# Aerial conductors to a shed



## Dylanewilliams

I have a client who wants to add lights and plugs to a shed. I was planning on doing an aerial drop from the house to the shed, but I was hoping to clarify a few code issues:

According to 340.12, UF cable can be run as overhead cable if it's labeled sunlight resistant and installed as messenger supported wiring.

Article 396.60 requires the messenger cable to be grounded

So can I run 12/2 UF wrapped around #6 bare copper or aluminum as the messenger wire, pull a ground through the weatherhead on either side, and attach the grounds from the UF, the weatherhead, and the messenger wire altogether and have everything be up to code? Is there a better way to do a single(or multiwire) 20 amp branch circuit as an overhead conductor?

Thanks!


----------



## TOOL_5150

Id run a piece of steel cable between the weatherheads, with UF zip tied to it. then pull an extra ground wire on 1 side up to the messenger cable and split bolt it on. dont make parallel ground paths.


----------



## Switched

I just use this;

https://www.platt.com/platt-electri...ultiple/64ACSRCHOX500/product.aspx?zpid=69445

or this;

https://www.platt.com/platt-electri...ltiple/63ACSRVOLX1000/product.aspx?zpid=69442


----------



## Dylanewilliams

$.62/foot? That's dirt cheap! Does this fall under the regulations of 338 for SE cable?


----------



## randas

I wouldn't be caught dead wrapping UF around a messenger cable.. way too handyman when you can probably +/- get ariel triplex cheaper


----------



## HackWork

I know we're past it, but just to be sure:


Dylanewilliams said:


> wrapped around #6 bare copper or aluminum as the messenger wire,


AL or CU will stretch, that's why you use either steel or ACSR (Al with a steel conductor in the core).


----------



## papaotis

hack is right again. i beleive in your situation, the mess. wire has to rated as such. dont the price right off, but yes triplex would worth it


----------



## nolabama

Triplex is too cheap to consider anything else.


----------



## Spunk#7

Why not go underground?


----------



## BBQ

nolabama said:


> Triplex is too cheap to consider anything else.


Other than the fact very little if any of it is NEC compliant to run. :jester:

It is not a listed cable nor is it a conductor type found in 310.


----------



## frankft

Would you run triplex for just 1 circuit? A situation I had was to run for a light on a gazebo. 15' from existing building, but pavement from the gazebo to the main house. 12/2 UF on a messenger cable IMO works better in this case than triplex.


----------



## nolabama

BBQ said:


> Other than the fact very little if any of it is NEC compliant to run. :jester:
> 
> It is not a listed cable nor is it a conductor type found in 310.


What??? Are you serious. What are you supposed to run overhead?? I am so glad we don't have inspectors.....


----------



## nolabama

frankft said:


> Would you run triplex for just 1 circuit? A situation I had was to run for a light on a gazebo. 15' from existing building, but pavement from the gazebo to the main house. 12/2 UF on a messenger cable IMO works better in this case than triplex.


Yes I would. It would not look like doodoo compared to UF on a messenger.


----------



## Switched

Wouldn't 396.2 Cover triplex and quadplex?

I would consider that a factory-assembled aerial cable. Correct me if I am wrong.


----------



## BBQ

Switched said:


> Wouldn't 396.2 Cover triplex and quadplex?
> 
> I would consider that a factory-assembled aerial cable. Correct me if I am wrong.


It would, or does if you find some UL listed triplex.

Most of it is made for the utilities and is not listed or labeled as the NEC requires.


----------



## BBQ

nolabama said:


> Yes I would. It would not look like doodoo compared to UF on a messenger.


Triplex would look worse than a well done steel messenger with UF neatly strapped to it.


----------



## nolabama

BBQ said:


> Triplex would look worse than a well done steel messenger with UF neatly strapped to it.


Said only by BBQ on an Internet forum once.


----------



## Switched

BBQ said:


> It would, or does if you find some UL listed triplex.
> 
> Most of it is made for the utilities and is not listed or labeled as the NEC requires.


That is something I did not know.


----------



## Switched

BBQ said:


> Triplex would look worse than a well done steel messenger with UF neatly strapped to it.


Did you loose your glasses, have an eyepatch, or are you just plain blind? LOL!

I gotta totally disagree with you on this. There is no way that UF strapped to a messenger cable will look better than triplex. UF looks like A** no matter how it is installed.


----------



## Switched

Okay, so what about this as a listing;

https://www.platt.com/CutSheets/Generic/URD alum.pdf

Pay attention to the last bullet under product markings; • “USE-2” per U.L. 854 available upon request.

What does that mean?

U.L. 854;

http://ulstandardsinfonet.ul.com/scopes/scopes.asp?fn=0854.html


----------



## BBQ

Switched said:


> Did you loose your glasses, have an eyepatch, or are you just plain blind? LOL!
> 
> I gotta totally disagree with you on this. There is no way that UF strapped to a messenger cable will look better than triplex. UF looks like A** no matter how it is installed.


The smallest triplex is at least 8 or 6 and is all twisted together looking like crap.

A 12/2 UF strapped straight to a small messenger with black cable ties is smother and much smaller. It shows much less. 

If you keep disputing it all I can say is you have never seen it done neatly.


----------



## BBQ

Switched said:


> Okay, so what about this as a listing;
> 
> https://www.platt.com/CutSheets/Generic/URD alum.pdf
> 
> Pay attention to the last bullet under product markings; • “USE-2” per U.L. 854 available upon request.
> 
> What does that mean?
> 
> U.L. 854;
> 
> http://ulstandardsinfonet.ul.com/scopes/scopes.asp?fn=0854.html


That is listed and marked, but it is not messenger cable is it?


----------



## Switched

BBQ said:


> The smallest triplex is at least 8 or 6 and is all twisted together looking like crap.
> 
> A 12/2 UF strapped straight to a small messenger with black cable ties is smother and much smaller. It shows much less.
> 
> If you keep disputing it all I can say is you have never seen it done neatly.


I'm messing with you. I have actually never seen it used. I've seen attempts with NM cable, but not UF. But to me, they would look the same. What type of cable ties are you using?


----------



## nolabama

Switched said:


> I'm messing with you. I have actually never seen it used. I've seen attempts with NM cable, but not UF. But to me, they would look the same. What type of cable ties are you using?


UL listed cable ties. Lol. Doodoo. It's all it can look like IMHO.


----------



## BBQ

Switched said:


> I'm messing with you. I have actually never seen it used. I've seen attempts with NM cable, but not UF. But to me, they would look the same. What type of cable ties are you using?


The only time I did it was for a temp feed and I used a good quality UV resistant black tie wraps but I have seen it done a few times.


----------



## Switched

BBQ said:


> That is listed and marked, but it is not messenger cable is it?


You got me there, totally looked at the wrong link. Back to research!


----------



## Dylanewilliams

I dont want to underground (which is what I almost always do) it because it's a 5' run and all concrete. 

So if its labeled it's covered in the nec under the article on use cable?


----------



## BBQ

nolabama said:


> UL listed cable ties. Lol. Doodoo. It's all it can look like IMHO.


It looks like a thin gray line across the sky, compared to a larger lumpy black line. :laughing:


----------



## HackWork

So what's the best overhead option for a 60a panel?


----------



## Switched

The link's for ASCR confirm what you are saying BBQ....darnit!

I still would go with it over UF though. I just can't imagine that stuff looking well at all.

All in all, I would go underground.


----------



## BBQ

Well I have run unlisted triplex or quadplex for 200 amp feeders. 

I guess I am lucky inspectors inspect from the ground.


----------



## Switched

I have installed tons of the stuff. Never gave it a second thought, and neither did any inspector for almost 20 years I guess.:whistling2:


----------



## nolabama

BBQ said:


> Well I have run unlisted triplex or quadplex for 200 amp feeders.
> 
> I guess I am lucky inspectors inspect from the ground.


I bet your a PITA to work with/around. I'm not trying to start nothing here, it's just some of the stuff you know....Jesus man people think I'm stupid if I bring up stuff like "you know triplex ain't listed for overhead use....". Only the POCO can use it cause the little letters dont line up with an NEC article. I would get laughed off a job.


----------



## BBQ

nolabama said:


> I would get laughed off a job.


I don't get laughed at too much but I do get the STFU stare. :laughing:


----------



## Switched

I might not like a lot of the guy's here as inspectors.......That is for sure.

I would learn a lot, but I may go out of business and/or get fired in the meantime. Some of these things 99% of us have never heard of.


----------



## ce2two

OH, just install bell wire, be proud of what you did and rip it out and do it right...:laughing:


----------



## gold

Electricians are allergic to digging. They break out in sweat and tears.


----------



## Switched

Goldagain said:


> Electricians are allergic to digging. They break out in sweat and tears.


I refuse to bid it, not only do I break out in sweat and tears, but I end up with nightmares for weeks on end.:whistling2:

"You don't really want to pay me xxx to dig do you?"


----------



## gold

HackWork said:


> So what's the best overhead option for a 60a panel?


What this guy asked ↑↑↑↑


----------



## Jlarson

I'll strap UF, TC or MC-HL to a piece of stainless aircraft cable in a heartbeat. Done.


----------



## papaotis

been a long time, but they used to make an 8 duplex. i dont know if they still do, but i think i know where i can find some. maybe it was 6, but i think 8:thumbsup:


----------



## Metersocket648

So if you're running triplex to an overhead light, do i use the messenger as grounx and one of the blacks as neutral and the other black as hot?


----------



## Kevin

Metersocket648 said:


> So if you're running triplex to an overhead light, do i use the messenger as grounx and one of the blacks as neutral and the other black as hot?


Yes. Usually there is a red line on one of the conductors of triplex so you can identify the different conductors.


----------

