# Pushing a ground rod in by hand.



## Bkessler (Feb 14, 2007)

Any one ever see a ground rod go in by hand with only a 44oz cup of water?


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## Interlock (Jul 14, 2010)

Nope, but I have driven many in pretty quickly with a small SDS-Plus hammer drill.


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## varmit (Apr 19, 2009)

I have done this many times myself in the proper soil conditions. Around here we call it slushing in a ground rod.


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## Bkessler (Feb 14, 2007)

I lost 20 bucks! It was worth it though.:laughing:


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

Been there, done that, got caught, had to install another rod.


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## Interlock (Jul 14, 2010)

480sparky said:


> Been there, done that, got caught, had to install another rod.


For what?


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

Interlock said:


> For what?


Using water.


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## Interlock (Jul 14, 2010)

480sparky said:


> Using water.


You were made to install another rod because you used some water to install the first one?


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## idontknow (Jul 18, 2009)

I've seen them go in by hand, it's all about soil conditions.

I've installed 2 10' x 3/4" ground rods by hand/boot at a church. The area was an orange grove and has very loose soil.

There is a housing project that's on an old citrus grove and every one of those rods went in by hand.


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

Interlock said:


> You were made to install another rod because you used some water to install the first one?



Yup. Inspector saw me, and informed me of a local amendment prohibiting it. That's why I bought "Brutus."


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## Interlock (Jul 14, 2010)

480sparky said:


> Yup. Inspector saw me, and informed me of a local amendment prohibiting it. That's why I bought "Brutus."


Jeeze. I hope it doesn't rain the next time you install a service or you might get gigged


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

Interlock said:


> Jeeze. I hope it doesn't rain the next time you install a service or you might get gigged



I don't work outside in the rain anyway.


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## william1978 (Sep 21, 2008)

I have done it a couple of times. I was telling a inspector one time that I could do that and he told me to wait on driving the ground rods until he got there because he wanted to see. He was amazed.


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## mattsilkwood (Sep 21, 2008)

We call it soaking it in around here. We is a lot of clay around here so it works pretty good most of the time.

I have heard of guys getting gigged for doing it but never had an inspector call me on it before.

I will normally soak one in half way so I can get the hilti on it.


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## Widestance_Politics (Jun 2, 2010)

So can someone explain the process with the water? I pushed one in by hand but it was in a planter area with extremely soft soil near the foundation.....I was actually able to pull it up and had to try like 3 more times until I found an area that actually had some resistance...


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

Widestance_Politics said:


> So can someone explain the process with the water? I pushed one in by hand but it was in a planter area with extremely soft soil near the foundation.....I was actually able to pull it up and had to try like 3 more times until I found an area that actually had some resistance...



Dig a small depression in the ground. Push the rod down as far as you can and still pull it back out. Fill the hole with water. Push the rod down as far as you can and still pull it back out. Fill the hole with water. Push the rod down as far as you can and still pull it back out. Fill the hole with water. Push the rod down as far as you can and still pull it back out. Fill the hole with water. Push the rod down as far as you can and still pull it back out. Fill the hole with water. Push the rod down as far as you can and still pull it back out. Fill the hole with water. Somewhere along the line, you'll get it all the way down.


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## s.kelly (Mar 20, 2009)

We were talking about it on a job with compacted soil once. Worked it about half way down before it seemed like it was time for power tools. 

Had no idea that there could be an issue with inspectors on this though. I thought it was a hail mary approach only, but never thought an pass/fail issue.

For those who have had issues,what is the reasoning given. I am agreeing with the comment above about driving in the rain.


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

s.kelly said:


> ...........For those who have had issues,what is the reasoning given. I am agreeing with the comment above about driving in the rain.


The issue, as I understand it, is lack of contact between the rod and the earth. Driving a rod in the rain will not provide enough water to duplicate the method (unless you work in the rain where you can expect several feet of water in a matter of minutes.......... not inches: _feet_.)

My personal opinion is that's it's a bunch of hooey, but rules are rules. I say that the next time there's a good soaking rain, or a freeze/thaw cycle, a rod will have the same amount of contact as one mechanically driven.


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## Widestance_Politics (Jun 2, 2010)

480sparky said:


> Dig a small depression in the ground. Push the rod down as far as you can and still pull it back out. Fill the hole with water. Push the rod down as far as you can and still pull it back out. Fill the hole with water. Push the rod down as far as you can and still pull it back out. Fill the hole with water. Push the rod down as far as you can and still pull it back out. Fill the hole with water. Push the rod down as far as you can and still pull it back out. Fill the hole with water. Push the rod down as far as you can and still pull it back out. Fill the hole with water. Somewhere along the line, you'll get it all the way down.


I hope you copy/pasted most of that...:laughing:


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## Bkessler (Feb 14, 2007)

The guy who showed me did so after he saw me pound the first one in, I'd say the soil conditions were harder than average. Meaning I was out of breath and sweaty after the first one, and this guy just pushes one in two minutes. With the only one cup of water from my empty 44oz fountain dew. It was amazing.


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

Widestance_Politics said:


> I hope you copy/pasted most of that...:laughing:



Copy and paste? :001_huh:


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## TOOL_5150 (Aug 27, 2007)

480sparky said:


> Copy and paste? :001_huh:


CTRL+C and then CTRL+V
CTRL+C and then CTRL+V
CTRL+C and then CTRL+V
CTRL+C and then CTRL+V
CTRL+C and then CTRL+V
CTRL+C and then CTRL+V

~Matt


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

TOOL_5150 said:


> CTRL+C and then CTRL+V
> CTRL+C and then CTRL+V
> CTRL+C and then CTRL+V
> CTRL+C and then CTRL+V
> ...


I knew that.


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## TOOL_5150 (Aug 27, 2007)

480sparky said:


> I knew that.


i figured as much. I just wanted to be part of this thread.

~Matt


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## 76nemo (Aug 13, 2008)

TOOL_5150 said:


> i figured as much. I just wanted to be part of this thread.
> 
> ~Matt


 

:laughing::laughing::laughing::laughing:


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## drsparky (Nov 13, 2008)

This thread got me thinking. Could you lube a ground rod with electrically conductive grease like like No-Ox-Id? Should go in easier if you had to drive it without a Hiti.


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## Chris Kennedy (Nov 19, 2007)

Around here I rarely ever get out a hammer. Just push them in, no water.


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## Shockdoc (Mar 4, 2010)

Does using salt water instead of straight water improve the ground rods conductivity ? I've actually had g/r s on the south shore of LI that would handle a power drill.


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## Southeast Power (Jan 18, 2009)

Dig a 6' trench and bend a 90 on each end of one ground rod and throw it in and cover it up, would be just as effective....:thumbsup:


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## Shockdoc (Mar 4, 2010)

jrannis said:


> Dig a 6' trench and bend a 90 on each end of one ground rod and throw it in and cover it up, would be just as effective....:thumbsup:


 I have done that before with one 90 at the end


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## Dennis Alwon (May 9, 2009)

Bkessler said:


> With only one cup of water from my empty 44oz fountain dew. It was amazing.


 That is amazing. How did he get a cup of water from an empty 44oz fountain cup. :laughing:


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## hardworkingstiff (Jan 22, 2007)

480sparky said:


> Yup. Inspector saw me, and informed me of a local amendment prohibiting it.


I think I'd ask to see the amendment in writing.



480sparky said:


> I say that the next time there's a good soaking rain, or a freeze/thaw cycle, a rod will have the same amount of contact as one mechanically driven.


 I'd have to agree with this.


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## bobelectric (Feb 24, 2007)

I won't try it! It's an internet trick to make me lose money trying old methods that don't work with shale.


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## 76nemo (Aug 13, 2008)

Maybe there is some things you can't find on YouTube, huh:001_huh:

I have never seen it done, but I know who's going to try it for S&G's:jester:


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## varmit (Apr 19, 2009)

I have done a resistance test on ground rods installed by slushing vs driven by a jackhammer and found no consistent differences in resistance. However, I have heard that some AHJ have issues with this method. I would think that all of the shaking and vibrations of driving a ground rod with sledge hammers, hammer drills or jack hammers would impede the continuity worse than the slushing method. As someone else said, after the ground settles, there would be no difference.


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## jwjrw (Jan 14, 2010)

Our ground is so hard in places I've had to dig a trench 30" deep more than a few times. Some areas you can grab the rod and jab it in 4 ft then hit a rock the size of a fat girl's butt at the all you can eat dessert bar.


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

Chris Kennedy said:


> Around here I rarely ever get out a hammer. Just push them in, no water.



Don't you hit water anyway about 6" down? :laughing:


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## Chris Kennedy (Nov 19, 2007)

480sparky said:


> Don't you hit water anyway about 6" down? :laughing:


Usually around 4 to 6 feet.


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

Chris Kennedy said:


> Usually around 4 to 6 feet.



Feet........... inches........... what's the difference? :laughing:


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## Geoff C (May 26, 2010)

i have a feeling there are a few rods I've driven out there that look like a dinner plate on the bottom. 2hrs of sledge hammer on a huge mountain of granite about 5' down. Somethings gotta give and it wasn't the rock.


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## Podagrower (Mar 16, 2008)

Chris Kennedy said:


> Usually around 4 to 6 feet.


I worked in a ritzy subdivision where the water was 18" below existing grade. Not real good for building, but it made keeping a ditch 18" deep pretty easy.


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## yamatitan (Sep 4, 2010)

Im new here I found this side while researching some klein tools. I started reading and found this thread. I have working as a helper for a licensed electrician for 4 years now since my junior year in highschool and now im in my junior year of college. Anyway just wanted to say that I have put in every single ground rod in by hand since ive been working for my boss. Hes really cheap and wont invest in any kind of hammer drill. He uses a regular drill to mount panels on brick, etc.. Im the only one in a crew that owns a hammer drill and its just a cordless 18v dewalt. Anyway ive probably installed around 500 ground rods using this method. He even reuses the ones for the temp poles by tightening the ground clamp and using a 2x4 to pry it out the ground.


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## Rudeboy (Oct 6, 2009)

yamatitan said:


> Im new here I found this side while researching some klein tools. I started reading and found this thread. I have working as a helper for a licensed electrician for 4 years now since my junior year in highschool and now im in my junior year of college. Anyway just wanted to say that I have put in every single ground rod in by hand since ive been working for my boss. Hes really cheap and wont invest in any kind of hammer drill. He uses a regular drill to mount panels on brick, etc.. Im the only one in a crew that owns a hammer drill and its just a cordless 18v dewalt. Anyway ive probably installed around 500 ground rods using this method. He even reuses the ones for the temp poles by tightening the ground clamp and using a 2x4 to pry it out the ground.


:laughing:
That _is_ a cheap bastard.


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

Rudeboy said:


> :laughing:
> That _is_ a cheap bastard.



The stingiest person spends the most.


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## Split Bolt (Aug 30, 2010)

480sparky said:


> Dig a small depression in the ground. Push the rod down as far as you can and still pull it back out. Fill the hole with water. Push the rod down as far as you can and still pull it back out. Fill the hole with water. Push the rod down as far as you can and still pull it back out. Fill the hole with water. Push the rod down as far as you can and still pull it back out. Fill the hole with water. Push the rod down as far as you can and still pull it back out. Fill the hole with water. Push the rod down as far as you can and still pull it back out. Fill the hole with water. Somewhere along the line, you'll get it all the way down.


480, thanks for the instructions! Too late though, when I tried it, the end of the ground rod poked through the bottom of my 44oz. cup of water on the very first hit!


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

Split Bolt said:


> 480, thanks for the instructions! Too late though, when I tried it, the end of the ground rod poked through the bottom of my 44oz. cup of water on the very first hit!



Uh, you don't put the cup in the hole. You just use it to pour the water in the hole with.:blink:


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## The Lightman (Jan 9, 2010)

Podagrower said:


> I worked in a ritzy subdivision where the water was 18" below existing grade. Not real good for building,


Good for sink hole attorneys in about eight years!


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## yamatitan (Sep 4, 2010)

480sparky said:


> The stingiest person spends the most.



I tell him this all the time, he refuses to drill through walls because it takes too much time. Then I ask him does he think the extra 20 minutes to drill out a house is not worth the 8 feet of romex your using going up and down every single stud. Not to mention the time it takes for me to climb up and down the ladder every time vs going straight through the walls.


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## NolaTigaBait (Oct 19, 2008)

480sparky said:


> Uh, you don't put the cup in the hole. You just use it to pour the water in the hole with.:blink:


:laughing:. I can usually push a ground rod in by hand with a cup of water also. Sometimes if it rained recently, I can drive it in without water even.


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