# optomotrist?



## ralph (Apr 6, 2008)

I have an optomotrist office to bid. No surgury, just 3 exam rooms and offices. Would anyone think the exam rooms should be hospital grade wire and devices ?
thanks


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## Speedy Petey (Jan 10, 2007)

Absolutely.


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## ralph (Apr 6, 2008)

Speedy Petey said:


> Absolutely.


 I cant remember how long its been since I bought a hosp grad outlet. My supplier quted me 12.00 sound right ?


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## Speedy Petey (Jan 10, 2007)

Sounds high. I remember them being under $10.

Now HCF MC cable, that is a shocker.


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## jwjrw (Jan 14, 2010)

ralph said:


> I cant remember how long its been since I bought a hosp grad outlet. My supplier quted me 12.00 sound right ?


 
I payed 18.79 for tamper proof hospital grade a few months ago.


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## Speedy Petey (Jan 10, 2007)

jwjrw said:


> I payed 18.79 for tamper proof hospital grade a few months ago.


Why TR? Was it in the spec for the job?
Seems kind of silly since kids will never be left along in an environment like that.


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## HAND (Jul 15, 2010)

Well my .02 is the place is not a hospital, but the lighting must be as good as it gets.


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## jwjrw (Jan 14, 2010)

Speedy Petey said:


> Why TR? Was it in the spec for the job?
> Seems kind of silly since kids will never be left along in an environment like that.


 

Yep spec. Was in trailers going to air force base. A few of the rooms were exam rooms and they also had them in the hallways.


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## Speedy Petey (Jan 10, 2007)

HAND said:


> Well my .02 is the place is not a hospital,


What does that have to do with it? 
Are you familiar with Art. 517?


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## Speedy Petey (Jan 10, 2007)

No to get too far off topic,



Speedy Petey said:


> Why TR? Was it in the spec for the job?


:001_unsure:
Well, I just noticed in the 2008: 

_*517.18(C)Pediatric Locations.* Receptacles located within the rooms, bathrooms, playrooms, activity rooms, and patient care areas of pediatric wards shall be listed tamper resistant or shall employ a listed tamper resistant cover._


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## 10492 (Jan 4, 2010)

jwjrw said:


> Yep spec. Was in trailers going to air force base. A few of the rooms were exam rooms and they also had them in the hallways.


They must be going to the Army. :whistling2:

The Air Force would build brand new buildings.:thumbsup:


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## jwjrw (Jan 14, 2010)

Dnkldorf said:


> They must be going to the Army. :whistling2:
> 
> The Air Force would build brand new buildings.:thumbsup:


 


They leased the trailers for 3 years. 14 of them side by side to make one large complex. And although I agree it sounds like the army it wasnt....:laughing:


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## Big City Electrician (Jul 5, 2010)

I have doubts that 517 is applicable to optometrists offices. There was some debate on this at MH:
http://forums.mikeholt.com/showthread.php?p=1224506

In my opinion, optometrists do not provide medical services as they are solely involved in testing eyes and fitting glasses, etc. However, I would consult the AHJ but since they have no financial involvement in the job and are typically intellectually lazy, there's no doubt that they would always require the more costly of any wiring method wen asked.


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## Speedy Petey (Jan 10, 2007)

Big City Electrician said:


> I have doubts that 517 is applicable to optometrists offices. There was some debate on this at MH:
> http://forums.mikeholt.com/showthread.php?p=1224506
> 
> In my opinion, optometrists do not provide medical services as they are solely involved in testing eyes and fitting glasses, etc.......


This is a very interesting point I never considered. I guess I did not make the distinction between optometrist, optician and ophthalmologist, or whatever the heck they are called. :laughing:
I thought an optician was the one who just fits and scripts glasses? I personally think the other two do qualify as health care facilities.


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## knowshorts (Jan 9, 2009)

If you are planning to bid, do you have drawings or specs to bid off of? What do they say about 517? 

On that above link, someone said 12/4 HCF mc is only good for 2 circuits now? Anyone got a code reference? Something new in 2008?


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## gardiner (Sep 25, 2007)

Check with your local inspection office as to whether this would be considered an area requiring hospital grade or not. I know of a couple of jurisdictions that would consider it just another office.


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## doubleoh7 (Dec 5, 2009)

I recently quoted a similar project. My AHJ tol me not to worry about hospital grade receps. I bid it and did not get the job. A guy with employees and a lot higher overhead than me bid lower. Can't win em all. Sometimes I with I was an optomotrist instead of a pessimist.


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## amptech (Sep 21, 2007)

I have done a few optometry offices and NEC 517 did not apply. If it applied to an optometry office, it would apply to the section of the DMV where they test your vision and I don't believe it does.


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## ralph (Apr 6, 2008)

Yes, Plans, but no specs.
The arch/engineering firm are notorious for missing things like this, and WILL not pay for their mistakes.
I guess im trying to go in with the builder with my bases covered. 
Yes he does realize that about the architect also.


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## ralph (Apr 6, 2008)

amptech said:


> I have done a few optometry offices and NEC 517 did not apply. If it applied to an optometry office, it would apply to the section of the DMV where they test your vision and I don't believe it does.


 Is there anything else they do, like administer eye drops or do any high tech testing? DMV is basically just - read the lines, isnt it?


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## ralph (Apr 6, 2008)

amptech said:


> I have done a few optometry offices and NEC 517 did not apply. If it applied to an optometry office, it would apply to the section of the DMV where they test your vision and I don't believe it does.





Speedy Petey said:


> Sounds high. I remember them being under $10.
> 
> Now HCF MC cable, that is a shocker.


 20.25 for a hosp grade GFI ? GEEZ


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## MDShunk (Jan 7, 2007)

Point #1.... let's separate this "hospital grade" speech from article 517 locations. Seldom are hospital grade devices required in article 517 locations. 

Point #2.... I've never managed to wire an optomitrist's exam room as anything other than an article 517 location. They're his patients, and that's where their care (exam) is done. If you can get your inspector to say that an eye doctor's exam room is not an article 517 location, you got a bonus. Count your blessings.


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## Introyble (Jul 10, 2010)

ralph said:


> I have an optomotrist office to bid. No surgury, just 3 exam rooms and offices. Would anyone think the exam rooms should be hospital grade wire and devices ?
> thanks


I really have to question your spelling of optomotrist. Well maybe that is right.


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## RIVETER (Sep 26, 2009)

ralph said:


> I have an optomotrist office to bid. No surgury, just 3 exam rooms and offices. Would anyone think the exam rooms should be hospital grade wire and devices ?
> thanks


Optometrists are not like doctors. They could work in a kiosk at the mall. Why would they require hospital grade?


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## John Valdes (May 17, 2007)

Introyble said:


> I really have to question your spelling of *optometrist*. Well maybe that is right.


That better?


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## knowshorts (Jan 9, 2009)

RIVETER said:


> Optomotrists are not like doctors. They could work in a kiosk at the mall. Why would they require hospital grade?


Yes, but if you go to one, you are their patient. Chiropractors and happy ending girls are not doctors either, but if you see them, you are their patient. HG receptacles may not be needed, but HCF mc may be required. Look at the definitions of HCF and PCA in Article 517 and if your still not sure, ask you AHJ.


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## Big City Electrician (Jul 5, 2010)

Is the room where a psychologist sees his patients a 517 location?


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## knowshorts (Jan 9, 2009)

Big City Electrician said:


> Is the room where a psychologist sees his patients a 517 location?


It's Arguable.

*Health Care Facilities.* Buildings or portions of buildings
in which medical, dental, *psychiatric*, nursing, obstetrical,
or surgical care are provided. Health care facilities include,
but are not limited to, hospitals, nursing homes, limited
care facilities, clinics, medical and dental offices, and ambulatory
care centers, whether permanent or movable.
*
Patient Care Area.* Any portion of a health care facility
wherein *patients* are intended to be *examined or treated.*


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## Speedy Petey (Jan 10, 2007)

RIVETER said:


> Optometrists are not like doctors. They could work in a kiosk at the mall. Why would they require hospital grade?


I think you are referring to an optician. Like Lenscrafters.


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## Big City Electrician (Jul 5, 2010)

Speedy Petey said:


> I think you are referring to an optician. Like Lenscrafters.


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## knowshorts (Jan 9, 2009)

Speedy Petey said:


> I think you are referring to an optician. Like Lenscrafters.


Even Lenscrafters have "special rooms" for patient eye examinations. I would say those rooms need 517 attention.


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## ralph (Apr 6, 2008)

MDShunk said:


> Point #1.... let's separate this "hospital grade" speech from article 517 locations. Seldom are hospital grade devices required in article 517 locations.
> 
> Point #2.... I've never managed to wire an optomitrist's exam room as anything other than an article 517 location. They're his patients, and that's where their care (exam) is done. If you can get your inspector to say that an eye doctor's exam room is not an article 517 location, you got a bonus. Count your blessings.


 Talked to the AHJ. He said if there are exams, then its required. He also said if other bidders end up getting the job, and not wire it properly, it will not pass, untill its corrected. It doesnt matter what the archtec / engineer have on the plans. Submitting today.


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