# Massachusetts permits



## sbrn33 (Mar 15, 2007)

There is a reason it's called a homeowners permit. What you are doing is illegal in Nebraska . Is it worth your license?


----------



## Pfloyd527 (Oct 4, 2011)

No obviously not but I wasn't aware that I wasnt able to do this..... I can't find where it is written.... There was no malicious intent....


----------



## BBQ (Nov 16, 2010)

It is a mess.

There is no such thing in MA state rules as a 'home owners permit' 

Only people doing work for hire need to be licensed and only licensed people can pull permits. A homeowner working in their own home is not working for hire so there is no state law requiring them to have license or pull a permit.

Yes, I do know some towns do issue HO permits. But I have never seen a state law about, in other words the towns are just making it up. Other towns refuse to do anything with a homeowner, no permits no inspections. 

You need to pull your own permit.


----------



## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

Pfloyd527 said:


> I'm doing a kitchen remodel on the side for a few extra bucks, I had the home owner go down to town hall and pull the electrical permit because I wasn't able to get to town hall during business hours and it was gonna just save me time. I was informed and unaware that supposedly a licensed electrician cannot work under a home owners permit...... I've combed the mass general laws and the code of mass regulations and can find no such ruling.... Is it some "un written law" or have I just not found the black and white??? If anyone has any knowledge on the subject such as the law chapter and section and any possible fines and penalties I would appreciate any type of direction on this subject. Thankyou!!!


You have to pull the permit and put down your full name and license number and you must have liability insurance or the HO must sign the waiver on the permit.

You can find the rules for mass Electricians here read them all .

A home owners permit is for a home owner to do his own work, not so he can hire an Electrician to do the work for him your license must appear on the permit if you are doing the work.


----------



## electricmanscott (Feb 11, 2010)

Dear Homeowner... You get what you pay for. Just sayin' :whistling2:


----------



## Pfloyd527 (Oct 4, 2011)

Thankyou all for your input, I know about liability insurance and carry my own policy so changing the permit hopefully won't be an issue, an oversight on my part but you live and learn I guess


----------



## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

BBQ said:


> It is a mess.
> 
> There is no such thing in MA state rules as a 'home owners permit'
> 
> ...


Your right it is a mess ,,

Thank god they redesigned the boards web site ,,It would help if they also included useful information like some answers to what should be a vary simple question like the OP's...:blink::blink:



BTW 
*Pfloyd527 welcome to the forum..:thumbup::thumbup:
*


----------



## BBQ (Nov 16, 2010)

All the relevant MGLs are listed in the front of the code book assuming you have the one with the MA amendments.


----------



## sbrn33 (Mar 15, 2007)

In Nebraska you have to be an Electrical Contractor(master) or homeowner living in the home being worked on to pull any type of electrical permit. A Journeyman could not pull one.
Although a kitchen remodal outside of a city would not need one unless you install a new service.


----------



## BBQ (Nov 16, 2010)

sbrn33 said:


> In Nebraska you have to be an Electrical Contractor(master) or homeowner living in the home being worked on to pull any type of electrical permit. A Journeyman could not pull one.
> Although a kitchen remodal outside of a city would not need one unless you install a new service.


Every place is different. here it is a tough to become a J-man and J-men can pull permits. A J-man can run a business with up to only one apprentice. 

If you want to grow the business you need a masters license. 

However masters can't work with the tools. Once you get your masters you must also keep up your j-man license to work in the field.


----------



## 19kilosparky984 (Sep 14, 2011)

sbrn33 said:


> In Nebraska you have to be an Electrical Contractor(master) or homeowner living in the home being worked on to pull any type of electrical permit. A Journeyman could not pull one.
> Although a kitchen remodal outside of a city would not need one unless you install a new service.


Only on ET would somebody reply to a thread about Massachusetts permits with what is needed for Nebraska..... :lol:


----------



## sbrn33 (Mar 15, 2007)

I was explaining my first post. next time read the whole thread. Are you rewire?


----------



## BBQ (Nov 16, 2010)

19kilosparky984 said:


> Only on ET would somebody reply to a thread about Massachusetts permits with what is needed for Nebraska..... :lol:


:thumbup:

It is what we all do. :jester:


Now to make this complete Mike can tell us the weather in HI. Let me guess 83 and sunny. :laughing:


----------



## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

BBQ said:


> All the relevant MGLs are listed in the front of the code book assuming you have the one with the MA amendments.


Not all but some also there is a lot more on the web site but not everything like it it should be...:whistling2:

My guess is they want to keep some of the rule secret..:laughing:


----------



## BBQ (Nov 16, 2010)

HARRY304E said:


> Not all but some also there is a lot more on the web site but not everything like it it should be...:whistling2:


Which MGLs about permits and licensing are not in the MA code book?


----------



## Pfloyd527 (Oct 4, 2011)

HARRY304E said:


> Your right it is a mess ,,
> 
> Thank god they redesigned the boards web site ,,It would help if they also included useful information like some answers to what should be a vary simple question like the OP's...:blink::blink:
> 
> ...


Thanks, I was searching the web looking for a forum designed for electricians very pleased with this one even though its made me feel like a dumbass but hey every day I learn something is a good day!! And yes bbq I have the addendums and never saw any text in reguards to this subject its not clear or specific


----------



## I_get_shocked (Apr 6, 2009)

I know of instances in MA where a homeowner was allowed to pull the electrical permit, while some towns do not allow the homeowner to perform electrical work and require a licensed electrician.


It would seem its up to the AHJ.


----------



## BBQ (Nov 16, 2010)

I_get_shocked said:


> It would seem its up to the AHJ.


I cannot find any state law that allows that and yes I do know it happens.

I can post a link to MA town web site that claims homeowners are not allowed to do their own wiring but it does not reference any law.


----------



## yankeewired (Jul 3, 2008)

Lets say I'm not in the business .i own a bar in Massachusetts then I can wire the bar without a license ? I'm not hiring myself just as a homeowner does not hire themselves . The wording in the regulations is poor . How about if I am licensed but volunteer my labor ? Am I hired ? There is no such thing in Massachusetts as a " homeowners permit" however some cities or towns issue electrical permits to homeowners and those homeowners are subject to inspections as would we . My point is why under any circumstance is this allowed ? It undercuts our jobs . Just a few points to think about


----------



## Pfloyd527 (Oct 4, 2011)

yankeewired said:


> Lets say I'm not in the business .i own a bar in Massachusetts then I can wire the bar without a license ? I'm not hiring myself just as a homeowner does not hire themselves . The wording in the regulations is poor . How about if I am licensed but volunteer my labor ? Am I hired ? There is no such thing in Massachusetts as a " homeowners permit" however some cities or towns issue electrical permits to homeowners and those homeowners are subject to inspections as would we . My point is why under any circumstance is this allowed ? It undercuts our jobs . Just a few points to think about


Well yes i completely agree with everything that you said except the only differance being that i am doing it for pay and the homeowner had offered to go down to town hall for me and just pull the permit himself which i had no objections where i was busy with my day job (unknowing that i was comitting a NO NO) I didnt do it trying to pull a fast one on the insurance end because i do carry my own liability insurance, it was merely a convenience thing to help me out. I surely wasnt trying to undercut electricians everywhere by having the homeowner do a little paperwork because it is part of our job... The only way i found out that what i had done was frowned upon was because the topic came up when he was getting estimates for his garage from other electricians. So now i look like an asshole because this is something i should have known..... such is life... Cant wait for this one to be over....


----------



## electricmanscott (Feb 11, 2010)

Pfloyd527 said:


> Well yes i completely agree with everything that you said except the only differance being that i am doing it for pay and the homeowner had offered to go down to town hall for me and just pull the permit himself which i had no objections where i was busy with my day job (unknowing that i was comitting a NO NO) I didnt do it trying to pull a fast one on the insurance end because i do carry my own liability insurance, it was merely a convenience thing to help me out. I surely wasnt trying to undercut electricians everywhere by having the homeowner do a little paperwork because it is part of our job... The only way i found out that what i had done was frowned upon was because the topic came up when he was getting estimates for his garage from other electricians. So now i look like an asshole because this is something i should have known..... such is life... Cant wait for this one to be over....



Next time just print out an application, fill it out and have the homeowner drop it off.


----------



## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

BBQ said:


> Which MGLs about permits and licensing are not in the MA code book?


Just most of this stuff.

http://www.mass.gov/ocabr/licensee/dpl-boards/el/regulations/rules-and-regs/


----------



## Pfloyd527 (Oct 4, 2011)

electricmanscott said:


> Next time just print out an application, fill it out and have the homeowner drop it off.


well said, easy enough to do, will do the next time around!


----------



## leland (Dec 28, 2007)

electricmanscott said:


> Dear Homeowner... You get what you pay for. Just sayin' :whistling2:


"A homeowner working in their own home is not working for hire so there is no state law requiring them to have license or pull a permit." (MGL 143 3L)

I'm a homeowner. I had to pull a permit for my upgrade. Dude saw me doing it.
I didn't even get paid for it.


----------



## donselec (May 7, 2011)

no you cannot do wiring in a commercial building or any building other than your 
residence and even then some inspectors wont give you a permit.
just a side note, if you don't get a permit and inspection your insurance co can 
fight you on payment if a claim is ever put in....


----------



## sbrn33 (Mar 15, 2007)

I have heard that before but I have never,ever seen it happen in real life. I have seen the insurance company go after everyone involed when a permit is pulled, go after the manufacter of the cause of the fire(such as a heater or hairdryer) but never after some hack that got paid cash and took off.


----------

