# Notching for romex



## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

Works for me.


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## bobbarker (Aug 6, 2015)

Will a right angle drill be able to get the job done? 
Cali is pretty tough in its building codes so I really think you need to get an answer from someone in that particular state about what they say about notching. I can do that where I am BUT I am not in Cali which is notorious for having tougher building codes because of the earthquakes there so a lot of standard practices allowed most places in the country might be illegal there


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## 3xdad (Jan 25, 2011)

Its fine with nail plates, but get ya one of these. i abuse mine and a quick sharpen with a rat tail and it's good to go. Had it for years.

https://www.kleintools.com/catalog/flex-bit-augers/flex-bit-auger-916-x-54-14-mm-x-1372-mm


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## Monkeyboy (Jul 28, 2012)

Definitely hurts the structural integrity.


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## besc (May 16, 2010)

No more than drilling a 3/4 hole in the middle of it.


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## Forge Boyz (Nov 7, 2014)

besc said:


> No more than drilling a 3/4 hole in the middle of it.


Actually it might. Check out the instructions for drilling holes I engineered lumber sometime. They get very specific about what you can and cannot do.


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## backstay (Feb 3, 2011)

I use flex bits, about 5 to 6 ft long and sizes from 3/4 to 1 in. I can drill all my top plate holes while standing on the floor, plus the narrow spaced wall stud bays.


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

Monkeyboy said:


> Definitely hurts the structural integrity.


In a stud?




Forge Boyz said:


> Actually it might. Check out the instructions for drilling holes I engineered lumber sometime. They get very specific about what you can and cannot do.


_
Engineered _studs?


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## Monkeyboy (Jul 28, 2012)

In any structural member, all penetrations should be as close to the center as possible. Edge cutting destroys a great deal of stability; solid or engineered.


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## bobbarker (Aug 6, 2015)

Some info on notching wood joists and wall studs for light frame residential construction
https://engineering.purdue.edu/~jliu/courses/CE479/extras/Notching_&_Boring_Guide_A11.pdf


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## telsa (May 22, 2015)

bobbarker said:


> Will a right angle drill be able to get the job done?
> Cali is pretty tough in its building codes so I really think you need to get an answer from someone in that particular state about what they say about notching. I can do that where I am BUT I am not in Cali which is notorious for having tougher building codes because of the earthquakes there so a lot of standard practices allowed most places in the country might be illegal there



California to earth: the number of nails in that stud sandwich is not to be believed.

Notching is THE way to go. Just don't scalp too deep. I use a depth limited portable panel saw with a carbide blade. (DeWalt oldie)

The idea is to just take out enough to let the Romex by. Then tuck the Romex back away from the surface.

Then nail plates all the way across. A single _shallow _pass with a DeWalt power plane -- for the perfectionists out there -- lets the nail plates drop into relief. 

Any attempt at drilling through the center will take you hours per attempt.


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## Forge Boyz (Nov 7, 2014)

480sparky said:


> In a stud?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I thought of how it sounded after I posted. I wasn't implying that engineered studs were being used. My point was more the principal of structural integrity that engineered lumber follows


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## Big John (May 23, 2010)

There are a lot of rules about where you can safely drill or notch a type of support. 

But until someone shows me otherwise, I'm gonna say ain't no way a 3/8" notch compromises anything.


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

I'm surprised no one has suggested going up through the top plate and over, or down through the basement and back up.


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## Bootss (Dec 30, 2011)

http://api.viglink.com/api/click?fo...www.kleintools.com/catalog/f...4-mm-x-1372-mm


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## emtnut (Mar 1, 2015)

The only structural integrity issues I've heard of are in the joists, keeping the holes near the edges.

I use a foot long spade bit ... you can drill through 2x4's like butter (even 6 of em), and a lot faster !:thumbsup:


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## papaotis (Jun 8, 2013)

i think that wall studs can be drilled up to 2/3. that what the plumbers do! sometimes more.


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## telsa (May 22, 2015)

Monkeyboy said:


> Definitely hurts the structural integrity.


You don't get 'it.'

California building standards mean that where you would see doubled 2x4 we have SIX(6) 2x6. --> becoming a 12 x 6.

Now do you see ?

It's apples and oranges between the Midwest and California.


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## telsa (May 22, 2015)

emtnut said:


> The only structural integrity issues I've heard of are in the joists, keeping the holes near the edges.
> 
> I use a foot long spade bit ... you can drill through 2x4's like butter (even 6 of em), and a lot faster !:thumbsup:


You don't get 'it.' 

There simply NO END of nails -- big nails -- everywhere up and down with no point open for a drill bit -- EVER. 

The result is a sandwich of six 2x6 studs so tightly nailed that it becomes a 12 x 6.

Now you might understand the OP.

As far as roughing-in, we're on a different planet out here.


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## Bootss (Dec 30, 2011)

3xdad said:


> Its fine with nail plates, but get ya one of these. i abuse mine and a quick sharpen with a rat tail and it's good to go. Had it for years.
> 
> https://www.kleintools.com/catalog/flex-bit-augers/flex-bit-auger-916-x-54-14-mm-x-1372-mm


You have an image or picture of that tool? I can't access that link.


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## emtnut (Mar 1, 2015)

telsa said:


> You don't get 'it.'
> 
> There simply NO END of nails -- big nails -- everywhere up and down with no point open for a drill bit -- EVER.
> 
> ...


Didn't think the nails were a problem, just the 2x6

re-reading, I think it's just in a tight space, can't fit the drill bit into.

Just use a flex bit !


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## JohnDeere (Nov 10, 2015)

480sparky said:


> I'm surprised no one has suggested going up through the top plate and over, or down through the basement and back up.



With 6 studs it might be under a window. 


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## backstay (Feb 3, 2011)

Lep said:


> You have an image or picture of that tool? I can't access that link.


How's this?


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## 3xdad (Jan 25, 2011)

Lep said:


> You have an image or picture of that tool? I can't access that link.














backstay said:


> How's this?


In my experience, the style on the far left out performs the more elongated single flute (greenlee) style.


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## emtnut (Mar 1, 2015)

3xdad said:


> In my experience, the style on the far left out performs the more elongated single flute (greenlee) style.



Agreed, once it bites in, your good to go. Mine is just a spade end, will have to look into one of those :thumbsup:


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

JohnDeere said:


> With 6 studs it might be under a window.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


And?


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## emtnut (Mar 1, 2015)

480sparky said:


> And?


How is it you manage to say so much with so little :blink: ?


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## backstay (Feb 3, 2011)

3xdad said:


> In my experience, the style on the far left out performs the more elongated single flute (greenlee) style.


That is also what I buy.


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

emtnut said:


> How is it you manage to say so much with so little:blink: ?


It's a gift.


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## telsa (May 22, 2015)

I took the OP to be describing the classic need to set a receptacle below a window.

I must be alone.


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## JohnDeere (Nov 10, 2015)

480sparky said:


> And?



How do you come down from the top plate to hit an outlet under a window genius. 


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## Southeast Power (Jan 18, 2009)

I was driving for a supply house back in the 70s and delivered to a very large trac house project.
They had a guy that only did the notching. and, he used a chainsaw to notch the face of the studs.
Now, everything here is metal studs but Im sure chain saw guy is long gone.


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## emtnut (Mar 1, 2015)

telsa said:


> I took the OP to be describing the classic need to set a receptacle below a window.
> 
> I must be alone.


No worries Telsa .... If indeed, It's lonely at the top. Who cares, It's lonely at the bottom too

hahaha .... Goddo quote :thumbup:


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## emtnut (Mar 1, 2015)

jrannis said:


> I was driving for a supply house back in the 70s and delivered to a very large trac house project.
> They had a guy that only did the notching. and, he used a chainsaw to notch the face of the studs.
> Now, everything here is metal studs but Im sure chain saw guy is long gone.


Wild how many chain saws I've heard around new construction !

Chain Saw Carpenters :no:


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## Monkeyboy (Jul 28, 2012)

emtnut said:


> Wild how many chain saws I've heard around new construction ! Chain Saw Carpenters :no:


We're just trying to stimulate the Mexican economy.


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

JohnDeere said:


> How do you come down from the top plate to hit an outlet under a window genius.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk



Um.... perhaps you need to learn to read. The OP only asked how to drill through 6 studs. _Nothing_ was said about having to do so to get to a recep under the window.

That said, what about going down and around?

Plan B: Adjust the layout of the receps so one under the window isn't required. It may add one to the total, but that's not the end of the world.


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## JohnDeere (Nov 10, 2015)

480sparky said:


> Um.... perhaps you need to learn to read. The OP only asked how to drill through 6 studs. _Nothing_ was said about having to do so to get to a recep under the window.
> 
> That said, what about going down and around?
> 
> Plan B: Adjust the layout of the receps so one under the window isn't required. It may add one to the total, but that's not the end of the world.



Maybe it's a slab. Maybe there's no attic. Maybe you shouldn't be so condescending to a new member. Maybe this is all make believe. 


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## emtnut (Mar 1, 2015)

JohnDeere said:


> How do you come down from the top plate to hit an outlet under a window genius.
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


Mebbe if you left out the genius part, your answer would have been with more respect :thumbsup:


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## sbrn33 (Mar 15, 2007)

JohnDeere said:


> Maybe it's a slab. Maybe there's no attic. Maybe you shouldn't be so condescending to a new member. Maybe this is all make believe.
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


And you were not condescending?


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## backstay (Feb 3, 2011)

Hey now! Make nice!


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## JohnDeere (Nov 10, 2015)

Seriously, screw you guys. Seriously. I'm telling cricket. Seriously. 


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## emtnut (Mar 1, 2015)

:vs_smirk:


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## telsa (May 22, 2015)

480sparky said:


> Um.... perhaps you need to learn to read. The OP only asked how to drill through 6 studs. _Nothing_ was said about having to do so to get to a recep under the window.
> 
> That said, what about going down and around?
> 
> Plan B: Adjust the layout of the receps so one under the window isn't required. It may add one to the total, but that's not the end of the world.


OP:
My nec book is at my work and the shop is locked. Anyone have any issues with inspectors when there is* 6 studs nailed together* and you* can't get your drill inside the cavity* so you make a *3/8 deep notch for the romex,* staple it then nail guard it. Seems like a no brainer but never done it. Mike. Oh*. I'm in California*. 


The OP hails from California.

Six studs across is the standard for a 'window package.'

The 'cavity' = the stud bay gap he has to work within should he attempt to drill.

The 'notching' = he's at the roughing-in stage such that notching is plain and simple.

The other location with lots of wood, a door opening, never involves drilling through six studs nailed together.

The six studs = window framing ( commercial )

Romex is permitted in low-rise commercial or complex residential builds in _some_ jurisdictions in California. 

&&&

Hence, I jumped to some conclusions.

My bad. 

I didn't see how 'notching' and drilling into old work jibed.

BTW, receptacles/ outlets under a window are typically required because a heat pump condenser/ evaporator is to be located right in front of it. It's a 'California thing.'


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

telsa said:


> .............BTW, receptacles/ outlets under a window are typically required because a heat pump condenser/ evaporator is to be located right in front of it. It's a 'California thing.'



Every window? :blink:


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## telsa (May 22, 2015)

480sparky said:


> Every window? :blink:


You'd be surprised.

In this case, only one window might need the recept/ outlet.

All windows get the 'seismic package.'


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## gryczewskip (Oct 27, 2015)

besc said:


> My nec book is at my work and the shop is locked. Anyone have any issues with inspectors when there is 6 studs nailed together and you can't get your drill inside the cavity so you make a 3/8 deep notch for the romex, staple it then nail guard it. Seems like a no brainer but never done it. Mike. Oh. I'm in California.


Can't you drill up an over,or down and up.

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## gryczewskip (Oct 27, 2015)

emtnut said:


> The only structural integrity issues I've heard of are in the joists, keeping the holes near the edges.
> 
> I use a foot long spade bit ... you can drill through 2x4's like butter (even 6 of em), and a lot faster !


Holes near the edge removes the integrity. 

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## telsa (May 22, 2015)

gryczewskip said:


> Can't you drill up an over,or down and up.
> 
> Sent from my E6782 using Tapatalk


There's only one location in California rough framing that is six studs thick: the bottom of a window package -- two are cripple studs.

The assembly, in conjunction with the OSB, is designed to resist side to side distortion, and the occasional thumping up and down.

That's why it's so absurdly thick. :thumbsup:


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## JohnDeere (Nov 10, 2015)

480sparky said:


> Every window? :blink:



Maybe. We're not there so we surely couldn't say for sure


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## Bootss (Dec 30, 2011)

I guess it's not a good idea to ask somebody else (carpenter, supervisor,etc.) if one is not really sure how to route the cable.

(or will that show that you're a dumbass bastard)some of this crap is hard to visualize in your head sometimes
:laughing::laughing:


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## emtnut (Mar 1, 2015)

gryczewskip said:


> Holes near the edge removes the integrity.
> 
> Sent from my E6782 using Tapatalk


I think we're talking 2 different things ... I mean length wise on a joist


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