# OSHA Cites North Billerica, Mass., Contractor Following Arc Blast



## user4818 (Jan 15, 2009)

Now where is Harry to tell us that OSHA should be disbanded?


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## user4818 (Jan 15, 2009)

IES is a big company in New England. I'm surprised that this happened as I would have expected them to have a pretty rigorous safety policy in place already. I'm sure they will implement one now.


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## macmikeman (Jan 23, 2007)

Peter D said:


> Now where is Harry to tell us that OSHA should be disbanded?


Harry doesn't need to , some guy named Walker has apparently got himself re-elected and he's gonna do it for Harry.


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## BBQ (Nov 16, 2010)

macmikeman said:


> Harry doesn't need to , some guy named Walker has apparently got himself re-elected and he's gonna do it for Harry.


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

Peter D said:


> IES is a big company in New England. I'm surprised that this happened as I would have expected them to have a pretty rigorous safety policy in place already. I'm sure they will implement one now.


They do Untill your on a job that they think no one is looking.


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## user4818 (Jan 15, 2009)

HARRY304E said:


> They do Untill your on a job that they think no one is looking.


I guess they got caught when they thought nobody was looking.


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

Peter D said:


> Now where is Harry to tell us that OSHA should be disbanded?


Ahhh! Wrong...:laughing:

We should disban the EPA.


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

Peter D said:


> I guess they got caught when they thought nobody was looking.


They probably did not even have close to enough J-men on the job either that is normal for them.


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## BBQ (Nov 16, 2010)

HARRY304E said:


> They probably did not even have close to enough J-men on the job either that is normal for them.


And you know this how?

The state watches large EC job ratios like a hawk 

We have a women watching it every day based on the people calling in sick.


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

BBQ said:


> And you know this how?
> 
> The state watches large EC job ratios like a hawk
> 
> We have a women watching it every day based on the people calling in sick.


Been there to see it first hand.


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## TimChaput69 (Nov 14, 2011)

If I'm not mistaken it was a couple Interstate guys that blew up a piece of switch gear at the Mall of NH too last year some time!? One guy got burnt really good and the other got minor burns. I think it was a 2000A switch they were playing in and blam-o!!


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## BBQ (Nov 16, 2010)

HARRY304E said:


> Been there to see it first hand.


Uh huh.

So you are currently privy to all Interstates jobs and the ratios. 
:no:

I think you are just talking out your butt again.


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

BBQ said:


> Uh huh.
> 
> So you are currently privy to all Interstates jobs and the ratios.
> :no:
> ...


I did my time there and still have friends that have been there all this time so it is not top secret how they run the show.

You need to move around a little more because you get stale working in the same place all the time.


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## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

Peter D said:


> IES is a big company in New England. I'm surprised that this happened as I would have expected them to have a pretty rigorous safety policy in place already. I'm sure they will implement one now.


 
A demo man cut into a 200A feeder on my job, blew up a sawzall (thankfully not himself) 

the feeder was IES's 'temp', utilizing old pipe runs, which they did not investigate as to branches, nor did they mark it as energized


This went about 6-700' through my end of the job to theirs

when the incident happened ipolitely informed IES's of THIER mistake

the foreman made quite the scene, insisting on blaming everyone and everything BUT his crew

All while they've this *'No incident for XXXXX working days'* sign up in their trailer

IES is a joke that deserves osha's wrath imho

~CS~


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## Lone Crapshooter (Nov 8, 2008)

Just looked at their site they have several safety awards and they claim that their people know about 70E. 
like a friend of my dad's use to say "Make a man wonder"


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## thegoldenboy (Aug 15, 2010)

Well, they had a help wanted ad I was thinking about applying. They sound like a piece of work, I think I'll stay put...


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

thegoldenboy said:


> Well, they had a help wanted ad I was thinking about applying. They sound like a piece of work, I think I'll stay put...


Unless you are a good foreman they will just use you for that job they want done promis you the whole wide world then dump you without warning.


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## TooFarFromFenway (Jul 15, 2011)

Why doesn't someone make a call to IES and ask for a copy of the past two years of OSHA form 300's? They are required to provide them......might make for some interesting reading if their reputation is that bad...


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## BBQ (Nov 16, 2010)

chicken steve said:


> A demo man cut into a 200A feeder on my job, blew up a sawzall (thankfully not himself)
> 
> the feeder was IES's 'temp', utilizing old pipe runs, which they did not investigate as to branches, nor did they mark it as energized
> 
> ...


So in your mind it is not the fault of the guy with the saw or the person that told him to cut the pipe 

Yeah that makes sense. 

As far as what your view of a joke is .... Who cares, you find fault with everyone and everything so that is the real joke.


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## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

we nearly had a man killed here BBQ

that's no joke

the company responsible for the incident didn't report it

they did, however, beat feet to deenrgize what should have not been energized in the first place

sadly, while their foreman was backpeddaling as loudly as he could, his J man was 20' up fixing the problem w/o having it lotto'd off

while wearing their company _'Safety First'_ shirts btw



further, had a few of their older dogs skip the fence to work my side of the job .....

these guys came credentialed, the real deal, and with a few choice stories

~CS~


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

chicken steve said:


> we nearly had a man killed here BBQ
> 
> that's no joke
> 
> ...


Most of those big company's are big on those stupid safety first glow in the dark lime colored shirts.

But in the real world it is safety last because there is no time for safety figured into the man hours.


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## Zog (Apr 15, 2009)

HARRY304E said:


> But in the real world it is safety last because there is no time for safety figured into the man hours.


Oh please, "real world"?? What exactly is that Harry? And how much time do you think "safety" takes?


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## BBQ (Nov 16, 2010)

HARRY304E said:


> Most of those big company's are big on those stupid safety first glow in the dark lime colored shirts.
> 
> But in the real world it is safety last because there is no time for safety figured into the man hours.


You are so talking out your ass now. :laughing:

We give people unpaid time off for doing the things you likely do every day. Do you install branch circuits into live panels?

Two of our guys just got written up and time off for that. 

When you go on a roof do you use, or even own fall protection equipment?

We own 100s of feet of roof railing so we can put a perimeter up around a roof. 

Do you wear a hard hat, gloves, safety glasses?

Our guys do because it does in fact reduce injuries. 

It is just so meaningless when you bitch about big company saftey policies when you have total disregard for safety at your own bussness.


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

Zog said:


> Oh please, "real world"?? What exactly is that Harry? And how much time do you think "safety" takes?


I'm just telling it like it was when I worked for company's like that they would put on the safety face and as soon as no one is looking the compleat opisit happens.

I have not worked for any of them in the last ten years but as you can see from the story nothing has changed. 

I am not against safety I am just pointing out that company's like that are full of "BS" and unless OSHA ,puts them out of business they will be back to the old way of doing things as soon as the heat is off.

Looking at the fines they received they will be right back at it in no time.


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

BBQ said:


> You are so talking out your ass now. :laughing:
> 
> We give people unpaid time off for doing the things you likely do every day. Do you install branch circuits into live panels?
> 
> ...


BBQ I am not talking about your company I don't no how your company operates except for what you have to say about them.

I am simply pointing out that most of them are full of chit and do not practice the way they say they do.

If your company does then that is good.


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## Sparkydog (Jun 8, 2012)

*not suprised*

I have talked to a lot of Interstate guys when they come into the supply house for thir side jobs. I know they are trying to join the union because of this exact consern. Interstate "beats them like dogs for no money". I hope they are sucessful and I hope the guys they hurt are ok.


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

BBQ said:


> When you go on a roof do you use, or even own fall protection equipment?


I don't do any roof top work commercial and I do not do solar panels


BBQ said:


> We own 100s of feet of roof railing so we can put a perimeter up around a roof.


 Good if I was doing that type of work I would be doing the same thing.



BBQ said:


> Do you wear a hard hat, gloves, safety glasses?


When needed yes 




BBQ said:


> It is just so meaningless when you bitch about big company saftey policies when you have total disregard for safety at your own bussness.


If that was a fact.


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## TooFarFromFenway (Jul 15, 2011)

HARRY304E said:


> When needed yes


Even I don't do that, and I am very safety conscious. 

Question: When you're climbing in the attic, do you wear your hard hat?


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## Big John (May 23, 2010)

In companies that size the person who really sets the tone for safety is usually the lead man on the ground. The company will almost always be compliant on paper, but how the guys actually act and what they actually do is often decided by how their direct superior pushes them.

Some crews are really safe, some crews are risk takers. I think that would be true in many places.

-John


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

TooFarFromFenway said:


> Even I don't do that, and I am very safety conscious.
> 
> Question: When you're climbing in the attic, do you wear your hard hat?


Never.


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## Shockdoc (Mar 4, 2010)

OSHA ;protecting stupid employees from stupid employers.


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## Big John (May 23, 2010)

Shockdoc said:


> OSHA ;protecting stupid employees from stupid employers.


 Your hate of all-things-government is clouding your judgment. 

If you look at the history of industrial manufacturing in this country--or even how modern American and foreign manufacturers operate abroad--it quickly becomes apparent that worker safety is a low priority, and has nothing to do with how smart a worker isn't.

Something needs to balance that out. If it's not OSHA, then what?

-John


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## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

TooFarFromFenway said:


> Even I don't do that, and I am very safety conscious.
> 
> Question: When you're climbing in the attic, do you wear your hard hat?


i've a few holes in my head from roofing nails that have proven to be rather convincing TFFF


~CS~


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## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

BBQ said:


> You are so talking out your ass now. :laughing:
> 
> We give people unpaid time off for doing the things you likely do every day. Do you install branch circuits into live panels?
> 
> ...


Nice that you've elected yourself safety judge BBQ

just remember when you point that finger, there's 3 pointing back








~CS~


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## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

Big John said:


> Something needs to balance that out. If it's not OSHA, then what?
> 
> -John


yet we are but fleas riding the double edged sword of bureacracy John....

~CS~


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## drsparky (Nov 13, 2008)

I hate that cliche. Only an idiot would repeat that tired trite. Just for fun point at the wall and look at the direction the other three fingers are pointed. Would anyone think that the other fingers are pointing at anything?


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## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

how's _'let he without sin cast the first stone'_ sit with ya spark?

~CS~


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## BBQ (Nov 16, 2010)

chicken steve said:


> how's _'let he without sin cast the first stone'_ sit with ya spark?
> 
> ~CS~


You are 'Mr I hate hypocrisy' I was just pointing out that Harrys bi


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## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

should i start addressing you as _Saint_ BBQ ? ~CS~


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## BBQ (Nov 16, 2010)

chicken steve said:


> should i start addressing you as _Saint_ BBQ ? ~CS~


Whatever blows your hair back kid.


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## TooFarFromFenway (Jul 15, 2011)

HARRY304E said:


> Never.


I don't either, but according to OSHA, it's a hardhat violation, subject to fines. 

Anyway, are you in this contractor's area? If so, would you call them and ask for their OSHA 300 form? I think it'd be an interesting read.


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## TooFarFromFenway (Jul 15, 2011)

chicken steve said:


> i've a few holes in my head from roofing nails that have proven to be rather convincing TFFF
> 
> 
> ~CS~


I hate roofing nails!! When we build our house, we're using peel-and-stick. No effing nails sticking out all over!!


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

TooFarFromFenway said:


> I don't either, but according to OSHA, it's a hardhat violation, subject to fines.
> 
> Anyway, are you in this contractor's area? If so, would you call them and ask for their OSHA 300 form? I think it'd be an interesting read.


I live in the area and we have parted ways. 

So I will maintain ignoring them.

Doing things like that have consequences and I'm not willing to pay that price.

If you want to call them the number is on their website in post #1.


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## angryceltic (Feb 21, 2012)

BBQ said:


> You are so talking out your ass now. :laughing:
> 
> We give people unpaid time off for doing the things you likely do every day. Do you install branch circuits into live panels?
> 
> ...



sounds like the safety policy at my work.


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## TooFarFromFenway (Jul 15, 2011)

HARRY304E said:


> I live in the area and we have parted ways.
> 
> So I will maintain ignoring them.
> 
> ...


Just curious sir, what do you mean by consequences? 

I just might do that though. Thanks Harry! 

Cheers!


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## BBQ (Nov 16, 2010)

TooFarFromFenway said:


> Anyway, are you in this contractor's area? If so, would you call them and ask for their OSHA 300 form? I think it'd be an interesting read.


I am not sure why you think the 300 form would be so interesting, a big company will have more lost time accidents than a small company. Not a fair way to compare. 

What is much more telling would be their insurance MOD rate.


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## NacBooster29 (Oct 25, 2010)

I work for this company and a few coments on here are foolish. I for one get paid well and am treated well. I've also been with this shop for 10 plus years as have a lot of my co workers. This accident was against.everything our company does. The two guys involved were part of a scheduled.shutdown, and they took it upon themselves to do the work hot the day before thanksgiving. Hours before the shutdown. That is all I will say about that. Yes our shop hands out neon green t shirts and also gray ones. With hard hats safety glasses and gloves. Obviously you cannot make everyone in a company 500 strong work safely every minute. But we do have a.great record. And a lot of top notch employees. Despite what chicken Steve believes.


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## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

> Despite what chicken Steve believes.


you mean _despite_ what i've seen your co _amount _to Nac

and i'm reading _'free lance hack'_ in your post confrimimg it

own up to your mistakes, and folks will speak better of you


~CS~


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## NacBooster29 (Oct 25, 2010)

I'm sure you dealt with 1 or 2 out of 500+ field employees. I cannot vouch for people I don't know, or speak directly to your incident. However as an entity our company has a great track record for safety. And painting a picture of an entire companies policies based on one poor interaction is not wise. As I have said I'm a newbie and I've been here 10 plus years. 
Safety is definetely preached, and all required and requested ppe is provided. Anyone choosing to work in an in safe manor while on their own watch . Cannot be controlled. Furthermore pertaining to this.incident, our company has made great efforts to put every field.personel through nfpa 70e training, including watching a grueling 4 hour video, and the hands on arc flash suite training. Ultimately the company cannot control individual people every second of.the day. 
In my opinion this osha fine is excessive, but due to the size.of our company they see.dollar signs.


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## MDShunk (Jan 7, 2007)

The fine actually seems small when compared to similar incidents.


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## Zog (Apr 15, 2009)

NacBooster29 said:


> In my opinion this osha fine is excessive, but due to the size.of our company they see.dollar signs.


In this case size does not matter, I agree with Marc, the fine was minor compared to other similiar incidents.


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## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

NacBooster29 said:


> > However as an entity our company has a great track record for safety
> 
> 
> 
> ...


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## jza (Oct 31, 2009)

chicken steve said:


> A demo man cut into a 200A feeder on my job, blew up a sawzall (thankfully not himself)
> 
> the feeder was IES's 'temp', utilizing old pipe runs, which they did not investigate as to branches, nor did they mark it as energized
> 
> ...


Sorry but, how does one mark a piece of pipe as "energized"? Sounds to me like it was your fault. As the electrician on the job, you should have told the demo man what's okay to cut into and what isn't. If you weren't 100% sure, you should have tested.


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## NacBooster29 (Oct 25, 2010)

Well C.S we can agree to disagree. Imo you based your entire opinion of our shop on one incident. That you mentioned.
As times have become leaner and meaner. Safety is a money saver. We have over the last several years gotten a substantial insurance rebate, which has been given back to the employees as paid days off.
I am the first to call bs on the entire safety plan, but it is the new norm for shops our size. We have more people so more opportunity for things to go wrong. 
Looking at this incident alone two employees made an error in judgement, and got injured. As I've stated before it is not feasibly possible to monitor this many guys at one time. The company does a top notch effort in training, and making us aware of safety concerns. As well as providing all needed safety equipment.
I would encourage you to not form such strong opinions of our shop with no first hand experience, of how things are now.


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## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

jza said:


> Sorry but, how does one mark a piece of pipe as "energized"? Sounds to me like it was your fault. As the electrician on the job, you should have told the demo man what's okay to cut into and what isn't. If you weren't 100% sure, you should have tested.


IE energized it w/o telling _anyone_ jza

~CS~


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## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

NacBooster29 said:


> > Well C.S we can agree to disagree.
> 
> 
> oh yes,....
> ...


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## NacBooster29 (Oct 25, 2010)

C.s. you sound like a bitter ex employee.


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## BBQ (Nov 16, 2010)

NacBooster29 said:


> C.s. you sound like a bitter person


I fixed it for you.


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## jza (Oct 31, 2009)

chicken steve said:


> IE energized it w/o telling _anyone_ jza
> 
> ~CS~


I don't check in with every EC in the city when I energize wires in a conduit. It's up to whomever is cutting that conduit to go through the proper procedures and check if what's in the conduit is energized.


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## slickvic277 (Feb 5, 2009)

I have to agree with Harry (shocking, I know) on the big company smoke & mirror show. I'm currently on a condo project. One that has been on going for many years. It's being built by one of, if not _the_ countries largest home builder. (I'm sure if you think hard enough it will come to you) and it's all a joke.

Once a month they call a big safety meeting where some big wide ass jag-off talks down his nose at everyone about keeping hard hats on at all times, cleaning up the job site, not using broken ladders, blah blah blah.

Meanwhile they can't get the rebar dudes to put caps on the thousands of rebar spikes sticking out of the ground. They have Mexicans tossing trash from the sliding glass doors (that lead to the balconies that aren't built yet ) 4 stories up with not even as much as a ground guy let alone a harness.

Guys walking around smoking dope all day, carpenters in flip flops, entrances and exits impeded by equipment, portable generators running indoors, etc, etc........

It's a big giant joke. Meanwhile I got cited for not having my hard hat on while roughing in recessed lights. :laughing:

Here's a good one, they supply the panels and the covers are on back order. I didn't even think that was possible. I have a whole building with not a single cover. Thank GOD there's a pile of cardboard at every turn. Just cut that to fit and PRESTO! instant panel cover! :laughing:


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## slickvic277 (Feb 5, 2009)

Wait, I think I know whats going on here. Bob, you work for IES don't you????
:laughing::thumbup: I bet you do.........:laughing:


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## user4818 (Jan 15, 2009)

slickvic277 said:


> Wait, I think I know whats going on here. Bob, you work for IES don't you????


:no:

He does work for one of IES main competitors, though.


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## slickvic277 (Feb 5, 2009)

Peter D said:


> :no:
> 
> He does work for one of IES main competitors, though.


Well Pete if thats the case, he should be dragging IES rep all through the mud. After all, alls fair in love in war. Unless, he's looking to jump ship!  Who knows, maybe he needs more internet time! :laughing:


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## NacBooster29 (Oct 25, 2010)

I have no problems with other contractors. I've worked for a smaller fire and security co. Besides ies. I've probably ran into bob and not realized at some point in my career. My work does not look better by making others look bad. I take pride in good work and part of that work is safety. I'm sure Bob feels this way too.


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## BBQ (Nov 16, 2010)

slickvic277 said:


> Well Pete if thats the case, he should be dragging IES rep all through the mud. After all, alls fair in love in war. Unless, he's looking to jump ship!  Who knows, maybe he needs more internet time! :laughing:


Nope, just being honest about the BS some are spewing here.

I have never worked for Interstate, not looking too and yes they do a lot of the same types of work we do. 

I certainly don't wish them any ill will. I also hope the burned guys get well.


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