# How old is this NM?



## MTW (Aug 28, 2013)

1970's.


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## Mshea (Jan 17, 2011)

Sorry never even seen 600 volt rating on NM cables. the plastic white jacket would make it newer than 1980 I would guess.


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## MTW (Aug 28, 2013)

Mshea said:


> Sorry never even seen 600 volt rating on NM cables. the plastic white jacket would make it newer than 1980 I would guess.


Our NM cable has been rated 600 volts for a long time now, and it's been plastic jacketed since the 1960's.


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## macmikeman (Jan 23, 2007)

I second the 70's show comment , since I was there installing it myself.


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## don_resqcapt19 (Jul 18, 2010)

What size is the EGC in the NM?


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## Going_Commando (Oct 1, 2011)

MTW said:


> Our NM cable has been rated 600 volts for a long time now, and it's been plastic jacketed since the 1960's.


Etco also made a white cloth romex with a teflony sheath in the early 60s. Ripped a bunch out of a house a few months ago. Reduced sized ground as well.


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## A Little Short (Nov 11, 2010)

MTW said:


> 1970's.





macmikeman said:


> I second the 70's show comment , since I was there installing it myself.


Yep, 70's to early 80's.
Had to do a home inspection on one not long ago that was built in early 80's. It had the blue NM cable. 
Of course it could have been old stock NM and just installed in early 80's.


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## FlyingSparks (Dec 10, 2012)

Going_Commando said:


> Etco also made a white cloth romex with a teflony sheath in the early 60s. Ripped a bunch out of a house a few months ago. Reduced sized ground as well.


Yeah I found that in this house too. It's amazing how easily the jacket rips off the cloth NM.


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## Mshea (Jan 17, 2011)

MTW said:


> Our NM cable has been rated 600 volts for a long time now, and it's been plastic jacketed since the 1960's.


Since use of NM is restricted to 150 volts to ground, ours is rated at 300. Ours has had a plastic jacket since the 60s too but I don't remember it being white. Orange strikes me as the color I remember.


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## FlyingSparks (Dec 10, 2012)

Mshea said:


> Since use of NM is restricted to 150 volts to ground, ours is rated at 300. Ours has had a plastic jacket since the 60s too but I don't remember it being white. Orange strikes me as the color I remember.


All the old plastic jacket NM in this house is white 10-14awg. Older cloth cover is a brownish blue. I haven't seen old orange NM before, only modern 10awg NM-B.


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## Shockdoc (Mar 4, 2010)

Ettco flex looked the same from the . Early 60s to the early 90s. If the ground is halfsize, pre 71, no b prefix, pre 84.

Sent from my C5215 using electriciantalk.com mobile app


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## Going_Commando (Oct 1, 2011)

Mshea said:


> Since use of NM is restricted to 150 volts to ground, ours is rated at 300. Ours has had a plastic jacket since the 60s too but I don't remember it being white. Orange strikes me as the color I remember.


Romex 150v to ground is a new thing. Used to be used all the time in shoe shops here running 600v delta with 12-3 and 10-3 romex.


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## elecpatsfan (Oct 1, 2010)

don_resqcapt19 said:


> What size is the EGC in the NM?


Yeah I was wandering the same thing, I've seen those de-rated grounds in the nm cable with that pink print. 

Is it illegal to feed out from existing plugs wired with the smaller ground?


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## don_resqcapt19 (Jul 18, 2010)

I think the code changed in 1968 to require the full sized EGC in NM.

I am not aware of any restrictions on extending a circuit from the old NM that has the smaller EGC.


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## FlyingSparks (Dec 10, 2012)

The EGC is 14awg, all conductors are copper.


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## MTW (Aug 28, 2013)

Going_Commando said:


> Etco also made a white cloth romex with a teflony sheath in the early 60s. Ripped a bunch out of a house a few months ago. Reduced sized ground as well.


I've only seen that variety of Ettco once or twice. The vast majority of it that I see is in nasty buildings from the 1970's. :laughing: The 70's had to be the low point of building construction in the last century.


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## MTW (Aug 28, 2013)

Speaking of old varieties of NM cable, here's a few I've seen or demo'd over the years from long defunct manufacturers:

Ammco Ammcoflex
Annoconda Dutrax
Hatfield Hatflex
Narragansett Narax 
Phelps Dodge
Rome Roflex
Triangle PWC


:nerd::nerd::nerd:


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## Magnettica (Jan 23, 2007)

My guess is the 1990's because I remember wiring houses with this stuff and it came in a cardboard box!


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## MTW (Aug 28, 2013)

Magnettica said:


> My guess is the 1990's because I remember wiring houses with this stuff and it came in a cardboard box!


They stopped making Type NM in 1984.


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## Vintage Sounds (Oct 23, 2009)

Mshea said:


> Since use of NM is restricted to 150 volts to ground, ours is rated at 300. Ours has had a plastic jacket since the 60s too but I don't remember it being white. Orange strikes me as the color I remember.


A while ago I worked on a renovation at a cottage property which was originally wired with sky blue NMD-7 made by Northern Telecom of all people. 

I actually liked it more than the modern stuff. The outer jacket was easier to split and the conductor insulation had what seemed like a slightly slimmer cross section.


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## papaotis (Jun 8, 2013)

MTW said:


> Speaking of old varieties of NM cable, here's a few I've seen or demo'd over the years from long defunct manufacturers:
> 
> Ammco Ammcoflex
> Annoconda Dutrax
> ...


ive seen all those names, but not ettco. ??


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## dspiffy (Nov 25, 2013)

Our circa 1980 building is slap full of that.


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## Meadow (Jan 14, 2011)

MTW said:


> I've only seen that variety of Ettco once or twice. The vast majority of it that I see is in nasty buildings from the 1970's. :laughing: The 70's had to be the low point of building construction in the last century.



Id whole heartedly agree with that statement. Aluminum wire, FPE, asbestos, apartment construction booming not to mention star trek lighting and funky avocado plumbing and appliances that worked as well as they looked :laughing:





FlyingSparks said:


> Can anyone give me a rough guesstimate on the age of this NM?
> 
> Here is what the jacket says:
> 14/2wg = 600v = uL = Ettcoflex = type NM = ettco = wire = cable = corp


IMO some of the best NM-B ever made for its time. Flexible, strips and pulled easily. But I still prefer my Southwire Sim pull:thumbup:


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## Going_Commando (Oct 1, 2011)

MTW said:


> Speaking of old varieties of NM cable, here's a few I've seen or demo'd over the years from long defunct manufacturers:
> 
> Ammco Ammcoflex
> Annoconda Dutrax
> ...


Back in the day, the company installed anaconda Dutrax exclusively. Stuff is rugged as hell.


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## FlyingSparks (Dec 10, 2012)

The only thing I don't like about this old ettco is it is somewhat more difficult to strip the individual conductors. I would vote for Romex simpull too, but I feel the outer jacket needs to be tougher. If I had the walls open in this house I would run EMT


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## MTW (Aug 28, 2013)

Going_Commando said:


> Back in the day, the company installed anaconda Dutrax exclusively. Stuff is rugged as hell.


Yeah, it's closer to UF than NM cable.


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## tjs1171 (Oct 13, 2020)

Shockdoc said:


> Ettco flex looked the same from the . Early 60s to the early 90s. If the ground is halfsize, pre 71, no b prefix, pre 84.
> 
> Sent from my C5215 using electriciantalk.com mobile app





Shockdoc said:


> Ettco flex looked the same from the . Early 60s to the early 90s. If the ground is halfsize, pre 71, no b prefix, pre 84.
> 
> Sent from my C5215 using electriciantalk.com mobile app


Yes, there’s gas in the car. I think the people down the hall know who you are. Get along Kid Charlemagne...
Ever join a forum for electrical-type jibber jabber and find yourself confronted with lyrics to a favorite Steely Dan tune? Happened to me....thanks for that! 👍


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## joe-nwt (Mar 28, 2019)

About 2,315 days older than when this thread was first posted.......


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## Tonedeaf (Nov 26, 2012)

it's from the 1970's, I did a renovation in the 1990 of a 10 story building in King of Prussia....the building was full of 480V circuits for PTAC's and heat pumps circuits.....all this type of cable. 

I was removing disconnected circuits from a panel in an occupied section of a building.....I had a piece of cable in my hand ready to cut it....someone stopped to talked to me and I let go the cable and accidentally grabbed HOT cable....When I cut the cable it disintegrated the entire head of my Ideal strippers. It sounded like a bomb....I use to have them hanging from my Mirror in my truck to keep fresh in my mind how dangerous electricity can be and how lucky I was.


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## 99cents (Aug 20, 2012)

A Little Short said:


> Yep, 70's to early 80's.
> Had to do a home inspection on one not long ago that was built in early 80's. It had the blue NM cable.
> Of course it could have been old stock NM and just installed in early 80's.


We had blue NMD when AFCI’s were required for bedrooms only. Some guys used it to keep track of arc fault circuits but it wasn’t a requirement.


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