# Bath/GFCI Snubbed out



## mnelectrician (Dec 1, 2008)

I usually put a whip in a wall for the vanity light for the same reason. Then I cut a box in for the light after the mirror and everything is in place. I know the inspectors always wanna make sure all the grounds are made up at rough in here too.


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## sbrn33 (Mar 15, 2007)

Are you an electrician?


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## leland (Dec 28, 2007)

Cletis said:


> We have been snubbing out our gfci bath rec. circuits lately because owners can't make their damn minds up. High mirror, Low mirror, Full mirror, no backsplash, high backspash, etc.. . So, we just snub out 2 wires (big double bath sink) like under cabinet lighting. And adjust later when they make their mind up.
> 
> My inspector hates me doing this and it really pisses him off. He failed me twice and I don't know why. I tried explaining but he says it has to be in box, skinned, and ground crimped for rough.
> 
> Anyone ever run into this ?




SHUT UP. You know better.


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## Chris1971 (Dec 27, 2010)

leland said:


> SHUT UP. You know better.



Know he doesn't!


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## mbednarik (Oct 10, 2011)

i do the exact thing in three cases, vanity light, switched outlets above kitchen upper cabinets for display lighting, island/peninsula lights. I never never had an inspector question it. Just use a plastic box and you don't have to worry about grounding it.


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## McClary’s Electrical (Feb 21, 2009)

I sometimes leave a whip in the wall for a vanity light when I don't know the centerline of the sink or the height of the mirror, but I have NEVER had to do that on a GFI.


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## B4T (Feb 10, 2009)

So you are using molly boxes to hold up a lighting fixture and a GFI receptacle that will get plenty of abuse with people pulling out the plug without holding the box from coming out with it after a few years.. :no:

You should be banned from doing residential and stick with cement walls and conduit..


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## leland (Dec 28, 2007)

mcclary's electrical said:


> I sometimes leave a whip in the wall for a vanity light when I don't know the centerline of the sink or the height of the mirror, but I have NEVER had to do that on a GFI.



ZACTLY. The vanity light-wip hidden in the wall,to be dug out later.

Never have I been allowed or expected to leave a wip for-- maybe a rec.:whistling2:


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## Chris1971 (Dec 27, 2010)

B4T said:


> So you are using molly boxes to hold up a lighting fixture and a GFI receptacle that will get plenty of abuse with people pulling out the plug without holding the box from coming out with it after a few years.. :no:
> 
> You should be banned from doing residential and stick with cement walls and conduit..



You should be banned for commenting on this thread.:thumbup:


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## B4T (Feb 10, 2009)

Chris1971 said:


> You should be banned for commenting on this thread.:thumbup:


So you think a molly box will stand up to the test of time.. :no:


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## Bulldog1 (Oct 21, 2011)

I am still trying to figure out what snubbed out means......:blink:

We stub out wires all the time for items like you described with no issue from inspectors.


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## Bulldog1 (Oct 21, 2011)

mcclary's electrical said:


> I sometimes leave a whip in the wall for a vanity light when I don't know the centerline of the sink or the height of the mirror, but I have NEVER had to do that on a GFI.



We do it for vanity lights and pendant lights over kitchen islands.


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## Bulldog1 (Oct 21, 2011)

B4T said:


> So you are using molly boxes to hold up a lighting fixture and a GFI receptacle that will get plenty of abuse with people pulling out the plug without holding the box from coming out with it after a few years.. :no:
> 
> You should be banned from doing residential and stick with cement walls and conduit..



They do make smart boxes......:whistling2:


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## Chris1971 (Dec 27, 2010)

B4T said:


> So you think a molly box will stand up to the test of time.. :no:



Is this the Molly box your talking about?

http://mollysbox.wordpress.com/


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## Cletis (Aug 20, 2010)

*ideal*

They are not ideal, but I use slater's. They have extra long wings. They feel pretty solid. If they do loosen it would take a long time...

http://tools.passandseymour.com/pdf/P.pdf

I can't help it if my eccentric builder can't make his mind up...


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## B4T (Feb 10, 2009)

Bulldog1 said:


> They do make smart boxes......:whistling2:


Do they make "smart wood" you can put into the wall cavity to screw the "smart box" too.. :whistling2:


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## Chris1971 (Dec 27, 2010)

Bulldog1 said:


> They do make smart boxes......:whistling2:


He's not smart enough to know how to use the smart box.


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## niteshift (Nov 21, 2007)

Always _was_ allowed to have wires hanging on rough in inspection...under cabinet switchlegs/feeds, disposal, dishwasher, vanity lights, water heaters, furnaces, exterior floods, front/back door lights. I've not done any business since '08, so have things changed?


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## Cletis (Aug 20, 2010)

*smart*



Chris1971 said:


> He's not smart enough to know how to use the smart box.


A "Smart Box" to me implies you DO NOT have to be smart to install. It just knows what to do


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## Cletis (Aug 20, 2010)

*hard*



niteshift said:


> Always _was_ allowed to have wires hanging on rough in inspection...under cabinet switchlegs/feeds, disposal, dishwasher, vanity lights, water heaters, furnaces, exterior floods, front/back door lights. I've not done any business since '08, so have things changed?


hard wired, hard wired, hard wired, hardwired, " Receptacle 

I think he just doesn't want to take it apart after finish and see if there is a box in there with the grounds tied.


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## parnellelectric (Dec 23, 2011)

Sometimes I get inspectors call that with two wires. I will strip out 4 in of the jacket then wirenut the grounds. Know its crazy but he will then sign off. Do you not have a wall to the side that you could put th recpt on?


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## Cletis (Aug 20, 2010)

*Not*



parnellelectric said:


> Sometimes I get inspectors call that with two wires. I will strip out 4 in of the jacket then wirenut the grounds. Know its crazy but he will then sign off. Do you not have a wall to the side that you could put th recpt on?


No, he won't tell me if their is backsplash, full mirror, or any decision yet but he want's a rough next week


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## niteshift (Nov 21, 2007)

Cletis said:


> hard wired, hard wired, hard wired, hardwired, " Receptacle





Cletis said:


> I think he just doesn't want to take it apart after finish and see if there is a box in there with the grounds tied.





I'm not following you here. Hardwire what? Take what apart? By who?

Inquiring minds want to know.


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## Cletis (Aug 20, 2010)

*hard*



niteshift said:


> I'm not following you here. Hardwire what? Take what apart? By who?
> 
> Inquiring minds want to know.


All the things you mentioned get hardwired. MIne is receptacle. That was difference. I just have a grumpy inspector..


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## niteshift (Nov 21, 2007)

Cletis said:


> hard wired, hard wired, hard wired, hardwired, " Receptacle
> 
> I think he just doesn't want to take it apart after finish and see if there is a box in there with the grounds tied.


I think I figured the question out. 
No the inspector wants to know at the RI if receptacles have grds tied together or not. Thats a big part of the RI inspection. 
Would you want to have to open up all the outlets to check at final, cause that is who would be doing it, if the inspector waited, which they will not.


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## mbednarik (Oct 10, 2011)

my inspector always goes around with an outlet tester and tests each outlet, including gfci in the required areas.


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## electricmanscott (Feb 11, 2010)

B4T said:


> So you are using molly boxes to hold up a lighting fixture and a GFI receptacle that will get plenty of abuse with people pulling out the plug without holding the box from coming out with it after a few years.. :no:
> 
> You should be banned from doing residential and stick with cement walls and conduit..


Are you an electrician?


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## B4T (Feb 10, 2009)

electricmanscott said:


> Are you an electrician?


So you think having molly boxes is a great idea.. you are really not very bright.. :no:

I have fixed enough FAILED molly boxes to know that is as hack as you can get..


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## Chris1971 (Dec 27, 2010)

B4T said:


> So you think having molly boxes is a great idea.. you are really not very bright.. :no:
> 
> I have fixed enough FAILED molly boxes to know that is as hack as you can get..



Are you an electrician or a handyman?


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## Bulldog1 (Oct 21, 2011)

Chris1971 said:


> Are you an electrician or a handyman?



I actually agree with B4T. We almost never use a cut in box for receptacles. Nor will we use the P&S boxes you can pop the device screw in because over time they can work loose.


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

Chris1971 said:


> Are you an electrician or a handyman?


:sleep1::sleep1:












:laughing:


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## Chris1971 (Dec 27, 2010)

Bulldog1 said:


> I actually agree with B4T. We almost never use a cut in box for receptacles. Nor will we use the P&S boxes you can pop the device screw in because over time they can work loose.



I agree but, it's nice getting him wound up.:thumbsup::laughing:


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## leland (Dec 28, 2007)

Cletis said:


> All the things you mentioned get hardwired. MIne is receptacle. That was difference. I just have a grumpy inspector..



put the damn box in.

when it has to be moved write a change order.:thumbsup: get paid and then move it. Always get paid for change orders before you do them.

not rocket science. about making money.:thumbsup:


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## niteshift (Nov 21, 2007)

mbednarik said:


> my inspector always goes around with an outlet tester and tests each outlet, including gfci in the required areas.


Thier refering to rough in inspections, there's nothing to put the tester into at that time, cept the recep at the main panel and/or your pocket.


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## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

niteshift said:


> Always _was_ allowed to have wires hanging on rough in inspection...under cabinet switchlegs/feeds, disposal, dishwasher, vanity lights, water heaters, furnaces, exterior floods, front/back door lights. I've not done any business since '08, so have things changed?


 
314.27(A) 

in that we would be _assuming_ up to a 50lb luminaire install ....

~CS~


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## Dennis Alwon (May 9, 2009)

I may be mistaken but many years ago there either was a cod or one was interpreted to mean that boxes should be securely fastened to the structure. This would not allow pop in boxes. 

IMO, I avoid it wherever possible. Soffits are one place they are somewhat unavoidable


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## RePhase277 (Feb 5, 2008)

Put the GFI at 5 ft, center of the sink. Guaranteed not in the backsplash:laughing:


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## macmikeman (Jan 23, 2007)

InPhase277 said:


> Put the GFI at 5 ft, center of the sink. Guaranteed not in the backsplash:laughing:


That won't work, cause the ****** plumbers always run their vent stack right straight up behind the middle of the sink where the plans clearly show a light fixture needs to go.


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## macmikeman (Jan 23, 2007)

Message to plumbers on sister sites. By the way, next time one of you morons do this to me, its sawsall time for your vent stack. CHECK THE PLANS FOR THE LIGHT FIXTURE LOCATION ABOVE THE MIRROR. OFFSET YOUR STACK.
thats all and have a nice day......


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

Plans? :001_huh:

For a _house_? :001_huh::001_huh:



?????








......._Plans for a house._







In my nearly 20 years, I have only seen one set of plans for an SFD that had plans that had an E-sheet, and even it did not show where the light over the bathroom sink went.


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## macmikeman (Jan 23, 2007)

Well, I guess its how things get handled where you are. E sheets required here along with plans to build a house. Or a shack, or a remodel, or just about anything beyond a repair job. 

Seldom do the plan sets I get not show a vanity light fixture or two above the bath sink(s) area. But plumbers are generally illiterate so they use the blueprints only to weigh them for bidding purposes.


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## handyandy (Jan 3, 2012)

Cletis did we not met a Woodstock?


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## niteshift (Nov 21, 2007)

chicken steve said:


> 314.27(A)
> 
> in that we would be _assuming_ up to a 50lb luminaire install ....
> 
> ~CS~


 
I do remember something to that effect. 

Thread hijack...

I found a cieling fan w/big light kit, suspended by a blue carlon old work box (i know i know) on the 1/2" sheetrock, over top of thier dining room table. Yeah it was still up with no sign of pulling thru. Ran every day for years, they didn't know what was just waiting to happen. It was changed to a old work fan box, kind that expands between the joists thru the existing or new hole in ceiling, box attaches to this, all adjustable.


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## macmikeman (Jan 23, 2007)

niteshift said:


> I do remember something to that effect.
> 
> Thread hijack...
> 
> I found a cieling fan w/big light kit, suspended by a blue carlon old work box (i know i know) on the 1/2" sheetrock, over top of thier dining room table. Yeah it was still up with no sign of pulling thru. Ran every day for years, they didn't know what was just waiting to happen. It was changed to a old work fan box, kind that expands between the joists thru the existing or new hole in ceiling, box attaches to this, all adjustable.


Darn, I wish you had of let it go so we could run a time test on this.........

I say sixty years after the fan fails the bugger finally comes down due to plastic fatigue.


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## niteshift (Nov 21, 2007)

macmikeman said:


> Darn, I wish you had of let it go so we could run a time test on this.........
> 
> I say sixty years after the fan fails the bugger finally comes down due to plastic fatigue.


:laughing:
Adjust timeframe for prior use. Used as a dining room light for xx years, then somebody(insert your villian here) used the same blue carlon old work box (i know i know) to hang thier new fan from. 

You just can't fix stupid.


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