# Testing CATV



## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

subelect said:


> I know that this is an idiotic question, but I am trying to figure out the simplest way to track down a problem with co-ax Cable TV in a customer's house.
> 
> The customer saw me wiring up a light fixture and asked if I could stop by and see why his daughter's new TV set is not receiving cable signal. All cables are terminated in the utility room and fed into the individual rooms.
> I will probably take a look at it on Wednesday and I could really use some knowledge from smart people before then.
> ...


You need a test tool for that here is a link that might help..*Ideal VDV MultiMedia Cable Tester Kit*


(Model # 33-856

http://www.twacomm.com/catalog/dept_id_562/model_33-856.htm?sid=D2CF452066E900F4CB034F7EE7BB2A33


----------



## mikeh32 (Feb 16, 2009)

HARRY304E said:


> You need a test tool for that here is a link that might help..
> 
> http://www.twacomm.com/catalog/dept_id_562/model_33-856.htm?sid=D2CF452066E900F4CB034F7EE7BB2A33


thats the one i use


----------



## administr8tor (Mar 6, 2010)

I have it too, lowes sells it for $79 or $89:thumbsup:


----------



## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

mikeh32 said:


> thats the one i use


Yes i think you can get them a home depot a little cheaper.


----------



## MDShunk (Jan 7, 2007)

I use a Sadelco DisplayMax Jr. Slightly more than $89


----------



## mikeh32 (Feb 16, 2009)

HARRY304E said:


> Yes i think you can get them a home depot a little cheaper.


I got mine off ebay for a nice price.


----------



## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

MDShunk said:


> I use a Sadelco DisplayMax Jr. Slightly more than $89


this one??http://www.aaatesters.com/CATV_Meters-Sadelco_DisplayMax_Jr_3000_Signal_Level_Meter.html


----------



## MDShunk (Jan 7, 2007)

HARRY304E said:


> this one??http://www.aaatesters.com/CATV_Meters-Sadelco_DisplayMax_Jr_3000_Signal_Level_Meter.html


Exact same one. A bit outdated if you were a full-blown cable tech, but perfect for an electrician. The one's the cable company uses are 2 grand and up, and often have features that an electrician wouldn't be able to use for lack of cable system passwords, etc.


----------



## Canadiantech (Jan 4, 2010)

For testing continuity of a cable or locating a given cable out of a bundle I just stick a resistor on one end, say the end in the bedroom, and then measure the resistance of each line in the utility room.

I use something like this:
http://www.prosatellitesupply.com/f_terminator.htm 
I removed the 75 ohm resistor and installed a handful of different values of resistors and then stuck them on some push-on fittings. I can tone out eight different lines using my standard multimeter and about $5 worth of parts. Using this method I can also estimate the length of the cable and sort of its condition. Double shielded RG6 cable with a 60% braid is standard with the CATV company here and has a loop resistance of 3.5 ohms per hundred feet when one end is shorted. If I am using a 100 ohm terminator I would expect to see about 104 ohms on the other end for approximately 100 feet of RG6 double shielded cable. 

While the DC resistance is great for identifying cables to make sure you have the right one hooked up, it does not guarantee performace. A meter like MDShunk has is great for testing the signal and there are lots of charts online that will tell you how much loss you should expect over a given length of a given cable type.


----------



## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

Canadiantech said:


> For testing continuity of a cable or locating a given cable out of a bundle I just stick a resistor on one end, say the end in the bedroom, and then measure the resistance of each line in the utility room.
> 
> I use something like this:
> http://www.prosatellitesupply.com/f_terminator.htm
> ...


Good work Welcome to the forum:thumbsup:


----------



## hbiss (Mar 1, 2008)

_I know that this is an idiotic question, but I am trying to figure out the simplest way to track down a problem with co-ax Cable TV in a customer's house._


I won't comment on the idiotic part other than to ask why you didn't tell him to call the cable company? It's their job, not yours. Gonna fix his backed up toilet too if he asked you?:whistling2:

-Hal


----------



## subelect (Nov 25, 2007)

I have no idea what your concept of being an electrician is, but around these parts, you never say no to a customer as long as the check clears the bank. Anything that involves wire is fair game: CAT-5, co-ax, THHN...etc.

The problem wound up being a poor installation (imagine that). The cable installers ran the cable most of the way, but never finished the run. Ran the last 25 feet, terminated it and moved on to the next job. 

I did not ask him if he had plumbing issues. Maybe next time.

Rick


----------



## don_resqcapt19 (Jul 18, 2010)

hbiss said:


> _..._
> 
> I won't comment on the idiotic part other than to ask why you didn't tell him to call the cable company? It's their job, not yours. Gonna fix his backed up toilet too if he asked you?:whistling2:
> 
> -Hal


Around here the cable guys are like the phone guys...they don't work on the cable in your house unless you pay them to do it and also like the phone companies they won't fish their wires. They will run exposed on the inside or the outside of your house. Something I would never permit in my house.


----------



## hbiss (Mar 1, 2008)

_I have no idea what your concept of being an electrician is, but around these parts, you never say no to a customer as long as the check clears the bank._

Thank you. That statement exactly illustrates my objection. Anything for a buck no matter whether you know what you are doing or not. Now you are dragging the profession down to the level of handymen and trunkers. We have absolute objections to electrical work done by DIYs, trunkers and other unqualified people. The reason they exist is for the very same reason you stated- _never say no to a customer as long as the check clears the bank._

Having worked for cable companies in a past life I can say that none of us (including me) are qualified technically to service or design the installation of cable wiring save for the actual installation of the cable itself and finding simple defects such as bad connectors, cuts, staples through the cable etc. Even a tech who has worked for one cable company moving on to another will have to go through training because each company and locality operate their systems differently and that can and frequently does change almost every few days. Unlike telephone there is no standard. It doesn't matter what meters and equipment you have, unless you know what you are supposed to be looking for they won't help you.

_Around here the cable guys are like the phone guys...they don't work on the cable in your house unless you pay them to do it and also like the phone companies they won't fish their wires. They will run exposed on the inside or the outside of your house. Something I would never permit in my house._

I can agree with that. The cable guys may be good with the technical stuff but you wouldn't want them to install any cable or phone wiring. Most cable companies will service the installation without charge if there is a problem. 

What I'm saying with all of this is know your limitations and treat your customers professionally. I know that with the economy the way it is it's very hard to turn away a job offer. I have seen way too many things done by ECs that I have been called to service after the fact that were just plain wrong. Just recently I found one CAT5 data run spliced up in the ceiling into three with wire nuts to serve three computers. An EC fished the wiring. A few months later the computers were installed. In this case the customer paid good money once and then had to pay again. That EC got his money and the check cleared, but do you think he will be coming back to make any more money? In the long run everybody loses. Customer is pissed and we look like hacks.

-Hal


----------



## don_resqcapt19 (Jul 18, 2010)

hbiss said:


> _Around here the cable guys are like the phone guys...they don't work on the cable in your house unless you pay them to do it and also like the phone companies they won't fish their wires. They will run exposed on the inside or the outside of your house. Something I would never permit in my house._
> 
> I can agree with that. The cable guys may be good with the technical stuff but you wouldn't want them to install any cable or phone wiring. Most cable companies will service the installation without charge if there is a problem.
> -Hal


Here they run the same scam as the phone company ... they want you to pay a monthly fee for inside cable maintenance.  If you don't pay the monthly fee, just like with the phone company, if the problem is in the wiring in your house, you get charged a repair fee.


----------



## hbiss (Mar 1, 2008)

Well, if the customer doesn't have maintenence then they are going to have to pay one way or another. I think for most people the logical thing to do then is to have the cable company take care of a problem, it's their system, no? Probably cheaper also, I know it would be compared to my rates. 

I do understand though that some people are ignorant and can't figure that out or they may have a axe to grind re the cable or phone company or may have something they don't want the cable or phone company to see, like their hack job Radio Shack mess that they know they will be told has to be replaced. In my experience it's always one of these types that approaches me and then either doesn't want to pay for what really needs to be done or just doesn't like what I tell them. I guess I could do _something,_ keep my mouth shut and take their money, but I would rather not deal with those people to begin with. If they should have called the cable company I would be the first to tell them so.

-Hal


----------



## don_resqcapt19 (Jul 18, 2010)

hbiss said:


> Well, if the customer doesn't have maintenence then they are going to have to pay one way or another. I think for most people the logical thing to do then is to have the cable company take care of a problem, it's their system, no? Probably cheaper also, I know it would be compared to my rates.
> 
> I do understand though that some people are ignorant and can't figure that out or they may have a axe to grind re the cable or phone company or may have something they don't want the cable or phone company to see, like their hack job Radio Shack mess that they know they will be told has to be replaced. In my experience it's always one of these types that approaches me and then either doesn't want to pay for what really needs to be done or just doesn't like what I tell them. I guess I could do _something,_ keep my mouth shut and take their money, but I would rather not deal with those people to begin with. If they should have called the cable company I would be the first to tell them so.
> 
> -Hal


The problem is that the prepaid fee only covers a problem with the cable wiring itself....anything else costs money. I am not saying I want to do that work because I don't, but it is my opinion that the fee is very close to a scam.


----------



## hbiss (Mar 1, 2008)

_The problem is that the prepaid fee only covers a problem with the cable wiring itself....anything else costs money. I am not saying I want to do that work because I don't, but it is my opinion that the fee is very close to a scam._ 

"Maintenence" plans vary from company to company and area to area. If one doesn't cover both labor and materials (as any that I am familiar with do) then yes, it is a scam. 

-Hal


----------



## don_resqcapt19 (Jul 18, 2010)

hbiss said:


> "Maintenence" plans vary from company to company and area to area. If one doesn't cover both labor and materials (as any that I am familiar with do) then yes, it is a scam.
> 
> -Hal


 It covers the labor and material, but only for problems with the physical wiring and jacks. How often do those items actually fail?


----------



## hbiss (Mar 1, 2008)

_It covers the labor and material, but only for problems with the physical wiring and jacks. _

Sounds like what the OP was asked to look into, no? Besides, what other problems should it cover? If your set top box quits working or your internet quits or you have no phone service they take care of that for free. That pretty much covers everything unless you think that they should handle your computer, TV and phone problems too.:no: 

-Hal


----------



## don_resqcapt19 (Jul 18, 2010)

hbiss said:


> _It covers the labor and material, but only for problems with the physical wiring and jacks. _
> 
> Sounds like what the OP was asked to look into, no? Besides, what other problems should it cover? If your set top box quits working or your internet quits or you have no phone service they take care of that for free. That pretty much covers everything unless you think that they should handle your computer, TV and phone problems too.:no:
> 
> -Hal


 No, I just think that the type of failures that they cover for the monthy fee are rare enough to make the fee a scam. As far as the OP, he indicated that the circuit was never completed, so I don't see that being covered under the monthly fee program.


----------



## hbiss (Mar 1, 2008)

Ok, lets look at this- 

_The problem wound up being a poor installation (imagine that). The cable installers ran the cable most of the way, but never finished the run. Ran the last 25 feet..._

Like I'm going to believe an installer who was there to do an add set never connected it and even left the cable too short and the customer let him walk out the door. Then they pay *somebody else* to fix it? :laughing: 

Believe me, the customer is BSing you! Bet you any amount of money the customer: 1) moved the location, 2) pulled the cable from another room and it was too short, 3) installed the cable himself and was afraid the cable company was going to bust him for adding another set, 4) the dog ate 25 feet of cable . 

As for cable problems being rare, they would be if nobody touched them. Been there, done that.

-Hal


----------



## johnsmithabe (May 3, 2011)

signal testing multimeter s available in market.


----------

