# Lighting Relay / Breaker Panels



## adonkle (Jun 10, 2014)

Likely a dumb question but I can't seem to find the answer out of Google. I'm doing research for an new construction auditorium project (comparing central stage lighting dimmer rack vs. a relay panel to handle stage lighting circuits), and I'm trying to find the "standard practice" for lighting control in new commercial buildings, such as K12 projects. From what I've read, all loads are fed from breaker panels just like any electrical system, but then the lighting circuits are routed to a separate relay panel to add automation on/off control. 

This seems slightly odd to me, since I would think that using combination breaker/relay panels would save a lot of cost and labor vs. 2 separate panels. The general sense I get is that separate panels are the standard practice install though, so I'm curious if anyone can explain why that is? (Or point me to where I might find the answer)

Thanks,


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## BBS (Aug 19, 2009)

This might be a stupid question, I don't know, but can your combo breaker/relay panel handle dimming?
I'm pretty inexperienced with this kind of lighting control but I imagine for an auditorium the client might need more flexibility to handle different load types and dim them. Something _like_ a Lutron Graphik Eye, with its separate power modules, might be better suited to their requirements.


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## adonkle (Jun 10, 2014)

BBS said:


> This might be a stupid question, I don't know, but can your combo breaker/relay panel handle dimming?
> I'm pretty inexperienced with this kind of lighting control but I imagine for an auditorium the client might need more flexibility to handle different load types and dim them. Something _like_ a Lutron Graphik Eye, with its separate power modules, might be better suited to their requirements.


The reason we're looking at a 100% relay system is that LED stage lighting has greatly improved over the last few years in a number of areas. LED stage lighting fixtures are fed 120V power, and controlled by a separate low voltage DMX cabling connected to each fixture. The DMX cable controls everything the fixture does, e.g. dimming from 100%-0%, changing color, etc. from a lighting control board. 

Because of this, the 120V power fed to each light no longer needs to dim, just automatically switch on/off like the main light fixtures in the building do at night already.


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## BBS (Aug 19, 2009)

Well it sounds like an interesting system to work on. 
I'd be speculating if I commented further but it would be cool to get some experience on those systems.


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## Vintage Sounds (Oct 23, 2009)

You sound like you're looking for the Cutler-Hammer Pow-R-Command system. The breakers themselves are remote controlled switches. I installed one of these in a retail environment. It looked pretty slick. I believe Square D has something similar called Powerlink.


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## CTshockhazard (Aug 28, 2009)

Haven't dealt with them in a while (pre LED) but they were a great company to deal.

http://www.marlincontrols.com/


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## B-Nabs (Jun 4, 2014)

I'm doing a theatre right now where the stage lighting comes out of what are called Echo relay panels, which incorporate OCPD and relays. The lights, as you say, are LED with DMX control. Don't have the exact part number handy but it's from this company http://www.etcconnect.com/Products/Dimming-Switching/Unison-Dimming/Echo-Relay-Panel/Features.aspx


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## Dennis Alwon (May 9, 2009)

I would bet Lutron has this ability. I have done a graphic eye system and we ran all the switch legs to a special panel that was fed from the main panel. From there all the low voltage cables-- in your case DMX were pulled to the panel and connected there.


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## adonkle (Jun 10, 2014)

B-Nabs said:


> I'm doing a theatre right now where the stage lighting comes out of what are called Echo relay panels, which incorporate OCPD and relays. The lights, as you say, are LED with DMX control. Don't have the exact part number handy but it's from this company http://www.etcconnect.com/Products/Dimming-Switching/Unison-Dimming/Echo-Relay-Panel/Features.aspx
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


Yup we use ETC a lot (they're one of the main dimmer rack manufacturers in the US, and recently moved into the Relay panel market with Echo). How do you think the Echo relay panel compares to the typical lighting control panels used in other areas of the building? (e.g. Eaton, Cooper, etc. brands)


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## B-Nabs (Jun 4, 2014)

We are still roughing in so I've only seen shop drawings for them, it'll be interesting to see how it all goes together. It seems like a good idea to have breaker & relay in one. Only thing I've seen that I don't like is they're only 4" deep and I think 14" wide. I'd prefer if they were more like other commercial panels, 6" deep and 20" wide.


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