# Pigtailing aluminum



## B W E (May 1, 2011)

Aside from the 110 violation, is there 
A: anything inherently unsafe about using standard wire nuts filled with Noalox
B. any mechanical or chemical difference between a standard wire but filled with Noalox and a wire nut listed for that purpose?


----------



## jza (Oct 31, 2009)

We always use wire nuts listed for aluminum to copper connections, and Noalox. This might be overkill though.


----------



## B4T (Feb 10, 2009)

DON'T use standard wire nuts.. :no::no::no:

You have to use the Ideal purple wire nuts made for AL - CU pigtailing.. 

Make sure you read the conductor limitations listed on the side of the box..


----------



## B W E (May 1, 2011)

B4T said:


> DON'T use standard wire nuts.. :no::no::no:
> 
> You have to use the Ideal purple wire nuts made for AL - CU pigtailing..
> 
> Make sure you read the conductor limitations listed on the side of the box..


That doesn't answer my questions. Aside from 110, WHY is it a no no?


----------



## B4T (Feb 10, 2009)

jza said:


> We always use wire nuts listed for aluminum to copper connections, and Noalox. This might be overkill though.


Canada has a different listing than us guys in the states..


----------



## B4T (Feb 10, 2009)

B W E said:


> That doesn't answer my questions. Aside from 110, WHY is it a no no?


Because standard wire nuts are listed for CU - CU only.. check the Ideal website..


----------



## B W E (May 1, 2011)

B4T said:


> Because standard wire nuts are listed for CU - CU only.. check the Ideal website..


Ok. I get that. That fact is abundantly clear. What I am asking, again, is are there any mechanical / chemical differences between the two methods??


----------



## fanelle (Nov 27, 2011)

Noalox I thought was simply a corrosion inhibitor. So simply filling a standard wire nut with it wont protect it from melting from the heat produced.


----------



## B W E (May 1, 2011)

fanelle said:


> Noalox I thought was simply a corrosion inhibitor. So simply filling a standard wire nut with it wont protect it from melting from the heat produced.


The heat produced is only the result of a high resistance connection. If the connection is mechanically sound, there would be no heat (as a side effect of a high resistance connection). There would still be overload heat, but that would occur regardless of the wire nut used. What is in the wire nuts rated for cu-al if not Noalox?


----------



## B4T (Feb 10, 2009)

B W E said:


> Ok. I get that. That fact is abundantly clear. What I am asking, again, is are there any mechanical / chemical differences between the two methods??


I believe the Ideal purple wire nuts have a square spring inside.. standard wire nut has a round spring.. http://www.idealindustries.com/products/wire_termination/twist-on/twister_al-cu.jsp


----------



## RePhase277 (Feb 5, 2008)

It's likely a different spring and/or spring material.

But even more likely is that UL simply has not put them to the test for such conductor combination.

And if they have, the wirenut manufacturers probably paid handsomely to sweep it under the rug... Standard wirenut: 10¢. Ideal Purple Wirenut: $2.00


----------



## fanelle (Nov 27, 2011)

As far as I can tell from Ideals website the only difference is UL listing. BWE has a good point it does seem that all there wire nuts are listed at 105° C and the ones listed as Al/Cu are only filled with a corrosion-resistant compound .


----------



## Cujo (Feb 4, 2012)

B W E said:


> Aside from the 110 violation, is there
> A: anything inherently unsafe about using standard wire nuts filled with Noalox
> B. any mechanical or chemical difference between a standard wire but filled with Noalox and a wire nut listed for that purpose?


After looking ideal website the bottom of the nut there has a piece of material that contains the connection (and noalox) a bit better.










I don't think it is any different other then the rating. The inherently unsafe part if you are relying on the installer to make sure he does it perfect every time.


----------



## Chris1971 (Dec 27, 2010)

B W E said:


> Aside from the 110 violation, is there
> A: anything inherently unsafe about using standard wire nuts filled with Noalox
> B. any mechanical or chemical difference between a standard wire but filled with Noalox and a wire nut listed for that purpose?




A. *Maybe? Maybe not? Why risk it.*

B. *One can never be certain. Why risk it.*


----------



## B W E (May 1, 2011)

Cujo said:


> After looking ideal website the bottom of the nut there has a piece of material that contains the connection (and noalox) a bit better.
> 
> I don't think it is any different other then the rating. The inherently unsafe part if you are relying on the installer to make sure he does it perfect every time.


It is my understanding that the flaps on the bottom of the purple wire nuts is simply to keep the Noalox inside the nut if the ambient temperature gets to a point where the goo would become thinner and drip out. 

I have found absolutely no difference, mechanical or chemical, between the two methods. 

Anyone ever used a plastic nail-on box in a remodel application by taking off the nails, and driving a few screws through the box into a stud?


----------



## B4T (Feb 10, 2009)

You also have to check with AHJ and see if they will accept the Ideal purples as a repair for the splices..

Also it is a good idea to CYA and use AFCI breakers on the circuits you repair..


----------



## B4T (Feb 10, 2009)

B W E said:


> Anyone ever used a plastic nail-on box in a remodel application by taking off the nails, and driving a few screws through the box into a stud?


Sure.. many times.. but that is another world from using standard wire nuts on a pigtail job..

You become the person of record till the day you die once you make repairs..


----------



## B W E (May 1, 2011)

B4T said:


> You also have to check with AHJ and see if they will accept the Ideal purples as a repair for the splices..
> 
> Also it is a good idea to CYA and use AFCI breakers on the circuits you repair..


Afci is not required here for this scope of work. Our ahj says this is "maintenance" and does not cross the AFCi threshold. And the wire but method is kosher here.


----------



## Big John (May 23, 2010)

Yeah, but isn't there some hoopla about these purple things burning up?

I'm glad I don't deal with aluminum house wiring, because I have no idea what's honestly safe and what isn't. I'd use those terminal block connectors, but can't say I'd be comfortable with anything else at this point.

-John


----------



## B W E (May 1, 2011)

B4T said:


> Sure.. many times.. but that is another world from using standard wire nuts on a pigtail job..
> 
> You become the person of record till the day you die once you make repairs..


And you would be equally responsible if a fire started in a box not mounted according to manufactures instructions as you would be with a wire nut.


----------



## k_buz (Mar 12, 2012)

B W E said:


> And you would be equally responsible if a fire started in a box not mounted according to manufactures instructions as you would be with a wire nut.


My plastic box held up by drywall screws didn't start the fire...your noalox filled tan wire nuts did :detective:


----------



## B4T (Feb 10, 2009)

B W E said:


> And you would be equally responsible if a fire started in a box not mounted according to manufactures instructions as you would be with a wire nut.


How is a plastic box held in place with drywall screws going to start a fire.. :no:


----------



## B W E (May 1, 2011)

k_buz said:


> My plastic box held up by drywall screws didn't start the fire...your noalox filled tan wire nuts did :detective:


but if they were purple, it'd be ok. Thats my point. It seems that no one can point to any difference between a red ideal wire nut filled with noalox and a purple one, other than one is listed for that purpose and one isn't. If you look at the MSDS of both a purple wire nut, and the combination of noalox and a regular wire nut, the materials are exactly the same. Same goo, same spring, different color.


----------



## macmikeman (Jan 23, 2007)

B4T said:


> I believe the Ideal purple wire nuts have a square spring inside.. standard wire nut has a round spring.. http://www.idealindustries.com/products/wire_termination/twist-on/twister_al-cu.jsp


I'm pretty sure Ideal Tan Twisters feature the square spring also. But of course they are not listed for AL-Cu connections.


To the OP. I get into long winded discussions once in a while with electrical inspectors at IAEI meetings on goofy subjects, among one which was the same as your question. The majority of the white shirts there said just to cover my ass was the true best reason use them. That made sense to me, so I always do. Mark em up and sell em. Yesterday my wife took my kids car (ours) Honda Pilot 2006 in for tune up. 6 new plugs which sell online for 6.99 were 178 bucks on the bill. Think like that guy and grow wealthy. Except don't break it down for customers , they give auto shops more respect than they do for us sparky's since we don't seem to organize as well.....


----------



## B4T (Feb 10, 2009)

B W E said:


> but if they were purple, it'd be ok. Thats my point. It seems that no one can point to any difference between a red ideal wire nut filled with noalox and a purple one, other than one is listed for that purpose and one isn't. If you look at the MSDS of both a purple wire nut, and the combination of noalox and a regular wire nut, the materials are exactly the same. Same goo, same spring, different color.


One is listed for the repair.. one is not.. end of story..


----------



## Chris1971 (Dec 27, 2010)

B4T said:


> One is listed for the repair.. one is not.. end of story..


Exactly.:thumbsup: some people like to argue about the dumbest things.


----------



## LARMGUY (Aug 22, 2010)

According to this website, http://www.alwirerepair.com/index.htm ,
they state the only legal permanent method is crimping this COPALUM with heat shrink or Alumicon with a connector with screw down terminals.

C.P.S.C. 
Repairing Aluminum Wiring - US CPSC Publication 516: This is the original U.S. CPSC document explaining the hazard of solid conductor aluminum electrical circuit wiring, and recommending the use of the AMP TYCO COPALUM special crimp connector to pigtail copper to the aluminum wires as an alternative to complete re-wiring of the building. For the latest US CPSC publication on aluminum electrical wiring see Aluminum Wiring - CPSC Publication #516-PDF.

Here is the crimp and tool.

http://www.te.com/catalog/cinf/en/c/10914/969?RQS=


----------



## macmikeman (Jan 23, 2007)

LARMGUY said:


> According to this website, http://www.alwirerepair.com/index.htm ,
> they state the only legal permanent method is crimping this COPALUM with heat shrink or Alumicon with a connector with screw down terminals.
> 
> C.P.S.C.
> ...


You believe everything you read on the web???????? :whistling2::laughing:


----------



## MarkyMark (Jan 31, 2009)

LARMGUY said:


> According to this website, http://www.alwirerepair.com/index.htm ,
> they state the only legal permanent method is crimping this COPALUM with heat shrink or Alumicon with a connector with screw down terminals.
> 
> C.P.S.C.
> ...


C.P.S.C. has approved the Alumiconn connectors now as well. For some crazy reason, the AMP spam sites have not updated this information yet.


----------



## LARMGUY (Aug 22, 2010)

macmikeman said:


> You believe everything you read on the web???????? :whistling2::laughing:


But, but, it's a lectrical based website and you guys is lectrical based so I figgured you'se guys would never lie to me so's I figgured these guys would be the same an not lie to me. Whew! I'm winded...


----------



## B4T (Feb 10, 2009)

LARMGUY said:


> But, but, it's a lectrical based website and you guys is lectrical based so I figgured you'se guys would never lie to me so's I figgured these guys would be the same an not lie to me. Whew! I'm winded...


More important.. we have to go by what the AHJ will accept since they have their name on the certificate also..


----------



## user4818 (Jan 15, 2009)

LARMGUY said:


> According to this website, http://www.alwirerepair.com/index.htm ,
> they state the only legal permanent method is crimping this COPALUM with heat shrink or Alumicon with a connector with screw down terminals.
> 
> C.P.S.C.
> ...


Those websites are meaningless and very biased towards the Copalum system. They show a handful of burned up purple wirenuts. Big deal. I can show you many more burned up wire nuts and terminals from poor copper wire splices. Of course a wirenut is going to melt down if it's not properly installed.


----------



## the-apprentice (Jun 11, 2012)

B4T said:


> DON'T use standard wire nuts.. :no::no::no:
> 
> You have to use the Ideal purple wire nuts made for AL - CU pigtailing..
> 
> Make sure you read the conductor limitations listed on the side of the box..


always used the purple ideal ones..there less messy

u can use noalox with the brown marrette brand marrettes


----------



## 220/221 (Sep 25, 2007)

B W E said:


> Aside from the 110 violation, is there
> A: anything inherently unsafe about using standard wire nuts filled with Noalox
> B. any mechanical or chemical difference between a standard wire but filled with Noalox and a wire nut listed for that purpose?



IMO, absolutely not.

1. Oxidation isn't an issue inside a house so the nolox does nothing. I've seen AL turn to powder when exposed to moisture but have never seen any problems in dry locations.

2. The wirenuts that were used on AL wire are the same ones that are made today. If the wirenuts were the cause of the failures, why are there so many millions of good connections?

The spring in that purple wirenut is the same as a red one and the nolox is the same stuff that comes out of a bottle. The reason cited to me by Ideal is that, there is no guarantee that field installed nolox would be properly applied.

This is all about insurance and covering asses.


Crap...old thread :jester:


----------



## B4T (Feb 10, 2009)

the-apprentice said:


> u can use noalox with the brown marrette brand marrettes


I would double check that with your Canadian AHJ.. they might of followed our lead and not certified that idea..


----------



## the-apprentice (Jun 11, 2012)

B4T said:


> I would double check that with your Canadian AHJ.. they might of followed our lead and not certified that idea..



could be right! i will give that a check tomorow


----------



## kennydmeek (Sep 12, 2009)

I did a major job using these and the purples wire nuts. Not going to get away with not arc-faulting this in my world....I like these a little better. I think they may have even been a little cheaper. Just don't remember.


----------



## kennydmeek (Sep 12, 2009)

Oops..here?


----------



## kennydmeek (Sep 12, 2009)

Here..


----------



## kennydmeek (Sep 12, 2009)

Finally...here.


----------



## Cletis (Aug 20, 2010)

:no:

Don't put *innocent lives with woman and children at risk* with *deadly purple wire nuts*. Don't trust me...read this 

http://www.alwirerepair.com/burned_purples.htm


The only 3 methods I would ever do is the following

1. *Rewire*

2. *Copalum Crimping*

3. *Alumiconn's *


----------



## Cletis (Aug 20, 2010)

*More*

In order to address the aluminum wire danger in a manner that fits the budget of most homeowners, contractors began using *make-shift solutions* using a combination of twist-ons, tape and gel or sealant. But, any use of a twist-on connector is a practice the Consumer Product Safety Commission highly recommends against.

DON'T USE MAKESHIFT SOLUTIONS !!


----------



## Magnettica (Jan 23, 2007)

Complete rewire seems the way to go here.


----------



## Elephante (Nov 16, 2011)

Cletis said:


> :no:
> 
> Don't put innocent lives with woman and children at risk with deadly purple wire nuts. Don't trust me...read this
> 
> ...


That can be also due to poor workmanship so you can't automatically assume it was the wire nuts. They probably didn't twist the wires properly before putting it in the wire nut. I've done a few aluminum wire correction jobs and I hate how feeble the aluminum wire is.One nick and the the wire falls off and not to mention the wires are two different sizes 10/12 or14/12 al/cu. I use the purple wire nuts with Nolax but I don't feel100 percent when I'm done with the job. I try to avoid doing these jobs. I try to convince the homeowner to rewire the home with copper or at least the ones with heavy loads. But, to answer the Ops question I don't really see a difference besides the little safety net that holds the Nolax in. I guess you can always say you used them when your in court.lol


----------



## dcwired (Sep 1, 2012)

I reccomend setscrew terminal blocks from Alumiconn @ www.kinginnovation.com.
They will send you a free sample.


----------



## kennydmeek (Sep 12, 2009)

Elephante said:


> That can be also due to poor workmanship so you can't automatically assume it was the wire nuts. They probably didn't twist the wires properly before putting it in the wire nut. I've done a few aluminum wire correction jobs and I hate how feeble the aluminum wire is.One nick and the the wire falls off and not to mention the wires are two different sizes 10/12 or14/12 al/cu. I use the purple wire nuts with Nolax but I don't feel100 percent when I'm done with the job. I try to avoid doing these jobs. I try to convince the homeowner to rewire the home with copper or at least the ones with heavy loads. But, to answer the Ops question I don't really see a difference besides the little safety net that holds the Nolax in. I guess you can always say you used them when your in court.lol


True that. When I did the above job the original work had all been done in regular wire nuts and every original splice was solid and intact.(for nearly 4o years) the problems were where people came along later and messed with it...Even located a hidden melt down when I arc faulted it all and one didn't hold. If your splice is good I see no reason to believe the purple wire nut won't be good. Bad splice nothing's going to be good..


----------



## daveco (Jun 12, 2010)

Sorry to keep an old thread going, but the reason I found this was I wanted to see how people liked the Alumiconn connectors. I've used the purples and just started using the Alumiconns and to be honest, I question the Alumiconns more than the purples. Reason being is, that after I torqued the set screws once, while pushing the wires back into the box, I could feel that they came loose. I re-torqued them and hope they hold. I feel better about having a 'spring' wire nut that keeps tension on the wires.

I've also remember reading on the IDEAL box of purples that you're supposed to put both wires in 'without' twisting first and that makes sense so the nolox gets coated all the way around the wires before contact with each other.

Those using Alumiconns, are you taping the wires together to minimize movement in the lugs? I'm waiting to see some melted Alumiconns soon ;-)


----------



## daveco (Jun 12, 2010)

BTW, my answer to the original question is, I feel the only difference is the color and the skirt to hold the goo in. They're in it to make more money.

For the record, "Always go with UL listing" There... I said it... but you can bet I'll be attempting to cut both of them in halve for a cross section view of them ;-) Maybe I'll post some photos if they're not full of my blood ;-)

Also, we always see the same photos of burnt purples... but we never know the circumstances that created it. I have plenty of photos of melted red, yellow and tan wirenuts with copper to copper, just not properly installed.


----------



## FastFokker (Sep 18, 2012)

I have aluminum wiring in my house and use the brown T&B marettes and a dab of penetrox/nolox. Works great, but I also do my best to keep circuit loading down.

Just go slow and make 100% sure your spliced connection is good. I was paranoid about the aluminum wiring after everyone telling me it's a death trap, so I've checked plugs that get used often and they are perfectly fine. But I would never plug a 1500W heater in and run it full blast for hours.

I ordered the free sample of those alumiconns and they seemed great, but they were actually a lot bigger than I expected. They say they are the same size as a wire nut.. but it seemed bigger. But the killer was the cost of $3-4 each.. I can get a 6 pack of brown marettes for $4. 

In my opinion aluminum wiring is perfectly fine.. it just requires more care in installation. If you abuse it, it'll fail much quicker than copper. Or if you don't complete your splices properly, they will eventually break down. I don't think apprentices should work on it.


----------



## Auselect (Dec 2, 2011)

No one mentioned anything about using Cu/Al devices? Then use purples on the j boxes, fixtures and neutrals...
The way I look at it.....a lot less Cu/Al connections and device is being used for its rating therefore my liability would be minimal.
Only time I would splice in Cu is for GFI's or over/under switches which I haven't found in Al rated.


----------



## B4T (Feb 10, 2009)

Auselect said:


> No one mentioned anything about using Cu/Al devices? Then use purples on the j boxes, fixtures and neutrals...
> The way I look at it.....a lot less Cu/Al connections and device is being used for its rating therefore my liability would be minimal.
> Only time I would splice in Cu is for GFI's or over/under switches which I haven't found in Al rated.


You lose the flexibility of using decora devices if you don't pigtail.. 

Anytime I am doing a pigtail job... I make up my switches and receptacles the day before.. 

Go to the job and one less step you need to do...

As I mentioned before... I won't do a pigtail job without using AFCI breakers to make sure nothing got missed along the way.. like a splice box buried in the wall or attic..


----------



## Auselect (Dec 2, 2011)

B4T said:


> You lose the flexibility of using decora devices if you don't pigtail..
> 
> Anytime I am doing a pigtail job... I make up my switches and receptacles the day before..
> 
> ...


That's a great idea, that would save a hell of a lot of time...I haven't come across a Decora job yet but if I do, I will do it this way.
I agree with the AFCI upgrade but I'm afraid it will create more of a headache with nuisance tripping, have you had any issues B4T?


----------



## FastFokker (Sep 18, 2012)

You don't do decora!?!? 

I seriously have never not done decora, except for the odd plug or switch hidden away where nobody will even see them. Everyone wants decora, at least around here.

I seem to recall finding CO/ALR decora plugs a couple years ago when I was looking, but they were really expensive. So I figured it made more sense to just do a decent copper pigtail connection to a standard decora plug. 

I really like B4T's idea of AFCI's for an added layer of security.


----------



## Semi-Ret Electrician (Nov 10, 2011)

It's strange the Ideals are only listed for AL-CU not AL-AL.

IMO their high cost is due mostly because of greed and insurance. 

It's hard to un-list something. IMO Ideal couldn't get a new listing on twist-on's similar to their 65's after all the bad press.

Also, just inserting wires into a wirenut and twisting until you get two turns on the wiring, like they state on their box/listing, seems like a recipe for failure.


----------



## Cletis (Aug 20, 2010)

Semi-Ret Electrician said:


> It's strange the Ideals are only listed for AL-CU not AL-AL.
> 
> IMO their high cost is due mostly because of greed and insurance.
> 
> ...


Once 10 children die in cali with a high powered lawyer watch how fast they unlist the 65's. i would never use them.


----------



## seabee41 (Dec 21, 2010)

alumiconns work well but take up a lot of space


----------



## kennydmeek (Sep 12, 2009)

Semi-Ret Electrician said:


> It's strange the Ideals are only listed for AL-CU not AL-AL.
> 
> IMO their high cost is due mostly because of greed and insurance.
> 
> ...


_It's weird because the Ideal package contradicts itself. When you get to the list of allowed combinations there are al-al combos in there. _


----------



## FastFokker (Sep 18, 2012)

Why would they not be listed for Al-AL? 

It's a rare situation that you're pigtailing a single AL conductor. Typically it's 1 AL in, 1 AL out, and 1 CU pigtail.


----------



## Shockdoc (Mar 4, 2010)

B W E said:


> That doesn't answer my questions. Aside from 110, WHY is it a no no?


It's been a practice since the early 70's . The only reason it's a no no is to release the manufacturers from liability. Can't say i ever had a B cap filled with penetrox fail on me. I've seen splices fail with standard wirenuts, 9 out of 10 installed by handymen and homeowners.


----------



## Semi-Ret Electrician (Nov 10, 2011)

IMO if AL wire is stripped back carefully, old section cut off, no-lox used and care is taken not to "cold work" the wire, most connections will be fine with listed connectors, following mfr. directions.

But, if a DIYer, moisture/corrosion or inexperienced electrician was involved tremendous expense and liability can result.


----------



## hukhogan (Dec 30, 2008)

I smell conspiracy theory. Or attorneys.


----------



## RGH (Sep 12, 2011)

...the crimp method requires special crimp tool very expensive...and if ya go with the terminal block...they have a torque screwdriver requirement..(about $170)...looked at this just a couple weeks ago for a homerowner that was selling his house and the inspector pingded the al wiring...passed job off...I don't see enough of that crap to justifiy buying the tools required to do it to insurance co./inspectors requirements...IMHO...if I had to Kenny did it the way I would....term blocks and torqued..:thumbsup: looks good ken-man...as usual..:thumbup:


----------



## Jlarson (Jun 28, 2009)

hukhogan said:


> I smell conspiracy theory. Or attorneys.



Sacks of bull **** do typically smell the same :laughing:


----------



## hukhogan (Dec 30, 2008)

Is there a difference?


----------



## xenon (Dec 27, 2012)

B W E said:


> Aside from the 110 violation, is there
> A: anything inherently unsafe about using standard wire nuts filled with Noalox
> B. any mechanical or chemical difference between a standard wire but filled with Noalox and a wire nut listed for that purpose?


I belive that the spring inside is made of a softer metal and the cover on the end keeps the compound from dripping out during hot weather. I try to replace with CU when possable. I don't like my name on AL RX


----------



## cguillas (Jun 25, 2009)

B4T said:


> I would double check that with your Canadian AHJ.. they might of followed our lead and not certified that idea..


Yep, Marette 63/65 wirenuts filled with penetrox is how it's done here.


----------



## B4T (Feb 10, 2009)

cguillas said:


> Yep, Marette 63/65 wirenuts filled with penetrox is how it's done here.


It says on the box for AL/CU conductors...


----------



## cguillas (Jun 25, 2009)

Well, yes. That's what they're used for.


----------



## B4T (Feb 10, 2009)

cguillas said:


> Well, yes. That's what they're used for.


I'm saying does it spell it out AL/CU on the spec sheet...

Sometimes the info is not there and guys think something is OK....it is not and come come back to bite you in the ass..


----------



## cguillas (Jun 25, 2009)

Oh, I was trying to make the point that specific wirenuts have the rating. 

In the case of marette 6x wirenuts, instead of a "biting" spring with a cut edge, it's a smooth wound copper spring that tightly binds an already-securely-twisted joint.


----------



## FastFokker (Sep 18, 2012)

B4T said:


> I'm saying does it spell it out AL/CU on the spec sheet...


Yeah, specifically the brown marette (brand) 63/65's are for al/al or al/cu or cu/cu. CSA approved.


----------



## cguillas (Jun 25, 2009)

Oh you were asking a question! I didn't see the question mark. I thought you were making a statement.


----------



## Rochsolid (Aug 9, 2012)

FastFokker said:


> I have aluminum wiring in my house and use the brown T&B marettes and a dab of penetrox/nolox. Works great, but I also do my best to keep circuit loading down.
> 
> Just go slow and make 100% sure your spliced connection is good. I was paranoid about the aluminum wiring after everyone telling me it's a death trap, so I've checked plugs that get used often and they are perfectly fine. But I would never plug a 1500W heater in and run it full blast for hours.
> 
> ...


I also have AL wiring in my house. It doesn't bother me, and I don't feel less safe in my home due to the AL wiring. Like Fokker said, due diligence while you do repairs and do them properly, you should have no issues. I use these wire nuts with penetrox.


----------



## Nick0danger (Aug 19, 2012)

there are over 200,000 homes in calgary with aluminum wiring, all built in the late seventies, i have not heard in 5 years any burning down. I ask inspectors and i have a couple buddies that put out fires none blamed on aluminum wire, 1 firefighter has not been to a fire 3 years as a firefighter and the other one has but all where drug houses.


----------



## cguillas (Jun 25, 2009)

Full on burn-the-house-down-and-take-the-neighbourhood-with-it fires are pretty rare, and the worst case scenario. Burned up joints and welded receptacles are probably pretty common. That's where we come in. People depend on us to do our jobs right and make things safe. 

If you've got lots of homes with Al and none of them are burning down, I would say that you've got electricians in your area that are well trained and comfortable repairing it.


----------



## cguillas (Jun 25, 2009)

And I think you're off by about 180 000. There are only about 450000 residential properties total in all of Calgary.


----------



## big2bird (Oct 1, 2012)

They need to toss all aluminum romex out of the code. It's worthless crap.


----------



## kennydmeek (Sep 12, 2009)

This was in a house built c.1974. Everything was in good shape except somebody came along after the fact, spliced copper onto it(poorly) and caused a meltdown.


----------



## user8640521 (Jan 17, 2009)

B W E said:


> That doesn't answer my questions. Aside from 110, WHY is it a no no?


'cause regular wire nuts don't come with a little tiny attorney in
every box to keep you safe... that is why they are unsafe.

i've got a nice photo somewhere of a purple wirenut that melted
and caught fire. smelled just like an ordinary wirenut.


----------



## Semi-Ret Electrician (Nov 10, 2011)

Crazy me I went to Wikipedia and they echo just about everything we've been talking about and their survey showed 5 stars in 5 that everyone who rated it agree;
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aluminum_wire


----------



## Elephante (Nov 16, 2011)

Semi-Ret Electrician said:


> Crazy me I went to Wikipedia and they echo just about everything we've been talking about and their survey showed 5 stars in 5 that everyone who rated it agree;
> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aluminum_wire


I didn't know that pre70s aluminum is different than today's aluminum wire. Very informative article.


----------



## Auselect (Dec 2, 2011)

I'm going to contact Leviton to see what they say about their CO/Alr devices, I would listen to them more then I would wiki, who knows who is editing on that site, until I find out otherwise I believe the rated devices are fine....
I'll keep you guys posted....


----------



## FastFokker (Sep 18, 2012)

Auselect said:


> I would listen to them more then I would wiki, who knows who is editing on that site


Which part exactly are you questioning? 

Wiki is usually pretty good at referencing their sources. If you see the superscript # at the end of a paragraphy or sentence, you can scroll to the bottom and check the reference source.


----------

