# Residential overhead disconnect/ reconnect



## Electricalbull (Nov 28, 2018)

I’ve installed about 10 services to date. I never have done my own disconnect/ reconnect with the changing rules of wpp I’m trying to get my self comfortable with it. Any tips would be appreciated! Or specific steps ? Purchased hot gloves today to do this job also! TIA


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## Switched (Dec 23, 2012)

Okay, I'll bite...

What is wpp?

Also, why would you actively look to do something that can:
1) Get you killed
2) Severely injure you
3) Get you in trouble with most POCO's
4) Get you in trouble with most AHJ's

I was brought up in the trades to do hot work, but in reality there is very little reason if ever to work on something live. It is stupid and dangerous.


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## joebanana (Dec 21, 2010)

Please fill out your profile so we have a better idea of your qualifications. 

How much did those gloves set you back? Did you keep the receipt?

Who did your cuts in the past? Who did your reconnects?


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## telsa (May 22, 2015)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Energy_Northwest

Washington Public Power.

The OP has never apprenticed.

He's getting away with his talent because most of the power in his area is "Public Power."

( The Tri-Cities area. )


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## telsa (May 22, 2015)

EUSERC standards are getting in his way.


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## MikeFL (Apr 16, 2016)

Electricalbull said:


> I’ve installed about 10 services to date. I never have done my own disconnect/ reconnect with the changing rules of wpp I’m trying to get my self comfortable with it. *Any tips would be appreciated! Or specific steps ?* Purchased hot gloves today to do this job also! TIA



Tip 1: Hire a licensed electrical contractor.


Step 1: Call a licensed electrical contractor.


To say you "purchased hot gloves" demonstrates you are not aware of the hazards. 



It's just not worth the risk. The internet is no place to attempt to learn how to perform such a dangerous task.


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

Make sure to shut the main breaker before pulling the meter.
Always pull the meter.
Cut the neutral first to get the bare wire out of the way. 
Cut the hots one at a time, have the electrical tape in your teath ready to go with a little flap sticking out.
Reconnected in the opposite order.
Home Depot has $5 splice reducers which work great. Install them on the dead conductor first. 

It is really common sense for an electrician. Don’t listen to the people who aren’t forced to disconnect and reconnect on their own. It’s easy to talk about not doing it when they have someone else who will do it for them. But not all of us have that luxury and we have to do it ourselves.


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## Electricalbull (Nov 28, 2018)

West penn power here in pa


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## Electricalbull (Nov 28, 2018)

Hackwork thank you! Also follow up question for you hackwork, is it worth me even purchasing the acsr cutter tool or a crimping tool ? Tia


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## Electricalbull (Nov 28, 2018)

JoeBanana- line gloves were only $100 and west penn power always did the disconnect/ reconnect for free now they want $110 for The disconnect and then another for the reconnect. So that been said if I’m doing this kinda work in obviously want to protect myself and do it right


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

Electricalbull said:


> Hackwork thank you! Also follow up question for you hackwork, is it worth me even purchasing the acsr cutter tool or a crimping tool ? Tia


The neutral line is sometimes ACSR, but it often will cut with a pair of linemans. I wouldn't spend a lot of money on a ratcheting cutter that cuts ACSR. I did buy the little Knipex bolt cutter looking things which are cool, but never needed them as my linemans cut it all.

A crimper is expensive and hard to use on an extension ladder with energized conductors. I like using these because they are cheap, easy to obtain, and very simple to install. You install it on 1 conductor at a time, you don't need to have both conductors inside of a crimp while trying to hold both conductors, the crimp, and the crimping tool which needs both hands.









$5.12 at Home Depot for the one that does up to 4/0. 2 for $5 for the smaller one that does 100A services.


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## Electricalbull (Nov 28, 2018)

Hackwork - yea those tools would run me about $800 and I’m assuming by you meaning opposite order you mean hot, hot, neutral to reconnect sir?


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## Electricalbull (Nov 28, 2018)

The neutral line is sometimes ACSR, but it often will cut with a pair of linemans. I wouldn't spend a lot of money on a ratcheting cutter that cuts ACSR. I did buy the little Knipex bolt cutter looking things which are cool, but never needed them as my linemans cut it all.

A crimper is expensive and hard to use on an extension ladder with energized conductors. I like using these because they are cheap, easy to obtain, and very simple to install. You install it on 1 conductor at a time, you don't need to have both conductors inside of a crimp while trying to hold both conductors, the crimp, and the crimping tool which needs both hands.

View attachment 130382


$5.12 at Home Depot for the one that does up to 4/0. 2 for $5 for the smaller one that does 100A services.[/QUOTE]



Testing.....


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## flyboy (Jun 13, 2011)

hackwork said:


> the neutral line is sometimes acsr, but it often will cut with a pair of linemans. I wouldn't spend a lot of money on a ratcheting cutter that cuts acsr. I did buy the little knipex bolt cutter looking things which are cool, but never needed them as my linemans cut it all.
> 
> A crimper is expensive and hard to use on an extension ladder with energized conductors. I like using these because they are cheap, easy to obtain, and very simple to install. You install it on 1 conductor at a time, you don't need to have both conductors inside of a crimp while trying to hold both conductors, the crimp, and the crimping tool which needs both hands.
> 
> ...


Are you using something like these to insulate the phase conductors?


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## Electricalbull (Nov 28, 2018)

I would use those vinyl pads then some super 88 after! Sorry don’t know how to use the forms yet was trying to quote hackwork before 😅


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

Electricalbull said:


> Hackwork - yea those tools would run me about $800 and I’m assuming by you meaning opposite order you mean hot, hot, neutral to reconnect sir?


Yes.

Normally we would disconnect the hot then the neutral. And reconnect the neutral then the hot.

But with service connections it is different, IMO. You shut off the main and pull the meter to make sure that there is no load and no other connections made. Then you want to cut the neutral out of the way since it is a bare conductor, and you don't want that near you while you are touching the hot conductor.

The same thing when reconnecting, you don't want the neutral anywhere near you until you are done working on the hots, then you can connect the neutral.


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

flyboy said:


> Are you using something like these to insulate the phase conductors?
> 
> View attachment 130384
> View attachment 130386


Nope.

I have been using the Burndy model CCO Crimpit Cover for a long time because it fits around the Home Depot splice reducers. I found them on sale online for like 50 cents each and still have a lot. But I wouldn't pay $1.50+ for them if I had to buy them now. I would just wrap the connectors with 2" wide black tape. They are free-air splices and with the stiff conductors they won't touch anything if you shape them right, so the insulation is just a formality. Most of the existing services that I upgrade have exposed energized metal on the conductors or connectors due to it wearing off. :smile:

Here you can see the bare connector on the neutral and the 2 hots with the Burndy CCO insulators taped shut.


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## Going_Commando (Oct 1, 2011)

I don't do too many, but the ones I have done I use a Burndy crimp tool with h-taps, and use the plastic snap on covers and then tape up the covers with 88+. I glove up, others dont. I have done 10 or so, so I'm not to the point of wanting to do it bare handed. If you get the conductors bent just so crimping isnt too bad, but I can see how Hax's method is easier and faster. We H-taps since that is what the utilities around here used before they switched to those piercing connectors. It's easiest to crimp from the bucket truck, but I've done it off an extension ladder or spikes. If anything the spikes were easier since you have both hands free and can move around more than a ladder.


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## 460 Delta (May 9, 2018)

If I may butt in here, but would a 30’ shotgun stick be a wise buy? A couple of our plants are primary metered and I have one to work on them. A quick yank on the fuse and it’s off, do your stuff and slam it back in. I think I paid $600 for the Chance stick I have.


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## CTshockhazard (Aug 28, 2009)

Use extra caution on houses with aluminum siding when you are following Hacks procedure :thumbup1:


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## flyboy (Jun 13, 2011)

CTshockhazard said:


> Use extra caution on houses with aluminum siding when you are following Hacks procedure :thumbup1:


I put a black scorch mark on a house once. :vs_laugh:

I swear, when I look back on some of the things I did in my career I wonder how I survived my own stupidity. :surprise:


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

Going_Commando said:


> I don't do too many, but the ones I have done I use a Burndy crimp tool with h-taps, and use the plastic snap on covers and then tape up the covers with 88+. I glove up, others dont. I have done 10 or so, so I'm not to the point of wanting to do it bare handed. If you get the conductors bent just so crimping isnt too bad, but I can see how Hax's method is easier and faster. We H-taps since that is what the utilities around here used before they switched to those piercing connectors. It's easiest to crimp from the bucket truck, but I've done it off an extension ladder or spikes. If anything the spikes were easier since you have both hands free and can move around more than a ladder.


 H-taps have to be installed on both conductors at the same time which means you need both conductors to sit just right and use the crimper with both hands as well. This is where the danger comes in, what happens if while you are starting to crimp the hot conductor slips out and touches the house? A nice big arc blast to send you off the ladder in a storm of molten metal. 

If I were going to use crimps, I would use those Insultap barrel type crimps that you install on one conductor and then crimp the other conductor into the other side afterwards. But this is still a bit dangerous when holding the crimpers with both hands.

That's why I like the split reducers, you can hold the hot conductor and the connector at the same time with one hand and use your little impact gun to drive the lug in with the other. A couple seconds and you are done.



460 Delta said:


> If I may butt in here, but would a 30’ shotgun stick be a wise buy? A couple of our plants are primary metered and I have one to work on them. A quick yank on the fuse and it’s off, do your stuff and slam it back in. I think I paid $600 for the Chance stick I have.


I don't pay much attention to the cut-outs in residential areas, but I assume they are for an entire block, or multiple blocks. Shutting down all of those houses would get you into a lot of trouble with the power company and possibly legally as well.


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## 460 Delta (May 9, 2018)

Ok, I see Hack, it’s pretty rural here and at most two homes are on a transformer. A quick heads up to the neighbors and they are cool. I may or may not have just swapped a main breaker on dads house using this method.


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## R777V (May 16, 2016)

Not to mention if you pull the transformer cut out under load lots of sparks and possible damage to the fuse cut out. What if after this stunt you couldn’t close the cut out or fumble it and blow the fusible link? I’m sure you’ve got a bucket full of those to retry again and again right? I prefer to leave neutral/ACSR up until phases are cut it keeps things grounded should you become a path. Just take your time and do things precisely. I have little boots made from old gloves to cap off right away. If you aren’t using insulinks parallel connectors too are a good solid connection. Hookup neutral first of course (last to disconnect, first to reconnect). It goes without saying, if you aren’t comfortable doing the job don’t do it! This of course is my preferred method, not the only one, but safety is paramount in these situations. OSHA will always stress that it is never right to do work hot, and when done hot there are few exceptions so take that all with a grain of salt if you will.


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## eddy current (Feb 28, 2009)

@HackWork, I understand that in your area and others this type of work is done by electricians but the vast majority of areas it is done by the utility. This type of work is dangerous and if someone is coming to an online forum to find out how to do it, they shouldn’t be doing it. 

Do you think it’s a good idea to describe in detail how to do this live on a public forum to a new member?

I don’t.


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

eddy current said:


> @HackWork, I understand that in your area and others this type of work is done by electricians but the vast majority of areas it is done by the utility. This type of work is dangerous and if someone is coming to an online forum to find out how to do it, they shouldn’t be doing it.
> 
> Do you think it’s a good idea to describe in detail how to do this live on a public forum to a new member?
> 
> I don’t.


 Considering I just did, I guess the answer is yes :biggrin:

He has done ten already and is going to continue doing them. Why not help him do it easier and safer?


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## R777V (May 16, 2016)

Cook county Chicago area ComEd only inspects and checks connections before signing off. Not sure of commercial service installations.


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## eddy current (Feb 28, 2009)

HackWork said:


> Considering I just did, I guess the answer is yes :biggrin:
> 
> He has done ten already and is going to continue doing them. Why not help him do it easier and safer?


Then why not send him a PM instead of posting in detail how to do it on a public forum?


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

eddy current said:


> Then why not send him a PM instead of posting in detail how to do it on a public forum?


Why would I do that?

Hopefully other people see what I post and possibly learn a new trick or have their own method and post it so I learned something. That’s the entire point of the forum.

We arent going to private message everyone when we talk about something that could be dangerous. That makes no sense. Everything we do has danger.


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## trentonmakes (Mar 21, 2017)

HackWork said:


> Why would I do that?
> 
> Hopefully other people see what I post and possibly learn a new trick or have their own method and post it so I learned something. That’s the entire point of the forum.
> 
> We arent going to private message everyone when we talk about something that could be dangerous. That makes no sense. Everything we do has danger.


I didnt learn anything this time, as I do it the same way as mentioned.

But I've picked up a few tricks and even learned things from topics like this.

So, Thanks!

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## sbrn33 (Mar 15, 2007)

I disconnect and reconnect all the time most services take 6-8 hours so the utility isn't coming after 3 or so. It is really not that big of deal. Pretty rare when I even wear glove unless it is snowy or rainy out. 
90% of the time I use H crimps because once I get the wires in I can hold them with one hand use my channel locks to squeeze them together until I give them a permanent crimp. 
I couple weeks after the inspection the utility will come and replace mine with theirs.


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

sbrn33 said:


> I disconnect and reconnect all the time most services take 6-8 hours so the utility isn't coming after 3 or so. It is really not that big of deal. Pretty rare when I even wear glove unless it is snowy or rainy out.
> 90% of the time I use H crimps because once I get the wires in I can hold them with one hand use my channel locks to squeeze them together until I give them a permanent crimp.


 By the time you get your channel locks out (before putting them back and grabbing the crimper while up on the ladder) you could have the splice finished if you use the bugs I posted.



> I couple weeks after the inspection the utility will come and replace mine with theirs.


 The same here, which is why I like to use the easiest and safest method possible instead of crimps which may last longer but are harder to install.


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## sbrn33 (Mar 15, 2007)

HackWork said:


> By the time you get your channel locks out (before putting them back and grabbing the crimper while up on the ladder) you could have the splice finished if you use the bugs I posted.
> 
> The same here, which is why I like to use the easiest and safest method possible instead of crimps which may last longer but are harder to install.


I would use romex clamps before I use those overpriced handyman connectors you like.


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

sbrn33 said:


> I would use romex clamps before I use those overpriced handyman connectors you like.


I used to use romex connectors. I don't like them because you also need to hold both conductors and the connector at the same time while installing them And if the PoCo doesn't come out for a few months they might fail. 

The splice reducers that I posted are Thomas & Betts Blackburn brand and good quality.


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## MDShunk (Jan 7, 2007)

Electricalbull said:


> West penn power here in pa


My former service area included West Penn/Allegheny and they didn't permit your own disconnect/reconnect, so I'm a little puzzled. 

If you're anywhere near me, I'd be happy to provide you training on how to do this safely and properly, and gift you a pair of H-tap crimpers and enough supplies to get you started.


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## MechanicalDVR (Dec 29, 2007)

HackWork said:


> Why would I do that?
> 
> Hopefully other people see what I post and possibly learn a new trick or have their own method and post it so I learned something. That’s the entire point of the forum.
> 
> We arent going to private message everyone when we talk about something that could be dangerous. That makes no sense. Everything we do has danger.


I see both sides of this issue just due to the fact that anyone can come in as a guest and read it and try it themselves.


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## MechanicalDVR (Dec 29, 2007)

MDShunk said:


> My former service area included West Penn/Allegheny and they didn't permit your own disconnect/reconnect, so I'm a little puzzled.
> 
> If you're anywhere near me, I'd be happy to provide you training on how to do this safely and properly, and gift you a pair of H-tap crimpers and enough supplies to get you started.


Wow, are you in the Christmas spirit or just reducing shop stock?


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## MDShunk (Jan 7, 2007)

MechanicalDVR said:


> Wow, are you in the Christmas spirit or just reducing shop stock?


He's gonna do it anyhow, so I figure why not train him on how not to get killed in the process.


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

MechanicalDVR said:


> I see both sides of this issue just due to the fact that anyone can come in as a guest and read it and try it themselves.


Very true.

But that could be said about everything that we talk about here, from running new wiring to replacing dimmers- and everything in between. I think it is more dangerous for us to talk about those other things because they are something that people will actually try to do themselves, which can lead to them getting hurt or it being done wrong and someone else getting hurt due to fire or shock. Splicing in a live service not so much :biggrin:


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

MDShunk said:


> My former service area included West Penn/Allegheny and they didn't permit your own disconnect/reconnect, so I'm a little puzzled.


 FWIW, my PoCo (PSE&G) says the same thing. We aren't allowed to touch the splices or the meters in any way, shape, or form. But it's the only way that it works :vs_laugh::vs_laugh: 



> If you're anywhere near me, I'd be happy to provide you training on how to do this safely and properly, and gift you a pair of H-tap crimpers and enough supplies to get you started.


That's really awesome, the OP better take you up on that.


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## MDShunk (Jan 7, 2007)

My former service area was the overlap for 5 PoCo's/Co-Ops. Some wouldn't let you touch it, some required you to do you own, and some gave you the option (1 charging a fee if they did it).


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

MDShunk said:


> My former service area was the overlap for 5 PoCo's/Co-Ops. Some wouldn't let you touch it, some required you to do you own, and some gave you the option (1 charging a fee if they did it).


I always assumed that it was a liability issue. PSE&G absolutely will not tell you outright to remove a meter to inspect the lugs or to cut/resplice a service. But they will hint that it is your only option. It makes for some really funny phonecalls :vs_laugh:

The wiring inspectors will say it to you if you ever meet them somewhere in person, but never on the phone :biggrin:


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## MDShunk (Jan 7, 2007)

HackWork said:


> I always assumed that it was a liability issue. PSE&G absolutely will not tell you outright to remove a meter to inspect the lugs or to cut/resplice a service. But they will hint that it is your only option. It makes for some really funny phonecalls :vs_laugh:
> 
> The wiring inspectors will say it to you if you ever meet them somewhere in person, but never on the phone :biggrin:


I feel you. Even among the PoCo's I dealt with that had rules against such, the linemen would always give me fist fulls of seal tags for such occasions.


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## MechanicalDVR (Dec 29, 2007)

MDShunk said:


> He's gonna do it anyhow, so I figure why not train him on how not to get killed in the process.


I figured that part on training him I was more referring to gifting him tools and materials.


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## MDShunk (Jan 7, 2007)

MechanicalDVR said:


> I figured that part on training him I was more referring to gifting him tools and materials.


It's not that big of a deal. I'm getting rid of most everything anyhow, so to see things go to someone that can use them pleases me. An MD6-8 crimper is only a couple hundred if new, and H-taps and covers are like a buck a piece.


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## MechanicalDVR (Dec 29, 2007)

HackWork said:


> Very true.
> 
> But that could be said about everything that we talk about here, from running new wiring to replacing dimmers- and everything in between. I think it is more dangerous for us to talk about those other things because they are something that people will actually try to do themselves, which can lead to them getting hurt or it being done wrong and someone else getting hurt due to fire or shock. Splicing in a live service not so much :biggrin:


Yeah but the DIY forum would have plenty of talk about the common things, the service disco/recon not so much.

Too bad there isn't a pro only forum like the business forum, that isn't available to the general public.


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## MDShunk (Jan 7, 2007)

As a promoter of free speech, I'm in favor of the widest dissemination of information and knowledge as possible. If someone gets hurt using that information, I feel no special guilt in that. Of course, my parents were poor when I was born. They didn't have the extra money for options like chrome wheels, leather seats, and empathy.


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## trentonmakes (Mar 21, 2017)

MechanicalDVR said:


> Yeah but the DIY forum would have plenty of talk about the common things, the service disco/recon not so much.
> 
> Too bad there isn't a pro only forum like the business forum, that isn't available to the general public.


I've done alot of my own electric before forums,youtube, and diy videos. Before I was working for an electrical contractor I felt pretty comfortable with whatever I was doing electric wise, but I don't think I would ever attempt splicing a service without someone supervising/guiding me.

That said, the first one I did, the jerk off I was working for put me on an aluminum ladder and went and sat in his truck! Lol



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## Forge Boyz (Nov 7, 2014)

MDShunk said:


> I feel you. Even among the PoCo's I dealt with that had rules against such, the linemen would always give me fist fulls of seal tags for such occasions.


I wish I could get some. I've asked already, but the guy I talked to said with smart meters they know when it is pulled, so they would be checking up on it anyway. So much for that.

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## MDShunk (Jan 7, 2007)

Forge Boyz said:


> I wish I could get some. I've asked already, but the guy I talked to said with smart meters they know when it is pulled, so they would be checking up on it anyway. So much for that.
> 
> Sent from my Moto Z (2) using Tapatalk


Here's how you work it: "Hey, I'm out of seal tags. I need a few more". :wink: Don't ask. Just act as if you always have some, and they're obligated to give you more.


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## Jack Legg (Mar 12, 2014)

MDShunk said:


> My former service area included West Penn/Allegheny and they didn't permit your own disconnect/reconnect, so I'm a little puzzled.
> 
> If you're anywhere near me, I'd be happy to provide you training on how to do this safely and properly, and gift you a pair of H-tap crimpers and enough supplies to get you started.


 Im in Adams County near you. WestPenn/Allegheny let us cut and reconnect now just like MetEd since they are all First Energy I guess. Still not allowed by Adams Electric Coop


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## Jack Legg (Mar 12, 2014)

sbrn33 said:


> I disconnect and reconnect all the time most services take 6-8 hours so the utility isn't coming after 3 or so. It is really not that big of deal. Pretty rare when I even wear glove unless it is snowy or rainy out.
> 90% of the time I use H crimps because once I get the wires in I can hold them with one hand use my channel locks to squeeze them together until I give them a permanent crimp.
> I couple weeks after the inspection the utility will come and replace mine with theirs.


 I do the same, with the channel locks to hold it together and then crimp with htap. It really cant get any easier than that


I have a positioning belt that lets both hands be free on the extension ladder


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## Electricalbull (Nov 28, 2018)

MDShunk said:


> Electricalbull said:
> 
> 
> > West penn power here in pa
> ...




About 30 mins east of Pittsburgh


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## Electricalbull (Nov 28, 2018)

Also thank you everyone for your input it was very helpful


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## Unionpride277 (Oct 31, 2018)

HackWork said:


> Make sure to shut the main breaker before pulling the meter.
> Always pull the meter.
> Cut the neutral first to get the bare wire out of the way.
> Cut the hots one at a time, have the electrical tape in your teath ready to go with a little flap sticking out.
> ...


Isn’t it best to disconnect your hots first and the neutral last.

when reconnecting power 
Land your neutral first and hots last .

Or it dosnt matter Bc the main is off and the meter is pulled , so theirs not a load on the neutral ?


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

Unionpride277 said:


> Isn’t it best to disconnect your hots first and the neutral last.
> 
> when reconnecting power
> Land your neutral first and hots last .
> ...


I don't have the time to type it out again since I am here banging so many hot babes right now, so I will just copy and paste it:



HackWork said:


> Normally we would disconnect the hot then the neutral. And reconnect the neutral then the hot.
> 
> But with service connections it is different, IMO. You shut off the main and pull the meter to make sure that there is no load and no other connections made. Then you want to cut the neutral out of the way since it is a bare conductor, and you don't want that near you while you are touching the hot conductor.
> 
> The same thing when reconnecting, you don't want the neutral anywhere near you until you are done working on the hots, then you can connect the neutral.


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## trentonmakes (Mar 21, 2017)

Unionpride277 said:


> Isn’t it best to disconnect your hots first and the neutral last.
> 
> when reconnecting power
> Land your neutral first and hots last .
> ...


Normally yes!

But in this case you don't want any bare metal near you when making the splices.



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## 99cents (Aug 20, 2012)

HackWork said:


> I don't have the time to type it out again since I am here banging so many hot babes right now, so I will just copy and paste it:


It isn’t difficult to switch from p0rn to ET, or so I’m told.


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## MechanicalDVR (Dec 29, 2007)

MDShunk said:


> It's not that big of a deal. I'm getting rid of most everything anyhow, so to see things go to someone that can use them pleases me. An MD6-8 crimper is only a couple hundred if new, and H-taps and covers are like a buck a piece.


I've done the same type thing just to condense things laying around the garage but it's still a generous present.


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## MechanicalDVR (Dec 29, 2007)

trentonmakes said:


> I've done alot of my own electric before forums,youtube, and diy videos. Before I was working for an electrical contractor I felt pretty comfortable with whatever I was doing electric wise, but I don't think I would ever attempt splicing a service without someone supervising/guiding me.
> 
> That said, the first one I did, the jerk off I was working for put me on an aluminum ladder and went and sat in his truck! Lol


Some people have zero common sense and would just jump right in there.

Kind of like the old 'spark plug' story. Tell a guy that is having an issue with his car running rough to pull off one spark plug wire at a time and smell the connector to see if they smell burned. You know more than half will say "I got a shock from more than half the wires"...just stupid.


You former boss sounds like a real peach.


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## MechanicalDVR (Dec 29, 2007)

Jack Legg said:


> I do the same, with the channel locks to hold it together and then crimp with htap. It really cant get any easier than that
> 
> 
> I have a positioning belt that lets both hands be free on the extension ladder


A "positioning belt"?

For you or the wires?


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## MechanicalDVR (Dec 29, 2007)

Unionpride277 said:


> Isn’t it best to disconnect your hots first and the neutral last.
> 
> when reconnecting power
> Land your neutral first and hots last .
> ...


Reread Hack's post and remember it, just don't go running out and try it for a while.


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## MechanicalDVR (Dec 29, 2007)

trentonmakes said:


> Normally yes!
> 
> But in this case you don't want any bare *grounded* metal near you when making the splices.


Fify!



ie: tools are bare metal


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## Unionpride277 (Oct 31, 2018)

trentonmakes said:


> Unionpride277 said:
> 
> 
> > Isn’t it best to disconnect your hots first and the neutral last.
> ...


Makes sense .

Less room for error


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## jelhill (Nov 11, 2018)

MikeFL said:


> Tip 1: Hire a licensed electrical contractor.
> 
> 
> Step 1: Call a licensed electrical contractor.
> ...



Amen! Go by your local IBEW office and ask them to show you a couple of gruesome videos showing the results of inexperienced guys trying to work on a service while it is hot. Electrical distributors also have Safety reps that come in and show those videos too. The super gruesome one's are guys were suffered a major arc fault while working on high-voltage equipment.


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

trentonmakes said:


> Normally yes!
> 
> But in this case you don't want any bare metal near you when making the splices.


Electrical shocks are bad, but they are not my main concern in this situation. It's the arc blast that I worry about the most. The skin searing flash and molten metal splashing on your face.

The service has a very high amount of available fault current, enough to make huge arc blasts, but usually not enough to open the cut-outs. That means it keeps blasting until it clears itself, which might be long after you hit the ground. 

So that is why I always keep the bare neutral out of the way and I prefer to use connectors which allow me to hold the hot conductor firmly. I don't like trying to balance it in an uncrimped connector while both of my hands are on a crimper, hoping that it doesn't pop out and hit something and blow up.


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## trentonmakes (Mar 21, 2017)

MechanicalDVR said:


> Fify!
> 
> 
> 
> ie: tools are bare metal


I found that out 1st hand on the aluminum ladder! Lol

Razor knife still has all the tape on it! Lol

Sent from my LG-K550 using Tapatalk


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## Jack Legg (Mar 12, 2014)

MechanicalDVR said:


> A "positioning belt"?
> 
> For you or the wires?


 d ring belt with adjustable lanyard, work hands free


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## MDShunk (Jan 7, 2007)

Jack Legg said:


> d ring belt with adjustable lanyard, work hands free


I just hook the crook of my knee of one leg over a rung and lean back if I need to. Not three points of contact, but who's counting?


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## MechanicalDVR (Dec 29, 2007)

Jack Legg said:


> d ring belt with adjustable lanyard, work hands free


Oh I see, wasn't familiar with the term 'positioning belt'.


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## matt1124 (Aug 23, 2011)

I use burndy insulinks and an OUR840 crimper. Easy peasy. Neutral gets an H-tap, just use an MD-6. Of all the expensive tools I've bought for all the stuff we get into, those two crimpers were an easy buy.

Had a smart meter tattle on me the other day. POCO showed up, put their barrel lock device on to keep me out. After they rolled away, went out to the van and got the key for them, took it right back off, kept going.


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## jelhill (Nov 11, 2018)

matt1124 said:


> I use burndy insulinks and an OUR840 crimper. Easy peasy. Neutral gets an H-tap, just use an MD-6. Of all the expensive tools I've bought for all the stuff we get into, those two crimpers were an easy buy.
> 
> Had a smart meter tattle on me the other day. POCO showed up, put their barrel lock device on to keep me out. After they rolled away, went out to the van and got the key for them, took it right back off, kept going.


Smart meters and Barrel locks are a pain in the butt. Was much easier in the old days to cut the tag, pull the meter, change the service and go on to the next job.


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

Barrel locks are easy. The sucky locks are the ones on these meter pans that you find in older multi-family houses. They are even hard to get unlocked with the key.










That's why drilling them in the right spot is my option of choice :biggrin:


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## Going_Commando (Oct 1, 2011)

MechanicalDVR said:


> HackWork said:
> 
> 
> > Very true.
> ...


Free speech is a mofo. I don't really care if some home jobber reads what we post. Personal responsibility is the unfortunate byproduct of freedom. We discuss topics and methods on here all the time that regular folks dont know whether its safe or not, but its not like this stuff has never been written about or talked about before. Its no secret how to work on energized equipment. A lot electricians around here won't do live taps because they've never done it, and are scared of it, and yet most of them have 0 electrical safety training. 

Anyways, yeah, the last couple h tap installs I did I pinched the flaps with channies. I havent done a residential service change in a couple years, so that part was a little rusty.


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## Kevin (Feb 14, 2017)

*Disconnect & reconnect*

Here in ottawa we are not permitted to do our own disconnect reconnects, however, across the river in quebec we can (and have to apperently).

Any arial wiring must be connected with crimps or ampact connectors... they must be permanant.

I've got a job to do at a friends place in quebec and need to work in the meterbase to change conductors... lost the job because we didn't want to use a crimper on the ladder. 

FYI, Ampact guns are EXSPENSIVE! Burndy makes one and the cheapest kit i was quoted at guillevin was 6K! and that's without any connectors or charges for it!


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## MTW (Aug 28, 2013)

I'm in National Grid land here, if you know anything about them you know that you pretty much have to do everything because if you don't, its not getting done. We have to use parallel groove connectors which they provide. I use my impact gun to tighten them up but have used a regular ratchet in the past. Thankfully a lineman gave me a bunch of rolls of 2" wide 3M 37 tape (much thicker than 33) for taping them up. They don't provide seal tags, however. 

I also use and strongly recommend getting some 500 volt rated gloves for this task. They are much easier to use than the kilovolt rated ones but still provide that high level of safety.


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## Sparkykurt (Dec 23, 2018)

*hot hook-ups*

Don't use an aluminum ladder!


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## trentonmakes (Mar 21, 2017)

Sparkykurt said:


> Don't use an aluminum ladder!


I concur!

Sent from my LG-K550 using Tapatalk


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

Sparkykurt said:


> Don't use an aluminum ladder!





trentonmakes said:


> I concur!


Oh it's fine. Rubber feet.


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## Switched (Dec 23, 2012)

HackWork said:


> Oh it's fine. Rubber feet.
> 
> 
> View attachment 130996


NO!

YOU ALSO NEED DE-OX!

If not the ladder may be corroded and not conduct properly.:wink:


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## Warning (Dec 21, 2018)

*Burndy Hot Taps*

Why not use Burndy Hot Taps? The jaws are isolated from the bolts that tighten the jaws. You dont even have to strip the conductors. The jaws bite right through the insulation. They come with dielectric grease in them. Loosen them enough to slip the conductors inside, unstripped, and then tighten down with a ratchet. Like I said, the bolts are isolated so your ratchet will not be energized as you are tightening them. I recommend checking the torque again right before you leave to make sure they are nice and tight. They are a rated connector. Our poco uses them all the time to tap off their overhead spans to a new drop.

Always de-energize your circuits before working on them, but if you can't do it hot, you shouldn't be touching it! Just my two Lincoln's worth!


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

Warning said:


> *Why not use Burndy Hot Taps?* The jaws are isolated from the bolts that tighten the jaws. You dont even have to strip the conductors. The jaws bite right through the insulation. They come with dielectric grease in them. Loosen them enough to slip the conductors inside, unstripped, and then tighten down with a ratchet. Like I said, the bolts are isolated so your ratchet will not be energized as you are tightening them. I recommend checking the torque again right before you leave to make sure they are nice and tight. They are a rated connector. Our poco uses them all the time to tap off their overhead spans to a new drop.
> 
> Always de-energize your circuits before working on them, but if you can't do it hot, you shouldn't be touching it! Just my two Lincoln's worth!


Because the ones that do 4/0 are $20+ each. I also am not the biggest fan of them because they only have little teeth that bit thru the insulation. I know they are tested and rated for that, but it still just doesn't seem right. 

The $5 barrel splice makes a solid connection and can be installed with a 12V impact gun in a couple seconds. I don't know how many hundreds of these I've installed in this situation over the last decade and I never had one fail.


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## MTW (Aug 28, 2013)

HackWork said:


> Because the ones that do 4/0 are $20+ each. I also am not the biggest fan of them because they only have little teeth that bit thru the insulation. I know they are tested and rated for that, but it still just doesn't seem right.
> 
> The $5 barrel splice makes a solid connection and can be installed with a 12V impact gun in a couple seconds. I don't know how many hundreds of these I've installed in this situation over the last decade and I never had one fail.


Hi Hacky. :vs_wave:

I'd use those if they weren't disallowed by the poco here. They provide the parallel groove connectors and tape but they are much more of a pain to use than the inline splicers. Oh well. I've used so many of the parallel connectors by now that it's nothing to me, but I'd rather use an easier connector given the danger.


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## Warning (Dec 21, 2018)

*Burndy Hot Taps*

How many wires on the drop? Your life and well being is not worth 80.00?
No one said electrical work was cheap! I use what's available too, but some items I just won't budge on-I am fortunate enough to work in a market where there is no such thing as too expensive. I know you call yourself hackwork, but even you must have SOME STANDARDS. Or are you the guy who buys the cheapest, crappiest materials and then charges out at the most outlandish rates for the stuff that I come behind and fix for nothing because I feel so bad for the poor homeowner who got taken to the cleaners by you?


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

Warning said:


> How many wires on the drop? Your life and well being is not worth 80.00?


 This is a silly argument. There is a greater chance of me getting hurt or killed driving to the job than splicing the service in. Should I just stay home?

The connectors you are speaking of are not that much safer (if any safer at all, that is only your opinion) than the connectors that I use. 



> No one said electrical work was cheap! I use what's available too, but some items I just won't budge on-I am fortunate enough to work in a market where there is no such thing as too expensive. I know you call yourself hackwork, but even you must have SOME STANDARDS. Or are you the guy who buys the cheapest, crappiest materials and then charges out at the most outlandish rates for the stuff that I come behind and fix for nothing because I feel so bad for the poor homeowner who got taken to the cleaners by you?


You talk a lot of sh1t for someone who just joined. What was your previous username?


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## eddy current (Feb 28, 2009)

Warning said:


> Why not use Burndy Hot Taps? The jaws are isolated from the bolts that tighten the jaws. You dont even have to strip the conductors. The jaws bite right through the insulation. They come with dielectric grease in them. Loosen them enough to slip the conductors inside, unstripped, and then tighten down with a ratchet. Like I said, the bolts are isolated so your ratchet will not be energized as you are tightening them. I recommend checking the torque again right before you leave to make sure they are nice and tight. They are a rated connector. Our poco uses them all the time to tap off their overhead spans to a new drop.
> 
> Always de-energize your circuits before working on them, but if you can't do it hot, you shouldn't be touching it! Just my two Lincoln's worth!


I have a couple of those that I removed from a grow-op that was stealing power and got caught. They tapped the underground feed before the meter with them.


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