# drill & tap



## Chris Kennedy (Nov 19, 2007)

paul d. said:


> is it just me or does it seem to you guys that most so- called electricians cant drill & tap a hole with out breaking the tap? i'm talking mild steel not stainless. :001_huh: ( holiday rant )


What size threads and what type of taps are you having problems with?


----------



## JohnJ0906 (Jan 22, 2007)

paul d. said:


> is it just me or does it seem to you guys that most so- called electricians cant drill & tap a hole with out breaking the tap? i'm talking mild steel not stainless. :001_huh: ( holiday rant )


I admit to breaking off the 6-32 portion of my 6-in-one several times. At least I can replace just the tap portion.


----------



## EBFD6 (Aug 17, 2008)

We have helpers that can't even drill the hole without breaking a bit, never mind breaking taps. They think you need to spin the bit as fast as humanly possible and push with everything you've got and then wonder why they only get a couple holes out of each bit before it's dull! WTF


----------



## Bob Badger (Apr 19, 2009)

Unless your used to tapping your going to break taps, everyone just tries to muscle them through without finesse until they have leaned the hard way.

This stuff it a real tap saver


----------



## paul d. (Jul 13, 2008)

Chris Kennedy said:


> What size threads and what type of taps are you having problems with?


 me???? i 'm not having the trouble. i KNOW how. lots of other people dont. but i guess lots of guys dont have exp. doing it . but if they dont know how, JUST TELL ME!!!. be glad to show em. oh well.


----------



## randomkiller (Sep 28, 2007)

Back in 8th grade shop class I was taught how to use a tap and die set. I wonder if that is one of the things that isn't taught any longer. The last apprentices we have I feel need to be reminded to do the paperwork before leaving the porta-johns, they seem to know nothing.


----------



## paul d. (Jul 13, 2008)

being a good mechanic is part of being a good electrician. kids dont use tools no more growing up like working on bicycles, lawnmowers, and such. but a 35 y.o. !!!!????? oh well. reckon everybody cant be good as me. :whistling2: ( BIG pork chops on the grill today ! ) you guys have a good Memorial Day !


----------



## drsparky (Nov 13, 2008)

I haven't really notice a problem, no I haven't had to order many extra. Maybe you have a training problem.


----------



## leland (Dec 28, 2007)

drsparky said:


> I haven't really notice a problem, no I haven't had to order many extra. Maybe you have a training problem.



Perhaps you work alone.:laughing: seriously,your location? I'm sure the young ones have more mechanical aptitude by 10 yrs than others at 40. Lots of farms up there. right?

I get the ones that can't read a tape and do all basic math on the cell calculator.

Actually had 1 kid, put a sawzall blade in my hole shooter and could'nt figure out how to get it to stop spinning.:laughing:


----------



## drsparky (Nov 13, 2008)

leland said:


> Perhaps you work alone.:laughing: seriously,your location?
> 
> I get the ones that can't read a tape and do all basic math on the cell *calculator*.


Calculator, that’s just a fad. I like to have fun at the engineering meetings, I whip my side rule, and most of the young engineers don’t recognize it and the old ones want to play with it for old time sake. 

I don't see a lot of apprentices up here; they are too far away from school. The few I did get were waiting for school to start so yes they were green. Last big job we had about a 60 to 1 journeyman to apprentice ratio.


----------



## leland (Dec 28, 2007)

Dads from Merrill,so I learned 'Yankee ingenuity' at an early age.:thumbsup:

Made the apprentice ship a bit easier.

60 to 1!! wow you were busy! On time and on budget?


----------



## nick (Feb 14, 2008)

Well first they have a attitude that they dont need you to tell them how or they dont want you to know they dont ! 

Its life were old there young ! But they can use a computer wow !

We tuned up and changed our own oil in our cars . fixed our radios and TV sets .
We pulled them big V 8 motors out of our cars and rebuilt them in the backyard ,we kinda installed a few transmissions too ! lots of fun 

Each year my dad took us to the junk yard to get our car for the year ! We would go to the farmers market and buy 4 broken lawnmowers for one dollar each the ones that had the horizontal rotating blades motor on top the old clinton type broken!! 
Put all the good parts on one mower for our new lawnmower that year . never called or used a mechanic or and repairman or electrician at our house ever . we even built our own house ! Take care its all new to me .


----------



## iaov (Apr 14, 2008)

paul d. said:


> is it just me or does it seem to you guys that most so- called electricians cant drill & tap a hole with out breaking the tap? i'm talking mild steel not stainless. :001_huh: ( holiday rant )


I guess I'm not most electricians. I'm very good at drilling and tapping. I learned a long time ago what a PITA it is to break a tap!


----------



## mattsilkwood (Sep 21, 2008)

i know what youre saying. some of these kids are pretty bad. i realize we were all green once but i dont think i was ever that green. dad had me working in his shop changing alternators and water pumps when i was 10. but i guess things were different back then.


----------



## nick (Feb 14, 2008)

mattsilkwood said:


> i know what youre saying. some of these kids are pretty bad. i realize we were all green once but i dont think i was ever that green. dad had me working in his shop changing alternators and water pumps when i was 10. but i guess things were different back then.



Well its not the kids today its how they our bought up not doing or knowing how . My company has a large number of employees and we see it a different way then most Electrical contractors do . Meaning lots of workers to pick from .

Most of our jobs have 150 electricians on them i get at least 18 or so on my crew , i kinda see one good app out of ten each year . That meaning comes to work everyday goes to app trade school gets good grades and works like a dog and has common sense ! 
Meaning he or she will stay in the trade and likes to work electrical .
Thats rare today !!! Take care there is good kids out there you just have to look . If they want to learn ill teach if they dont they go fast .Best to ya


----------



## Noe (Apr 7, 2009)

I understand that they are green, I can even get that they were not taught how to do some stuff, like do not touch a live circuit...they have to be taught these things. What gets me is that they ask for higher pay or more beni's when they know they do not know much.


----------



## paul d. (Jul 13, 2008)

AND to throw a little blame around, its up to the management to supply the right size drill bit for the tap. and some tap majic, or rapid-tap or at least get some cutting oil.


----------



## Kevin J (Dec 11, 2008)

Like RK said, I'm still pretty young compared to some on here, but going through school, I had great vocational classes. Drilling and tapping was a basic skill to learn. Nowadays, the shop classes here have been replaced with "horticulture and floral" classes. What a waste.


----------



## mattsilkwood (Sep 21, 2008)

i remember when i was just about to turn 16 i came home from school one friday i came home and there was an old cougar sitting in the driveway. i go in the house and dad asked if i liked my car. wow it was like the best car ever in my eyes. then he said good you can start rebuilding the engine tommorrow, ill buy the parts and you can work it off in the shop:001_huh:


----------



## leland (Dec 28, 2007)

Kevin J said:


> Like RK said, I'm still pretty young compared to some on here, but going through school, I had great vocational classes. Drilling and tapping was a basic skill to learn. Nowadays, the shop classes here have been replaced with "horticulture and floral" classes. What a waste.



Easy there 'cowboy'! I got a degree in Ornamental horticulture (landscape construction/ design) just could'nt make it with the winters off.
Still got some very well off friends in their own business doing it.Big money.

But again can't teach common sense,but the good ones have it and don't know it. You must bring it out in them.


----------



## drsparky (Nov 13, 2008)

leland said:


> Dads from Merrill,so I learned 'Yankee ingenuity' at an early age.:thumbsup:
> 
> Made the apprentice ship a bit easier.
> 
> 60 to 1!! wow you were busy! On time and on budget?


All the overtime you could stand, saved a lot of money, had travelers from as far a Detroit. Bid work was under budget, I stuck around and did a lot of change orders, both T&M nte and fixed bids. When I sent the last of the equipment back there were a lot of new in the package taps, we really didn't break many.


----------



## Kevin J (Dec 11, 2008)

leland said:


> Easy there 'cowboy'! I got a degree in Ornamental horticulture (landscape construction/ design) just could'nt make it with the winters off.
> Still got some very well off friends in their own business doing it.Big money.
> 
> But again can't teach common sense,but the good ones have it and don't know it. You must bring it out in them.



Not meaning to offend!! Actually, the programs I went through was Agriculture Mechanics,(small emphasis on agriculture, big emphasis on mechanics) and it was a good all around program. The problem now is that they got rid of the mechanics end of the program after some of the instructors retired.


----------



## MDShunk (Jan 7, 2007)

Kevin J said:


> Like RK said, I'm still pretty young compared to some on here, but going through school, I had great vocational classes. Drilling and tapping was a basic skill to learn. Nowadays, the shop classes here have been replaced with "horticulture and floral" classes. What a waste.


My oldest son's football coach (a mountain of a man) is also the home economics teacher at his high school. That strikes a funny bone with me, but the football team eats good. :laughing:


----------



## Kevin J (Dec 11, 2008)

MDShunk said:


> My oldest son's football coach (a mountain of a man) is also the home economics teacher at his high school. That strikes a funny bone with me, but the football team eats good. :laughing:


Ahem, in my school district in the 7th grade, it was a requirement to take home economics. So, needless to say, I could at one time make a pillow, run a sewing machine, and knew what a backstitch was.:thumbup:


----------



## kbsparky (Sep 20, 2007)

Are you using these?


----------



## MDShunk (Jan 7, 2007)

kbsparky said:


> Are you using these?


I love those, but they will absolutely snap off if you're doing anything much thicker than a 4-square There's not enough "drill" before they start to "tap". If you try to use a DTAP on a steel column, for instance, the tap will catch and start cramming the thing through before the drill bit is all the way drilled, and it will snap right off. The DTAP is the cat's pajamas for sheet metal.


----------



## mattsilkwood (Sep 21, 2008)

kbsparky said:


> Are you using these?


i love em but i usually drill em first then i use em in my 10n1. and dont let the cubs use em


----------



## randomkiller (Sep 28, 2007)

MDShunk said:


> My oldest son's football coach (a mountain of a man) is also the home economics teacher at his high school. That strikes a funny bone with me, but the football team eats good. :laughing:


All the guys in Mechdvr's family look like the Dallas defensive line and I have seen everyone of them in an apron at home cooking. These guys are those old school Sicilians that make killer pasta sauce and unbelievable meat dishes. They remind you of the big boys in Bronx Tale or Goodfellas.


----------



## electricalperson (Jan 11, 2008)

i break taps all the time.

i broke all the taps i had that marc posted. note to self: dont use it to drill 2 inch thick steel


----------



## randomkiller (Sep 28, 2007)

electricalperson said:


> i break taps all the time.
> 
> i broke all the taps i had that marc posted. note to self: dont use it to drill 2 inch thick steel


I have broken a ton of easy outs but can't remember the last tap I have snapped off.


----------



## electricalperson (Jan 11, 2008)

randomkiller said:


> I have broken a ton of easy outs but can't remember the last tap I have snapped off.


 i need to use oil on my taps


----------



## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

EBFD6 said:


> We have helpers that can't even drill the hole without breaking a bit, never mind breaking taps. They think you need to spin the bit as fast as humanly possible and push with everything you've got and then wonder why they only get a couple holes out of each bit before it's dull! WTF


 
Time to educate. After all the student can only put into practice what he has been taught.


----------



## leland (Dec 28, 2007)

randomkiller said:


> I have broken a ton of easy outs but can't remember the last tap I have snapped off.



Easy outs-- Thats a key less chuck right?:laughing: Oh the ones to take out the broken taps..now I see.:thumbup:



(no offense taken Kevin, no room here for 'glass chins'  )


----------



## Toronto Sparky (Apr 12, 2009)

I put the tap in my cordless with the clutch fairly low using nolox (anti-oxi) as lube. 
I rarely break a tap even when tapping beams.


----------



## electricalperson (Jan 11, 2008)

i had a 1/4-20 tap break when i was using it by hand. i was tapping a steel beam. i like to thread screws into the beam and but a nut and lockwasher on the back for bonding. lets see how many people say that threading isnt needed :thumbsup:


----------

