# Question on average rate per hour



## Bkessler (Feb 14, 2007)

I think legit company's are charging anywhere from 65 per man hour and up.


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

It's too regional an issue to give you a price, unless someone here is in your area. Someone may charge $25/hour, another may be $125.


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## waco (Dec 10, 2007)

I charge $25.00 and hour for anything over the first hour. I charge $85.00 for the first hour or any part of the first hour.


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## itsunclebill (Jan 16, 2007)

waco said:


> I charge $25.00 and hour for anything over the first hour. I charge $85.00 for the first hour or any part of the first hour.


So, youre retired and do this for grins, right?

I know common laborers that make over $20.00/hr and they don't have any overhead and get medical and other benes from their employer. How do you pay for all that at $25.00/hr?


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

waco said:


> I charge $25.00 and hour for anything over the first hour. I charge $85.00 for the first hour or any part of the first hour.


Wanna full-time job? 

I'll make a killing paying you 25 clams an hour as contract labor, then I charge my usual $75 an hour.

I five years, I'll be sitting on the beach, sippin' Piña coladas all day.


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## Dano (Sep 3, 2008)

I am in the new mexico area.


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## waco (Dec 10, 2007)

I don't have employees and I don't have helpers and I try not to compete with what I call "on-line" companies. Yes, I'm retired, but that doesn't mean I'm dead.

When I need other trades, I include their cost in the cost to the customer. Mostly carpenters and finishers.

$25.00 an hour isn't bad where I am. The big companies where paying $9.50 an hour just a few years ago.

I hope when you are my age, you'll still be able to do some of this stuff -- and know your limitations as I know mine.

Dano, New Mexico has got to be like West Texas where wages are horrible. I haven't been out there in a very long time, but working people are way down the ladder out there. "Trickle down" in action.


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## waco (Dec 10, 2007)

480sparky said:


> Wanna full-time job?
> 
> I'll make a killing paying you 25 clams an hour as contract labor, then I charge my usual $75 an hour.
> 
> I five years, I'll be sitting on the beach, sippin' Piña coladas all day.


No, I long ago quit working for opportunists. Just have no need for them or their work. That is why I encourage young electricians to always look toward the day they can be on their own.

That said, I charge $85.00 for the first hour or any portion of the first hour. A majority of residential service calls take less than an hour. On bigger jobs, I charge what I said, but it remains my contention that very little of commercial and residential work is worth more than $25.00 an hour.

Let's face it, commercial and residential are highly repetitive work -- meaning, doing the same task over and over again. Industrial isn't, but I stay away from that mess.


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

waco said:


> ..... but it remains my contention that very little of commercial and residential work is worth more than $25.00 an hour.


It's worth what the customer is willing to pay. So if I charge $75 an hour and the customer pays it, then that's what it's worth.


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## John (Jan 22, 2007)

Dano said:


> I am doing a speech in my speech class to inform them how to replace a outlet.
> I was wondering if someone can point me in the direction on where I can find an average rate per hour someone would charge. If there is a web page or something like that will work.
> I am electrician but in the military so it is hard to price it.
> Thanks,
> Dan


Rephrase the question to "How long would take to replace an outlet" and you will get a better answer.
Try doing one and time yourself. Then do the math.:thumbsup:


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## randomkiller (Sep 28, 2007)

waco said:


> I don't have employees and I don't have helpers and I try not to compete with what I call "on-line" companies. Yes, I'm retired, but that doesn't mean I'm dead.
> 
> When I need other trades, I include their cost in the cost to the customer. Mostly carpenters and finishers.
> 
> ...


 
Do you have insurance? Do you pull a permit at $25 and hour?


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## ohmontherange (May 7, 2008)

You are absolutely correct Waco, Wages for skilled labor and trades in West Texas & Eastern New Mexico are very low compared to the national average excluding a few (very few) companies. I occasionally do contract work @ 75.00 hr with a 150.00 minimum plus expenses ( if required).


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## Jono (Aug 28, 2008)

i charge AU$110 for first hour or part thereof, and AU$77 per hour after that. For larger construction/renovation jobs where there are considerably more hours on each job, i charge a flat rate of AU$66 per hour to the builder because of the volume of work.
People in Sydney get charged anywhere from $50 to $90 per hour. I'm aiming for the halfway mark on the hourly rate.


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

Jono said:


> i charge AU$110 for first hour or part thereof, and AU$77 per hour after that. For larger construction/renovation jobs where there are considerably more hours on each job, i charge a flat rate of AU$66 per hour to the builder because of the volume of work.
> People in Sydney get charged anywhere from $50 to $90 per hour. I'm aiming for the halfway mark on the hourly rate.


That works out to roughly $89, 62, 53, 41 and 73 UD$, respectively (at exchange rates at the time of this post).


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## waco (Dec 10, 2007)

I have insurance and I pull permits when required. I just don't need to rip people off to make it.


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## Bkessler (Feb 14, 2007)

Different strokes for different folks. Seriously though I will pay you 26 an hour if you want to move to socal.


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## dowmace (Jan 16, 2008)

I don't do resi on a normal basis, but when I do commercial the first hour for one man is $55 every hour after that is $45 per man. If the job is an industrial normal service call it's going to be $105 per hour plus $75 per additional man required. If it is going to be a technical service call such as motor controls expect me to charge $145 for the control technician I'll send out (normally myself). And of course if it is a PLC trouble call and I have to bring out my laptop expect me to charge $185-$235 depending on the customer, if its a steady customer I'll charge them the lower $185 if it's a new customer and I think it's a going to be a one shot deal $235 all the way.


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

> I have insurance and I pull permits when required. *I just don't need to rip people off to make it*.


You had me till you made this statement, we are not ripping people off, it is a fair price based upon an agreement between contractor and customer. 

My time in training and skills in solving problems others cannot is worth something. In addition I have over 1/2 a million in test equipment then there are the trucks, warehouses and employees. I charge a fair rate for a quality service and the customer understands my rates going into the job.


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## te12co2w (Jun 3, 2007)

I charge 65 for a journeyman and for apprentice it is based on their status. New hires I charge 25 but then I start them at 14.5. There is no way I could cover expenses charging 25 an hour for an electrician. I would pay 24-30 for a journeyman depending on skill level. I think I am still low in this area. Other shops charge starting at 75. I could not even afford a vehicle if I charged 25.
This is a hot spot right now though. Lots of oil and gas money around.


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## waco (Dec 10, 2007)

brian john said:


> You had me till you made this statement, we are not ripping people off, it is a fair price based upon an agreement between contractor and customer.
> 
> My time in training and skills in solving problems others cannot is worth something. In addition I have over 1/2 a million in test equipment then there are the trucks, warehouses and employees. I charge a fair rate for a quality service and the customer understands my rates going into the job.


I don't have a bunch of expensive equipment and trucks and payroll to support, so I don't need to charge like I do have that overhead. I don't have a problem with what others charge for their services. I can only have an effect on what I do.

As for skills, I figure that is why somebody calls us in the first place. There is a huge amount of technique involved in what I do -- far more technique than electricity in most cases.

I suspect I'm doing work you wouldn't even want to fool with -- a certain market niche. I no longer feel I can stay up with guys like you, so I really don't try to compete with you.


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

waco & brian: Let me pose this to you: I looked at a job the other day, and I want you both to look at it as well. A person owned property on both sides of a road. Their house is on one side, and their horse barn is on the other. When they built them, they wired the horse barn to their house for power. Somewhere between them is some 2-2-4 URD.

Recently, they sold the the property with the horse barn, and the new owners needs to get their own service. The POCO has already installed a new transformer. I plan on installing a meter pedistal, and tie right in to the existing wiring that is between the two structures.







 







 







 

Now, let's be honest here. Who is going to be cheaper? waco, at $25/hour, or brian, at, say $100/hour?​ 
I know neither one of you have x-ray vision, so you need to find the existing feed between the house and the barn. waco shows up with a shovel. brian shows up with a shovel _and a locator_.​ 
I can pretty much guarantee brian will be cheaper, because within 5 minutes of pulling up to the job site, he's digging the one small hole he needs to find the existing line between the road and the barn. waco can spend all day digging hither and yon, pokin' and hopin', and _may_ get lucky finding it.​ 
By lunchtime, brians already got the trench dug to the transformer, and the meter pedistal set. waco, you're most likely still making holes.​ 
I'm not saying brian is any better an electrician than waco. It's just that brian has learned the value of having the proper tool for the job. So an 'hourly rate' *really means nothing* in many cases. And at $25/hr, you will never earn enough to purchase the proper tools needed for this type of job.​ 
Many people ask me what my hourly rate is. I respond with, "Which is cheaper... someone who charges $50 an hour and will take 8 hours, or me at $70 an hour, and will take only three hours?"​


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## heel600 (Oct 31, 2007)

480sparky said:


> waco & brian: Let me pose this to you: I looked at a job the other day, and I want you both to look at it as well. A person owned property on both sides of a road. Their house is on one side, and their horse barn is on the other. When they built them, they wired the horse barn to their house for power. Somewhere between them is some 2-2-4 URD.
> 
> Recently, they sold the the property with the horse barn, and the new owners needs to get their own service. The POCO has already installed a new transformer. I plan on installing a meter pedistal, and tie right in to the existing wiring that is between the two structures.
> 
> ...


You're exactly right on that job. But if one were to stick to just adding recessed lights, GFIs, and simple stuff like that, you would need very few specialty tools, bucket truck, trencher, etc.

Different strokes for different folks.


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## waco (Dec 10, 2007)

First, I wouldn't tie into the existing feed. I'd set a temporary near the job site and feed it from the existing PUCO service.

That said, if I did have an issue with a legitimate underground feed, I'd rent a trencher and drop a new feed. What am I going to do with an old feed I've gone to the trouble to uncover?

Not a very good example.

Oh, and I'd charge the customer for the rental and my time to dig the trench and drop a new feed.

Trencher runs maybe $220.00 a day and it will get a lot of trench run in four hours. How much does it cost to maintain your "locator" which you might use twice a year?

And, once you locate it, how will you dig it up? By hand? I rent a small backhoe which does fine and if it is too deep or too hard, I have an operator with his own hoe.

So, some of the cost is sunk (between the two of us) but I'm done and the wire is new and I sleep good.


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

waco said:


> First, I wouldn't tie into the existing feed. I'd set a temporary near the job site and feed it from the existing PUCO service.
> 
> That said, if I did have an issue with a legitimate underground feed, I'd rent a trencher and drop a new feed. What am I going to do with an old feed I've gone to the trouble to uncover?
> 
> ...


 
Why a temporary? What good would it do?


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## waco (Dec 10, 2007)

Well, it would be legal.

So, do you mean to feed the new owners' barn from the old owner's panel or did the utility drop the transformer on top of the existing subservice to the barn and did they dig it up for you?

Are the new owners of that property going to stay with 2-2-4 feed for whatever they decide to put on the property?

Maybe you could give us a better technical description of the work, but I will say this, right up front, I don't use used materials on anybody's job.


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

Waco:

I understand where you are coming from, I guess it is my business sense that says nothing wrong with being on the low end but if the average EC is getting 35.00 why not be 32.00. More money in you pocket and not undercutting the competition or fostering bad blood with the competition about your company. If the competition is 55.00 and your are 53.00 you can work less and make the same wages.


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

waco said:


> Well, it would be legal.
> 
> So, do you mean to feed the new owners' barn from the old owner's panel or did the utility drop the transformer on top of the existing subservice to the barn and did they dig it up for you?
> 
> ...


There's already 2-2-4 running between the house and the barn, and a 100a panel in the barn. I am going to install a 100a meter/main pedestal between that existing 2-2-4 and the new transformer. All I am doing is supplying the barn with a new service, as opposed to the old feeder that's there now.

Existing:












Proposed:










No one is diggin up that 2-2-4 because no one knows where it is. The POCO won't touch it because 1.) it has nothing to do with the utility or service and 2.) it's a private line. That's why I have a locator.... so I don't spend two days digging it up to find it.

I see no reason to retrench all the way to the barn... the wire is in place already. The only reason to replace it is if I find it to be unsuitable once I find it.

If you don't use used material, you'd rewire the entire barn as well?


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## Bkessler (Feb 14, 2007)

Is it possible there is animosity towards waco because there is no possible way for most companies to survive at that labor rate? Nothing personal towards Waco but it does piss me off when I here of people charging so much under the "going rate" because I can't compete with that. ANd I feel it takes my work away. Those feeling are probably unjustified but oh well. I get the same feeling about unlicensed contractors or handymen doing electrical. Waco is doing nothing wrong and there is a million and one ways to accomlish the same task, and they can all be right.


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

Bkessler said:


> Is it possible there is animosity towards waco because there is no possible way for most companies to survive at that labor rate? Nothing personal towards Waco but it does piss me off when I here of people charging so much under the "going rate" because I can't compete with that. ANd I feel it takes my work away. Those feeling are probably unjustified but oh well. I get the same feeling about unlicensed contractors or handymen doing electrical. Waco is doing nothing wrong and there is a million and one ways to accomlish the same task, and they can all be right.


 
I would agree with this 125%


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

I don't have anything against waco either. I'm just trying to point out that 'hourly rate' doesn't mean much in many cases.

Another example:

I charge $75/hour. Joe Sixpack charges $50/hour Who's cheaper?

Your first instinct is to say Joe is. But I mark my material up 25%, and Joe marks his up 100%.


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

I lost a job to a another contractor years ago, his rates were substantially lower than mine.

Now he is in the DC area, had an office, trucks, union employees, secretaries. I could not figure out how he was so cheap, later the customer told me.

I was 42.00 an hour he was 27.00, 8.00 truck charge, 5.00 equipment rental plus 10 and 10 (21%) on top of this. It is just a numbers game sometimes. He never told the customers about the extras.


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## Bkessler (Feb 14, 2007)

No I get it but it is exactly how I feel, a little p/o but not really justifiable. I explain to my customers why I am worth my 125 for the first hour all the time. A lot of service companies have addition charges for example one service company I worked for for only a month because he was a crook, Told customers there was a 45 dollar diagnostic fee that was waived if work was ordered at one hour mininum (85) after signature bill was totaled and a 45 dollar truck/fuel fee was added to every customer so mininum was 130. Customers were told over phone and new to sign waiver right away but were not told of other fee and we were told not to mention it. Any job that took longer or had material the fee was just lost in the total and customers never realized it.


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## 184 (Mar 9, 2008)

I charge $100.00 per hour $150.00 minimum and travel time one way, but I'm in the San Francisco Bay Area where thats a good deal! I'm a one man shop and I want to make $800.00 a day or better. And I am


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## Mountain Electrician (Jan 22, 2007)

Bkessler said:


> Is it possible there is animosity towards waco because there is no possible way for most companies to survive at that labor rate? Nothing personal towards Waco but it does piss me off when I here of people charging so much under the "going rate" because I can't compete with that. ANd I feel it takes my work away. Those feeling are probably unjustified but oh well. I get the same feeling about unlicensed contractors or handymen doing electrical. Waco is doing nothing wrong and there is a million and one ways to accomlish the same task, and they can all be right.



I agree with that statement as well. But I am glad waco doesn't live around here. After labor burden and overhead, I've got anywhere between 25 and 32 dollars in an electrical man-hour before profit.


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## waco (Dec 10, 2007)

As I wrote, I'm retired and I really do try to stay out of the way of "on line" companies. "On line" companies are those with employees who are trying to start families and buy houses and such. That is the illusion I choose and I'm okay with it.

One thing always come to mind, except for emergencies, which aren't that many, electrical work is what we call "elective" or "discretionary" spending and if it becomes too expensive, people don't buy it.

I think my rates are about right for the economics of the area I'm in and the limits I place on the work I accept.

As for the barn, I see the issue as one of a new service, not a barn rewire. I assumed the new owners might be thinking about building a house which is why I would run a temp.

If I had to approach the job meaning to reuse the existing subfeed and if I knew enough to draw a picture of where I thought it was, I'd rent a Terramite and dig across the line where I thought the subfeed was, far enough away from the transformer to "ensure" I could use the wires once I found them.

I have actually used a locator, extensively, but in cases where I had to keep long runs of temporaries up while large apartment complexes were being built. Of course, those were abandoned after the services were up and running.


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## Skyline Electric (Jul 30, 2008)

waco said:


> but it remains my contention that very little of commercial and residential work is worth more than $25.00 an hour.


Each business must charge what they think their time is worth. You realize that that you bring so little to the table that you are only worth beggar's wages and I respect that.


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## Wireless (Jan 22, 2007)

Bkessler said:


> Is it possible there is animosity towards waco because there is no possible way for most companies to survive at that labor rate? Nothing personal towards Waco but it does piss me off when I here of people charging so much under the "going rate" because I can't compete with that. And I feel it takes my work away. Those feeling are probably unjustified but oh well. I get the same feeling about unlicensed contractors or handymen doing electrical. Waco is doing nothing wrong and there is a million and one ways to accomplish the same task, and they can all be right.


One of the problems is Waco makes all legitimate contractors look like rip offs. The customer is only going to compare one licensed electrician to another, they don't think of overhead when comparing $25 to $75 all they hear is one company is trying to charge them $50 over the "going rate".


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## Skyline Electric (Jul 30, 2008)

Let's not forget that the phrase "going rate" is an incomplete and contracted version of the actual phrase: "Going _out of business_ Rate". There are two types of contractors: Successful contractors and unsuccessful contractors. When you compare the pool of successful contractors to the unsuccessful contractors the first thing you notice is that the unsuccessful contractors always price their services at a fraction of their successful peers.

By the way, an electrical contractor who wears a tool belt and works alone would fall into the category of unsuccessful contractors since he cannot charge enough to cover the cost of hiring someone to work for him. If you're a new EC and wearing the tools that's one thing, but if you're still a one man operation after 20 years you would need to re-evaluate your career choices.


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## Jono (Aug 28, 2008)

Skyline Electric said:


> By the way, an electrical contractor who wears a tool belt and works alone would fall into the category of unsuccessful contractors since he cannot charge enough to cover the cost of hiring someone to work for him. If you're a new EC and wearing the tools that's one thing, but if you're still a one man operation after 20 years you would need to re-evaluate your career choices.


Well maybe in your opinion. I think some people prefer less stress and prefer to work for themselves by themselves and don't chase a tonne of work with $$ in their eyes.

This thread has turned to sh!t.


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## Bkessler (Feb 14, 2007)

Every good thread need a punching bag. It's just Waco's turn.


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## MechanicalDVR (Dec 29, 2007)

Skyline Electric said:


> Each business must charge what they think their time is worth. You realize that that you bring so little to the table that you are only worth beggar's wages and I respect that.


 
You dont have to be an ass about it.


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## MechanicalDVR (Dec 29, 2007)

Jono said:


> Well maybe in your opinion. I think some people prefer less stress and prefer to work for themselves by themselves and don't chase a tonne of work with $$ in their eyes.
> 
> This thread has turned to sh!t.


 
I know many guys that are very happy doing enough work to pay their bills and have no plans on getting bigger anytime soon. I met a lawyer today that changed his lifestyle after 9/11, moved to NJ from NY and works out of his house. When I asked him if he missed the big paycheck he said "sometimes but I never miss my kids ballgames anymore". Its all relative to the individual. Maybe Waco is content with his style of business.


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## Skyline Electric (Jul 30, 2008)

MechanicalDVR said:


> You dont have to be an ass about it.


LOL............


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## John (Jan 22, 2007)

Skyline Electric said:


> Let's not forget that the phrase "going rate" is an incomplete and contracted version of the actual phrase: "Going _out of business_ Rate". There are two types of contractors: Successful contractors and unsuccessful contractors. When you compare the pool of successful contractors to the unsuccessful contractors the first thing you notice is that the unsuccessful contractors always price their services at a fraction of their successful peers.
> 
> By the way, an electrical contractor who wears a tool belt and works alone would fall into the category of unsuccessful contractors since he cannot charge enough to cover the cost of hiring someone to work for him. If you're a new EC and wearing the tools that's one thing, but if you're still a one man operation after 20 years you would need to re-evaluate your career choices.


So a contractor that has more people working for him is more successful than someone that has less people working for him. Very interesting business plan. You make it sound like the old pyramid sales scam.:shifty:


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## Skyline Electric (Jul 30, 2008)

John said:


> So a contractor that has more people working for him is more successful than someone that has less people working for him. Very interesting business plan. You make it sound like the old pyramid sales scam.:shifty:


ROFLMAO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :laughing:


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## John (Jan 22, 2007)

Skyline Electric said:


> ROFLMAO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :laughing:


LMFAOIPIMP is more applicable.
View attachment 694


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## waco (Dec 10, 2007)

The problem, as I see it, isn't so much about the prevailing rates in an area, but the amount of product one can get for those rates. Plain fact is, bigger companies are paying for an awful lot of "dead"time, travel being the biggest one. I have yet to find anybody able to address the waste other than simply betting they can get a customer base willing to subsidize their business practices.

There are certainly places where my rates would be far too low. Where I am isn't one of those places.


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## mdcorreia (Mar 31, 2007)

waco said:


> I have insurance and I pull permits when required. I just don't need to rip people off to make it.


Sir, do you know some basic accounting skills? If you just started out on your own, it will take you 3 years to realise you are loosing your shirt! It happed to me 26 years ago - untill I took a BASIC accounting course. 
Many electricians are good mechanics but lack numbers skills.
One very usefull formula which I have notice, for about 30 years, with tons of successfull contractors including myself is: charge EXACTLY double a journeyman's electrician hourly wages for your business. If an electrician makes $23/hr in your area charge $46, if your apprentice or helper requires $12/hr wages, charge $24 for his time etc. Simple math!


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## fungku (Oct 17, 2008)

We charge $70 an hour for journeyman, and $50 for apprentice. No hidden truck costs, or anything.

As far as "going rate" for our area, most electricians charge between $70-85/hour


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## MechanicalDVR (Dec 29, 2007)

fungku said:


> We charge $70 an hour for journeyman, and $50 for apprentice. No hidden truck costs, or anything.
> 
> As far as "going rate" for our area, most electricians charge between $70-85/hour


 
The package (cash & benefits) for a journeyman in my area is @$68.00.


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## christopher (Oct 29, 2008)

Do you all charge a lower rate for your apprentices? If you have a journeyman and an apprentice on the job...both are working seperately....at journeyman skill level?


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## Nodoggie (Oct 17, 2008)

What a bizarre and saddening thread! I do understand that residential rates are lower than other rates. I also understand that times are rough. But based on some of the ridiculously low rates I've heard quoted here, think I've some of you guys trying to get work hanging out in front of the Home Depot! You know?....you're "office": the west side of the parking lot.


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## fungku (Oct 17, 2008)

fungku said:


> We charge $70 an hour for journeyman, and $50 for apprentice. No hidden truck costs, or anything.
> _
> As far as "going rate" for our area, most electricians charge between $70-85/hour_


_
_


MechanicalDVR said:


> The package (cash & benefits) for a journeyman in my area is @$68.00.


Journeyman here usually are paid between $30-35/hour and depending on the company you work for, you may get benefits.


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## robnj772 (Jan 15, 2008)

The question was how much to change an outlet,a resi service call.



MechanicalDVR said:


> The package (cash & benefits) for a journeyman in my area is @$68.00.


Yea for an "A" rated union guy on a big commercial job to get PAID not to CHARGE there is a huge difference.

Someone getting PAID 68 dollars an hour is going to have to be CHARGED out at something like 136 dollars for the contractor to make a profit.Especially with all the extra fees and charges the union gets from your employer.

There is no way that you could be competative changing an outlet charging that.

The "going rate" for a contractor to charge in NJ is between 85-115 an hour.


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## rlc3854 (Dec 30, 2007)

robnj772 said:


> The question was how much to change an outlet,a resi service call.
> 
> Go back to the first post, your statement is not the question. For the guys working for themselves i.e. contractors: everyone needs to charge the amount necessary to provide an income, health benefits, retirement and grow the business. That equates to about twice the hour charge. A lot of areas only pay $12-$15 an hour with no benefits. To some in other parts of the country they wouldn't even get out of bed for that amount. Well in about a year more people will probably get out of bed for a lot less if the work is available. People in California have always made good money and benefits but, they also bought homes that cost $45k to build for $200k and now there worth- can you say-can anybody qualify to buy a foreclosure.


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## robnj772 (Jan 15, 2008)

rlc3854 said:


> robnj772 said:
> 
> 
> > The question was how much to change an outlet,a resi service call.
> ...


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## rlc3854 (Dec 30, 2007)

robnj772 said:


> rlc3854 said:
> 
> 
> > My first post??? Read the thread I only posted once on this topic.
> ...


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## robnj772 (Jan 15, 2008)

rlc3854 said:


> robnj772 said:
> 
> 
> > rlc3854 said:
> ...


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## pyeelectric (Dec 8, 2010)

*Are we charging enough or not enough?*

We serve the Charleston, SC. and surrounding area. We charge 45/hr for a one man job. If it's a 2 man job we charge 55/hr plus material and permits ect.... Work is not steady, and we are barely making it. Do we need to up our prices or what? Any Ideas??? The going price is 65-75/hr.


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## B4T (Feb 10, 2009)

pyeelectric said:


> We serve the Charleston, SC. and surrounding area. We charge 45/hr for a one man job. If it's a 2 man job we charge 55/hr plus material and permits ect.... Work is not steady, and we are barely making it. Do we need to up our prices or what? Any Ideas??? The going price is 65-75/hr.


At $45.00 an hour.. you are not making any money.. might as well part the truck in the back yard and _save money_ that way.. 

Raise your rates or you won't make it..


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## pyeelectric (Dec 8, 2010)

What should we charge than? I am trying to charge than since we are a small contractor? I want our company to be able to make it.


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## B4T (Feb 10, 2009)

I charge $90.00 for a service call and there are guys here charging $60.00 for the same thing..

You need to charge at least $65.00 for one man at the minimum.. 

Also never charge by the hour.. IMO the negative far out weigh the positive points you may come across..


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## electricmanscott (Feb 11, 2010)

Thread from the dead.....

For service work I've been getting $125.00 for the first hour, $89.00 - $98.00 each additional hour depending on where the job is and my mood. One man.


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## B4T (Feb 10, 2009)

electricmanscott said:


> Thread from the dead.....
> 
> For service work I've been getting $125.00 for the first hour, $89.00 - $98.00 each additional hour depending on where the job is and my mood. One man.


Good that your area can support those kind of prices.. many places can't from what I have seen posted on this forum..


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## pyeelectric (Dec 8, 2010)

I would never get any business if I charged that much!! That is way to steep for South Carolina.


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

pyeelectric said:


> I would never get any business if I charged that much!! That is way to steep for South Carolina.


You can very easily get those prices by just giving a grand total price for each job you look at:thumbsup:


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## B4T (Feb 10, 2009)

pyeelectric said:


> I would never get any business if I charged that much!! That is way to steep for South Carolina.


Exactly.. you need to have an idea of the _going rate_ in your area to at least be in the same ballpark.. :thumbsup:


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## pyeelectric (Dec 8, 2010)

The going price is 75-85 dollars per hour.


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## B4T (Feb 10, 2009)

pyeelectric said:


> The going price is 75-85 dollars per hour.


Good.. if you are really slow and need the work then $65.00 is a great place to start..

You can always raise you rates at some other time when your pockets are full..

Good luck.. :thumbsup:


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## pyeelectric (Dec 8, 2010)

Thank you to all who helped me with my question!!


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## Whatevva (May 18, 2011)

I'm at $72 and $110 with a (good)helper. Min 2 hours.


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## macmikeman (Jan 23, 2007)

And I only have to work two days a week to match what your earnings for six days of 10 hours are. 

I'd hit the search button and look for "Flat Rate Pricing" if I were you, and read as much about it as you can. 

In the end its all your choice.


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## benski (Jul 29, 2011)

heel600 said:


> You're exactly right on that job. But if one were to stick to just adding recessed lights, GFIs, and simple stuff like that, you would need very few specialty tools, bucket truck, trencher, etc.
> 
> Different strokes for different folks.



Sounds like a maintenance guy more then an electrician to me:whistling2:


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## benski (Jul 29, 2011)

B4T said:


> Good that your area can support those kind of prices.. many places can't from what I have seen posted on this forum..


Your joking right? You know how many electrical companies are in this country? What you read from members here is probably like 5% of the total amount of electrical companies.

$125 an hour for the first hour for a service call is pretty normal. **** (no pun intended) the Roto Rooter guys charge $150+ to snake a drain that takes 15-20 mins. so electricians can't charge that much??


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## LK1 (May 7, 2011)

benski said:


> Your joking right? You know how many electrical companies are in this country? What you read from members here is probably like 5% of the total amount of electrical companies.
> 
> $125 an hour for the first hour for a service call is pretty normal. **** (no pun intended) the Roto Rooter guys charge $150+ to snake a drain that takes 15-20 mins. so electricians can't charge that much??


Yup, sounds like some are looking at the guys that worked for an hourly pay check and then decided to go in business without understanding the real costs of running a business, many of these guys think they can make a living working a business on an hourly rate , over the past years I saw them come and then saw them go, a comment was made I don't have to cheat to make it, that guy is not going to make it in a business, until he learns so basic accounting and how to cover operating and overhead costs, along with non productive hours and their associated costs. 
As was noted this site has a small percent of the total trade posting and out of that there are guys on here that have their own ideas on how to run a business and may not be making a go of it themselves, but from my view in the area around me the guys that are charging more are able to grow and make a decent living, we have plenty of guys in my area low balling trying to make it, the larger percent of them are like roaches they hang around until their money runs out or their wife leaves with the plumber


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

There are numerous threads about setting rates. 

Do a site search.

You really need to know your cost.
While many will disagree knowing what the “going rate” is helps.


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## benski (Jul 29, 2011)

waco said:


> I charge $25.00 and hour for anything over the first hour. I charge $85.00 for the first hour or any part of the first hour.



$25 an hour?




So if you get called to hang 3 cieling fans that take roughly a half hour per fan you make like $110?:blink:


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## Jlarson (Jun 28, 2009)

I'm probably gonna end up just like Waco when I get old. 

He's not stealing anyone's work cause the work belongs to the client.


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## B4T (Feb 10, 2009)

benski said:


> Your joking right? You know how many electrical companies are in this country? What you read from members here is probably like 5% of the total amount of electrical companies.
> 
> $125 an hour for the first hour for a service call is pretty normal. **** (no pun intended) the Roto Rooter guys charge $150+ to snake a drain that takes 15-20 mins. so electricians can't charge that much??


No Ben.. not joking.. even at $90.00 a service call.. I will only get the guy who doesn't say.. _"Let me talk to my wife and I will get back to you"_

In other words he is calling around looking for the best deal.. I am not it..

Plumbers always make more on service calls that we do.. many posts on this forum why..


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## Jlarson (Jun 28, 2009)

B4T said:


> Plumbers always make more on service calls that we do.. many posts on this forum why..


Fixing an overflowing toilet will aways fetch more money then say bringing a fuse panel up to code.


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## electricmanscott (Feb 11, 2010)

electricmanscott said:


> Thread from the dead.....
> 
> For service work I've been getting $125.00 for the first hour, $89.00 - $98.00 each additional hour depending on where the job is and my mood. One man.





B4T said:


> Good that your area can support those kind of prices.. many places can't from what I have seen posted on this forum..


It's not so much that my area can support my rates, it's the people I am working for. Mostly repeat customers that I've worked for for years. I have always been one of the highest around and still am. In some cases more than double what other guys are charging. It is my reputation that supports my prices and the willingness of my customers to choose me without shopping for the cheapest guy. If they did that I would loose every time.

That said, I do a fair amount of service work for new customers too and they tend to bitch about the cost. I will go right into my "cost of business" speech without hesitation. Most usually get it and say wow I had no idea health insurance cost that much. Some are just ignorant cheapskates and you will never please them.


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## LK1 (May 7, 2011)

electricmanscott said:


> It's not so much that my area can support my rates, it's the people I am working for. Mostly repeat customers that I've worked for for years. I have always been one of the highest around and still am. In some cases more than double what other guys are charging. It is my reputation that supports my prices and the willingness of my customers to choose me without shopping for the cheapest guy. If they did that I would loose every time.
> 
> That said, I do a fair amount of service work for new customers too and they tend to bitch about the cost. I will go right into my "cost of business" speech without hesitation. Most usually get it and say wow I had no idea health insurance cost that much. Some are just ignorant cheapskates and you will never please them.


Many of them work for large companies and have no idea of what it costs to support an employees payroll, and some of the EC's out there depending on a spouses insurance also are dumb to the cost, and don't understand they are working with a false burden from what other EC's need to add to their.costs


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## benski (Jul 29, 2011)

B4T said:


> No Ben.. not joking.. even at $90.00 a service call.. I will only get the guy who doesn't say.. _"Let me talk to my wife and I will get back to you"_
> 
> In other words he is calling around looking for the best deal.. I am not it..
> 
> Plumbers always make more on service calls that we do.. many posts on this forum why..


Sounds like your not getting service calls your getting general work calls. A service call 9 out of 10 people just pay what it costs because it's an emergency no time to call around.

For example a recent heat wave we have 103+ temps in my area had a call to run a dedicated AC circuit because the breaker kept tripping. I told them my price they said "i dont care what it costs just get out here a.s.a.p if you can".

People pay you just have the wrong customers.


And if plumbers make more then us they are doing things right and sticking with their price and not worrying about the customers wallet just their own.

When you stop worrying about the customers wallet you will make real money.


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## McClary’s Electrical (Feb 21, 2009)

dowmace said:


> I don't do resi on a normal basis, but when I do commercial the first hour for one man is $55 every hour after that is $45 per man. If the job is an industrial normal service call it's going to be $105 per hour plus $75 per additional man required. If it is going to be a technical service call such as motor controls expect me to charge $145 for the control technician I'll send out (normally myself). And of course if it is a PLC trouble call and I have to bring out my laptop expect me to charge $185-$235 depending on the customer, if its a steady customer I'll charge them the lower $185 if it's a new customer and I think it's a going to be a one shot deal $235 all the way.


So you have 10000 worth of software (rs line, rs logic, etc) on your laptop. And that's just Ab's stuff. I call bs


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## Magnettica (Jan 23, 2007)

I tell 'em $125 to diagnose the problem and that sometimes no parts are needed to make the fix. However, materials are sometimes needed to complete the repair. Unfortunately we won't know until we diagnose the problem. It seems only new customers have a problem with this.


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## rnr electric (Jan 29, 2010)

in our area, i charge $105hr, for residential, and 145 hr for light commercial. I dont do much hrly stuff though. mostly contract. and no big commercial jobs to speak of


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## ohiosparky99 (Nov 12, 2009)

Waco, just wondering and don't take this wrong, buy out of the 25.00 an hour, are you paying taxes, state & fed unemployment, WC, and all that, because if you are, you aren't even making minimum wage, but if your working for cash, then sure you can make it on 25 an hr.


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## benski (Jul 29, 2011)

Magnettica said:


> I tell 'em $125 to diagnose the problem and that sometimes no parts are needed to make the fix. However, materials are sometimes needed to complete the repair. Unfortunately we won't know until we diagnose the problem. It seems only new customers have a problem with this.


I'm at $110 to diagnose. I tell them no matter how long it takes to diagnose the problem the price is still $110. That's just a diagnosis of the problem after I find the problem I give a price to fix it. If it is a simple fix like a loose wire or busted receptacle no extra charge.

This works great for me because I can diagnose most residential electric problems in roughly an hour. If it's a fluke case where it takes hours to diagnose I will take the hit because it hasn't happened yet.


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## Magnettica (Jan 23, 2007)

benski said:


> I'm at $110 to diagnose. I tell them no matter how long it takes to diagnose the problem the price is still $110. That's just a diagnosis of the problem after I find the problem I give a price to fix it. If it is a simple fix like a loose wire or busted receptacle no extra charge.
> 
> This works great for me because I can diagnose most residential electric problems in roughly an hour. If it's a fluke case where it takes hours to diagnose I will take the hit because it hasn't happened yet.


I agree with that 100%. 

If you can't figure out what the problem is in less than an hour you might want to consider not being in business for yourself. It takes years of experience and hard work to be able to diagnose these problems quickly. Some guys learn earlier than others too.


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## Cletis (Aug 20, 2010)

I don't totally agree with sir. There has been a huge surge of buried jboxs lately. Ever had to dig out a hidden/buried aluminum jbox in a boarders attic in the summer ?


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## benski (Jul 29, 2011)

Cletis said:


> I don't totally agree with sir. There has been a huge surge of buried jboxs lately. Ever had to dig out a hidden/buried aluminum jbox in a boarders attic in the summer ?


That's not diagnosing and I would charge for that. If I pinpointed it down to a problem of a buried jbox somewhere I'm done the diagnosis and I will give the customer a price.


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## Shockdoc (Mar 4, 2010)

We try to get $100 an hour and have been called .............after the fact. So I try to keep it at $85 an hour


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## Cletis (Aug 20, 2010)

benski said:


> That's not diagnosing and I would charge for that. If I pinpointed it down to a problem of a buried jbox somewhere I'm done the diagnosis and I will give the customer a price.


The funny thing is when people lose power It's usually a burnt wire or gfci popped.I already know that walking in... So how do you approach hard to find burnt wire prolems ... Moneywise?


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## gold (Feb 15, 2008)

Cletis said:


> The funny thing is when people lose power It's usually a burnt wire or gfci popped.I already know that walking in... So how do you approach hard to find burnt wire prolems ... Moneywise?


In a house...
$99 diagnostic Flat rate the repair. You can bet your ass we will find it in 20 minutes.


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## pyeelectric (Dec 8, 2010)

I only have general liability. We only have 2 guys working so we don't have to have wc. If we took out for taxes ect... we would not be able to make it. October will be one year, we've been in business. We have only grossed about 10,000. Most of the calls we have received is like installing ceiling fans or switches and outlets.


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## macmikeman (Jan 23, 2007)

pyeelectric said:


> I only have general liability. We only have 2 guys working so we don't have to have wc. If we took out for taxes ect... we would not be able to make it. October will be one year, we've been in business. We have only grossed about 10,000. Most of the calls we have received is like installing ceiling fans or switches and outlets.



Donner Party.






I'm sorry that was kinda harsh I know. I meant it.


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## rnr electric (Jan 29, 2010)

pyeelectric said:


> I only have general liability. We only have 2 guys working so we don't have to have wc. If we took out for taxes ect... we would not be able to make it. October will be one year, we've been in business. We have only grossed about 10,000. Most of the calls we have received is like installing ceiling fans or switches and outlets.


with all do respect.. how do you make 2 guys wages on those sales?.
believe me i know hard times too. but thats not alot of money, do you supplement your income with other things?
sorry "due respect"


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## pyeelectric (Dec 8, 2010)

Our wives work to help make ends meet.


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## rnr electric (Jan 29, 2010)

pyeelectric said:


> Our wives work to help make ends meet.


 10-4 ,as i said i didnt mean any disrespect at all.just curious. we have all been there just starting out. if you are constantly making forward progress, then you are doing good in my book


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## pyeelectric (Dec 8, 2010)

I have recently got a few bigger general contractors to offer us work. We just starting making more money in the past 6 months.


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## rnr electric (Jan 29, 2010)

pyeelectric said:


> I have recently got a few bigger general contractors to offer us work. We just starting making more money in the past 6 months.


 Good, i am glad to hear that.. sometimes starting is the hardest part.
Quick story: my sons godfather(my dads best friend) was very wealthy, and when i was young i used to work for him,sweeping,cleaning,wiring,and gen maintenance on his properties and busineses. he told me one time that "the hardest million he ever made was his first.. the easiest was every one after that." that tells me two things, first off, stay in there and keep trying till you get where you want to, second It takes money to make money. keep your chin in the fight and you will do fine


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## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

Any 2013 guidlines on the _going rate_ fellas?

~CS~


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## B4T (Feb 10, 2009)

chicken steve said:


> Any 2013 guidlines on the _going rate_ fellas?
> 
> ~CS~


What guidelines do you need.. :blink::blink:

It was the same rules for last year and the year before that... nothing has changed..


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## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

b-b-b-ut it's *2013* B4T! ~CS~


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## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

I can recall being cornered by my local compeditors shorly after i made my debute

I was 'low boy' at the time, but really had no clue. It made them look bad, and i wasn't doing my biz any favors

Since then, we've always traded notes on the going rate

always good to be _middle boy_ in the public's eye

jmho

~CS~


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

chicken steve said:


> I can recall being cornered by my local compeditors shorly after i made my debute
> 
> I was 'low boy' at the time, but really had no clue. It made them look bad, and i wasn't doing my biz any favors
> 
> ...


Flat rate...:thumbsup:


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## Cletis (Aug 20, 2010)

HARRY304E said:


> Flat rate...:thumbsup:


Hey Harry. I havent download that program yet. Had 3 post light calls last week. They call and say my post light don't work how much to fix ?? What would the flat rate system you have say to that one ? 

I made $ 125, $ 140, and $ 225 

Bad socket, bad switch and socket, had to dig a bit and do a splice 

Did I leave money on table??


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## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

HARRY304E said:


> Flat rate...:thumbsup:


 
Even FL has some tether to competitiveness Harry.....

~CS~


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

Cletis said:


> Hey Harry. I havent download that program yet. Had 3 post light calls last week. They call and say my post light don't work how much to fix ?? What would the flat rate system you have say to that one ?
> 
> I made $ 125, $ 140, and $ 225
> 
> ...


Yes....did you price those on the phone?


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

chicken steve said:


> Even FL has some tether to competitiveness Harry.....
> 
> ~CS~


Nothing works perfectly .


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## electricmanscott (Feb 11, 2010)

chicken steve said:


> b-b-b-ut it's *2013* B4T! ~CS~


Am I the only one that was seeing rainbows and unicorns today?? :whistling2:


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## greenwire (May 27, 2012)

To continue this old thread...

The problem I'm seeing with T&M is sticker shock, and buyer's remorse after getting the bill. _More recent thread posted on this.

_But, are you guys considering the difference between a one man shop who has no employees, no payroll expenses, etc., when you're recommending FR vs. T&M?

One poster (I don't recall who-*EDITED: robnj772 Post#55*), pointed this out perfectly that Waco was justified in his $25/hr (2008, at the time) wage because he was retired, and basically working for wages, notwithstanding he being an EC, but with no employees, as opposed to the rates the employees make. I'm wondering if you're considering the price of an EC vs that of someone working for wages when comparing FR to T&M.


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

greenwire said:


> To continue this old thread...
> 
> The problem I'm seeing with T&M is sticker shock, and buyer's remorse after getting the bill. _More recent thread posted on this.
> 
> ...


....................

I fixed the link so it goes to post 55 for you.


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## yrman (Jun 12, 2011)

waco said:


> I have insurance and I pull permits when required. I just don't think my services are worth anything and I like dragging down my trade.


Fixed it for him.

I just realized that this thread is 100 years old. Why is itnalive again? Zombie thread,,,,?


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## flyboy (Jun 13, 2011)

yrman said:


> Fixed it for him.
> 
> I just realized that this thread is 100 years old. Why is itnalive again? Zombie thread,,,,?


Wow! I read almost all the way through page 4 before I realized how old this thread was. :laughing:

I was getting nauseous and deeply depressed. :blink:


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## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

I could line you up with a FR 'script for that, quality stuff , top notch people, background checks, drug free, paper trained & house broken!

~CS~


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## greenwire (May 27, 2012)

LOL guys, you all tell us newbies to search for answers, well I did, and I found something i liked, and I asked another question


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## Muslickz (Apr 19, 2013)

Going rate in my area.. (Well what we charge...) In Orlando Florida area is $65 for one man, $95 for two Plus materials. 

Having never heard a complaint I am suspecting there is some room to raise that a little bit, maybe 5%-10%... inflation and all.. 

-Mus


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

As a SWAG based on what I have read here 45.00-165.00 but this really is regional.

In Washington DC it would push 200.00, 100 miles south near Farmville VA, I would bet you could get it for 45.00.


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## rrolleston (Mar 6, 2012)

Dano said:


> I am doing a speech in my speech class to inform them how to replace a outlet.
> I was wondering if someone can point me in the direction on where I can find an average rate per hour someone would charge. If there is a web page or something like that will work.
> I am electrician but in the military so it is hard to price it.
> Thanks,
> Dan


I charge a flat rate to show up to do anything. It's $90 to show up plus parts and up to two hours of work.


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## Shockdoc (Mar 4, 2010)

We charge anywhere from $75 to $95 an hour, much depending on the customer and type of job and length of job. If I'm on a 2 day T &M job I'll often cut the labor rate to $75 a mech/$35 helper if multiple workers are billed to ease the pain on the customer.


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