# Telephone Wires, Coaxial Cable, 14/2, 12/2 Romex



## Dennis Alwon (May 9, 2009)

ElectricMan2 said:


> Is it a NEC Code Violation to run Telephone Wires, Coaxial Cable, 14/2, 12/2 Romex Wires through the same hole through wall studs and floor joists?
> 
> I have read that it is a manfactur's recommendation to keep the Telephone Wires and Coaxial Cable at least 6 inches from Romex wires but is it a NEC Code violation?
> 
> If it is an NEC Code Violation can somebody please put the code up including when the code took effect.. Thanks.


It is not an NEC violation but running NM parallel with phone wires for any distance is not a good idea as it could cause interference on the lines.


----------



## jza (Oct 31, 2009)

Dennis Alwon said:


> It is not an NEC violation but running NM parallel with phone wires for any distance is not a good idea as it could cause interference on the lines.


Not likely as modern day communication cables are shielded against this.


----------



## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

I don't think it's ever been an NEC issue. But for many years, it was a poor design choice as the 60Htz would bleed into the tele & catv lines and you could hear it on your phones and it would affect your TV reception.


----------



## BIGRED (Jan 22, 2007)

I am pretty sure it was in the Code that holes had to be 2" apart, romex in one, P/C in the other.


----------



## DontKnowWye (Dec 11, 2010)

jza said:


> Not likely as modern day communication cables are shielded against this.


That's like saying "Modern homes are insulated against the cold". That doesn't mean that it won't get cold inside of them. It's good practice to keep low voltage cables away from 120V and higher.


----------



## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

BIGRED said:


> I am pretty sure it was in the Code that holes had to be 2" apart, romex in one, P/C in the other.



Never heard that one.


----------



## mattsilkwood (Sep 21, 2008)

Dennis Alwon said:


> It is not an NEC violation but running NM parallel with phone wires for any distance is not a good idea as it could cause interference on the lines.


 I've heard this many times but have never seen it. Has anyone ever seen it or is this like bigfoot?


----------



## jza (Oct 31, 2009)

mattsilkwood said:


> I've heard this many times but have never seen it. Has anyone ever seen it or is this like bigfoot?


Never seen it either, mainly bull**** speculation by uneducated ropers who've never stepped foot on a real job site.


----------



## electricmanscott (Feb 11, 2010)

And yet Peter D is not allowed here.


----------



## BIGRED (Jan 22, 2007)

480sparky said:


> Never heard that one.


I am looking, I know it was in the Code, not sure what year. Maybe it was taken out?


----------



## rlc3854 (Dec 30, 2007)

electricmanscott said:


> And yet Peter D is not allowed here.


 
Your next:furious:


----------



## DontKnowWye (Dec 11, 2010)

rlc3854 said:


> Your next:furious:


"Your" should be "You're".


----------



## rlc3854 (Dec 30, 2007)

DontKnowWye said:


> "Your" should be "You're".


 
Yikes, the spelling and grammar Nazis are back


----------



## Wireless (Jan 22, 2007)

mattsilkwood said:


> I've heard this many times but have never seen it. Has anyone ever seen it or is this like bigfoot?


 
I have heard the interference on an intercom system!


----------



## mikeh32 (Feb 16, 2009)

its not under nec, its under eia/tia standards. 

just went over this in class oddly enough


----------



## den (Mar 28, 2009)

I know that I can buy combination hv @ lv recepticle boxes?


----------



## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

den said:


> I know that I can buy combination hv @ lv recepticle boxes?



Is that a question or a statement?:001_huh:

BTW, boxes would be an NEC requirement.


----------



## den (Mar 28, 2009)

Statement: I can by combo boxes

Question: Just because I can buy them, does that make it not a violation to have hv @ lv in close proxcimity.


----------



## Edrick (Jun 6, 2010)

Oh jeez -smacks for head-, to the ones that haven't seen this I'm surprised. I work in the entertainment industry. Live Venues, Theaters, TV Studios, Production Houses, etc... and there's numerous times that we've had issues wether it's with a video feed, audio feed, or Data feed that is caused by the noise created from the "high voltage" and improper runs of cabling. This is not a myth legend or hidden secret. We constantly get 60 Hertz hum from electrical interference and go through great lengths to eliminate it. 

Hell just running our audio snake by an extension cord can cause an issue.


----------



## macmikeman (Jan 23, 2007)

What the OP is refering to is 800.133.(2). Pay attention to the exceptions. And remember this article is referencing "communications circuits. If you run tv or phone wire next to romex your ok. It has an outer sheath.


----------



## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

macmikeman said:


> What the OP is refering to is 800.133.(2). Pay attention to the exceptions. And remember this article is referencing "communications circuits. If you run tv or phone wire next to romex your ok. It has an outer sheath.



Kewl.:whistling2:


----------



## mikeh32 (Feb 16, 2009)

480sparky said:


> Kewl.:whistling2:


I will get you the req for it 2morrow. I have no code books or my tia/eia standard book....


----------



## macmikeman (Jan 23, 2007)

The thing I didn't have time to post earlier is that there is a code section for tv cables(community antenna systems) also, I think it is like 840 or something close to that. What you will find is it also has a .133 (2) with the same rulings,
Some inspectors never bother to read the exceptions and think it is wrong to have tv or phone cables run thru the same holes as romex. They are wrong


----------



## BBQ (Nov 16, 2010)

jza said:


> Not likely as modern day communication cables are shielded against this.


Really?

I think not.:no:


----------



## McClary’s Electrical (Feb 21, 2009)

BBQ said:


> Really?
> 
> I think not.:no:


 

Cat V 's got amazing rejection, as compared to a regular phone cable, nontwisted. Each pair of cables inside a CATV is twisted at a different rate, thus is a different length than the other pairs.


----------



## BBQ (Nov 16, 2010)

mcclary's electrical said:


> Cat V 's got amazing rejection, as compared to a regular phone cable, nontwisted. Each pair of cables inside a CATV is twisted at a different rate, thus is a different length than the other pairs.


And that is still not 'shielded' unless you order it with shielding.


----------



## McClary’s Electrical (Feb 21, 2009)

BBQ said:


> And that is still not 'shielded' unless you order it with shielding.


 

Very true.


----------



## Split Bolt (Aug 30, 2010)

This relates to a similar thread going on right now as well. I wired some homes MANY years ago that were near an FM radio station tower. I got a little lazy in some of the runs and ran the phone cables through the same holes as the romex. The people who ended-up buying the homes complained of hearing the radio station on their phones!


----------



## McClary’s Electrical (Feb 21, 2009)

Split Bolt said:


> This relates to a similar thread going on right now as well. I wired some homes MANY years ago that were near an FM radio station tower. I got a little lazy in some of the runs and ran the phone cables through the same holes as the romex. The people who ended-up buying the homes complained of hearing the radio station on their phones!


 

yes, but that had nothing to with using the same hole.


----------



## BBQ (Nov 16, 2010)

BIGRED said:


> I am pretty sure it was in the Code that holes had to be 2" apart, romex in one, P/C in the other.


I think this may be what you are thinking of ..



> *800.133 Installation of Communications Wires, Cables,
> and Equipment.* Communications wires and cables from
> the protector to the equipment or, where no protector is
> required, communications wires and cables attached to the
> ...





> *820.133 Installation of Coaxial Cables and Equipment.*
> Beyond the point of grounding, as defined in 820.93, the
> coaxial cable installation shall comply with 820.133(A)
> and (B).
> ...


But notice that is "Conductors" as in THHN, not cables as NM and MC.


----------



## mikeh32 (Feb 16, 2009)

check tia/eia 570-b


----------



## BBQ (Nov 16, 2010)

ElectricMan2 said:


> Is it a* NEC Code* Violation to run Telephone Wires, Coaxial Cable, 14/2, 12/2 Romex Wires through the same hole through wall studs and floor joists?
> 
> I have read that it is a manfactur's recommendation to keep the Telephone Wires and Coaxial Cable at least 6 inches from Romex wires *but is it a NEC Code violation?*
> 
> If it is an *NEC Code* Violation can somebody please put the code up including when the code took effect.. Thanks.





mikeh32 said:


> check tia/eia 570-b


So Mike, where is 570-B in the NEC?  

I think it is well established that it is bad practice to run com with power but I get the impression that ship already sailed for the OP and they are asking if there is a code that can force a change to what has already been done. :jester:


(By the way, TIA/EIA is a standard not a code)


----------



## mikeh32 (Feb 16, 2009)

BBQ said:


> So Mike, where is 570-B in the NEC?
> 
> I think it is well established that it is bad practice to run com with power but I get the impression that ship already sailed for the OP and they are asking if there is a code that can force a change to what has already been done. :jester:
> 
> ...


I know. I have a part of it in front of me. forgot to do all my homework. But it covers residential low voltage wiring.


----------



## BBQ (Nov 16, 2010)

mikeh32 said:


> I know. I have a part of it in front of me. forgot to do all my homework. But it covers residential low voltage wiring.


TIA has no 'power' at all if not specifically adopted by a jurisdiction.

I know it has not been adopted in any place around me, it is usually attached to jobs via contract specifications.


----------



## jza (Oct 31, 2009)

BBQ said:


> Really?
> 
> I think not.:no:


Guess you guys use ****ing garbage in New England.


----------



## Jlarson (Jun 28, 2009)

I've run lots and lots of low volt with power cable, heck most of my house is like that too. No phone, network or cable issues ever.


----------



## jwjrw (Jan 14, 2010)

Jlarson said:


> I've run lots and lots of low volt with power cable, heck most of my house is like that too. No phone, network or cable issues ever.



I have done it many times as well. Might even do it again. :whistling2::laughing:


----------



## BBQ (Nov 16, 2010)

jza said:


> Guess you guys use ****ing garbage in New England.


Hey s hit head, what type of cable are you using for common phone lines?


----------



## jza (Oct 31, 2009)

BBQ said:


> Hey s hit head, what type of cable are you using for common phone lines?


Shielded cat5e, WHAT DO YOU RUN, ******?


----------



## BBQ (Nov 16, 2010)

jza said:


> Shielded cat5e, WHAT DO YOU RUN, ******?


No one in my area runs shielded cat 5e unless it is specified.


----------



## jza (Oct 31, 2009)

BBQ said:


> No one in my area runs shielded cat 5e unless it is specified.


That's unfortunate.


----------



## jwjrw (Jan 14, 2010)

BBQ said:


> No one in my area runs shielded cat 5e unless it is specified.



Maybe in commercial we MIGHT get a spec for it on a job but as a rule no one here runs it either.:no:


----------



## BBQ (Nov 16, 2010)

jza said:


> That's unfortunate.


Not really, it works dandy.

It seems unfortunate that you choose to waste money that would be better in your pocket. :thumbsup:


----------



## jwjrw (Jan 14, 2010)

jza said:


> Shielded cat5e, WHAT DO YOU RUN, ******?




If anything BBQ is BI......he is married with children.....maybe a Larry Craig sorta situation??:laughing:


----------



## McClary’s Electrical (Feb 21, 2009)

jwjrw said:


> If anything BBQ is BI......he is married with children.....maybe a Larry Craig sorta situation??:laughing:


 

Not to mention that he hunted down and killed the last person who called him ******.


----------



## jza (Oct 31, 2009)

COME ****ING GET ME

come on COME


----------



## mattsilkwood (Sep 21, 2008)

BBQ said:


> No one in my area runs shielded cat 5e unless it is specified.


 Same here.


----------



## mattsilkwood (Sep 21, 2008)

jwjrw said:


> If anything BBQ is BI......he is married with children.....maybe a Larry Craig sorta situation??:laughing:


 Just remember, it's not gay if you don't f**k back.:laughing:


----------



## BBQ (Nov 16, 2010)

mattsilkwood said:


> Just remember, it's not gay if you don't f**k back.:laughing:


:laughing::laughing:


----------



## McClary’s Electrical (Feb 21, 2009)

mattsilkwood said:


> Just remember, it's not gay if you don't f**k back.:laughing:


:laughing::laughing:



mattsilkwood said:


> Same here.


same here too.



jza said:


> COME ****ING GET ME
> 
> come on COME


Go snort a Xanex and calm down


----------



## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

I'm glad it's Christmas season.


You can just feel the love in the air.


----------



## drsparky (Nov 13, 2008)

Very rarely do I see shielded cat 5e. I would guess 95% or better is not shielded.


----------

