# Has anyone used ConEst Estimating Software



## eds construction

We use conest. I like it because of the ability to get instant pricing from our suppliers. It can do alot of stuff and gets overwhelming sometimes. It took me about 30 days to learn how to use the program.


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## jabix

Net Pricer is a nice function, but I can use that with my curretn software. Have you used any other software that you could rate ConEst against.


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## eds construction

We used to use Vision Infosoft. Conest is more toward the commertial where as infosoft had a large residential database. I like the conest


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## jabix

I would have to agree, I have been researching ConEst for about a month and even had a sales guy come to our shop and give a presentation. If you have not seen their new software you should check it out, although you would have to call them and set up a little time to demo it with them over the internet. It is called Sure Count and you can use a PDF, TIFF, DWG, ETC files of prints and this program will scan the pages after you tell it what to look for and will automatically count the fixtures or devices and transfer them to count sheets which you can then assign assemblies to each of those fixtures or devices. We are looking into getting this software.


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## jabix

Right now the software is not totally complete and is in Beta testing, but if you get in on the ground level you can get it for 2,000.00 and they will upgrade it for free as they change the program. they are projecting that if you wait until the program is complete it is going to sell for around 4,500.00


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## eds construction

Thanks, I will check into it. Good luck


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## Wamegojim

jabix said:


> Net Pricer is a nice function, but I can use that with my curretn software. Have you used any other software that you could rate ConEst against.


I am currently using Accubid. But, I would love to be able to switch to ConEst. I used to use it in the past at other companies I have been at. It is definitely the superior program. I have also used Estimation for a short period. I can't believe anyone buys their stuff.


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## jabix

Right on, like I said earlier, I have researched for about a month and even checked out accubid, they are a lot more picey than ConEst and their program cannot do some of the nice things that ConEst can, like with the price of copper right now it's nice to be able to click a button and chnage from THHN Copper to XHHW AL and have the program automatically change the pipe fittings straps etc. to meet the code requirements


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## jabix

And that's just the begining I could go on forever about the advantages.


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## sparky54

Here’s my experience over the last 25 years of trying them out, I have personally used Conest, Estimation (who sold out to Maxwell), Mccormick and Vision. In my experience and dozens of estimators I’ve compared notes with - nothing compares to the intuition and flexibility of Accubid. 

As far as the automatic symbol-recognition when I tried it I find it too risky. I know others who tried Surecount and told me it only works for very small projects (I dont have any of these) because the accuracy is barely good enough for budget counts -- this is also consistent with products like On Screen Takeoff who is not just another flash in the pan... I’ve actually seen companies like surecount come and go before. On Screen Takeoff tells their users to realistically expect about 80% accuracy from their symbol-recognition tool. That I can believe… but I don’t need 80% accuracy budgets, I need 100% accurate estimates that I can buy from and build from. If it was 95% I might be interested in preliminary budgets but I dont know how 80% flies for anybody.


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## jabix

I would have to agree that Accubid is a great program but they do not have the NEC code tables programmed into their software so I canpt just press a button and change from copper to aluminum conductors and have the wire pipe, fittings, etc. change automatically to the correct sizes like I can do with ConEst.


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## BDB

jabix said:


> Right now the software is not totally complete and is in Beta testing, but if you get in on the ground level you can get it for 2,000.00 and they will upgrade it for free as they change the program. they are projecting that if you wait until the program is complete it is going to sell for around 4,500.00


 Ok, 1st time here at the Electrician talk forum, so bare with me if I do not do things the right way. I am looking at getting ConEst system and doing a search I found this place. I noticed on the above post you stated that you could get the program for $2000.00? Is this for the LITE version? I have a quote for the LITE version for $2295.00 and the PLUS version for $3795.00. And nothing was said about a free upgrade. Was this before they had the four diffrent versions? I am looking at getting the PLUS version and I was thinking about getting the add on for the Sure Count, but from what I am reading here it doesnt sound like it is to trust worthy. Any help or insight on ConEst to help me make my mind up would be great.


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## jabix

The 2000.00 price is just for the sure count system, the ConEst Intellibid systems run about 2295.00 lite, 3795.00 plus, 4995.00 pro, 5995.00 design build. If you have any questions at all get in contact with Paul Liccardi at 866-709-0766 he is really knowlegable and is actually a representative that I purchased my system from.


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## jabix

ConEst Intellibid is a great program it is very reliable and has been around for quite a while. The sure count system is new and in beta testing but works great and any upgrades that they may do will be free since your getting in on the ground floor.


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## BDB

jabix said:


> The 2000.00 price is just for the sure count system, the ConEst Intellibid systems run about 2295.00 lite, 3795.00 plus, 4995.00 pro, 5995.00 design build. If you have any questions at all get in contact with Paul Liccardi at 866-709-0766 he is really knowlegable and is actually a representative that I purchased my system from.


How long have you had your system? How long after getting it did you feel comfortable enough with it to trust bidding a job? Any regrets? and finally (for now any ways) which level did you buy?


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## jabix

I am with a new company, they have only had it for about 3 months, but I have used it for the past 3 years. I think that out of all the systems that I have tried out this is the easiest to learn. I spent three months researching and trying out software programs when my current boss decided that the vision infosoft that we have is not working for what we want the system to do. I have no regrets about this product. We had to purchase the pro systems so that we could network them and have two estimators working on on one project. If you only have one estimator I would recommend the plus system. The nice thing is you can always upgrade to the next level of software and just pay the difference in price later on. So you could buy the plus system and upgrade later to the pro and just pay the difference between the two programs. Just remember that if you buy the plus and want to get the sure count system you have to have the count sheet link and the sure count link which you would have to add to the plus program which would cost around $600.00. If you don't mind counting the symbols on the prints yourself start out with just the plus system and add the sure count later. One warning with that option is that when the sure count software is complete it is probably going to cost about 4000.00 instead of the 2000.00 that you can get it for now.


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## BDB

jabix,
Thank you for your opinion on ConEst, very informative. That is a pretty high price for the sure count, it would be more then the system itself


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## jabix

Only if you wait too long to purchase it, anyways it wold be worht it to save all that time not having to count the devices, fixtures, etc. and then having it automatically import the information into the Intellibid program is nice too. Putting everything into the count sheets on intellibid so all you have to do is just assign an assembly to it and it will populate a whole list of materials. Anyways, call Paul if you have any questions he is a great guy and very helpful, he not only sells the system he also has is own estimating company and uses it to estimate jobs for a living. So, he is very knowledgable.


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## macdaddy

For what its worth, Our Company has Accubid, ConEst and Vision. 
We have 14 estimator/ PM's and the general consensus is ConEst rules. Our Chief estimator is ready to pull the plug on Accubid and send it back to Canada where Accubid is from "Non American" because ConEst has the best reports, and substitution tools that Accubid can't do half of what they say they could..... as far as Vision..its the Home Depot special for the residential guys.


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## BDB

macdaddy,
I am looking for a estimating program, so let me pick your brain a bit if you do not mind.
1.Which conest system do you have?Lite, Plus,Pro or Design Build?
2. What add on do you have?
3. What add on do you wish you had?
4. Do you have the Sure Count? If so, how well does it work? Reliable? Still in Beta release?
5. They keep telling me it will save LOTS of time when bidding, how so? (I currently use a home system that runs in DOS)
6. Do you do the yearly Service Plan?

I have been looking at either conest or McCormick


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## macdaddy

We have ConEst Design Build, the reason we went full boat is for the advanced substitution. I can take off a job in CU, and with a click of a button I can change the job to ALU and it will automatically up size the conduit and fitting to code. Accubid cant do it and wont because the owner of Accubid told us, he does not want to look like conest. 
As far as Sure count, I agree with everyone....save your money for now. Its a great idea BUT its only 70% accurate on a good day and Accubid, McCormick and all the other guys have not been able to make it any better either...yet. Hopefully the technology will come at a later date. We have it here, and dont use it.

We pump out almost 700 mill in estimates a year and we have been able to make the ConEst do everything we want as far as speed and bells and whistles. We have one guy that insists on Accubid and we have races with him all the time...yup and looses every one. 
Yearly service plan is a good idea, there are tweaks and upgrades that all Software companys make and you get them with the Mainenence...take the maint...its cheap, and they all are about + - 800 bucks


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## Estimatorguy100

*Estimating Software*

Does anyone know of take off software that can do "digital" take offs (from PDF, TIF, DXF, etc.), is under a $1,000 budget, integrates with existing excel spreadsheets and also includes built-in estimating and assemblies?


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## Estimatorguy100

*Digital Take Off Software*

sorry


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## chiefestimator

*New Estimating Software*

Jabix - Have you made your desicion yet?


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## BDB

jabix said:


> Right now the software is not totally complete and is in Beta testing, but if you get in on the ground level you can get it for 2,000.00 and they will upgrade it for free as they change the program. they are projecting that if you wait until the program is complete it is going to sell for around 4,500.00


I just purchased Conest, and with sure count you have to make sure you have count sheets as well. They gave me an offer I had to take, got sure count and count sheets added to my Plus purchase for $500.00


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## DavisIMI

I have Conest also, Design Build. I too researched all of the above mentioned software companies before I bought and the choice was clear. It seems that mostly it comes down between Conest and Accubid, Accubid looked a little mickey mousey to me, and after comparing the two Conest was the winner by far. I've been using it for 3 years now and all I do is industrial control and instrumentation, and I've had to set up my own assemblies and tweak the software to fit my needs but I would'nt change it for nothing now. Everyone of these software packages are only as good as the time you want to invest in it, its no get a job for magic software, you have to develope your own labor units,( theirs are good for starters and a guide), and you can only do that through job costing. It takes some time to get it set up for your company but when you do, look out.


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## Russell1200

I am also thinking about getting an estimating program.

I used Conest a few years ago. But the company I worked with had tweaked it in odd ways and we never got much in the way of training so it took forever to figure out even the basics.

I have seen enough of McCormick's system to be intrigued.

Accubid seems to have the most adherents around here. But that may be just because it has a reputation for being easy to use out of the box. Not necessarily because it is the best for all purposes.

What I also find aggravating is that it is very hard to get a straight up discussion of pricing. The Conest pricing noted above is the first I have seen, and they obviously did not come from the company.


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## BDB

Russell1200 said:


> The Conest pricing noted above is the first I have seen, and they obviously did not come from the company.


I asked conest for price sheet on the different systems they have, and they emailed me a price sheet in no time. In fact all 3 sent me prices when I asked.


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## Russell1200

As an update, I went with Accubid.

Without getting too much into the technicalities, it has a different style of data base which I preferred. But I also liked some aspects of the McCormick product.

For the price Electrical Bid Manager also seemed like a pretty good product. Probably not as diverse as some of the others, but fairly straightforward.

The largest factor is that it is by far the dominant estimating package in my area. Also rather telling is that some of big contractors have switched to it from one of the other major systems. I have estimators who have offered me help with the data base, based on their past experiences and that alone would be very helpful.

Oddly enough most of the people who used multiple systems mentioned that they really liked Accubid's ability to cut and paste in and out of excel. But Accubid itself does not make a point of this in their presentations. I am not exactly sure of the significance of this but I have to respect independent citations from experienced users.


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## chiefestimator

*ConEst*

My office uses ConEst exclusively. We put a few other system keys in a drawer after trying ConEst. Here are a few reasons;

The interface is the most user configurable I have ever seen. For instance, since we do many industrial estimates, it would save a lot of keystrokes if PVC coated materials in the PVC library. It took 5 minutes to make it happen.

The major part of the interface is the audit trail, which is completely interactive. You can change quantities, labor, prices and factors. You can also copy, cut and paste, between phases or even between projects. 

Another feature of the audit trail is comments. You can add as many comments as you want. They can be used for organization, information or even takeoff.

The summary screen is also completely interactive. All changes made in the summary screen update the audit trail instantly. Also the summary is constantly updated. Whenever you change or add to the takeoff, the summary is updated.

These are just some of the reasons I changed my office ConEst.


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## Russell1200

I have used Conest a lot, and was not entirely thrilled with its interface. Particularly with regards to the set up of the project. What Conest does with changes at the audit trail level Accubid does at all levels.

But of the big three, everyone one of them does something that the others don't do, or don't do well. None of them are critical.

And all of them are rather clumsy unless you invest the time in learning them well. They will all get the job done, but for a high end user in particular, none of them are painless.


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## chiefestimator

"What Conest does with changes at the audit trail level Accubid does at all levels."


Russell1200 - Can you be more specific?


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## Russell1200

Conest and others use a two part program. They have a data base, and then there compiler. Pretty much the way that Access and Excell interact.

Accubid has a C++ type data base. The database is embedded within the same program. So when you apply the item to its "slot" it is there. There is no button to push to make it interact with the compiler part of the program (aka audit trail).

This is particularly useful when you have jobs with lots of potential variety in scopes of work or alternates.

It also allows the job set up (how many floors, which sheets you are taking off from, etc) to be right at th point where you are entering your pick off. So you do not need to back out of it to make a change.

But they all have their peculiarities, and none of them are particularly intuitive. People who say they are intuitive have usually worked on them 2000+ hours.


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## chiefestimator

*ConEst vs Accubid*

That all sounds like programer talk (no insult intended). I don't care about the inner workings and hidden mechanisims. For me, a non-programmer, I pick an item or assembly, give it a count, and it appears on the audit trail. I can then modify it, multiply it, factor it, copy it, paste it or delete it. And I do not need to back out to make a change.

As far as variety and scope, I have never found a project that could not be organised easily on ConEst, including a $30,000,00 electrical with 42 bid items (I have learned to hate multiple bid items). To be fair, I never had a problem with getting Accubid to do the same. 

Here is a thought for you. I believe all of the major estimating programs can get the job done. It may come done to a matter of taste. However, you must look past the advertizing and sales pitches. Accubid has a very polished Wall Strret approach to marketing. In my opinion, that is why they have a big slice of the large contractor market.


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## Russell1200

I found all of their sales pitches to be pretty much the same: Inaccurate and/or misleading attestations as to the advantages of their program. It was a little like buying a car. The exception being Electrical Bid Manager who were pretty painless.

You are the one that asked for the details on the audit trail! LOL.

As an update, the one item I do like is the onscreen take off. I bought the less expensive non-CAD version. Set up with a larger second monitor it works very well.


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## SoSpec

I have been estimating for 38 years and have been through many systems. I used Estimation, MC2 and Estmat. I primarily use ACCUBID and have been using this system for many years. I have taught Estmat and was approached about teaching ConEst. ConEst is a VERY GOOD system, but the average electrical contractor cannot justify purchasing all of the systems out there. The best estimating system is the one you are most comfortable with, I have seen many contractors buy estimating systems and let them sit on the shelf and gather dust. You have to commit the time to learn a system, it will not estimate by itself. I have used ACCUBID for many years and I can "make it dance", so it is the system for me. My experience with the SureCount is that by the time I "set up" all of the symbols for the program to count, I could already have my takeoff completed. You can't go wrong with either ACCUBID or ConEst if you take the time to learn the program. I operate an estimating service and I have found through my customers that ACCUBID seems to be more widely used.


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## chiefestimator

Russell1200 said:


> As an update, the one item I do like is the onscreen take off. I bought the less expensive non-CAD version. Set up with a larger second monitor it works very well.


So true Russell. Digital takeoff has saved my neck health and solved my document storage problem. I also appreciate not paying for drawings.


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## BDB

Ok all you ConEst users out there. How long did it take you to understand the system enough to use for a bid? I purchased Conest a couple months back, and granted I have not worked with it as much as I would like to (just can not find the time to sit down and give it a few hours of my undivided attention)but My heads spins when I go from one section to another. During training I understood what the guy was showing me, but after we leave that screen and move on I can not go back and do what he showed me. I still do not understand how to actually do a bid from start to finish. They show how to use this screen and how to use that screen, but do not really show you how to do a start to finish bid. Anyone have any secrets they care to share? Did you take just the on phone training or did you spend the money and go to a live training?


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## chiefestimator

BDB - Call me @ 805 523-1575. I will give you a hand.


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## Russell1200

When you go for training you need to have worked through whatever tutorials, etc. they give you and be halfway conversant with basics. Otherwise you are trying to learn to much too quickly.

I am taking Accubid training. But I went through the tutorial and did some practice with and without their live count before hand. That way I could focus on what (for me) wound up being the trickier issues.

Having someone walk you through even a small estimate will help a lot. I would take the Chief up on his very generous offer.


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## SoSpec

I have been using ACCUBID for many years and with my previous knowledge of other systems, I am "self taught". I occasionally get correspondence from Accubid about classes they are having when they come to Atlanta, but who can afford $2695 for a class.


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## Russell1200

$2695? I wonder which class it is. I have two series of classes and they don't cost that much.

If you have been using them that long, I suspect the standard classes would not have enough information to be of use to you.

I am not sure what they do with the more advanced users. The online training is one on one, so obviously there is a lot of flexibility: they can spend time on the areas you are having issues with.


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## SoSpec

This was for a class in Atlanta, not a one on one.


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## BDB

chiefestimator said:


> BDB - Call me @ 805 523-1575. I will give you a hand.


Chief, thanks for the offer, It may be a day or 2 before I can give ya a call, do I just ask for chief? So did you go to a training class? How long did t take you to get comfortable with it?


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## chiefestimator

BDB said:


> Chief, thanks for the offer, It may be a day or 2 before I can give ya a call, do I just ask for chief? So did you go to a training class? How long did t take you to get comfortable with it?


I got comfortable with the program in about 4 hours. I am however, at one with the machine. I have been using computers since before the Apple II. 

I can teach you the concepts of using the program in about an hour. After that, as with every program out there, you have to get familiar with the data base. Where is the 3/4" pvc coated lb? I will give you a quick run thru the libraries that come with the program.

Depending on the size and types of projects you bid, it will take you 4 to 10 estimates to be comfortable with the program.


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## SoSpec

Back in the 80's I used a program from MC2 that ran on an IBM mainframe computer. Once you had all of your data in, you pushed a "calculate" button and you could leave for the rest of the day. A $6,000,000 project I did took the computer 8 hours to calculate. New systems calculate as you go, but you will notice everytime you enter something you will get a slight little hesitation as it does the calculation. I am presently doing a project that has 32 different breakdowns, as you enter more and more data that hesitation becomes greater. I am using ACCUBID, do you users of ConEst see the same hesitation? Of course the end product is well worth the small inconvenience. I could break the job down into a series of smaller jobs on different estimates, but I like to keep the job as one, just using different areas and bid items.


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## chiefestimator

Hey SoSpec - I didn't think there were any estimators left that were old enough to have used a mainframe. I never used one directly. My very first estimating gig was with a company that connected to a mainfraime thru a teletype using the Estimation system. We had to put a 10 didgit code on each takeoff item. The receptionist would type it into the teletype, creating a punch tape. The punch tape would then be fed into the machine and sent to Denver, Depending on the priority we assigned, we would get the estimate back in 2 to 24 hours.

In regards to your speed question, we get the slight hestitation upon each entry, but it does not get longer. It is always a fraction of a second. What does get longer on a large estimate is a recalc, which you generally do just before finalizing a project to make sure you have all the latest prices in your estimate. With ConEst, that time is cut down a significant amount if you have 2GB of memory or more. The most recent very large project was about 700 pages of takeoff, and took about 20 seconds to recalc.


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## 3rdgeneration

Not to get of topic but I have been an estimator for 15 plus years now and I am in a terrible slump in estimating jobs and losing money after the job is done. We use Accubid for our pricing and I am somewhat lukewarm on the whole program. It may be a great program but I really am not sure because I have never used any other program that I can compare it to.

Anyway, lately I have been missing badly on my material totals. The last few jobs we bid and got I was approximately 20-25% to low on my material. The wire pricing was correct but it seems I just don't pick up alot of misc items like reducing washers, unistrut, lug bolts etc.. Granted these items aren't very pricey but we know they do add up. I guess my question is just how in detail do you guys do an estimate?? For example if you are doing a 180,000 sq ft school renovation, do you sit and measure the length of every branch circuit feed to every receptacle and switch ?? Right now I add all my receptacles and switches and figure on average each receptacle will have 25' of c/w feeding it. The same for lights, I do not take time and draw out each homerun or branch circuit that will feed every circuit for every light, I simply just add the total of fixtures and roughly estimate how the Br. circuits will run. In the past when there were numerous jobs being bid I picked up lots of "shortcuts" to estimate jobs and I'm wondering now if these shortcuts are biting me in the butt now.

On average a 100,000 sq ft brand new school takes me around a week to take off and load into Accubid. Does that sound like on average to short of time to do a quality estimate?? 

On Accubid, again I really don't seem to pick up many material items going back to reducing washers, unistrut etc...for example on a 100,000 sq ft brand new school I will only end up with approx 60-70 different material items when we all know that to do a job that size I should have well over 200 different items figured. I don't know if it's Accubid that isn't giving me the numbers of items I am looking for or if it's user error instead.

I have thrown alot out there for the masses to read, any input is appreciated!!!


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## dawgs

If you are consistently 20-25% low on your materials you can mark them up at the end of your estimate. Do you use a material pricing service with accu-bid? Do you send your materials for quote sometimes to check your suppliers pricing versus your estimate? You may need to check some of the assemblies and see if they are complete with all the hardware needed to complete the task. By the way I use vision bid manager, so I dont have experience with accu-bid.


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## chiefestimator

My first thought is what changed? I gather from your statement that only recently did you start losing money on material. Analyze any changes to the way you estimate and price materials.

Second, does your company have a job costing system? Can you compare the quantities in your estimates to the actual materials used? You definitely need to do this before blaming miscellaneous materials. 

Third is theft, which is on the rise. I recently worked with an insurance company to determine the amounts of material that should have been used on a project. Somehow, a company allowed over 10,000 feet of #10 MC to be shipped to a project that had less than 1,000 feet on the plans.

Regarding measuring versus averaging branch, I have mixed feelings. I was trained on the west coast, where every project is engineered with the branch conduit shown. We were required to measure every bit of it. As my career progressed, I got involved with large tenant work projects in high rise buildings. Many of these were “unit” priced, requiring an average amount of branch conduit to be included with each outlet. This was good for the tenant work, but it did not work well for other types of projects, such as the schools you mentioned. 

After starting an estimating firm, I began to get east coast projects, which are generally not engineered with the branch shown. I wanted some advice on to handle this, so I called George Hauge, the owner of ConEst, who is an east coast trained estimator. His method involved drawing in and measuring the homeruns. The branch for the outlets is then averaged, with the length determined by the layout of the project.

Your miscellaneous material markup is completely dependent on you estimating system’s database. Some databases have very simple assemblies, such as a receptacle with a box, ring, device and plate. Others include much more, such as wirenuts, supports and ground pigtails. In the time before computers, our assemblies were simple, and we used a 5% miscellaneous material markup on commercial projects. Industrial projects will require a larger markup. The database I use now has very extensive assemblies, so we have cut our miscellaneous markup down to 2%.

The time required to estimate a school should average less than 3 hours per electrical plan sheet. This is a little higher than other types of commercial work because the low voltage pages usually have 5 or 6 systems stuffed into them. If it is a large project with over 20 plan sheets, the time per sheet should start going down.


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## Russell1200

Generally the pricing does not come from the estimating software, but from a pricing service or the material distributor. The default material pricing (at least in the case of Accubid) is high. They presume that if you are using the default pricing you are in the very early stages and still practicing with the program and getting up to speed.

Some materials have climbed back up recently in price. You may want to update your pricing more frequently. I know of one company that stuck with the original pricing from when they first got the program and never changed their pricing -they were McCormick users: but the program makes no difference - within only a couple of years they were getting killed on pricing.

The next thing to look at is cost shifting. A very common problem if project management is a separate function from the estimating side. Go back through the losing project's invoices and see just what exactly was billed to them and see if the sequencing makes sense. If your work load has slowed up a little, what you will see is that a lot of material was bought early in the project that rightfully belonged to an earlier project - but when no work came in behind the current job to continue the cost shifting project, the job began to "fade". Usually this causes a collapse in numbers at the start of a company's revenue downturn.

Theft as mentioned above, theft can be an enormous problem. One person can steel an amazing amount of materials. But people do no suddenly "learn" to steel. With enough data you can usually pin point or narrow down where the loses are coming from.

A second factor would be a change in crew skill level. But 25% is a big number. Usually the differential there is as much (or more) time, rather than the material itself.

Finally, there is no way washers, etc. add up to 25%. It will vary with the program but 2% is a much more reasonable figure. If your "assumptions" worked reasonably well in the past it is not that likely that they would suddenly come up consistently wrong in one direction. The law of compensating errors would pretty much have it falling on both sides of the cost pattern.

So to summarize, your pricing being out of date, is by far the most likely problem that relates to the estimating program. But the pricing itself is not a function of the program, but the input into the program. But once you go through the invoices, and compare pricing to rule that out (or confirm it), I would look elsewhere besides the estimating program.


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## BDB

3rdgeneration said:


> For example if you are doing a 180,000 sq ft school renovation, do you sit and measure the length of every branch circuit feed to every receptacle and switch ??


This is how I take a job off. I roll every conduit run and circuit, from home runs to to each branch.




3rdgeneration said:


> Right now I add all my receptacles and switches and figure on average each receptacle will have 25' of c/w feeding it. The same for lights,


This is where I am having trouble with ConEst (and I figure all the systems do this as well). It is set up for this type of takeoff( average) but I had never heard of this method until the guy doing my online training told me about it, I am still not to sure about it. I am trying to figure out how to use Con Est with the way I take a job off (which is rolling off every run and NOT doing average)


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## The Estimator

The major software companies Accubid, Conest, and Mccormick now have some form of sure count software as an optional upgrade. McCormick uses On Screen Takeoff,
which has been used by general contractors for a long time.and is a finished product not a beta. No program will count every symbol with 100% accuracy. The advantage of these programs is getting the drawings by the internet and doing your takeoff on screen with out the cost of printing the drawings.


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## SoSpec

I have "played" with Sure Count. Maybe I did not take enough time to learn it or I was just so easily swayed, but my experience was that by the time it took to "set up" the symbols for it to count, I could have finished my takeoff. I now get 90% of the drawings sent to me by my clients by e-mail, can't remember the last time someone actually shipped a set of drawings to me.


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