# Do you guys use slim LED pots?



## mdimillo (Dec 30, 2017)

Hey guys,

First non-introduction thread. Basic question, wherever you are, how popular are the new LED "slimline" potlights?

Where I am we almost use them for everything. I think Liteline is a Canadian brand, but they just released ones with rotating gimbals to basically completely blow the regular recessed can type lights out of the water. With 1/2" of vertical clearance you can't beat them. They're great because you can now put potlights over joists and trusses (within reason, still need room for the clips).

The early ones were pretty chit and the clips always broke off, but that was more of a 2015/2016 problem.

What are your guys thoughts on these things?


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## 99cents (Aug 20, 2012)

mdimillo said:


> Hey guys,
> 
> First non-introduction thread. Basic question, wherever you are, how popular are the new LED "slimline" potlights?
> 
> ...


I use Lotus mostly. They invented them and the quality is high. I tried Lieline when they came out because a supplier had a special price on them. The clips were lousy so I never tried them again. Lotus has 3" and 4" gimbals and also a really nice one that fits an octagon box.


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## Sparkied (Jan 2, 2018)

I like useing them , simple and never had a problem, never used em in a remodel with vapor barriered cielings tho. 

Only question i have about them is how airtight they actually are, if piercing through the vapor barrier in a remodel to wire the box and clamping in the light would cause and condensation issues. I cant see it being a problem since they are super thin and rated air-tight, however would still like to know peoples thoughts on this.


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## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

I'm using a lot of Progress LED's lately.

There sell themselves by far and large on economical means

While i don't know exact specifics, their '_insult on vapor seal_' should be less than that of an old style cut in recessed....

~CS~


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## 99cents (Aug 20, 2012)

Sparkied said:


> I like useing them , simple and never had a problem, never used em in a remodel with vapor barriered cielings tho.
> 
> Only question i have about them is how airtight they actually are, if piercing through the vapor barrier in a remodel to wire the box and clamping in the light would cause and condensation issues. I cant see it being a problem since they are super thin and rated air-tight, however would still like to know peoples thoughts on this.


I use the Lotus low voltage extensions. If you're careful drilling your hole, you won't damage the VB. I prewire the JB's and mount them on a framing member above the insulation. Tuck Tape the hole for the cable.


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## 99cents (Aug 20, 2012)

Check out the Lotus J-Box light. It fits an octagon box. It twists on and is about 5" in diameter. You should use a deep box. I have used it where I am adding lighting but making use of some existing fixture locations. It's also good for low ceilings and bulkheads where head clearance is iffy.


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## mitch65 (Mar 26, 2015)

We use them pretty much for rework and T-bar ceilings. They are as handy as pockets in your shorts but the boss figures its nice to put cans in new construction in drywall so that if HO decides to change the look down the road they have the option of just changing the pot trims, not having to retrofit a fixture.


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## Sparkied (Jan 2, 2018)

99cents said:


> Check out the Lotus J-Box light. It fits an octagon box. It twists on and is about 5" in diameter. You should use a deep box. I have used it where I am adding lighting but making use of some existing fixture locations. It's also good for low ceilings and bulkheads where head clearance is iffy.


Those look pretty nice aswell.. got any pictures of them on a ceiling? Tryd googling but can't seem to find one.


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## Arrow3030 (Mar 12, 2014)

I'm all about Lithonia wafers for renovation. Lotus is the original as I understand it. Apparently elite makes them too at 27k which makes them relevant to only the biggest a-holes (I only recently stopped carring about 27k vs 30k)

I can't imagine using them on new work even with that goofy plate thing.


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## Majewski (Jan 8, 2016)

Wafers or nothing!


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## mdimillo (Dec 30, 2017)

Arrow3030 said:


> I'm all about Lithonia wafers for renovation. *Lotus is the original as I understand it.* Apparently elite makes them too at 27k which makes them relevant to only the biggest a-holes (I only recently stopped carring about 27k vs 30k)
> 
> I can't imagine using them on new work even with that goofy plate thing.


Yeah that's my understanding. I bought some Phillips ones for my Dad's place but they're not my favourite. I think the new Liteline is definitely where it's at.

Haven't tried Lotus yet but I might because I need some 3" ones for a job I'm doing. No Phillips nor Liteline (non-gimbal) solutions up here in Canada.


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## mdimillo (Dec 30, 2017)

99cents said:


> I use the Lotus low voltage extensions. If you're careful drilling your hole, you won't damage the VB. I prewire the JB's and mount them on a framing member above the insulation. Tuck Tape the hole for the cable.


Prewire the JB's eh. I think I'm going to start doing that. Usually we do them all during finishing and just run the wires, but it makes more sense to have a guy on a ladder tying in the JB's while they're still accessible. Especially if you mount the rough-in rings where there's a framing member right in the way.

As for the vapour barrier, on a new installation, we usually use the big rectangular pre-shaped VP's and the insulation guys just tuck-tape around them like the VB's for device boxes. Same with speakers. Go to cut the hole out and you get a mouth full of blown insulation unless you think ahead.


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## 99cents (Aug 20, 2012)

mdimillo said:


> Prewire the JB's eh. I think I'm going to start doing that. Usually we do them all during finishing and just run the wires, but it makes more sense to have a guy on a ladder tying in the JB's while they're still accessible. Especially if you mount the rough-in rings where there's a framing member right in the way.
> 
> As for the vapour barrier, on a new installation, we usually use the big rectangular pre-shaped VP's and the insulation guys just tuck-tape around them like the VB's for device boxes. Same with speakers. Go to cut the hole out and you get a mouth full of blown insulation unless you think ahead.


I still like old fashioned cans for new construction. They're faster. Boarder cuts the holes.

You gotta be some kind of insane to use remodel cans for reno work.


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## Dark Knight (Jan 6, 2016)

99cents said:


> I still like old fashioned cans for new construction. They're faster. Boarder cuts the holes.
> 
> You gotta be some kind of insane to use remodel cans for reno work.


Same here. Always cans for new construction and Liteline SlimLED's for retro and T-BAR. I hate having to cut them out myself.


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## CT Tom (Aug 10, 2014)

Did a full kitchen remodel where the Lithonia slims were the only option, between old framing, poor framing, two bathrooms above, there would have been 8' of no recess right in the middle of the kitchen, so I talked builder into firring down the ceiling and we used the wafer recess, came out nice.


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## mitch65 (Mar 26, 2015)

one of our less careful journeymen found today that they are thin enough that you can install them if you cut your hole with a stud almost dead centre. As long as you have room to get the driver in the hole.


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## trentonmakes (Mar 21, 2017)

mitch65 said:


> one of our less careful journeymen found today that they are thin enough that you can install them if you cut your hole with a stud almost dead centre. As long as you have room to get the driver in the hole.


I find poking a screwsriver through much easier to patch the a big 5/6 inch hole

Texting and Driving


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

mitch65 said:


> one of our less careful journeymen found today that they are thin enough that you can install them if you cut your hole with a stud almost dead centre. As long as you have room to get the driver in the hole.


If you can't get the driver into the hole (like when using 4" lights and you hit the joist dead center) you can install the driver in another light's hole and then snake over low voltage wire to the light on the joist.


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## sbrn33 (Mar 15, 2007)

I really like the look of the new slim cans....


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## sbrn33 (Mar 15, 2007)

CT Tom said:


> Did a full kitchen remodel where the Lithonia slims were the only option, between old framing, poor framing, two bathrooms above, there would have been 8' of no recess right in the middle of the kitchen, so I talked builder into firring down the ceiling and we used the wafer recess, came out nice.


man what did we do a year ago. sure lucky these came out.


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## Arrow3030 (Mar 12, 2014)

My hope is they don't hit main stream big box and remain exclusive to people in the know.

I have them in my house and they are completely silent which is a big deal for the wife. She hates the halos at my folks for this reason.

One gripe is 10 percent dimming seems accurate. It'd be nice if it was lower.

I'm using Lithonia. How noisy and how well do other brands dim?


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## lighterup (Jun 14, 2013)

Slim Pots?

when I did , I preferred fatties


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## mdimillo (Dec 30, 2017)

The cans for new construction are alright, but you're limited to joist cavities and you can't always get them perfect sometimes. With regards to the boarder cutting the holes, we just hang those sheet metal rings with the 4" holes for the slimlines's so buddy still has to cut the holes.

Yeah if I had to cut the holes in new construction that would be an instant no. Plus you'd probably slice the vapour barrier too, which is a hole other animal especially with blown insulation. If you hang the rings, you can put those big preformed vapour barriers and the insulation guys tuck tape around them. Godsend.


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## mdimillo (Dec 30, 2017)

Sorry for the double post, but yeah, the primary advantage to cans used to be that you could get gimbal trims, but that's been rendered moot now with the new Liteline (and likely other) offerings. We just run slimlines all around at the company I used to work for, and when I do side work, I do things that way as well. Better design overall for sure, plus it saves you using LED bulbs since all slims are LED.

You can get Chinese trash ones from San Remo for like $14 in Canada. Can't beat that for builder grade projects, and $25 or so for the 4" ones up here in Canada for Liteline's offerings.


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## NDC (Jan 12, 2016)

99cents said:


> I use the Lotus low voltage extensions. If you're careful drilling your hole, you won't damage the VB. I prewire the JB's and mount them on a framing member above the insulation. Tuck Tape the hole for the cable.


 _Edit for the incorrect quote._


I had to bump this because this is exactly how I want to install these lights from now on. Do you use carbide grit to cut your holes? A regular hole saw will rip through the VB no matter how careful you are no?
I found a supplier for extension cables, I can get them in 10 and 20 foot lengths. What lengths do you find you use more of?


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## NDC (Jan 12, 2016)

Arrow3030 said:


> My hope is they don't hit main stream big box and remain exclusive to people in the know.
> 
> I have them in my house and they are completely silent which is a big deal for the wife. She hates the halos at my folks for this reason.
> 
> ...



I have installed Lotus, Lithonia, EEl, and a brand called dawnray and they all seem to be 10% max dimming.


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## codyb (Aug 23, 2018)

I've been installing a lot of Topaz 4" and 6" Slim LEDs as of late in most of my retros. IMO they are quality lights for the fraction of the cost of a can, trim and bulb. They put out a ton of light, dimmable and suitable for install in damp locations.


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## aduck337 (Oct 18, 2017)

Liteline Luna and SLM have been great for us. The 3 and 4" Lunas are becoming more and more common for new construction and we use the pre construction brackets from them with a poly boot supported all 4 sides. 

We usually just cut the DC plugs off and run securex if we are doing remote mounted drivers for areas the ceiling is deep enough for the light itself, but not the driver. Not technically ok since it's not a factory extension cable, but it works 100% and no inspector has ever questioned it. Dimming is really good and silent on the Luna product and not quite as good on the cheaper SLM wafer ones. I don't like the 120 degree beam spread on wafers for most rooms, it's pretty aggressive on the eyes. 45 degree spread on the Lunas is much more comfortable. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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