# We're letting you go...



## LGLS (Nov 10, 2007)

We're letting a guy go this Friday. I was going to post this in reply to the "To improve the union" thread but I think this deserves it's own.

We got this guy about a year ago. For about 2/5ths of what our shop does requires 2 special certifications and a CDL license with air brake endorsement, and the ability to drive stick. He has all that. For 2/5ths more, you need at least the CDL, and the remaining 1/5 anybody can do.

The main reason is, he's got that "old school" attitude. No matter who he works with, he tells them to slow down. When you layout work and make a plan, that's not considered "go time" for him... he's gotta ponder it a while and reflect. (This is for everyday stuff we do all the time.) Oftentimes, we go out in crews of 2 or 3, but when there's a "push" other crews who are available for OT are sent to assist you, and when more manpower shows up, he thinks that means he can put his feet up and relax. He's late at least 20 minutes at least 2x a week. He bangs in once every 3 weeks and it's always a 1st thing in the morning call in, not a day-before heads up.

The boss has heard from one too many "I don't want to work with him." Despite the fact that it will be difficult to replace him, and will undoubtedly result in having to pay others overtime while a suitable replacement is found, he's history. 

Union environment or not, never allow others with nefarious intents drag you down to their level.


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## backstay (Feb 3, 2011)

Hopefully he gets told exactly what you just printed. Guys like this need to know why. Slowing down a job or telling others to slow down for any reason other than quality of work is automatic fire for me.


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## sparky970 (Mar 19, 2008)

I can't believe you kept him for a year. I've went through 4 guys in the last 5 weeks. Number 5 is getting laid off next week. It has not been fun. 95% of our local is working and guess what's left. I have gotten 2 great guys, but we had to poach them from other contractors.


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

IslandGuy said:


> We're letting a guy go this Friday. I was going to post this in reply to the "To improve the union" thread but I think this deserves it's own.
> 
> We got this guy about a year ago. For about 2/5ths of what our shop does requires 2 special certifications and a CDL license with air brake endorsement, and the ability to drive stick. He has all that. For 2/5ths more, you need at least the CDL, and the remaining 1/5 anybody can do.
> 
> ...


He's a slacker and should be fired on the spot in front of the men, for maximum embarrassment, guys like that do not belong in any trade.

I've got plenty of tolerance for slow workers, as long as their work is really good, they are cool with me, but anyone who tells others to slow down because he does not want to work hard at his job should be fired without notice .


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## CADPoint (Jul 5, 2007)

Why Wait Till Friday?


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## Going_Commando (Oct 1, 2011)

IslandGuy said:


> We're letting a guy go this Friday. I was going to post this in reply to the "To improve the union" thread but I think this deserves it's own.
> 
> * We got this guy about a year ago. For about 2/5ths of what our shop does requires 2 special certifications and a CDL license with air brake endorsement, and the ability to drive stick. He has all that. For 2/5ths more, you need at least the CDL, and the remaining 1/5 anybody can do.*
> 
> ...


Can you expand on that bold part? I am a bit confused about it. What do you guys do that requires a CDL and extra certs, if you don't mind me asking?


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## macmikeman (Jan 23, 2007)

I'm a loner. And this type of thread is the reason I have been happy for decades working by myself. And guess what? The jobs always finish on time when I said they would.


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## FrunkSlammer (Aug 31, 2013)

At least he didn't work himself out of a job.. that's the real threat to union guys! :laughing:


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## eejack (Jul 14, 2012)

FrunkSlammer said:


> At least he didn't work himself out of a job.. that's the real threat to union guys! :laughing:


I do it all the time. 
And train my replacements as well. :thumbsup:


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## hardworkingstiff (Jan 22, 2007)

Seriously, why did you keep him this long?


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## Spunk#7 (Nov 30, 2012)

hardworkingstiff said:


> Seriously, why did you keep him this long?


 BA's buddy?


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## htneighbors (Jan 23, 2009)

I don't see why it's a "fact that it will be difficult to replace him." Seriously? 

I DO know it's a fact this type of union worker (in all trades) has been on the project I'm on. That's part of the reason it went from $3 to $15 billion and took about 6 years total! Had I been in charge here, I would have fired about 95% of the workers on this job. Looking so forward to leave here the end of the month! Came up here initially for a 6-8 month job and I've been here 18 months! 

Before I get blasted - I'm not picking on union workers, this job just happens to be a union job. I've been all over on different projects and I've seen both good and bad in union and non-union.


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## Big John (May 23, 2010)

It's tough getting people. We hired a guy on a probationary status who had all the right credentials on paper. Needless to say when he accidentally took the ruler out of my combination square and spent 20 minutes trying to put it back together before giving up, it really made me wonder about the value of those credentials.


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

Big John said:


> It's tough getting people. We hired a guy on a probationary status who had all the right credentials on paper. Needless to say when *he accidentally took the ruler out of my combination square and spent 20 minutes trying to put it back together before giving up*, it really made me wonder about the value of those credentials.


:blink:

Man..:no:
:laughing:


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## Rollie73 (Sep 19, 2010)

Big John said:


> It's tough getting people. We hired a guy on a probationary status who had all the right credentials on paper. Needless to say when he accidentally took the ruler out of my combination square and spent 20 minutes trying to put it back together before giving up, it really made me wonder about the value of those credentials.


I'm sorry dude.......I told you I would buy you a new combination square.......just as soon as I pay off my dealer. I'm on the hook for a lot of crack....... ok ?


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## MTW (Aug 28, 2013)

Big John said:


> It's tough getting people. We hired a guy on a probationary status who had all the right credentials on paper. Needless to say when he accidentally took the ruler out of my combination square and spent 20 minutes trying to put it back together before giving up, it really made me wonder about the value of those credentials.


I did that to mine once by accident but it took me an hour to put it back together.


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## 120/208 (Nov 18, 2012)

IslandGuy said:


> We're letting a guy go this Friday. I was going to post this in reply to the "To improve the union" thread but I think this deserves it's own.
> 
> We got this guy about a year ago. For about 2/5ths of what our shop does requires 2 special certifications and a CDL license with air brake endorsement, and the ability to drive stick. He has all that. For 2/5ths more, you need at least the CDL, and the remaining 1/5 anybody can do.
> 
> ...



What you described isn't just a union issue. Slugs like him exist in all types of careers.


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## union347sparky (Feb 29, 2012)

Big John said:


> It's tough getting people. We hired a guy on a probationary status who had all the right credentials on paper. Needless to say when he accidentally took the ruler out of my combination square and spent 20 minutes trying to put it back together before giving up, it really made me wonder about the value of those credentials.


 This makes me laugh. I got two guys from our hall (very bottom of the book) to help us out on a big job on a short call. Both seemed intelligent on first meeting. Once I handed them their hard hats I had to watch both of them fumble around for a 1/2 hour trying to figure out how the liner snapped in. They never did redeem theirselves that two weeks. Slow and stupid. They were deemed tweedledee and tweedledumb.


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## ponyboy (Nov 18, 2012)

union347sparky said:


> This makes me laugh. I got two guys from our hall (very bottom of the book) to help us out on a big job on a short call. Both seemed intelligent on first meeting. Once I handed them their hard hats I had to watch both of them fumble around for a 1/2 hour trying to figure out how the liner snapped in. They never did redeem theirselves that two weeks. Slow and stupid. They were deemed tweedledee and tweedledumb.


How do guys like that even top out? I've said it before and I'll say it again- I'm very hopeful that the statewide license and REQUIRED apprenticeship in Iowa will scare off the losers and weed out the idiots. Hopeful.


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## Big John (May 23, 2010)

ponyboy said:


> How do guys like that even top out? I've said it before and I'll say it again- I'm very hopeful that the statewide license and REQUIRED apprenticeship in Iowa will scare off the losers and weed out the idiots. Hopeful.


 I dunno, I've met more than one moron with a ticket. Then it makes me think we need to do away with multiple-choice tests.


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## LGLS (Nov 10, 2007)

backstay said:


> Hopefully he gets told exactly what you just printed. Guys like this need to know why. Slowing down a job or telling others to slow down for any reason other than quality of work is automatic fire for me.


He won't be told unless HE presses the issue. He's going to get ROWd, and the boss will wait about a month to put a call in for manpower, though his certifications won't be specified. He doesn't really have to be told, if he doesn't know his attendance alone is cause for layoff, that's his problem. I know he's already aware a couple of specific guys refuse to work with him.

If he calls me at home after the layoff, which he probably will, I'll tell him specifically. If he doesn't, I know just who to leak that information to so he does get the message. 



sparky970 said:


> I can't believe you kept him for a year. I've went through 4 guys in the last 5 weeks. Number 5 is getting laid off next week. It has not been fun. 95% of our local is working and guess what's left. I have gotten 2 great guys, but we had to poach them from other contractors.


 A-Journeymen are easy to come by. Require a CDL class B with air brake and you knock 90% of them right out of the line up. Now add arc-fusion fiber optic certification, and 2 others and you're really thinning the herd. So we're just going for CDL and I and another guy are going to have to step up to the plate on all those kinds of jobs. If whomever we get is willing we'll get him/her trained and certified ourselves.

I think a big part of this guy's act was simply knowing he's difficult to replace, and taking advantage of that. Add to that the fact that the company owner is a softie, and it kills him to cut a guy loose. In that respect he keeps the shop small and is loathe to hire.



HARRY304E said:


> He's a slacker and should be fired on the spot in front of the men, for maximum embarrassment, guys like that do not belong in any trade.
> 
> I've got plenty of tolerance for slow workers, as long as their work is really good, they are cool with me, but anyone who tells others to slow down because he does not want to work hard at his job should be fired without notice .


 Everyone already knows his act, hence the layoff. He's already an embarrassment in front of the men, hence the requests to not be partnered with him. And he's not a slow worker, he's a loafer, is easily distracted by anything other than the job at hand. The big problem in our line of work is dependability is crucial. If you don't show up at work today, others will have to step up and do your job. It's also a logistics nightmare when you're late and don't call, because already alternate plans between who is going where and with what trucks and what material and laying the job out to someone else have to be made. 



CADPoint said:


> Why Wait Till Friday?


 Don't know, that's not my call.



Going_Commando said:


> Can you expand on that bold part?


 No.



macmikeman said:


> I'm a loner. And this type of thread is the reason I have been happy for decades working by myself. And guess what? The jobs always finish on time when I said they would.


 That's great Mac, but you do realize there are types of work that require more people or larger crews. For what we do, if only a couple of components are missing or something is left out it usually requires the entire crew to address a very expensive "punch list." And oftentimes, lane closures (which require planning and permits) and flagmen, arrowboards, etc. It's not easy to keep all your ducks in a row when one of the cylinders isn't firing. 


FrunkSlammer said:


> At least he didn't work himself out of a job.. that's the real threat to union guys! :laughing:


 Well, the sad thing is that he WAS vetted before reporting to work day 1. He did have a good track record. I've come to learn it was more due to something political than actual performance. 



hardworkingstiff said:


> Seriously, why did you keep him this long?


 He started out great, really put his best foot forward. Slowly all the "flaws" and "issues" began rearing their ugly heads little by little. At this point he doesn't even say sorry or excuse himself when he's late, and doesn't gripe when docked. 


Spunk#7 said:


> BA's buddy?


 Not in the least. I don't think he has a buddy.



htneighbors said:


> I don't see why it's a "fact that it will be difficult to replace him." Seriously?


 Seriously. Fact is, there's probably about 10 guys in our local with our certifications and qualifications who can pass background checks. The only solution right now is not to replace him at all, but do without him. We'll groom someone else. The thing is, there's no calls for manpower of our sort, so when he does get sent out it'll be a more common call, so he'll be in a position where he's easily replaceable. Maybe that'll straighten him out.


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## Big John (May 23, 2010)

IslandGuy said:


> ...He started out great, really put his best foot forward. Slowly all the "flaws" and "issues" began rearing their ugly heads little by little. At this point he doesn't even say sorry or excuse himself when he's late, and doesn't gripe when docked....


I agree it's possible he's legitimately gaming the system because he thinks chits gold, but that attitude is also familiar in guys whose drinking has started getting the better of them.


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## Chrisibew440 (Sep 13, 2013)

FrunkSlammer said:


> At least he didn't work himself out of a job.. that's the real threat to union guys! :laughing:


Heeeere we go! Plug man.


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## dawgs (Dec 1, 2007)

IslandGuy said:


> He won't be told unless HE presses the issue. He's going to get ROWd, and the boss will wait about a month to put a call in for manpower, though his certifications won't be specified. He doesn't really have to be told, if he doesn't know his attendance alone is cause for layoff, that's his problem. I know he's already aware a couple of specific guys refuse to work with him.
> 
> If he calls me at home after the layoff, which he probably will, I'll tell him specifically. If he doesn't, I know just who to leak that information to so he does get the message.
> 
> ...


I would look outside the hall for what you need. Then bring him into the local when you find the right guy.


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## union347sparky (Feb 29, 2012)

ponyboy said:


> How do guys like that even top out? I've said it before and I'll say it again- I'm very hopeful that the statewide license and REQUIRED apprenticeship in Iowa will scare off the losers and weed out the idiots. Hopeful.


I have no idea how these two made it out of high school let alone pass our code test. No matter what we do there will always be a few that slip through.


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## kg7879 (Feb 3, 2014)

I have never had to put a liner in my hard hat. The company has the hard hat ready to go when i take the call. Thank god because I know the sign of intelligence is whether I can figure that out.


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## jefferyb_2 (Nov 11, 2013)

ponyboy said:


> How do guys like that even top out? I've said it before and I'll say it again- I'm very hopeful that the statewide license and REQUIRED apprenticeship in Iowa will scare off the losers and weed out the idiots. Hopeful.


 The bad thing is that Iowa is issuing the "Unclassified" license to people who can't pass the test and travelers so it's not going to weed anyone out.


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## sparky402 (Oct 15, 2013)

jefferyb_2 said:


> The bad thing is that Iowa is issuing the "Unclassified" license to people who can't pass the test and travelers so it's not going to weed anyone out.


I live in omaha and had a job to do just outside council bluffs city limits. I have my EC for council bluffs but the state of iowa said i needed to start as an apprentice to get my state card. They wouldnt recognize that ive had my EC in council bluffs,which is in iowa by the way, for the last 4 years and had my JW before that. I said im not trying to recip all i want to do is take the test but they insisted im still a beginner.


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## electricmanscott (Feb 11, 2010)

ponyboy said:


> How do guys like that even top out? I've said it before and I'll say it again- I'm very hopeful that the statewide license and REQUIRED apprenticeship in Iowa will scare off the losers and weed out the idiots. Hopeful.



Being un a state with strict licensing and education requirements I can say it won't unfortunately.


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## ponyboy (Nov 18, 2012)

jefferyb_2 said:


> The bad thing is that Iowa is issuing the "Unclassified" license to people who can't pass the test and travelers so it's not going to weed anyone out.


I'm aware of this and as far as I know "unclassified" means you can't work unsupervised


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## retiredsparktech (Mar 8, 2011)

Big John said:


> It's tough getting people. We hired a guy on a probationary status who had all the right credentials on paper. Needless to say when he accidentally took the ruler out of my combination square and spent 20 minutes trying to put it back together before giving up, it really made me wonder about the value of those credentials.


Those are the kind that make great engineers. Not mechanically inclined at all.


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## bkmichael65 (Mar 25, 2013)

ponyboy said:


> How do guys like that even top out? I've said it before and I'll say it again- I'm very hopeful that the statewide license and REQUIRED apprenticeship in Iowa will scare off the losers and weed out the idiots. Hopeful.


Apprenticeships and licensing has never weeded out the losers and idiots. Electrical licensing exams, for the most part, just verify that you know how to look up something in a book. I think they need to have a simulator for testing where you can get electrocuted, blown up or burn a building down when you do something wrong


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## jefferyb_2 (Nov 11, 2013)

ponyboy said:


> I'm aware of this and as far as I know "unclassified" means you can't work unsupervised



I believe you're correct but who is policing this? There aren't enough inspectors to visit every job site. I've only been on 1 job where a state inspector came and checked licenses, and the only city inspector that's checked licenses on jobs I've been on is Davenport.


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## pete87 (Oct 22, 2012)

ISLAND GUY

We got this guy about a year ago. For about 2/5ths of what our shop does requires 2 special certifications and a CDL license with air brake endorsement, and the ability to drive stick. He has all that. For 2/5ths more, you need at least the CDL, and the remaining 1/5 anybody can do.



It is great getting a CDL to fill a need . I have a Class A & air brakes . But i think he forgot the Golden Rule .

If you do not make the EC money , How the Hell can he pay you ?






Pete


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## Big John (May 23, 2010)

retiredsparktech said:


> Those are the kind that make great engineers. Not mechanically inclined at all.


 :lol: He actually was an EE. Unfortunately, he applied for a field position, so mechanical aptitude is a necessity.


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## ponyboy (Nov 18, 2012)

jefferyb_2 said:


> I believe you're correct but who is policing this? There aren't enough inspectors to visit every job site. I've only been on 1 job where a state inspector came and checked licenses, and the only city inspector that's checked licenses on jobs I've been on is Davenport.


I think they got rid of a lot of state inspectors and are down to I want to say 5 now. So yeah it's hard to see everything and they only inspect county jobs, city inspectors do the rest. Both our state inspector and our city inspector are pretty good about asking for licenses from what I hear


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## mainejakes (Mar 28, 2014)

htneighbors said:


> I don't see why it's a "fact that it will be difficult to replace him." Seriously?
> 
> I DO know it's a fact this type of union worker (in all trades) has been on the project I'm on. That's part of the reason it went from $3 to $15 billion and took about 6 years total! Had I been in charge here, I would have fired about 95% of the workers on this job. Looking so forward to leave here the end of the month! Came up here initially for a 6-8 month job and I've been here 18 months!
> 
> Before I get blasted - I'm not picking on union workers, this job just happens to be a union job. I've been all over on different projects and I've seen both good and bad in union and non-union.


then dont say its a union worker, say its a worker. nonunion guys can be and often times are worse than union guys.

theres a certain sort of sterotype about private tradesmen and their little scams.


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## LGLS (Nov 10, 2007)

pete87 said:


> It is great getting a CDL to fill a need . I have a Class A & air brakes . But i think he forgot the Golden Rule .
> 
> If you do not make the EC money , How the Hell can he pay you ?
> Pete


 In this case, the engine still runs and gets you to where you're going even though one of the cylinders isn't firing.


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## CADPoint (Jul 5, 2007)

Well, do tell how it all went down!

 :001_huh: :jester: 

:whistling2:

:thumbup:


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## sparky970 (Mar 19, 2008)

IslandGuy said:


> He won't be told unless HE presses the issue. He's going to get ROWd, and the boss will wait about a month to put a call in for manpower, though his certifications won't be specified. He doesn't really have to be told, if he doesn't know his attendance alone is cause for layoff, that's his problem. I know he's already aware a couple of specific guys refuse to work with him.
> 
> If he calls me at home after the layoff, which he probably will, I'll tell him specifically. If he doesn't, I know just who to leak that information to so he does get the message.
> 
> ...


With all that being said. Did anybody ever tell him what was expected? We've found that without letting employees know exactly what is expected, they will never meet expectations. We have put together a list of specifics that we give to new hires, spelling out quality, production, safety, housekeeping, and customer interaction. Some of it sounds ridiculous, but needs to be pointed out.


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## ampman66 (Dec 5, 2012)

CADPoint said:


> Well, do tell how it all went down!
> 
> :001_huh: :jester:
> 
> ...


 Yeah... Inquiring minds want to know....


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## htneighbors (Jan 23, 2009)

mainejakes said:


> then dont say its a union worker, say its a worker. nonunion guys can be and often times are worse than union guys. theres a certain sort of sterotype about private tradesmen and their little scams.


1. This is a thread in Union Topics
2. Just stating the facts.


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## eejack (Jul 14, 2012)

htneighbors said:


> 1. This is a thread in Union Topics
> 2. Just stating the facts.


Well that is just like your opinion dude. :laughing:


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## Spunk#7 (Nov 30, 2012)

Most contractors in this business subscribe to "The use em' and lose em' method. Being punctual,working hard,keeping up to date technically has no effect on longevity. We all know the kind of help they keep and why!


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## LGLS (Nov 10, 2007)

CADPoint said:


> Well, do tell how it all went down!
> 
> :001_huh: :jester:
> 
> ...


 After it happens I will. From my conversation with the owner and the stunts he pulled this week I (my bad) assumed Friday was his last day, but it didn't happen.


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## LGLS (Nov 10, 2007)

sparky970 said:


> With all that being said. Did anybody ever tell him what was expected? We've found that without letting employees know exactly what is expected, they will never meet expectations. We have put together a list of specifics that we give to new hires, spelling out quality, production, safety, housekeeping, and customer interaction. Some of it sounds ridiculous, but needs to be pointed out.


Nah- this guy has been around the block and he knows the drill. He knows if the job at hand is 1/2 done and it's fast approaching "regular" quitting time that we all have to stay until completion. It will be at that point when he brings up a doctor's appointment, or has to pick up his kid, or whatever the excuse is to dodge his obligation to the career in favor of whatever the excuse du jour is to not work. 

We spent Friday cleaning up a punch list of items HE left out when first installed by him while I was out on furlough. I was fit to be tied because some of the stupidest, simplest things were left out and it took 3 of us all day to address- totally wasted time. I mentioned at the end of the day "well, there's $4500.00 in labor down the drain." His response was "The object of the game is to make some of their money, our money." My partner, knowing me and knowing how I felt that day and how I feel about chit like that immediately distracted me and told him "we're done here for today, head back to the shop." Then we pressed on without him to finish up. 

I thought he's get his walking papers when he got back but he didn't


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## CADPoint (Jul 5, 2007)

Monday it technically a safer day to get fired for everyone.

The departed doesn't get to build up steam all weekend.

The departed faces a new week and will on average go and seek another dance.

They'll have their tools in their automobile and they can go roll
on to the next yahoo.

Unrelated, my present boss has a free hand on hiring and firing, where picking up a new person Monday. So he let his Boss know yesterday, that Boss response;
"The new guy's not going to try to take over the department is he!"...

I've worked with too many good bosses that would have never let something like this happen.

Sorry to read about the pain.... been there, lived that, and got lots of tee-shirts...


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## LGLS (Nov 10, 2007)

CADPoint said:


> Sorry to read about the pain.... been there, lived that, and got lots of tee-shirts...


Well, I'll let you know when it's all overwith. If I had at LEAST a T shirt that would be SOMETHING, but for now... nothing. I don't know about how other guys feel, but facing a guy every day knowing his days are numbered and acting like everything is same-o same-o kinda reeks havoc on my psyche... I don't know if it's depression or anxiety or what it is, but it's something.


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## mr hands (Sep 15, 2013)

IslandGuy said:


> Union environment or not, never allow others with nefarious intents drag you down to their level.


The dude has no "nefarious intent."

He knows well what we all know... Without us, the Bossman can't do the job. And number two, there will always be either work, or no work, so make it last a little longer.

You sound so proud to be up eye to eye with the bossman's paunch. Good for you buddy. That taste takes a long time to wash out of your mouth.


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## mr hands (Sep 15, 2013)

sparky970 said:


> I have gotten 2 great guys, but we had to poach them from other contractors.


Like it is difficult to 'poach' rockets from a commercial sweat shop.


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## captkirk (Nov 21, 2007)

mr hands said:


> The dude has no "nefarious intent."
> 
> He knows well what we all know... Without us, the Bossman can't do the job. And number two, there will always be either work, or no work, so make it last a little longer.
> 
> You sound so proud to be up eye to eye with the bossman's paunch. Good for you buddy. That taste takes a long time to wash out of your mouth.


Thats why guys like you ride the bench...union or non loosers sit.


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## mr hands (Sep 15, 2013)

bkmichael65 said:


> Apprenticeships and licensing has never weeded out the losers and idiots.


Says a man in FLORIDA.

When we get your kind up here, they end up doing odd jobs off craigslist. Ever seen a florida electrician squeeze out a linear mile of vulkem? That hardiplank looked real ugly.


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## MTW (Aug 28, 2013)

mr hands said:


> Says a man in FLORIDA.
> 
> When we get your kind up here, they end up doing odd jobs off craigslist. Ever seen a florida electrician squeeze out a linear mile of vulkem? That hardiplank looked real ugly.


Miller is back. :whistling2:


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## mr hands (Sep 15, 2013)

captkirk said:


> Thats why guys like you ride the bench...union or non loosers sit.


I sit when I want to. Which is pretty often. I'm pretty capable when I want to be. Muah hah hah haaaaaaa


Isn't it fabulous?? All these boomers retiring?? The contractors will have to let me work it my way if they want to get it done at all. There is going to be so much work, because the oldtimers leaving a vacuum, and the young guys are too damn dumb to figure it out. It's okay, they can carry me. And when my attitude is completely downloaded into the youths, they will only work for real foremen. Not these rocket suckpump company men, they will milk it as long as possible under them.


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## sparky970 (Mar 19, 2008)

mr hands said:


> Like it is difficult to 'poach' rockets from a commercial sweat shop.


 
Both industrial. One guy from a 100man non union shop and the other was a foreman at a 300 man union shop.


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## ponyboy (Nov 18, 2012)

sparky970 said:


> Both industrial. One guy from a 100man non union shop and the other was a foreman at a 300 man union shop.


 If you grab a guy from a non union shop and he's damn good what scale does he get? Is he ce/cw?


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## htneighbors (Jan 23, 2009)

eejack said:


> Well that is just like your opinion dude. :laughing:


Butthurt? My opinion aside, you obviously can't handle the facts! 
You must have been a traveler on this project! :whistling2:


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## captkirk (Nov 21, 2007)

mr hands said:


> I sit when I want to. Which is pretty often. I'm pretty capable when I want to be. Muah hah hah haaaaaaa
> 
> 
> Isn't it fabulous?? All these boomers retiring?? The contractors will have to let me work it my way if they want to get it done at all. There is going to be so much work, because the oldtimers leaving a vacuum, and the young guys are too damn dumb to figure it out. It's okay, they can carry me. And when my attitude is completely downloaded into the youths, they will only work for real foremen. Not these rocket suckpump company men, they will milk it as long as possible under them.


troll alert... looser living in his moms basement looking at ****.... :laughing:


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## halfamp (Jul 16, 2012)

mr hands said:


> I sit when I want to. Which is pretty often. I'm pretty capable when I want to be. Muah hah hah haaaaaaa
> 
> 
> Isn't it fabulous?? All these boomers retiring?? The contractors will have to let me work it my way if they want to get it done at all. There is going to be so much work, because the oldtimers leaving a vacuum, and the young guys are too damn dumb to figure it out. It's okay, they can carry me. And when my attitude is completely downloaded into the youths, they will only work for real foremen. Not these rocket suckpump company men, they will milk it as long as possible under them.


There's plenty of younger guys with a clue who don't have your crappy attitude. With that attitude you'll be bouncing around until no one in your local will hire you any more


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## sparky970 (Mar 19, 2008)

ponyboy said:


> If you grab a guy from a non union shop and he's damn good what scale does he get? Is he ce/cw?


JW scale, he's licensed. He worked for our competitor at the same site I'm at. There are 3 or 4 more guys that would like to jump ship too?


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## sparky970 (Mar 19, 2008)

mr hands said:


> I sit when I want to. Which is pretty often. I'm pretty capable when I want to be. Muah hah hah haaaaaaa
> 
> 
> Isn't it fabulous?? All these boomers retiring?? The contractors will have to let me work it my way if they want to get it done at all. There is going to be so much work, because the oldtimers leaving a vacuum, and the young guys are too damn dumb to figure it out. It's okay, they can carry me. And when my attitude is completely downloaded into the youths, they will only work for real foremen. Not these rocket suckpump company men, they will milk it as long as possible under them.


Didn't you say before that you were out at Intel? That's probably the only place that would put up with your crap. You'd never make it elsewhere.


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## eejack (Jul 14, 2012)

htneighbors said:


> Butthurt? My opinion aside, you obviously can't handle the facts!
> You must have been a traveler on this project! :whistling2:


I always like chatting with you 'english as a second language' folks.


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## MTW (Aug 28, 2013)

captkirk said:


> troll alert... looser living in his moms basement looking at ****.... :laughing:


He's just Miller_elex reincarnated.


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## bkmichael65 (Mar 25, 2013)

mr hands said:


> Says a man in FLORIDA.
> 
> When we get your kind up here, they end up doing odd jobs off craigslist. Ever seen a florida electrician squeeze out a linear mile of vulkem? That hardiplank looked real ugly.


What a coincidence, we were just talking about losers and idiots and here you are!


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## cwsims84 (Jan 21, 2012)

sparky970 said:


> Didn't you say before that you were out at Intel? That's probably the only place that would put up with your crap. You'd never make it elsewhere.


Intel is the only reason half the guys in 48 have jobs... Having worked with a bunch of the turds who have milked Intel their whole careers, they would never make it at real Jobsites and most don't when they take a call elsewhere, or they just simply dont take calls for anything but intel. its a shame to see some of the turds that hide behind our union!


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## mr hands (Sep 15, 2013)

cwsims84 said:


> Intel is the only reason half the guys in 48 have jobs... Having worked with a bunch of the turds who have milked Intel their whole careers, they would never make it at real Jobsites and most don't when they take a call elsewhere, or they just simply dont take calls for anything but intel. its a shame to see some of the turds that hide behind our union!


I take assume the 84 in your moniker means that you were born in 1984.

Now wipe the placenta off your head, junior, and get back to work, the bossman needs you to stay on task, put your nose to the grindstone, and keep moving forward.

Just wait until you finally learn, you are nothing but a number. How long you've been with a shop, is just another number. A metric. You're nobody to the office once you do something they frown upon. Maybe you get sick and miss work, and lose production. Well now you are a POS. Lol.

Even the junior foreman who got promoted the second he turns out, who been with the same shop his whole apprenticeship, even he's just a number. You're nobody unless you're spawned from the same come drop. Understand yet?


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## MTW (Aug 28, 2013)

Yup, definitely miller.


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## lefleuron (May 22, 2010)

Mr. Hands is correct on this boys.

In as absolute honesty as the internet allows, I was the top guy at a shop for 4 and 1/2 years, and I was blamed for a mistake made by my boss- and was let go.

He bald faced lied, but got to keep his job. I was out.

A year later I came to understand he took a 15K cut in pay the same week I was fired.

They needed to lay blame squarely on someone, and that was me. They let him buy his way out.

You really are just a number in any shop larger than the population of Hooterville.


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## mr hands (Sep 15, 2013)

Hooterville population is 2.

Its a popular destination for motorboating.


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## LGLS (Nov 10, 2007)

Well guys, sorry it took this long but the guy was terminated about 3 weeks ago. And for much of these past 3 weeks, myself and others have had to go over a lot of this guy's work performing punch lists that seem longer than the original scope.

From another thread about nonfunctional apprentices:


Big John said:


> Someone who needs their hand held is dead-weight, and I can only hope firing them opens their eyes.


 I hope so too John. But a journeyman with decades experience has to have eyes on him at all times, or can't be trusted to complete simple 1-man tasks on his own and actually lies about work done that wasn't, I have to figure something is going on that I can't see because he really does have a stellar reputation.

One guy in the shop told me he thinks the guy is on drugs. He said he always excuses himself to a restroom sometimes 2-3x a day, and then within an hour, he can detect a physical change in the guy. All I can say is it's speculation. I never thought the guy was on drugs but sometimes I overlook the obvious.


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## mr hands (Sep 15, 2013)

Drugs, coke, drunks, who knows???

It could be an attempt to undermine your contractor.

You never know what's going on... until long after it happened.

People here are cokers, on adderralls, meth, prescription narcotics, all kinds of funky sh1t. The most obvious are the drunks though. Some smell like it in the morning. The worst still reek of booze at lunch.

If this guys effs up so bad that your contractor get's fired, on a big industrial site, that can mean just about everybody's job gets flushed back to the hall. Remember, the ec is who pays you. Unless the owner of the ec is a raging prick, or the manpower supt is a little hitler, then you're obligated to protect the EC. Don't let some douche call you a bruther4ucker, other than that, let them get themselves fired, don't help the process and be labeled a snitch, not worth it. There is a limited amount of work, and attrition will get rid of the non-performers.


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## retiredsparktech (Mar 8, 2011)

sparky970 said:


> Didn't you say before that you were out at Intel? That's probably the only place that would put up with your crap. You'd never make it elsewhere.


Gentlemen: Please enlighten me!
Is INTEL an agency for hiring non-union electricians? It sounds like they're not very selective!


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## JourneymansGF (Jan 24, 2013)

Why is it that hard workers, that do a good job tend to catch slack from the guys relaxing, spending too much time writing on the walls of the porto (or reading the walls of the porto!!) or just flat out stand around?? I like going to work, doing my job, shooting the sh*t while we bust the work day out, then go home... I hate those few guys that yell at me for doing my job & doing it right! On more than 1 job I was plucked off a different job & brought to another just to get a job that should've been done months ago done in a few weeks time because of the guys slacking off to prolong it... & being I've been laid off, I get their fear of the job ending... But in the long run the company or Foreman is gonna get tired of being looked at or blamed for why his job is taking months to finish over the deadline... If its slow & right that's 1 thing... But to be going at a snails pace just to prolong the job... Do you think that's right to do to the guy who employed you to do a certain job?? There are exceptions, but I'm done having guys come at me over what they're not doing... You know??


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