# Need help with NEMA Motor Starter



## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

Mishka said:


> Hi all,
> 
> 
> Im looking for a good explanation about Motor Starters , specifically about how to connect start stop , maybe a diagram with explanation of the contacts of Motor Starter in it .
> ...


Take a look at this one.


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## Chrisibew440 (Sep 13, 2013)

Did you figure it out?


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## IP-EI (Apr 7, 2014)

Mishka said:


> Hi all,
> 
> 
> Im looking for a good explanation about Motor Starters , specifically about how to connect start stop , maybe a diagram with explanation of the contacts of Motor Starter in it .
> ...


Best resource for something like that is an UGLYs book. Very good diagrams of start/stops and basic starters. 

If you're just starting out in this area, it's a great investment.

And remember, a starter is just a relay with overload protection. Don't over think it.


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## sparky2477 (Mar 24, 2011)

You have 3 wires to start/stop if there is only 1 start/stop u will need to jump the per from the stop to the start. 3 wires 1 goes to stop as constant 120v other side of stop jumps to start at that same point that wire runs back to the normally open side of aux. The third wire runs back to coil to make it change pozitions . Normally the net runs thru the overloads unless there is a surge suppressor installed. If so u have to run the 120 thru the ol or it will not kick out. Feel free to ask more ?s


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## lefleuron (May 22, 2010)

sparky2477 said:


> You have 3 wires to start/stop if there is only 1 start/stop u will need to jump the per from the stop to the start. 3 wires 1 goes to stop as constant 120v other side of stop jumps to start at that same point that wire runs back to the normally open side of aux. The third wire runs back to coil to make it change pozitions . Normally the net runs thru the overloads unless there is a surge suppressor installed. If so u have to run the 120 thru the ol or it will not kick out. Feel free to ask more ?s


 I have a question...


HUH?:laughing:


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## sparky2477 (Mar 24, 2011)

Wats the ?


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## erics37 (May 7, 2009)

sparky2477 said:


> Wats the ?


That was the most difficult-to-comprehend explanation of a 3-wire start/stop circuit I have ever seen.


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## sparky2477 (Mar 24, 2011)

Ok well I never claimed to b a teacher just trying to help guess if u look at uglys book I could get mine and try to explain better.


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## Safari (Jul 9, 2013)

sparky2477 said:


> Ok well I never claimed to b a teacher just trying to help guess if u look at uglys book I could get mine and try to explain better.


there was no problem. with your explanation I followed it up.I think for someone starting out like the OP might see the explanation as too wordy but if he actually uses pen and paper he will get. it 

Sent from my HUAWEI Y210-0100 using Tapatalk 2


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## bostongtp (Apr 9, 2014)

lefleuron said:


> I have a question...
> 
> HUH?:laughing:


Lol I hear him it is difficult to explain...I'll try and re iterate what he said..

This is for a 3 wire momentary stop start

FROM THE STOP START bring 3 #4 THHN wires to the MOTOR STARTER, LABEL them at both ends 1,2,3. 

@ THE STOP/START bring wire #1 to the stop button terminal. bring a JUMPER from the second stop terminal, to the START terminal, take wire #2 and place wire #2 in same terminal with the JUMPER on the start terminal, now take wire #3 place it under the other start terminal.

@ THE MOTOR STARTER:
the motor start should have numbers raised on the plastic to identify the terminal screw numbers, in that event you would take WIRE #1 for your LINE (hot conductor feeding stop start circuit)
WIRE #2 would go to #2 terminal and WIRE NUMBER 3 would go to 3 terminal. At least that's how mine was from Square D.


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## bostongtp (Apr 9, 2014)

Mishka said:


> Hi all,
> 
> Im looking for a good explanation about Motor Starters , specifically about how to connect start stop , maybe a diagram with explanation of the contacts of Motor Starter in it .
> Google or youtube didn't helped, there is a lot of diagrams to be honest but not much with explanations and even less videos .
> ...


Also motor starters are used because the components inside not only monitor the current but the thermal temperature of the windings. 

There's "heaters" that are used in most motor starters which are made of 2 little strips of metal that when in use and drawing current they heat up to the same temperature as the windings. When they heat up too much it means the motors being overworked and drawing excessive current. So the 2 metal pieces naturally seperate and as they cool they re - form to make contact. 

Also they don't make breakers in 2.5a 5.6a, etc, and motors are very sensitive to overvoltage and overcurrent conditions, and range from a variety of amerages so company's make special equipment like these, where you can very precisely protect equpment.


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## Southeast Power (Jan 18, 2009)

Mishka said:


> Hi all,
> 
> 
> Im looking for a good explanation about Motor Starters , specifically about how to connect start stop , maybe a diagram with explanation of the contacts of Motor Starter in it .
> ...


Ok I'll let you in on a secret. The diagram for a 3 wire stop/start is printed on a label inside of the motor starter cover.


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## IP-EI (Apr 7, 2014)

jrannis said:


> Ok I'll let you in on a secret. The diagram for a 3 wire stop/start is printed on a label inside of the motor starter cover.


I've never seen a wiring diagram on the inside of a starter. But I've also only been in 1 facility that used start/stop stations. Everywhere I work, we use JOAs with the auto circuit going to a triac fired by the DCS. 

But start/stops are simple once you understand the function of aux contacts....


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## don_resqcapt19 (Jul 18, 2010)

This Square D document is a good source for motor controls.


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## Mishka (Apr 12, 2014)

IP-EI said:


> Best resource for something like that is an UGLYs book. Very good diagrams of start/stops and basic starters.
> 
> If you're just starting out in this area, it's a great investment.
> 
> And remember, a starter is just a relay with overload protection. Don't over think it.


Yep I have it already ))

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337 using Tapatalk


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## Mishka (Apr 12, 2014)

bostongtp said:


> Also motor starters are used because the components inside not only monitor the current but the thermal temperature of the windings.
> 
> There's "heaters" that are used in most motor starters which are made of 2 little strips of metal that when in use and drawing current they heat up to the same temperature as the windings. When they heat up too much it means the motors being overworked and drawing excessive current. So the 2 metal pieces naturally seperate and as they cool they re - form to make contact.
> 
> Also they don't make breakers in 2.5a 5.6a, etc, and motors are very sensitive to overvoltage and overcurrent conditions, and range from a variety of amerages so company's make special equipment like these, where you can very precisely protect equpment.


Thanks,nice explanation )

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337 using Tapatalk


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## Mishka (Apr 12, 2014)

don_resqcapt19 said:


> This Square D document is a good source for motor controls.


Wow its a treasure you got there)

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I337 using Tapatalk


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## Nom Deplume (Jul 21, 2013)

Mishka said:


> Hi all,
> 
> 
> Im looking for a good explanation about Motor Starters , specifically about how to connect start stop , maybe a diagram with explanation of the contacts of Motor Starter in it .
> ...


Try these PDFs by Square D.
http://static.schneider-electric.us/docs/Motor Control/0140BR9102.pdf

http://static.schneider-electric.us/docs/Machine Control/0140CT9201.pdf


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## bostongtp (Apr 9, 2014)

jrannis said:


> Ok I'll let you in on a secret. The diagram for a 3 wire stop/start is printed on a label inside of the motor starter cover.


Very true. Multiple schematics as well, for a 2 wire, 3 wire, etc. It was very easy to look at the diagram and complete the inatall, verifying my work with ugly reference book made me confident. Ugly ' s electrical reference books are the bees knees, not even trying to "push" their product, I obviously have no affiliation with them.


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## bostongtp (Apr 9, 2014)

bostongtp said:


> Very true. Multiple schematics as well, for a 2 wire, 3 wire, etc. It was very easy to look at the diagram and complete the inatall, verifying my work with ugly reference book made me confident. Ugly ' s electrical reference books are the bees knees, not even trying to "push" their product, I obviously have no affiliation with them.


The only "oops" I had was when I wired it 2 wire and the contactor wouldn't latch. Then I just brought another wire from the contactor #2 terminal to the start/stop jumper(constant 10 feed, could be 12v,24v,120v,277v feed etc.) 

Don't forget, the contactor "coils" (what makes the c Ok not actor pull in and energize the load) can be interchangeable. So if you have a 220v coil on a motor starter you found at your shop, for a small price, you can get the interchangeable components at the local supply ( to change the coil from 12v to 24, or 120v to 277, etc.)


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## lefleuron (May 22, 2010)

bostongtp said:


> Lol I hear him it is difficult to explain...I'll try and re iterate what he said..
> 
> This is for a 3 wire momentary stop start
> 
> ...



Thank you my friend,

I never would have understood a complex circuit like that without pen and paper.


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## bostongtp (Apr 9, 2014)

lefleuron said:


> Thank you my friend,
> 
> I never would have understood a complex circuit like that without pen and paper.


Of course you would have, you just did, you needed someone to explain things on your frequency, im glad i could help. 

Because of some people on here, ive been able to take a basic understanding of the fundamentals and transfer it into something huge, integrating controls and relay logic (or PLC's) with existing specific use circuits, innovating useless ideas, re-inventing the wheel, etc. That's what this site is all about.

I've made substantial money due to the knowledge I've obtained from people who I don't even know what they look like, and I've never done anything for. You want to talk about amazing, that's it right there. I thank them.

Just remember something...If everyone takes and no one gives back, where could we go. No where. There would be nothing for the next.


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## sparky2477 (Mar 24, 2011)

It don't sound like ur taking ne thing


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## sparky2477 (Mar 24, 2011)

Ladder logic is a difficult bugger to understand sometimes specially if u throw hydraulic control power and pneumatic control power into the mix of things


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## bostongtp (Apr 9, 2014)

sparky2477 said:


> It don't sound like ur taking ne thing



I've taken info on derating calculations, roof De - icing equipment info and install practices, auto transformer theory, I've taken away alot...


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## bostongtp (Apr 9, 2014)

sparky2477 said:


> Ladder logic is a difficult bugger to understand sometimes specially if u throw hydraulic control power and pneumatic control power into the mix of things


What's the difference between pneumatic and hydraulic control power?

What do your systems generally consist of?


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## sparky2477 (Mar 24, 2011)

Its all 120v its just diff sensors/ normally open/ normally closed limit switches


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## sparky2477 (Mar 24, 2011)

It depends on application there is alotta diff circumstances


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## sparky2477 (Mar 24, 2011)

What class and group and group r u in


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## ponyboy (Nov 18, 2012)

Hydraulic controls can be a bitch to troubleshoot. There was a good thread on it here not too long ago. Air controls aren't too bad, I work with them a lot in our ovens and powder coat areas. It's mostly proving switches


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## sparky2477 (Mar 24, 2011)

Cool I helped automate a feed mill pneumatic power like crazy so there was several diff actions that required pnematic power or hydraulic power they were always 120v n/o sensors


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## bostongtp (Apr 9, 2014)

sparky2477 said:


> Its all 120v its just diff sensors/ normally open/ normally closed limit switches


Kind of like where security alarms are normally closed systems but fire alarm is normally open?


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## [email protected] (Jan 29, 2014)

On similar thought ,, DOSE ANY ONE ,, 
Know a good ,, schematic program,, ( FOR MOTOTR-CONTROL )
see several out there ,, ALL SEEN DONT LET ME TAG ,, WITH NUMBERS ,, or let me identify,, wiring 
designing ,, control cabinets ,, tried doing with on scrap paper ,, lol 
want a clean,, program, ,to copy leave in the cabinet,, and can have on
lap top,, for service and files,,


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## don_resqcapt19 (Jul 18, 2010)

Take a look at Constructor. I had a very old DOS based version of this and it was a great program. It is a bit pricey now. It lets you design the circuit, test it using simulation and print it.


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