# Wire Nut / Tape issue with Recess Lighting



## rmsowell (Nov 11, 2009)

I am installing recessed lights in a soffet under construction in my master bedroom. I have installed the regular HALO 6" (new install) IC cans with wire nuts. All is fine, life is good. 

Problem:
One non-HALO eyeball 5" special fixture has the junction box on top of its non-IC can. This is a remodel type can I was forced to use thanks to space issues. They specify min. 90 deg. C. for the nuts and wire in the junction box. They then say to wrap the nuts in electrical tape (EHHH, here we go again!) The 3M vinyl tape is only rated at 80 deg C.

Why do they want the wire nuts wrapped with tape? I have read everyone's threads about the tape and nuts. Lets not get that started again.

My only guess is that they are concerned that the constant heating / cooling will may cause the nuts to loosen.

If I must wrap, I need 90 deg. C or higher tape. Any suggestions.

Rmsowell


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

Just don't tape them.


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## RMatthis (Nov 9, 2009)

I don't understand why people look WAY DEEPER into something then it really is. In my opinion, Wrap or don't wrap...as long as you are using quality wire nuts and no bare copper is showing what's the problem? The Thermal sensor in the can will burn up from the heat before the wiring in the j box will...

That's just one mans opinion.


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## captkirk (Nov 21, 2007)

i think your over thinking the whole thing......:whistling2: only chumps tape wire nuts......


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## sparks134 (Jan 30, 2009)

The OP said, "NUTS"!!!!:laughing::laughing::laughing:

I call them WIRE BALLS!!!!!!!!:laughing::laughing:


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## rmsowell (Nov 11, 2009)

FYI - the non-HALO fixture is Commercial Electric. (I will now bend over and accept my punishment). It looked good, fit good, low profile. I have seen the negative posts and it is easily removable if I need to replace the temp. sensor. I assume this is the only item that may fail, right?


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## sparks134 (Jan 30, 2009)

rmsowell said:


> FYI - the non-HALO fixture is Commercial Electric. (I will now bend over and accept my punishment). It looked good, fit good, low profile. I have seen the negative posts and it is easily removable if I need to replace the temp. sensor. I assume this is the only item that may fail, right?
> 
> [/!:no:


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## sparky105 (Sep 29, 2009)

use 130 c about:blink: 3 go arounds will do ya fine:whistling2:


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## knowshorts (Jan 9, 2009)

If you don't use the right temperature tape and don't follow the manufactures' instructions and also use Commercial Electric fixtures, your house will burn down and kill the neighbor across the street.


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## egads (Sep 1, 2009)

OK, space issues. Tell us what the space issues are and I bet we could recommend a can.


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## rmsowell (Nov 11, 2009)

Thanks to everyone's input.

A electrician told me to toss the nuts and use bucannon splice-caps. he claim these will not have the temp. issues and are crimped on.

Anyone has experience with these? He says I can take off the nuts, crimp them over the twisted 12 AWG solid wires and I am good to go.


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## sparks134 (Jan 30, 2009)

:wallbash:to much work for something so simple, this is making my head hurt!


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

rmsowell said:


> Thanks to everyone's input.
> 
> A electrician told me to toss the nuts and use bucannon splice-caps. he claim these will not have the temp. issues and are crimped on.
> 
> Anyone has experience with these? He says I can take off the nuts, crimp them over the twisted 12 AWG solid wires and I am good to go.


 
Man, I'd swear there's an engineer involved here.









Oh, wait..... you _are_ an engineer. :laughing:




Just put plain old, every-day, run of the mill wire nuts on and fuhgeddabowdit. 

No crimps. No tape. Wire nuts. Done.


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## sparks134 (Jan 30, 2009)

480sparky said:


> Man, I'd swear there's an engineer involved here.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


 this thread sucks!


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## RobRoy (Aug 6, 2009)

robnj772 twists wirenuts with his mouth!


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## nolabama (Oct 3, 2007)

Buy some 90 degree tape and tape em up real good. Why in the world would you not tape em anyway. :thumbup:


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## RMatthis (Nov 9, 2009)

knowshorts said:


> If you don't use the right temperature tape and don't follow the manufactures' instructions and also use Commercial Electric fixtures, your house will burn down and kill the neighbor across the street.


LMFAO.... :laughing:
That just made my day...


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## william1978 (Sep 21, 2008)

sparks134 said:


> I call them WIRE BALLS!!!!!!!!:laughing::laughing:


 Me too.


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## william1978 (Sep 21, 2008)

No tape and just use regular wire balls.


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## kbsparky (Sep 20, 2007)

rmsowell said:


> Thanks to everyone's input.
> 
> A electrician told me to toss the nuts and use bucannon splice-caps. he claim these will not have the temp. issues and are crimped on.....


Does this mean you are not an electrician?

This forum is not for DIY issues ...:no:


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## nolabama (Oct 3, 2007)

kbsparky said:


> Does this mean you are not an electrician?
> 
> This forum is not for DIY issues ...:no:


Its worse than a DIY 480 says OP is an engineer.


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## RMatthis (Nov 9, 2009)

nolabama said:


> Its worse than a DIY 480 says OP is an engineer.


Ha,Ha,Ha... 
Too many times I have walked into troubleshoot a problem and the first words I hear "well my neighbor who's an electrical engineer"...LOL


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## idontknow (Jul 18, 2009)

Wagos!

Seriously though they work great. No twist, no tape, and visual confirmation of connection.


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## RMatthis (Nov 9, 2009)

idontknow said:


> Wagos!
> 
> Seriously though they work great. No twist, no tape, and visual confirmation of connection.


They make life easier for sure...but I still like to twist all my wires. Call me old school. I have a feeling that in 20 years we'll all be saying, "well those were good in their day but..."


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## Grimlock (Aug 4, 2009)

Just CAD weld the wires together and be done with it already. (Then tape it)


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## running dummy (Mar 19, 2009)

you need some HV rubber tape, then go 4 times around with Super 33, and then use some shrink tape on it. that should do the trick


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## nolabama (Oct 3, 2007)

running dummy said:


> you need some HV rubber tape, then go 4 times around with Super 33, and then use some shrink tape on it. that should do the trick


you forgot the cambric - I would highly recommend this particular individual application have cambric tape. 

HV rubber tape, then cambric then super 33 then the shrink tape that should hold up.

that or a polaris tap


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## running dummy (Mar 19, 2009)

nolabama said:


> you forgot the cambric - I would highly recommend this particular individual application have cambric tape.
> 
> HV rubber tape, then cambric then super 33 then the shrink tape that should hold up.
> 
> that or a polaris tap


How could I forget!!!


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## heel600 (Oct 31, 2007)

nolabama said:


> you forgot the cambric - I would highly recommend this particular individual application have cambric tape.
> 
> HV rubber tape, then cambric then super 33 then the shrink tape that should hold up.
> 
> that or a polaris tap


Only a hack would omit the potting compound


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## cdnelectrician (Mar 14, 2008)

Better wire em up with teck cable, romex wont hold up!


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## Grimlock (Aug 4, 2009)

cdnelectrician said:


> Better wire em up with teck cable, romex wont hold up!


 No, we better go with copper bus just to be on the safe side.


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## user4818 (Jan 15, 2009)

I would use Polaris connectors and then wrap them with an 1/8" minimum of Super 88.


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## nolabama (Oct 3, 2007)

heel600 said:


> Only a hack would omit the potting compound


So I am a hack-whats potting compound.
dont google it i am gonna do that


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## rmsowell (Nov 11, 2009)

Wow, I like the potting compound idea. Actually could could seal the whole light in potting compound, but changing the light bulb would be a B*tch. Enough engineer bashing. 

I have decided not to tape the wire nuts. The connectors are sufficient to hold since I tighten them until they scream. 

Lets end this thread!


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## Power Tech (Aug 23, 2009)

Aren't the black wire nuts high temp?

I was taught to use those in HID and incandescent ceiling fixtures.


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## zen (Jun 15, 2009)

*door jam switch*

whats with door jam switches,,,every thing about them gets on my nerves,,first they will be covered up then they are metel ,,have no room in them , an acceptable connector gets in the way or its costly,,you need to tape the terminals its probably gonna short out and the ground screw that comes with it never goes in its place without hassle....is there a good reason no one makes a better one thats plastic..


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## egads (Sep 1, 2009)

zen said:


> whats with door jam switches,,,every thing about them gets on my nerves,,first they will be covered up then they are metel ,,have no room in them , an acceptable connector gets in the way or its costly,,you need to tape the terminals its probably gonna short out and the ground screw that comes with it never goes in its place without hassle....is there a good reason no one makes a better one thats plastic..


Holy thread hijack batman!

Here's my suggestion, stop using them, use this instead:

http://www.hankselectric.net/detail.aspx?ID=1087

TimeSaver Model CR-120V (there is also a 20 amp version)

It's a relay, mounted at the fixture. small low voltage wires are run to an alarm contact. 
Just don't use the other one, called a Betterswitch. They are unreliable and not UL tested.


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## thekoolcody (Aug 30, 2008)

You only tape your wire nuts, if you dont know how to splice. If you make a good splice, the nut should fit fine.


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