# Inside Apprentice working outside of jurisdiction



## tophat (Aug 12, 2012)

Hello all. New user, first time poster.
I have a question I was hoping someone here could advise me on.
I am a inside apprentice working in the outside locals jurisdiction. I know that the JW's on the job will be signing the outside locals book (3?) and begin recieving a higher rate of pay. As an apprentice I know I am generally not allowed to work outside of my jurisdiction. But I am pretty sure I will be signing the book too. I was wondering if anyone else had experienced something like this? I was also wondering what to expect in terms of pay and benefits. Will I recieve the pay upgrade too since essentially we arew all signing the outside locals book? Is there a way they can keep me on the job and deny me the new higher wage? Would I recieve my current apprentice pay for the inside program, The pay for the corresponding level of apprenticeship in the outside program or the same wage as the JW's that are on the job? Thanks and solidarity!!


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## sbuck22 (Jun 14, 2012)

The best thing for you to do is contact you apprenticeship coordinator. If you do not have one contact whoever is in charge of the apprenticeship and make sure they have knowledge of you working outside of your classification and they will also tell you what to expect.

I worked in another local as an apprentice but the two locals had a prior agreement and I was paid the benefits of the other local and paid the higher of the two wages.


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## tophat (Aug 12, 2012)

Thanks for the reply. I contacted my our training director last week. I was contacted back earlier this week and told I was ok to work for the outside wireman local (technically I am still geographically inside my jurisdiction). The work is outside wireman work but the job classification is different so none of the outside guys want it, since it would mean a big drop in pay for them. It means a raise for all of the JW's and (hopefully) me too! I just wasnt sure how it works with apprentices. I think we will be signing their book 3. I dont necessarily trust the hall or the contractor. Its become clear that they really arent looking out for our best interests anymore. I understand the reasons why they might not be, but it still doesnt make it right... I was hoping a brother on here would have experienced or had some knowledge of what might happen in a situation like this. So i could have an idea about what to say or expect when we sign the book. Obviously I would like to recieve the raise. If there is some precedent I would like to be made aware of it. Thanks!!


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## btharmy (Jan 17, 2009)

It seems like a strange situation to me. You imply the "outside" guys don't want the work because of the pay cut. So why would an "inside" guy get a pay raise to "outside" wages do the work? Seems fishy. If it is true, working on the same job, you should get the pay increase too. It sucks you don't think your hall is looking out for its members. It sucks even worse if you are right. No offense, but for your sake, I hope you are wrong.


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## sbuck22 (Jun 14, 2012)

As a JIW I ran a project with JOW but we were doing work that could be classified either way so I still received JIW scale and they had JOW scale. Only job I was ever on where the foreman made less than the workers.


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## tophat (Aug 12, 2012)

Apparently we were supposed to have been receiving the higher rate for weeks now. But the hall said they didnt want to play hardball. In our area outside lineman make about 10+/hr more than inside. But another job classification that belongs to the outside local is for traffic signals. It pays less than line work does. So none of them want to do it and take a pay cut. But the work needs to get done. Since we are inside guys, we cant sign book 1 or book 2. But we can sign book 3. So i think thats what will happen. The hall cleared me to sign the book. I was just wondering, if anyone knew, if there was a statute or precendent for denying me, an apprentice, the higher traffic signal rate.


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## sbuck22 (Jun 14, 2012)

If you are working out of a local other than your home local whether it is your classification or not you must play by the rules of the local you are working in.

When you top out and travel to another local it will be the same as working out of classification. When you sign to work in another local you use their bylaws not your home locals. So what ever their wages are become your wages, what ever their benefits are become your benefits. The jobsite conditions that are in the bylaws become your jobsite conditions. 

So yes you should get the wages of a person in that classification that describes you. Your benefits will be paid to the local you are working out of and then through reciprocity be sent back to your home local.

Have you signed the ERTS(Electronic Reciprocal Transfer System) forms? If not contact your home local for the form. Otherwise your H&W, pension and any other funds will stay in the other local and you would have a break in your H&W.


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## Celtic (Nov 19, 2007)

LU 3 has so many classifications, it really matters which classifications you are actually talking about.

LU 3 has both inside and outside agreements...which may also overlap classifications.... to further muddy the waters.

What letter are they up to? Like "L" or "M"?


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## tophat (Aug 12, 2012)

I dont want to say which local just yet. I get the feeling from the conversations and situations that things are touchy right now. I don't know if anyone here is from my local, so I want to be discreet. I necessarily mind rocking the boat, I just want to know what it is Im talking about before I speak up. Thanks everybody for taking the time and for your input. I really appreciate it.


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## sbuck22 (Jun 14, 2012)

I haven't seen any touchy subjects just info. When all else fails ask the JIW's you work with.


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## tophat (Aug 12, 2012)

aApparently I was eligible to sign their book amd recieve the signalman rate. But he outside local wanted one of their apprentices on the job so I will be shipped off to another site...damn... Thanks sbuck22, celtic and btharmy for responding


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