# GC handing out fines???



## All_amped_up (Nov 12, 2007)

Anyone have a GC on a large job hand out fines? I have NEVER heard of this 'till I got run off a job for refusing to sign a BLANK fine.

Bit of a story but I have to explain in detail. 1st this was a Union job {I'm Union} NOw....I'm putting in a recept upstairs at a column by a window, the window was out and guard rails put up to keep folks safe...I'm fine with that, HOWEVER, I had to remove the lower rail to install the recept and stub it up since the rock guys were slapping up the rock in the area.
The assistant super KNEW I did it and told me to put it back when I was done.
Now MY fault, I went to break, came back and finished...so yes I left it open, I admit fault. NOw..the Super comes up and asks me to fill out this paper, with Name, social number and sign it....as I read over it, I see that it's a citation for safety. The kicker is the fine amount was blank....I told the guy I wasn't signing a blank check for them......I asked to speak with the safety guy and talk with my boss as well....

Next thing I get is my boss telling my I'm being run off the job for refusing to sign this BS ticket, I told him the situation and he agreed with me....we go to talk with the GC and they tell me there is no talking about it, I violated their and OSHA's safety rule....to wrap it up, I loose my damn job due to not signing this ticket, and my company had no-where to send me so I get laid off.....I'm pissed about this!
Has anyone else dealt with this before? Do I have a case with a civil suit?


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## BryanMD (Dec 31, 2007)

Two Q's: 1) When you working up there were you tied off? and 2) What does your BA say?


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

What does the contract between your employer and the GC state about this?

I've never heard of such a thing, but that doesn't mean anything.


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## All_amped_up (Nov 12, 2007)

Well here in the south the IBEW is..uh..weak. I got the whole..."oh let it go re-sign the books and keep yourself off the radar" since I have 1 1/2 yrs to turn out.
I wasn't tied off it was on a column, the window that was braced off was about 3 ' wide, so was the column...I DO admit I was wrong for taking a break and leaving the lower rail off, however I refuse to sign a BLANK ticket. Hell they could write $5 or $5,000,000 in there ya know.


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## gilbequick (Oct 6, 2007)

All amped up where do you live?


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## All_amped_up (Nov 12, 2007)

GA, my local is 613


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## Kletis (Jan 18, 2008)

I definitely would not have signed it either!! NEVER sign a blank check, they should not expect you to either.


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

Along the same lines, I once worked on a large job where the GC had a Safety Meeting every Tuesday morning. Every person from every trade was required to attend.

At the end, we all signed a form stating we had attended that meeting, which also listed the date and subject of the meeting ("Ladder safety" or "Fall Protection"....). I'm sure this was to protect him from fines & lawsuits if someone got hurt. His defense would be, "Well, we had a meeting about that on this date, and he was in attendance. Documentation is right here....."

One day, the GC walks up to me with a form that had already been signed by about 15 people. No date... No subject.... just signatures. He tells me to sign it because he wasn't here the previous Tuesday so no safety meeting was held. He wanted the signatures so he could fill in the date & subject later.

I handed it right back to him and said, "No way." He asked why. I said, "I know exacly what you're doing. You're getting everyone to sign a blank safety meeting form with no subject or date on it. Three weeks from now, someone gets hurt doing something stupid. Is his signature on this form? If so, you simply fill in an appropriate date and the subject that matches what he did wrong, and you are now 100% off the hook as you supposedly 'just had a safety meeting on that very subject', so you can't blame me."


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## electricalperson (Jan 11, 2008)

480sparky said:


> Along the same lines, I once worked on a large job where the GC had a Safety Meeting every Tuesday morning. Every person from every trade was required to attend.
> 
> At the end, we all signed a form stating we had attended that meeting, which also listed the date and subject of the meeting ("Ladder safety" or "Fall Protection"....). I'm sure this was to protect him from fines & lawsuits if someone got hurt. His defense would be, "Well, we had a meeting about that on this date, and he was in attendance. Documentation is right here....."
> 
> ...


i was on a job like that once. the GC just gave us a paper to sign and walked away. around christmas time he spoke about the danger of christmas trees


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

electricalperson said:


> i was on a job like that once. the GC just gave us a paper to sign and walked away. around christmas time he spoke about the danger of christmas trees


Kinda curious.... just how dangerous is a Christmas tree? I've never used one on the job.


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## nap (Dec 26, 2007)

> =All_amped_up;48472]
> Has anyone else dealt with this before?


seen guys run off a job for less. Don't remember any fines though.




> Do I have a case with a civil suit


No. They don't need a reason to run you off the job. Depending on what the contract is between your (former) employer and the GC/constr. managemnt, this may or may not have been alllowed. It is becoming more prevelant so I would suspect it was allowable.

So, where was your steward and you need to understand what Weingarten rights are.


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## MechanicalDVR (Dec 29, 2007)

You should never have left the area unmanned for break.


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## All_amped_up (Nov 12, 2007)

MechanicalDVR said:


> You should never have left the area unmanned for break.


Yeah, I do admit fault for that and never argued with the GC over it. Just argued about signing a blank fine. And weather or not they are entitled to even write fines. We had safety meeting on Mondays, and a safety video on Thurs. signing the safety sheet each time.
We didn't have a stewart on this job, there was only 8 electricians. What get's me is no one time during all the safety meetings, or at the start of the job did the GC say they would fine us for a violation. 
I'm just getting more and more pissed about it, my unemployment is running out, and work is not hitting here at my local, and now in Dec. I have my anniversary, my sons B-day, X-mas coming up, and then my wifes B-day..
So yeah I'm a little stressed


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## DDB1205 (Dec 13, 2008)

All_amped_up said:


> Yeah, I do admit fault for that and never argued with the GC over it. Just argued about signing a blank fine. And weather or not they are entitled to even write fines. We had safety meeting on Mondays, and a safety video on Thurs. signing the safety sheet each time.
> We didn't have a stewart on this job, there was only 8 electricians. What get's me is no one time during all the safety meetings, or at the start of the job did the GC say they would fine us for a violation.
> I'm just getting more and more pissed about it, my unemployment is running out, and work is not hitting here at my local, and now in Dec. I have my anniversary, my sons B-day, X-mas coming up, and then my wifes B-day..
> So yeah I'm a little stressed


I have worked with alot of 613 hands, they are some jam up Brothers. My question is, what did your hall say? Did you tell them what was going on?


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## pawpaw702 (Dec 13, 2008)

Sorry to hear about your getting smoked, at this time of the year. I've never heard of getting fined for a safety violation. Smoked yes, but fined? Its too late now, but I would have told my BA the whole deal, and see if he could get something done. this should be a valuable lesson, and thank God no one got hurt. Never leave your work area without replacing any barricades, danger tape, or dead fronts off of live panels. 

In Brotherhood, Paw Paw


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## BryanMD (Dec 31, 2007)

found here: Cool IBEW Sites
Electrician Talk - Professional Electrical Contractors Forum (great ibew electrical discussion forum, talks about jatc scores, and so much more) - http://www.electriciantalk.com/

Just a heads up to all the loyal IBEW brothers who have joined here of late...
whatever you may believe or may have been told ET.com is NOT an ibew discussion forum. 

Brothers are more than welcome to participate in any of the chatter on actual work or theory or anything else but **lay off** trying to twist every topic into an us vs them argument. It will get you more grief than joy and will undercut the value that the *occasional* and actually on topic pro organization comment could have.

In the "Union Topics" section of the forum... go for it. But understand that most merit shop guys won't even looking at your words there; let alone absorbing the message.

And for everybody else... Don't engage them when they start up.


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## pawpaw702 (Dec 13, 2008)

Why...whatever do you mean?


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