# In-floor radiant heating cause fire



## emtnut (Mar 1, 2015)

freddmc said:


> My son has structure on his property that has a garage with a suite above the garage.He just purchased the property a few months ago. The suite(actually a single room) has tile floor with in floor electric (radiant?) heating. They noticed that there were hot areas on the floor so turned the thermostat down. At any rate a couple of days ago they smelled smoke and went into the suite to check .


I'd either sell the place now ! Or call an electrician, before anyone falls asleep on the floor


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## freddmc (Dec 12, 2016)

Unfortunately selling the place is not an option and they did have an electrician look at it but he was not able to suggest what the problem might be. I suppose they should call another electrician. They will, of course, tear up the floor and have to lay a whole new floor but would like to figure out what caused it as they have other areas in their house with in floor heating. What tests can an electrician do to try and pinpoint the problem?
When I brought this up on a flooring problem they suggested this type of heating has a lot of problems, something I hadn't heard before.

Thanks

Fred


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## wcord (Jan 23, 2011)

Usually we do not place the wires under cabinets or similar items which do not allow air flow over the surface of the tile.
I've heard that heating under cabinets has heated the cans of food, to the point that the contents were cooked ( but took many months)
I've researched and installed a hundred or so systems over the last 15 years, and never heard of any combustion problems


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## 99cents (Aug 20, 2012)

In floor heating cable doesn't come close to the flashpoint temperature of wood. Maybe, if it was damaged during construction, there could be some arcing and sparking. It's supposed to be GFCI protected.


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## emtnut (Mar 1, 2015)

freddmc said:


> Unfortunately selling the place is not an option and they did have an electrician look at it but he was not able to suggest what the problem might be. I suppose they should call another electrician. They will, of course, tear up the floor and have to lay a whole new floor but would like to figure out what caused it as they have other areas in their house with in floor heating. What tests can an electrician do to try and pinpoint the problem?
> When I brought this up on a flooring problem they suggested this type of heating has a lot of problems, something I hadn't heard before.
> 
> Thanks
> ...


I was just kidding about selling the place :jester:

This is not a DIY place, if you want to work on this yourself, DIY chatroom http://www.diychatroom.com/f18/ , is a sister site of this forum, and many electricians here will help you out.

If you're looking for an electrician, make sure he is a licensed contractor, and he will easily fix you up :thumbsup:

In floor heating systems are safe, when properly installed and tested


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## wcord (Jan 23, 2011)

freddmc said:


> Unfortunately selling the place is not an option and they did have an electrician look at it but he was not able to suggest what the problem might be. I suppose they should call another electrician. They will, of course, tear up the floor and have to lay a whole new floor but would like to figure out what caused it as they have other areas in their house with in floor heating. What tests can an electrician do to try and pinpoint the problem?
> When I brought this up on a flooring problem they suggested this type of heating has a lot of problems, something I hadn't heard before.
> 
> Thanks
> ...


The cabling can be checked with an ohm meter and a meggar.
IF, the system was installed properly, the meggar will read infinity to ground.
The ohm reading will depend on the size of the system and manufacturer.
Ideally, there is an ID tag in the thermostat box

A qualified electrical contractor will know how to do this.
Also, most of the manufacturers have authorized select contractors to repair their installations. I would recommend you find out the type of system and get their assistance


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## freddmc (Dec 12, 2016)

Thanks. I'm am not intending to diy but am trying to get enough info to find some one to determine the cause. The firemen blamed it on the mattress, the flooring forum blamed it on corrosion or shifting floor. and an electrician couldn't pinpoint it.What is obvious is that the wiring got hot enough to cause wood to burn.

I have found in the part that with a forums like thes there are usually a number of reasons suggested by experts that can lead a person to the solution.

Regards

Fred


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## inetdog (Apr 13, 2016)

The high temperature is a solid indication that either heating cable not designed for in floor use was installed OR the heat cable was damaged during installation. (Nail or screw through it?)
You can get hot spots if you make a tight hairpin bend in the cable, but not that hot!

Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk


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## backstay (Feb 3, 2011)

The only way to get a very high temp out of floor warming cable is to have a damaged spot that act like a bad connection. I've never installed cable on wood, only in tile floors. The mattress had nothing to do with this.


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## inetdog (Apr 13, 2016)

backstay said:


> The only way to get a very high temp out of floor warming cable is to have a damaged spot that act like a bad connection. I've never installed cable on wood, only in tile floors. The mattress had nothing to do with this.


You will notice that under a mattress the floor gets hotter, but not in a dangerous way.

Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk


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## backstay (Feb 3, 2011)

inetdog said:


> You will notice that under a mattress the floor gets hotter, but not in a dangerous way.
> 
> Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk


Or a rug.


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## dmxtothemax (Jun 15, 2010)

Surely in floor heaters don't get hot enough to cause a mattress to burn !
Or at least not if they are working correctly !
Or installed wrongly.


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## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

Firemen are about as good with electrical forensics as we are with predicting the weather Fred

Inasmuch as we offer condolences , as Enut alluded, we are allowed to guide you toward a diagnosis , or otherwise direct a diyer here

Good luck

~CS~


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## sbrn33 (Mar 15, 2007)

If there was charred wood I am guessing it is not the right cable for the purpose. Probably some diyer decide to use some other kind of cable since it was cheaper. Unhook it and put in a mini split.


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## 99cents (Aug 20, 2012)

After reading this post again, this is a product used for space heating, not the usual low watt density product we use for tile warming.

I dunno, at one time there was an issue with electric radiant ceiling tiles. Maybe the stuff installed in this suite is the same kind of animal.

My suggestion is that, if you don't know what you have, abandon it. An electrician can run baseboard heat or fan forced up there no problem, particularly if you're doing ceiling repairs anyway.

Now the mods can lock this thread  .


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## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

99cents said:


> Now the mods can lock this thread  .


They only work part time 99 

As an aside, inasmuch as we do get these sorts of threads started tugging at our heart strings, i would caution they may not be who they appear to be

They may, in fact, be insurance adjusters looking to validate claim litigation , or other such entities aiming our advice back on us :no:


~CS~


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## MikeFL (Apr 16, 2016)

If you can identify the manufacturer of the heating system, call that manufacturer and tell them "your product caught my house on fire". You will have their attention. They will want to come right out and find out what went wrong. My guess is bad installation as others have alluded to.


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## oliquir (Jan 13, 2011)

maybe wrong voltage cable? they put 120v one and fed it with 240v?


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## freddmc (Dec 12, 2016)

Thanks to all for the responses.

I can assure you I am simply trying to help my son who knows nothing about electricity(In fact the same day as the fire he called me to ask how to replace the electrical plug on his vacumn cleaner) And because the electrician he talked to wasn't any help I thought I would do some research. Often when multiple people offer their opinion some good advice comes out. In this case probably the best advice is to abandon the in floor heating and put in baseboard units as well as get a competent electrician to check out the other installations in the house.

Thanks again.


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