# Sticky Tape or Velcro ?



## Cletis (Aug 20, 2010)

Have to mount 7 undercabinet light and on conduit (of some sort) to 2 gang switch box under cabinet. The bottom of this cabinet is so thin a screw will not work without poking through. 

Only thing I can think of is sticky tape (not removable) or velcro strips (removable). Any experience with either? 

Would this pass code? Luckily, this job is not inspected


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## MechanicalDVR (Dec 29, 2007)

Use a mechanical fastener and avoid the lawsuit when the fixture falls and splashes water on the oil in frying pan and blinds the child talking to mommy. Inspection or lack of it won't void liability.


And the cabinet bottom can't be less than 1/2" particle board.


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## TimChaput69 (Nov 14, 2011)

I would say an industrial strength velcro. Two sided tape seems to become more like a foam pad after awhile and sucks to remove. Some of the velcro out there is like crazy strong and will last forever if not separated on a regular basis. Just not sure about listing and heat though, but again how resistant is tape to heat from the lights?.


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## jw0445 (Oct 9, 2009)

I would use trim tape from an auto body supply. Wipe both surfaces with alcohol before applying. It won't come off without destroying what it's stuck to.


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## Cletis (Aug 20, 2010)

*plan*



MechanicalDVR said:


> Use a mechanical fastener and avoid the lawsuit when the fixture falls and splashes water on the oil in frying pan and blinds the child talking to mommy. Inspection or lack of it won't void liability.
> 
> 
> And the cabinet bottom can't be less than 1/2" particle board.


its only 2 mm thick



TimChaput69 said:


> I would say an industrial strength velcro. Two sided tape seems to become more like a foam pad after awhile and sucks to remove. Some of the velcro out there is like crazy strong and will last forever if not separated on a regular basis. Just not sure about listing and heat though, but again how resistant is tape to heat from the lights?.


that's what I wanted to do



jw0445 said:


> I would use trim tape from an auto body supply. Wipe both surfaces with alcohol before applying. It won't come off without destroying what it's stuck to.


good idea

I just talked with gc. He wants me to use these little mini screws that just bite in barely without coming out other side


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## MechanicalDVR (Dec 29, 2007)

What kind of cabinets have a 2mm bottom?


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## TimChaput69 (Nov 14, 2011)

How about some of that 80's vintage superglue!? With just one drop you can tow a train, patch a fender, fix a broken fingernail, fix a glass, put a broken flower pot back together, and lift a car with a crane!! Remember that stuff? That'll work.


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## Cletis (Aug 20, 2010)

*these*



MechanicalDVR said:


> What kind of cabinets have a 2mm bottom?


Apparetly the ones they hung. Everyone of job has never seen a bottom panel that thin ?


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## MechanicalDVR (Dec 29, 2007)

Cletis said:


> Apparetly the ones they hung. Everyone of job has never seen a bottom panel that thin ?


 
It's your insurance but, I'd never hang a fixture or box without a real fastener. One of many reasons I sleep so soundly at night.


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## TimChaput69 (Nov 14, 2011)

I wonder if the cabinet was built wrong?? Meaning i wonder if the top panel was mounted on the bottom by accident.


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## retiredsparktech (Mar 8, 2011)

Cletis said:


> Apparetly the ones they hung. Everyone of job has never seen a bottom panel that thin ?


How about small machine screws and nuts. Like four 6/32 flat head screws. Of course, the heads would be inside the cabinet.


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## Cletis (Aug 20, 2010)

*?*



TimChaput69 said:


> I wonder if the cabinet was built wrong?? Meaning i wonder if the top panel was mounted on the bottom by accident.



possible?



retiredsparktech said:


> How about small machine screws and nuts. Like four 6/32 flat head screws. Of course, the heads would be inside the cabinet.


nothing can penetrate up into cabinet absolutely



MechanicalDVR said:


> It's your insurance but, I'd never hang a fixture or box without a real fastener. One of many reasons I sleep so soundly at night.


sometimes you gotta do what you gotta do. I'm not too worried about one these these falling down into a hot boiling pot of oil splashing a child in face and being sued. I'm thinking 1mil : 1 chance of that

Just another case of trying to make HO happy, GC happy, code compliant which is becoming a pain in ass


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## TattooMan (Feb 10, 2012)

If anyone is willing to cut corners because the code is "irritating" or a "pain in the ass" then they shouldn't be doing any work in any construction field.


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## Cletis (Aug 20, 2010)

*ok*



TattooMan said:


> If anyone is willing to cut corners because the code is "irritating" or a "pain in the ass" then they shouldn't be doing any work in any construction field.


Thanks for the wise words. I'll let them know they need to remove and :thumbup:return all the custom cabinets and get ones with the proper size bottom board and tell them I won't install the undercabinet lighting until they do. Then I'll wait 2-3 yrs in court to get my $7k from the GC that won't pay me because of all this.


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## TattooMan (Feb 10, 2012)

Cletis said:


> Thanks for the wise words. I'll let them know they need to remove and :thumbup:return all the custom cabinets and get ones with the proper size bottom board and tell them I won't install the undercabinet lighting until they do. Then I'll wait 2-3 yrs in court to get my $7k from the GC that won't pay me because of all this.


Perfect! In the meantime continue on with your "I gotta do what I gotta do" philosophy and in 2-3 years when your 7k comes back maybe you can use that to pay bills instead of the unemployment you will be collecting because the business failed after word spreads about the shoddy work.


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## Cletis (Aug 20, 2010)

*..*



TattooMan said:


> Perfect! In the meantime continue on with your "I gotta do what I gotta do" philosophy and in 2-3 years when your 7k comes back maybe you can use that to pay bills instead of the unemployment you will be collecting because the business failed after word spreads about the shoddy work.


I can't help it people buy inferior products. I'm doing as instructed by the gc and Ho at this point. It's not like the frikin undercabinet lights are going to dislodge and fall and exploding bursting into flames and electrocute all inside ...:laughing:

Two questions for you. 

Do you cross crosswalks when it says not too? 

Do you speed ?


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## TattooMan (Feb 10, 2012)

Cletis said:


> I can't help it people buy inferior products. I'm doing as instructed by the gc and Ho at this point. It's not like the frikin undercabinet lights are going to dislodge and fall and exploding bursting into flames and electrocute all inside ...:laughing:
> 
> Two questions for you.
> 
> ...


I can honestly say no and no. This job in particular I'm sure will have no problem. But it's the work ethic I guess. Do things right, all the time and not just when circumstances allow it, and you will be successful.


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## MechanicalDVR (Dec 29, 2007)

Cletis said:


> possible?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
If I don't feel good about something like that I walk away.


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## MechanicalDVR (Dec 29, 2007)

Cletis said:


> I can't help it people buy inferior products. I'm doing as instructed by the gc and Ho at this point. It's not like the frikin undercabinet lights are going to dislodge and fall and exploding bursting into flames and electrocute all inside ...:laughing:
> 
> Two questions for you.
> 
> ...


 
Integrity, it's what you do when no one is watching.


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## The_Modifier (Oct 24, 2009)

Would *PL Premium* work for you Cletis? At least on the conduit?


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## 360max (Jun 10, 2011)

are the lights mounted toward the back of the cabinetry?


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## TimChaput69 (Nov 14, 2011)

This might sound strange at first but can the GC install a running board along the whole bottom of the cabinet set in and the whole length to make it look factory? Then you can fasten with real screws and legit? Running board made of same type wood the cabinets are made of and inlay between so they can be either toe nailed or screwed into the sides of the cabinet that hang down by like a 1/2 to 3/4 of an inch? Get what i mean?


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## retiredsparktech (Mar 8, 2011)

MechanicalDVR said:


> What kind of cabinets have a 2mm bottom?


How is that bottom going to support the items stored inside. Dinnerware is pretty heavy.


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## MechanicalDVR (Dec 29, 2007)

retiredsparktech said:


> How is that bottom going to support the items stored inside. Dinnerware is pretty heavy.


 
Exactly what I was thinking. But I didn't want to ask such a hard question. I have never seen any wood panel 2mm thick (less than 1/8") support anything.


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## big vic (Jan 23, 2012)

Cabinets were probably mounted upside down. Check out the thickness of the top panel


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## Cletis (Aug 20, 2010)

*?*



TattooMan said:


> I can honestly say no and no. This job in particular I'm sure will have no problem. But it's the work ethic I guess. Do things right, all the time and not just when circumstances allow it, and you will be successful.


I had a feeling you were the boyscout type..



MechanicalDVR said:


> If I don't feel good about something like that I walk away.


me too normally. I can't seem to walk away from 7k though 



MechanicalDVR said:


> Integrity, it's what you do when no one is watching.





The_Modifier said:


> Would *PL Premium* work for you Cletis? At least on the conduit?


I'm that hack


I know the difference between putting sticky tape on undercabinet lighting and running a 3 wire to a sub panel. Big difference


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## Cletis (Aug 20, 2010)

*?*



TattooMan said:


> I can honestly say no and no. This job in particular I'm sure will have no problem. But it's the work ethic I guess. Do things right, all the time and not just when circumstances allow it, and you will be successful.


I had a feeling you were the boyscout type..



MechanicalDVR said:


> If I don't feel good about something like that I walk away.


me too normally. I can't seem to walk away from 7k though 



MechanicalDVR said:


> Integrity, it's what you do when no one is watching.





The_Modifier said:


> Would *PL Premium* work for you Cletis? At least on the conduit?


I'm that hack


I know the difference between putting sticky tape on undercabinet lighting and running a 3 wire to a sub panel. Big difference


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## MechanicalDVR (Dec 29, 2007)

Cletis said:


> I had a feeling you were the boyscout type..
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 
You think they'd hold $7000 for not doing the under cabinet lights?


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## MechanicalDVR (Dec 29, 2007)

If it was my job I would have a serious talk with the GC and let him explain to you why the cabinet bottoms are so thin and let the job of providing you with a suitible mounting surface to him. Would you mount high hats in a 1/2" fiberglass lay in panel? The answer is no, you have a reasonable expectation of installing things in a workman like manner in a professional method.


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## Service Call (Jul 9, 2011)

Sticky tape won't hold if the lights produce any kind of heat. I second cabinets could be installed upside down. Measure the "top" panel thickness.


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## svh19044 (Jul 1, 2008)

You have a couple simple options.

Use undercab LED tape strip with it's supplied double sided tape (don't use a fixture with any weight, even the Seagull linear LX can be mounted with tape, but a box style fluorescent/xenon isn't something that I would install with tape)

Have the GC build a thicker false bottom for the cabinet, lay it inside so that you can drill through and attach to the thicker wood without penetrating through.


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## Cletis (Aug 20, 2010)

*...*



MechanicalDVR said:


> You think they'd hold $7000 for not doing the under cabinet lights?


thats how gc's get when you don't do what they want sometimes. 



Service Call said:


> Sticky tape won't hold if the lights produce any kind of heat. I second cabinets could be installed upside down. Measure the "top" panel thickness.


of course not. That's hack. 



svh19044 said:


> You have a couple simple options.
> 
> Use undercab LED tape strip with it's supplied double sided tape (don't use a fixture with any weight, even the Seagull linear LX can be mounted with tape, but a box style fluorescent/xenon isn't something that I would install with tape)
> 
> ...


That's what they should do. He said they test mounted one with really little screws that just bite in enough in his opinion and he want's us to do it that way so I"m going to tomorrow. Will take close up pics as well.


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## svh19044 (Jul 1, 2008)

Cletis said:


> thats how gc's get when you don't do what they want sometimes.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Tell him to install them and remove that item from your final bill. 

I wouldn't install them if that wood is as thin as you say. This just has hack written all over it, and it reflects upon you even though it's not directly your fault.


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## Cletis (Aug 20, 2010)

*$$*



svh19044 said:


> Tell him to install them and remove that item from your final bill.
> 
> I wouldn't install them if that wood is as thin as you say. This just has hack written all over it, and it reflects upon you even though it's not directly your fault.


Yeah. thats a great idea. He has his guy that did everything else there. Kind of handyman type. I'm going to really push him into installing these and knock some do re me off his bill. A number $$$ will talk loudly. I'll tell him his handyman can probably do it for 1/2 and his eyes will light up.


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## Mike D (Sep 16, 2008)

Is there a lip or trim of some sort that will hide the cables and fixtures?
If so, how about having the cabinet guy (since they are custom) install a slightly thicker bottom ontop of the existing thinner bottom. This would swiltch the responsibility and liability of something falling. The trim or lip shhould allow for such an install.

I have had some luck with getting some cabinet guys to install a new bottom and actually leave a gap in between for wiring and we are able to recess the fixtures, leaving a really slick looking install!


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## french connection!! (Dec 13, 2007)

use some toggle bolt and tell them it will stop the coffee cup on the shelves from sliding out in case of earthquake . I've seen some cabinet from that european blue and yellow store with 1/4 '' bottom panel , but not as thin are you telling us .


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## Cletis (Aug 20, 2010)

*yep*

yeah. It would be like plinko in reverse for the coffee cups


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## MDShunk (Jan 7, 2007)

I've run into this before with cheap cabinets. I still have a box of the bolts I used. I used 10-24x5/8" "elevator bolts". They are like a carriage bolt, with a very large smooth flat head. Put the head inside the cabinet, and the nut inside the fixture.


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## Cletis (Aug 20, 2010)

*Glue*

Here is image I got off an official site for how to install plugmold at an angle


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## MDShunk (Jan 7, 2007)

Cletis said:


> Here is image I got off an official site for how to install plugmold at an angle


plugmold.org is not an official site, and they still have pics of mine up, despite my DMCA complaint.


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## Cletis (Aug 20, 2010)

*?*

Who owns the site?


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## MDShunk (Jan 7, 2007)

Cletis said:


> Who owns the site?


Some private guy in Illinois.


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## Cletis (Aug 20, 2010)

*ahhh*

ahh. I see. Just some business guy using it to draw people in and get the counter to move and then sell ads to companies. He doesn't care how he gets them their...just so they click ...:laughing:


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## Cletis (Aug 20, 2010)

Ta da !!!!


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## Cletis (Aug 20, 2010)

Frontal view standing. No see anything


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## electrictim510 (Sep 9, 2008)

I dont like the idea of telling the guy you will not do the rest of the job and to find someone to finish it. This can cost you all future work with said GC and strengthen your competition. I think there can always be some kind of agreement made that everyone is happy with, you just have to watch the legal stuff so that something doesnt backfire on you.


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## k_buz (Mar 12, 2012)

So, there are new cabinets and counter tops and new (fished in) under cabinet lights, but the counter top recepts haven't been brought up to code? Oh, that's right, no permit.

Why, if there is a new tile backsplash, are the switches mounted to the bottom of the cabinet? I would think it would have been much better to put them in the wall. Unless there is a construction issue, like drywall on block wall.


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## rrolleston (Mar 6, 2012)

Short machine screws with fender washers inside and the nuts and washers in the fixture. Better than having the fixture fall down.


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## walkerj (May 13, 2007)

I would never do any of that in a customers house.


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## davis9 (Mar 21, 2009)

Could have screwed them in through the back towards the wall in addition to the silicone. Switches could have been mounted the same way. Not sure why they have so many? May as well have used the unit switches.

Tom


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## rrolleston (Mar 6, 2012)

Hopefully the bottom of the cabinets fall out before the lights fall down.


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