# Nema 4x



## wildleg (Apr 12, 2009)

if you are going in the top I agree with the meyers. otherwise no. JMO, don't have my codebook handy.


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## Amish Electrician (Jan 2, 2010)

Keep in mind that NEMA 4X is rated to withstand a pressurised stream of water from ANY direction- not just from above.

Depending on the specific site, your boss might be smart.


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## JRaef (Mar 23, 2009)

In order for you to maintain the integrety of the Type 4X rating, any device penetrating it must be SPECIFICALLY rated for Type 4X as well. If the liquid tight connectors bear a UL Type 4X rating, then the Myers hubs are redundant and just add another potential point of seal failure. If the liquid tight connectors DO NOT bear a UL Type 4X rating, then the Myers hubs are a cheat, because they would technically satisfy the requirement for maintaining the enclosure rating, but violate the intent because the non-listed liquidtight connectors could leak ahead of the hubs and the system fails anyway.

So bottom line, start with the ratings of the liquid tight connectors. Most of the name brand products are going to be UL Type 4X rated, but cheap Chinese knockoffs may not be.

http://www.tnb.com/shared/docs/tc_1_g_5331sstseries.pdf
From page 2;
• UL® Listed Ratings: 3, 3R, 4, 4X

So...
Your boss is technically wrong, but don't forget who signs the paycheck!


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## renosteinke (May 14, 2009)

I believe you are in error.

Threaded fittings are evaluated by UL assuming that they will enter threaded hubs. 

Simply punching a hole in the side of the cabinet and securing the fitting with opposing locknuts will not maintain the NEMA 4 rating.


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## don_resqcapt19 (Jul 18, 2010)

renosteinke said:


> I believe you are in error.
> Threaded fittings are evaluated by UL assuming that they will enter threaded hubs. ...


I don't think that is correct. While I don't agree, UL says that hubs are not suitable for use with fittings.


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## JRaef (Mar 23, 2009)

renosteinke said:


> I believe you are in error.
> 
> Threaded fittings are evaluated by UL assuming that they will enter threaded hubs.


No, that is not correct. If the fitting _IS LISTED_ by UL for Type 4X, then that means it can be used all by itself in that manner. Hubs are for threaded conduit only.



> Simply punching a hole in the side of the cabinet and securing the fitting with opposing locknuts will not maintain the NEMA 4 rating.


I agree with that statement, but I never suggested that. I said that if you want to connect to a UL Type 4X box, you MUST use fittings that are rated for Type 4X. UL Type 4X rated fittings will connect to the box in the same manner as a Myers hub, O ring seals and a sturdier nut on the inside.


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## renosteinke (May 14, 2009)

Well, let's see the UL quotes, then.

There's simply no way for an entry into a box to be watertight if all there is to it is a hole with a pair of locknuts. The fitting might be "4," but that box stopped being sealed the moment you made the hole. How do you propose to seal it?

Having actually done the tests, I can guarantee that simple locknuts on straight threads into a simple hole will fail the Nema-4 test. Simple locknuts on tapered threads? Lots of luck even getting that tight!

If you look, you will find an O-ring as part of a Myers' Hub for that reason.

As for fittings in hubs .... look a bit closer at that UL statement in "question corner." UL certainly needs to hire some folks who are literate in the use of the language ... as the statement appears to address all threaded fittings, while it is specifically addressing a question about EMT fittings. Left unanswered - indeed, this is where the answer only confuses things further- is the fact that some fittings have straight threads while others have tapered ones. For the seal to occur, you need tapered threads on both the fitting and the hub.

Regarding that specific situation .... straight threads into tapered threaded hubs ... it is correct that you will not get the seal you need. There simply are not enough threads in contact. I think you'll find that while EMT fittings have straight threads, most sealtite fittings have tapered threads. 

The simple fact is that UL lists individual components, and it is up to us to use them correctly. There is never any assurance that simply using UL listed components in their intended manner will result in an assembly that is correct.

So, the OP is back where he started ... does the enclosure need to remain tight against a hose stream from any direction? If it does, his boss is right.


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## don_resqcapt19 (Jul 18, 2010)

John,
It appears you are correct. The following is from this OZ Gedney document.


> • Furnished with locknut and KO sealing ring.
> • Liquidtight/Raintight/Oiltight/Concretetight
> • UL Listed NEMA Type 4 when installed into a NPT threaded entry or UL Listed conduit hub (sizes 11⁄4” and larger require thread sealant).


I wonder what thread sealant is listed for this application?


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## buddhakii (Jan 13, 2011)

So I wonder if appleton fittings would require the hub to maintain the rating as well. I just installed some fittings to a 4x enclosure and didn't use hubs. I figured that is what the white o-ring was for and didn't want to create another point that it could leak.


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