# Open Neutral



## SHOCKnAWE (Dec 25, 2011)

Just got back from a service call at an apartment building (8 units) where a tenant lost a zone valve control, refrigerator and television set; at least that was obvious. When I got there, all the circuits were off and I had 240 between phases and 0 from phase to neutral. All the terminations were sound in the unit's load center, so I dug into the Sylvania meter pack to find the grounded lug was burnt off the buss. That's just the easy part of the problem, I'll cut and paste what I'm planning to state on the invoice.

FINDINGS: Grounded (neutral) conductor failure in the meter pack in the equipment room. Failure occured at the factory connection between the grounded lug bar and grounded meter pack buss; the field connection made by the installing contractor was sound. Of the four meters installed in this meter pack, two other neutral connections have been previously repaired which was detectable by a non-factory screw installed. The service and meter packs in these apartments should be replaced as soon as possible. Additional failures of this nature will cause erratic voltages in the unit affected by the failure; this is highly likely to occur. Another major issue at hand in the building are the feeders supplying the load centers in every unit. The cable is a #6 awg aluminum service entrance cable. These cables are rated at 40 amps, they are protected at 70 amps; 30 amps over their rated capacity. The cables should have been a #2 awg aluminum to meet the rated overcurrent protection; three sizes larger. To correct the feeder cable problem, larger cables should be installed to every unit, or gas ranges should be installed and the cable protected to its rating. These hazzards are significant and put life and property at risk.

Wish me luck on this one. Either they give the go ahead to fix it, or I won't go back. If it ever got ugly, my liability could replace the building, but not a life, should that be lost. Crap like this should have been tagged in the early 80's when it was built by the AHJ.


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## hardworkingstiff (Jan 22, 2007)

Depending on when the service cable was installed it may have been OK (at 75c) to rate it at 50-amps. Either way though, 70 is a bit strong.

If you do this, are you forced to upgrade to arc-fault breakers? If so, are there existing MWBCs? What about smoke detectors, do they need an upgrade?

Good luck, I hope you get the work.


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## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

Tell 'em your gonna fix it right , or not at all 

Good Luck S&A....~CS~


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## SHOCKnAWE (Dec 25, 2011)

The cable of concern is just between the meter pack and each unit's load center, which should be replaced as well due to the Sylvania brand. It doesn't look like MWBC's would be an issue in these units, but would have to evaluate all 8 independently.

The cable may be 75 deg rated, but the breaker knocks that down to 60 deg so that put me in a different column, leaving me with a 40 amp cable. A couple years ago, our AHJ sent out a notice that #6 al ser cable used on ranges is not 50 amp and they were going to tag us if we used a 50 amp on them. If you go by the 75 deg rating of the cable, it looks to be alright, but if you read the label on the breaker, al conductors get the 60 deg rating; not 75 deg. My fix to that was #8 copper generally speaking, otherwise I'd have to go to a #4 al or protect #6 at 40 amp; which should still hold most ranges.


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## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

well, according to 110.14, anything under 100amps runs @ 60C max, so your ahj's on the ball there....~CS~


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## hardworkingstiff (Jan 22, 2007)

chicken steve said:


> well, according to 110.14, anything under 100amps runs @ 60C max, so your ahj's on the ball there....~CS~


What does 110.14(C)(1)(a)(3) mean?


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## erics37 (May 7, 2009)

I've seen a pretty healthy dose of factory meter pack connections go bad, almost always on cheap-ass vinyl siding apartment complexes.


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## stubs (Feb 3, 2011)

make sure that you state the problem on your invoice to the owner --it will help if a law suit happens--you did your part--good luck


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