# T-12 to T-8 bulb color



## The Lightman (Jan 9, 2010)

I have been installing Sylvania FO32/25W/841/XP/SS/ECO in a couple of parking garages that I maintain for the last eight months and am quite satisfied with them.
• Up to 22% energy savings compared
to standard 32W T8 lamp
• 25 Watt, 4-foot, SUPERSAVER energy
saving, T8 lamp
• A member of the SYLVANIA
ECOLOGIC3 family of lamps
• 2475 Initial lumens (850 is 2400)
• 94% lumen maintenance at 40% of
rated life


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## jwjrw (Jan 14, 2010)

But what im asking is what t-8 bulb will give me the same color light the 
t-12 daylight plus has? This is in an office and the owner likes the light color he had before better.


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## The Lightman (Jan 9, 2010)

I did understand your question. The lamps that I mentioned are white in color output. The higher the K, the whiter the light.
FO32/25W/850XP/SS/ECO3 is 5000K


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## The Lightman (Jan 9, 2010)

Correlated color temperature (CCT) is a measure of the "shade" of whiteness of a light source, again by comparison with a blackbody. Typical incandescent lighting is 2700 K, which is yellowish-white. Halogen lighting is 3000 K. Fluorescent lamps are manufactured to a chosen CCT by altering the mixture of phosphors inside the tube. Warm-white fluorescents have CCT of 2700 K and are popular for residential lighting. Neutral-white fluorescents have a CCT of 3000 K or 3500 K. Cool-white fluorescents have a CCT of 4100 K and are popular for office lighting. Daylight fluorescents have a CCT of 5000 K to 6500 K, which is bluish-white.


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## jwjrw (Jan 14, 2010)

Great info. Ok I know white light is 5000k to 6500k. Which one in your opinion is closest to the 6400k daylight plus t-12's? I guess what Im asking is a 6500k t-8 going to br the same white as a t-12 6500k? I had heard they don't match exactly.


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## The Lightman (Jan 9, 2010)

A T=1/8 of an inch. The color should be very close whether it is T-5 or T-12 at whatever Kelvin is specified. Ask your supplier for the brightest they got.


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## jwjrw (Jan 14, 2010)

Thanks for your help. I had been told that the colors were not the same. Thats why I was confused. I found some 6500k. I will buy 4 and put them in a fixture to see if he is happy before I install all the bulbs.


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## The Lightman (Jan 9, 2010)

awesome, light 'em up!


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## Innovative (Jan 26, 2010)

The whitest bulb I have found, without going to a bulb that is over 2.55 per bulb is the GE F32T8/XL/SPX65/ECO. If you are a GE preferred provider on a GE program they will run about 2.28 after your rebate.
CRI 85
Lumens 2750
life 42,000 hours
Color temp 6500K
IMO, a better (cheaper ) product is the Sylvania FO32/765/ECO about $1.65 or a GE F32T8/SP65/ECO about 1.60 both of these lamps are around a 76 CRI 2700 lumens and 24,000 hours.

I really like the GE lamps, they seem to out last all other lamps in the same conditions.


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## jwjrw (Jan 14, 2010)

Innovative said:


> The whitest bulb I have found, without going to a bulb that is over 2.55 per bulb is the GE F32T8/XL/SPX65/ECO. If you are a GE preferred provider on a GE program they will run about 2.28 after your rebate.
> CRI 85
> Lumens 2750
> life 42,000 hours
> ...


 

Cheapest I can find 6500k here is 2.90 each
My light bulb dealer who I can usually get 4100k for 1.20 each is almost 4.00 a bulb.
Lowes is 6.98 for 2
Ill have to check online for the ones you listed. Thanks


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## BuzzKill (Oct 27, 2008)

jwjrw said:


> The t-12 Had "Daylight plus" bulbs.


It's lamps! Not "bulbs".
"Bulbs" are what you put in the ground to grow.


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## BuzzKill (Oct 27, 2008)

The Lightman said:


> awesome, light 'em up!


what's the color temp of "reveal" type incandescent?
and..what the color temp of "daylight' florescent, incandescent fixture type?


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## MDShunk (Jan 7, 2007)

When you start to get into the 6,000's, the color turns remarkably blue. Just a head's up.


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## BuzzKill (Oct 27, 2008)

MDShunk said:


> When you start to get into the 6,000's, the color turns remarkably blue. Just a head's up.


as it should be, daylight is blue tinted, makes your hands look "pink" under the window....some people freak over this due to their years on end of exposure to plain yellow lamps. Take the client's hand and walk over to the window and then compare under a regular incandescent.


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## fraydo (Mar 30, 2009)

BuzzKill said:


> as it should be, daylight is blue tinted, makes your hands look "pink" under the window....some people freak over this due to their years on end of exposure to plain yellow lamps. Take the client's hand and walk over to the window and then compare under a regular incandescent.


Thats why reef aquariums will use lamps in the 10,000K range. Less than that and corals will not make it.


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## Lighting Retro (Aug 1, 2009)

> I was told a t-8 5000k would be the same color light as the daylight plus bulbs the t-12's had. Does this sound correct?


Yes, usually you will use 5,000K as a replacement. It's a great look. Going to the 6500 like someone said you will be adding more blue. Almost looks artificial. He will probably like the 5000k. 

The 700 series lamps are cheaper, but the lifespan is not as long and the CRI is not as high. You get what you pay for on those.


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## Innovative (Jan 26, 2010)

fraydo said:


> Thats why reef aquariums will use lamps in the 10,000K range. Less than that and corals will not make it.


Actually coral really enjoy 6500K lamps, the actual color temp of sunlight. The higher color temp lamps are purely for our viewing enjoyment, as they make the corals look more colorful. Alot of people put lamps up to 20000k on their corals, just to get a really blue look.


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## Electric_Light (Apr 6, 2010)

jwjrw said:


> But what im asking is what t-8 bulb will give me the same color light the
> t-12 daylight plus has? This is in an office and the owner likes the light color he had before better.


Daylight Plus is 6500K. I don't know the CRI, but it can be anywhere from 70 to 89 (regular Daylight is 70, Sylvania Daylight Deluxe is 89)

Some supply houses don't even carry 865 in big brands, so you might have to get them at Home Depot. They only have them them in 10 pack, whole cases aren't available. 
The one you want is the Philips TL865/Plus long life (CRI ~82 ~2800 lm) which is $25 for 10. These have the same color as "daylight CFL" that are common these days


I expect the price difference between the RE70 to RE80 to widen even in the next year to reduce inventory. 

Along with most T12s, RE70s will become implicitly banned by DOE legislation effective July 14th, 2010. To meet the new law, 4' T8 and T12 lamps must meet 89 LPW, or 88 LPW for "daylight" (4500 to 7500K) to pass. 
T8 lamps below 4500K: 2816 lumens
T8 lamps between 4500 to 7500: 2848 lumens 

Right now RE80s maybe pushed as an upgrade or premium over the cheaper RE70s, but not when RE70s are outlawed.


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## fraydo (Mar 30, 2009)

Innovative said:


> Actually coral really enjoy 6500K lamps, the actual color temp of sunlight. The higher color temp lamps are purely for our viewing enjoyment, as they make the corals look more colorful. Alot of people put lamps up to 20000k on their corals, just to get a really blue look.


As I remember, it was recommended to use the 10000k lamps because the xoxanthellae in captive coral, specially the stony kind, needed the added spectrum.


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## pesdfw (Jun 23, 2010)

I use 5000k on everything ... I hate the yellow look the lower k bulbs give out ... I think the blue in the 6500k would just be weird ...


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## Electric_Light (Apr 6, 2010)

There are six colors to chose from. 35&41 are the most popular in commercial applications. 

I think only Sylvania makes 2700K T8 lamps, but its the color of most residential screw-in CFLs. 

5000K works good if you're blending with daylight, but many occupants will find too "harsh" or "blue".
2700
3000
*3500
4100*
5000
6500


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## Toronto Sparky (Apr 12, 2009)

Chart of colors


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## Lighting Retro (Aug 1, 2009)

We use 5,000 on nearly everything, and when we present 4100k along with 5000k, 5000k almost always wins. We rarely get a request for 3500k, and have yet to get one for 6500.


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## Electric_Light (Apr 6, 2010)

Toronto Sparky said:


> Chart of colors


It's worth noting that kelvin temperature used for everything but incandescent lamps is *correlated* color temperature, meaning that its assigned a "best fit" kelvin temperature. 










The center line represents blackbody radiator and perpendicular lines show the variation in chromaticity for same color temperatures. As the graph shows, its possible for a source to have quite a bit of variation in color, but still have the same 4000K CCT. 

I have noticed that even with 741/841 lamps, some have greener tint while some have pinkish tint. 

The lighting industry uses photopic lumen and it should be the standard used for reporting purposes(unless/until it becomes an accepted performance measure), but in low light level, higher CCTs tend to produce higher scotopic weighed lumens, so they seem brighter(with some exceptions such as clear mercury which has a CCT close 6500K)

http://www.getdeco.com/products/induction/intro/pdf/Photoptic_vs_Scoptopic_Case_Study.pdf
Of course, before/after photo here is useless, because the camera auto-adjust exposure but the chart looks interesting.

About attachments:

Left to right. What it looks like on "daylight balance" or when you go inside after being outside in the daylight. 

3000K halogen, 27, 35, 41, 50, 65 CFLs

What it looks like on "tungsten balance" on right side.. if you're working where its lit by a halogen light, then go into a room lit by 6500K light, then this is what you'll experience.

In the consumer market 27 = soft white, 35= bright white, 41 = cool white, 50 is uncommon, 65 = daylight.

I think 6500 looks bad... 3500 and 4100, you can't really go wrong with. 
I personally like the 5000, specifically the PHILIPS ALTO 850.


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## sparky970 (Mar 19, 2008)

jwjrw said:


> I have a customer who I changed some t-12 fixtures to t-8's.
> The t-12 Had "Daylight plus" bulbs. Im told they might be 6400k.
> The T-8 fixtures came with 4100k bulbs. The 4100k put too much pink light out for customer. Customer wants the "white" light the t-12 bulbs had. I was told a t-8 5000k would be the same color light as the daylight plus bulbs the t-12's had. Does this sound correct?


6400's would be awfully "blue"


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## jwjrw (Jan 14, 2010)

I tried 5000k and 6000k. Customer wanted the 6000k.


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## Toronto Sparky (Apr 12, 2009)

jwjrw said:


> I tried 5000k and 6000k. Customer wanted the 6000k.



Guess he was feeling blue. :whistling2:


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