# Tired of this building



## KRD (Feb 25, 2012)

And yes that's how I found it above a layer of mat.


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## erics37 (May 7, 2009)

I don't like compression couplings.


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## KRD (Feb 25, 2012)

They were specked for this job


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## erics37 (May 7, 2009)

Oh, and that's a violation of 300.18(A) :jester:


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

KRD said:


> Even working for this company for a month in a building. Been pulling wire and on a lot of runs there are 6-7-8 90's. Couplings not set and fall apart. This happened today...


It is amazing how many guys cannot use a 2 pairs of channel locks to tighten up a compression fitting.

Also that clip looks too close to the end of the pipe for the compression fitting to fit properly.


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## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

what's with the red pipe? ~CS~


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## Southeast Power (Jan 18, 2009)

KRD said:


> They were specked for this job


Too bad. This reflects how some engineers are so out of touch with basic installation practices.
I would always specify steel set screw fittings for an indoor environment like that.


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## running dummy (Mar 19, 2009)

chicken steve said:


> what's with the red pipe? ~CS~


Fire alarm, more than likely. 

Usually I like pulling wire, but not when you have to deal with what you're seeing. 


I was on a job recently where I was tasked with pulling all the branch circuit home runs. The engineers speced solid wire for everything. Biggest pita! We had to use a tugger for everything and I even snapped the 1/4 rope a few times. 

The engineer claims that it is a better connection on devices because a few strands are lost while stripping when using stranded wire.


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## GEORGE D (Apr 2, 2009)

running dummy said:


> Fire alarm, more than likely.
> 
> Usually I like pulling wire, but not when you have to deal with what you're seeing.
> 
> ...


He could have specifyed fork terminals for devices or spec grade devices with wire clamps. I used to only use solid but now I only buy stranded. Being a 1 man band, I need the easiest possible pulls.


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## Southeast Power (Jan 18, 2009)

running dummy said:


> Fire alarm, more than likely.
> 
> Usually I like pulling wire, but not when you have to deal with what you're seeing.
> 
> ...


Again, more ignorance on the part of the engineer.
But,
Some will specify solid as "value engineering"


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## Big John (May 23, 2010)

running dummy said:


> ...The engineer claims that it is a better connection on devices because a few strands are lost while stripping when using stranded wire.


So with 19 strands of copper, how much does it affect the ampacity if you lose one strand? How can someone be so educated and so stupid?

-John


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## running dummy (Mar 19, 2009)

I actually spoke to the engineer about this and he would not be moved. I asked if we could pigtail with solid to the device. No. 

Also he was very adamant about the mud rings and devices. We were required to use 3/4" rings for 5/8" rock. No big deal, until he took a plate off and said "the device cannot be supported by the drywall, only the ring". :huh: 

His reasoning? It won't be properly grounded. 

Yes...he said grounded


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## TattooMan (Feb 10, 2012)

KRD said:


> Even working for this company for a month in a building. Been pulling wire and on a lot of runs there are 6-7-8 90's. Couplings not set and fall apart. This happened today...


One of the projects I'm on has to be finished by the 29th of this month. Two main sections of the building aren't even gridded with tiles let alone flooring, Sheetrock and paint. It's a cluster of a place because no one wants to pay the $5000 a day for not being out on time. I feel your pain...


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## RePhase277 (Feb 5, 2008)

running dummy said:


> I actually spoke to the engineer about this and he would not be moved. I asked if we could pigtail with solid to the device. No.
> 
> Also he was very adamant about the mud rings and devices. We were required to use 3/4" rings for 5/8" rock. No big deal, until he took a plate off and said "the device cannot be supported by the drywall, only the ring". :huh:
> 
> ...


3/4" rings are what you're supposed to use for 5/8" rock. What size would you use?


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## B W E (May 1, 2011)

And self grounding receptacles are bonded through the screw, not just the ears. But yah, I've always used 3/4" rings on 5/8 drywall.


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## Amish Electrician (Jan 2, 2010)

A few have said "I've always used 3/4" rings on 5/8 drywall." Good for you!

I had to sort of figure that one out the hard way, after a few years of finding my boxes knocked crooked when the drywall crew tried to force their boards down and the receptacles were left 'floating' because the mud ring didn't allow for the texture coat.

I went to the box store the other day, and guess what? Only 1/2 and 5/8 rings there.

So ... I've even gone a bit overboard these days. I now go with deeper rings, so I can set the box back a bit. No more of the mud ring screw heads pushing the drywall out. When I set the boxes, I actually do it with a ring on and a piece of drywall to see exactly how the ring will line up. 

Sure, it's slower .... but it has eliminated all the time I spent wrestling with the pushed-back boxes.


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## emahler (Oct 13, 2011)

Caddy H23.


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## LightsOn81 (Jan 6, 2012)

Compression fittings work if you use your friggin channel locks. Red pipe is fire alarm to be sure. Both of those are requirements here on camp lejeune. The conduit coming apart will get your tail reamed by everyone on the job ( we are hard on each other) and the bends in excess will get you back over there to cut in a box.


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## LightsOn81 (Jan 6, 2012)

It's amazing how an EC will ask a man when hiring " can you run conduit?" and never ask how many bends in a run between pull points how far between boxes etc. I think I will tee off someones head with my ideal bender the next time I got to cut in a box in a run because of another guys ignorance and incompetence. Especially if he gets paid more to screw it up than I get paid to do it right.


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## EBFD6 (Aug 17, 2008)

LightsOn81 said:


> how far between boxes etc.


There is no answer to this


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## tkb (Jan 21, 2009)

Solid wire is very common for fire alarm systems and is required by soome fire alarm codes.

More than 360 degrees of bends is just plain hack and shows that a real electrician didn't run the conduits.


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## Chris Kennedy (Nov 19, 2007)

I will often go over 360, but I pull the wire also. No big deal.


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## TOOL_5150 (Aug 27, 2007)

Amish Electrician said:


> A few have said "I've always used 3/4" rings on 5/8 drywall." Good for you!
> 
> I had to sort of figure that one out the hard way, after a few years of finding my boxes knocked crooked when the drywall crew tried to force their boards down and the receptacles were left 'floating' because the mud ring didn't allow for the texture coat.
> 
> ...


not a bad idea, i have done the same thing before.:thumbsup:


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## wcord (Jan 23, 2011)

tkb said:


> More than 360 degrees of bends is just plain hack and shows that a real electrician didn't run the conduits.


As a point of information, our CEC (Canada) prohibits more than 360 degrees of bends in our conduit runs.


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## wendon (Sep 27, 2010)

wcord said:


> As a point of information, our CEC (Canada) prohibits more than 360 degrees of bends in our conduit runs.


Same here in the states.

NEC 358.26

Hard to push a fish tape through more bends then that.


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## LightsOn81 (Jan 6, 2012)

All the jobs at camp lejeune allow a max of 270 for current carrying circuits fire alarm and certain technology. Anything with coax and fiber optic is 180 and you can't use a jbox as a 90


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## noarcflash (Sep 14, 2011)

the mud ring, or J-box is suppose to sit flush with the finished wall, so the device is always 'supported' by the drywall or back splash tile, or whatever is the finished wall.

and what is the difference if you use the ground screw and wire it to the box ?


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## Norcal (Mar 22, 2007)

wendon said:


> Same here in the states.
> 
> NEC 358.26
> 
> Hard to push a fish tape through more bends then that.


 
Sometimes it's a PITA to pull w/ four 90°'s.


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## jimmy21 (Mar 31, 2012)

4 90s and a kick never hurt anyone


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## electricalperson (Jan 11, 2008)

i wish skill and craftsmanship were the norm in this trade instead of the exception. i see more hacks and installers than craftsmen and electricians. its annoying


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## Southeast Power (Jan 18, 2009)

electricalperson said:


> i wish skill and craftsmanship were the norm in this trade instead of the exception. i see more hacks and installers than craftsmen and electricians. its annoying


I would really like to say something here that would make Brother Noah proud:whistling2:


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