# Guy wire on service



## Johnnyp (Aug 7, 2019)

Starting to do a lot more residential now and wonder how you guys are doing your guy wires to the roof. I haven’t done a service that needed one but know it’s coming. Is there a kit your buying or just building from materials bought at hardware store,Lowe’s,hd etc... biggest question how are you attaching lag hook to shingles or metal room and weatherproofing the penetration? Thanks


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## 99cents (Aug 20, 2012)

Depends on where you are, what the code says and what the utility requirements are.

This is typical in my area. No mention of a guy wire. Distance between the roof and the POA depends on conduit size.


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## Johnnyp (Aug 7, 2019)

In my area I typically see just a 1/4” or 1/8 cable hit near the point of attachment on the ridgid then back some feet mounted to the roof.


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## 99cents (Aug 20, 2012)

Guy wire kits are made by guys like T & B. Personally, I would avoid it if possible, especially with metal roofing. If your rules say you can get to your desired height with larger conduit, that’s what I would do.

If I used the kit, I would toss the lag and put a bolt through a solid framing member.


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## Cow (Jan 16, 2008)

99cents said:


> Guy wire kits are made by guys like T & B. Personally, I would avoid it if possible, especially with metal roofing. If your rules say you can get to your desired height with larger conduit, that’s what I would do.


I agree.

I've only had to use a guy wire kit once, because we had to shoot the mast way up due to the low roof pitch. I wasn't a fan of running a couple big lags down through a perfectly waterproof roof.

I know I wouldn't like them going through my roof.


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## 99cents (Aug 20, 2012)

Cow said:


> I agree.
> 
> I've only had to use a guy wire kit once, because we had to shoot the mast way up due to the low roof pitch. I wasn't a fan of running a couple big lags down through a perfectly waterproof roof.
> 
> I know I wouldn't like them going through my roof.


The only time I thought I might need one, I got permission from the utility to break their own rules to move the service to a different location with a higher roof line.


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## macmikeman (Jan 23, 2007)

Poco minimum here is 2" even for a hundred amp drop. I follow along cause the poco is the ruler. And the last overhead I did they wanted a guy wire even though the mast did not exceed 36" above the roof line. Those guys at the poco would make great overlords. They should put them in charge of social distancing for Corona virus.


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## Mobius87 (May 20, 2019)

Like others have said, it depends on where you are. Where I am it is the same as what 99cents posted. There are no cut and dry rules regarding exceeding those distances, just that the AHJ has to deem it acceptable. Here that seems to mean 2" rigid steel with no joints above the last mast clamp before the roofline, and a guy wire attached to structure opposite of the line tension.

I don't bother with a guy kit, as they're too expensive. Technically I suppose I probably should though, to maintain the whole CSA assembly rating thing.

I've always just used a threaded eye bolt with a flat shoulder, bolted through the roof structure wherever feasible. A large washer and copious amounts of Blackjack roof tar if I have to go through the shingles/metal roof. 1/8" aircraft cable (1700lbs break), aluminum crush sleeves, and a turnbuckle complete the deal. Usually costs <$20 at the local hardware vs several hundred for a kit.


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## macmikeman (Jan 23, 2007)

Nowadays we have to actually do two guy wires at 45 degrees from each other on the backside opposing the drop. When I started out in the trade we used to just take a measurement from the weather head to the spot where the eye hook would be installed and double that amount plus a foot or two using solid #6 bare copper wire for twisting around the other. Then install it from the mast thru the eyelete and back up to the weatherhead again and secure it by the twisting around the other part of the same wire run . Next we put a long screwdriver between the two halves of the copper wire and hand turned it until the two halves of the wire were neatly spun around each other like twisted pair cable only prettier. Each turn shortened the wire some , so in the end the wire became very taut and held the masthead very firmly and nice. But that isn't allowed any longer, even though it was better looking and actually better all the way around. Now we have to run stainless steel cable to the eyelet and cinch it tight using those things I can't recall the name of right at the moment (64.5 yrs old....) that my old boat used to have to hold the shrouds and stays tight...... damn I hate getting senile. Ah, Turnbuckle, it just hit me out of nowhere........:smile:


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## 99cents (Aug 20, 2012)

Mobius87 said:


> Like others have said, it depends on where you are. Where I am it is the same as what 99cents posted. There are no cut and dry rules regarding exceeding those distances, just that the AHJ has to deem it acceptable. Here that seems to mean 2" rigid steel with no joints above the last mast clamp before the roofline, and a guy wire attached to structure opposite of the line tension.
> 
> I don't bother with a guy kit, as they're too expensive. Technically I suppose I probably should though, to maintain the whole CSA assembly rating thing.
> 
> I've always just used a threaded eye bolt with a flat shoulder, bolted through the roof structure wherever feasible. A large washer and copious amounts of Blackjack roof tar if I have to go through the shingles/metal roof. 1/8" aircraft cable (1700lbs break), aluminum crush sleeves, and a turnbuckle complete the deal. Usually costs <$20 at the local hardware vs several hundred for a kit.


Yeah, I can buy a T & B 2 1/2” “mast” from a box store at a horrendous price but nowhere is there a rule saying how high I can go with it.


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## Mobius87 (May 20, 2019)

99cents said:


> Yeah, I can buy a T & B 2 1/2” “mast” from a box store at a horrendous price but nowhere is there a rule saying how high I can go with it.


Wait, did you say it was 450mm max for 1 1/4", or 4500mm?

Nothing like getting called to this abortion at 1630 on a Friday... 9' above the roofline.









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## 99cents (Aug 20, 2012)

Mobius87 said:


> Wait, did you say it was 450mm max for 1 1/4", or 4500mm?
> 
> Nothing like getting called to this abortion at 1630 on a Friday... 9' above the roofline.
> 
> ...


I don’t know why they didn’t call me back to fix it. There’s no such thing as customer loyalty anymore.


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## Mobius87 (May 20, 2019)

99cents said:


> I don’t know why they didn’t call me back to fix it. There’s no such thing as customer loyalty anymore.


Ya, people are dogs... no wait, dogs are loyal too. Hmmm.


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## VELOCI3 (Aug 15, 2019)

Mobius87 said:


> Wait, did you say it was 450mm max for 1 1/4", or 4500mm?
> 
> Nothing like getting called to this abortion at 1630 on a Friday... 9' above the roofline.
> 
> ...



Should’ve been a pole mtd drop


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## Mobius87 (May 20, 2019)

VELOCI3 said:


> Should’ve been a pole mtd drop
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


Ya, that's what I'm quoting them now to repair it

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## VELOCI3 (Aug 15, 2019)

I hate overhead wires from the utility all over the place. Makes neighborhoods look ugly etc. 


We do wiring like that but we call it temporary. 


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## CMP (Oct 30, 2019)

Sometimes the best way to learn is by observing others, and see what not to do.
This guy tie was was installed after the fact, attaching it to the local lighting box.


The lesson here is, install the mast extension and coupling on the lower end, instead of an afterthought on the top end.


In the previous photo, the coupling at the gutter line, will soon look like this one.


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## MHElectric (Oct 14, 2011)

CMP said:


> Sometimes the best way to learn is by observing others, and see what not to do.
> This guy tie was was installed after the fact, attaching it to the local lighting box.
> 
> 
> ...


First of all, I completely agree with your statement of learning by observing what others have done. This was how I was able to get a handle on residential work after don't nothing but commercial construction. 

Secondly, in regards to your pictures, I do not like it when the short end of a rigid mast is on top. But I had to do it on the side of a printing shop a couple years ago. I still eyeball it every time I drive by. 

I think it'll be fine.


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## CMP (Oct 30, 2019)

And here is the amount of drop that they expected those coupling threads to support. With only one strap at the drip edge, pretty ludicrous. It was still energized as well, a quick hack to get-er-done.


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## macmikeman (Jan 23, 2007)

I finally understand now , what a block head looks like........


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