# Estimating a monster house



## B4T (Feb 10, 2009)

You price it the same way as a small house.. set a price per item and just do the math..


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## sparky250 (Aug 28, 2012)

depends where in canada your located. Off the top of my head I would bid $25k-$30k which would be an " all inclusive " package with pot lights smokeys sub panel if hteres a suite possibly bathroom fans.

Whats the crazy total you came up with.


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## Marc77 (Sep 10, 2012)

Thanks for the quick reply, I came up with 20k so far, without material, I'm stumped on how much wire. So many pots ... They will burn through alot of spools.


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## 10492 (Jan 4, 2010)

Marc77 said:


> Thanks for the quick reply, I came up with 20k so far, without material, I'm stumped on how much wire. So many pots ... They will burn through alot of spools.


Just on receps, 350*55= $19K.

You're gonna lose money if you think $20K is crazy.

From JUST your original post, I'd be over $40K, and this is without ANY questions.


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## Speedy Petey (Jan 10, 2007)

Dnkldorf said:


> Just on receps, 350*55= $19K.
> 
> You're gonna lose money if you think $20K is crazy.
> 
> From JUST your original post, I'd be over $40K, and this is without ANY questions.


+1 :thumbsup:


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## Nosparxsse (Aug 12, 2007)

Is the home Total electric or are there gas appliances???

Could make a difference in the service size...

at least $28,000-35,000 (at LEAST.) ( I am in Indiana though..._)

cover your BUTT!


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## B4T (Feb 10, 2009)

I did a house that size about (5) years ago.. except it had a 300 amp. underground service.. copper 250'.. that I had to pipe jack under a road.. job was $65,000+..


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## Cletis (Aug 20, 2010)

*Big*

Bigger is not Better $35k min. You'll lose it anyhow to someone for around 15-20k


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## 99cents (Aug 20, 2012)

Marc77 said:


> I'm trying to price a monster house with all the bells and whistles.. 5000. Sqf. 2 floors, not including unfinished basement. 350 outlets including 114 pots. Some are outside pots.
> Any idea of a breakdown mat & labour.
> I came up with a crazy price.


I am just finishing a house like this and never again. My advice to you? Take your crazy price and double it. On second thought, TRIPLE it.

Unless your home builder is very well organized and schedules his trades extremely well, you're going to be in trouble right from the beginning. You need to be able to send a crew out there and put in solid eight hour days to make it worth your while.

Your contract must detail everything you are responsible for. Anything you do over and above, no matter how small, needs to be covered by a change order. Those change orders could mean the difference between profit and loss on a home of this size.

I know a guy who wires big, custom houses and he knows what he's doing. Judging by his lifestyle, he must be charging "crazy" pricing.

You say all the bells and whistles. Does that mean sound, security, satellite TV, low voltage control? You have to know exactly what you're up against from the outset.

Are you working with high ceilings? I was on a job where it took three guys all day to hang a single chandelier.

I'm not trying to discourage you but this has to be a job that you're prepared to walk away from unless you're completely satisfied that you're going to be making good money at it.


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## Marc77 (Sep 10, 2012)

I want to thank you guys for the advice, after I added the material it came to closer to 30k. I realize there's a lot of unforeseen and detail that needs to be addressed. The one thing I'm not sure is how much 14/2. I priced 150m roll for every 1000sqf, so 5rolls but there are so many pots that I think the number is closer to 8.


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## 99cents (Aug 20, 2012)

Marc77 said:


> I want to thank you guys for the advice, after I added the material it came to closer to 30k. I realize there's a lot of unforeseen and detail that needs to be addressed. The one thing I'm not sure is how much 14/2. I priced 150m roll for every 1000sqf, so 5rolls but there are so many pots that I think the number is closer to 8.


8 rolls? I hope you have a wire stretcher in your truck


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## sparky250 (Aug 28, 2012)

8 rolls is way too low. Id say estimate for 15 rolls 14/2, 6 rolls, 14-3, and I always put in a 1/4-1/2 roll for things like 12/2,10-2, 10-3,8/3, etc.

A lot of 14/3 is used for your multi branch home runs and also bigger house bigger hallways etc more 3/4 way switching.


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## AcaciaStrain (Feb 28, 2010)

Recently helped a buddy do a home that was 1,500 sq ft and we burned up quite a bit of two wire. Bid more then you need on a large job like that, sometimes homeowners will be indecisive on where to put a fixture so you'll leave a few extra feet pulled up in case on the final walk through, before rock, your having to move it. Plus the guy that thinks he needs to leave an extra three feet for tails at the box


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## svh19044 (Jul 1, 2008)

$22750 standard receptacles
$15960 basic 5" recessed step baffles
$3600 Roughly 30 switch legs (we'll assume they cheap out and do no dimmers)
$5400 Roughly 30 120v AFCI/GFCI circuits
$2100 Roughly 15 120v standard circuits
$3000 roughly 10 240v circuits
$3000-6000 new service
$2000 for fixtures (low end)

Are we including phone/cable/data too? How about smokes, I'll just assume this falls in with alarm?

8 rolls is hardly enough to get started, let alone finish the job. You will easily double/triple that.

I'm well over $60k for what you described in a 5000sq ft house. And I'm not surprised that so few of these bids are won, as I know from past experience that some of the companies are doing it for 1/3 of what I would charge. However, that also dictates that their bid is usually for standard 1 fixture lighting, and minimum to code, despite with the gc/architect calls for. Once they get in, their fun starts.


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## Marc77 (Sep 10, 2012)

Thanks again for the advice I met with the contractor, he gave me a smaller job to test 
The water. I haven't settled on a price for the 
5k Sqf. House, I guess there has been changes
So I have to see them.


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## union347sparky (Feb 29, 2012)

Marc77 said:


> Thanks again for the advice I met with the contractor, he gave me a smaller job to test
> The water. I haven't settled on a price for the
> 5k Sqf. House, I guess there has been changes
> So I have to see them.


Changes already. Homes this size change all the time and without warning. I agree with what most people are saying and bid high. I have done two high end homes with "bells and whistles" and one ended up T&M at the end because about half way through its just one big change order. The other I started off T&M.


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## sbrn33 (Mar 15, 2007)

Marc77 said:


> I want to thank you guys for the advice, after I added the material it came to closer to 30k. I realize there's a lot of unforeseen and detail that needs to be addressed. The one thing I'm not sure is how much 14/2. I priced 150m roll for every 1000sqf, so 5rolls but there are so many pots that I think the number is closer to 8.


You will easily have 10,000 foot of 14-2
1250 of 14-3
and 
3000 foot of 12-2 in that house
easily.

around here that house should go for $30K but in reality someone will do it for around twenty maybe even $17.
Good luck, sometimes your better off not getting it. remember you will be tied up on a low profit job for two months and you will lose whatever good work comes along.


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## dronai (Apr 11, 2011)

Marc77 said:


> Thanks again for the advice I met with the contractor, he gave me a smaller job to test
> The water. I haven't settled on a price for the
> 5k Sqf. House, I guess there has been changes
> So I have to see them.


These guys are right, but you are new, and your builders knows it. If you had the right number you wouldn't get the job. Make sure you wear a good pair of kneepads for this job when job costing. You should take an estimating class before learning the hard way.


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## cal1947 (Nov 14, 2009)

*cal1947*

you will not use 14/3 for home runs,you have to have af breakers in bedrooms


sparky250 said:


> 8 rolls is way too low. Id say estimate for 15 rolls 14/2, 6 rolls, 14-3, and I always put in a 1/4-1/2 roll for things like 12/2,10-2, 10-3,8/3, etc.
> 
> A lot of 14/3 is used for your multi branch home runs and also bigger house bigger hallways etc more 3/4 way switching.


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## rnr electric (Jan 29, 2010)

Just my two cents.. But at5000 sf and 100 cans/standard white baffle trims and bulbs, I'm at $28k or so right off the bat. Then any "bells and whistles" would also be added in also. U/c lights, upper cabinet lighting, puck lights, LEDs,pools,specialty fixtures,heated floors,step lighting,etc,etc,etc. All priced accordingly. This would not be far from 40k pretty easily..
I would never try to tell anybody how to price a job but I know that at 20k I could not make money on it.
I used to be scared to turn in a 40-50k bid because it just seemed too high to me.TRUST ME HERE.... Lose 10k one time and that scared feeling will go away quickly. Good luck!


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## sparky250 (Aug 28, 2012)

cal1947 said:


> you will not use 14/3 for home runs,you have to have af breakers in bedrooms


OP is from Canada and here we can pull home runs in 14/3 as only those receptacles in bedrooms require Arc Fault Breakers. So yea for the bedroom plug circuits, 14/2 only.


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## jr360 (Dec 7, 2011)

I wired my house in 04. I used 7000 ft 12/2. no 14/2 or 14/3. 24 cans. G/o heating and cooling. 6200 sq. ft living, 3 car garage. Screen porch w/outlets and ceing fan. 400 amp service with manual transfer sw. 2 subpanels . kitchen up stairs and down staris. bells and whistles was done by a electronic guy ( $5000). By the bids on this post, I save myself a bunch of money!


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## 10492 (Jan 4, 2010)

jr360 said:


> I wired my house in 04. I used 7000 ft 12/2. no 14/2 or 14/3. 24 cans. G/o heating and cooling. 6200 sq. ft living, 3 car garage. Screen porch w/outlets and ceing fan. 400 amp service with manual transfer sw. 2 subpanels . kitchen up stairs and down staris. bells and whistles was done by a electronic guy ( $5000). By the bids on this post, I save myself a bunch of money!


Count up your labor hrs you invested in rewiring your own home, and multiply by about $90/hr.
Remember, ALL your hours into it.

Bet these numbers come closer than you realize..........


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## JohnR (Apr 12, 2010)

I had a job smaller than that, was a remodel with an attatched garage added on, The total I cam to was 26k. The Gc then took that #, knocked 4k off and submitted it for me. He was told that the electrical was "really low". Still didn't get the job for other reasons. His price and the winner was 4k. That, after knocking my price down. Sighhhh..... Didn't find out about the cut on my price from him.


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## 99cents (Aug 20, 2012)

This is a good discussion. If the poster has intentions of getting into the big house market then this could be an opportunity. If its just a job that he hopes to make some money at, then it's probably one to walk away from. It's a question of "where do I want my business to be five years from now?". If custom home wiring isn't in the future then it shouldn't be in the present.

Somebody on this site said that you should never bid a job twice as big as you have already done. It's good advice. It sounds to me like the poster isn't ready for this one. That's okay.

Personally, I would rather do ten $5000 jobs than one $50,000 job. It spreads me around, gives me a much better chance at spin-off business and doesn't commit most of my resources to one customer. Of course, I'm a little guy. To me, a $50,000 job is big. To someone else, it might not be worth their time.

When I was stuck doing my own monster house, I turned down a lot of good business. Not only did I bid the job too low but it cost me money in lost business. Lesson learned.

I was talking to my favorite customer last week, a successful guy and a general contractor. I asked him his secret of success. He said to do quality work and don't take on more than you can handle. It's probably that simple.


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## bobelectric (Feb 24, 2007)

Guess how much nm is in Bill Gates' house. Probably none,all conduit.


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## mdfriday (May 14, 2007)

bobelectric said:


> Guess how much nm is in Bill Gates' house. Probably none,all conduit.


My mom's house is all conduit.


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## Hippie (May 12, 2011)

mdfriday said:


> My mom's house is all conduit.


Who laid all that pipe for her


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## TOOL_5150 (Aug 27, 2007)

Hippie said:


> Who laid all that pipe for her


they pipe their houses over there... That would make resi more interesting.


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## electricmanscott (Feb 11, 2010)

Marc77 said:


> I came up with a crazy price.





Marc77 said:


> Thanks for the quick reply, I came up with 20k so far, without material, I'm stumped on how much wire. So many pots ... They will burn through alot of spools.




That IS a crazy price.

Without using a calculator $50k+ easy


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## local134gt (Dec 24, 2008)

mdfriday said:


> My mom's house is all conduit.


So is mine :thumbsup:


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## mdfriday (May 14, 2007)

Im in a county that does not require it, so when my house was built, it was romex. I'm ok with it...


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## MHElectric (Oct 14, 2011)

Forget it. If you are questioning your high numbers right now, and all these guys here are telling you that your low....let it go... let it go! The smartest thing I have done on several occasions was to walk away. Let some other sucker get caught up on this job with not enough money in it.


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## rnr electric (Jan 29, 2010)

Take into consideration this.
Most monster homes are very custom, and will typically have a decorator,engineer or architect and also a home owner involved throughout the whole process. There will be changes in the field that WILL be overlooked for billing.you can plan on many trips back and forth to hang errant lights as they come in.. Consider two days minimum for walk throughs with HO and decorator. I have had rough ins (and therefore inspections and draws) held up for a couple weeks while the decorators consulted with others and homeowners and GCs to make decisions on lighting and such. I do mainly big custom homes and that is my bread and butter, about 60% overall of my business, I am fortunate that I do not "bid" most of them but rather just give a price for them and it is still a very hectic rat race. The folks he saying that 30-40k is a high price have probably not done many of these homes, and probably got lucky on the few that they have done. The guys that say 30-40-50k all day long have probably had their a$$es handed to them a few times (like me) and have learned to play the game. Geographical area has a lot to do with this also IMO.. In other words a home on the Florida gulf coast is not usually the same as the same home in Podunk somwhereville.


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## Northbank (Sep 6, 2012)

When the economy was better up her in the pacific NW, we used to win quite a few of these types of resi jobs with a "cost plus" bid. The plus is the percentage you want to make (or can afford to lose) above and beyond the cost of the tangible items like materials, permits, etc. The materials were always marked up to our sell price as well, which gave a little more cushion to the job. These jobs weren't profit windfalls, but we kept a lot of guys busy.


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## Magnettica (Jan 23, 2007)

To the OP.... don't forget to calculate for high ceilings and/ or landscape crap in the way for those exterior hi-hats. And a contract with clauses, that's also pretty damn important on a large project like this. Be firm and don't waiver from your price, stand firm, and have the buyer SIGN A CONTRACT.


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## stefanop1979 (Sep 26, 2012)

I roughed in my own house which is 3200 sq ft., 62 potlights, 9 soffit pots, and a few extra tails in the attic, and I ran through 6 coils of 14/2. 



Marc77 said:


> I want to thank you guys for the advice, after I added the material it came to closer to 30k. I realize there's a lot of unforeseen and detail that needs to be addressed. The one thing I'm not sure is how much 14/2. I priced 150m roll for every 1000sqf, so 5rolls but there are so many pots that I think the number is closer to 8.


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