# NM-B (romex) defective or just wierd?



## mlzmaz (Aug 30, 2011)

I've got a roll of 14-3 NM-B that I think may be defective. It's southwire brand.

It doesn't lay flat, because it's not flat. The conductors seem to be scrunched into the outer sheath. Every 20-50 feet there's a bulge, when I cut one open, the red wire was making two loops around the other three wires, all the wires we're headed straight and then the red one just wrapped around the whole bundle twice before rejoining the other wires and going straight.

The outer sheath is intact, the wire insulation seems to be intact. The red wire being looped around doesn't seem to me as if it's adding extra strain to anything, even the red wire.

Should I return it, or deal with it? I think I can strategically use the roll to avoid using the bulging areas. Is 14-3 supposed to be flat? My 12-3 is flat, I've never used 14-3 before.


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## Dennis Alwon (May 9, 2009)

mlzmaz said:


> I've got a roll of 14-3 NM-B that I think may be defective. It's southwire brand.
> 
> It doesn't lay flat, because it's not flat. The conductors seem to be scrunched into the outer sheath. Every 20-50 feet there's a bulge, when I cut one open, the red wire was making two loops around the other three wires, all the wires we're headed straight and then the red one just wrapped around the whole bundle twice before rejoining the other wires and going straight.
> 
> ...


Return it-- 14/3 can be round or flat depending on which brand but there should not be a bulge. It may be fine but why take the chance.


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## thegoldenboy (Aug 15, 2010)

Sounds like a quality control issue.


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## user4818 (Jan 15, 2009)

I wouldn't say it's defective, I've noticed that most of the Southwire 3/C is all lumpy and misshaped like that.


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## mlzmaz (Aug 30, 2011)

I noticed I forgot to include a pic. This shows the spiraling of one of the conductors. I didn't cut this section open yet but the ones that I have it's always been the red wire doing this. This picture shows one spiral but some of the other ones have had two complete spirals in about two inches of cable.

I think I am going to try to contact the company. Failing that I will probably return it, I've already used about 50' off of the 250' roll though (before I noticed this issue).


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

Once the drywall goes up, who cares what it looks like?

Besides, doesn't THHN look the same inside of EMT? :whistling2:


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

mlzmaz said:


> I noticed I forgot to include a pic. This shows the spiraling of one of the conductors. I didn't cut this section open yet but the ones that I have it's always been the red wire doing this. This picture shows one spiral but some of the other ones have had two complete spirals in about two inches of cable.
> 
> I think I am going to try to contact the company. Failing that I will probably return it, I've already used about 50' off of the 250' roll though (before I noticed this issue).



I would send it back it looks like it got bound up in the machine or something, so i would not trust it.:no:


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## Cletis (Aug 20, 2010)

*M*

Just meg it and be done with it


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## kaboler (Dec 1, 2010)

It's older, so those things are where the threading direction is reversed. That's all.


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## Chris1971 (Dec 27, 2010)

480sparky said:


> Once the drywall goes up, who cares what it looks like?:



That might work in the corn patch but, in the real world the 14-3 should be returned. Sounds like it's defective.


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

Chris1971 said:


> That might work in the corn patch but, in the real world the 14-3 should be returned. Sounds like it's defective.



Why is it defective? Because it don't look pretty? Is 'good-looking' part of the UL listing?


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## Chris1971 (Dec 27, 2010)

480sparky said:


> Why is it defective? Because it don't look pretty? Is 'good-looking' part of the UL listing?



I probably wouldn't use it based on what the OP described in the first post. It would also depend on how bad the wire looks based on his picture.


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## user4818 (Jan 15, 2009)

Cletis said:


> Just meg it and be done with it



Just use it and be done with it.


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## oldtimer (Jun 10, 2010)

Peter D said:


> Just use it and be done with it.



I do not agree. 

I think he should take it back, and make them replace it.

That would be better than possibly having trouble later!

The supplier will not lose, they will be compensated.


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

Peter D said:


> Just use it and be done with it.


Yup nothing to worry about...:laughing::laughing:


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## user4818 (Jan 15, 2009)

HARRY304E said:


> Yup nothing to worry about...:laughing::laughing:


:sleep1:


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

Wow. I learn something new every day. Wires that are twisted around each other will spontaneously burst into flame when electricity is applied.


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## user4818 (Jan 15, 2009)

480sparky said:


> Wow. I learn something new every day. Wires that are twisted around each other will spontaneously burst into flame when electricity is applied.



You never know what kind of outrageous conjecture you'll encounter on ET. :laughing:


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## stuiec (Sep 25, 2010)

480sparky said:


> Wow. I learn something new every day. Wires that are twisted around each other will spontaneously burst into flame when electricity is applied.


 
who said anything about electricity??


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

stuiec said:


> who said anything about electricity??


Oh, so the FD has already left?


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

Peter D said:


> :sleep1:


Tired today..??:laughing:


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## Chris1971 (Dec 27, 2010)

HARRY304E said:


> Tired today..??:laughing:



Maybe A sleeping disorder? :laughing:


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## mlzmaz (Aug 30, 2011)

Seems to be 6 to 4 (or something like that, it's hard to count replies) that I should return it, so I'm going to return the 200' I have left and rewire what's already in the walls once I have replacement. Got it from lowes anyway, I don't think I'll run into trouble there.

What really tipped me in this direction is that I found a twisted area with the printing over it, the printing is all distorted. I think I agree with the comment HARRY304E made, it was potentially bound up in the machine and there is a chance of subtle damage to the outer sheath or inner wire insulation. I do believe that at least the outer sheath was stretched and is now thinner in these areas.


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## MF Dagger (Dec 24, 2007)

14-3 when flat always has weird spots like that. I'll go grab a partial roll from truck quick to see if I can get a picture


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## JohnR (Apr 12, 2010)

IMO, just weird. All the southwire romex around here that is 12-3 or 14-3 is like that now. Seems strange after having only round for years. Never saw flat unless it was UF.


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## MF Dagger (Dec 24, 2007)

Too much work for a Sunday to clean far enough down.


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## steelersman (Mar 15, 2009)

The wire looks fine in the pic you posted. You were exaggerating in your original post claiming that the red wraps around twice.....it doesn't wrap around twice, only once and it doesn't matter......the wire is fine and don't listen to all the weirdos claiming that it will be a problem.....they don't know jack about resi work anyhow.....


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## Chris1971 (Dec 27, 2010)

steelersman said:


> The wire looks fine in the pic you posted. You were exaggerating in your original post claiming that the red wraps around twice.....it doesn't wrap around twice, only once and it doesn't matter......the wire is fine and don't listen to all the weirdos claiming that it will be a problem.....they don't know jack about resi work anyhow.....



Your right I don't know Jack or John or Gary or Steve or Steelersman....:thumbup::laughing:


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

Wow. Distorted printing is now an issue. I'm really going to have to watch what I install these days.


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## mlzmaz (Aug 30, 2011)

steelersman said:


> The wire looks fine in the pic you posted. You were exaggerating in your original post claiming that the red wraps around twice.....it doesn't wrap around twice, only once and it doesn't matter......the wire is fine and don't listen to all the weirdos claiming that it will be a problem.....they don't know jack about resi work anyhow.....


The picture only shows one wrap, I admitted that. I did have a spot where it wrapped twice and the bulge was 3-4 inches long, didn't get a picture though.



> Wow. Distorted printing is now an issue. I'm really going to have to watch what I install these days.


I was thinking the issue was more about why the printing was distorted, I.E. the sheathing and wire insulation was stretched and thinned out.

I replaced it with cerrowire 14-3. Seems to be much better, the sheath has a nice matte appearance and the cable is flat and uniform.


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## Jlarson (Jun 28, 2009)

mlzmaz said:


> Seems to be 6 to 4 (or something like that, it's hard to count replies) that I should return it, so I'm going to return the 200' I have left and rewire what's already in the walls once I have replacement.


What a blatant waste of time, money, and resources.


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## Sparky J (May 17, 2011)

*Don't use it but be thankful...*

Don't use it but be thankful years ago when I was working for a track home electrical company wiring McMansions one of the other crews got 1000 feet of 12-2 ran it all but upon tieing it in realized no ground on the entire spool.


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## steelersman (Mar 15, 2009)

mlzmaz said:


> The picture only shows one wrap, I admitted that. I did have a spot where it wrapped twice and the bulge was 3-4 inches long, didn't get a picture though.
> 
> 
> I was thinking the issue was more about why the printing was distorted, I.E. the sheathing and wire insulation was stretched and thinned out.
> ...


Whatever troll.......


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

steelersman said:


> Whatever troll.......


Another boring post....at least your consistent..


:sleep1::sleep1:


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## steelersman (Mar 15, 2009)

HARRY304E said:


> Another boring post....at least your consistent..


Yeah sorry mine aren't as informative as yours:

_We know,, you love your self.....:laughing:

__Pool pump..

__He did not want to wrinkle it..:laughing:

__ Prime rib thank you....:laughing::laughing: ...

__Where is that middle finger...

__:no::no:

I can go on and on......but it is quite obvious.....
_


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

steelersman said:


> Yeah sorry mine aren't as informative as yours:
> 
> _http://www.electriciantalk.com/f2/w...-him-her-so-good-12931-post545219/#post545219__
> 
> ...


Yup there is a difference all of your posts are negative that is a fact .

You just took 5 of my post from other threads if you don't like them then please reply in those threads. 

Or just report them all.

Boy your sure love to give people crap from spelling to who cares what else.

But when someone points out you need to grow up here is the result... Thats right that's you.:laughing:


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## steelersman (Mar 15, 2009)

HARRY304E said:


> Yup there is a difference all of your posts are negative that is a fact .
> 
> You just took 5 of my post from other threads if you don't like them then please reply in those threads.
> 
> ...


Harry you are the one who always starts with me. I haven't said anything to you and you start in again with me......why do you act like a little kid? You need to put the bottle down and go to sleep.


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

steelersman said:


> Harry you are the one who always starts with me. I haven't said anything to you and you start in again with me......why do you act like a little kid? You need to put the bottle down and go to sleep.


Why do you have to slam other members especially newbie's about spelling and grammar or just because they asked a question that YOU think is stupid .

The fact is these guys come here and seek to advance their knowledge in the Electrical trade.

None of us know every thing about Electrical work and that includes me that is why we are here we are all trying to learn more.


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## steelersman (Mar 15, 2009)

You took offense to what I said about everyone telling him to return it being gay since you were one of them.....well guess what? It is lame and weak minded to return it and be scared that the wire is defective.....and furthermore it shows a lack of understanding about the wire if you think that way.....it's a Chicken Little mentality.......


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

I was installing some 14/2 yesterday, and lookie what I found about 200' into a 250' roll:


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## AnthonyClifton (Sep 14, 2011)

Use it and move on.


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## A Little Short (Nov 11, 2010)

480sparky said:


> I was installing some 14/2 yesterday, and lookie what I found about 200' into a 250' roll:


Com-on, tell us how you twisted that wire while it was still in the sheath!
I bet you cut it, twisted it, and glued it back.
Or...is that some of your trick videography ?:laughing:


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

Little-Lectric said:


> Com-on, tell us how you twisted that wire while it was still in the sheath!
> I bet you cut it, twisted it, and glued it back.
> Or...is that some of your trick videography ?:laughing:


No. I got lucky and this showed up right as I was feeding a ceiling light. I was able to coax enough slack out of the run to be able to cut this off and use it for this vid. I cut it, dropped it on the floor, and it ended up getting swept up. I suddenly remembered it tonight so I had to dig it out of the trash can outside.


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## stuiec (Sep 25, 2010)

480sparky said:


> No. I got lucky and this showed up right as I was feeding a ceiling light. I was able to coax enough slack out of the run to be able to cut this off and use it for this vid. I cut it, dropped it on the floor, and it ended up getting swept up. I suddenly remembered it tonight so *I had to dig it out of the trash can outside*.


 
_Thats_ the video I want to see!:jester:


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

stuiec said:


> _Thats_ the video I want to see!:jester:


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## stuiec (Sep 25, 2010)

:laughing::laughing::laughing: yeah! Thanks man! Hey! We have the same socks!


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## oldtimer (Jun 10, 2010)

stuiec said:


> :laughing::laughing::laughing: yeah! Thanks man! Hey! We have the same socks!


 SOCKS?

He isn't wearing socks!

:laughing::laughing:


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

oldtimer said:


> SOCKS?
> 
> He isn't wearing socks!
> 
> :laughing::laughing:


I am now.... I found a pair of argyles last night. :thumbsup:


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