# Carlon boxes



## suffolkmike (Dec 19, 2011)

*Carbon boxes*

Auto corrected to carbon in the title.


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## Dennis Alwon (May 9, 2009)

Nothing wrong with them. Personally I don't like the way the wire clamp works so I use P&S. I think it became a joke since they were sold at the Home Depot and Lowes.

I corrected the title


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## MTW (Aug 28, 2013)

My supply house carries Crouse Hinds plastic boxes which are just rebranded Cantex boxes. They appear to be better than Carlon but they are more expensive, so I just stick with the Carlons.


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## macmikeman (Jan 23, 2007)

If you live in the land of 100% all pressure treated wood, you know the difference. Carlon nails are a joke.


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## tersus (Jul 3, 2012)

I hate blue Carlon boxes, especially the remodel type. They're flimsy and don't hold their shape depending on how you nail them to the stud--especially a 2 or 3 gang box. The holes for device screws are never threaded. Allied fiberglass boxes are where it's at.


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## Expediter (Mar 12, 2014)

I only use the Super Blues. I detest the fiberglass boxes. They are such cheap junk that if you bump them with your hammer, they crack and need to be replaced. If you back the first device out and insert another, the chances of the device screw stripping out is very good.

The gray plastic boxes from the SH are too expensive and have the same properties as the cheap carlon plastic boxes. All should be discontinued IMO. The heavy Bakelight ones are ok, just too expensive.


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## MTW (Aug 28, 2013)

Expediter said:


> I only use the Super Blues. I detest the fiberglass boxes. They are such cheap junk that if you bump them with your hammer, they crack and need to be replaced. If you back the first device out and insert another, the chances of the device screw stripping out is very good.
> 
> The gray plastic boxes from the SH are too expensive and have the same properties as the cheap carlon plastic boxes. All should be discontinued IMO. The heavy Bakelight ones are ok, just too expensive.


I hate the Allied boxes too. I once did an ivory to white device change in a condo that had the Allied's, and a bunch of them were broken or stripped out. I refuse to use them. 

The bakelites used to be very popular here but once they got too expensive, most EC's switched to Carlon or Slater.


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## guest (Feb 21, 2009)

Expediter said:


> *I only use the Super Blues.* I detest the fiberglass boxes. They are such cheap junk that if you bump them with your hammer, they crack and need to be replaced. If you back the first device out and insert another, the chances of the device screw stripping out is very good.
> 
> The gray plastic boxes from the SH are too expensive and have the same properties as the cheap carlon plastic boxes. All should be discontinued IMO. The heavy Bakelight ones are ok, just too expensive.


Same here, nothing wrong with the Super blues. 

Carlon also makes the adjustable boxes, where they have a metal bracket you secure to the stud. There is a screw accessible after the finish is put up where you can adjust the box to the finish surface depth. Very handy in kitchens and baths where tile is involved, no guessing during rough on how far to set the box. 

The _only_ drawbacks to them are that in anything other than single gang, the end of the box opposite the bracket can push into the wall a bit. And they are made with the standard Carlon Blue plastic. I'd really like to see the adjustable feature in the Super Blue plastic version, that would make it the almost perfect box for all seasons. 

As to the OP' question, the main reasons are as others have said, first off they are common in the big box stores, they are favorites of DIY's and hacks as they are so cheap, and that the regular ones always distort out of shape and strip easily. It has been a running joke on here for years. :laughing:


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## rcar (Apr 28, 2013)

Any brand nail on is fine with me. The Carlon cut in boxes are a different story though. The flaps get hung and bent, always a pain in the a**. The round cut ins are the worst box known to man. All round cut ins should be round, not kinda round with big humps ever so often.


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

rcar said:


> Any brand nail on is fine with me. The Carlon cut in boxes are a different story though. The flaps get hung and bent, always a pain in the a**. The round cut ins are the worst box known to man. All round cut ins should be round, not kinda round with big humps ever so often.



I use these:










3-5/8 hole saw works perfect.


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## A Little Short (Nov 11, 2010)

Dennis Alwon said:


> Nothing wrong with them. Personally I don't like the way the wire clamp works so I use P&S. I think it became a joke since they were sold at the Home Depot and Lowes.


Seems there is something about any of them that I don't like.

For nail-ons I like P&S
I thought I liked the P&S old work until I was installing some in a paneled wall. They don't tighten up enough to make the box tight. I had to use Madison clips to tighten up the box. 
Luckily it was just a switch box. If it was a receptacle box I wouldn't trust it because pushing/pulling on the plug end would probably loosen it back up.

I too like the Super blue but seems "Blowes" has either stopped carrying them or were out when I looked. Come to think of it I looked on their website later and didn't see them there either.


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## MTW (Aug 28, 2013)

I hate the P&S boxes with the "Quick Click" feature. I much prefer the threaded holes over those.


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## 3D Electric (Mar 24, 2013)

Allied black plastic boxes for nailons (they have threaded 6-32 screw holes), only fiberglass for anything cut in or in the ceiling. Snap or strip enough 8-32 screws in a plastic box in the ceiling it gets pretty aggravating.


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## wendon (Sep 27, 2010)

tersus said:


> I hate blue Carlon boxes, especially the remodel type. They're flimsy and don't hold their shape depending on how you nail them to the stud--especially a 2 or 3 gang box. The holes for device screws are never threaded. Allied fiberglass boxes are where it's at.


Where are you finding blue Carlon remodels with nails? You're doing it wrong. I use blue's all the time. I do like the Allied fiberglass boxes but they're not all that great when the tapers fill the screw holes with mud. I don't care all that much for the Super Blues because, unless the vandal with the rotozip is very careful, the cover plate barely covers. I hate the Slaters with the push in screw feature. Probably has more to do with what's available locally.


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## A Little Short (Nov 11, 2010)

wendon said:


> Where are you finding blue Carlon remodels with nails? You're doing it wrong. I use blue's all the time. I do like the Allied fiberglass boxes but they're not all that great when the tapers fill the screw holes with mud. I don't care all that much for the Super Blues because, unless the vandal with the rotozip is very careful, the cover plate barely covers. I hate the Slaters with the push in screw feature. Probably has more to do with what's available locally.


I too was wondering about remodel boxes with nails!:blink:

What are the Slater/P&S with the push in screw feature? Don't think I've run across those unless I have and used them wrong!


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## wendon (Sep 27, 2010)

A Little Short said:


> I too was wondering about remodel boxes with nails!:blink:
> 
> What are the Slater/P&S with the push in screw feature? Don't think I've run across those unless I have and used them wrong!


They have that little metal clip that allows you to just push the screw in and then it strips out when you tighten it. A drywall screw will fix it.


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## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

The whole Carlon thing hails back to the _metal_ men , who's recent renaissance via weights being introduced in 314.27 frittered out when manufacturers caught up with accommodating listings.....~CS~


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## tersus (Jul 3, 2012)

wendon said:


> Where are you finding blue Carlon remodels with nails? You're doing it wrong. I use blue's all the time. I do like the Allied fiberglass boxes but they're not all that great when the tapers fill the screw holes with mud. I don't care all that much for the Super Blues because, unless the vandal with the rotozip is very careful, the cover plate barely covers. I hate the Slaters with the push in screw feature. Probably has more to do with what's available locally.


I didn't word that very well, I know the remodels don't have nails. One of the reasons I don't like the blue Carlons is because of the crappy workmanship I usually see in them--other's sloppy wiring job. I'm sure it's different in other areas, but almost every time I have to pull the switches or receptacles out of a blue box to troubleshoot, I usually have to fix something I shouldn't have to--wire nuts pop off, no slack on the conductors, or they were put on the devices worth a crap. You just learn to associate certain things with quality of work, profiling I guess. For me where I'm from, blue box=sloppy work and fiberglass box = nice neat work. Not always the case, but ridiculous how often it seems to be. Another reason I like the fiberglass boxes is because I can break them apart in a finished wall pretty easily without damaging the wall. For example, somebody wants to add a switch, I can break the 1 gang nail-on apart in the wall, fish the wire down easily, and then put the 2 gang in.


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## Norcal (Mar 22, 2007)

480sparky said:


> I use these:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I agree, quick and simple. Carlon's version of those boxes are a joke, too many steps to use them.


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## macmikeman (Jan 23, 2007)

Norcal said:


> I agree, quick and simple. Carlon's version of those boxes are a joke, too many steps to use them.


Not only that, they don't use machine screws to hold the bracket, carlon supplies sheet metal course thread screws that wont screw in easily and sometimes by the time you have the clamp secured, you have punched in the drywall at the spot where the ears are from trying to screw in the crappy securing screws for the bracket. Total garbage.


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## A Little Short (Nov 11, 2010)

chicken steve said:


> The whole Carlon thing hails back to the _metal_ men , who's recent renaissance via weights being introduced in 314.27 frittered out when manufacturers caught up with accommodating listings.....~CS~


Dang! Just when I thought I had my "CS" translator updated and tuned in.
Time for a new "updated CS" translator!:blink:


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## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

It's really no big deal Shorty, the code assumed weight requirements, the EI's here were insisting on metallic octagons due to their listing until the plastic box manufacturers caught up....:thumbsup:~CS~


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## shocksystems (Apr 25, 2009)

480sparky said:


> I use these:
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Funny, I hate these boxes. Sometimes one of the wings won't catch behind the ceiling board (particularly if the ceiling is not a standard thickness) and then you are kind of stuck, one behind, one not, trying to to get the other wing in without damaging the ceiling. Then the fact that it is fiberglass makes it more likely that the screw holes will strip.

Cheers!

Jim


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

shocksystems said:


> Funny, I hate these boxes. Sometimes one of the wings won't catch behind the ceiling board (particularly if the ceiling is not a standard thickness) and then you are kind of stuck, one behind, one not, trying to to get the other wing in without damaging the ceiling...........


Easy fix: Take a pair of tinsnips to the clamp and lop off ¼" before installing.



shocksystems said:


> ......Then the fact that it is fiberglass makes it more likely that the screw holes will strip.
> 
> Cheers!
> 
> Jim


Easy fix: Don't use a cordless to tighten the screws.


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## Norcal (Mar 22, 2007)

shocksystems said:


> Funny, I hate these boxes. Sometimes one of the wings won't catch behind the ceiling board (particularly if the ceiling is not a standard thickness) and then you are kind of stuck, one behind, one not, trying to to get the other wing in without damaging the ceiling. Then the fact that it is fiberglass makes it more likely that the screw holes will strip.
> 
> Cheers!
> 
> Jim


 
If you strip the threads, use a Heli-Coil kit or one of their competitors products, I use a 6/32 kit to repair those expletive deleted Kwik-Clik boxes, then the OEM device screws still work.


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## samjg1 (Jan 18, 2015)

macmikeman said:


> Not only that, they don't use machine screws to hold the bracket, carlon supplies sheet metal course thread screws that wont screw in easily and sometimes by the time you have the clamp secured, you have punched in the drywall at the spot where the ears are from trying to screw in the crappy securing screws for the bracket. Total garbage.


I usually take the electric screwdriver to the screws and run the clamp down and back to the starting position before installing the box. Just hold the clamp still while doing it. 
Makes a big difference.


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## samjg1 (Jan 18, 2015)

macmikeman said:


> Not only that, they don't use machine screws to hold the bracket, carlon supplies sheet metal course thread screws that wont screw in easily and sometimes by the time you have the clamp secured, you have punched in the drywall at the spot where the ears are from trying to screw in the crappy securing screws for the bracket. Total garbage.


Before installing the box try turning the screws to bring the clamps in and out (I use an electric screwdriver).
The box goes in much easier that way.


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## macmikeman (Jan 23, 2007)

samjg1 said:


> Before installing the box try turning the screws to bring the clamps in and out (I use an electric screwdriver).
> The box goes in much easier that way.



I have been doing that........


I have been doing that.......





:laughing:


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## samjg1 (Jan 18, 2015)

For some reason my original reply didn't show up on my puter, and I didn't see any way to delete the second one


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## MTW (Aug 28, 2013)

I'm switching to black enameled gem boxes.


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## Going_Commando (Oct 1, 2011)

MTW said:


> I'm switching to black enameled gem boxes.


Like a boss.


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## MHElectric (Oct 14, 2011)

Anybody done a price check with a case of 18 cu carlon vs P&S?



MTW said:


> I hate the P&S boxes with the "Quick Click" feature. I much prefer the threaded holes over those.


I love the quick clips when I'm under the house making up j-boxes. No screwdriver needed to put on the blank cover, just bang the screws in with your kleins.


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## MHElectric (Oct 14, 2011)

MHElectric said:


> Anybody done a price check with a case of 18 cu carlon vs P&S?


Nevermind, I just looked it up. Carlon wins by a mile - $24 for a case of 18 cu nail on boxes.


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## mapmd (Oct 26, 2014)

tersus said:


> I hate blue Carlon boxes, especially the remodel type. They're flimsy and don't hold their shape depending on how you nail them to the stud--especially a 2 or 3 gang box. The holes for device screws are never threaded. Allied fiberglass boxes are where it's at.


I've had this problem too. Really do like the single gang nail-ons though, including where you insert the wire. As for larger gangs, I not only dislike their flimsy-ness, but how you insert the wire as well. It's also difficult to nail at those angles too, especially when you're below windows.



Expediter said:


> I only use the Super Blues. I detest the fiberglass boxes. They are such cheap junk that if you bump them with your hammer, they crack and need to be replaced. If you back the first device out and insert another, the chances of the device screw stripping out is very good.
> The gray plastic boxes from the SH are too expensive and have the same properties as the cheap carlon plastic boxes. All should be discontinued IMO. The heavy Bakelight ones are ok, just too expensive.


I've never used anything else, but then again I'm not the one buying them (14 mo. experience). I've never heard of any other brands either like Slater or Bakelight. Even the supply house that sells P&S outlets and switches sells Carlon boxes, and I didn't even know P&S made boxes. Also happened to crack a 4-gang with my hammer earlier in the week, the cold probably did not help.



macmikeman said:


> If you live in the land of 100% all pressure treated wood, you know the difference. Carlon nails are a joke.


How does one build a house using all PT lumber? Sounds rather crazy in my opinion. Regulations?


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## five.five-six (Apr 9, 2013)

I hate PT splinters....


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## MTW (Aug 28, 2013)

If they could sell Slater boxes at Carlon prices, I'd be happy. I like the Slater cable clamps but I hate the Quick Klik or whatever it's called.


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## Lectric (Nov 22, 2014)

Here in Pa pressure treated is only allowed at grade level , nothing exposed or concealed in living areas. As far as op we use all Carlon B120A. Or B122A. Singles , B232,B344, etc...and yup busted my share due to the cold.


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## MHElectric (Oct 14, 2011)

MTW said:


> If they could sell Slater boxes at Carlon prices, I'd be happy. I like the Slater cable clamps but I hate the Quick Klik or whatever it's called.


Everybody likes the Slater box clamps, but they are twice the price of a carlon box. And if you don't like the quick klicks, it seems like it's not even worth it.

I'm won't swear P&S off, but I'm using carlon for now. The cost savings...that's what it boils down to.


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## pjholguin (May 16, 2014)

I like P&S...The SH carries others but I prefer Qiik Klik and use the deep 22s. It leaves a lot
of room for big devices.


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## Chris1971 (Dec 27, 2010)

suffolkmike said:


> I see a lot of threads mentioning Carlon boxes. Is there a problem with these? I have spent the last 3 years in residential service and I haven't found much difference between any of the old work boxes.


The Carlon boxes seem to distort sometimes when you nail them on. Probably the biggest issue I've seen with them.


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## MTW (Aug 28, 2013)

My supply house sell crouse hinds plastic boxes. They are actually made by cantex and seem pretty decent.


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## DougAles (Jan 2, 2015)

Hi Everyone. 

I've enjoyed reading this thread and listening to the feedback. Thank you. 

Carlon offers many types of boxes, PVC, polycarbonate, and phenolic. 

Here is a link to our catalog:

http://tnblnx3.tnb.com/emAlbum/albums//StrategicPlatformCatalogs2013/cat1_carlonnonmetallicboxes.pdf

If I can offer selection assistance, please just ask.

Note: if your happy with your current box choice, whichever brand, I'm happy for you. I'm simply posting this to see if I can help.


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## RIVETER (Sep 26, 2009)

suffolkmike said:


> I see a lot of threads mentioning Carlon boxes. Is there a problem with these? I have spent the last 3 years in residential service and I haven't found much difference between any of the old work boxes.


I use them...no problem as far as I know.


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## Black Dog (Oct 16, 2011)

RIVETER said:


> I use them...no problem as far as I know.


Same here:thumbsup:


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## guest (Feb 21, 2009)

DougAles said:


> Hi Everyone.
> 
> I've enjoyed reading this thread and listening to the feedback. Thank you.
> 
> ...


Hi Doug, and thanks for joining in on this discussion.  

Here's my take on the Carlon line:



> Same here, *nothing wrong with the Super blues*.
> 
> Carlon also makes *the adjustable boxes*,
> The _only_ drawbacks to them *are that in anything other than single gang, the end of the box opposite the bracket can push into the wall a bit. And they are made with the standard Carlon Blue plastic. I'd really like to see the adjustable feature in the Super Blue plastic version, that would make it the almost perfect box for all seasons. *



Now I'll confess to not having looked through the catalog link you posted, so maybe my ideal Super Blue adjustable depth box already exists? 

If not, maybe drop a line to your engineering/production depts to see if it would be cost-effective to make it happen?


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## Black Dog (Oct 16, 2011)

mxslick said:


> Hi Doug, and thanks for joining in on this discussion.
> 
> Here's my take on the Carlon line:
> 
> ...


I use the adjustable type all the time .....


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## Oakey (Feb 16, 2009)

Carlon makes a plastic box that has a sidecar, its comes in handy in some older reno's.
About the extent of it for me


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## wendon (Sep 27, 2010)

DougAles said:


> Hi Everyone.
> 
> I've enjoyed reading this thread and listening to the feedback. Thank you.
> 
> ...


Doug,
That sounds an awful lot like "if you like your box you can keep your box" !!!!!!!:laughing:

I use regular Carlon nail on all the time with very little trouble. I've had more trouble with the fiberglass boxes. I actually like the regular ones better than the Super Blues.


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## Switched (Dec 23, 2012)

Doug, thanks for joining.....please please pay attention!

I would really like a remodel box we can actually use on stucco out here on the West Coast. Something we can cut in when the stucco is 1-1/2" to 2" deep, the current cut in boxes, from every brand, just plain suck for this application!

Okay.... 

Beyond that, I think people don't like the fact that it makes it appear they buy all their stuff from HD!:laughing:


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## Black Dog (Oct 16, 2011)

Switched said:


> Doug, thanks for joining.....please please pay attention!
> 
> I would really like a remodel box we can actually use on stucco out here on the West Coast. Something we can cut in when the stucco is 1-1/2" to 2" deep, the current cut in boxes, from every brand, just plain suck for this application!
> 
> ...


No one will know!!:laughing:


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## Going_Commando (Oct 1, 2011)

I hate Carlon boxes and will be sticking with my preferred brands. Fiberglass boxes suck too


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## mikewillnot (Apr 2, 2013)

Just worked on a round carlon nail-on behind a ceilng fixture with one piece of 14/2 coming into the box. Mouse got in through excess gap where the romex came in, and made a nest. Nice and warm up there, behind the light bulb. Used some of the fiberglass insulation from the attic for his nest. Chewed about 1/3 of the insulation off the conductors. Nice.


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## mikewillnot (Apr 2, 2013)

Switched said:


> I would really like a remodel box we can actually use on stucco out here on the West Coast. Something we can cut in when the stucco is 1-1/2" to 2" deep, the current cut in boxes, from every brand, just plain suck for this application!:laughing:


Lately I've been seeing contractors mount new-work carlons (or old-work too) in old-work situations by placing them next to a stud and driving a couple of drywall screws through the side of the box from the inside, into the stud.

Still, probably hard to pull off with a 2" deep wall surface.


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## Switched (Dec 23, 2012)

mikewillnot said:


> Lately I've been seeing contractors mount new-work carlons (or old-work too) in old-work situations by placing them next to a stud and driving a couple of drywall screws through the side of the box from the inside, into the stud.
> 
> Still, probably hard to pull off with a 2" deep wall surface.


I can use a Smart Box for that. It would be cool to have a true retrofit product that doesn't require a stud for placement.


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## MTW (Aug 28, 2013)

Going_Commando said:


> I hate Carlon boxes and will be sticking with my preferred brands. Fiberglass boxes suck too


So what do you use then? Slater? I can't picture you using those brown bakelite ones.


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## mikewillnot (Apr 2, 2013)

I give up. What's a smart box? Seriously.


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## MTW (Aug 28, 2013)

mikewillnot said:


> I give up. What's a smart box? Seriously.


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## mikewillnot (Apr 2, 2013)

Cool! Want!


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## Knauer (Jun 6, 2011)

MHElectric said:


> Everybody likes the Slater box clamps, but they are twice the price of a carlon box. And if you don't like the quick klicks, it seems like it's not even worth it. I'm won't swear P&S off, but I'm using carlon for now. The cost savings...that's what it boils down to.



Slater makes a cheaper single and double gang box. Exact same but no quick clamps. P122 vs s122 and p235 vs s235.


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## wendon (Sep 27, 2010)

In my opinion, the bottom of the barrel is the Slater with the quick clicks. Absolute junk. You might as well go ahead and mount your device with drywall screws instead of the regular 6-32 or they'll just strip out.


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## Going_Commando (Oct 1, 2011)

wendon said:


> In my opinion, the bottom of the barrel is the Slater with the quick clicks. Absolute junk. You might as well go ahead and mount your device with drywall screws instead of the regular 6-32 or they'll just strip out.


I honestly dont know why yall have such a hard time with slater boxes. Ive been putting them in for years and only stripped them out when i tried to just push the screws in. It aint that hard, I promise. 

Yes Pete, we primarily use Slater or Madison Smart boxes. The clamps actually hold the romex in place, they dont flex as much when hammering the nails. I also prefer 22cu in boxes instead of 18s like most carlons are.


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## Shockdoc (Mar 4, 2010)

i still use them. This is the last of a case i bought for $10.


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## MTW (Aug 28, 2013)

Shockdoc said:


> View attachment 51625
> i still use them. This is the last of a case i bought for $10.



I'd throw those right in the trash. Not even worth using if they're free.


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