# service disconnect location?



## Celtic (Nov 19, 2007)

As far as you want....however, once they become service entrance conductors it's another story as detailed in 230.70


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## electromanj (Dec 18, 2007)

Gotcha, thanks Celtic.
By the way- how bout them cowboys!


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## turqee (Feb 19, 2008)

speakin of which... did you know on UG service it is legal, ( although unpractical ) to use the meter itself as means of disconnect? This helped me when I had to finish a job after jacklegs.


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## Celtic (Nov 19, 2007)

turqee said:


> speakin of which... did you know on UG service it is legal, ( although unpractical ) to use the meter itself as means of disconnect?



Says who?


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## nap (Dec 26, 2007)

I am with celtic on this one

Who told you it was a disconnect, especially since it is not rated or listed as a disconnect which would mean the code would not accept it as a disconnect.

actually, I do not see anything that would limit how far away the disconnect as long as it stays outside. The code requires the desconnect ot be nearest to the point of entry. Some AHJ's have come up with a number for how long the feeders can be. I have been told 11 feet is the number around here but I have never found any justification for that or any other number. It simply needs to be installed where the feeders enter the building.


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## Speedy Petey (Jan 10, 2007)

turqee said:


> speakin of which... did you know on UG service it is legal, ( although unpractical ) to use the meter itself as means of disconnect? This helped me when I had to finish a job after jacklegs.


Really? Where would this be?
Sorry, but I am with the others. The meter is NO disconnect.


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## cmec (Feb 11, 2008)

Its a gray area look at 225.2 ,225.32,230.6 and 230.70


Where I live traditonally its a judgment call by the inspector , inside the building 3 feet of unfused se cable was acceptable maybee a little more to go past an fuel oil tank

With the UCC and the ICC electrical code giving the bco authority over the electrical inspector I dont know ,depends on whos calling the shots.

I have seen places where they can run up to 40 ft inside (scarry)


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## nap (Dec 26, 2007)

cmec said:


> Its a gray area look at 225.2 ,225.32,230.6 and 230.70
> 
> 
> 
> )


I surely hope you are speaking to the distance thing and not the meter as a disconnect.

Yes, it is a gray area and it is up to the inspector.

there are no numbers in the code and the only thing it does state is "inside nearest the point of entrance of the service entrance conductors"

To me, that states that you are not allowed to run the SE conductors inside anymore than necessary to reach a readily accessible area. The 40 feet you spoke of is obviously beyond what the code intended.



> With the UCC and the ICC electrical code giving the bco authority over the electrical inspector I dont know ,depends on whos calling the shots.


Not sure where you are at but around here, the only greater authority than the electrical inspec (concerning electrical work anyway) is the state level offices that determine what the code for the state is. Even then, ultimately, it is only interpretation that is allowed. The inspector is not allowed to make code.


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## cmec (Feb 11, 2008)

Pennsylvania passed the uniform construction code act 45 ,and adopted the ICC codes with that came the ICC electrical code that gives the building code offical authority over the electrical inspector. Its really scarey a two day course and test puts some one that dosent know witch end of the kleins to hold or what their for in charge of everything.

The 40 ft of se cable was on hilton head island in south carolina,on a friends condo pallemetto electric Is the utility co when I questioned it they told me that aint the way we do it in buefort county.They did a whole complex that way


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## ralph (Apr 6, 2008)

cmec said:


> Pennsylvania passed the uniform construction code act 45 ,and adopted the ICC codes with that came the ICC electrical code that gives the building code offical authority over the electrical inspector. Its really scarey a two day course and test puts some one that dosent know witch end of the kleins to hold or what their for in charge of everything.
> 
> The 40 ft of se cable was on hilton head island in south carolina,on a friends condo pallemetto electric Is the utility co when I questioned it they told me that aint the way we do it in buefort county.They did a whole complex that way


 its 35 ' in beaufort county. Hilton head is " upon entrance "


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## nap (Dec 26, 2007)

well, how about the reason the code states as such is to allow for different situations while still maintaining a moderate level of safety. Personally, I believe that the 35 or 40 feet allows an usafe condition and should not be done, regardless of what _may_ be allowed.

I continue to hear more and more stories about how somebody cut into, drilled into, or some other way damaged the service feeders which are protected by only the POCO's cut-outs. Several fires I know of are directly related to just such a situation as you guys are installing.

Even though a disco may not be required, that doesn;t mean it isn;t a good idea and shouldn;t be installed.

Remember; the NEC is only a minimum requirement.


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## cmec (Feb 11, 2008)

I agree se cable unfused is dangerous, Espically in stick frame construction. But Dont you think if you ran a screw into a peice of ser or seu with an overcurrent device on it it would still arc?

Dont you think ,Unless somepthing is in the contract documents requires a disconect (thats not required by code )and its a competive bid situation not too many people are going to put one in .
ITS up to the code makers or local govt to make standards or have ammendments.
The first thing your told in code enforcement is do not enforce your personal opinion,If you cant put your finger an an code article shut up.


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## nap (Dec 26, 2007)

> I agree se cable unfused is dangerous, Espically in stick frame construction. But Dont you think if you ran a screw into a peice of ser or seu with an overcurrent device on it it would still arc?


maybe if they would require SE type U I would think it would be relatively safe, same as when outside but SE cable by definition does not require the outer wrap of the neutral. I still do not like the idea of a wire being fused at the level it is but at least that would be better.



> Dont you think ,Unless somepthing is in the contract documents requires a disconect (thats not required by code )and its a competive bid situation not too many people are going to put one in .


Understood but the lowest bid isn;t always the taken bid. Actually, this is something I would like to see the code committee actually take up and define and correct. That would allow all to bid on a level field.



> The first thing your told in code enforcement is do not enforce your personal opinion,If you cant put your finger an an code article shut up.[/


Well, the fact it is ambiguously stated as the nearset point inside the building allows the inspector to support his decision to not allow 35 feet of SE inside the building. It is not opinion, it is application of what is actually stated.


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## turqee (Feb 19, 2008)

The meter as a disconnect is a call the inspector would have to make. But the location of the meter is really up to the guy who screws it on. As long as it meets power co. regulations.


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## nap (Dec 26, 2007)

turqee said:


> The meter as a disconnect is a call the inspector would have to make. But the location of the meter is really up to the guy who screws it on. As long as it meets power co. regulations.


I'm glad you threw that last sentence in there. In EVERY POCO jurisdiction I work in (about 10) the POCO specifies where the meter is to be mounted. In one of the areas, the POCO requires the meter on the front of the building even just so they can access it easier.

and no, the meter as a disco is not a AHJ call. Unless you have a meter that is also rated and listed as a disco, it is illegal. If an AHJ allows it, it still does not make it legal, it simply means he was wrong to allow it and when youhave a new or different inspector and the home needs to be brought up to code, you may very well need to install a seperate (actual ) disco.


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