# Any female sparkies out there?



## backstay (Feb 3, 2011)

You're going to have two types. 

One that hates women on the job. You can not fix them. They will not give you any respect. They may try to sabotage the job to get you. If your boss won't get rid of this type, you are doomed. 

Then there's the type that will challenge you no matter what sex you are. They are easier to deal with. I treat them like they act, if it is a child then they get it right back. If its in the open in front of others I give one chance with a talk, then they get dressed down in public. 

Find out who is professional and treat them that way. Be sharper than the others, both in intelligence and wit. 

I have run crews up to 40 men(and women) with all the kinds from the joker to the pro. You may be an exceptional person, but at 4 years you're about 6 to 8 years from where you need to be to handle crews. Your boss should know this or you're being setup. I should add that my daughter has worked with me in my business, and I wouldn't do this to her at 4 or 5 years.


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## sparky970 (Mar 19, 2008)

I would guess it's because you're still an apprentice


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## AlbertaGirl (May 14, 2012)

I agree with you on the years, and the boss has said its more of a training exercise than the weight of a foremans position. My foreman is 24 years old, he is running our site which is 3 multi-family buildings, 80 suites each. I have more experience than him in terms of years, and know many things he does not. His advantage is that he is an asshole, and the other guys listen to him, an respect his authority. I am essentially a baby sitter at the moment, just watching and making sure the other guys stay on task and are doing their job correctly. Still being an apprentice I am not held responsible for much. Thankfully. I QC their work, and if something is missed I catch the heat. I guess having a leader type role will look good on a resume, showing maturity and responsibility. anything helps when many companies look at my first name on my resume and toss it aside. 

Just wanting to prove I can handle it, so they can see I'm worth keeping around. But hey, my entire apprenticeship so far has been spent proving to everyone around me that I can do what they can. 

I can bend 1 1/4 Emt by hand, and most of my coworkers cannot. I spent hours refining the techniques when I was on a job and left by myself a lot. I have to work harder than the guys to make sure they see I'm capable and it's seemed to pay off so far. So I've proved I can do the job, and I'm a fairly likeable person and not used to people NOT getting along with me. I thought it would be easier than the work itself, boy was I wrong!


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## AlbertaGirl (May 14, 2012)

Will work on the wit  I'm a little slow on the comebacks, thanks for the message


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## stlouis (Aug 25, 2012)

Respect is earned. You sound a bit whiny. Poor me I'm a girl . Just do your job and stop worrying about what those under you think. If your boss has given you authority without backing you up then your screwed.


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## NacBooster29 (Oct 25, 2010)

I've always found that leading by example is a good style. If grown men cannot come to work, and work with no hand holding, they find the door relatively quickly.
Somedays I feel like a babysitter, large crews. With one or two turds can get out of hand quick. You need to be able to keep the ones who need the hand holding and dumbness away from the pack.
Don't forget your still an apprentice too. 
As far as being a woman, if you know your stuff, the good workers will listen, just flush the turds who won't.


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## adroga (Mar 3, 2011)

I don't think she sounds whiny at all...

Remove the fact she mentioned she's a woman and you'll see a question posted before about younger guys or less experienced guys running crews of people who won't listen/respect/whatever...


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## union347sparky (Feb 29, 2012)

stlouis said:


> Respect is earned. You sound a bit whiny. Poor me I'm a girl . Just do your job and stop worrying about what those under you think. If your boss has given you authority without backing you up then your screwed.


When you're a Forman you need to only be worried about the guys under you. Their work is a direct reflection on you. Keep them busy and stay a few steps ahead of them. If you can always have the answers without saying let me check the respect will come.


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## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

ah _geez_.....

first they got the vote, then they got women's boots, now they wanna rule the trade

next, they'll be ruling the world fellas.....

~CS~


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## niteshift (Nov 21, 2007)

AlbertaGirl,

Sounds like you'll be proving yourself much of the time, because you sound like you're learning much faster then those around you.

It's a tough world out there. Congrats on the promotion(?):thumbsup:


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## niteshift (Nov 21, 2007)

chicken steve said:


> ah _geez_.....
> 
> first they got the vote, then they got women's boots, now they wanna rule the trade
> 
> ...


CS, now look what you started.:jester::laughing::blink:


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

As a helper I had trouble with mechanics not wanting to listen to me, some of it was me some of it them. I stuck it out and some of them did not.

When I got on my first union job some of the A JW's gave me a hard time, but then I realized all I could do was move forward, I made friends with most of them and the rest, I think they found their way back to the hall.

It takes time, and their realizing you are decent, you may need to earn their respect. If they give you any real grief you may need to ax one or two. BUt hopefully they will see why you have the reigns and let you lead.

Me personally I will listen to anyone that has the ability to lead.


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## ElectraWoman (Jul 19, 2012)

My shop is really great and I have no trouble with any of the guys there as I have been shipped about. Yesterday was the first time I felt like I was being judged by my gender, but not by my guys.

We were doing a reinstall after fire had gutted a small strip mall, New everything was going in. I showed up to meet my Jman and his helpers only to discover a flooring crew of 5 guys also there. Much starring and confused/aggressive looks tossed my way as I pulled out my tools, strapped on my belt and disappeared into a tiny crawl space behind some furniture to change out an outlet.

I could have been irritated or self conscious but I decided that my efforts should speak for me instead of saying something smart. I got lost in the running of MC, terminating ends, installing quads outlets...I forgot to pay them any mind (and I forgot to take a lunch). By the time we were breaking for the day the other crew was all grins and polite nods. 

Not every time will have that ending for me but I was glad yesterday did. Made me feel pretty darn pleased with myself. Good luck to you, work hard and let your efforts speak for themselves. I wish you great success and you are in my prayers.


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

I have been on a few jobs where the women (particularly engineers office types) dressed IMO less than appropriately for a construction site. Heels, super tight jeans or short skirt and low cut blouse. Then they get upset when the workers stare.

Had a female steam fitter that was wearing tank tops and going braless (she was rather well endowed) and she coped an attitude. The safety guy was afraid to say anything to her due to possible sexist charges, yet the male workers were required to wear shirts with short sleeves. You do have to consider where you are at. Is it right maybe not but that is the way it is.


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## kennydmeek (Sep 12, 2009)

brian john said:


> I have been on a few jobs where the women (particularly engineers office types) dressed IMO less than appropriately for a construction site. Heels, super tight jeans or short skirt and low cut blouse. Then they get upset when the workers stare.
> 
> Had a female steam fitter that was wearing tank tops and going braless (she was rather well endowed) and she coped an attitude. The safety guy was afraid to say anything to her due to possible sexist charges, yet the male workers were required to wear shirts with short sleeves. You do have to consider where you are at. Is it right maybe not but that is the way it is.


Had a floor sanding professional in a bikini on a house restoration last year. Didn't even know what to think about that. This electrician did what he had to do and vacated for a couple of days..


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## Cujo (Feb 4, 2012)

I don't think it has much to do with you being a 4th year since that is pretty common here. I think some guys will just never have respect for a woman. When you are the acting foreman you will know that these are people who you don't want on your crew. Being older should help. 

I think the best way is to just stay firm with what you want and expect. I find the younger generation of workers is less likely to look at a woman and have less respect for them then say someone who is older.


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## Celtic (Nov 19, 2007)

brian john said:


> Had a female steam fitter that was wearing tank tops and going braless (she was rather well endowed) and she coped an attitude.


I might have worked with her...short..brown hair...kinda cute actually?


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

Celtic said:


> I might have worked with her...short..brown hair...kinda cute actually?


VERY CUTE actually.


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## Celtic (Nov 19, 2007)

brian john said:


> VERY CUTE actually.


Coulda been her 

The one I worked with did not have an attitude...was rather pleasant...and we all looked out for her until the other trades knew to just leave her be.
I cannot remember her name..it was over a decade ago.

I meet her one morning in a jobsite parking lot...misty cool fall morning...dressed as you described ~ but with the bib folded down.
One of the best mornings. Ever.

LOL


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## chewy (May 9, 2010)

I dont like being told what to do by women or even men alot more physically smaller than me, thats my problem to deal with and I try make it work but there is often resentment at my end I dont really have control over.


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## RGH (Sep 12, 2011)

running a crew is never easy...1 tip at a time ...match guys up to jobs they do well and they like to do...tell the group what the scope is then ask who wants do do what...men are usually happy doing stuff we like...happy crew is a productive crew...good luck...:thumbsup:..(I use to post the scope everyday) sign the sheet guys...adjust accordingly


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## Tsmil (Jul 17, 2011)

chewy said:


> I dont like being told what to do by women or even men alot more physically smaller than me, thats my problem to deal with and I try make it work but there is often resentment at my end I dont really have control over.


Typical alpha male attitude.


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## chewy (May 9, 2010)

Tsmil said:


> Typical alpha male attitude.


Pardon me for being a Man.


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

chewy said:


> Pardon me for being a Man.


A pair of cable cutters can fix that,


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## Celtic (Nov 19, 2007)

chewy said:


> I dont like being told what to do by women or even men alot more physically smaller than me, thats my problem to deal with and I try make it work but there is often resentment at my end I dont really have control over.





chewy said:


> Pardon me for being a Man.


You really think that is an acceptable excuse?

So guys that can follow orders and know their status on the totem pole are not men?


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## chewy (May 9, 2010)

brian john said:


> A pair of cable cutters can fix that,


Youll never get them, I can suck them up like a Samurai.


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## chewy (May 9, 2010)

Celtic said:


> You really think that is an acceptable excuse?
> 
> So guys that can follow orders and know their status on the totem pole are not men?


I accept is isnt acceptable but its a natural reaction for me, I cant help an emotional reaction no matter how subtle it manifests itself.


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## Celtic (Nov 19, 2007)

chewy said:


> I accept is isnt acceptable but its a natural reaction for me, I cant help an emotional reaction no matter how subtle it manifests itself.


No offense, but IMHO a man can control his emotions ...to just say "I'm a man" doesn't excuse bad behavior/attitude.

What are you going to do when a _younger_ woman or _younger _man a lot more physically smaller than you is telling you what to do...ya big galoot!
**


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## chewy (May 9, 2010)

Celtic said:


> No offense, but IMHO a man can control his emotions ...to just say "I'm a man" doesn't excuse bad behavior/attitude.
> 
> What are you going to do when a younger woman or younger man a lot more physically smaller than you is telling you what to do...ya big galoot!


Its not so much telling me what to do its how they go about it, if my boss said "Pull your f%&king head in and sort that bloody reel out" I would just say yep but if someone like I described said that to me I cant let it go.


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## Celtic (Nov 19, 2007)

chewy said:


> Its not so much telling me what to do its how they go about it, if my boss said "Pull your f%&king head in and sort that bloody reel out" I would just say yep but if someone like I described said that to me I cant let it go.


I hear ya....

...sometimes, we have to take our marching orders from some snot-nosed, wet-behind-the-ears, ass-hat....like it or not.


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## bobelectric (Feb 24, 2007)

Term here is take your money. And drug up.


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## dykeluver (Jul 30, 2012)

i had a Woman" hendrix, oh sorry. My past foemen/boss was a Women. She knew her codes, her work, her theory. I learned alot from her. Damn shame to hear yer catchin flack from the boys. Blow them away with your knowledge. That might shut up the smart ones. The dumb ones shouldn't be there......


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## AlbertaGirl (May 14, 2012)

RGH said:


> running a crew is never easy...1 tip at a time ...match guys up to jobs they do well and they like to do...tell the group what the scope is then ask who wants do do what...men are usually happy doing stuff we like...happy crew is a productive crew...good luck...:thumbsup:..(I use to post the scope everyday) sign the sheet guys...adjust accordingly


Thanks to everyone for the great advice and messages of encouragement! I do have a lot to learn, and know not everyone will be happy when I'm in charge no matter what I do. Learning to not take it personally I think will be the toughest part. 

I don't wear clothes deemed unacceptable, no worries there lol..


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## macmikeman (Jan 23, 2007)

Babies.


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## chewy (May 9, 2010)

macmikeman said:


> Babies.


Do not call one Baby, sweetheart or love.


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## Wibber (Feb 3, 2010)

You are being sized up from two fronts.

Those being supervised by you tend to test whether you can be distracted by disrespecting you by virtue of your sex.

Your employer is checking out whether you get distracted by idiots.

Do your job. Stay focused. Forget your gender. Do not get dragged into tangents by small minds.

While there are challenges unique to your gender - you also have advantages by virtue of it as well. Make use of them.


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## MollyHatchet29 (Jan 24, 2012)

Don't take it personal; it's going to get hard to earn respect no matter what gender if you're an apprentice running a crew of journeymen. With that being said, it must be reiterated that respect is earned. When I was in the Army, I finally earned a spot as a team leader after a short time in. You can never expect your crew/team to do what you're not willing to do yourself. I found out that its one of the best ways to earn it, along with not forgetting where you came from and standing up for your men when the need arises. They have to trust you; know your stuff, do the work with them and prove that you're sharp and aren't afraid to get dirty. Don't get involved in gossip or drama, pretty much keep your nose clean. I'm also a female in the trade and haven't come across many, let alone ones that share my outlook on the gender role as it pertains to being an electrician. You'll always have to disprove the stereotypes and prove that you can and will work, and will use, for example, small stature, eye for detail, whatever it may be, etc to get the job done. The guys I've work with said they respect me for my heart and love of the trade and enjoy working with me. I'll be the first one offering to crawl in small spaces or do tedious tasks. I know I'll never be "one of the guys" but I see them as my brothers. It's gotten me along so far and I hope my advice will do the same for you. Good luck!


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## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)




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## Dennis Alwon (May 9, 2009)

We had a member named electricista (Alice) who appeared to know the NEC well.


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## electricmanscott (Feb 11, 2010)

It's simple, people are aholes as evidenced in this thread. Electricians tend to be snobby stuck up types because we are the most important trade and none of us can be replaced as we are the best. :thumbup:
As for Chewy... Wow


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## Celtic (Nov 19, 2007)

electricmanscott said:


> As for Chewy... Wow


Settle down..
he knows he is both the source and solution for his situation....
nothing to see here...
keep the line moving.

:thumbsup:


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

Celtic said:


> Settle down..
> he knows he is both the source and solution for his situation....
> nothing to see here...
> keep the line moving.
> ...


Hey at least he is being honest.:thumbsup:


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## eejack (Jul 14, 2012)

AlbertaGirl said:


> I'm a 4th year and have been given my own crew at work. Sounds awesome, but it's a struggle trying to get these guys to have level of respect I deserve. Basically the boss is telling me I'm in training to run my own site next year when I've got my ticket. Genius. At this rate I don't think I'll be able to handle 10-15 guys that won't listen to me. Granted they are all 19-22 years old and I'm almost thirty, but I think the fact I'm female really pisses them off. It's like I take away from the manliness of their job or something. Maybe I'm just not that big of a bitch and they sense it. Maybe if I treat them like **** I'll get a little respect? Wtf.. Any ideas?


What I take from this is two things - too many workers to supervise, especially for a green foreman and all of your workers are still children. So you are in the unfortunate position of playing Miss Nancy with a bunch of knuckleheads just exploring the world in what is likely their first job.

Lucky you.

Now I know you have at least one or two of these fellows that you get along with - use that to your advantage. Give them a couple of guys to run and something straightforward to do.

You have at least one really decent mechanic. Give him the dumbest guy in your crew and ask him to help him out.

You have a couple of guys really giving you a hard time. Find the worst possible job, put them on it and forget them. They are already malcontents and it won't get any better with them.

Right now you are getting the respect you deserve, because you have given them no reason to respect you more. 

Don't knitpick and unlike everyone else be positive. A few compliments will go a long way. Don't pick on yourself or anyone else. When someone asks a question and you don't know, don't guess. Tell them you don't know and go and get an answer. Be firm but allow folks to express ideas and opinions.

Casey Stengel once said that the key to managing baseball players was to keep the 4 guys who didn't like you away from the 10 guys who were undecided.


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## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

so......may i ask the ladies of the trade how they handle our upholding the time honored caricature of construction workers when we're _expected_ to ?










~CS~


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

AlbertaGirl said:


> I agree with you on the years, and the boss has said its more of a training exercise than the weight of a foremans position. My foreman is 24 years old, he is running our site which is 3 multi-family buildings, 80 suites each. I have more experience than him in terms of years, and know many things he does not. His advantage is that he is an asshole, and the other guys listen to him, an respect his authority. I am essentially a baby sitter at the moment, just watching and making sure the other guys stay on task and are doing their job correctly. Still being an apprentice I am not held responsible for much. Thankfully. I QC their work, and if something is missed I catch the heat. I guess having a leader type role will look good on a resume, showing maturity and responsibility. anything helps when many companies look at my first name on my resume and toss it aside.
> 
> Just wanting to prove I can handle it, so they can see I'm worth keeping around. But hey, my entire apprenticeship so far has been spent proving to everyone around me that I can do what they can.
> 
> I can bend 1 1/4 Emt by hand, and most of my coworkers cannot. I spent hours refining the techniques when I was on a job and left by myself a lot. I have to work harder than the guys to make sure they see I'm capable and it's seemed to pay off so far. So I've proved I can do the job, and I'm a fairly likeable person and not used to people NOT getting along with me. I thought it would be easier than the work itself, boy was I wrong!





AlbertaGirl said:


> I have to work harder than the guys to make sure they see I'm capable and it's seemed to pay off so far.


Really????:laughing:
Sorry,But everyone on a construction job had better be working as hard as they can and it does not matter what your first name is,If someone is not getting it done daily then they should get sent back to the shop,Every day as an Electrician in the field you and any other electrician must prove they are good enough to have back on the job tomorrow.

As a foreman you should be keeping notes on each electrician you have on the job You must be able to identify who is a slacker and who are the hard workers ,And you must take action call the shop and tell them that you have a slacker and you want him off the job right now then send him/her back to the shop on the spot,Don't allow them to waste your man hours because you will need them at the end of the job ,If you as a foreman is running out of man hours before the job is compleat *YOU* will be fired.Keep that note book on the men in your truck so no one can see it,If you are using an Iphone Ipad ,to identify who is a slacker or lap top keep the notes in there,Do not let anyone see those notes.

To identify who is a slacker keep track of what time they show up in the morning, If your start time is 0700 at that time the guys should know what they will be doing and they should be on the move,Guys that show up after 0700 without calling should be sent to the shop as long as your boss agrees to that but he should some will not,But remember those guys that show up late are eating up your man hours.

I found that you must cut the guys slack on coffee break and lunch the guys will like that ,Just make sure you project manager /or boss knows about it ,Once the extra time is up Snap the whip and get them rolling again.Near the end of the day that is when the real slack masters start showing their faces they will always be first to the gang box wrapping up for the day you need to watch out for that because it is likely they have been coasting for up to 15 minutes before they show up at the gang box.

There is much more too it then what I posted but this will help you develop your style running jobs.
Keep in mind the guys are going to have a hard time respecting you while you are still an apprentice and that will go one till they know you are licensed and have held that license for a while.

Your boss is giving you a gift of learning to run jobs before you become a Journeyman don't let him down.,Ask as many questions as you can think of on how to improve your style of running jobs.

At the end of the day grab that notebook and walk the job and take a good look at what really got done and who did it,The next day you should question why stuff is not getting done in a timely manner and know who was supposed to be doing it take them aside and find out what is going on and they better have a reason.

Also at the end of the day you should have an idea of what everyone will be working on the next day and make sure all the stock is there so the work will get done.,You must stay on top of the stock otherwise you will have guys standing idle because you did not get your stock orders in.

In the morning make sure you are always the first one on the job because you don't want anyone sneaking around the job behind your back talking to the GC's foreman and stabbing you in the back watch out for that as well.

You said your foreman the 24 year old has an advantage because he is an asshole ,foremen who are assholes will never get the full respect of the men in fact that can work against them and can get to the point that the GC's foreman will not want him on the job so you do not want to be an asshole foreman ,but treat all the men in a fair but strict manner.

Also you must find out who is good at what ,If you have guys that are good at running pipe have them run pipe not MC cable,,Find out who is good at cutting in panels ,building electric rooms ECT.

And finally ,This post is way too long even I didn't read it...:laughing:


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## McClary’s Electrical (Feb 21, 2009)

electricmanscott said:


> It's simple, people are aholes as evidenced in this thread. Electricians tend to be snobby stuck up types because we are the most important trade and none of us can be replaced as we are the best. :thumbup:
> As for Chewy... Wow


 
If you believe in fairy tales, Kane killed able. The second person on the earth killed the third person on the earth. Yeah, it's in our nature.


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

mcclary's electrical said:


> If you believe in fairy tales, Kane killed able. The second person on the earth killed the third person on the earth. Yeah, it's in our nature.


:blink::blink:


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## Stickshaker (Jun 29, 2012)

mcclary's electrical said:


> If you believe in fairy tales, Kane killed able. The second person on the earth killed the third person on the earth. Yeah, it's in our nature.


Cain. Abel. Third person killed fourth person. Sorry, I get like this sometimes...:blink:


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## electricmanscott (Feb 11, 2010)

HARRY304E said:


> Really????:laughing:
> Sorry,But everyone on a construction job had better be working as hard as they can and it does not matter what your first name is,If someone is not getting it done daily then they should get sent back to the shop,Every day as an Electrician in the field you and any other electrician must prove they are good enough to have back on the job tomorrow.


^^^Proof that Harry is not a real electrician and has never worked on a construction site. :laughing:


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

electricmanscott said:


> ^^^Proof that Harry is not a real electrician and has never worked on a construction site. :laughing:


That's right and don't you forget it..:laughing:


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## chewy (May 9, 2010)

In my defence I think it is worth mentioning I have only ever seen 2 female tradesman.


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## McClary’s Electrical (Feb 21, 2009)

Dennis Alwon said:


> We had a member named electricista (Alice) who appeared to know the NEC well.


 I remember her, reminded me a lot of you Dennis


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## Dennis Alwon (May 9, 2009)

mcclary's electrical said:


> I remember her, reminded me a lot of you Dennis


Gee I wonder why? :whistling2:


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## chewy (May 9, 2010)

Did it just get ghey in here?


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## Ninja (Aug 31, 2012)

1. An apprentice shouldn't be running work
2. Women shouldn't be in the trade.


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## chewy (May 9, 2010)

Ninja said:


> 1. An apprentice shouldn't be running work
> 2. Women shouldn't be in the trade.


Joe the mechanic?


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## McClary’s Electrical (Feb 21, 2009)

Ninja said:


> 1. An apprentice shouldn't be running work
> 2. Women shouldn't be in the trade.


It happens dude.


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## Dennis Alwon (May 9, 2009)

chewy said:


> Joe the mechanic?


someone looking for attention anyway....


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## Ninja (Aug 31, 2012)

Sorry, my first post on this forum was a little out of line. If I ever have to report to a female foreman, she'll get my respect and I'll do my job.. Just sayin, you never see big multimillion dollar jobs ran by a gal


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## electricista (Jan 11, 2009)

mcclary's electrical said:


> I remember her, reminded me a lot of you Dennis


Are you all talking about me...:thumbup:


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## Semi-Ret Electrician (Nov 10, 2011)

AlbertaGirl said:


> I'm a 4th year and have been given my own crew at work. Sounds awesome, but it's a struggle trying to get these guys to have level of respect I deserve. Basically the boss is telling me I'm in training to run my own site next year when I've got my ticket. Genius. At this rate I don't think I'll be able to handle 10-15 guys that won't listen to me. Granted they are all 19-22 years old and I'm almost thirty, but I think the fact I'm female really pisses them off. It's like I take away from the manliness of their job or something. Maybe I'm just not that big of a bitch and they sense it. Maybe if I treat them like **** I'll get a little respect? Wtf.. Any ideas?


Lots of good advice. Being older than the others is good. Being an apprentice is bad especially if you're supposed to be leading a crew of more experienced guys (hope none are JW's).

Nothing wrong with being a woman in charge of men. Several jobs I've been on have been lead by woman and they had the respect of all 50 of us.

As a supervisor, don't get too bogged down with the tools, if you do you will find you're the only one working. In technical work, a good leader can only directly supervise about 10 people. Make sure the work is well laid out, understood by all and there is material/tools available to proceed.

As pointed out, keep good notes w/ dates and times, a lot of the guys will be keeping notes on you. There may be a time when even your best worker may turn bad and you will need specific notes to correct him/her or fire them. If need, be follow company policy w/ verbal warnings then written warnings. They could save your company 18 months worth of unemployment compensation if you have to let someone go, "w/o cause". 

Spend every off the job you can in a Code Handbook and other technical manuals , your advice must be flawless. When you make a mistake (and you will) admit it and move on. As already pointed out don't guess, the guy who wants your job will be taking notes.

If you want someones attention whisper don't shout. Praise in public, correct in private. 

Defend your crew. Your notes should include above average performance as well as bad. You won't get promoted unless you can nominate someone to succeed yourself.

Remember, with the attitude you've already shown, you will succeed, everyone will soon forget you are woman and there will not be a glass ceiling. But, no one ever gets promoted unless the've already been succesfully doing the next level.:thumbsup:


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

electricista said:


> Are you all talking about me...:thumbup:


Good thing you remembered the password just in case you get banned....:laughing:


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## Shockdoc (Mar 4, 2010)

Just wait until the next generation of our daughters run the field. All the panzie boys will take up jobs in law enforcement.


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## MollyHatchet29 (Jan 24, 2012)

mcclary's electrical said:


> It happens dude.


Someone has to keep the cockroaches off your back.


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## Tsmil (Jul 17, 2011)

mcclary's electrical said:


> If you believe in fairy tales, Kane killed able. The second person on the earth killed the third person on the earth. Yeah, it's in our nature.


I guess this was before women where considered people.


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## Tsmil (Jul 17, 2011)

Ninja said:


> Sorry, my first post on this forum was a little out of line. If I ever have to report to a female foreman, she'll get my respect and I'll do my job.. Just sayin, you never see big multimillion dollar jobs ran by a gal


I'll have to tell my sister that. She is a project manager that has to oversee and schedule all trades on a job site before it is handed over to the owners. Some of those owners include people like Debeers and Enbridge. I would say that these are multi-million dollar projects. Mind you she is not a tradesman but she earns more than most or all here.


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## adroga (Mar 3, 2011)

It is impossible to defeat an ignorant man in argument. ~William G. McAdoo



...


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## MollyHatchet29 (Jan 24, 2012)

Some gals do a fine job. Look at this one working hard right here.


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## macmikeman (Jan 23, 2007)

Babies.


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## Wirenuting (Sep 12, 2010)

macmikeman said:


> Babies.


LoL.


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

MollyHatchet29 said:


> Some gals do a fine job. Look at this one working hard right here.
> 
> .


You need to take up shaving..:laughing:


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## lightingguy (Jun 22, 2012)

MollyHatchet29 said:


> Some gals do a fine job. Look at this one working hard right here.


You sure that's a chick? :laughing:


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## MollyHatchet29 (Jan 24, 2012)

lightingguy said:


> You sure that's a chick? :laughing:


Haha! Sometimes he acts like one. Kidding!!! He's a good dude.


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## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

you lot think working with women in the trades is rough ought to check nout workin' with women FF's.....~CS~


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## Electrician Tyler (Sep 2, 2012)

The way I see it is that some of these thick headed young in's won't ever listen so they'll spend there careers digging ditches. If it requires you screaming it in to their heads then do it.


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## Shockdoc (Mar 4, 2010)

My women at work, mrs shockdoc and little ms shockdoc


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## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

Doc,
we're gonna have to kick you outta the man club if you keep this up.....~CS~


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## Semi-Ret Electrician (Nov 10, 2011)

Ninja said:


> Sorry, my first post on this forum was a little out of line. If I ever have to report to a female foreman, she'll get my respect and I'll do my job.. Just sayin, you never see big multimillion dollar jobs ran by a gal


Sorry fella, you may never see one but many of us have. And, they earned everybody's respect.


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## D-Bo (Apr 15, 2012)

AlbertaGirl said:


> I'm a 4th year and have been given my own crew at work. Sounds awesome, but it's a struggle trying to get these guys to have level of respect I deserve. Basically the boss is telling me I'm in training to run my own site next year when I've got my ticket. Genius. At this rate I don't think I'll be able to handle 10-15 guys that won't listen to me. Granted they are all 19-22 years old and I'm almost thirty, but I think the fact I'm female really pisses them off. It's like I take away from the manliness of their job or something. Maybe I'm just not that big of a bitch and they sense it. Maybe if I treat them like **** I'll get a little respect? Wtf.. Any ideas?


Maybe they have an issue taking directions from an apprentice. A 4th year running work? That's rich


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## Electrician Tyler (Sep 2, 2012)

A lot of commercial companies have apprentices running the show now I've heard of second years doing it.


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## McClary’s Electrical (Feb 21, 2009)

Bad thing is they wanna work in their pajamas:


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## D-Bo (Apr 15, 2012)

Electrician Tyler said:


> A lot of commercial companies have apprentices running the show now I've heard of second years doing it.


How is that even possible


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## AlbertaGirl (May 14, 2012)

D-Bo said:


> How is that even possible


Oh it's possible! I'm guessing you have never worked here in Alberta, our oil industry is booming and a lot of the work force for residential is scarce due to the journeyman rate only being 37/hr rather than 45 in the mod yards and the oil fields. So res takes what it can get, and it's mostly inexperienced first years and apprentices that can't get into industrial because they are green. When I was a first year my foreman was a third year and he was running a massive condo site. 400+ suites!! Welcome to Canada...


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

D-Bo said:


> Maybe they have an issue taking directions from an apprentice. A 4th year running work? That's rich


At 1 year I had a mechanic taking orders from me on a condo project, at 2.5 years I ran mechanics and helpers. Had a few issues but you either learn and move on or fail.


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## macmikeman (Jan 23, 2007)

I had a woman who could wire a house by herself and do a terrific job of it with only 4 months of working with 2 j-men. She was better than them at it at the end of the 4th month working. They were getting kinda resentful when I let her go out on her own without them. But you know what stopped her career in the electrical field?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
?
Babies....


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## Cujo (Feb 4, 2012)

D-Bo said:


> How is that even possible


Well, you see, the second year shows up to work and tells everywhere where he/she wants them to work and what they want them to do. 

But seriously there are a few reasons and things that allow it to happen. There are no checks to make sure there is a proper foreman, at least from the government. Any time I've been on a site the only one who might care is the GC (rarely out side of industrial). Also, it's is getting better but school can fill up quickly and employers often want guys working all the time since it is hard to find people. Not to defend it, but it isnt uncommon for apprentices (especially 4th years) to have 6-7 years experience. There are multiple journeyman at my company who have less experience then me (4th year).


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## Celtic (Nov 19, 2007)

Ninja said:


> Just sayin, you never see big multimillion dollar jobs ran by a gal


Have you been on every big multimillion dollar job?


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## D-Bo (Apr 15, 2012)

AlbertaGirl said:


> Oh it's possible! I'm guessing you have never worked here in Alberta, our oil industry is booming and a lot of the work force for residential is scarce due to the journeyman rate only being 37/hr rather than 45 in the mod yards and the oil fields. So res takes what it can get, and it's mostly inexperienced first years and apprentices that can't get into industrial because they are green. When I was a first year my foreman was a third year and he was running a massive condo site. 400+ suites!! Welcome to Canada...


Okay I get it yeah they got apprentices running work in Canada and no I've never worked there. The point is that maybe your guys take offense to being run by an apprentice because that doesn't say much about their own abilities. I've heard of it happening but I doubt its effectiveness


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## Frasbee (Apr 7, 2008)

I'll tun your **** aoprenties ding k ow to need shot to run a jib. Eleven grd AK vs so easy anyway.


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## chewy (May 9, 2010)

Frasbee said:


> I'll tun your **** aoprenties ding k ow to need shot to run a jib. Eleven grd AK vs so easy anyway.


Are you ok?


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## D-Bo (Apr 15, 2012)

chewy said:


> Are you ok?


No work tomorrow. Lots of us probably got a good shine on.


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## erics37 (May 7, 2009)

Frasbee said:


> I'll tun your **** aoprenties ding k ow to need shot to run a jib. Eleven grd AK vs so easy anyway.


This one's out there even for your light-weight ass :laughing: I think I'm gonna make it my signature


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## MollyHatchet29 (Jan 24, 2012)

mcclary's electrical said:


> Bad thing is they wanna work in their pajamas:


I do my best work in my pajamas! Plus, those pants rock!


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## chewy (May 9, 2010)

MollyHatchet29 said:


> I do my best work in my pajamas! Plus, those pants rock!


First time seeing someone working in PJs, normally they seem reserved for trips to the supermarket on welfare cheque day.


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## D-Bo (Apr 15, 2012)

mcclary's electrical said:


> Bad thing is they wanna work in their pajamas:


That's certainly not helping the cause. No ones getting my respect wearing chit like that to work, man or woman


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## McClary’s Electrical (Feb 21, 2009)

D-Bo said:


> That's certainly not helping the cause. No ones getting respect wearing chit like that to work, man or woman


 
That's not at work, just an inside joke.


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## D-Bo (Apr 15, 2012)

mcclary's electrical said:


> That's not at work, just an inside joke.


Ah 10-4 good buddy


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## chewy (May 9, 2010)

mcclary's electrical said:


> That's not at work, just an inside joke.


What the hell is going on here, some kind of weird pajama kink party? Are you some kind of pimp master?


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## AlbertaGirl (May 14, 2012)

erics37 said:


> This one's out there even for your light-weight ass :laughing: I think I'm gonna make it my signature


Hahahahahaha hahahaha


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## MollyHatchet29 (Jan 24, 2012)

chewy said:


> What the hell is going on here, some kind of weird pajama kink party? Are you some kind of pimp master?


Welllll.... Just that one time... (Bruce said to give him a call someday, McClary. He said you were a cutie). 

I was out of town at a friends house and she wanted me to fix her light. So, I did when I woke up the next day. In my pajamas.


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## McClary’s Electrical (Feb 21, 2009)

Tell Shellie I said HEY!!!:laughing:


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## greenman (Apr 20, 2012)

ar u liceenced


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## MollyHatchet29 (Jan 24, 2012)

greenman said:


> ar u liceenced


From her first post, AlbertaGirl is a 4th year apprentice.


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## Frasbee (Apr 7, 2008)

D-Bo said:


> No work tomorrow. Lots of us probably got a good shine on.


FUUUUUUUUUCK

I still have work today.


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## greenman (Apr 20, 2012)

not to many licensed guys or gails i know would take orders from an apprentice.
4 year is not long time to learn the trade.


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## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

D-Bo said:


> How is that even possible


some states have a license/apprentice ratio

here it's 1:1

not sure about Canada....?

~CS~


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## greenman (Apr 20, 2012)

we have apprentices ratio here in canada.
no one to one yet


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## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

well the thing is, an apprentice can run the show, but it's the license that'll ultimately be responsible for it all ~CS~


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## wcord (Jan 23, 2011)

greenman said:


> we have apprentices ratio here in canada.
> no one to one yet


Manitoba is one to one. Only indentured apprentices and journeymen, no helpers in the system anymore


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## blueheels2 (Apr 22, 2009)

I see 3 reasons why a man would have problems working for a woman.
1. She doesn't know her stuff but chances are if she got the lead role she knows it.
2. You are a Neanderthal.
3. You have a small penis.


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## LightsOn81 (Jan 6, 2012)

I'm in a similar situation where as 4th year, I have picked up the trade quickly, know the code decently and despite my employers efforts to keep me in my place, they have to put me as a lead guy over JWs and mechanics due to their incompetence or apathy. 

I agree that time has to spent in this trade but there has to be some sort of common sense used when choosing leaders. In North Carolina, it's called a limited/intermediate/ unlimited license depending on whichever you apply for. A guy with a license is just that: a guy or gal with a license. It doesn't make you a good leader. It doesn't mean that I should automatically put you in charge of a crew if im the one running my company. without seeing if you can follow first. 
I DON'T KNOW EVERYTHING but I know how to do what I'm told as long as it doesn't endanger others or property. I can read and apply the code and job specs. I can show up on time without being under the influence. I know how to ask questions. I know how to motivate people to work and meet job requirements and production quotas. You can know how to build a space shuttle to get us to mars in two hours but if you can't do the stuff I posted above for the people I work for then you ain't no better than the green helper who ain't qualified to use anything but a shovel and a screwdriver handle. If those pricks want to be in charge they need to either get in line and with the program or start their own company where they can do what they want. Tell em to kick rocks and count light poles on their way to Down The Road Electric.
Some of the biggest hacks and lazy bums I have met have a licenses or journeyman cards. There should be a leadership license for those that are put in charge at a company that they don't own.


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## LightsOn81 (Jan 6, 2012)

chicken steve said:


> well the thing is, an apprentice can run the show, but it's the license that'll ultimately be responsible for it all ~CS~


That's why that superintendent needs to be all in that apprentice or JWs tail making sure they are trusting the right one to get the job done.


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## chewy (May 9, 2010)

I have run guys more experianced and higher paid than me, its not easy and it helps to make an example out of the first one that steps out of line. 

"Piss off back to the office and tell them I dont need you" usually suffices.


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## Electrician Tyler (Sep 2, 2012)

I'm a fourth year as well I just haven't been able to get in for school yet even though I'm well over on hours. As for the newbies that are having trouble listening, guaranteed they will make it to j man but have no clue what to do on a lot of sites because they refused to listen and learn. It's guys like them that give us apprentices reason to run job sites because they have no clue what's going on.


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## adroga (Mar 3, 2011)

Why are some people here ragging on apprentices leading jobs?

It's not their fault , blame management .

My last company of 25 ish sparkies and apprentices had some apprentices run jobs.

Even had the boss say if a 4 th year can run a job then they are fired because they are too expensive.

My question was how could you logically insult a 4 th year for not being able to run jobs but not the journeymen under him?


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## sparky970 (Mar 19, 2008)

If you have to have an apprentice run the show because your JW's are too dumb, good luck.


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## al13nw4r3LC76 (Apr 6, 2009)

I have worked with some good women Electricians but many bad ones. What makes a woman want to work construction? To me it honestly seems to be for the attention. Just being honest. Most guys resent women being in the trade. They are often a distraction in my experience.


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## Frasbee (Apr 7, 2008)

chewy said:


> I dont like being told what to do by women or even men alot more physically smaller than me, thats my problem to deal with and I try make it work but there is often resentment at my end I dont really have control over.


I was running a crew of guys all last week. All of them taller than me.

Guess you and I wouldn't get along. :whistling2:


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## MDShunk (Jan 7, 2007)

al13nw4r3LC76 said:


> I have worked with some good women Electricians but many bad ones. What makes a woman want to work construction? To me it honestly seems to be for the attention. Just being honest. Most guys resent women being in the trade. They are often a distraction in my experience.


My experience is just the opposite. The women I've been around worked extra hard to fit in, and most were built more like men than women.


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## Shockdoc (Mar 4, 2010)




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## bruce6670 (Apr 27, 2010)

I would have no problem working for a woman if she knew what she was doing. Working for an apprentice is another story. Kinda like the principle taking direction from a student.


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## AlbertaGirl (May 14, 2012)

al13nw4r3LC76 said:


> I have worked with some good women Electricians but many bad ones. What makes a woman want to work construction? To me it honestly seems to be for the attention. Just being honest. Most guys resent women being in the trade. They are often a distraction in my experience.


 
If I wanted attention I would have been a stripper. Unfortunately for you I have the brains to do better. I wanted to work construction so I could help to support my family, my 3 kids and my mortgage. If your so distracted by women then maybe you should have chosen a different career, like janitor of a mens brothel. Just being honest.

See these are the people I know I will have to deal with in the entirety of my career working in construction. To the guy who called me whiny.. I do have the proof to back up my claims as this joker shows. No matter what your dealing with people who don't want you around. I'm okay with that. Being in charge of someone who thinks this way just makes a supervisor role even harder than it has to be. I have so many great ideas from people here that I wonder why I didn't post something like this sooner. 

Thanks again to you guys for your suggestions, back to work tomorrow armed with new strategies to be a better leader. :thumbsup:


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## chewy (May 9, 2010)

Frasbee said:


> I was running a crew of guys all last week. All of them taller than me.
> 
> Guess you and I wouldn't get along. :whistling2:


Depends, ideally I would see you at 6:45am and we would talk about what we are doing, I would get nessacery drawings and material off you and go do my thing. I would see you at 10am for smoko, give you a quick update then we would have non work related conversation then I would go do my thing, see you again at 1pm for lunch, tell you where Im at and non work related conversation again then I go do my thing until 4:30 where I give you a full rundown and return unused material and drawings and I go home. If you start bird dogging me then Im afraid my tolerance for that is directly proportionate to your size :laughing:


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## carri (Feb 26, 2012)

I am female taking the apprenticeship electrical test soon, at the UAW in Belvidere Illinois. I work at Chrysler.


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## McClary’s Electrical (Feb 21, 2009)

carri said:


> I am female taking the apprenti. Electrical test soon. at the UAW in Belvidere Illinois I work at Chrysler.


 
Is English/ punctuation part of the test?


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## MDShunk (Jan 7, 2007)

carri said:


> I am female taking the apprenti. Electrical test soon. at the UAW in Belvidere Illinois I work at Chrysler.


 I was recently at Chrysler HQ in Auburn Hills, MI. Massive place. More like it's own county.


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## greenman (Apr 20, 2012)

one of the best apprentice i had was a female.


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## carri (Feb 26, 2012)

Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.
Albert Einstein


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## carri (Feb 26, 2012)

MDShunk said:


> I was recently at Chrysler HQ in Auburn Hills, MI. Massive place. More like it's own county.


 Yes Chrysler in Belvidere is huge. I work up in paint. They are setting up for a test coming soon. hiring some line workers to take the skilled trades test. aren't you still at Chrysler? I will post my picture on this site when I figure out how to navigate.


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## sparky105 (Sep 29, 2009)

Working for a woman not a big deal. Working for a snot nose apprentice(not caring how old or thier gender) not in a millin years apprentice is there to learn and do as I say not learn and tell me what to do that is not learning that is ********


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## MDShunk (Jan 7, 2007)

carri said:


> Yes Chrysler in Belvidere is huge. I work up in paint. They are setting up for a test coming soon. hiring some line workers to take the skilled trades test. aren't you still at Chrysler? I will post my picture on this site when I figure out how to navigate.


No. I was in Detroit taking a class, and a Chrysler engineer was in the class that offered to show me some stuff in the place. I did get to see some of the paint line bot arms, though (through the glass).


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## McClary’s Electrical (Feb 21, 2009)

carri said:


> Great spirits have always encountered violent opposition from mediocre minds.
> Albert Einstein


 
Well cool, you can copy a quote with no typos. Or did you cut and paste?


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## D-Bo (Apr 15, 2012)

No problem with female trade workers. But the impression I got from most I worked with was they usually had some chip on their shoulder like they had something to prove and that resulted in poor attitude. Don't care you're a woman in a male dominated field,congratulations, just show up on time do your work and don't get me killed.


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## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

Let the work do the talkin' D Bo?

such a novel idea....

~CS~


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## MollyHatchet29 (Jan 24, 2012)

I never thought of any job I did was because I wanted attention. I can only speak for myself in that regard. You could call me a nerd, or a rare breed, whatever, but I really enjoy doing electric work. It makes me feel good about myself and keeps me interested. Since I was young, I've always had more guy friends than girls; honestly I find most to be whiny and full of drama and easily offended by my tell it like it is attitude. If some of you are easily distracted by females in the job, then you need to get your hormones in check. I'm not trying to be a distraction; I'm there to get the job done and learn some ish.


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## Frasbee (Apr 7, 2008)

chewy said:


> Depends, ideally I would see you at 6:45am and we would talk about what we are doing, I would get nessacery drawings and material off you and go do my thing. I would see you at 10am for smoko, give you a quick update then we would have non work related conversation then I would go do my thing, see you again at 1pm for lunch, tell you where Im at and non work related conversation again then I go do my thing until 4:30 where I give you a full rundown and return unused material and drawings and I go home. If you start bird dogging me then Im afraid my tolerance for that is directly proportionate to your size :laughing:


Micromanagement is a poor leadership style to begin with. I've watched small quiet men lead large jobs and large outspoken men struggle with small crews. Respect. Earned and given has worked well for me so far.


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## erics37 (May 7, 2009)

Frasbee said:


> I'll tun your **** aoprenties ding k ow to need shot to run a jib. Eleven grd AK vs so easy anyway.





Frasbee said:


> Micromanagement is a poor leadership style to begin with. I've watched small quiet men lead large jobs and large outspoken men struggle with small crews. Respect. Earned and given has worked well for me so far.


Like night and day :laughing::thumbup:


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## chewy (May 9, 2010)

Frasbee said:


> Micromanagement is a poor leadership style to begin with. I've watched small quiet men lead large jobs and large outspoken men struggle with small crews. Respect. Earned and given has worked well for me so far.


I couldn't agree more, I work with a guy thats about 5 foot 6 and weighs about 60kg and we get along fine because of mutual respect and we compliment each other, I can lift him up into ceilings if we can't be bothered getting our ladder and I can carry drums of cable when we don't have a cart. As D-bo mentioned I just seem to notice some people can develop a chip on their shoulder, I guess smaller guys seems to have a harder time coming up in some cases so are more likely to have a chip on their shoulder not to say guys larger than I can't be arrogant ****heads. Its a broad spectrum.


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## MollyHatchet29 (Jan 24, 2012)

chewy said:


> I couldn't agree more, I work with a guy thats about 5 foot 6 and weighs about 60kg and we get along fine because of mutual respect and we compliment each other, I can lift him up into ceilings if we can't be bothered getting our ladder and I can carry drums of cable when we don't have a cart. As D-bo mentioned I just seem to notice some people can develop a chip on their shoulder, I guess smaller guys seems to have a harder time coming up in some cases so are more likely to have a chip on their shoulder not to say guys larger than I can't be arrogant ****heads. Its a broad spectrum.


Awww it's like Rob and Big! "People let me tell ya 'bout my bestttt friend!".


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## chewy (May 9, 2010)

MollyHatchet29 said:


> I never thought of any job I did was because I wanted attention. I can only speak for myself in that regard. You could call me a nerd, or a rare breed, whatever, but I really enjoy doing electric work. It makes me feel good about myself and keeps me interested. Since I was young, I've always had more guy friends than girls; honestly I find most to be whiny and full of drama and easily offended by my tell it like it is attitude. If some of you are easily distracted by females in the job, then you need to get your hormones in check. I'm not trying to be a distraction; I'm there to get the job done and learn some ish.


I'm going to be totally honest, even if a lady wasn't what most would consider attractive and she was dressed down in work clothes... anything female looks good on a construction site, men think about sex like every 6 seconds or something, your never going to stop men doing that I don't think. I'm single so I constantly think about it, If I was on hour 10 of a 12 hr shift and a bird came up to me and said hey how about we go behind the riser and you know, I'm not going to go "oh no thats unprofessional blah blah blah" I'm going to take her to pound town and leave her in a smoking pile. Your not distracting us, we distract ourselves, its the way we are hardwired. We successfully integrated females into office work so I'm sure once we get more females into construction they won't be such a novelty and we will just carry on and get work done.


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## chewy (May 9, 2010)

MollyHatchet29 said:


> Awww it's like Rob and Big! "People let me tell ya 'bout my bestttt friend!".


I'm white but I had a maori guy I worked with, I was White Rhino and he was Brown sugar. :laughing:


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## MDShunk (Jan 7, 2007)

chewy said:


> I'm going to be totally honest, even if a lady wasn't what most would consider attractive and she was dressed down in work clothes... anything female looks good on a construction site, men think about sex like every 6 seconds or something, your never going to stop men doing that I don't think. I'm single so I constantly think about it, If I was on hour 10 of a 12 hr shift and a bird came up to me and said hey how about we go behind the riser and you know, I'm not going to go "oh no thats unprofessional blah blah blah" I'm going to take her to pound town and leave her in a smoking pile. Your not distracting us, we distract ourselves, its the way we are hardwired. We successfully integrated females into office work so I'm sure once we get more females into construction they won't be such a novelty and we will just carry on and get work done.


I don't know, man. My marriage is important to me.


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## chewy (May 9, 2010)

MDShunk said:


> I don't know, man. My marriage is important to me.


Yeah I'm talking about being single, I can wait 14hrs for nookie but if you don't know when your next is coming you take what you can get. :laughing:


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## user4818 (Jan 15, 2009)

MDShunk said:


> I was recently at Chrysler HQ in Auburn Hills, MI. Massive place. More like it's own county.


Closest I've been is the Chrysler museum which is on the same campus. Pretty cool place, too bad they happen to make Chrysler products there, though.


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## MDShunk (Jan 7, 2007)

Peter D said:


> Closest I've been is the Chrysler museum which is on the same campus. Pretty cool place, too bad they happen to make Chrysler products there, though.


Yes, I went to the museum also. I wanted to see the turbine car, and thankfully they had one on display. That was all I really wanted to see, but I looked at everything. They had that crazy one-off motorcycle they built with tandem front and rear wheels. That thing looks nuts. I'm a sucker for a museum, no matter who's name is above the door.


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## D-Bo (Apr 15, 2012)

chewy said:


> We successfully integrated females into office work...


Hahaha that's fricking great! And perhaps another con with women in the workplace. I won't curb off color conversation to protect anybodys delicate sensibilities. I can't talk about my latest sexual conquests with my girlfriend or my wife so that leaves only work


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## user4818 (Jan 15, 2009)

MDShunk said:


> Yes, I went to the museum also. I wanted to see the turbine car, and thankfully they had one on display. That was all I really wanted to see, but I looked at everything. They had that crazy one-off motorcycle they built with tandem front and rear wheels. That thing looks nuts. I'm a sucker for a museum, no matter who's name is above the door.


No jet car when I was there.  Did you see the Ford museum too?


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## adroga (Mar 3, 2011)

sparky105 said:


> Working for a woman not a big deal. Working for a snot nose apprentice(not caring how old or thier gender) not in a millin years apprentice is there to learn and do as I say not learn and tell me what to do that is not learning that is ********



I understand your attitude towards a snot nosed apprentice, but to be more critically analyzing This situation the question to ask us why are YOU not in charge and apprentice is?

Bosses son.. Fine deal with it diplomatically 

Management thinks an apprentice should lead you, then you have some hard questions to as yourself.


----------



## chewy (May 9, 2010)

D-Bo said:


> Hahaha that's fricking great! And perhaps another con with women in the workplace. I won't curb off color conversation to protect anybodys delicate sensibilities. I can't talk about my latest sexual conquests with my girlfriend or my wife so that leaves only work


So long as we can get past the double standard and allow any female members of the crew to talk about any whang they smashed in the weekend. :laughing:


----------



## D-Bo (Apr 15, 2012)

chewy said:


> So long as we can get past the double standard and allow any female members of the crew to talk about any whang they smashed in the weekend. :laughing:


The ones I've known would be more interested in my weekend exploits...if you catch my drift...


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## MDShunk (Jan 7, 2007)

Peter D said:


> No jet car when I was there.  Did you see the Ford museum too?


No. I should have changed my flight to see some more stuff in hindsight. No big deal. I was surprised at how courteous the drivers were in the Detroit area for it being a big city and all. Nothing at all like the DC and Baltimore traffic around here.


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## user4818 (Jan 15, 2009)

MDShunk said:


> No. I should have changed my flight to see some more stuff in hindsight. No big deal. I was surprised at how courteous the drivers were in the Detroit area for it being a big city and all. Nothing at all like the DC and Baltimore traffic around here.


I highly recommend the Ford museum.

The other funny thing about driving in Detroit and surrounding areas is seeing 95% American made (or at least Big 3 branded) vehicles on the road.


----------



## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

chewy said:


> I'm going to be totally honest, even if a lady wasn't what most would consider attractive and she was dressed down in work clothes... anything female looks good on a construction site, men think about sex like every 6 seconds or something, your never going to stop men doing that I don't think. I'm single so I constantly think about it, If I was on hour 10 of a 12 hr shift and a bird came up to me and said hey how about we go behind the riser and you know, I'm not going to go "oh no thats unprofessional blah blah blah" I'm going to take her to pound town and leave her in a smoking pile. Your not distracting us, we distract ourselves, its the way we are hardwired. We successfully integrated females into office work so I'm sure once we get more females into construction they won't be such a novelty and we will just carry on and get work done.


One company i worked had a M / F couple caught by a customer doin' the wild thing in the basement 

(yeah, i said _basement?_ too....)

anyways, they were fired, shunned, flogged, etc ad nasuem....

they opened their doors shortly after, word gets around about such debaucheries rather quickly in a small pond and all....

and where hired by many in the local area

talk about a F*ckin biz plan......

~CS~


----------



## chewy (May 9, 2010)

chicken steve said:


> One company i worked had a M / F couple caught by a customer doin' the wild thing in the basement
> 
> (yeah, i said basement? too....)
> 
> ...


While were on the subject of basements and debauchery Stevie me ole china plate, heres a funny story: 

My mates were working in a Hospital and you know the extensive basement and tunnels systems they have, as the hospital aged from the 60's certain tracts of tunnels and rooms were forgotten...

During a renovation of the hospital my 2 mates were scoping out cable runs and came across a room that contained a mattress, candles and pornographic magazines. At smoko it was mentioned as a bit of a laugh and my other 2 mates went to go and check it out, they went down the tunnel and rounded the corner to find 2 dudes going at it! They came back as white as ghosts! :laughing:


----------



## Amish Electrician (Jan 2, 2010)

Consider this the start of your 'apprenticeship' in leadership.

Your attitude and approach can have a major influence. You need to earn their respect. You also need to LISTEN and *observe.*

Sure, a little pep talk can help. Tell them you're all in ittogether, that the way for them to look good is for YOU to look good. Tell them it's your job to make sure they can do theirs. Tell them what needs to be done, and get out of the way.

I've also had good results by starting off telling the guys that we're all adults, we're all pros, and that I expect everyone to behave accordingly.

Otherwise, it's your job to monitor things. If instructions are not being followed, you have to find the problem and fix it. You've got some tools in your box; use them.

These tools include work assigments and scheduling. Someone has a marked lack of enthusiasm on Tuesday, tell him to come in at 12 Wednesday. Hit him in the pocketbook. Or, assign him to the sewage pit rewire. Don't hesitate to send him back to the office. You have a customer to please, and don't have time for kid games.


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## user8640521 (Jan 17, 2009)

Ninja said:


> Sorry, my first post on this forum was a little out of line. If I ever have to report to a female foreman, she'll get my respect and I'll do my job.. Just sayin, you never see big multimillion dollar jobs ran by a gal


one of the larger shops in this area, runs about $70M a year,
has a woman as a CEO.

business is solidly profitable. has been for the 18 years she has
been running it.


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## John Valdes (May 17, 2007)

brian john said:


> A pair of cable cutters can fix that,


And a pair of tweezers.



mcclary's electrical said:


> If you believe in fairy tales, Kane killed able.


And if you believe in fairy tales, Able messed with his mother Eve. 
I mean we do have more than three people on the earth.



LightsOn81 said:


> That's why that superintendent needs to be all in that apprentice or JWs tail


Not so. Its wrong. :laughing:


----------



## Frasbee (Apr 7, 2008)

erics37 said:


> Like night and day :laughing::thumbup:












That was the captain speaking. :thumbsup:

Not sure what he was trying to say though...:blink:


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## electrictim510 (Sep 9, 2008)

Just my opinion; Do not try to hard to prove anything to the guys around you. Every female I have worked around in the trade except one was always trying to prove themselves and therefore never got anywhere. Best thing to do is just do your job to the best of your ability and whatever happens happens. Just let the jokes slide off of you, being an apprentice they will find something to pick at you about and you just happen to be an easy target being a female. You will get more respect for how you take it rather than how you respond.


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## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

any true capitalist doesn't see in gender ,or race

it's who gets it done, how fast, and how good....

~CS~


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## Shockdoc (Mar 4, 2010)

Not to sound sexist or anything but, this country did roll alot better back in thr 40s and 50s when mom raised the kids at home and the man brought home the bacon. Kids had more respect and more of their parents time. This economy forces all parties of the home to work in order to live.


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## Frasbee (Apr 7, 2008)

Shockdoc said:


> Not to sound sexist or anything but, this country did roll alot better back in thr 40s and 50s when mom raised the kids at home and the man brought home the bacon. Kids had more respect and more of their parents time. This economy forces all parties of the home to work in order to live.


We need to reassess our priorities as a society.

Here's an interesting thought, though it wouldn't apply to our kind of profession. Well, it could, but it seems guys have mixed results with it.

"Results only work environment/ROWE"

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=124705801


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## 99cents (Aug 20, 2012)

Are you supposed to be telling journeymen what to do? What's your ratio, journeyman to apprentice? If a 4th year is running a crew then it sounds to me like somebody forgot to read the Alberta Electrical Trade Regulation. I don't care how common it is, if somebody is abusing the journeyman to apprentice ratio then he has no respect for the trade or the people who work for him. Maybe your problem isn't with the crew but the jerk you're working for.


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## Frasbee (Apr 7, 2008)

The "meritshop" system would dictate that the apprentice be paid the journeyman wage and the journey step down to an apprentice wage.


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## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

Shockdoc said:


> Not to sound sexist or anything but, this country did roll alot better back in thr 40s and 50s when mom raised the kids at home and the man brought home the bacon. Kids had more respect and more of their parents time. This economy forces all parties of the home to work in order to live.


not sexist, _classist_ Doc

at least the slaves of the old world _knew_ they were subjucated....

~CS~


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## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

Frasbee said:


> The "meritshop" system would dictate that the apprentice be paid the journeyman wage and the journey step down to an apprentice wage.


 
if this _were_ a meritocracy, this old master would be buying a lotta coffee and jelly donuts for those 4th yr _hotshots_ Fras

and you know what? if they were mining for gold on _my_ dime, that's exactly what i'd be doing

~CS~


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

Frasbee said:


> We need to reassess our priorities as a society.
> 
> Here's an interesting thought, though it wouldn't apply to our kind of profession. Well, it could, but it seems guys have mixed results with it.
> 
> ...


When I was making "A" scale my wife and I decided that she would stay home and raise the kids.

About 30% of the men that work for me have stay at home wires/moms.

It is a choice on how you decide to live, Child care, extra clothes, car and someone else raising your kids....A no brainer here.


----------



## Shockdoc (Mar 4, 2010)

Here on the island the only stay at homes are the banking / wall street types whos wives have nannies to raise the kids anyway. Nice to see things are different in other parts of the country. Middle class requires two working members here to afford the "great luxuries" and high taxes of Long Island.


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## adroga (Mar 3, 2011)

It's nice to dream about a spouse staying home and taking car of the kids but like many have said here, it takes 2 salaries today to maintain a decent standard of living.

The other thing that most guys in our male dominated macho way of living have yet to realize that woman are becoming on average higher educated and will be earning bigger paychecks so as a result it would be you staying home since you make less than her, how would this affect your decision?


----------



## ace24wright (Jul 10, 2012)

adroga said:


> It's nice to dream about a spouse staying home and taking car of the kids but like many have said here, it takes 2 salaries today to maintain a decent standard of living.
> 
> The other thing that most guys in our male dominated macho way of living have yet to realize that woman are becoming on average higher educated and will be earning bigger paychecks so as a result it would be you staying home since you make less than her, how would this affect your decision?


 Oh Yeah, think of all the X-box time in between loads of laundry!


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## electrictim510 (Sep 9, 2008)

adroga said:


> It's nice to dream about a spouse staying home and taking car of the kids but like many have said here, it takes 2 salaries today to maintain a decent standard of living.
> 
> The other thing that most guys in our male dominated macho way of living have yet to realize that woman are becoming on average higher educated and will be earning bigger paychecks so as a result it would be you staying home since you make less than her, how would this affect your decision?


Ive heard this before but I am wondering where they get their source from. I think it is a bunch of bull. Probably written by a woman, or gay man. My wife is a stay at home mom, its best for our kids and our family as a whole. If she would of been the bread winner it would of went the opposite way and I would of stayed home. Ive seen very very few woman financially dominated households myself.


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## Wirenuting (Sep 12, 2010)

adroga said:


> It's nice to dream about a spouse staying home and taking car of the kids but like many have said here, it takes 2 salaries today to maintain a decent standard of living.
> 
> The other thing that most guys in our male dominated macho way of living have yet to realize that woman are becoming on average higher educated and will be earning bigger paychecks so as a result it would be you staying home since you make less than her, how would this affect your decision?


My wife makes more then me. 
That's ok in my book. 

She threatens to hire an electrician to fix the ceiling fan in my den. 
Some day I might take her up on it. LoL


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## adroga (Mar 3, 2011)

Higher percentage of women are graduating with university and higher degrees..

Statistically speaking its only a matter of time before they dominate households as wage earners.


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## electrictim510 (Sep 9, 2008)

adroga said:


> Higher percentage of women are graduating with university and higher degrees..
> 
> Statistically speaking its only a matter of time before they dominate households as wage earners.


 
Statistics are misleading and usually biased. I know many a loser who did not use their degrees.


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## Frasbee (Apr 7, 2008)

adroga said:


> Higher percentage of women are graduating with university and higher degrees..
> 
> Statistically speaking its only a matter of time before they dominate households as wage earners.


Cool.

She makes the money and cooks me dinner. :thumbup:


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## carri (Feb 26, 2012)

Just remember Electrical union sister keep your chin up. You are doing a good thing. My grandfather was an electrician and my dad was an engineer. God put you there for a reason. Bless you.


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## McClary’s Electrical (Feb 21, 2009)

Wirenuting said:


> My wife makes more then me.
> That's ok in my book.
> 
> She threatens to hire an electrician to fix the ceiling fan in my den.
> Some day I might take her up on it. LoL


 
It woud actually be cool to hire an electrician and what how he handles himself and see what lines of BS he throws around. All those money hungry crook contractors.


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## adroga (Mar 3, 2011)

electrictim510 said:


> Statistics are misleading and usually biased. I know many a loser who did not use their degrees.


Most of them were probably men who didn't know what they wanted..

Most women I know have juggled university a career and family while the tradesmen works and comes home waiting for dinner and the house cleaned... You guys that bash women really have no clue ..


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## electrictim510 (Sep 9, 2008)

adroga said:


> Most of them were probably men who didn't know what they wanted..
> 
> Most women I know have juggled university a career and family while the tradesmen works and comes home waiting for dinner and the house cleaned... You guys that bash women really have no clue ..


Nope. Mostly women who get knocked up, then decide not to pursue. The rest were basically split 50/50 men and women. Didnt make an exact count, but those numbers are pretty accurate from my experience anyway.


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## chewy (May 9, 2010)

Sometimes getting pregnant can mean they do pursue something.

My Mum is from a small mining town with a population of less than 2000, never finished school and was working in a deli when she meet my dad and thought that was all she would ever be good for.

She had 3 boys then went to work as a bank teller, she moved up into a running a team at the call centre, then moved up to managing a call centre in our state Telecommunications provider, she then moved up the corporate ladder and is now one of the most sought after fixed term contract project managers in the country, earns a lot more than my dad and they now have a huge property portfolio and are talking about retiring in the next couple of years. She always says its not what you know its who you know and preaches the importance of networking and something nice you do for someone one day might mean something nice for you tomorrow.


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## MollyHatchet29 (Jan 24, 2012)

Heck yea. Mom Power. My mom was a stay at home housewife. She's said to me recently that she wishes she would have worked part time. With her in her mid 50s, no marketable skills and today's job market, almost no one would hire someone that far removed. So, she says she's stuck being a housewife and hates it. (She's not stuck, just won't try at all) I'm grateful that she was always there for us as kids, but feel for her in many ways. I'm also grateful I realized I didn't want to be that. I work, bust my butt at home, do very well in school and I'm always there for my daughter. It's all part of my plan to provide the best for her and be a great role model in hopes that she'll see that working hard to get what you want pays off. Nothing in life is free.


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## backstay (Feb 3, 2011)

My wife has stayed at home and raised two kids. Both are doing great. We went without the extras(boats, 4 wheelers, big vacations, etc)But the time spent with family was and still is priceless. Now we're getting grandchildren, and hope to spend the quality time with them.


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

backstay said:


> My wife has stayed at home and raised two kids. Both are doing great. We went without the extras(boats, 4 wheelers, big vacations, etc)But the time spent with family was and still is priceless. Now we're getting grandchildren, and hope to spend the quality time with them.


Choices have to be made and sometimes the only choice is work, we all do what we must. BUT, I had a guy working for me and he could not do OT because of his wife's job. I sat down with him and we discussed the lack of OT, with the overtime he made more money than she did, with her clothes, wear and tear on car, tolls, gas and child care her working was costing them money.

He went home and laid it all out for her, her response was "I don't care that it cost us money, if you think I am staying home all days with these kids you are FU*KING CRAZY.


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## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

chewy said:


> She had 3 boys .


i'm one of 3 brothers

I can still recall being told _'bleed outside!'_....

~CS~


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## sparky105 (Sep 29, 2009)

adroga said:


> I understand your attitude towards a snot nosed apprentice, but to be more critically analyzing This situation the question to ask us why are YOU not in charge and apprentice is?
> 
> Bosses son.. Fine deal with it diplomatically
> 
> Management thinks an apprentice should lead you, then you have some hard questions to as yourself.


There is not one sinario that this would happen on any sight I work on but I have heard it happening. what is even better then apprentice running a job is a first year jm thinking when they passed the test they got a God card and can ramrod a bunch of 20 yr guys. As far as I'm concerned they just got a ticket to learn not lead.


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## aDudeInPhx (Feb 20, 2012)

Frasbee said:


> I'll tun your **** aoprenties ding k ow to need shot to run a jib. Eleven grd AK vs so easy anyway.





erics37 said:


> This one's out there even for your light-weight ass :laughing: I think I'm gonna make it my signature


That is some funny shot, still lmao at it :lol: :lol: :lol:


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## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

_light wieght a*s....?_

perhaps at my age i should be opining in the positive, some of these trade fillies might have the distance on me.....~CS~


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## MollyHatchet29 (Jan 24, 2012)

chicken steve said:


> light wieght a*s....?
> 
> perhaps at my age i should be opining in the positive, some of these trade fillies might have the distance on me.....~CS~


Translation?


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## chewy (May 9, 2010)

MollyHatchet29 said:


> Translation?


He isnt aware Frasbee has a smaller physique.

He is going to stay positive, some of the woman in the trade might have more stamina than he does so Women in the trade cannot be bad at all.


----------



## MollyHatchet29 (Jan 24, 2012)

chewy said:


> He isnt aware Frasbee has a smaller physique.
> 
> He is going to stay positive, some of the woman in the trade might have more stamina than he does so Women in the trade cannot be bad at all.


Ahhh thanks, Chewy. Good Wookie. I don't speak Kashyykian.


----------



## mtylerb (Apr 18, 2012)

wcord said:


> Manitoba is one to one. Only indentured apprentices and journeymen, no helpers in the system anymore


2:1 in AB. 4th years aren't counted in that ratio. 4th year is allowed to work on their own, but can't have the two apprentices assigned to them inasfar as employment counts are concerned.

Ontario is ... interesting:

Canlii:


> *8. *(1) The number of apprentices who may be employed by an employer in the certified trade shall not exceed the number set out in Column 2 of the Table opposite the number of journeymen employed by the employer set out in Column 1. TABLE​
> 
> ```
> Column 1                             Column 2
> ...





sparky105 said:


> Working for a woman not a big deal. Working for a snot nose apprentice(not caring how old or thier gender) not in a millin years apprentice is there to learn and do as I say not learn and tell me what to do that is not learning that is ********


Leadership is a skill that needs to be learned. So a 4th year learning the ins and outs of directing a job site is just fine by me. So long as there is a Journeyperson that is ultimately responsible for the work and can provide direction to the 4th year if a mistake is made. No different, though, for a Journeyperson in a leadership role. There needs to be accountability somewhere. I also see nothing wrong with throwing a 4th year "to the wolves" to learn how to direct a crew. Sometimes it's the best way to learn.



99cents said:


> Are you supposed to be telling journeymen what to do? What's your ratio, journeyman to apprentice? If a 4th year is running a crew then it sounds to me like somebody forgot to read the Alberta Electrical Trade Regulation. I don't care how common it is, if somebody is abusing the journeyman to apprentice ratio then he has no respect for the trade or the people who work for him. Maybe your problem isn't with the crew but the jerk you're working for.


Canlii:


> *Employment of apprentices*
> 
> *5**(1)* Where a person employs an apprentice, that employment must be carried out in accordance with this section.
> 
> ...


There isn't much more, other than wages and a description of what the job entails in the regulation. Surely nothing that says a 4th year cannot direct a Journeyperson as part of their duties.


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## Legacyelectric (Sep 9, 2012)

I started out in the trade having been educated in the Navy as a nuclear electronics technician. I knew the theory better than most on my first day as a helper. I worked with a guy who was also a neighbor who had been with the company for 13 years at the time. Two years in and I was running jobs, telling the guy who had been there since I was a 7 year old what to do. Awkward. All it ultimately took was a good conversation about it all. 

That being said, I wouldn't be thrilled about my wife or daughter working construction.


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## eejack (Jul 14, 2012)

mtylerb said:


> Surely nothing that says a 4th year cannot direct a Journeyperson as part of their duties.


Part of my CBA ( IBEW Local #164) ...

10.13 An Apprentice is to be under the supervision of a Journeyman Wireman at all times.

< snip things about the journeyman supervising the apprentice >

An Apprentice shall not be the first person assigned to a job site and apprentices shall not supervise the work of others.


----------



## black (Oct 12, 2011)

Shockdoc said:


> Not to sound sexist or anything but, this country did roll alot better back in thr 40s and 50s when mom raised the kids at home and the man brought home the bacon. Kids had more respect and more of their parents time. This economy forces all parties of the home to work in order to live.


It's not sexist. I *know* you were thinking that men could stay home and raise the children. I am completely sure you weren't assuming that child rearing would automatically be done by women. 

:icon_cheesygrin:


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## chewy (May 9, 2010)

This thread is Cletis without Boobs.


----------



## backstay (Feb 3, 2011)

chewy said:


> this thread is cletis without boobs.


----------



## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

chewy said:


> This thread is Cletis without Boobs.


now _there's_ an image fit for birth control.....~CS~


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## MollyHatchet29 (Jan 24, 2012)

Cletis! With boobs!


----------



## chewy (May 9, 2010)

MollyHatchet29 said:


> Cletis! With boobs!


He's got cookie nips!


----------



## John Valdes (May 17, 2007)

brian john said:


> It is a choice on how you decide to live, Child care, extra clothes, car and someone else raising your kids....A no brainer here.


Choice? What about the folks that make minimum wage Brian?
Not everyone has the ability to live as you have. There are many families with children that MUST have both parents at work to survive.




Shockdoc said:


> Here on the island the only stay at homes are the banking / wall street types whos wives have nannies to raise the kids anyway. Nice to see things are different in other parts of the country. Middle class requires two working members here to afford the "great luxuries" and high taxes of Long Island.


They do here to Doc. Not everyone has a high paying job like many of us have or had.
It took both of us to get by. That's why my wife is my partner and not some slave just to cook and clean.



adroga said:


> The other thing that most guys in our male dominated macho way of living have yet to realize that woman are becoming on average higher educated and will be earning bigger paychecks so as a result it would be you staying home since you make less than her, how would this affect your decision?


It's a fact girls and women excel in school and can be healthy income earners. I am all for it. If the women can do the job, they deserve what the job would pay a man.



brian john said:


> Choices have to be made and sometimes the only choice is work, we all do what we must. BUT, I had a guy working for me and he could not do OT because of his wife's job. I sat down with him and we discussed the lack of OT, with the overtime he made more money than she did, with her clothes, wear and tear on car, tolls, gas and child care her working was costing them money.
> 
> He went home and laid it all out for her, her response was "I don't care that it cost us money, if you think I am staying home all days with these kids you are FU*KING CRAZY.


Some women are just meant for the workplace and want to succeed just like you do. I applaud the wife for sticking to her guns, even if the numbers did not jive.


----------



## black (Oct 12, 2011)

Resources about female electricians and women in the trades:

"Live Wire" by Francine Moccio - a really interesting book about female electricians. It focuses on women in IBEW Local 3. Do a google video search for "live wire book talk." it's a panel including the author and several of the women interviewed for the book. 

"We'll Call You If We Need You" by Susan Eisenberg. Susan was in Local 103 for 18 years and wrote this book about women in the trades. A google video search of her name shows some talks she has given. She also writes a really good blog. Search "Susan Eisenberg blog."

There is a book and website called "Sisters in the Brotherhoods" by Jane LaTour. 

I'll include links later (on a crappy computer right now).


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## bobelectric (Feb 24, 2007)

Not interested.


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## Shockdoc (Mar 4, 2010)

Perhaps they should sue to have it renamed ISEW.........the sisterhood.


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## Going_Commando (Oct 1, 2011)

Shockdoc said:


> Perhaps they should sue to have it renamed ISEW.........the sisterhood.


That would be fitting regardless of whether they were any females in the locals or not. I have never seen more gossip and clucking like a bunch of hens than from union workers. Of course, I am sure that isn't the case for all unions, just all the ones I have been in contact with, regardless of trade. :whistling2:

Also wanted to add, to try and keep this kind of on topic, if a female can meet the requirements of the job and can complete installs in a neat and workmanlike (workpersonlike?) manner, I have no problem with it whatsoever. In fact, I could not care any less if its a man or woman wearing a pouch. I just want to get my job done, do it well, and hopefully have it go smoothly so I can get a paycheck and be proud of my work. I find it refreshing when there are women around on jobs anyways. They give me something to look at, and it cleans up my language a bit. I tend to get a bit harsh when I spend a lot of time on a construction site, and sometimes it has a way of spilling over after work.


----------



## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

actually, in an objective overview of the current employment situation, it's us guys that _lead_ the unemp stats, _not_ the gals

now one might wonder _how_ this is, yet i equate it to human nature, females being somewhat more subserviant not being subjected to the testosterone posioning we are......

~CS~


----------



## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

oh and, i took my little girl to work @ 5 Doc

most of the women HO's called me back just because of her

old age and treachery fits the capitalist bill at times too!

~CS~


----------



## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

John Valdes said:


> Some women are just meant for the workplace and want to succeed just like you do. I applaud the wife for sticking to her guns, even if the numbers did not jive.


go girl!

my only real problem is when women try to emulate men , which is usually manifest in the suit/skirts 

i know it's just a superficial hangup, but for those women out there climbing the corportae ladder, or even the ones we in our trade use.....

just be a woman, it kinda makes us glad we were born men when you do

~CS~


----------



## Going_Commando (Oct 1, 2011)

chicken steve said:


> go girl!
> 
> my only real problem is when women try to emulate men , which is usually manifest in the suit/skirts
> 
> ...


Maybe I'm just weird, but I think a chick in Carhartts is sexy. Not sure if that's what you were talking about, but just throwing that out there. :laughing:

Crap, there I go derailing the thread again.


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## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

sure GC, farm overalls make my old blackened heart skip a beat too.....~CS~


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## black (Oct 12, 2011)

bobelectric said:


> Not interested.


I am not interested that you are not interested. You are not interested that I am not interested that you are not interested. I am not interested that you are not interested that I am not interested that you are not interested.


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## stuiec (Sep 25, 2010)

black said:


> I am not interested that you are not interested. You are not interested that I am not interested that you are not interested. I am not interested that you are not interested that I am not interested that you are not interested.


interesting......


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## angryceltic (Feb 21, 2012)

stuiec said:


> interesting......


Indeed


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## al13nw4r3LC76 (Apr 6, 2009)

There is also the case of Contractors needing a certain percentage of women and minorities just to bid a job..... No offense to the ladies but you may think your gods gift to the trade though you are just a statistic. Same goes for everyone else.


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## ce2two (Oct 4, 2008)

Do you have to live in the HOOD to be part of it...:laughing:


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## black (Oct 12, 2011)

al13nw4r3LC76 said:


> There is also the case of Contractors needing a certain percentage of women and minorities just to bid a job..... No offense to the ladies but you may think your gods gift to the trade though you are just a statistic. Same goes for everyone else.


There is another type of "affirmative action" that is discussed less frequently, and gets a lot of men jobs. It is called the Good Ol' Boys Club. Dude got a job because of who his daddy knows, who his uncle knows, et cetera. This isn't based on any kind of merit or skill on the guy's part. A guy I know was suspended from his apprenticeship for being high on the job, and he also failed his class. But his daddy knows the right people, so that guy always has a job.


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## erics37 (May 7, 2009)

black said:


> There is another type of "affirmative action" that is discussed less frequently, and gets a lot of men jobs. It is called the Good Ol' Boys Club. Dude got a job because of who his daddy knows, who his uncle knows, et cetera. This isn't based on any kind of merit or skill on the guy's part. A guy I know was suspended from his apprenticeship for being high on the job, and he also failed his class. But his daddy knows the right people, so that guy always has a job.


My parents have supported me but not in a bad way. I got accepted to a respected private university in upstate New York, and attended for 2 years before I dropped out because I was a dumb kid. My dad paid my way the whole time. I moved back home and lived in the extra bedroom, paid my parents rent for a year or so before I got my own place. From that point on I haven't asked for or been offered anything more substantial than some jars of homemade strawberry jam :thumbup: Worked at a plywood mill for about 3 years, and then a small residential GC for about a year, before I started my apprenticeship.

However I call the s**t out of them for advice, my dad is retired but owned a computer software company, and is a financial expert and a master carpenter. My mom is a retired ER nurse and a CPA. So between them I can get good advice on investments, fixing things around the house, and doing my taxes :laughing:

Proud to not be in a good ol' boys club.


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## watt? (Nov 10, 2011)

Hey Alberta Girl, maybe its just the province? ; ). I just finished with a crew of 140 guys. I was it for the female representation. I think I freaked out a few of the guys in the other trades but by the end of the 6 months there I was just an apprentice that got some experience. I think I felt the best when after a couple of months of just brief chats the lead plumber actually commented that there weren't enough women in trades and said he was glad to see at least one trying it out. I felt he was genuine. My guys where always willing to help me out, not because I didn't try but because I needed guidance. I find that either we try to act too manly and then get the butch designation. I made an effort when I started with my company to just be myself. people of any gender can take it or leave it really. I don't know what it would be like to try and organize a group but I managed to coordinate in small teams and we got stuff done fine. with the guys, just tell them what needs to get done, stick with business. Most people are responsive to tasks and forget who is delegating them.

Good luck I would like to know how things work out.


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## Amish Electrician (Jan 2, 2010)

I've worked with all manner of crews, and I have to say the guys I worked with in the electrical biz were head and shoulders above the rest ... still, though ...

My current crew, by pure chance, is 100% female. 4 ladies, operating as two pairs. I haven't had a better crew, ever. They listen, they learn, they bust their tails. 

They don't look small - they're 'average' in build for women - but they're enough smaller than the average guy that they're real aces in crawl spaces and attics. Their work is neat, and they keep the jobsite neat.

Just as important are the positive attitudes and ready smiles they bring to the job. I say this, even though we do industrial work in a heavy industrial setting.


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## MrsElectric (Aug 12, 2011)

I feel more at home in an attic than in a kitchen.


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