# Got beat out bad on this one



## BurtiElectric (Jan 11, 2011)

I bid a job last week, and found out today I got crushed.
Two family building, 3 bed rms per unit, completely gutted, The bid was for new wiring throughout, 4 each Cable and phone per side, and a three gang oh service 100 amp per position. I bid the job at 10,400 with the owner paying for permit and inspections. I dont think that's too high
Can somebody ballpark this for me? What do you think?:thumbup:


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## jwjrw (Jan 14, 2010)

Our bid would of been much higher than 10k.


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

BurtiElectric said:


> I bid a job last week, and found out today I got crushed.
> Two family building, 3 bed rms per unit, completely gutted, The bid was for new wiring throughout, 4 each Cable and phone per side, and a three gang oh service 100 amp per position. I bid the job at 10,400 with the owner paying for permit and inspections. I dont think that's too high
> Can somebody ballpark this for me? What do you think?:thumbup:


 Good thing you did not get it ..its a $20,000+ job


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## BurtiElectric (Jan 11, 2011)

Wow. Really? This is what I figured so you know where I am at:
2400.00 for the service
4000.00 per unit

They are not big places.
Building owner buys all the fixtures including cans


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## Speedy Petey (Jan 10, 2007)

You bid $10.4k on THAT job and got beat BAD??? 
Be thankful you didn't get it, and thank your lucky stars you are not the other guy.


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## BurtiElectric (Jan 11, 2011)

Pete are you ready for this? Sit down
The job went for 6700.00


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## william1978 (Sep 21, 2008)

BurtiElectric said:


> Pete are you ready for this? Sit down
> The job went for 6700.00


 Someone is about to loose there ass on this one.:whistling2:


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## BurtiElectric (Jan 11, 2011)

If you guys were going to bid this job, what would you figure per opening?


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## knothole (Mar 10, 2007)

BurtiElectric said:


> The job went for 6700.00


Glad I didn't get that one......


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## jwjrw (Jan 14, 2010)

BurtiElectric said:


> If you guys were going to bid this job, what would you figure per opening?



I don't price by opening. I just look the job. I make a list of what material I need to do it and estimate how long I think it will take to do each room or task and then time it by my hourly rate and then add it up. (plus tax and mark up on material)


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

Why does everyone get so bent out of shape when they lose a job? Better than losing thousands of dollars just doing the job. :thumbsup:


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## BurtiElectric (Jan 11, 2011)

Not bent out of shape, just curious what others thought


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

BurtiElectric said:


> Not bent out of shape, just curious what others thought



I don't worry about it. I just move on to greener pastures.


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## jwjrw (Jan 14, 2010)

BurtiElectric said:


> Not bent out of shape, just curious what others thought



Nothing surprises me anymore. I saw a GC get beat by 100k on a job. There is no way it could be done for that but it did get done. We did everything else in the shopping center. Our GC owned the shopping center and showed us the other GC's bid.:blink:


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## Dennis Alwon (May 9, 2009)

The EC is very happy. After that job there will be plenty of money for beer and pizza for a week.-- well maybe.


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

BurtiElectric said:


> Pete are you ready for this? Sit down
> The job went for 6700.00


 WOW! his company name must be GREENIE Electric:laughing::laughing:


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

Dennis Alwon said:


> The EC is very happy. After that job there will be plenty of money for beer and pizza for a week.-- well maybe.


 Good one...:laughing:


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## dieselram752 (Jan 23, 2008)

You know he will get a deposit and never be seen again.


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## electricmanscott (Feb 11, 2010)

480sparky said:


> Why does everyone get so bent out of shape when they lose a job?


Because most of us don't live in a ****ing cornpatch and have bills to pay.


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

electricmanscott said:


> Because most of us don't live in a ****ing cornpatch and have bills to pay.



Do me a favor........ PM me when you have something informative to say.


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## frenchelectrican (Mar 15, 2007)

BurtiElectric said:


> I bid a job last week, and found out today I got crushed.
> Two family building, 3 bed rms per unit, completely gutted, The bid was for new wiring throughout, 4 each Cable and phone per side, and a three gang oh service 100 amp per position. I bid the job at 10,400 with the owner paying for permit and inspections. I dont think that's too high
> Can somebody ballpark this for me? What do you think?:thumbup:


For your bid on that house simauir size in France that will be little over 30,000€ { Euros } 

I will say you got lucky for one reason someone underbid and try to rewire the whole house that is connires for very low price that will end up eat them up due the overhead cost will get them fast. { unless they got a real cheap labour person to help it }

Merci.
Marc


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

frenchelectrican said:


> For your bid on that house simauir size in France that will be little over 30,000€ { Euros }
> 
> I will say you got lucky for one reason someone underbid and try to rewire the whole house that is connires for very low price that will end up eat them up due the overhead cost will get them fast. { unless they got a real cheap labour person to help it }
> 
> ...





> 30,000€ { Euros }


How much is that in dollars..


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## MDShunk (Jan 7, 2007)

With the little information you gave, I'd say the cheapest I could do this would be maybe 16K.


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## frenchelectrican (Mar 15, 2007)

HARRY304E said:


> How much is that in dollars..


Ok you asked for and with recent exchange rate here the price 

40,877.50 US dollars

Merci.
Marc


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## jefft110 (Jul 7, 2010)

frenchelectrican said:


> Ok you asked for and with recent exchange rate here the price
> 
> 40,877.50 US dollars
> 
> ...



 



Figured I'd beat Harry to it.


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## MarkyMark (Jan 31, 2009)

Ridiculously low pricing on residential new construction quit surprising me about fifteen years ago.

Face it, for a cookie cutter, minimum code, install like this, any monkey could rope it. I'll bet there is not a single hi-hat in the house. Maybe one three way for the stairs? Negotiate good pricing on your materials and hire a bunch of $5 an hour illegals and the winning bidder will probably actually make money on this.

You only really have two choices when your competition is beating you on price like this - find out what competitive price advantage they have, and copy it - or find a different niche to compete in where you have an advantage of some sort.

Or bitch about it on the interwebs and hope that changes something.


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## electricmanscott (Feb 11, 2010)

MarkyMark said:


> Ridiculously low pricing on residential new construction quit surprising me about fifteen years ago.
> 
> Face it, for a cookie cutter, minimum code, install like this, any monkey could rope it. I'll bet there is not a single hi-hat in the house. Maybe one three way for the stairs? Negotiate good pricing on your materials and hire a bunch of $5 an hour illegals and the winning bidder will probably actually make money on this.
> 
> ...




Well said. This is why I am trying desperately to get out of this crap.


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## Shockdoc (Mar 4, 2010)

BurtiElectric said:


> Pete are you ready for this? Sit down
> The job went for 6700.00


Guys in PA (certain parts) are giving it away for $100 a day labor. I bid out condo's a while back at cut throat prices and got beat out by $20k.


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## Chris1971 (Dec 27, 2010)

Craigslist is destroying the trade.


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## electricmanscott (Feb 11, 2010)

Chris1971 said:


> Craigslist is destroying the trade.


Nonsense.


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## sfeyelectric (Dec 31, 2010)

Shockdoc said:


> Guys in PA (certain parts) are giving it away for $100 a day labor. I bid out condo's a while back at cut throat prices and got beat out by $20k.



Thanks for adding certain parts. That not enough to make me think about setting an alarm clock!


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## elecpatsfan (Oct 1, 2010)

I think 10,400 is a very fair bid-- for each unit! Where I'm from I think 6700 buys the materials and maybe leaves enough to pay the help. That would leave a big zero for my own efforts


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## doubleoh7 (Dec 5, 2009)

Maybe there is a supply and command issue here?? Looks to me like there are too many electricians ( or at least people doing electrical work) in the country. Maybe half of us should quit and go do something else??


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

doubleoh7 said:


> Maybe there is a supply and command issue here?? Looks to me like there are too many electricians ( or at least people doing electrical work) in the country. Maybe half of us should quit and go do something else??



Thanks for volunteering! :laughing:


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

480sparky said:


> Thanks for volunteering! :laughing:


 Good one..:laughing:


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## doubleoh7 (Dec 5, 2009)

480sparky said:


> Thanks for volunteering! :laughing:


 
Not unless I win the lottery tonight. The odds against that are astronautical, especially considering that I haven't bought a ticket. I buy a ticket two or three times a year. The other times that I feel lucky, I just save a trip into town and flush a dollar bill down the toilet.


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## Shockdoc (Mar 4, 2010)

sfeyelectric said:


> Thanks for adding certain parts. That not enough to make me think about setting an alarm clock!


From Monroe or Pike county ?


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

doubleoh7 said:


> Not unless I win the lottery tonight. The odds against that are astronautical,....



_astronomical_




doubleoh7 said:


> ........ especially considering that I haven't bought a ticket.........


_
Impossible_, then.




doubleoh7 said:


> ..........., I just save a trip into town and flush a dollar bill down the toilet.


I feel the same way about marriage. Instead of getting involved with a woman, I just find some bitch I don't like and buy her a house. :laughing:


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## doubleoh7 (Dec 5, 2009)

Originally Posted by *doubleoh7*  
_Not unless I win the lottery tonight. The odds against that are astronautical,...._

astronautical = astronomincal

pandelerium = pandemonium


I will use the language as I see fit.



What do you have a fancy degree like a PFD or something?


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

doubleoh7 said:


> ..........What do you have a fancy degree like a PFD or something?


I can create PDFs with my computer. :laughing:


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## cmec (Feb 11, 2008)

BurtiElectric said:


> I bid a job last week, and found out today I got crushed.
> Two family building, 3 bed rms per unit, completely gutted, The bid was for new wiring throughout, 4 each Cable and phone per side, and a three gang oh service 100 amp per position. I bid the job at 10,400 with the owner paying for permit and inspections. I dont think that's too high
> Can somebody ballpark this for me? What do you think?:thumbup:


 

What county was that in ???


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## wwilson174 (Apr 25, 2008)

Chris1971 said:


> Craigslist is destroying the trade.


 

What is destroying the trade is ROMEX, if these jobs were required to be done in emt these $5 per hour competitors would disappear . The race to the bottom is in the home stretch. BillW.


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## doubleoh7 (Dec 5, 2009)

wwilson174 said:


> What is destroying the trade is ROMEX, if these jobs were required to be done in emt these $5 per hour competitors would disappear . The race to the bottom is in the home stretch. BillW.


 
]

EMT can be hacked up as well. NM cable is safe if installed correctly.


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## cmec (Feb 11, 2008)

HOME depot sells 1/2 sticks of emt too.


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## wwilson174 (Apr 25, 2008)

doubleoh7 said:


> ]
> 
> EMT can be hacked up as well. NM cable is safe if installed correctly.


 
Safety was not the point at issue, but rather the number of people who are qualified to effectively install it! BillW


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## doubleoh7 (Dec 5, 2009)

wwilson174 said:


> Safety was not the point at issue, but rather the number of people who are qualified to effectively install it! BillW


 
I'm picking up what you are putting down. I'm just saying that the hacks will figure out how to hack up emt as well. They will also run bare thhn conductors in the walls where they can get away with it.


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

wwilson174 said:


> What is destroying the trade is ROMEX, if these jobs were required to be done in emt these $5 per hour competitors would disappear . The race to the bottom is in the home stretch. BillW.


Why monkey around with EMT? Rigid all the way.

And *NO THREADLESS COUPLERS*!


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## wwilson174 (Apr 25, 2008)

480sparky said:


> Why monkey around with EMT? Rigid all the way.
> 
> And *NO THREADLESS COUPLERS*!


 

Sarcasm is no substitute for reasoned debate! BillW


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## Cletis (Aug 20, 2010)

*2 family*

That's good cigarette and beer money for some ....

Personally, I'd call the inspector and let him know there are some hacks on that job and to keep a close eye

Teach them a lesson and the owner as well.


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## wwilson174 (Apr 25, 2008)

doubleoh7 said:


> I'm picking up what you are putting down. I'm just saying that the hacks will figure out how to hack up emt as well. They will also run bare thhn conductors in the walls where they can get away with it.


 
Can you tell me what you mean by " hack up EMT" ? BillW


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## doubleoh7 (Dec 5, 2009)

Cletis said:


> That's good cigarette and beer money for some ....
> 
> Personally, I'd call the inspector and let him know there are some hacks on that job and to keep a close eye
> 
> Teach them a lesson and the owner as well.


 
Many of us live in areas of the country with no licensing or inspections. If the lights come on, the customers thinks they bought quality work.


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## doubleoh7 (Dec 5, 2009)

wwilson174 said:


> Can you tell me what you mean by " hack up EMT" ? BillW


 

Cobbled together

Half a55ed

jury rigged

Obama rigged


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## Cletis (Aug 20, 2010)

*Dirtbags*

I don't get too upset about it anymore. I'll just call and tell them address and to take a look at carefully. I know all the inspectors well and they know me too. If they are doing good work that's one thing. 

One thing I still can't believe. I see customers spend 50k on granite countertops, heated toilets, waterfall showers, etc... then they skimp on the one thing that really matters...THEIR LIFE!!! 

ABSOLUTELY STUPID!!!


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## wwilson174 (Apr 25, 2008)

doubleoh7 said:


> Cobbled together
> 
> Half a55ed
> 
> ...


 
Are you saying that this would give them an advantage? BillW


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## doubleoh7 (Dec 5, 2009)

Cletis said:


> I don't get too upset about it anymore. I'll just call and tell them address and to take a look at carefully. I know all the inspectors well and they know me too. If they are doing good work that's one thing.
> 
> One thing I still can't believe. I see customers spend 50k on granite countertops, heated toilets, waterfall showers, etc... then they skimp on the one thing that really matters...THEIR LIFE!!!
> 
> ABSOLUTELY STUPID!!!


That happens because people are stupid. They see electrical work as a commodity.


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## doubleoh7 (Dec 5, 2009)

wwilson174 said:


> Are you saying that this would give them an advantage? BillW


 

Anyway money can be saved puts the hack at an advantage when quality and code compliance does not matter.

Time = money

Material = money


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## B4T (Feb 10, 2009)

cmec said:


> HOME depot sells 1/2 sticks of emt too.


They fit better in the trunk that way.. :laughing:


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## Cletis (Aug 20, 2010)

*Stupid People*

Speaking of that. I'm going to start another thread about stupid customers. Look for it...

Cletis


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## B4T (Feb 10, 2009)

wwilson174 said:


> What is destroying the trade is ROMEX, if these jobs were required to be done in emt these $5 per hour competitors would disappear . The race to the bottom is in the home stretch. BillW.


At least you didn't blame FOX NEWS.. :laughing:

But both are equally off the wall.. are you on drugs.. kind of thinking.. :no:

Doubling the labor cost on wiring a house does no good for anyone involved.. :no:


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## wwilson174 (Apr 25, 2008)

doubleoh7 said:


> Anyway money can be saved puts the hack at an advantage when quality and code compliance does not matter.
> 
> Time = money
> 
> Material = money


That is my point, as long as romex is code compliant, ropers can compete with electricians.BillW


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## wwilson174 (Apr 25, 2008)

B4T said:


> At least you didn't blame FOX NEWS.. :laughing:
> 
> But both are equally off the wall.. are you on drugs.. kind of thinking.. :no:
> 
> Doubling the labor cost on wiring a house does no good for anyone involved.. :no:


Would you care to debate that point with the members of Local 134 in Chicago? BillW


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## doubleoh7 (Dec 5, 2009)

wwilson174 said:


> That is my point, as long as romex is code compliant, ropers can compete with electricians.BillW


 
I am more expensive than "ropers" when I do residential. It is because I charge enough to do quality, code compliant work in NM. I do not cut corners. My point is that a hack, regardless of what wiring method they are using, will do crappy and dangerous work.


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## electricmanscott (Feb 11, 2010)

And the winner of the dummy award for most idiotic post of the year is....
:laughing:




wwilson174 said:


> What is destroying the trade is ROMEX, if these jobs were required to be done in emt these $5 per hour competitors would disappear . The race to the bottom is in the home stretch. BillW.


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## electricmanscott (Feb 11, 2010)

And the runner up for the dummy award for the most idiotic post of the year goes to... Wow folks, a multiple winner.
:laughing:





wwilson174 said:


> That is my point, as long as romex is code compliant, ropers can compete with electricians.BillW


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## jefft110 (Jul 7, 2010)

What do they call plumber wannabe's who run pex/pvc instead of copper/cast?


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## 10492 (Jan 4, 2010)

jefft110 said:


> What do they call plumber wannabe's who run pex/pvc instead of copper/cast?


 
part time HVAC technician?

What I win?


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

jefft110 said:


> What do they call plumber wannabe's who run pex/pvc instead of copper/cast?


In Arizona, they're called _roofers_. :laughing:


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## Speedy Petey (Jan 10, 2007)

I think this is sufficiently off topic that we shall close.


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