# Sticky  So you want to become an apprentice in Canada...



## 99cents

Tis should be a sticky under the Apprentice section!


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## Black Dog

Vintage Sounds said:


> Vintage Sounds
> 
> To be continued


 @Vintage Sounds


Good man------:thumbup:

I will push for a sticky on this----Good work


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## Dennis Alwon

Done........


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## AK_sparky

I like it! It will be nice to link to this in those generic "how do I become a 'lectrician?" posts.

One correction: Apprenticeships in ON are handled by OCOT now, not MTCU for compulsory trades.


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## flinnagin

What an awesome resource. Keep it up


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## metalpats

in quebec it's a lot harder, yhere is basically three way to became a journeyman
1-do a DEP in electricity, it's a community college thing that last a 2 year, and then pray to find someone who will hire an apprentice
2- have a contractor sign you for 150h and then wait for the job pool to open , wich it never open for any trade
3- do 8000h in less than 5 years at one contractor, if you wish to work for someone else and you do , or your shop close out, you need to restart at zero


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## Vintage Sounds

metalpats said:


> in quebec it's a lot harder, yhere is basically three way to became a journeyman
> 1-do a DEP in electricity, it's a community college thing that last a 2 year, and then pray to find someone who will hire an apprentice
> 2- have a contractor sign you for 150h and then wait for the job pool to open , wich it never open for any trade
> 3- do 8000h in less than 5 years at one contractor, if you wish to work for someone else and you do , or your shop close out, you need to restart at zero


Wow, that sucks, but thanks for the information. I think when I get a chance to do my next update here I'll create a separate section for Quebec because obviously the process is different there.


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## metalpats

Vintage Sounds said:


> Wow, that sucks, but thanks for the information. I think when I get a chance to do my next update here I'll create a separate section for Quebec because obviously the process is different there.


i would add that there is no apprenticeship for non union electrician working in theatre and that being an electrician for the show business suck way more than anything i've said the rest of this trade here

that what happen when you let a right wing government enter a parliament that have been on the left side for 30 years, you end up with the worse of both


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## metalpats

Vintage Sounds said:


> Wow, that sucks, but thanks for the information. I think when I get a chance to do my next update here I'll create a separate section for Quebec because obviously the process is different there.


the best way to do it in quebec is to do the DEP then get an apprenticeship elsewhere in canada, and since all your schooling is done you can challenge the canadian red seal in the first or second year, do 6500h and get back to quebec, then wait 6 month and challenge the journeyman exam


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## wcord

ST. JOHN'S, N.L. -- Apprentices will find it easier to move between the provinces and territories while they are doing their training under an agreement signed by the premiers on Thursday.
Premier Paul Davis of Newfoundland and Labrador says the agreement, which takes effect in January, will help Canada build an educated and skilled workforce.
Nova Scotia has been among the provinces pushing for the changes, which it says will recognize the technical training and relevant hours that are needed by an apprentice to complete their training regardless of where it is done in the country.
Students who graduate from pre-apprenticeship training programs will also get full recognition.
Nova Scotia Premier Stephen McNeil says the agreement will help employers find the skilled workers they need and make it easier for people who have left the province to begin an apprenticeship program elsewhere and want to return home to complete their training.




Hopefully the powers that be, keep a high level of standards for passing.


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## CMart

*Can't Find Work*

I'm posting this on behalf of my wonderful boyfriend who is in camp for the next eight weeks, doing a job he has hated the last 4 years. However, he is hardworking and does not like to remain idle.

He has just finished his Foundations and Level 1 Electrical training, thinking that this was the right path for him. We are starting to have our doubts now. It's been drilled into our heads during high school that you either go to college, or get a trade. 

For the life of him, he cannot find a job. I have sent off over 20 resumes in British Columbia alone, and now I'm starting to apply in Alberta (Since he is in camp now, I have taken this on.) He has called local companies 4 hours in each direction, who are probably about ready to file for a restraining order by now. They probably sit in their office and say, oh it's him again, calling... The poor smuck.

I work for an airline, who steadily books for electrical companies, and I even asked one of them if they ever hire apprentices. They said rarely.

I hear all about this skilled workers shortage and yadah yadah, but I don't see anybody sweating over it. Is there something productive he could be doing while he awaits these elusive opportunities? Or any advice at all?

Thanks!


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## Ink&Brass

CMart said:


> I'm posting this on behalf of my wonderful boyfriend who is in camp for the next eight weeks, doing a job he has hated the last 4 years. However, he is hardworking and does not like to remain idle.
> 
> He has just finished his Foundations and Level 1 Electrical training, thinking that this was the right path for him. We are starting to have our doubts now. It's been drilled into our heads during high school that you either go to college, or get a trade.
> 
> For the life of him, he cannot find a job. I have sent off over 20 resumes in British Columbia alone, and now I'm starting to apply in Alberta (Since he is in camp now, I have taken this on.) He has called local companies 4 hours in each direction, who are probably about ready to file for a restraining order by now. They probably sit in their office and say, oh it's him again, calling... The poor smuck.
> 
> I work for an airline, who steadily books for electrical companies, and I even asked one of them if they ever hire apprentices. They said rarely.
> 
> I hear all about this skilled workers shortage and yadah yadah, but I don't see anybody sweating over it. Is there something productive he could be doing while he awaits these elusive opportunities? Or any advice at all?
> 
> Thanks!


It's tricky out there right now. A lot of guys who have spent their whole apprenticeships exclusively doing heavy industrial and/or oilfield electrical are having a hard time even getting an interview because they lack commerical/resi experience, which in AB seems to be where all the work is currently. Being green seems even rougher.


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## CMart

Yeah, and Alberta is the last place we want to be. Other than Saskatchewan where he is drilling now. Ick!

I will keep on trying to find these opportunities. But I feel like he missed the boat. We blew through our savings while he was off for 5 months in school and I ended up gaining 4 jobs working 80 hours to cover the bill too. 

This decision to go this path has driven me almost mad, but I feel more sorry for him. He really enjoyed school and he's smart and hardworking. But well keep our heads up and hope something comes along soon. A mine just got approved in kitimat I think. Maybe they'll have SOMETHING for him.

Thanks


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## willian.yyc

My 2 cents ...
I took the pre-employment program and I got a job right after finishing school.
From my experience the pre-employment program does NOT help to get a job. You'll be seen as a green person, but it helps a lot after getting a job because it's a lot easier to learn when you have already some basic knowledge, and you can also challenge the 1st year apprenticeship when you finish the program (at least in Alberta).
I had a list of all the electrical companies where I live, and I used to go to at least 1 company every morning at 6:30am to introduce myself and give them my resume. I'm an introvert so I hated doing that but I did anyway.
As a first year apprentice, you won't find a job just sending resumes online. You have to put yourself out there. I know a guy who got a job after visiting the same electrical company 6 times ... Seriously!
But getting a job is just 50% of the challenge, you also need to survive in the trade. 
As a first year apprentice you'll work a lot and you won't make a lot of money. You must be a quick learner, nobody will hold your hand and explain the same thing 10 times. You'll also encounter some ***holes journeyman and apprentices.

It can be a lot of fun if you really like the trade but certainly it's not for everyone.


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## Dshervank

I'm trying hard to become an apprentice and doing everything I can, I'm enrolling into pre apprenticeship training and in the mean time applying to any job postings cold calling places and showing up to places and dropping off resumes. 

I've also been taking advantage of some free online training/educational resources such as youtube and others my question is this what topics am I best off to study which will best prepare me? I want to study up on topics which will best help. 

Also if anyone has any other advice or reccomend any further steps I should be taken I'd greatly appreciate it. 

Thank you.


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## Coresel

I've finished my pre apprenticeship with a 3.8 GPA, 2 years ago. And still looking for a company to hire me. I must of sent out over 500 applications with no reply. 

Any advice?


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## AK_sparky

Coresel said:


> I've finished my pre apprenticeship with a 3.8 GPA, 2 years ago. And still looking for a company to hire me. I must of sent out over 500 applications with no reply.
> 
> Any advice?


500 applications and not even a reply? I'd say there's something really wrong with your resume.


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## Coresel

AK_sparky said:


> 500 applications and not even a reply? I'd say there's something really wrong with your resume.


I'll PM you my resume


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## AK_sparky

Coresel said:


> I'll PM you my resume


Feel free to if you want. I don't mind having a quick look over it.

One option some people have done is to volunteer at a Habitat for Humanity build. I haven't done it so YMMV. It could be a good place to network with some of the trades. Bring donuts and coffee and let guys know you are looking for electrical work...Then work your butt off!

You could also try the supply houses. They sometimes hear of stuff from their customers.

Where in Canada are you? I just moved to NL and it's pretty slow here right now.


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## Coresel

PM'd

I'm in Toronto. I've tried everything. I've stood outside electrical suppliers at 6am handing out my resume, I've worked for free for a week to prove myself.

I am highly capable. I've got my own tools/vehicle. I don't know what the problem is. Bad luck?


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## Electrorecycler

Coresel said:


> PM'd
> 
> I'm in Toronto. I've tried everything. I've stood outside electrical suppliers at 6am handing out my resume, I've worked for free for a week to prove myself.
> 
> I am highly capable. I've got my own tools/vehicle. I don't know what the problem is. Bad luck?


 Wow, that's rather strange. It sounds like they don't like green guys in TO. I'm in Barrie and have helped a couple of guys get their foot in the door. One suggestion would be to try and get in with an electrical company as a laborer. It's crappy work, but if you work hard, have a good attitude and learn fast, it usually pays off. I had a guy on my job a few years ago who came in with four guys from labor ready. At the end of the day, he was the only guy left. Three months later I had the boss sign him up as an apprentice.


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## AK_sparky

Coresel said:


> PM'd


I took a look at your resume. It could be cleaned up a bit for "flow", but really it should be fine. I didn't see anything on it that should be a red flag keeping you from getting responses.

I guess keep knocking on doors. Good luck.


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## ELECTRICK2

Dshervank said:


> I'm trying hard to become an apprentice and doing everything I can, I'm enrolling into pre apprenticeship training and in the mean time applying to any job postings cold calling places and showing up to places and dropping off resumes.
> 
> I've also been taking advantage of some free online training/educational resources such as youtube and others my question is this what topics am I best off to study which will best prepare me? I want to study up on topics which will best help.
> 
> Also if anyone has any other advice or reccomend any further steps I should be taken I'd greatly appreciate it.
> 
> Thank you.


First Aid Course from St Johns Ambulance or equivalent
Up to date criminal records check
Drivers abstract
Keep your resume short and include things that would be pertinent to the trade.

In this day, if you have first aid you should at least get a phone call.
Drivers abstract and criminal record check saves employer from having to do it later.


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## spinninwheels

Coresel said:


> I've finished my pre apprenticeship with a 3.8 GPA, 2 years ago. And still looking for a company to hire me. I must of sent out over 500 applications with no reply.
> 
> Any advice?


Though I haven't hired in the electrical field, I have close to 10 yrs. experience hiring people. My only advice would be to *keep it to 1 page*.

Don't cram everything to make it into 1 page.

You may think some things are important to include, but it may not relate to the field. 

This may seem difficult, but remember that the person looking at all the resumes may be knee-deep in them.

Don't repeat yourself.

Forget cover letters unless targeting larger companies with an HR department.

Say as much as you can in as few words as possible - brevity is key.

Use bold and/or highlighting font to organize sections/heading/etc.

Show your resume to someone in an HR/hiring position for feedback (doesn't have to be in the electrical field).

What you want, ultimately, is a job.
- the resume gets you noticed/phone call
- the phone call gets you the interview
- the interview gives you the time to fill in the blanks and sell yourself.


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## psgama

I would recommend taking a pre-apprenticeship course. Here in BC, They are quite common. It gives you your first year qualification (minus the hours) and they will generally place you with a company to work with during the pre-apprenticeship program, with a possibility of getting hired on with the company if you're any good and they're in need of apprentices.


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## Mr.Awesome

Sask here,

Don't do pre employment. Your school hours count towards your apprenticeship hours and puts you at a higher pay grade than a green guy who didn't go to school. However, a pre em graduate and a green guy have both never spent a day in the field so some companies don't want to pay you extra when your experience level is no different than a guy they pulled off the street.
Find a company who does larger sites (schools, hospitals). Often when it comes time to put in hundreds of switches and receptacles, the company will hire guys off the street for bare bones pay to do the simple work, then lay most of them off. If you can get on doing monkey work, at least your foot is in the door and maybe you can prove yourself capable enough to not be let go later.
And don't get excited and do something dumb like buy a new truck because "now you're a tradesman". Your job security is low your 1st and 4th year. 1st because you're new and they're feeling you out, 4th because they're monitoring your skill level to see if you're worth a 30% increase in pay when you become a journeyman.
Have no life for only 4 years, focus on your job, and you're set from there.


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## ELECTRICK2

Mr.Awesome said:


> Sask here,
> 
> Don't do pre employment. Your school hours count towards your apprenticeship hours and puts you at a higher pay grade than a green guy who didn't go to school. However, a pre em graduate and a green guy have both never spent a day in the field so some companies don't want to pay you extra when your experience level is no different than a guy they pulled off the street.
> Find a company who does larger sites (schools, hospitals). Often when it comes time to put in hundreds of switches and receptacles, the company will hire guys off the street for bare bones pay to do the simple work, then lay most of them off. If you can get on doing monkey work, at least your foot is in the door and maybe you can prove yourself capable enough to not be let go later.
> And don't get excited and do something dumb like buy a new truck because "now you're a tradesman". Your job security is low your 1st and 4th year. 1st because you're new and they're feeling you out, 4th because they're monitoring your skill level to see if you're worth a 30% increase in pay when you become a journeyman.
> Have no life for only 4 years, focus on your job, and you're set from there.


Great advice, hope it gets read. thread is a month old.
I've made the same mistake many times. Another mistake I make is not paying attention to what page I'm on in the thread. So I post something brilliant and it has nothing to do with where the thread has gone. This is just a heads up from one Canuck to another.


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## psgama

We don't pay our Pre-apprenticeship guys any more than a green guy until after 6 months working with us here in Northern BC.


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## Cory10

Yeah I don't think any pre app's care about being paid a few bucks more an hour, would gladly work for minimum wage just for a chance to prove myself. I know my brother started as a term 2 instead of 1 in the IBEW but I wouldn't expect a private company to do that also. Few greenish guys I know work for 11-12 an hour wiring up 5 million dollar homes just to get some hours and experience.


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## Stan B.

This is how you apply to the IBEW in the Toronto area (although our local has now merged with Barrie and Oshawa). Check this page weekly starting in February or March.

http://www.electricalapprenticeship.ca/apply/construction.html

Oh, and anyone who tells you there is a "shortage" of workers in a field is full of **** and has an agenda. When I applied to the JAC over 10 years ago around 600 people applied that intake and 120 got accepted. Ask anyone who went into law or teaching in Ontario in the last 10 years because of the supposed "shortage" how easy it was to find work after they graduated. You can safely take what the government and media tell you and assume 90% of it is the complete opposite of the truth and it will serve you well in life.

If you're not able to get an apprenticeship in the trade you prefer, consider another trade or at least find a construction job so you have something construction related to put on your resume. Another job you can try to get in the meantime is at an electrical wholesaler (eg. Nedco), you will learn the materials of the trade and you can talk to lots of electrical contractors.


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## maddy8

i m preparing for main c of q exam.
can u pls suggest me good books and give me sample papers,
my mail id : [email protected]
thanks a lot


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## Hey_Kneepads

Stan B. said:


> This is how you apply to the IBEW in the Toronto area (although our local has now merged with Barrie and Oshawa). Check this page weekly starting in February or March.
> 
> http://www.electricalapprenticeship.ca/apply/construction.html
> 
> Oh, and anyone who tells you there is a "shortage" of workers in a field is full of **** and has an agenda. When I applied to the JAC over 10 years ago around 600 people applied that intake and 120 got accepted. Ask anyone who went into law or teaching in Ontario in the last 10 years because of the supposed "shortage" how easy it was to find work after they graduated. You can safely take what the government and media tell you and assume 90% of it is the complete opposite of the truth and it will serve you well in life.
> 
> If you're not able to get an apprenticeship in the trade you prefer, consider another trade or at least find a construction job so you have something construction related to put on your resume. Another job you can try to get in the meantime is at an electrical wholesaler (eg. Nedco), you will learn the materials of the trade and you can talk to lots of electrical contractors.


The worker shortage might affect any trade EXCEPT the electrical one. There's always going to be work, but the industry is SATURATED with electricians. You only need to look up your town's yellow pages to realize that, and that's just the listed companies. The big commercial ones with 100's of guys employed aren't even usually on the YP.

That's not meant to make anyone give up or anything, but simply an explanation why finding an apprenticeship can be so hard. It took me 4 years to land one, and it wasn't until I'd spent those 4 years doing datacom and fire alarm/security/access control and learned as many skills as possibly without getting an actual apprenticeship that I did get one.


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## Drew83

Interesting read;

One thing that I missed, or wasn't covered in the OP's write up was: 

If someone is indentured as an apprentice in say NS, but needs to travel for work. Would the apprenticeship be interprovincial, or would you need to be indentured all over again in the working province, and file all paper work accordingly? 

My understanding of Journeymen/Red seal, is that your journeyman's ticket is provincial or territorial to where you earned it but are then able to write a red seal test which would let you work inter provincially? 

Would seem that the apprenticeship would follow the same suite? 

If this is the case, how often are other provinces willing to take a registered apprentice from one province, and deal with getting him signed on in another?


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## wcord

Drew83 said:


> Interesting read;
> 
> One thing that I missed, or wasn't covered in the OP's write up was:
> 
> If someone is indentured as an apprentice in say NS, but needs to travel for work. Would the apprenticeship be interprovincial, or would you need to be indentured all over again in the working province, and file all paper work accordingly?
> 
> My understanding of Journeymen/Red seal, is that your journeyman's ticket is provincial or territorial to where you earned it but are then able to write a red seal test which would let you work inter provincially?
> 
> Would seem that the apprenticeship would follow the same suite?
> 
> If this is the case, how often are other provinces willing to take a registered apprentice from one province, and deal with getting him signed on in another?


Harmonization Update
In 2013, the Canadian Council of the Directors of Apprenticeship (CCDA) launched its Harmonization Initiative. This initiative aims to substantively align apprenticeship systems across Canada by making training requirements more consistent in the Red Seal trades. Through national consultation with industry and training stakeholders, the initiative seeks consensus for consistency on the Canada-wide use of Red Seal trade names, numbers of levels, and total training hours (both technical training and on-the-job). Finally, using the most recent National Occupational Analyses (NOA’s) or Red Seal Occupational Standards (RSOS’s), industry and training stakeholders provide feedback on the development of a more consistent sequence of training content across the levels of technical training. Harmonization will support mobility of apprentices, an increase in their completion rates and enable employers to access a larger pool of apprentices.

Having completed much of the work for Phase 1, which involved 10 trades, the CCDA most recently launched Phase 2 of the initiative with the next eight trades (see Red Seal website for the list of these trades). Manitoba and local stakeholders have participated in the national consultations for all trades that are designated in the Province.

List of trades for which Manitoba provided or will provide industry and training stakeholder input:
Carpenter
Welder
Ironworker (Generalist)
Mobile Crane Operator
Tower Crane Operator
Heavy Duty Equipment Technician
Agricultural Equipment Technician
Truck and Transport Mechanic
Automotive Service Technician
Construction Electrician
Industrial Electrician
Industrial Mechanic (Millwright)
Plumber
Steamfitter/Pipefitter


Not sure, but I thought that years ago, MB, SK and AB had harmonized the program for electrical apprentices. Never met anyone that moved during their apprenticeship.


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## wcord

Here is more information regarding apprentices etc for the Red Seal Trades in Canada.

http://www.red-seal.ca/about/ccd.1-eng.html


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## MechanicalDVR

Coresel said:


> PM'd
> 
> I'm in Toronto. I've tried everything. I've stood outside electrical suppliers at 6am handing out my resume, I've worked for free for a week to prove myself.
> 
> I am highly capable. I've got my own tools/vehicle. I don't know what the problem is. Bad luck?


Any guy that would have you do that and not actually pay you isn't worth working for. What a special kind of a Dbag!


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## Max C.

Hey everybody,

My name is Max and I am looking to begin my career in the electrical trade. Since the age of six, I have been fascinated with electrical wiring, and have dreamed of becoming an electrician for years now. As a recent high school graduate, I am finally able to bring this dream into reality via apprenticeship.

After lurking here for the last while, I have gained an excellent set of resources for pursuing an the dream - specifically, this thread (thank you Vintage Sounds)! However, upon handing a plethora of résumés to numerous electrical contractors and a local supply house, the consensus is - no pre-apprenticeship course, no apprenticeship.

Back-tracking, I have been volunteering at a local Habitat For Humanity ReStore, putting in over 1200 hours working with light fixtures, ceiling fans, building test equipment, etcetera. I have also worked on various electrical projects around the home, going so far as bending conduit (for practice) and creating a mock sub-panel setup on a plywood board.

With all of this experience, what I am wondering is - how much value would a pre-apprenticeship course *actually* provide? Is it worth "biting the bullet" and taking the course, or can my 1200 hours at the ReStore plus various home projects be counted towards First Year experience?


 I am open to any suggestions you guys may provide  



Thanks,

Max


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## nasali

*I need answers to these questions!!!*

Im filling out a application to have funding to start the training to be an electrician, I have to fill out 3 Interviews for the funding, if i could please get help with this any person in the electrician occupation is welcome, I appreciate it very much. 

Questions are 
1. Contact Name: Occupation: Years:
Company Name, Adresse and Phone

Hours of work(shifts, weekends, ot, availability)

Places of work ( environment, sectors, location accessibility, paperwork/academics, workplace expectations)

physical expectations

occupation health and safety considersations (health risks, workplace risks, long term effects, work/life balance)

what duties can you expect to do as a first or second year apprentice

what kind of skills and qualities do you think someone needs to be successful as in your trade/occupation?

other notes you would like to add:


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## wcord

nasali said:


> Im filling out a application to have funding to start the training to be an electrician, I have to fill out 3 Interviews for the funding, if i could please get help with this any person in the electrician occupation is welcome, I appreciate it very much.
> 
> Questions are
> 1. Contact Name: Occupation: Years:
> Company Name, Adresse and Phone
> 
> Hours of work(shifts, weekends, ot, availability)
> 
> Places of work ( environment, sectors, location accessibility, paperwork/academics, workplace expectations)
> 
> physical expectations
> 
> occupation health and safety considersations (health risks, workplace risks, long term effects, work/life balance)
> 
> what duties can you expect to do as a first or second year apprentice
> 
> what kind of skills and qualities do you think someone needs to be successful as in your trade/occupation?
> 
> other notes you would like to add:


Long read , my apologies for out typing Tesla lol

The type of work a first year electrician apprentice does can be different depending on where they’re working. All electricians have had different experiences during their first year as an apprentice. 

The great thing about being an apprentice is that they aren’t required to know anything about the trade. Apprentices learn the trade over time because the journeyman or foreman will show the apprentice how to do everything.

First Year Apprentice Electrician Duties
Digging trenches for running underground electrical pipe (conduit)
Load / unload equipment and material
Pull wire and install electrical devices (maybe small or large)
Learn how to bend conduit and install it
Get material to help the journeyman complete tasks
Clean up at the end of the day.
The time of year, type of electrical work, and phase of construction will dictate the type of work the apprentice will be doing.

Requirements To Become An Electrician Apprentice
Apprentice Electricians are required to take a certain amount of academic courses each year. The amount varies between each licensing agency; this is usually a Provincial requirement.

Topics of training can include electrical theory, blueprint reading, current Canadian Electrical Code . In some apprenticeships schooling, the apprentices also learn first aid, some PLC programming, control wiring

Specialized training in areas such as welding, communications, or fire alarm systems can lead to acquiring other certifications which increases the apprentices value. These usually are something you obtain once you get your Red Seal

The Golden Rules For All New Apprentices

*Show up to work on time*

It’s quite simple really – if a new hire can’t show up to work on time – they’re gone.

*Have a good attitude*

Attitude plays a big part on how you’re treated and what types of jobs you’ll be involved with.

If you have a poor attitude you’re either going to become a professional ditch digger or standing in the back of the unemployment line – so stay positive.

*Follow instructions *

It’s the apprentice’s job to follow instructions, learn, and do the job right the first time.

*Plan ahead*

When apprentices start learning to plan ahead and prepare the tools / materials for the journeyman it makes a great impression – and improves efficiency on the job.

*Don’t distract your journeyman from their job*

An apprentice’s job is to help the journeyman electrician work faster – wait to ask questions.

*Be prepared to work outside your comfort zone*

You will work in extremely hot or cold conditions, so you will have to learn how to dress.
You will work at heights, on extension ladders, man lifts, scaffolding
You will work in the mud, up to your ass. You could work in a barn, in crap.
You will work in dirty, miserable smelling ( think sewage ) places
You will use muscles you never knew you had.

Tips All First Year Electricians Should Know the following:

It is not your job to know what to do next.

That comes with time and experience. If you don’t know what to do next, or have no job to do, do not feel guilty.

Some people ask the job site foreman for another task or you simply start sweeping. Sweeping is the default, “I’m out of work to do” task that gets the point across without you bothering anyone.

It is your supervisor’s job to delegate work. It is your job to do the work he has delegated.

As long as you are doing the work you have been delegated, you are a successful apprentice, and should not stress.

Starting a new career can be very stressful.

You should find a way to relax when you get home, and not dread coming into work the next day. It may take a month or two.

This does not mean drinking a 12 pack of Schlitz while you eat your TV dinner.

Go to the gym, ride a bike, build a shelf, or even better, read.

Arrive early and stay late for the first week.

Live your job and over commit for a while. This will break you of any desire to “clock out early” or “cut corners”.

You’ll beat it into your head that this is your life now, and you’ll stop trying to be sneaky with the time sheets.

After that you can start scaling back your involvement to a more reasonable level, and focus on doing your 8 and going home.

You might want to try only calling people “sir” when they’re delegating work to you properly.

If a journeyman is acting like an idiot, do the job – but be reserved.

If they’re good with delegating work and teaching stuff when they can, start throwing out “sir’s” like you’re in the military – it helps reinforce that your loyalty is earned.

If a supervisor is being a jerk, be polite.

If he’s yelling at you about not picking up one little piece of trash or he’s just not treating you with respect, be OVERLY polite.

It’s like passive aggressiveness, but it’s less passive.

“I’m sorry about not picking that trash up. It makes both myself and the company look much less professional than we should. Thank you for holding me to the standards this job demands”.

The key is to be genuine with the apology so he knows you’ve learned from your error, but over do it so he has NO REASON to be a **** afterward.

If he keeps acting like an asshole at that point you’re justified in giving it right back to him.

But doing so requires that you actually DO learn from your mistakes and try your hardest not to make them again.



Lunch and break time are HOLY to construction workers.

If you don’t eat lunch, bring carrots or at least a drink to the site so you look like you’re waiting to go back to work – laborers get put off by that.

There’s also a pattern to break time, and it goes like this:

Resting/eating joking for the first 80%, talking about the job you’re doing or will currently do for the last 15% (“So we’re bringing power to this room from this conduit here, right?”), and watching the supervisor for when he stops breaking during the last 5% – this is when the break is over.

Look for the signs of each phase and you’ll never be out of place.

Be around.

Turning into a phantom and disappearing before lunch and ghosting back to work afterwards is a no-no. These stupid acts will get you **** canned faster than Usain Bolt’s 100 meter sprint.

No one likes open-ended problems.

If you present someone with a problem – some factoid that will slow down progress – you should also present them with a possible solution – or a path to finding the solution.

Your supervisors will get all pissy if you stack problems onto their plate and don’t include ways to solve those problems.

If I don’t have a solution for a problem, get one of the other apprentices to bring it up to a manager.

Don’t be a smart ass, but be smart.

If your supervisor asks you to fetch something for him, but he didn’t specify exactly what he wanted, and he’s also the type of person to get pissy when you ask him to be specific – you’re better off just grabbing everything he might possibly have been referring to and presenting them all to him like, “take your pick”.

It gets the point across that he needs to be more informative and also conveying that you’ll do your best with the info you’re given

You will be teased and the brunt of some good natured jokes. ( of course there is always the as##le who doesn't know when to stop)
Weakness is like blood to a shark, so don't show it.
Eventually you will learn how to give and take the ribbing. 


There's more but hopefully this is a good start


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## Vo1com

Hello everyone,

Long time reader, first time posting on the forum. 

I am a graduate from a 2 year electrical engineering course at the local community college. I am trying to find my self an electrical apprenticeship but am having some difficulty finding some to take me on. 

I have tried cold calling and showing up at different electrical companys which are in my area. Ive applied to numerous job postings online and have had no response. Ive had my resume redone professionally by a career center and I've yet to have a call back or a response from any of my applications.

I currently work at a hardware and deal with different electrical contractors and have talked to them about what they require from an apprentice and have been told I have what it takes and to just keep trying.

Anyone have any advise that might help me out?

Thanks! 

Nick


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## XCasper

*Internationally trained...*

Howdy folks,

I've recently immigrated to Saskatchewan from Florida. I now have all my ducks in a row to work legally. I've even been approved by Sask Apprenticeship to sit for the Sask IP exam. Here's the rub: There's a lot of little and not so little differences between standard practices here and Florida. 

Even though they credited me with 10,000hours and say I can challenge the exam today I realized rather quickly, looking at the only practice exam I could find, that i need to do some studying first. The good thing is Sask will let me work for a year if I can find an employer.

Now the reason I'm posting all this gibberish. Does anyone in the Canadian system have any advice on study guides, sources of practice exams, etc? Most of y'all wouldn't need to ask this because you attended the schools but I did not.

Thanks for your time.


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## MechanicalDVR

Vo1com said:


> Hello everyone,
> 
> Long time reader, first time posting on the forum.
> 
> I am a graduate from a 2 year electrical engineering course at the local community college. I am trying to find my self an electrical apprenticeship but am having some difficulty finding some to take me on.
> 
> I have tried cold calling and showing up at different electrical companys which are in my area. Ive applied to numerous job postings online and have had no response. Ive had my resume redone professionally by a career center and I've yet to have a call back or a response from any of my applications.
> 
> I currently work at a hardware and deal with different electrical contractors and have talked to them about what they require from an apprentice and have been told I have what it takes and to just keep trying.
> 
> Anyone have any advise that might help me out?
> 
> Thanks!
> 
> Nick


First off welcome aboard!

Secondly have you gone to supply houses in your area and asked if they know any ECs hiring? 

Maybe put a post on their bulletin board if they have one.


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## MechanicalDVR

XCasper said:


> Howdy folks,
> 
> I've recently immigrated to Saskatchewan from Florida. I now have all my ducks in a row to work legally. I've even been approved by Sask Apprenticeship to sit for the Sask IP exam. Here's the rub: There's a lot of little and not so little differences between standard practices here and Florida.
> 
> Even though they credited me with 10,000hours and say I can challenge the exam today I realized rather quickly, looking at the only practice exam I could find, that i need to do some studying first. The good thing is Sask will let me work for a year if I can find an employer.
> 
> Now the reason I'm posting all this gibberish. Does anyone in the Canadian system have any advice on study guides, sources of practice exams, etc? Most of y'all wouldn't need to ask this because you attended the schools but I did not.
> 
> Thanks for your time.


Better off starting a new thread on this.


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## LaurentBricoleur

Canada is a great place to become apprentice !


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## LaurentBricoleur

Suit of the message, sorry for double message :

I become apprentice on Canada when I was 19 YO such as électricien and I keep a good memory of this time.
I vouch !


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## MechanicalDVR

LaurentBricoleur said:


> Suit of the message, sorry for double message :
> 
> I become apprentice on Canada when I was 19 YO such as électricien and I keep a good memory of this time.
> I vouch !


When did you move on to France?


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## LaurentBricoleur

I move from Canada to France since 10 years. The two country are good my friend !


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## MechanicalDVR

LaurentBricoleur said:


> I move from Canada to France since 10 years. The two country are good my friend !


Which one do you prefer?


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## LaurentBricoleur

For work, I prefer Canada because people are more sympatic in Canada. But I've got my family in France, I'm connected to France


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## MechanicalDVR

LaurentBricoleur said:


> For work, I prefer Canada because people are more sympatic in Canada. But I've got my family in France, I'm connected to France


Ahh, say no more.:thumbsup:


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## stevenmichael

SO.. first time poster, i just received my red seal in the mail two days ago and i a, very happy. for me the whole program wasn't too bad if you have time. i was indentured back in 2007 and had all the hope in the world of being an electrician, then life happened. got married , built a house, work work work, let my apprenticeship license expire all but gave up on my dream. started doing construction primarily with my father and was making ends meat. then one day i got a call from my apprenticeship officer asking where the hell i was! then he threatened to toss my hours in the garbage so i signed up for two blocks to keep him happy. once i was there and seen how good i was doing on my exams i decided ti go further since i had enough hours to go up to block 3. towards the end of block 3 i received an email from apprenticeship stating that they reduced the hours to 7200 and with the hours credited i was able to go on and write my exam....and passed. in all it took me 8 months in school but hey! now im certified red seal and i was able to take it all at the local nscc college i just wish i was younger, would keep going on to other things..


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## Chachi

All, 

I have a question regarding the Electrical Techniques certificate program offered at Ontario colleges. It is an 8 month training program (theory and hands experience). Please note that I realize there is an extra cost involved with this certificate program. And I hope this discussion thread does no go in discussion of the financial aspect of the Electrical Techniques certificate. Instead I wanted to know the qualitative experience and knowledge gained from this program. The reason is that I some construction experience, and I noted that some carpenters or electricians had negative attitude and how badly the young apprentices were treated. As such, I am tempted take the Electrical Techniques program simply to get better experience/knowledge and in the long term it will pay off. My questions are:
- For those that did take the Electrical Techniques, did you find that you were better prepared (experience and knowledge) than compared to an apprentice who took the first block of theoretical training?
- For the electricians who trained the younger ones, do you have any comments on the level of preparation of a person who completed Electrical Techniques VS a person who took the first block of theoretical training?

Thank you very much.


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## AnonYmousElectricalGuy

Vintage Sounds said:


> In this thread I'll attempt to create a reference resource for new guys starting the trade, collecting information, advice and experiences in a single spot. It should reduce the number of repetitive threads posted by new guys, while at the same time giving them all consistent and (hopefully) accurate information.
> 
> While the target audience is Canadian apprentices/hopefuls due to our Red Seal program and relative similarities across the country(and also, that's what I know), I'd like to think a lot of the general information should be applicable to anyone starting out in the electrical trade(s) anywhere. It would be nice if the thread could become a sticky, once it fills out a bit.
> 
> This is of course a work in progress so I'd be happy to hear any feedback/recommendations etc.
> 
> *__*
> 
> A little about me: As of this writing(June 14 2015) I'm a 28 year old fourth year apprentice with six months to go before I start my last trade school session. I started in Ontario, where I did my first block of school at Humber College, after which I moved to Alberta and continued my apprenticeship. In that time I've experienced a variety of different types of work and learned to survive in the trade without necessarily being the "ideal candidate".
> 
> *__
> 
> Intro*
> 
> So anyway, you're thinking about becoming an electrician. Great. Everyone comes into this trade from somewhere, whether you're an 18 years old and just out of high school, somewhere in your 20s burnt out on university or an unskilled job, or someone who is leaving a different career.
> 
> You may have already heard from other people a bunch of things about electrical - or the trades in general - but the reality is that it's an extremely varied field. When I started out I imagined I would mainly be hanging chandeliers for Mrs. Jones. While I did do that, and it is part of our trade, I never imagined at that time that I would later find myself overhauling a 60 year old hydroelectric generator or inside a factory rewiring a machine that carbonates water used in soft drinks. The point here is whatever preconceived ideas you have will most likely *not* reflect what you experience in the field, so don't get hung up on that stuff. Also, there's nothing wrong with hanging a chandelier for Mrs. Jones.
> 
> *Part 1: Starting in the trade
> 
> 
> How do I start?*
> 
> You first get a job with a licensed electrical contractor. Notice I underlined that. You can't just get a job working for "a guy" or your uncle or whatever. The employer must put you on payroll. If you fail to make sure of this you are screwing yourself over and will end up with unrecordable experience that will NOT count towards an apprenticeship.
> 
> *But I have no experience, skills or tools!*
> 
> Of course you don't. We all started somewhere. Whoever hires you will obviously understand that they are hiring a green person who needs to learn everything from scratch. Yes it can take some time to find someone who will hire a zero-experience hand, but if you really want something, you can't expect it to be handed to you.
> 
> *I don't like doing hard work, and I heard electrical work is an easy way to make big bucks.*
> 
> LOL. Nope.
> 
> *I'm not big and strong. Is that going to be a strike against me?*
> 
> I'm not big and strong either, but I'm doing okay. There is room for various shapes and sizes of people because the work is varied. Last year I was on a crew with a guy who was 6'7" and a female apprentice who was 5'0".
> 
> *I'm a woman and I want to get into the trade, but it seems to be male-dominated. *
> 
> Well, it's true that electrical, and construction in general is a male-dominated field, but so what? It's 2015 and you shouldn't let people's preconceptions prevent you from doing a job you like. One of the best journeymen I have ever worked with was actually a journeywoman. I've worked with plenty of female sparkies and if I was to compare the number of good ones to crappy ones, the percentage of good ones is much higher than for men. This is just my experience.
> 
> It's an unfortunate reality that in this day and age sexual harassment is still something that's out there every day. You have to be prepared to stand up for yourself and know your rights.
> 
> *How do I get a job with an electrical contractor?*
> 
> You'll probably have to take a multi-pronged approach. In other words, yeah, look on Kijiji, Craigslist, Indeed, etc online to find people who are hiring. Many people make the mistake of stopping there. You should also look at people who are NOT hiring. Look up electrical contractors in your area and contact them directly. Find their shops and go in person. Bring your resume with you. You need to be persistent and resourceful. Realise that the owner of an electrical contracting company is a busy individual and don't waste their time. You could also go to an electrical supply wholesaler and ask if someone there knows a contractor looking for people. Give them your name and number. Someone might be asking. You could also get a job at a wholesaler as a step into the trade.
> 
> If someone calls you for an interview - and this should be common sense - don't show up looking like an idiot. Wear some decent clean clothes(no lame Metal Mulisha logo t-shirts, but also don't wear a suit), cut your hair, shave, put on a belt...whatever it takes. Use your head.
> 
> *I don't have a resume or my resume is crappy and out of date.*
> 
> If you don't fix this you're going to have a very hard time. There are lots of free online resources for making resumes. No spelling or grammar errors. Later, I'll add some links to resources here.
> 
> *What should I expect to get paid?*
> 
> A first year apprentice normally makes a percentage of what the company is paying its journeymen. It varies by province, but Alberta for example, starts at 50%. You should get a raise each time you move up a level.
> 
> That being said, lots of times, especially with small companies, they will just give you a "take it or leave it" number. It may not be high but it should be above minimum. I don't like this and it's not exactly legal, but at least when I was back in Ontario it seemed like a lot of ECs were getting away with this. Depending on your situation and the job market you may decide to accept this in order to get your foot in the door and gain some experience.
> 
> If you are a union apprentice, the union collective bargaining agreement determines what you will be paid.
> 
> *What happens after getting a job?*
> 
> You need to get yourself registered(in some provinces the preferred term is "indentured") as an apprentice. This means involving a government agency, which will be different in every province and therefore have its own procedures. Generally this involves filling out some forms, meeting some people, and signing a contract of apprenticeship. Sometimes if you have past experience in something similar, they may be willing to give you some credit. This contract is what enables you to do electrical work for your employer. It is otherwise illegal for someone to go and do electrical work somewhere except for their own homes.
> 
> The contract also stipulates that you must finish your apprenticeship and become a journeyman by a specified date or your apprenticeship is null and void. In other words you can't just avoid taking your final exam and be a fourth year forever. By the way, people who do that are losers.
> 
> Also, you *must* become registered/indentured ASAP. Again, rules vary by province, but when I started in Ontario the rule was it had to be within the first three months.
> 
> Alberta: Apprenticeship and Industry Training (AIT)
> British Columbia: Industry Training Authority (IAT)
> Manitoba: Apprenticeship Manitoba
> New Brunswick: Post Secondary Education, Training & Labour (PETL)
> Newfoundland: Department of Advanced Education and Skills
> Nova Scotia: Nova Scotia Apprenticeship Agency
> Ontario: Ministry of Training, Colleges & Apprenticeships
> Northwest Territories: Education, Culture and Employment
> Nunavut: Department of Family Services
> Prince Edward Island: Department of Workforce and Advanced Learning
> Quebec: Emploi Quebec
> Saskatchewan: Saskatchewan Apprenticeship and Trade Certification Commission
> Yukon: Department of Education
> 
> *How long does it take to get through an apprenticeship?*
> 
> Around 4 to 5 years. Every province has a different number of hours you need to complete. Ontario requires 9000, Alberta 6000, Saskatchewan 7200, etc etc. Later I'll post every province's requirement here. In the mean time, I'm sure if you do some research you can find out what applies to you. Apart from just accumulating a bunch of on-the-job hours, you also have to go to trade school 3 to 4 times during your apprenticeship.
> 
> *School?!?! Nobody told me about this, and besides I hate school!*
> 
> Well, suck it up princess. Trade school is a part of the deal. You will have to take 2 to 3 months off work every time. This is your career we're talking about.
> 
> *What's all this stuff about ratios?*
> 
> In the context of apprenticeship, the term ratio refers to the number of journeymen to apprentices allowable by law at a given employer. Each province has different rules on this which means you need to find out what applies to you. For example, Ontario requires 3 journeymen for each apprentice, whereas Alberta allows two apprentices for each journeyman, or in other words 0.5:1. At some point I will list each province and territory's ratio here.
> 
> *Why is ratio important?*
> 
> If your employer is not compliant with the ratio requirement(i.e. too many apprentices and not enough journeymen) it means you can't be registered as an apprentice and therefore your experience and hours won't be recorded. This is a very bad situation to be in. You need to find a new employer immediately because you are otherwise wasting your time. There are no exceptions to this.
> 
> *What about one of those pre-employment programs or "electrical colleges? Will that help me get a job?*
> 
> Maybe, but - I personally don't like the concept. You have to pay them lots of money - as in thousands - to learn a bunch of stuff you'll learn in the trade anyway. Some people come out of these programs thinking they know everything and end up getting a rude awakening once they actually enter the trade.
> 
> Having said that, it seems to be a trend that's spreading. I know and work with a lot of people who have gone through these programs and they seem happy(and more importantly, employed). If you're convinced it'll help you get your foot in the door and you're okay with shelling out that kind of money, go for it. However, look around. Pretty much 99% of electricians out there have made it without these programs.
> 
> *Do I need my own vehicle?*
> 
> Yes. Don't let anyone tell you otherwise. You don't need a truck or anything special. If you're unable to afford much all you should focus on is getting something reliable, cheap to buy, cheap to operate and cheap to insure.
> 
> IMPORTANT: NEVER transport any company tools or materials in your personal vehicle under any circumstances. You don't have the proper insurance coverage for that and if you end up having to make an insurance claim(say, if you had an accident) your insurance company would just _love_ to find out that you were doing something outside the terms of your policy so they can deny you coverage! For that matter I have recently been informed that even transporting your _personal_ tools in your car as you go from site to site constitutes "commercial use" so you need to think about getting commercial insurance, which - yes - costs more. You really need to talk to someone who deals with auto insurance to get an idea of what is required.
> 
> *Part 1A What about being unionised?*
> 
> For the most part unionised electricians in Canada(and also the USA) are represented by the International Brotherhood of Electrical Workers. This union is by far the oldest and largest, and so it has hundreds of locals. You'll have to find the one that is local to you. Depending on the size of the local their apprenticeship system may be almost completely in-house or it may not be any different from non-union.
> 
> There is also the Canadian Union of Skilled Workers(formerly IBEW local 1788) and the Christian Labour Association of Canada.
> 
> *Unions are corrupt scumbag organisations that just serve themselves and are full of lazy people etc etc
> 
> or
> 
> Unions are super amazing and everyone who isn't union is a thankless underpaid rat with inferior skills etc etc *
> 
> We aren't going to get into that here. You should also avoid doing so in real life.
> 
> *How does being in a union work?*
> 
> I don't know about the other unions, so I can only talk about the IBEW here, and I'm going to greatly simplify for the sake of making this easy to read. I'm not union, but I was for a year. If there's anything inaccurate here I'm sure the union guys on this forum can let me know/yell at me.
> 
> The IBEW basically works like a big temp agency. You don't simply walk up to a union electrical shop and hand in your resume to get hired. When a unionised contractor requires electricians, they inform the local union. The local then puts out a call for whatever number of electricians the contractor asked for.
> 
> In the mean time, when union electricians are out of work, they are supposed to sign the out of work list at the local's dispatch office. The expectation is that you sign as soon as you are laid off from wherever you were previously working. This way, when new work becomes available, the guys who have been out of work the longest(top of the list) get first crack at it. If they don't want it, the next person gets a chance. When that job is over, if the contractor doesn't still need you for another job, you get laid off and sign the books. Repeat cycle.
> 
> When you are out of work, and the union doesn't have a job for you to go to, you are expected to NOT go to work for a non-union electrical contractor. In other words, either sit at home, or do a non-electrical job. Some locals allow an exception to this, as long as you inform them first. You should know the rules before you do something like that, or you may get kicked out and blacklisted.
> 
> Apart from that, the union negotiates your pay, benefits and pension on your behalf - which means everyone you work with is paid according to the same agreement. They are supposed to address issues between workers and employers. The local also offers courses you can take to upgrade your skills and qualifications, often at a heavily subsidised rate.
> 
> *How do I get into the IBEW? I heard there is an aptitude test?*
> 
> You'll have to to find out from whatever local you're trying to get into, what their exact procedures and requirements are.
> 
> You might have to do an aptitude test(a bunch of common sense and logic based things, if I remember correctly. Didn't seem like something you could study for) and come in for an interview. If you get through those things, then you will eventually get placed with a contractor and given a start date.
> 
> *Should I go union or non union? Which is better?*
> 
> After more than 100 years of electrical work we still haven't found the answer. You will have to decide for yourself.
> 
> 
> 
> To be continued


I got a job with an electrical contractor as a control tech, after 5 months I asked about my apprenticeship and I was terminated for asking about it. He would send me out to client sites to do electrical installs. Its not enforced, the company claims its not required to go to sites to do electrical installs. I did 3 year Electrical technologist program


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## BleedingLungsMurphy

AnonYmousElectricalGuy said:


> I was terminated for trying to extort my employer by threatening report his business for illegal activity.........unless he indentured me. I wouldn't have cared about the alleged illegal activity if he had indentured me thought, as long as I get what I want I don't actually care about anything else.


You sound like an old man yelling at clouds, son. Are you going to be okay?


----------

