# Furnace switch location.



## Mr. Sparkle

Ok, 

In a new house, let's say a new 2 zone 2 story house. 

You only _need_ an emergency switch at the basement stair entrance if it is an oil burning furnace, correct?

Whats abouts the furnace switch for the furnace in the attic?

Does it _have_ to be in located on the 2nd floor by the attic stairs?

AHJ Issue?

This is a debate I am having with another electrician.........(goes to rummage through code book.....)


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## BryanMD

The intentions behind and rules promulgated for the oil burner "emergency" switch are a whole other can of worms from the intentions and rules about service related power disconnecting. Follow?


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## Mr. Sparkle

Yep, I gotcha. 

Sorry I forgot to mention this is a house with Natural Gas we are speaking of.

I was kinda trying to explain that to my buddy. I'm sure you don't need the switch at the basement entrance with NG, just looking for clarification on when a NG furnace is located in the attic really.


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## user4818

This is a local code issue. You won't find it in the NEC. There is an NFPA oil burner standard that spells this out, but I have no idea what it is.


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## user4818

Mr. Sparkle said:


> Yep, I gotcha.
> 
> Sorry I forgot to mention this is a house with Natural Gas we are speaking of.



In that case, no remote switch is required, unless you have a local code requiring it.


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## MDShunk

You're going to find those switch requirements in whatever mechanical code your jurisdiction uses. Often, you'd need two switches. One at the top of the basement stairs (or, outside the boiler room if one story) and a second switch that is capable of being operated by the technician while the flame is being observed.


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## Toronto Sparky

I always thought it was near the closest exit from where the furnace is located.
My place doesn't even have one.
Mind you the breaker is well labeled and panel is by the stairs leading to the exit.


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## MDShunk

Toronto Sparky said:


> I always thought it was near the closest exit from where the furnace is located.
> My place doesn't even have one.
> Mind you the breaker is well labeled and panel is by the stairs leading to the exit.


Those switch codes for oil burners (in particular) got put in back when "puff backs" were more common. The idea was that you could turn off the furnace without having to enter the room where the furnace is.


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## user4818

MDShunk said:


> You're going to find those switch requirements in whatever mechanical code your jurisdiction uses. Often, you'd need two switches. One at the top of the basement stairs (or, outside the boiler room if one story) and a second switch that is capable of being operated by the technician while the flame is being observed.


Just so we're clear, the remote switch requirement (if one even exists in one's particular jurisdiction) is for oil burners only. There is no such requirement, other than the NEC mandated disconnect, for gas burners. 

I find there is great confusion on this issue.


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## Toronto Sparky

From what I have learned , if the oil burner keeps running without a flame and the oil leaks into the house , it will be cheaper to rebuild the house than it is to make the house "liveable" again. 
But at least with oil the house would still be standing.. A gas leak tends to send em air borne..


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## B4T

By me the requirements are set by the local building code


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## KayJay

Residential oil burners are very safe. They will not just continue to operate without flame and spew oil all through a building.
If for some reason the burner flame goes out during operation, the cad cell resistance changes and the primary control will then shut down the burner motor, oil valve, etc… and lockout, requiring a manual reset, normally around 45 seconds after the flame is no longer "sensed". On older oil burners, they used a thermal stack switch that sensed the heat from combustion to provide the same type of protection.


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## JohnJ0906

Peter D said:


> Just so we're clear, the remote switch requirement (if one even exists in one's particular jurisdiction) is for oil burners only. There is no such requirement, other than the NEC mandated disconnect, for gas burners.
> 
> I find there is great confusion on this issue.


One jurisdiction I worked in required remote switches for NG as well.


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## MDShunk

KayJay said:


> Residential oil burners are very safe. They will not just continue to operate without flame and spew oil all through a building.
> If for some reason the burner flame goes out during operation, the cad cell resistance changes and the primary control will then shut down the burner motor, oil valve, etc… and lockout, requiring a manual reset, normally around 45 seconds after the flame is no longer "sensed". On older oil burners, they used a thermal stack switch that sensed the heat from combustion to provide the same type of protection.


I was talking about a puff back, not oil leakage.


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## KayJay

MDShunk said:


> I was talking about a puff back, not oil leakage.


I should have used quotes… it was late. :yawn:

I was responding to Toronto Sparky’s concern regarding flameout with oil burners.


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## MDShunk

KayJay said:


> I should have used quotes… it was late. :yawn:
> 
> I was responding to Toronto Sparky’s concern regarding flameout with oil burners.


Yeah. Every time I go on a service call for an oil burner, I ask people, "how many times did you press the reset button". I'm not sure why I bother. They all lie. I've dipped and sopped up almost a gallon of oil out of fireboxes already. Even once you get it cleaned up pretty well, it will still smoke like a freight train for an hour once I get it running.


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## frenchelectrican

MDShunk said:


> Yeah. Every time I go on a service call for an oil burner, I ask people, "how many times did you press the reset button". I'm not sure why I bother. They all lie. I've dipped and sopped up almost a gallon of oil out of fireboxes already. Even once you get it cleaned up pretty well, it will still smoke like a freight train for an hour once I get it running.


 
I have see that situation more than once with my HVAC freind he called me in pretty often to deal some insane oil burners that allready flooded :blink:
Useally anywhere from very small pool of fuel oil all the way much as 20 liter of fuel oil !!!!

As long the combustion chamber is cold there is very little chance you can have this blow up not like gaz units.

Ditto with generators { more common with oversized units of course or unloaded test run }

Yeah they will smoke like train with damaged turbocharger or overfueled engine { If you know General Electric train make those diesel engine I called them the " toaster " they are good for blowing out the turbos }

And also with smoke stack from furance to chimmeny it will glow red for few minutes until it clear up then cool off to normal tempture range.
{ I allready have few good trick how to purge them out }

Merci, Marc


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## woodchuck2

You fella's actually work on the furnaces/boilers? I have only wired one boiler in 10yrs or so that i have been in this field of work and that was just last year. Even then the plumber and i ended up in a pissing match before it was all said and done. Around here we just run our circuit to the HVAC location and leave it to the installers. I will often inspect their work afterwards since it falls under my inspection just so i know it was done right. The last thing i want is any kind of liability for a furnace/boiler malfunction. One of the local oil companies sent their crew out to service the HVAC system at the local Fire Company, several days later there was a malfunction of some sort that caused a smoke back up. The building was less than a year old and caused over $200k in damages.


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