# 3 Phase Disconnects 60A Fuses



## william1978 (Sep 21, 2008)

I do it all the time. I know I should be wearing PPE, but this is just my opinion " I don't need no stinking PPE". This is just my opinion.


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## Mike_586 (Mar 24, 2009)

I see that you're here in Ontario, and odds are you're running into more 347/600 than 277/480. I've just seen my first 277/480 switch gear up here, usually when I run into it its a step down transformer from 347/600 to run a few pieces of American made equipment, not a whole building.

For some reason I'm hitting a mental block on the rules regarding what you're doing. I'll have to look it up, but you really should be taking a look at the Occupational Health and Safety Act, for your own benefit. Knowing you're rights, responsibilities and the consequences is in your best interest.

Here's a link to the page with the OHSA and a few other regulations. 

http://www.csao.org/WebHelp/OHSA_and_Regs.htm

I'll look into the rules a bit tonight and give you some better answers tomorrow (I have some other related stuff here that might be of relevance) with the rules/regs to back it up, along with a few other pointers to *keep your ass covered*.

EDIT: Try downloading the downloadable version of the OSHA and searching a few key words...

Electrical Hazards (take note of the parts about written policies required and section 191)
Penalties
Duties of Workers
No discipline or dismissal by employer
Onus of proof


A quick question. What part of Ontario are you in?


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## randomkiller (Sep 28, 2007)

william1978 said:


> I do it all the time. I know I should be wearing PPE, but this is just my opinion " I don't need no stinking PPE". This is just my opinion.


 
If you are feeling generous just put me down as the beneficiary in your will, I can use the money.


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## william1978 (Sep 21, 2008)

randomkiller said:


> If you are feeling generous just put me down as the beneficiary in your will, I can use the money.


 I wish I could, but nothing from nothing is nothing.:laughing:


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## mattsilkwood (Sep 21, 2008)

to me it all depends on what you are doing. if you are just looking at the latch imo its not that big of a deal. but first and foremost if you dont feel comfortable in a hot disconnect or a hot whatever you shouldnt be in one.


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## william1978 (Sep 21, 2008)

Maybe I can be buried in PPE. :whistling2: :jester:


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## william1978 (Sep 21, 2008)

mattsilkwood said:


> to me it all depends on what you are doing. if you are just looking at the latch imo its not that big of a deal. but first and foremost if you dont feel comfortable in a hot disconnect or a hot whatever you shouldnt be in one.


 I agree.


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## JTMEYER (May 2, 2009)

One of my jobs at the meat packing plant I worked for was to wash out all the diconnects on the cut floor every month. We just opened em up and blasted them out live with a medium pressure hose. most were 30A all were 480. Young and dumb. Although I never did get a shock or see one blow up.


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## mattsilkwood (Sep 21, 2008)

JTMEYER said:


> One of my jobs at the meat packing plant I worked for was to wash out all the diconnects on the cut floor every month. We just opened em up and blasted them out live with a medium pressure hose. most were 30A all were 480. Young and dumb. Although I never did get a shock or see one blow up.


now thats just crazy and ive got a pretty high tolerence for crazy


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## william1978 (Sep 21, 2008)

JTMEYER said:


> One of my jobs at the meat packing plant I worked for was to wash out all the diconnects on the cut floor every month. We just opened em up and blasted them out live with a medium pressure hose. most were 30A all were 480. Young and dumb. Although I never did get a shock or see one blow up.


 Electricial equipment and water don't mix. It is crazy to purposely spray water in those disconnects.


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## JTMEYER (May 2, 2009)

william1978 said:


> Electricial equipment and water don't mix. It is crazy to purposely spray water in those disconnects.


It had been done that way for ages before I was there, and I'm very certain that it is still being done that way. I would wear 1000v gloves when I could find a pair.


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## sparkyboys (May 3, 2009)

mastertorturer, 

yeah you should wear gear for that but once you deal with enough tranny switches and gears,..............

its nothing but "G" thang


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## bobelectric (Feb 24, 2007)

Are you inspecting for code compliance or inspecting as in P.M.


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## Mastertorturer (Jan 28, 2009)

bobelectric said:


> Are you inspecting for code compliance or inspecting as in P.M.


It's for anual fire inspections. We make sure the electrical aspects of exhaust fans are safe and accurate. 

The defects are (supposed to be) reviewed and another contractor or regular in house electrician will repair it. Although tons of defects are left and carry over to the next inspection. 

I've taken courses in Electrican Hazards , Lock out-Tag out, PPE and general safety. This is mostly to cover the company's liability. The general attitude is "Yeah, yeah, yeah safety whatever". 

It would be nice to know what's running through their heads when they put themselves in danger willingly. Then they try and convince other people to do it. What for?


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## Zog (Apr 15, 2009)

mattsilkwood said:


> to me it all depends on what you are doing. if you are just looking at the latch imo its not that big of a deal. but first and foremost if you dont feel comfortable in a hot disconnect or a hot whatever you shouldnt be in one.


"Feeling comfortable" wont stop that 36,000 degree fireball from burning the skin off you. It is the guys who "Feel comfortable" that end up statistics.


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## ralpha494 (Oct 29, 2008)

You should watch the mannikins burn in front of 30, 60 and 100 amp disconnects and picture yourself there.

www.westexinc.com


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## Zog (Apr 15, 2009)

Mastertorturer said:


> How dangerous is it really? Am I paranoid? If a 480v 30A 3 phase panel is an Arc Flash Hazard then how bad is this? If that is dangerous how would other companies view this?
> 
> I just want some FACTS because in all honesty I don't trust this guy.
> 
> Thanks for reading.


Well the voltage has little to do with the hazard level and the 60A means nothing, the danger level is a product of available energy and clearing time of the protective device. If your plant has not done an arc flash study, then you need to follw the 70E task tables, or better yet the new canadain version (CSA Z462) eh?


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## cdnelectrician (Mar 14, 2008)

Man, I have seen 600V do some scary ass sh!t. As soon as I see something wrong in a switch, gear or MCC it's getting shut down so I can fix it. If the boss doesn't like it he can do it himself!


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## TheRick (Apr 13, 2008)

mattsilkwood said:


> to me it all depends on what you are doing. if you are just looking at the latch imo its not that big of a deal. but first and foremost if you dont feel comfortable in a hot disconnect or a hot whatever you shouldnt be in one.


 
Those that feel comfortable taking shorcuts, and ignoring safety practices, should watch this video. 

http://www.ifeltcomfortable.com/

It is extremely graphic, but it makes a very good point.....don't get too comfortable....that is when we make mistakes! 

SHUT IT OFF OR WEAR YOUR PPE!


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## Mastertorturer (Jan 28, 2009)

Zog said:


> Well the voltage has little to do with the hazard level and the 60A means nothing, the danger level is a product of available energy and clearing time of the protective device. If your plant has not done an arc flash study, then you need to follw the 70E task tables, or better yet the new canadain version (CSA Z462) eh?


Well there is a slim to none chance of people doing arc-flash studies on service equipment. Pretty much every winning bid on contracts are lowest price. Regardless of quality-craftsmenship or expertise. 

The mechanical room I'm talking about had at least 4 code violations and hack work.

One more question to everyone. Has anyone ever seen a contractor or employee delt with accordingly? People get away with so much it's hard to believe it happens.


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## Zog (Apr 15, 2009)

Mastertorturer said:


> Well there is a slim to none chance of people doing arc-flash studies on service equipment.


Then use the task tables, thats what they are for.


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## william1978 (Sep 21, 2008)

JTMEYER said:


> It had been done that way for ages before I was there, and I'm very certain that it is still being done that way.


 Just because its been done that way for a long time don't make it right.:no:


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## TOOL_5150 (Aug 27, 2007)

TheRick said:


> Those that feel comfortable taking shorcuts, and ignoring safety practices, should watch this video.
> 
> http://www.ifeltcomfortable.com/
> 
> ...


Very good video. ITs 10 minutes of the 23 minute video but it makes a point.

~Matt


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## TheRick (Apr 13, 2008)

If you get a chance to see the whole thing do not do it right after lunch!


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## MoscaFibra (Apr 15, 2021)

If you are opening a disconnect of that size live, you SHOULD be wearing a face shield, gloves and FR clothing at the least.

I do not always. I am trying to be better at that part of it too. Your boss sounds oblivious to consequences. Even if I make the poor decision to open it without gear, I would not go poking at a loose wire! I have actually had a flash occurrence in a panel before when someone left a bare pig tail in a lighting panel, I killed the panel I was in, tested all the breakers (we were replacing the automated lighting system) but this wire was fed from the panel beside it. It grounded out on the wall when I pull the bundle forward. I didn't get hurt, but the flash did hurt my eyes and my hand was covered in a black soot. 

It happens, even sometimes when you think it cant.


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