# Need help with water heater wiring



## soulfly (Jun 28, 2010)

Hi was wondering if you could help me out? I just replaced my GE10 gallon electric water heater which runs on 240V. I have not hooked it up yet because I'm not sure if it is safe or practical to run it on my panel which is only 120V. My old heater was 120V. We have two apartments and a huge garage all running off the same breaker 120V and our bill is sky high. Any suggestions? thank you


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

Highly impractical to run a 240v water heater on 120. It will take 4 times as long to heat the water. Time to call your electrician to update your service, as well as a plumber to install a gas line for a gas water heater.


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## oldtimer (Jun 10, 2010)

What size is your service entrance ??


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## william1978 (Sep 21, 2008)

Call a electrician.


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## Bkessler (Feb 14, 2007)

I suggest you get out the phone book. You doing his own electrical work is like a murderer trying to defend himself in court.


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## wildleg (Apr 12, 2009)

I suggest solar hot water heating system. for 10 grand or so you can install it yourself and in 20 years you will have paid for it and be saving money.


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## william1978 (Sep 21, 2008)

oldtimer said:


> What size is your service entrance ??


 I think it is just a 120v.:blink:


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## william1978 (Sep 21, 2008)

Who needs hot water?


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## oldtimer (Jun 10, 2010)

william1978 said:


> I think it is just a 120v.:blink:


 You have satisfied my curiosity. You obviously do not have any knowledge of electricity. PLEASE call an electrician.


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

oldtimer said:


> What size is your service entrance ??



I'll guess it's 14"x3"22". :jester:


Oh, wait. The OP is in Canada. 30.48cm x 7.62cm x 55.88cm.


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## william1978 (Sep 21, 2008)

oldtimer said:


> You have satisfied my curiosity. You obviously do not have any knowledge of electricity. PLEASE call an electrician.


 Me or the OP?:laughing::laughing:


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

oldtimer said:


> You have satisfied my curiosity. You obviously do not have any knowledge of electricity. PLEASE call an electrician.


I've never met him, but I got a dollar that says he does. :thumbsup:


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## B4T (Feb 10, 2009)

What size electric service does the building have.. go look and write down the numbers on inside of circuit breaker cover.


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## oldtimer (Jun 10, 2010)

soulfly said:


> Hi was wondering if you could help me out? I just replaced my GE10 gallon electric water heater which runs on 240V. I have not hooked it up yet because I'm not sure if it is safe or practical to run it on my panel which is only 120V. My old heater was 120V. We have two apartments and a huge garage all running off the same breaker 120V and our bill is sky high. Any suggestions? thank you


 Hi Bubbles ( TRAILER PARK BOYS ) :jester:


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## soulfly (Jun 28, 2010)

*Not Sure*



oldtimer said:


> What size is your service entrance ??


The numbers off the box are 
LL186
Form 100
s.49

We used to have old school fuses had it changed to regular box 6 months ago. 

Not sure


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## william1978 (Sep 21, 2008)

soulfly said:


> The numbers off the box are
> LL186
> Form 100
> s.49
> ...


 We need to know what brand of panel you have.


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## jwjrw (Jan 14, 2010)

Im still trying to figure out how he has a 120v panel only. I think he has 240v. Possibly could use same wire just terminate it correctly for 240v at panel and heater. A job for a licensed electrician.


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## soulfly (Jun 28, 2010)

*Panel*

It's a Amalgamated Electric Corp Combo Panel AC Volt 120/240 Max amp 100


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## jwjrw (Jan 14, 2010)

soulfly said:


> It's a Amalgamated Electric Corp Combo Panel AC Volt 120/240 Max amp 100


 
Ha! I knew he had 240v! Are there extra spaces left in the panel?


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## william1978 (Sep 21, 2008)

Post us some pictures of the panel and the water heater.


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

I think it's obvious the OP is in way over his head. Time to call in a pro.


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## william1978 (Sep 21, 2008)

480sparky said:


> I think it's obvious the OP is in way over his head. Time to call in a pro.


 With a little help I think he can do it.


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## soulfly (Jun 28, 2010)

*Fuse Box*

There are 4 empty single spaces in the box.
The guy who replaced our old box just used the same old power box ran it to a new box right underneath it with the new fuses. He say it 120 v but I noticed the new fuses that were put in there are 4 120/240V fuses the rest are just singles with four empty spots. Sorry to sound confusing


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## jwjrw (Jan 14, 2010)

soulfly said:


> There are 4 empty single spaces in the box.
> The guy who replaced our old box just used the same old power box ran it to a new box right underneath it with the new fuses. He say it 120 v but I noticed the new fuses that were put in there are 4 120/240V fuses the rest are just singles with four empty spots. Sorry to sound confusing


 
You still have fuses or do you now have breakers?


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## NolaTigaBait (Oct 19, 2008)




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## william1978 (Sep 21, 2008)

jwjrw said:


> You still have fuses or do you now have breakers?


 We must have this info so we can help.:thumbsup: :jester:


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

If you have a 240v water heater, and you only have 120 volts available, you need a voltage-doubling fuse. If you have a Home depot nearby, you can get them there. But don't look in the electrical department...... they are stocked in the plumbing aisle.


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## soulfly (Jun 28, 2010)

*Water Heater*

Sorry they are now breakers. The thing is I had someone come here and change it for me 6 months ago to breakers cost me $1200.00 because like I said in this house there are 3 fridges, two stoves, two microwaves and two water heaters. one 30 gallon in the front house and the small 10 gallon i'm putting in the back unit. Before I had the box changed it always would trip the breaker. Now he says its 120v and everything seems ok. No power trips but my hydro has since gone through the roof and it's summertime. Most cooking is done outside and there are no washer and dryer. I don't know. Can't really afford to call another guy to come by. I just want to hook up this 240v hot water tank.


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## william1978 (Sep 21, 2008)

What 480sparky has mentioned would be the easiest way. Those are pretty inexpensive at Lowe's or home depot.


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## william1978 (Sep 21, 2008)

soulfly said:


> Sorry they are now breakers. The thing is I had someone come here and change it for me 6 months ago to breakers cost me $1200.00 because like I said in this house there are 3 fridges, two stoves, two microwaves and two water heaters. one 30 gallon in the front house and the small 10 gallon i'm putting in the back unit. Before I had the box changed it always would trip the breaker. Now he says its 120v and everything seems ok. No power trips but my hydro has since gone through the roof and it's summertime. Most cooking is done outside and there are no washer and dryer. I don't know. Can't really afford to call another guy to come by. I just want to hook up this 240v hot water tank.


If you would post some pic's it would make this so much easier for us and you, and you would have hot water by night fall.:thumbsup:


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## soulfly (Jun 28, 2010)

*pic*

How do I post the pics?


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

soulfly said:


> How do I post the pics?



Click here.


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## jwjrw (Jan 14, 2010)

How has this thread lasted this long?:blink:


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## william1978 (Sep 21, 2008)

480sparky said:


> Click here.


 Thanks Ken I was looking for that thread.:thumbsup:


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## soulfly (Jun 28, 2010)

*Fuse Box*

Ok here are the pics hope this helps.

http://s949.photobucket.com/albums/ad339/soulflytribal/fuse box/


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## NolaTigaBait (Oct 19, 2008)

That panel is upside down...I think thats your problem...You can't get 240 volts with an upside down panel...I hope you didnt pay someone for that.


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## soulfly (Jun 28, 2010)

*box*

$1200.00

Does it really matter if it is upside down?


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## crazymurph (Aug 19, 2009)

soulfly said:


> Ok here are the pics hope this helps.
> 
> http://s949.photobucket.com/albums/ad339/soulflytribal/fuse box/


 You paid $1200 for that mess?! How did that feel?


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## soulfly (Jun 28, 2010)




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## william1978 (Sep 21, 2008)

soulfly said:


>


 Don't get upset we are trying to help.


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

I see a lot more problems than not having hot water.

How can a contractor hire an electrician that does that level of work?


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## soulfly (Jun 28, 2010)

Not upset with you. Guy said hes been an electrician for years. My bad


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

crazymurph said:


> You paid $1200 for that mess?! How did that feel?


That's only $1,160.67 US$.


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## soulfly (Jun 28, 2010)

So it its totally wrong? I need to know.


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## jwjrw (Jan 14, 2010)

soulfly said:


>


 
Normally since you aren't a professional electrician the moderators would of already sent you to the DIY forum.
What you want to do is fine as long as the wire to the water heater is the right size and the water heater is a 240 one. By changing the breaker and connections at panel and water heater. A professional shouldn't want too much to do it. Call one. Electricity is dangerous and faulty work can cause a fire. Is your life worth more than a couple hunderd bucks?


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## william1978 (Sep 21, 2008)

soulfly said:


> So it its totally wrong? I need to know.


 Well...........We would need some more pic's to answer that.:thumbsup:


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## jwjrw (Jan 14, 2010)

480sparky said:


> I see a lot more problems than not having hot water.
> 
> How can a contractor hire an electrician that does that level of work?


 

I don't think it looks too bad. Who knows how bad it looked before.


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

First, I doubt that new panel is bonded properly, nor are the grounds and neutrals separated.

Second, I'd say that Square D panel is rated for tandems/piggyback breakers.

Then there's what appears to be an older panel to the upper right........ with one breaker turned off (I'll assume that;s the circuit in question). Just on a hunch, I'd say this entire service is overloaded. 

All that NM (Loomix, for you) is bundled....... not good.

Without taking the cover off the SqD panel, that's just what I see offhand.


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## NolaTigaBait (Oct 19, 2008)

BReakers off in the "up" position also...I'm sure there are others


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## william1978 (Sep 21, 2008)

I really think you need to BCsparkygirl to come and take a look at your problem sense she lives up your way. Shoot her a PM and see if she can help you out.


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## oldtimer (Jun 10, 2010)

You have an old Amalgamated 100 amp fuse panel. They have pulled the guts out of the loadcenter and used it as a junction box. PLEASE call an electrician.


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## jwjrw (Jan 14, 2010)

480sparky said:


> First, I doubt that new panel is bonded properly, nor are the grounds and neutrals separated.
> 
> Second, I'd say that Square D panel is rated for tandems/piggyback breakers.
> 
> ...


 

So all you really see is a panel in the upper right. The rest of what you are saying we do not know. I suggest the op take the cover off ,take pics and lets see how correct you are. Give us the size wire feeding panels etc.

I still think no matter how you did that job it would look like crap. Only canada would mount a panel that way.


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

NolaTigaBait said:


> BReakers off in the "up" position also...


That's legal in Canada.


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## oldtimer (Jun 10, 2010)

Correct. It is legal. As has been posted before.


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## william1978 (Sep 21, 2008)

oldtimer said:


> Correct. It is legal. As has been posted before.


 You are in canada maybe you could help this guy out.


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## NolaTigaBait (Oct 19, 2008)

480sparky said:


> That's legal in Canada.


Dumb canadians:jester:


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## oldtimer (Jun 10, 2010)

I am just sitting here at my computer. No work for Crusty Old B******s like me. :icon_cry::yes:


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

oldtimer said:


> I am just sitting here at my computer. No work for Crusty Old B******s like me. :icon_cry::yes:



I know where you might be able to find a service upgrade and water heater hookup. :thumbsup:


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## william1978 (Sep 21, 2008)

480sparky said:


> I know where you might be able to find a service upgrade and water heater hookup. :thumbsup:


 :laughing::laughing:


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## jwjrw (Jan 14, 2010)

480sparky said:


> I know where you might be able to find a service upgrade and water heater hookup. :thumbsup:


 
:laughing:


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## oldtimer (Jun 10, 2010)

Thanks, but No Thanks. :laughing:


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## Speedy Petey (Jan 10, 2007)

I think it is safe to say that he just need to get an electrician i there to fix the mess from the other guy. 

You all knew this was coming.
Soulfly, don't take offense, it's just how things work around here. The sign up page is pretty clear on this.


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