# EMT Installations



## Black Dog (Oct 16, 2011)

A Little Short said:


> Just a few questions:
> 
> Do you guys use a labor chart or assembly price for running EMT?
> 
> ...


Use 1-1'4" and make an easy pull, 11 to 15 man-hours, with a lift that will cut the man-hours down a bit.


----------



## A Little Short (Nov 11, 2010)

Black Dog said:


> Use 1-1'4" and make an easy pull, 11 to 15 man-hours, with a lift that will cut the man-hours down a bit.


Just curious what you pay for renting a scissor lift in your area?


----------



## Black Dog (Oct 16, 2011)

A Little Short said:


> Just curious what you pay for renting a scissor lift in your area?


http://www.bigrentz.com/equipment-rentals/scissor-lifts/

Scissor Lift Rental. Starting at $99 per Day and $399 per Month. Nationwide Delivery. Give us a call now to get started!





  
*19 Ft Narrow Scissor Lift for Rent*

*Nationwide Delivery Available
*

*$99 / Day*


*$287 / Week*


*$399 / 4-Weeks*


----------



## daveEM (Nov 18, 2012)

Probably 30 hours by the time you get the sub panel installed and the straps screwed down.

I'm working off a spanky new computer but I'll try to recover, from my old hard drives, a pricing sheet for a job I did last month using my labor units from '75.

It was a 70 foot run of 1", and I had to drill thru 2 - 8" block walls. 3 phase, 60 amp so 4 #6 conductors, a feed breaker, and sub panel connection. 4 90 degree bends and a couple of offsets so a 6x6x4 pull box.

8 foot ceiling, so I'm working off a 4' ladder. You are not. I'm drilling a concrete ceiling and installing anchors. << that's 3 hours there to drill, anchor, and screw 30 holes.

There is one scary labor unit... 5.2 hours to slap the sub panel up. Do you know 'poof'? He's kinda like the magic dragon... material is just all of a sudden sitting for you right at the job site. No I didn't think you knew him.

You gotta pick this stuff up, deliver it, pack it from the curb to the working site. I packed my 70 feet of conduit 200 feet from the curb, inside the parking garage to the work site. The labor units have some of this stuff built in.

I'll try to extract the sheet and post it for you.

Black Dog is a nice guy but you aren't doing this job in 11 hours.

*Edit*: In fact by the time you picked up and delivered this stuff I'm thinking the morning is shot and eff all done.


----------



## daveEM (Nov 18, 2012)

Here is a snap of the sheet. I'd run 1-1/4 for your job. 

If you have time and if I have a few minutes I'll run the quote for you if I can find my excel sheet. Anyway note only 70 feet of conduit on this sheet and 1" conduit instead of 1-1/4. You would also have more couplings, higher labor (wire,conduit) , etc. I gotta go, be back later. Be careful and don't murder yourself on this job.


----------



## ponyboy (Nov 18, 2012)

Hopefully you make a killing on those labor units because I would have that done before lunch


----------



## Hippie (May 12, 2011)

no way i would get a lift for that if there are obstacles that will require ladders to get around anyway. its only 14', if it was too high to work off 12' ladders then maybe. i would figure around a day and a half for 2 guys, depending on site conditions, to run pipe and pull wire


----------



## daveEM (Nov 18, 2012)

ponyboy said:


> Hopefully you make a killing on those labor units because I would have that done before lunch


Well for sure you would have gotten the material picked up and delivered to the work site. As long as the wholesale wasn't packed with folks such as yourself.

But anyway... in your dreams.

This job isn't getting done before lunch and it's not getting done in 11 hours.


----------



## ponyboy (Nov 18, 2012)

daveEM said:


> Well for sure you would have gotten the material picked up and delivered to the work site. As long as the wholesale wasn't packed with folks such as yourself. But anyway... in your dreams. This job isn't getting done before lunch and it's not getting done in 11 hours.


Some people keep overhead. 170' is not that much. So that's 17 pieces of pipe, 14 of them straight. If it's 1" you don't even need a powered bender. Maybe it would take a service guy 11 hours but that's not gonna fly in construction.


----------



## Jlarson (Jun 28, 2009)

11 hours... yikes


----------



## 360max (Jun 10, 2011)

ponyboy said:


> Hopefully you make a killing on those labor units because I would have that done before lunch


171' of 1 1/4" before lunch, are you really an electrician?


----------



## A Little Short (Nov 11, 2010)

daveEM said:


> Here is a snap of the sheet. I'd run 1-1/4 for your job.
> 
> If you have time and if I have a few minutes I'll run the quote for you if I can find my excel sheet. Anyway note only 70 feet of conduit on this sheet and 1" conduit instead of 1-1/4. You would also have more couplings, higher labor (wire,conduit) , etc. I gotta go, be back later. Be careful and don't murder yourself on this job.


You forgot to give me the labor charge!:whistling2::laughing:

Seriously, thanks for the spread sheet.

I have a week or so. I will be on vacation next week. I don't think I will give them a quote until I get back.


----------



## ponyboy (Nov 18, 2012)

360max said:


> 171' of 1 1/4" before lunch, are you really an electrician?


Apparently yeah. This isn't the land of mc and tek. I've done this type of job countless times, a lot of it solo too. There's also a lot of stuff I can't do fast that many others can


----------



## five.five-six (Apr 9, 2013)

ponyboy said:


> Hopefully you make a killing on those labor units because I would have that done before lunch


When's lunch?


----------



## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

Why not use some fat MC cable , maybe save on labor Shorty?

~CS~


----------



## daveEM (Nov 18, 2012)

A Little Short said:


> You forgot to give me the labor charge!:whistling2::laughing:
> 
> Seriously, thanks for the spread sheet.
> 
> I have a week or so. I will be on vacation next week. I don't think I will give them a quote until I get back.


That should work. I'm afraid to put my old drives in my new computer (something was really strange with it, Win7 tried to fix them too ). 

I have a docking station coming from Amazon (they think by July 9). I can plug my old drives in it and try to 'USB' the data to my new machine. It's an easy sheet to build also, so I might do that too.

Pony is a construction worker. His material is there and if it isn't he sends his slave to go get while he produces.

This is a service truck job. I spent my whole life on a service truck doing jobs like this. << That's a very long time, at least since 1970. I don't know that I ever worked more than 6 hours a day. At least 2 hours on average picking stuff up, be it a mag starter, or a handy box, at 3 different wholesales often. Somebody (the customer of course) has to pay for your time.

You will win and lose jobs like this when the other guys have no clue. They will be 1/2 your price and they will learn from experience. It's not the end of the world to make $10 an hour on a 30 hour job because they think they can do it in 10. In the big picture they can recover... or die.

You note that on my job above I was drilling into a concrete ceiling. Big difference doing that or driving screws into a wood ceiling. What are you using for fasteners?


----------



## A Little Short (Nov 11, 2010)

daveEM said:


> You note that on my job above I was drilling into a concrete ceiling. Big difference doing that or driving screws into a wood ceiling. What are you using for fasteners?


They have steel structured ceiling. I will probably use 1-hole straps. Maybe purlin clips if I need to.


----------



## ponyboy (Nov 18, 2012)

A Little Short said:


> They have steel structured ceiling. I will probably use 1-hole straps. Maybe purlin clips if I need to.


I'd be leery of one hole straps on 1 1/4" pipe. I've seen them sag in no time especially on steel backing. Just my 2 cents.


----------



## A Little Short (Nov 11, 2010)

ponyboy said:


> I'd be leery of one hole straps on 1 1/4" pipe. I've seen them sag in no time especially on steel backing. Just my 2 cents.


So 2-hole, minis, or what?


----------



## five.five-six (Apr 9, 2013)

Steel structured ceiling? Is the roof the ceiling?


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


----------



## ponyboy (Nov 18, 2012)

A Little Short said:


> So 2-hole, minis, or what?


Sounds like I'd use minis in your situation


----------



## Going_Commando (Oct 1, 2011)

A Little Short said:


> They have steel structured ceiling. I will probably use 1-hole straps. Maybe purlin clips if I need to.


As in steel roof deck? You know you have to stay 4" below that right? Are the bar joists running in the direction you need to pipe?

If yes, then Caddy bang-ons or beam clamps, 1/4 20s or 3/8 bolts and minnies.


----------



## ponyboy (Nov 18, 2012)

If it's only a 14' ceiling I'm guessing it's a trussed roof with a steel skinned ceiling. Totally fine to run on that if it's the case


----------



## A Little Short (Nov 11, 2010)

ponyboy said:


> If it's only a 14' ceiling I'm guessing it's a trussed roof with a steel skinned ceiling. Totally fine to run on that if it's the case


Maybe my choice of words was wrong, this is what the ceiling is...


----------



## ponyboy (Nov 18, 2012)

A Little Short said:


> Maybe my choice of words was wrong, this is what the ceiling is... http://s1224.photobucket.com/user/LittleBill1/media/2014-06-300012014-06-30013_zpsda411c9e.jpg.html


Oh those things suck.


----------



## Oklahoma sparky (Jul 12, 2011)

ponyboy said:


> Oh those things suck.


Nah z purlin those are cake if you have the right fasteners.


----------



## ponyboy (Nov 18, 2012)

Oklahoma sparky said:


> Nah z purlin those are cake if you have the right fasteners.


Yeah I just don't like the pitch. 88° to get on it and then a kick in the middle. I just ran a bunch of 2" on it Thursday and I screwed minis


----------



## five.five-six (Apr 9, 2013)

You want to use the correct fasteners. I wouldn't drill any of those beams or that roof. 


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


----------



## piperunner (Aug 22, 2009)

Well if you don't run 500 feet a day your gone that's 1/2" to 1 " with bends 
at 14 foot one man. That's our estimate most of men can do more in one day because were pipe monkeys. Caddy makes what you need bang on clip pipe straps its easy and yes don't drill purlins its going to p--- off the structural engineer a little. :thumbup:


----------



## ponyboy (Nov 18, 2012)

You can drill z purlins don't even worry about. A few tek screws aren't going to hurt anything. And I highly doubt any structural engineer will ever be in that building, ever.


----------



## piperunner (Aug 22, 2009)

ponyboy said:


> You can drill z purlins don't even worry about. A few tek screws aren't going to hurt anything. And I highly doubt any structural engineer will ever be in that building, ever.



Well maybe were you work but we don't drill anything structural its just not done but you can do anything you want they make beam clamps caddy fasteners and many types of approved straps that's what we use . Do what you want I don't really care . :thumbup:


----------



## ponyboy (Nov 18, 2012)

piperunner said:


> Well maybe were you work but we don't drill anything structural its just not done but you can do anything you want they make beam clamps caddy fasteners and many types of approved straps that's what we use . Do what you want I don't really care . :thumbup:


Yeah but that's not a center for performing arts, it's a piece of shít warehouse building.


----------



## piperunner (Aug 22, 2009)

ponyboy said:


> Yeah but that's not a center for performing arts, it's a piece of shít warehouse building.


 Well actually I have done some purlin jobs I guess if you don't have specs or a contractor that cares go for it . The only thing we could drill was a cross support on that type of job . And only after the roof was screwed down and completed .
I guess in florida we have building codes that when mother nature comes its not a good thing to have a hole in the wrong spot . If you drill one in the wrong place its bye bye roof in august . :thumbup:


----------



## ponyboy (Nov 18, 2012)

piperunner said:


> Well actually I have done some purlin jobs I guess if you don't have specs or a contractor that cares go for it . The only thing we could drill was a cross support on that type of job . And only after the roof was screwed down and completed . I guess in florida we have building codes that when mother nature comes its not a good thing to have a hole in the wrong spot . If you drill one in the wrong place its bye bye roof in august . :thumbup:


Well bullshít. A 7/32" hole through the bottom of a Z purlin will not hurt anything, not even in Florida. I work with engineered specs all the time and we don't screw anything to the purlins, but I'm not that naive to actually believe it'd make a difference.


----------



## MTW (Aug 28, 2013)

:sleep1:


Sent from my iPhone using electriciantalk.com


----------



## daveEM (Nov 18, 2012)

I wonder if either one of them ran their quota of 500 feet of 1" today.


----------



## ponyboy (Nov 18, 2012)

daveEM said:


> I wonder if either one of them ran their quota of 500 feet of 1" today.


You know your dogs probably want to run into traffic when you put those ***** costumes on them


----------



## CFL (Jan 28, 2009)

piperunner said:


> Well actually I have done some purlin jobs I guess if you don't have specs or a contractor that cares go for it . The only thing we could drill was a cross support on that type of job . And only after the roof was screwed down and completed .
> I guess in florida we have building codes that when mother nature comes its not a good thing to have a hole in the wrong spot . If you drill one in the wrong place its bye bye roof in august . :thumbup:


I don't know about the engineering, but I do know the guys screwing down the roof and walls are not engineers. I have no problem screwing into purlins just like they do. I have never worked on a new project with this type of construction though.

As far as 500' feet of pipe a day, you know that's new construction speed. If you've ever done work in an occupied building you know it's way different, even in a warehouse with no dropped ceiling. Plus, doing one run of pipe in a building is very different from a hundred runs in a building you're familiar with, with all of your material and equipment on site and ready to go. So stop bs'n.:no:


----------



## sbrn33 (Mar 15, 2007)

well.....


----------



## daveEM (Nov 18, 2012)

ponyboy said:


> You know your dogs probably want to run into traffic when you put those ***** costumes on them


 I guess you didn't get your 500 feet in eh? Maybe tomorrow.


----------



## theJcK (Aug 7, 2013)

I've used tek screws with one holes and bang on caddies.. and if you're one of the pocket guys just need channel locks and flathead to install clip and pipe.. much easier.


----------



## daveEM (Nov 18, 2012)

Well my original guess at 30 hours was pretty close to my estimate.

I'm at 29.39 hours. The 'pdf' of the spreadsheet (for those interested) is here...
https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B9tuT5PGdLy5U09tWTE3anNpRmc/edit?usp=docslist_api

Labor Unit: This guy sorta explains them. Why 14 minutes to install a receptacle?...
http://www.electriciansonlinetraining.net/bids.html

It's along these lines. To the OP... I have an hour or so into your job. You I suspect have a couple already... going out and looking, measuring, etc. Sorta why it takes 14 minutes to install a receptacle when really it takes a couple of minutes.

Fun pricing jobs.

To the OP... let me know how it goes, hours tagged against the job (include my 1.5). Include of course material pickup, delivery, time on phone ordering, etc. It don't get their by magic.

Don't worry about the pony or runner. They are but construction slaves, why their boss gets rich, why they get to work. The type of people you want to sent to a job like this (stuff there of course so they can produce.

To the pony and runner... read the link on 'the labor unit', then tomorrow bust your butt for the boss and run 600 feet. You aren't making him that much money and he needs money to stay in business... to employ you of course.


----------



## piperunner (Aug 22, 2009)

ponyboy said:


> Well bullshít. A 7/32" hole through the bottom of a Z purlin will not hurt anything, not even in Florida. I work with engineered specs all the time and we don't screw anything to the purlins, but I'm not that naive to actually believe it'd make a difference.


 
Well bull**** to you ponyboy what specs you just said you don't screw anything to the purlins make up your mind do you or don't you .
Whens the last time you were here to read our specs how do you know what our building code is . 
You must be unsure of yourself don't get your feathers in a ruffle and do they let you run 2 inch conduit or 4 inch on the purlins were your from .
You say you run 2 inch all the time lets see you conduit work put up you work lets see your installed 7/32" self tappers .:thumbup:


----------



## piperunner (Aug 22, 2009)

daveEM said:


> Well my original guess at 30 hours was pretty close to my estimate.
> 
> I'm at 29.39 hours. The 'pdf' of the spreadsheet (for those interested) is here...
> https://docs.google.com/file/d/0B9tuT5PGdLy5U09tWTE3anNpRmc/edit?usp=docslist_api
> ...


Well run your mouth you don't have a clue to what we do just think like you do and stick with your little box stores and metal buildings that's why your small because you cant handle a real job they want a company that can get it done not rip them off for a little run less then 200 feet . :laughing:


----------



## hardworkingstiff (Jan 22, 2007)

*FL building code*

If anyone knows which Florida building code does not allow us to drill a #14 tek screw into a Z purlin, please post it, I'd like to read it myself.

Thanks


----------



## sbrn33 (Mar 15, 2007)

piperunner said:


> Well run your mouth you don't have a clue to what we do just think like you do and stick with your little box stores and metal buildings that's why your small because you cant handle a real job they want a company that can get it done not rip them off for a little run less then 200 feet . :laughing:


Why do you have to be like this?


----------



## CopperSlave (Feb 9, 2012)

sbrn33 said:


> Why do you have to be like this?


----------



## ponyboy (Nov 18, 2012)

piperunner said:


> Well bull**** to you ponyboy what specs you just said you don't screw anything to the purlins make up your mind do you or don't you . Whens the last time you were here to read our specs how do you know what our building code is . You must be unsure of yourself don't get your feathers in a ruffle and do they let you run 2 inch conduit or 4 inch on the purlins were your from . You say you run 2 inch all the time lets see you conduit work put up you work lets see your installed 7/32" self tappers .:thumbup:


Well my primary employment is at a place that is full of engineers and we follow specs almost all the time, I also loan myself out to multiple contractors that I've worked with in the past so I'm not stuck in the same buildings every day of the year. As far as pictures of my work well they're on here. I don't get a self congratulatory boner every time I put a bend in a piece of pipe like you do sorry. 

You said a tek screw hole in a z purlin could potentially cause the roof to come off. That was stupid. Just deal with it


----------



## hardworkingstiff (Jan 22, 2007)

hardworkingstiff said:


> If anyone knows which Florida building code does not allow us to drill a #14 tek screw into a Z purlin, please post it, I'd like to read it myself.
> 
> Thanks


OK, I spoke with a friend who's a GC and has built BJ gas stations in Florida (he is also a metal building distributor). He told me that you could install the tek screw provided the manufacturer has had it "tested and certified" for the wind loads down there with the tek screws in it. If it was certified for 2 tek screws per 10 feet, you could not install 3 in 10 feet (etc).

It's all about what has been "certified" for their hurricane concerns.


----------



## sbrn33 (Mar 15, 2007)

hardworkingstiff said:


> OK, I spoke with a friend who's a GC and has built BJ gas stations in Florida (he is also a metal building distributor). He told me that you could install the tek screw provided the manufacturer has had it "tested and certified" for the wind loads down there with the tek screws in it. If it was certified for 2 tek screws per 10 feet, you could not install 3 in 10 feet (etc).
> 
> It's all about what has been "certified" for their hurricane concerns.


Well, that is good to know. I really doesn't sound like a code though. I also would like to see pink nicks code section.


----------



## MTW (Aug 28, 2013)

Any monkey can run pipe.


----------



## piperunner (Aug 22, 2009)

MTW said:


> Any monkey can run pipe.


 Well I see your still here thought you might have left with your buddies since you have no back up .:thumbup:


----------



## piperunner (Aug 22, 2009)

ponyboy said:


> Well my primary employment is at a place that is full of engineers and we follow specs almost all the time, I also loan myself out to multiple contractors that I've worked with in the past so I'm not stuck in the same buildings every day of the year. As far as pictures of my work well they're on here. I don't get a self congratulatory boner every time I put a bend in a piece of pipe like you do sorry.
> 
> You said a tek screw hole in a z purlin could potentially cause the roof to come off. That was stupid. Just deal with it


 
Well I didn't know your primary employment was a place of engineers that changes everything now I know why your confused about tex screws . I don't post pictures anymore its a joke and a waste of time here. 

Never seen a picture of your work what post . So you work with engineers but loan your self out whats that . So your a temp worker I don't get it 
what kind of work is that part timer .:thumbup:





:thumbup:


----------



## piperunner (Aug 22, 2009)

sbrn33 said:


> Well, that is good to know. I really doesn't sound like a code though. I also would like to see pink nicks code section.


 
Well I got a code section for ya its big and its pink what happen to your site did you guys run out of money or did you get tried of talking to yourselves .
:thumbup:


----------



## ponyboy (Nov 18, 2012)

Congratulations on being a 60+ year old glorified lead man. I hope you enjoy piping shoeboxes for your remaining years


----------



## MTW (Aug 28, 2013)

I learned how to use the Greenlee CT-880 table bender in one afternoon and I was bending pretzels with it a day later. Pipe is easy once you know a few tricks.


----------



## piperunner (Aug 22, 2009)

MTW said:


> I learned how to use the Greenlee CT-880 table bender in one afternoon and I was bending pretzels with it a day later. Pipe is easy once you know a few tricks.


 

Well I agree as to your bending pretzels in one day. But I have never seen any of your trick pipe work that you talk so much about . I guess it so easy 
you do have time to show us . :thumbsup:


----------



## MTW (Aug 28, 2013)

piperunner said:


> Well I agree as to your bending pretzels in one day. But I have never seen any of your trick pipe work that you talk so much about . I guess it so easy
> you do have time to show us . :thumbsup:


No, I don't feel the need to take pics of my work. It speaks for itself. :thumbsup:


----------



## piperunner (Aug 22, 2009)

ponyboy said:


> Congratulations on being a 60+ year old glorified lead man. I hope you enjoy piping your shoeboxes for your remaining years



Well iam 61 years old your upsetting me with that comment I don't know if I can post any more gee oh my that hurt my feelings . That's what they call age discrimination . That's my goal one more year of glorified leadman ya! then ill be poor and just check in to a nursing home . 
Iam going to keep my 1/2" bender with me it will be my cane so when I walk around ill be happy.

You can only hope to make it as long as me kid .:thumbup:


----------



## MTW (Aug 28, 2013)

piperunner said:


> Well iam 61 years old your upsetting me with that comment I don't know if I can post any more gee oh my that hurt my feelings . That's what they call age discrimination . That's my goal one more year of glorified leadman ya! then ill be poor and just check in to a nursing home .
> Iam going to keep my 1/2" bender with me it will be my cane so when I walk around ill be happy.
> 
> You can only hope to make it as long as me kid .:thumbup:


Phil, you're the best electrician in central Florida by far.


----------



## piperunner (Aug 22, 2009)

MTW said:


> No, I don't feel the need to take pics of my work. It speaks for itself. :thumbsup:


 

Well what work speaks for itself .


----------



## piperunner (Aug 22, 2009)

MTW said:


> Phil, you're the best electrician in central Florida by far.


Well its about time I was waiting for that now i may be civil to you but will have to see iam not that trusting lets see what ponyboy has to say hes still a punk kid in my book .:thumbup:


----------



## MTW (Aug 28, 2013)

piperunner said:


> Well its about time I was waiting for that now i maybe be civil to you but will have to see iam not that trusting lets see what ponyboy has to say his still a punk kid in my book .:thumbup:


Phil, I'm just having some fun, no different that what you're doing right now. Your pipe work is awesome but stay away from that grounding theory. :laughing:


----------



## ponyboy (Nov 18, 2012)

piperunner said:


> Well its about time I was waiting for that now i may be civil to you but will have to see iam not that trusting lets see what ponyboy has to say hes still a punk kid in my book .:thumbup:


For how long you've been on the forums you sure do get trolled easy. I'm gonna leave you alone now


----------



## piperunner (Aug 22, 2009)

MTW said:


> Phil, I'm just having some fun, no different that what you're doing right now. Your pipe work is awesome but stay away from that grounding theory. :laughing:



Well after being in the trade since 1969 its no fun trust me iam not here for fun i really hate you punks .:thumbup:


----------



## MTW (Aug 28, 2013)

piperunner said:


> Well after being in the trade since 1969 its no fun trust me iam not here for fun i really hate you punks .:thumbup:


Never mind, you're a total hack and your pipe work is garbage.


----------



## MTW (Aug 28, 2013)

ponyboy said:


> For how long you've been on the forums you sure do get trolled easy. I'm gonna leave you alone now


Good plan. Maybe you can learn how to change an HID ballast now. Those 4 lamp T8's are probably getting easier by the day.


----------



## ponyboy (Nov 18, 2012)

MTW said:


> Good plan. Maybe you can learn how to change an HID ballast now. Those 4 lamp T8's are probably getting easier by the day.


What's HID??


----------



## MTW (Aug 28, 2013)

ponyboy said:


> What's HID??


You don't need to know. Just follow the diagram.


----------



## ponyboy (Nov 18, 2012)

Shaking a tree boss. Shaking a tree


----------

