# Look over my estimate?



## elecpatsfan (Oct 1, 2010)

Hi Guys I'm bidding on a 6-house cul-de-sac each house is 2 bedroom 2 bath, 1800 sq. ft. Builder wants single bay garage priced as an extra. Please let me know what you think about my bid before I hit the send button. Thanks



*Description of work:*

-Supply and install 200 amp underground electrical service (100' trench by others) $2500
-Supply and install 150 amp underground electrical service (100' trench by others) $2250
-Supply and install 100 amp underground electrical service (100' trench by others) $2000


-Rough and finish wiring for all areas of the house: plugs and switches per code; finish plates; rough wire and hang owner-supplied ceiling light fixtures where desired. Supply and install (4) fluorescent light fixtures for closets; Dedicated circuits and plugs for washer and dryer (dryer venting by others); TV and Telephone jacks where desired; Rough wire and hang owner-supplied outside light fixtures; Outside GFCI plugs front and back; Rough wire and hang owner-supplied vanity light fixtures, chandeliers, and/or sconces; Bathrooms to have 20 amp GFCI plugs at vanities, exhaust fans supplied and installed (venting by others); electrical provisions for kitchen appliances (microwave plug and circuit, dishwasher plug and circuit, electric stove 240v plug and circuit, refrigerator plug and circuit, (2) 20 amp counter plug circuits) ; Basement lighting 3-way switching system with 4 key-less lamp holders; Supply and install arc-fault breakers required for the branch circuit wiring; HVAC power wiring, low voltage wiring; Supply and install smoke and CO detectors throughout the house; Permit and inspections

*Base Price $13500*

Deduct $300 if gas stove
Deduct $200 if gas dryer

*Extras:*

LED recessed light fixture $120
Xenon under-cabinet light fixture $130
LED under-cabinet light fixture $150
Hang owner-supplied paddle fan $110
LED flood light $210
Dimmer/ fan speed control $50

Garage wiring to include: (3) 20 amp receptacles on dedicated circuit for workbenches, overhead plug for door opener, 3-way switching system between house door and garage back door, 4' 2-bulb lensed fluorescent light fixture on ceiling, switch and wiring for back door outside owner-supplied lantern, low voltage wiring for garage door opener and sensors. $750


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## Black Dog (Oct 16, 2011)

First:

Change the Word Plug to Receptacle


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## Black Dog (Oct 16, 2011)

Also add all this into your grand total.



> *Base Price $13500*
> 
> Deduct $300 if gas stove
> Deduct $200 if gas dryer
> ...


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## McClary’s Electrical (Feb 21, 2009)

Not a chance in hell of you getting that job


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## elecpatsfan (Oct 1, 2010)

Why?


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## Bootss (Dec 30, 2011)

Do you consider yourself an efficient house Roper?
Is this something you do a lot of or are you kind of new to this?


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## elecpatsfan (Oct 1, 2010)

Been doing it on my own for ten years now. What issue do you see?


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## elecpatsfan (Oct 1, 2010)

Sounds like mcclary thinks I'm high and lep thinks I'm low


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## Black Dog (Oct 16, 2011)

mcclary's electrical said:


> Not a chance in hell of you getting that job


That's cheap for up here he will be fine.

You have to pay A good journeyman $35 an hour here maybe even a little more.


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## elecpatsfan (Oct 1, 2010)

Black dog is making some sense around here. Anyone else?


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## 99cents (Aug 20, 2012)

If the GC doesn't have specs, make your own. For example, what happens when you put in a cheap 70 CFM fart fan and the GC says, "We always put in ultra quiet 110 CFM". Then you have a fight on your hands for fifty bucks. Include the part number of the el cheapo fan in your bid.

If they don't ask for extras, don't quote them at the beginning. Wait until you're into the job and then give him a nice, fat, juicy change order request.

I'm confused if the service is a separate price or included in your base bid.

Pricing seems a little skinny but I don't know your market.

No doorbell. I would give them a maximum number of TV and telephone locations. If you budget for three and they want five, you just lost out on three hundred bucks.


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## elecpatsfan (Oct 1, 2010)

I usually do a 100 cfm $100 fan. The service price is in addition to the base price, just don't know what size service so i quoted three scenarios. For 200 amp service the grand total would be 2500 + 13,500 or $16,000 with no extras.


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## 99cents (Aug 20, 2012)

elecpatsfan said:


> I usually do a 100 cfm $100 fan. The service price is in addition to the base price, just don't know what size service so i quoted three scenarios. For 200 amp service the grand total would be 2500 + 13,500 or $16,000 with no extras.


You might want to clarify that. Seems a little ambiguous to me.


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## elecpatsfan (Oct 1, 2010)

You're right I will do that. I'm glad I ran things by you guys , thank you guys


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## Black Dog (Oct 16, 2011)

elecpatsfan said:


> You're right I will do that. I'm glad I ran things by you guys , thank you guys


Good Luck!:thumbsup:


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## Black Dog (Oct 16, 2011)

elecpatsfan said:


> Hi Guys I'm bidding on a 6-house cul-de-sac each house is 2 bedroom 2 bath, 1800 sq. ft. Builder wants single bay garage priced as an extra. Please let me know what you think about my bid before I hit the send button. Thanks
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Also make sure you break all those links to ET before you send it .:laughing:


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## McClary’s Electrical (Feb 21, 2009)

elecpatsfan said:


> Sounds like mcclary thinks I'm high and lep thinks I'm low


I'm only picking dude. No biggie.


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## Bootss (Dec 30, 2011)

elecpatsfan said:


> Been doing it on my own for ten years now. What issue do you see?


If you've been doing it for that long you can tell us how to do things.
:laughing:


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## elecpatsfan (Oct 1, 2010)

I'm the captain of my own ship, but I can still learn something from you fart smellas


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## Bootss (Dec 30, 2011)

elecpatsfan said:


> I'm the captain of my own ship, but I can still learn something from you fart smellas


What's your top 5 tips of the day for ropeing a house?


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## Black Dog (Oct 16, 2011)

Lep said:


> What's your top 5 tips of the day for ropeing a house?


1.NEVER take Turbo LAX before the work begins.

2. Never hire an apprentice who is on Turbo LAX.

3. Never hire a journeyman who is a Turbo LAX addict.

4. Never hire anyone who smokes angel dust laced with Turbo Lax.

5. Never hire anyone who eats chocolate frosted Coffee Rolls from Dunkin Donuts laced with Turbo Lax....








:laughing::laughing:


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## Bootss (Dec 30, 2011)

Black Dog said:


> 1.NEVER take Turbo LAX before the work begins.
> 
> 2. Never hire an apprentice who is on Turbo LAX.
> 
> ...


are you saying the job is not finished until the paperworks done? I had my gallbladder removed I always have Turbo LAX
:laughing:

Tip 1.good preliminary planning getting stuff on paper (out of your head and on paper)

Tip 2.efficient home run layout

I don't claim to be the best house wireman, that's why I asked the questions and I'll pick up things from the other guys also


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## Black Dog (Oct 16, 2011)

Lep said:


> are you saying the job is not finished until the paperworks done? I had my gallbladder removed I always have Turbo LAX
> :laughing:
> 
> Tip 1.good preliminary planning getting stuff on paper (out of your head and on paper)
> ...


:laughing: Hold It!:no::laughing:


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## Knauer (Jun 6, 2011)

Yesh, you get paid well for a small house. 

Spec out tv locations and wire pulled to each one;
Master/bed2-4/ living room single tv location w/ rg6/cat5e. 

Bath fans 100 cfm Panasonic light kit extra, venting by other

Receptacles and switches to code

Install fixtures per plan, provided by builder. 

Count out your cans unless there is a print with them on it. 

Here we can't set anything less than 200a service unless it's a small duplex then it's 100a x2

List all dedicated circuits. 

Knauer


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## flyboy (Jun 13, 2011)

elecpatsfan said:


> You're right I will do that. I'm glad I ran things by you guys , thank you guys


How much profit do you expect to make off this job?


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## elecpatsfan (Oct 1, 2010)

I'm thinking materials to be 6,000, labor 10,000.


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## jw0445 (Oct 9, 2009)

I would specify a quantity of cable and phone jacks. With what you wrote you could be installing a zillion of them.


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## btharmy (Jan 17, 2009)

$4 per sq foot. :whistling2:


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## btharmy (Jan 17, 2009)

elecpatsfan said:


> I'm thinking materials to be 6,000, labor 10,000.



Ok, but how much of that is profit?


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## Jack Legg (Mar 12, 2014)

here is gonna be the reply you get from the builder-

$7.50 a sq ft???? are you effin kidding me???? and that don't even include the service???? you need to sharpen your pencil sparky. I got 6 houses for you to do right next to each other, you need to do better than that.


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## elecpatsfan (Oct 1, 2010)

I guess the price does seem high when you put it that way. Jack, what do you think the number should be?


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## pete87 (Oct 22, 2012)

Lep said:


> What's your top 5 tips of the day for ropeing a house?




First of all you " Rope " a house , there is no " Ropeing " a house .

(1) make your helper wear a thong when she works with you .

Pete


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## elecpatsfan (Oct 1, 2010)

I am basing my number on other projects that I've won. Right now I'm doing a 2800 sq.ft. 4 bed with 15 recessed, 200 underground service, 2 car garage for $18,000. Builder said only one guy beat my number and he was old and slow. He knows me and my helper come in and burn it up, so he went with us.


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## Jack Legg (Mar 12, 2014)

elecpatsfan said:


> I guess the price does seem high when you put it that way. Jack, what do you think the number should be?


the number should be as high as *you* need it to be

I was just saying what the builder will probably say


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## aftershockews (Dec 22, 2012)

elecpatsfan said:


> I guess the price does seem high when you put it that way. Jack, what do you think the number should be?


What is the opening count and opening type? Electric or gas heat?
If electric heat , what is the Kw?
D&D? Microwave? Gas or electric stove? There are quite a few variables I would need to know before I would give a bid. Once I know all of what I need to know then I can give a price, including the service size.


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## Black Dog (Oct 16, 2011)

Jack Legg said:


> here is gonna be the reply you get from the builder-
> 
> $7.50 a sq ft???? are you effin kidding me???? and that don't even include the service???? you need to sharpen your pencil sparky. *I got 6 houses for you to do right next to each other*, you need to do better than that.


Carrot stick....


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## RIVETER (Sep 26, 2009)

Lep said:


> What's your top 5 tips of the day for ropeing a house?


Spelling Roping properly would help.:jester:


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## Bootss (Dec 30, 2011)

RIVETER said:


> Spelling Roping properly would help.:jester:


"Rope a Dope" a house, there I got it.
:laughing:


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## te12co2w (Jun 3, 2007)

Do you supply underground wire to the meter? Conduit? Here the power company insists on 3" pvc from transformer to meter base with pull string installed. They supply and pull the wire. We use to install the conduit and pull string for around 7-8 dollars per foot. Haven't don one for awhile now. Ditch by others.


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## sbrn33 (Mar 15, 2007)

te12co2w said:


> Do you supply underground wire to the meter? Conduit? Here the power company insists on 3" pvc from transformer to meter base with pull string installed. They supply and pull the wire. We use to install the conduit and pull string for around 7-8 dollars per foot. Haven't don one for awhile now. Ditch by others.


You got $8 per foot to put 3inch pvc in an existing trench? You are good. :thumbup:


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## elecpatsfan (Oct 1, 2010)

te12co2w said:


> Do you supply underground wire to the meter? Conduit? Here the power company insists on 3" pvc from transformer to meter base with pull string installed. They supply and pull the wire. We use to install the conduit and pull string for around 7-8 dollars per foot. Haven't don one for awhile now. Ditch by others.


Around here we supply and install 2" underground conduit with 4/0 aluminium triplex. Also a set of 1" conduits w/ pull strings for tv and tel. $2500 is pretty standard price for a 100' underground service of this size for as long as I can remember.


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## elecpatsfan (Oct 1, 2010)

I talked with some other E.C.s from my area that I've known for a while. Looks like my original estimate was quite high like McClary and others eluded to. Even though the contractor said he wasn't getting any other numbers except mine, I still wanted to be fair and competitive. Here is what I ended up sending him:

*Description of work:*
-Rough and finish wiring for all areas of the house: plugs and switches per code; finish plates; rough wire and hang owner-supplied ceiling light fixtures where desired. Supply and install (4) fluorescent light fixtures for closets; Dedicated circuits and plugs for washer and dryer (dryer venting by others); 3 TV/Telephone jacks where desired; Rough wire and hang owner-supplied outside light fixtures; Outside GFCI plugs front and back; Rough wire and hang owner-supplied vanity light fixtures, chandeliers, and/or sconces; Bathrooms to have 20 amp GFCI plugs at vanities, exhaust fans supplied and installed (venting by others); electrical provisions for kitchen appliances (microwave plug and circuit, dishwasher plug and circuit, electric stove 240v plug and circuit, refrigerator plug and circuit, (2) 20 amp counter plug circuits) ; Basement lighting 3-way switching system with 4 key-less lamp holders; Supply and install arc-fault breakers required for the branch circuit wiring; boiler power wiring, low voltage wiring; Supply and install smoke and CO detectors throughout the house; doorbell system; Permit and inspections

*Base Price $8,350*

*150 amp electrical service $2,250*

------------------

*Total $10,600*


* 
Extras:*

LED recessed light fixture $120

Xenon under-cabinet light fixture $130
LED under-cabinet light fixture $150
Hang owner-supplied paddle fan $110
LED flood light $210

Dimmer/ fan speed control $50

Split-system A.C. power $450


Garage wiring to include: (2) 20 amp receptacles on dedicated circuit for workbenches, overhead plug for door opener, 3-way switching system between house door and garage back door, 4' 2-bulb lensed fluorescent light fixture on ceiling, switch and wiring for back door outside owner-supplied lantern, low voltage wiring for garage door opener and sensors. $750


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## elecpatsfan (Oct 1, 2010)

Oh shoot I forgot to change the word "plugs" to "receptacles". That's ghetto of me


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## Knauer (Jun 6, 2011)

If you are the only bidder don't go so cheap. If we have no competition prove usually goes up 10-20% above our bargain/competitive pricing. Gotta make money when you can. Most builders will try to take all your profits out. Also take into account your holding costs for material and payroll.


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## flyboy (Jun 13, 2011)

I just read this thread and now I feel nauseous.


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## McClary’s Electrical (Feb 21, 2009)

Black Dog said:


> Carrot stick....


So what? My uncle wires 300 houses per year, all for the same contactor. What are you trying to say?


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## McClary’s Electrical (Feb 21, 2009)

elecpatsfan said:


> I talked with some other E.C.s from my area that I've known for a while. Looks like my original estimate was quite high like McClary and others eluded to. Even though the contractor said he wasn't getting any other numbers except mine, I still wanted to be fair and competitive. Here is what I ended up sending him:
> 
> *Description of work:*
> -Rough and finish wiring for all areas of the house: plugs and switches per code; finish plates; rough wire and hang owner-supplied ceiling light fixtures where desired. Supply and install (4) fluorescent light fixtures for closets; Dedicated circuits and plugs for washer and dryer (dryer venting by others); 3 TV/Telephone jacks where desired; Rough wire and hang owner-supplied outside light fixtures; Outside GFCI plugs front and back; Rough wire and hang owner-supplied vanity light fixtures, chandeliers, and/or sconces; Bathrooms to have 20 amp GFCI plugs at vanities, exhaust fans supplied and installed (venting by others); electrical provisions for kitchen appliances (microwave plug and circuit, dishwasher plug and circuit, electric stove 240v plug and circuit, refrigerator plug and circuit, (2) 20 amp counter plug circuits) ; Basement lighting 3-way switching system with 4 key-less lamp holders; Supply and install arc-fault breakers required for the branch circuit wiring; boiler power wiring, low voltage wiring; Supply and install smoke and CO detectors throughout the house; doorbell system; Permit and inspections
> ...


I'm sincerely sorry to say, but new construction is not a get rich 
Quick scheme. 

Let's talk reality, you want to pay yourself master electrician prices, to do this all yourself, but honestly, I can have two guys on this job for three days to complete rough in, and service. Same thing on Trim out, two guys, three days. I can charge half your hourly rate, blowing you completely out of the water, while I sit at home at watch jerry springer while the romex flies. Welcome to capitalism.


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

mcclary's electrical said:


> I'm sincerely sorry to say, but new construction is not a get rich
> Quick scheme.
> 
> Let's talk reality, you want to pay yourself master electrician prices, to do this all yourself, but honestly, I can have two guys on this job for three days to complete rough in, and service. Same thing on Trim out, two guys, three days. I can charge half your hourly rate, blowing you completely out of the water, while I sit at home at watch jerry springer while the romex flies. Welcome to capitalism.


I love that. I setup 2 guys on a service upgrade for $160 cash each and then go home and take a nap.


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## elecpatsfan (Oct 1, 2010)

The builder sounds like a pretty laid back guy and he does quite a bit in my area. I did the math and at 10 days of total work (which I think is an over estimate) with my helper and I, $4600 for materials, I should be making about $500/ day. I'll take it- and gain a new client in process


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## McClary’s Electrical (Feb 21, 2009)

HackWork said:


> I love that. I setup 2 guys on a service upgrade for $160 cash each and then go home and take a nap.


Amen brother. And don't forget Steve Wilkos......


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## McClary’s Electrical (Feb 21, 2009)

elecpatsfan said:


> The builder sounds like a pretty laid back guy and he does quite a bit in my area. I did the math and at 10 days of total work (which I think is an over estimate) with my helper and I, $4600 for materials, I should be making about $500/ day. I'll take it- and gain a new client in process


Ok fine. Let me know how it goes


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## Black Dog (Oct 16, 2011)

mcclary's electrical said:


> I'm sincerely sorry to say, but new construction is not a get rich
> Quick scheme.
> 
> Let's talk reality, you want to pay yourself master electrician prices, to do this all yourself, but honestly, I can have two guys on this job for three days to complete rough in, and service. Same thing on Trim out, two guys, three days. I can charge half your hourly rate, blowing you completely out of the water, while I sit at home at watch jerry springer while the romex flies. Welcome to capitalism.


Can't do that here, a 2 man job you must have at least one Journeyman/Master, Many journeymen also have their master license.

I'm doing one right now me and another Master Electrician and we are being paid that way. I can leave anytime and not have to take the helper with me.


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## elecpatsfan (Oct 1, 2010)

Going home and taking naps/ watching tv while your guys work is a bad habit to fall into. Quick way to turn into a soft cream puff.


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## A Little Short (Nov 11, 2010)

What the heck are all the hyperlinks from the word "install" that links back to the forum???:blink:



> -Supply and install 200


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## elecpatsfan (Oct 1, 2010)

I don't know why those happen, I just did a cut and paste from my email


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## wildbooker (Jun 6, 2014)

You Have to remember not to sell yourself short. The second you cross that Bourne bridge the price goes up. We should become more like plumbers and less cut throat all the time.


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