# Any Opinions on EE Controls Contactors



## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

Pearce Services said:


> A month ago, I installed 9 hydraulic dock levelers, and now I have 2 units that need new contactors.
> 
> The EE Controls contactor is designed for 120v, is getting 122-123v, and it drops down to 119+/- when the button is depressed. The contactor chatters. The units that do not chatter also drop to 119v when in use.
> 
> ...


Did you check your push buttons ?It sounds like the button is not making good contact.


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## BBQ (Nov 16, 2010)

I would put this on the manufacturer of the control panel.

119 volts is not to low.


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## Pearce Services (Sep 9, 2012)

HARRY304E said:


> Did you check your push buttons ?It sounds like the button is not making good contact.


 
Thanks......good thought

I checked out the pushbutton, inspected the wire and terminals, looks okay, and I jumped out the pushbutton, no difference, but when I depress the contactor is makes good contact.


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## Pearce Services (Sep 9, 2012)

BBQ said:


> I would put this on the manufacturer of the control panel.
> 
> 119 volts is not to low.


That's what I thought also, parts are being replaced under warranty. I don't want a recurring problem with this equipment. That's why I was asking about this manufacturer. I cant just change out to Eaton or AB because it is under warranty, but if I find that they are not a good manufacturer or keep having issues, I will ask the dock leveler manufacturer to send out a different brand.


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## Pearce Services (Sep 9, 2012)

@BBQ....

Where are you in New England?


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## Big John (May 23, 2010)

Pearce Services said:


> ...I opened the unit, the spring looks ok, the contacts are not pitted (yet), and the coil is intact....


 When you opened it, could you see the mating faces between the coil and the armature? I've seen chatter where those get dirty or rusty. But, if you push it in by hand and it holds, that tends to suggest that's not the problem. 

I think the next test I'd do would be to swap the positions between the chatterer and a good contactor. If the problem moves over, it's just a junk contactor. 

I've never used EE, can't comment on them specifically, but all IEC stuff is "value engineered" by design.


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## Pearce Services (Sep 9, 2012)

Big John said:


> When you opened it, could you see the mating faces between the coil and the armature? I've seen chatter where those get dirty or rusty. But, if you push it in by hand and it holds, that tends to suggest that's not the problem.
> 
> I think the next test I'd do would be to swap the positions between the chatterer and a good contactor. If the problem moves over, it's just a junk contactor.
> 
> I've never used EE, can't comment on them specifically, but all IEC stuff is "value engineered" by design.


I already put a new contactor in one of the positions, and when i got there they were telling me that the second one is now chattering. The new contactor did solve the problem, BUT for how long???

The contacts look new as they should.

I love that phrase "value engineered", When I chose my vendor for the levelers, they talked all "high and mighty" about how they are the best manufacturer, blah blah blah....I hope these "waste-makers" planned for a little longer life expectancy than 30 days.


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## varmit (Apr 19, 2009)

I would think that the voltage drop would be due to the hydraulic pump motor starting- assuming that it is on the same circuit. This sounds as if there is something loose or a high resistance connection somewhere. It can certainly also be a bad batch of contactors. With all of this "made in China" stuff, batches of defective components are common these days.


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## Big John (May 23, 2010)

varmit said:


> I would think that the voltage drop would be due to the hydraulic pump motor starting- assuming that it is on the same circuit....


 I was wondering. But something of that duration would most likely be seen by any meter, so I'm assuming his 119 is solid.

I suppose you could put a fast-capture meter on their with Min/Max enabled and run this thing through the whole operation cycle. See what the minimum voltage at the contactor terminals is.


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## Pearce Services (Sep 9, 2012)

varmit said:


> I would think that the voltage drop would be due to the hydraulic pump motor starting- assuming that it is on the same circuit. This sounds as if there is something loose or a high resistance connection somewhere. It can certainly also be a bad batch of contactors. With all of this "made in China" stuff, batches of defective components are common these days.


that is the same circuit. the company is out of NY, not sure where they are manufacrured though,

I have never seen or heard of them before


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## Pearce Services (Sep 9, 2012)

Big John said:


> I was wondering. But something of that duration would most likely be seen by any meter, so I'm assuming his 119 is solid.
> 
> I suppose you could put a fast-capture meter on their with Min/Max enabled and run this thing through the whole operation cycle. See what the minimum voltage at the contactor terminals is.


If there is a larger drop at startup, and the voltage settles in at 119v after startup, I would think that the chatter would stop at that point, but it chatters even when I read 119v. 

Have you heard of this brand?


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## JRaef (Mar 23, 2009)

EE Controls is a company in NY that has "cobbled together" a line of motor controls by mixing products from various mfrs all over the world, none of which has a complete line by themselves. Their main line of contactors came from AEG in Germany for years. AEG is a huge company in other things, but unlike Siemens, they never fleshed out their electrical products line beyond the low hanging fruit of the small HP EU market. EEC cut a deal to import them to North America and fill in the gaps in the product line by branding other mfrs. The AEG contactors and breakers are not crap, but they are IEC, so you have to be careful about how they are used, like any IEC device.

But I recently heard that EEC has also now taken on a super cheap line of Chinese contactors as well, because the couldn't compete in the price-only market against the Telemecaniques, Siemens and ABBs of the world with the AEG product. When I worked for Siemens, we could not compete on price against the Chinese crap, but most people who tried them came back to us because they were just that, crap. Siemens had investigated having their DP contactors built in China too, but after sampling the QC, decided instead to just get out of the DP contactor business altogether rather than further sully their reputation by selling crap.

If it says Made in Germany, it is the AEG product and should be OK so it might just be a bad batch (or something else). If it says Made in China, it's their newer cheap crap line and from what I heard, you are not alone in your experience.

Being that it's a hydraulic pump, is there a pressure switch involved? Could the switch itself be set so that it is chattering, which THEN makes the contactor chatter? Just a thought.


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## Pearce Services (Sep 9, 2012)

There is no pressure switch on this system. Thanks for all that info. 

I just checked the removed unit, there is no markings for origin. just a date stamp of August 27th, 2012. 

If it doesnt say Germany, can I assume that it is not an AEG unit?

Kevin


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## JRaef (Mar 23, 2009)

Pearce Services said:


> There is no pressure switch on this system. Thanks for all that info.
> 
> I just checked the removed unit, there is no markings for origin. just a date stamp of August 27th, 2012.
> 
> ...


Yes, the AEG versions clearly say AEG right on the front. 









If all it says is "EEC" or "ECX series", then it's their cheap Chinese ones.

Al little more snooping says that they are most likely made by Yueqing E-Tec Electric Co., Ltd. in Sibanqiao Village, Xiangyang Town, Yueqing, Zhejiang, China (Mainland) 

From the looks of it, they appear to specialize in knock-off clones of other legitimate brands of contactors, they have Siemens and Telemecanique clones on their website. For example they have a line of overload relays that use the exact same part numbering as Siemens OL relays.

Gotta love it...


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## Pearce Services (Sep 9, 2012)

It is an ECX unit, thanks for your research efforts.

Another Question......

Would you change to Eaton or ABB, or ride it out and wait for failure?

One month old and the smell from inside the contactor is like a burnt motor, Is there a fire risk?


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## JRaef (Mar 23, 2009)

The chattering is stressing the coil insulation, that's probably the smell you are picking up. Why it is chattering is yet to be determined. According to their website, the coil voltage tolerance is -20%, so a 120V coil SHOULD be good down to 96V. Crap or not, make sure you are not overlooking something else before expecting another brand to make a difference. I'd be chasing the ENTIRE control circuit looking for places where there is a chattering going on. If you are satisfied that there just is no way that's happening, then it might just be that these are defective.

Another possibility on the contactor chattering that just occurred to me is that the "shading coil" is loose or broken inside of it. These are a necessary component in an AC contactor armature that prevents the magnetic field in the armature from collapsing every time the AC voltage crosses zero, which in our case is 120 times per second. It's a conductive ring, usually copper, embedded in a groove in the iron pole face of the armature that causes a phase shift in the magnetic fields around it, so the residual effect carries the holding force across those brief gaps in time.








If the copper loop is broken, it doesn't conduct and the field doesn't form. 

Here's a picture of a broken one, they don't all look exactly like this because it depends on the armature design, but you can get the idea. The circled side is broken, the other side is not. It doesn't have to be missing to cause a failure, just a small gap will do it. They are made from wire that is formed and welded, so if the weld was bad, it can be no good.












PERSONALLY, I would use an A-B contactor, even an IEC version, over a cheap brand. But they pay me to say that, so take it for what it's worth... :whistling2:


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## varmit (Apr 19, 2009)

You could remove the contactor and connect it to a known good 120 volt source and see if it chatters. "Jreaf" idea seems feasible. "Made in China" will be the ruin of what manufacturing remains in the US. I previously always believed that when I installed a new component that it WOULD work. Now I almost assume that it probably will not.


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## Peewee0413 (Oct 18, 2012)

Definitely remove it and see if it chatters using a separate power source.


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## Pearce Services (Sep 9, 2012)

JRaef,

that is great info, I will check that out. Thanks

Kevin


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## Pearce Services (Sep 9, 2012)

Thanks to everyone for their help on this. I inspected the shading coils, both are intact. But I noticed that the armature is pitted on one side, one side is polished see pic.









I am sending this back to the manufacturer for analysis, I will post their findings when I get them (thanks again)


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## brucebb (Feb 7, 2013)

*Likely cause not the contactor.*

A voltage test of a stock ECX18-A contactor (the product user never provided the part# so this is a part# guess) will prove that it holds in, down to an 85 Volt level before chatter occurs ! 

This item has a less than 1 in 1,000 defective product rate. 

FYI, all those major "Amerian" electric controls manufacturers have hundreds of their part #s produced in China ! 

FYI, contactor buzzing or chatter is 99% caused by external influences (flutter in the control circuit, losse terminals or low voltage or low current), not a contactor defect. Perhaps the contactor had recieved a surge or short circuit thus damaging it. If the cause is left uncorrected, a new contactor will also chatter due to a fault in the circuit.

The computer that runs your entire company , your cell phone, your car, and every appliance you own are all likely comprised of over 50% Chinese products. Some are 95% components made in China. It is inappropriate to assume a products malfunctions due to it's country of origin. I am willing to ship you a free replacement contactor to assist.


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