like it.
> At the end of the line. All of the neighbors have ether sat or direct beamed wifi. The reports of the sat is it is expensive and is so so for speed and reliability. The direct beam wifi, I have read their contract and they refuse to provide clear answers to when they can decide to throttle your connection. Also they require a 3 year contract which is unbreakable, IE leave and you still pay for the balance of the time. I am thinking of going back to a 4G hot spot like I had in NM when I was at the mine.


It's true that DSL depends on the distance from the CO and the quality of the copper plant. A lot of places that were marginal with the early DSL equipment are now OK. The telcos are more motivated than they used to be (too late) now that cable co's have taken so much of what remains of their landline business. So they may reinvest. Even if they don't make a major investment, they are just doing a better job on maintenance of splices, replacing raggedy old cables, etc. 

I had a customer that was right at the distance limit for their CO. The DSL installer thought he was doing them a favor, he said it's too close to call, he was not going to certify it. I explained that they were just outside of cable company territory (less than a quarter mile, but a lot of money to extend the coax for one customer. They were paying $450 a month for a 1.5mbit T1 line, which was still more functional than satellite. I assured them they'd be perfectly fine if their 3mbit $50/month DSL was a bit spotty, and in fact, they had customers walking away at the counter or hanging up the phone because the 1.5mbit T1 was not workable for some of the things they needed to do there. I asked if he could retest over and over, and quit as soon as he got one that passed. 👍 That shop is still there.


----------



## splatz (May 23, 2015)

SWDweller said:


> The direct beam wifi, I have read their contract and they refuse to provide clear answers to when they can decide to throttle your connection. Also they require a 3 year contract which is unbreakable, IE leave and you still pay for the balance of the time. I am thinking of going back to a 4G hot spot like I had in NM when I was at the mine.


I had that exact same issue with a customer with a wireless internet provider. If you read the contract carefully - even if they had downtime, you had to pay in full. Even if it was six months of down time! Just a ridiculous contract. But, if you're slightly creative, it's not that hard for a business to work around. Ironically, the company folded and stopped billing them - no other notice - but kept working for almost a year after the last bill. Brilliant strategists.


----------



## The_Modifier (Oct 24, 2009)

gpop said:


> I just got the invite for starlink beta testing in our area in the next 3-6 months. (first come first served)
> 
> You-tube shows that the dish can be placed on the floor then powered up and it finds the satellites based on gps. Video is edited so there is no reference to real time.
> 
> ...


I think it it geo locked- meaning that if your company (not the client) was to use it for travelling around (to job sites) it would only work in one area. And since it is a limited invite.... leaves it open to IF they can get it as it is meant for residential use only as I have read.


----------



## paulengr (Oct 8, 2017)

splatz said:


> I would guess / predict that the aiming will be quick - less than a minute - but I'd also predict that will be the least of the problems you'll have with Elon Musk's internet service
> 
> I have had good luck with cellular equipment with external antenna. You can put a high gain antenna on a pole and 9 times out of 10 get great coverage where your phone gets **** coverage.
> 
> ...


DSL is more than that. If you are close enough for it to work you get 40 Mbps. But there is a huge difference. Cable uses one cable for the whole neighborhood. Things get noticeably slower in the evenings for instance. With DSL there is just one user on the system before you hit a fiber connection so I rarely see anything other than 40 Mbps all the time. Never see that with cable except at 2 AM.


----------



## Kevin (Feb 14, 2017)

paulengr said:


> DSL is more than that. If you are close enough for it to work you get 40 Mbps. But there is a huge difference. Cable uses one cable for the whole neighborhood. Things get noticeably slower in the evenings for instance. With DSL there is just one user on the system before you hit a fiber connection so I rarely see anything other than 40 Mbps all the time. Never see that with cable except at 2 AM.


This is what persuaded me to go with DSL (well, it was sold as FTTN... The node is only 173 meters away from me). I pay for 50 Mbps download and get 54 all the time, on the existing copper lines from the 1970's from the node to my apartment. 

It's definitely an upgrade from the coaxial I used to have...


----------



## Kevin (Feb 14, 2017)

The_Modifier said:


> IF they can get it as it is meant for residential use only as I have read


Curious, where did you read that? I installed it at a construction site that doesn't even have cell service most of the time, and if starlink looks up the address it's an OPG hydro plant... Lol


----------



## The_Modifier (Oct 24, 2009)

Kevin said:


> Curious, where did you read that? I installed it at a construction site that doesn't even have cell service most of the time, and if starlink looks up the address it's an OPG hydro plant... Lol


I don't know how I missed replying to this, but from the Starlink contract:


> *Residential Use.* Services and the Starlink Kit are for use exclusively at the address you provided in your Order, and only for personal, family, household or residential use.


----------



## Dan the electricman (Jan 2, 2011)

When I first read the thread title, I thought it was about this old LAN technology:

StarLink (starlink7.com)


----------



## gpop (May 14, 2018)

Deiced against starlink for the house and went with T-mobile 5g unlimited wireless. It was the same price as the 3-5 mbps copper connection per month but delivers 20+ mbps with no contract and no equipment fee. 

Still need to read the contract to see if i can use the base unit anywhere i can get a good signal.


----------

