# A Turn of Roles



## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

We are on a job, were we are the only union shop, for some reason the open shop mechanical contractor has decided to ride my employees hard and screwing with them constantly, to the point were a few of the men are ready to go to dukes with these fools. Myself I am going to the GC.
In 42 years I have never seen open shop men trying to start trouble. I am thinking a call to the Sheet Metal Workers hall for a little help might be in order.

So for those of you I told this never happens my apologies. Just goes to show there are A-holes in both teams.


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## jbfan (Jan 22, 2007)

I hope the GC backs you!

Open or Union, there is no reason to ride another trade, when we all want the same thing.

Make our money, and go home safe.


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

brian john said:


> We are on a job, were we are the only union shop, for some reason the open shop mechanical contractor has decided to ride my employees hard and screwing with them constantly, to the point were a few of the men are ready to go to dukes with these fools. Myself I am going to the GC.
> In 42 years I have never seen open shop men trying to start trouble. I am thinking a call to the Sheet Metal Workers hall for a little help might be in order.
> 
> So for those of you I told this never happens my apologies. Just goes to show there are A-holes in both teams.


Geeez What a pain you would think that the mechanical contractor would rather just get the work done and make a profit instead of causing trouble on the job site and i really don't see why the GC would put up with that kind of crap..:no:


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

Nice machine Brian.....:thumbsup:

Maybe you could use that to take care of those Mechanical contractors that are giving you a hard time..:whistling2::laughing:


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## troublemaker1701 (Aug 11, 2011)

Time for some parking lot justice.


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

troublemaker1701 said:


> Time for some parking lot justice.


 
I would NEVER do that, that is what thugs resort to. I have had my union trucks messed with by other union members as they thought we were open shop, because I refuse to plaster my trucks with IBEW emblems.

I'll go through the proper channels or my guys will kick butt.:laughing:


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## retiredsparktech (Mar 8, 2011)

brian john said:


> I would NEVER do that, that is what thugs resort to. I have had my union trucks messed with by other union members as they thought we were open shop, because I refuse to plaster my trucks with IBEW emblems.
> 
> All you need is one small one, stuck on the corner of the rear window. That's not plastering IMO.


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

retiredsparktech said:


> brian john said:
> 
> 
> > I would NEVER do that, that is what thugs resort to. I have had my union trucks messed with by other union members as they thought we were open shop, because I refuse to plaster my trucks with IBEW emblems.
> ...


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## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

brian john said:


> We are on a job, were we are the only union shop, for some reason the open shop mechanical contractor has decided to ride my employees hard and screwing with them constantly, to the point were a few of the men are ready to go to dukes with these fools. Myself I am going to the GC.
> In 42 years I have never seen open shop men trying to start trouble. I am thinking a call to the Sheet Metal Workers hall for a little help might be in order.
> 
> So for those of you I told this never happens my apologies. Just goes to show there are A-holes in both teams.


 
can you be specific as to just what the _'beef'_ is Brian?

~CS~


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

The feel we are 

Over paid
Lazy
Starting to early, we start at 6:00 their boss won’t let them start till 7:00.
Dislike that we have company trucks, they drive their own.

Basically they are being asses and constantly taunting the men, trying to start trouble getting the other trades to hassle us.

Just being general PIA's


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## RIVETER (Sep 26, 2009)

brian john said:


> We are on a job, were we are the only union shop, for some reason the open shop mechanical contractor has decided to ride my employees hard and screwing with them constantly, to the point were a few of the men are ready to go to dukes with these fools. Myself I am going to the GC.
> In 42 years I have never seen open shop men trying to start trouble. I am thinking a call to the Sheet Metal Workers hall for a little help might be in order.
> 
> So for those of you I told this never happens my apologies. Just goes to show there are A-holes in both teams.


"Ride" your guys in what way?


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

RIVETER said:


> "Ride" your guys in what way?


See above, I am waiting for a meeting to see if it has escalated to any issues regarding material, installed equipment or vehicles. 

The issue is something that starts out slow, such as constantly hassling workers sooner or later will turn nastier.


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## RIVETER (Sep 26, 2009)

brian john said:


> See above, I am waiting for a meeting to see if it has escalated to any issues regarding material, installed equipment or vehicles.
> 
> The issue is something that starts out slow, such as constantly hassling workers sooner or later will turn nastier.


I am thinking that you wanted me to go to the post #10. I did. I would assume that you got the job because your bid was better than the "other" guy. If there is a combination of union...non...on the job there can always be a possibility of negative interaction. If your guys are doing their job in a professional manner, you...they, should not have to put up with it. I suppose that you, as the boss are in a bind and will have to figure a way that the guys can coexist.Good luck. It's rough at the top.


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## MDShunk (Jan 7, 2007)

I'm wondering, in the back of my mind, if this mechanical contractor didn't also bid the electrical portion and got a sore ass about getting beat out.


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

MDShunk said:


> I'm wondering, in the back of my mind, if this mechanical contractor didn't also bid the electrical portion and got a sore ass about getting beat out.


Good point many Mechanical Contractors are Electrical Contractors as well.


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## MDShunk (Jan 7, 2007)

HARRY304E said:


> Good point many Mechanical Contractors are Electrical Contractors as well.


Yeah, I mean, it's not unusual for the mechanical contractor to do the HVAC, plumbing, sprinkler, electrical, and whatever all else they are corporately qualified to do.


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## Jlarson (Jun 28, 2009)

MDShunk said:


> I'm wondering, in the back of my mind, if this mechanical contractor didn't also bid the electrical portion and got a sore ass about getting beat out.


I've had that happen. 

The only thing that pisses them off more is when you get them kicked off entirely and take the mechanical work too. :laughing:


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## BBQ (Nov 16, 2010)

retiredsparktech said:


> All you need is one small one, stuck on the corner of the rear window. That's not plastering IMO.


Why does he need any at all?

I don't let the guys put any stickers of any kind on the company trucks.


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## 360max (Jun 10, 2011)

BBQ said:


> Why does he need any at all?
> 
> I don't let the guys put any stickers of any kind on the company trucks.


I'm glad you let them smoke cigs tho :thumbup:


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## BBQ (Nov 16, 2010)

360max said:


> I'm glad you let them smoke cigs tho :thumbup:


Not on the job, what they do while alone in the van is up to them.


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## Loose Neutral (Jun 3, 2009)

Brian, just call up the A team from south east and go up in that mother deep with tons of heat and blast those mo fos. That will teach them.


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## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

brian john said:


> See above, I am waiting for a meeting to see if it has escalated to any issues regarding material, installed equipment or vehicles.
> 
> The issue is something that starts out slow, such as constantly hassling workers sooner or later will turn nastier.


 
well i wish you luck Brian

having recently been in a similar situation where we were being provoked, i simply directed my crew to _not _respond, and if necessary throw their tools in the truck & leave

~CS~


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## Southeast Power (Jan 18, 2009)

brian john said:


> The feel we are
> 
> Over paid
> Lazy
> ...


Kind of like here on the forum..:whistling2:


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## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

jrannis said:


> Kind of like here on the forum..:whistling2:


your _late_.....slacker! ~CS~


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## Southeast Power (Jan 18, 2009)

chicken steve said:


> your _late_.....slacker! ~CS~


I start at 6:30..


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## 360max (Jun 10, 2011)

BBQ said:


> Not on the job, what they do while alone in the van is up to them.


that is fair, very fair.


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## slickvic277 (Feb 5, 2009)

brian john said:


> We are on a job, were we are the only union shop, for some reason the open shop mechanical contractor has decided to ride my employees hard and screwing with them constantly, to the point were a few of the men are ready to go to dukes with these fools. Myself I am going to the GC.
> In 42 years I have never seen open shop men trying to start trouble. I am thinking a call to the Sheet Metal Workers hall for a little help might be in order.
> 
> So for those of you I told this never happens my apologies. Just goes to show there are A-holes in both teams.


Selective memory?????

I get it all the time. Especially in our suburban jurisdiction where unions are looked down on.
Usually I see it with open shop GC's. They have a chip on their shoulder before they even meet the guys because they have to use union labor on a particular job, or a union sub won a bid, or whatever the case may be.

I got it real bad from Verizon's techs. Actually, a fight almost broke out.
Comcast was another one where there guys were ball bags.

There was a non union Iron Workers outfit from Maryland, them guys were looking for trouble. Honestly, this is nothing new.


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## nitro71 (Sep 17, 2009)

I'd set up a security camera and leave one of your trucks right where they can get at it. This is a felony crime to vandalize someones vehicle. As far as the project goes that's kinda out of my league but I'd document everything and take a lot of picutures and call your lawyer.


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## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

slickvic277 said:


> Selective memory?????
> 
> I get it all the time. Especially in our suburban jurisdiction where unions are looked down on.
> Usually I see it with open shop GC's. They have a chip on their shoulder before they even meet the guys because they have to use union labor on a particular job, or a union sub won a bid, or whatever the case may be.
> ...


 
maybe they took the big inflatable rat badly?

~CS~


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## Jbird66 (Oct 26, 2010)

Seems kind of ironic "a turn of roles" and the union guys feelings are hurt. Sounds like the Mech contractor is simply doing what has been done to open shops for years. I have had Union stickers put on my trucks, called names, my work site turned into a junk pile from other trades. I think the simple answer is to just smile and act like nothing happened and go on with your day. I am here to tell you that is what gets under the Union guys skin the most when they mess with us. Please do not understand I have some close friends that are union but by your own comments the Unions are the ones supposed to be initiating this type of behavior and now they do not like it!


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## slickvic277 (Feb 5, 2009)

Jbird66 said:


> Seems kind of ironic "a turn of roles" and the union guys feelings are hurt. Sounds like the Mech contractor is simply doing what has been done to open shops for years. I have had Union stickers put on my trucks, called names, my work site turned into a junk pile from other trades. I think the simple answer is to just smile and act like nothing happened and go on with your day. I am here to tell you that is what gets under the Union guys skin the most when they mess with us. Please do not understand I have some close friends that are union but by your own comments the Unions are the ones supposed to be initiating this type of behavior and now they do not like it!


Since this post makes hardly a lick of sense, I'll decode it using my special decoder ring.

I hate Black people but since I have Black friends I am not racist. 
This forum really, really needs a jerk-off smily.


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## BBQ (Nov 16, 2010)

slickvic277 said:


> Since this post makes hardly a lick of sense,


Actually it makes perfect sense.




> I hate Black people but since I have Black friends I am not racist.


His post is nothing like that at all, you are really reaching today.


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

Jbird66 said:


> Seems kind of ironic "a turn of roles" and the union guys feelings are hurt. Sounds like the Mech contractor is simply doing what has been done to open shops for years. I have had Union stickers put on my trucks, called names, my work site turned into a junk pile from other trades. I think the simple answer is to just smile and act like nothing happened and go on with your day. I am here to tell you that is what gets under the Union guys skin the most when they mess with us. Please do not understand I have some close friends that are union but by your own comments the Unions are the ones supposed to be initiating this type of behavior and now they do not like it!


Acting like an ass and causing trouble is more typically related to open shops exposure to union men. Most jobs I have been on the open shop men lay low. My point is no one open shop or union has a right to screw with anyone over who they work for. Grow up, act like a decent employee and lets get the job done, I have more important things to do.

In 42 years this is the first time I have seen or heard of open shop men hassling union workers. The other way around I do not have enough toes and fingers to count.


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## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

> Grow up, act like a decent employee




grow up and stop using inflatable rats for intimidation, and maybe the _'tude _won't come back upon you.....

~CS~


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## Jbird66 (Oct 26, 2010)

brian john said:


> Acting like an ass and causing trouble is more typically related to open shops exposure to union men. Most jobs I have been on the open shop men lay low. My point is no one open shop or union has a right to screw with anyone over who they work for. Grow up, act like a decent employee and lets get the job done, I have more important things to do.
> 
> In 42 years this is the first time I have seen or heard of open shop men hassling union workers. The other way around I do not have enough toes and fingers to count.


I totally agree about getting the job done but to only complain when the table is turned and you are on the receiving end and not the giving end. Like the title says "a turn of roles." I am just pointing out why do the union workers feel the need to complain when somebody plays the game by the rules that they have set?


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

Jbird66 said:


> I totally agree about getting the job done but to only complain when the table is turned and you are on the receiving end and not the giving end. Like the title says "a turn of roles." I am just pointing out why do the union workers feel the need to complain when somebody plays the game by the rules that they have set?


YOU obviously have never read my union post, I rant on both side of this issue. I worked open shop for 8 years and put up with my fair share of union crap. Not allowed to use the elevator in a 12 story building, someone putting mastic in all our homeruns, been called every by every bad word the union has in their dictionary. As recently as last year a union idiot thinking we were open shop messed with my trucks. Recently had a union official tell one of my employees, what an evil POS I was as an owner.
I refused to picket, I would NEVER work on a job with the rat.
Why do I complain if it affects my bottom line, you affect my money I will be in your face like flies on doodoo.

I firmly believe for the majority of workers the IBEW is the best path.

I firmly believe the best electricians are the ones that work hard and are employed in an open shop or a union shop.

I firmly believe the union does more to hurt themselves, than anything I will ever post and that the union will die if they do not change their methods.


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## Chris1971 (Dec 27, 2010)

I never understood why people (any trade, union or nonunion) use intimidation as a tactic. Can't people concentrate on their work. Get the job done, collect a paycheck and move on to the next project?  I've got better things to do in life than to act like a moron on a job site.


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## erics37 (May 7, 2009)

Sounds like a lot of B.S. going on at those east coast jobs.

F**k all that.

I've never been on a jobsite where the trades didn't get along (beyond the normal day-to-day hiccups of construction matters) unless one party or another was legitimately and genuinely a total ass hat. Which, of course, has nothing to do with union affiliation or lack thereof.


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## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

brian john said:


> I firmly believe the union does more to hurt themselves, than anything I will ever post and that the union will die if they do not change their methods.


 
glad your _aware_ of that Brian

i think most tradesmen aren't about to play the animal farm canard

these folks that are down on your crew bring up the _'rat'_ , and your position is going to be >>>>

_*'representative of the guys who threw the first punch' *_

You thus forfiet any of the above insight representing your union, which touts itself as a democratic org. i.e.- you all _voted _for 'rat'

~CS~


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## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

Chris1971 said:


> I never understood why people (any trade, union or nonunion) use intimidation as a tactic. .


because they can't compete in the capitalist system they support....

~CS~


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## MDShunk (Jan 7, 2007)

I think that the bottom line is that, sometimes, people behave badly. The only thing they seem to have in common is that they're... people. :thumbsup:


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## BBQ (Nov 16, 2010)

erics37 said:


> unless one party or another was legitimately and genuinely a total ass hat. Which, of course, has nothing to do with union affiliation or lack thereof.



:laughing:

Yeah, asshatery crosses all borders and boundaries.


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