# Journeyman without textbooks?



## JonnDohh (May 31, 2019)

Are there states where I can achieve Journeyman certification without textbooks? I am hoping there is somewhere where any combination of OJT, hands-on-learning, or skills/knowledge testing can get me to the next level. 



I enjoy working in the trade very much. I do not like the school I go to at all. 



I do fine on tests. I like to work with my hands and learn by doing. I don't like textbook style learning. 



I don't really like the state I live in and will probably move soon anyway.


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## nrp3 (Jan 24, 2009)

I'll think you'll find that either you have no licensing, or they will require some form of formal education that goes along with it. Much of it is code related and you just find a way to get through it. As you have figured out most of the relevant learning like most things in life is hands on. It just allows you to get ready to take the exam. They may accept hours that you have accumulated provided you have documentation to prove it, but schooling is hard to avoid. I think here there is one provider that has gotten approval for online schooling you can do at home.


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## canbug (Dec 31, 2015)

If you are going to be an electrician, you will need textbooks. We didn't get our tickets at the bottom of a Cracker Jack box, we earned it which requires some schooling and a lot of tests to show you understand how this works and you are competent in your job. That equals safety. I know you may be able to "wire" something but do are you able to explain to someone or yourself "why" you did it that way?


Tim.


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## Wirenuting (Sep 12, 2010)

Don't like school, don't like your state, don't like textbooks.

Join the Navy... 
You might not like it, but you'll have lots of OJT working with your hands chipping the rust and painting things gray.
The world is 78% water and you'll have the opportunity to experience the adventure.
And you won't have to worry about hay fever.


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## 99cents (Aug 20, 2012)

You need a combination of theory and job skills. Suck it up.


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## just the cowboy (Sep 4, 2013)

You will never stop book learning in this trade if you want to be good........

The best people on here can tell you things that come from books, of all kinds ( manuals, instructions, code books, white papers, on and on and on) and most of it off the top of their head. I have been in the trade for over 40 years and am in the process of learning cyber-security, Radio telemetry and Server setup at one time and I am 61 years old. 

SO GET LEARNING

Cowboy


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## jarrydee (Aug 24, 2019)

I started in 1998. back then, school was a waste of time. It did not count towards your hours. I stopped working in the trade in 2004 for over a decade. I was 6 months short of my hours to test. In 2018 I got back into the trade and got the 6 months I needed, but I was worried I would not be approved for the test, because since I had been gone, schooling had become a requirement. For some reason, I got lucky and after sending in proof of my hours, I got approved and passed my test. I was VERY worried about not being approved because I missed out on the schooling. I kinda wish It was required back when I started, it is always great to learn more.


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

JonnDohh said:


> Are there states where I can achieve Journeyman certification without textbooks? I am hoping there is somewhere where any combination of OJT, hands-on-learning, or skills/knowledge testing can get me to the next level.
> 
> I enjoy working in the trade very much. I do not like the school I go to at all.
> 
> ...


Where in Maryland? Read, buy books improve your lot in life. Education won't hurt you.


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## Southeast Power (Jan 18, 2009)

JonnDohh said:


> Are there states where I can achieve Journeyman certification without textbooks? I am hoping there is somewhere where any combination of OJT, hands-on-learning, or skills/knowledge testing can get me to the next level.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Sorry, the answer is no.
Our apprentices have to have 2000 hours classroom instruction and 10,000 hours of OJT. 
If you can’t do that.
look into:
Iron worker
Roofer
Block mason
Concrete finisher
Logging
Commercial fishing


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## Mulder (Sep 11, 2010)

No schooling is needed in Wisconsin. All that is needed to qualify for the journeyman's exam is 4 years and 8000 hours experience.


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## joebanana (Dec 21, 2010)

It's easier to learn theory by reading, than by mistake. The NEC is pretty much useless without an understanding of even basic theory. Books are your friend, your goto, your argument settler.


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## varmit (Apr 19, 2009)

The ability to read and comprehend detailed instructions and manuals is the most important skill a person in any profession can process. 

If a person is to do some task that they have never done before, it would be very wise to do some reading and research to learn some of the details before commencing. [ As an example, if you were given the job to install a $5000 VFD, you would not just guess at it and hope it worked.] Books are a very helpful tool.


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## eddy current (Feb 28, 2009)

In Canada, if you can prove you have enough experience working in electrical ( approx 5 years) you can write the red seal licence but there is no way you would pass without having very good knowledge of our codes and how to navigate our code book.


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## John Valdes (May 17, 2007)

Mulder said:


> No schooling is needed in Wisconsin. All that is needed to qualify for the journeyman's exam is 4 years and 8000 hours experience.


I think its the same here. But we all still had to take the test. Going into the exam with no book learning will not turn out well.
I mean the code book is a book.



JonnDohh said:


> I do fine on tests. I like to work with my hands and learn by doing. I don't like textbook style learning.


How do you think you will do going into the exam without a code book.
You gotta use books man. For almost anything that will set your apart from the guys that know how to pull wire and bend pipe but know nothing else.
Actually great pipe benders use a book. To at least learn how.

I cannot tell you how many guys have told me they could pass the test with no exam prep.
Funny thing is, they never mention the test again. 
To be a good electrician you gotta learn how. OTJT is great. But what happens when a problem needs to be solved? Voltage drop? Ect......


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## MotoGP1199 (Aug 11, 2014)

I use my code book every so often but I could never imagine trying to pass the test without it. Also when I went to take my test I read the code book from front to back and learned soooooo much. There is a lot of stuff in there that I will never touch but needed to know for the test and there was a lot of stuff that I learned and use all the time. So much I learned that I could do that I didn't know was code compliant that saves me time and money and other things I "Heard" and realized it wasn't completely correct the way it was explained to me. My code book now rides in the van and helps a lot with some inspectors. Inspectors all seem to know code, problem is I don't know what code book their reading from because it sure isn't from the NEC all the time, lol.


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## jarrydee (Aug 24, 2019)

I took a prep class after I failed my first time. When I went back in to take the test, I had my 60 questions answered that I needed to pass all done without even opening my code book. Which then gave me time to answer the questions that I needed my book for. I finished with an hour and a half left on the clock. You WILL NEED to know how to navigate that code book. No way around it, unless you get lucky like I did. I KNEW I had passed when I seen that 60 questions were answered without opening my book. I would NOT suggest you go into it that way. be prepared. I studied all kinds of books and video lessons, took practice tests online, spent months on calculations. Just be as prepared as you can


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## John Valdes (May 17, 2007)

jarrydee said:


> I took a prep class after I failed my first time. When I went back in to take the test, I had my 60 questions answered that I needed to pass all done without even opening my code book. Which then gave me time to answer the questions that I needed my book for. I finished with an hour and a half left on the clock. You WILL NEED to know how to navigate that code book. No way around it, unless you get lucky like I did. I KNEW I had passed when I seen that 60 questions were answered without opening my book. I would NOT suggest you go into it that way. be prepared. I studied all kinds of books and video lessons, took practice tests online, spent months on calculations. Just be as prepared as you can


That was good luck getting the same test. But at least you were prepared and that is paramount!
It took a 12 week code course. I took the exam the weekend after the class ended and 12 weeks of intense study.
Funny part is I did the best on calcs and closed book. ( I admit I did some guessing as to not leave any unanswered questions). I did terrible on the open book part. But I did pass on the first try and I thank my instructor and Tom Henry's code class and prep materials.


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## Bird dog (Oct 27, 2015)

Some people think they can force feed themselves & regurgitate it on a test. That isn't happening most likely. Part of my strategy was get a hotel the night before in the place they're giving the test (it was a two hour drive for me).


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## John Valdes (May 17, 2007)

I also had a 2 plus hour drive and did drive! Stupid. I should have got a room too Dog. 
I almost slammed into deer on the way. Big buck. 

I know a guy that says he passed without study. He went to a weekend crash prep seminar and that was all he needed. Holt I think?
He was much smarter than me I guess.


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## Bird dog (Oct 27, 2015)

John Valdes said:


> I also had a 2 plus hour drive and did drive! Stupid. I should have got a room too Dog.
> I almost slammed into deer on the way. Big buck.


With your cooking skills, it may have been a plus. :biggrin:




John Valdes said:


> I know a guy that says he passed without study. He went to a weekend crash prep seminar and that was all he needed. Holt I think?
> He was much smarter than me I guess.


The guy was smarter than me no doubt.


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## jarrydee (Aug 24, 2019)

John Valdes said:


> That was good luck getting the same test. But at least you were prepared and that is paramount!
> It took a 12 week code course. I took the exam the weekend after the class ended and 12 weeks of intense study.
> Funny part is I did the best on calcs and closed book. ( I admit I did some guessing as to not leave any unanswered questions). I did terrible on the open book part. But I did pass on the first try and I thank my instructor and Tom Henry's code class and prep materials.


I did not get the same test. It was the prep course I took. They pounded 174 "MAIN" questions into your head. By memorizing them, I did not even need to open my code book. My second test was actually not even close to my first. Totally different


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## phamousgrey (Mar 22, 2018)

jarrydee said:


> I started in 1998. back then, school was a waste of time. It did not count towards your hours. I stopped working in the trade in 2004 for over a decade. I was 6 months short of my hours to test. In 2018 I got back into the trade and got the 6 months I needed, but I was worried I would not be approved for the test, because since I had been gone, schooling had become a requirement. For some reason, I got lucky and after sending in proof of my hours, I got approved and passed my test. I was VERY worried about not being approved because I missed out on the schooling. I kinda wish It was required back when I started, it is always great to learn more.



you sound like a "usa" person, regardless,.. that amount of time you'd have definately failed the test at that time. no doubt about it.


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## phamousgrey (Mar 22, 2018)

unfortunately i cant tell you what you should know, i have no idea what the "americans" think is relavant.


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## manchestersparky (Mar 25, 2007)

JonnDohh said:


> Are there states where I can achieve Journeyman certification without textbooks? I am hoping there is somewhere where any combination of OJT, hands-on-learning, or skills/knowledge testing can get me to the next level.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


There are counties that only require a letter from the master verifying 4 years of work experience to take the J-mans test. Research the various jurisdictions (Montgomery County is one of them)

You can always skip the J-mans test / license and go straight for the Masters License as well. Just need a letter(s) from the master(s) verifying 7 years experience. ( This is what I did - I never held a J-Mans license , figured if I'm sitting for a test might as well go all the way)


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## Tonedeaf (Nov 26, 2012)

you can become a journeyman without school in phila nj and DEL if you get your hours and have a master electrician sign for you.......*you'll never pass a master electrician's test without books.*

in many municipalities PA.....you can call yourself a Journeyman or a Master Electrician....they have no requirements other than you having a name


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## Superman (Mar 19, 2019)

The written test is important part making sure you have at least a basic understanding using the NEC.


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