# Does anyone run a home run just for garage door operers?



## backstay (Feb 3, 2011)

I run up to two openers off one circuit, but I feed from a GFCI receptacle on the wall.


----------



## bmailman20 (Jan 4, 2013)

backstay said:


> I run up to two openers off one circuit, but I feed from a GFCI receptacle on the wall.


I do the same, so I can gfi protect the openers for the inspector, and then line-side it afterwards (wink).


----------



## Dennis Alwon (May 9, 2009)

bmailman20 said:


> I usually have a 12-wire circuit for my garage outlets, and I'll run a deprecate load from the gfi for the GDOs. My foreman says he wants a HR for each opener. Sounds like a major waste to me. Any thoughts?


Nothing wrong with your install but I usually do put the gdo on its own circuit. If there are 2 doors then I usually run one circuit for both.


----------



## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

I've always installed a dedicated (not sure what a deprecated circuit is!) 20a circuit... one or two openers.

HO's really like to be able to turn of the operators when they go on vacation.


----------



## MIKEFLASH (Apr 14, 2012)

Nope never its a waste


----------



## bmailman20 (Jan 4, 2013)

480sparky said:


> I've always installed a dedicated (not sure what a deprecated circuit is!) 20a circuit... one or two openers.
> 
> HO's really like to be able to turn of the operators when they go on vacation.


I meant a seperate gfi load. Big thumbs and iPhones don't mix. Lol


----------



## Powersource (Aug 19, 2011)

Always put Garage door opener and doorbell on same circuit. May even throw the attic light on it too.


----------



## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

bmailman20 said:


> I meant a seperate gfi load. Big thumbs and iPhones don't mix. Lol


I've always installed a dedicated 20a circuit... one or two openers.



480sparky said:


> I've always installed a dedicated (not sure what a deprecated circuit is!) 20a circuit... one or two openers.
> 
> HO's really like to be able to turn of the operators when they go on vacation.


----------



## TOOL_5150 (Aug 27, 2007)

480sparky said:


> I've always installed a dedicated (not sure what a deprecated circuit is!) 20a circuit... one or two openers.
> 
> HO's really like to be able to turn of the operators when they go on vacation.


I dont deal with many openers, but mine can lock from the wired switch in the garage. dont need to shut it off.


----------



## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

TOOL_5150 said:


> I dont deal with many openers, but mine can lock from the wired switch in the garage. dont need to shut it off.



As I stated, some HO's like to be able to turn them off.


----------



## sbrn33 (Mar 15, 2007)

480sparky said:


> As I stated, some HO's like to be able to turn them off.


I would put a wall switch then. I don't like homeowners in an electrical panel for no real reason.


----------



## ElectricJoeNJ (Feb 24, 2011)

480sparky said:


> As I stated, some HO's like to be able to turn them off.


In the past I've wired them to a wall switch near the house entry door so they can shut them off if they want to.


----------



## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

sbrn33 said:


> I would put a wall switch then. I don't like homeowners in an electrical panel for no real reason.


 Why not? You don't think homeowners are intelligent enough to turn a breaker on and off but are smart enough to operate a switch?


----------



## FanelliBT (Dec 14, 2012)

We one one circuit for all garage doors but on loadside of the GFCI on the outside of the garage... To many people around here don't carry house keys. I don't get why but they do...


----------



## wendon (Sep 27, 2010)

backstay said:


> I run up to two openers off one circuit, but I feed from a GFCI receptacle on the wall.


If they want to turn off the openers, tell them just to push the test button!


----------



## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

wendon said:


> If they want to turn off the openers, tell them just to push the test button!


Although technically, that's not a 'legal' disconnect. Jez sayin'


----------



## wendon (Sep 27, 2010)

480sparky said:


> Although technically, that's not a 'legal' disconnect. Jez sayin'


:laughing::laughing::laughing: WWCD!

I used to wire them on a separate circuit until they required GFCI protection. Now I feed them from a GFI on the garage wall.


----------



## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

wendon said:


> :laughing::laughing::laughing: WWCD!


Start a poll. :whistling2:


----------



## leland (Dec 28, 2007)

480sparky said:


> I've always installed a dedicated (not sure what a deprecated circuit is!) 20a circuit... one or two openers.
> 
> HO's really like to be able to turn of the operators when they go on vacation.



Now that is really weird. To me. I have never in 30 years had such a request.

Nor have I run a ckt from the basement to the attic to the garage.

Even when there where only GFCI brkrs available for a reasonable fee.

20A ckt to the garage (lights 15A off of the lighting ckt.). All GFI requirements met. want more... pay more.:thumbsup:.


----------



## Vintage Sounds (Oct 23, 2009)

My parents' house has three door openers on a single 15A circuit, as well as 3 receptacles. Never been a problem. Canada has no GFCI requirement for garages, but I put one in anyway.


----------



## BBQ (Nov 16, 2010)

bmailman20 said:


> I usually have a 12-wire circuit for my garage outlets, and I'll run a deprecate load from the gfi for the GDOs. My foreman says he wants a HR for each opener. Sounds like a major waste to me. Any thoughts?


My thoughts are that you have started two threads about problems you are having with your foreman.

My suggestion is to do what is asked of you (assuming it is within code) or find a new job.


----------



## Dennis Alwon (May 9, 2009)

480sparky said:


> Although technically, that's not a 'legal' disconnect. Jez sayin'


You don't need a disconnect for the gdo since it plugs in so the gfci does not have to be within sight


----------



## bmailman20 (Jan 4, 2013)

BBQ said:


> My thoughts are that you have started two threads about problems you are having with your foreman.
> 
> My suggestion is to do what is asked of you (assuming it is within code) or find a new job.


No real problem with the foreman, but in 10 years, I've learned that different shops satisfy the code and customers needs with different methods. In the future, I hope to be on my own, and I find this forum a useful tool to gather several useful opinions. 
For now, like you say, just do what's asked of me.


----------



## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

bmailman20 said:


> I usually have a 12-wire circuit for my garage outlets, and I'll run a deprecate load from the gfi for the GDOs. My foreman says he wants a HR for each opener. Sounds like a major waste to me. Any thoughts?


my panel runneth over.....~CS~


----------



## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

Dennis Alwon said:


> You don't need a disconnect for the gdo since it plugs in so the gfci does not have to be within sight



Run-of-the-mill GFCIs are not rated as disconnects. That's my point.


----------



## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

leland said:


> Now that is really weird. To me. I have never in 30 years had such a request...........


That's because the average HO never has thought about it.


----------



## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

bmailman20 said:


> I usually have a 12-wire circuit for my garage outlets, and I'll run a deprecate load from the gfi for the GDOs. My foreman says he wants a HR for each opener. Sounds like a major waste to me. Any thoughts?


That is a waste unless they're 20' doors..:laughing:


----------



## Voyager (Mar 4, 2010)

I will always run a separate 20 amp circuit to ceiling mounted receptacles for the garage door openners. One circuit for all openners.


----------



## kbsparky (Sep 20, 2007)

Got 3 openers on one circuit. Run `em all at the same time, too. Never had a problem. :thumbup:


----------



## retiredsparktech (Mar 8, 2011)

480sparky said:


> I've always installed a dedicated (not sure what a deprecated circuit is!) 20a circuit... one or two openers.
> 
> HO's really like to be able to turn of the operators when they go on vacation.


 What about the new GDO's, that have the battery backup. The batteries will be dead, by the time they return.
BTW, what code cycle did they require GDO receptacles, to be GFI'ed.


----------



## bmailman20 (Jan 4, 2013)

retiredsparktech said:


> What about the new GDO's, that have the battery backup. The batteries will be dead, by the time they return.
> BTW, what code cycle did they require GDO receptacles, to be GFI'ed.


'08 requires ALL outlets in garages and unfinished basements to have gfi protection. This includes GDOs, alarm systems, freezers, and ejector pumps. Major pain in the a$$ when there's a nuisance trip. The only exception is a fire protection panel


----------



## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

retiredsparktech said:


> What about the new GDO's, that have the battery backup. The batteries will be dead, by the time they return.
> ..........


Is that my problem?


----------



## sbrn33 (Mar 15, 2007)

bmailman20 said:


> '08 requires ALL outlets in garages and unfinished basements to have gfi protection. This includes GDOs, alarm systems, freezers, and ejector pumps. Major pain in the a$$ when there's a nuisance trip. The only exception is a fire protection panel


What is a nuisance trip?


----------



## bmailman20 (Jan 4, 2013)

sbrn33 said:


> What is a nuisance trip?


Where I would normally put a single receptacle, now I need a gfi, where someone is likely to use the other half of the receptacle. Opens the possibility of tripping the gfi, and disabling my GDO, bait freezer, sewage pump, or other essential equipment. 
I would love to see a single gfi receptacle.


----------



## drspec (Sep 29, 2012)

bmailman20 said:


> Where I would normally put a single receptacle, now I need a gfi, where someone is likely to use the other half of the receptacle. Opens the possibility of tripping the gfi, and disabling my GDO, bait freezer, sewage pump, or other essential equipment.
> I would love to see a single gfi receptacle.


They may cost more, but have you ever heard of gfci breakers?


----------



## kbsparky (Sep 20, 2007)

drspec said:


> ... have you ever heard of gfci breakers?


Using GFCI breakers in place of receptacles does not solve the nuisance trip problem associated with these devices.

Freezers full of spoiled food or bait, flooded basements from non-working sump pumps, and inoperative door openers will still result from either method.


----------



## drspec (Sep 29, 2012)

kbsparky said:


> Using GFCI breakers in place of receptacles does not solve the nuisance trip problem associated with these devices.
> 
> Freezers full of spoiled food or bait, flooded basements from non-working sump pumps, and inoperative door openers will still result from either method.


I have never had nuisance tripping with a gfci. There was always a reason for the tripping. It may be a fault of the equipment that's plugged in. It may be something in the wiring, but there's always a problem that triggers the tripping.
Removing the gfci protection or installing a single receptacle does not magically fix the problem.


----------



## RGH (Sep 12, 2011)

HARRY304E said:


> That is a waste unless they're 20' doors..:laughing:


...for the hell of it as Harry said here (waste)..and your boss told you so this is a very good reason too...your in the pickle kid....the springs do the work if the door is setup correctly....a child could open a 600# door...do you know how to do a motor load calulation?....this would be a nice learning problem for you...code issue/demand issue/boss issue(lol) can you get the spec sheet for the door opener? this will help you to understand why 20 amps is a waste here for starters...:thumbup:


----------



## sbrn33 (Mar 15, 2007)

kbsparky said:


> Using GFCI breakers in place of receptacles does not solve the nuisance trip problem associated with these devices.
> 
> Freezers full of spoiled food or bait, flooded basements from non-working sump pumps, and inoperative door openers will still result from either method.


What is a nuisance trip?


----------



## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

sbrn33 said:


> What is a nuisance trip?


I consider it the response someone gives their customers in order to blame the GFCI for malfunctioning instead of accepting the real reason of an actual ground fault.


----------



## Skooby (May 3, 2012)

My inspector lets me wire a single receptacle for door opener(s) if they are on(in) the ceiling on the line side of the GFCI, and I label them "no GFCI protection".


----------



## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

Skooby said:


> My inspector lets me wire a single receptacle for door opener(s) if they are on(in) the ceiling on the line side of the GFCI, and I label them "no GFCI protection".


Then your inspector needs a Code Update class.


----------



## Southeast Power (Jan 18, 2009)

bmailman20 said:


> I usually have a 12-wire circuit for my garage outlets, and I'll run a deprecate load from the gfi for the GDOs. My foreman says he wants a HR for each opener. Sounds like a major waste to me. Any thoughts?


Do what your foreman wants. They may have asked for or were sold a separate circuit 
When you get to play foreman, you will expect your guys to do what you ask.

If you don't learn how to take orders, you cannot give orders.


----------



## mbednarik (Oct 10, 2011)

480sparky said:


> Then your inspector needs a Code Update class.


You need to read our state amendments.

http://www.dps.state.ia.us/fm/electrician/ElectricalCode/Electrical_Code.shtml


----------



## rrolleston (Mar 6, 2012)

I run a home run for all mine right to the nearest receptacle in the garage.


----------



## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

mbednarik said:


> You need to read our state amendments.
> 
> http://www.dps.state.ia.us/fm/electrician/ElectricalCode/Electrical_Code.shtml


I ignore it because far too many local AHJs haven't accepted the change


----------



## Saywhat16 (Jan 17, 2013)

Depending on the wattage used on the garage door motor If the main panel is easy to get to and u have enough room n panel best to run a home run. If u r connecting to a used circuit Be sure u don't run over ur wattage rating


----------



## RGH (Sep 12, 2011)

@115v for reference.....1/4hp 5.8a....1/3hp 7.2a....1/2hp....we won't go there....:whistling2:...so where do we want to go with this...15 or 20....op please..and tell us what and why you think ok?.....:whistling2:...Gfic to BE included in the circuit as req'd.....size/cir and why...


----------



## big2bird (Oct 1, 2012)

bmailman20 said:


> I usually have a 12-wire circuit for my garage outlets, and I'll run a deprecate load from the gfi for the GDOs. My foreman says he wants a HR for each opener. Sounds like a major waste to me. Any thoughts?


Do as your told. Code is just a minimum requirement. Maybe the homeowner just wants it.


----------



## kbsparky (Sep 20, 2007)

sbrn33 said:


> What is a nuisance trip?





480sparky said:


> I consider it the response someone gives their customers in order to blame the GFCI for malfunctioning instead of accepting the real reason of an actual ground fault.





drspec said:


> I have never had nuisance tripping with a gfci. There was always a reason for the tripping. It may be a fault of the equipment that's plugged in. It may be something in the wiring, but there's always a problem that triggers the tripping.
> Removing the gfci protection or installing a single receptacle does not magically fix the problem.


A "nuisance" trip occurs when the GFCI trips out when there has not been any ground fault condition from connected equipment. The GFCI trips out usually due to outside influences, such as from surges.

In my experience this usually happens during thunderstorms, from distant and not-so-distant lightning strikes.

Even GFCI units with =nothing= connected suffer from this problem.

The CMP have ignored this problem with all the mandates and discussions about improving the operation of refrigerators, motors, etc. Like I said, even GFCI units with nothing plugged into them can and will trip out from these events.

So, a homeowner has a freezer full of food, and a sump pump in the basement. A bad storm blows through, and trips out all their GFCI outlets.

The homeowner is away on vacation for a week, and returns home to find spoiled food (ruined freezer), and a flooded basement. All in the name of "safety". I say HUMBUG!! 

No, an alarm would not have helped in this situation, either.


----------



## Shockdoc (Mar 4, 2010)

My ex boss would have us run a 20 amp circuit for them. I just tag them off any local circuit.


----------



## Shockdoc (Mar 4, 2010)

big2bird said:


> Do as your told. Code is just a minimum requirement. Maybe the homeowner just wants it.


"F*ck you, I won't do what you tell me" .......:laughing:


----------



## union347sparky (Feb 29, 2012)

Egos run wild on this forum. .


----------



## 99cents (Aug 20, 2012)

I don't understand the question. This is like asking, "Should I run a home run for a popcorn machine?"

Until you know what your connected load is (i.e, watts, hp, amps), how do you answer that question?

How many doors?
HP per door?
Calculated current?
Make an informed decision.


----------



## Paul353 (Nov 18, 2012)

Would this be considered a "Home run" for the garage door openers? After all, it does run to the home... :001_huh:


----------



## macmikeman (Jan 23, 2007)

In response to the original poster: Yes, in my own garage I did it. I have three sloping doors that do a 45 deg instead of a 90 when they roll up. The top of the rail and the motor are around 14 foot up in the air. I dig my garage.


----------



## Saywhat16 (Jan 17, 2013)

Just do the math what size motor and how many watts it takes. For example if ur using 1000watt on each opener than run two openers if needed. Gives u 20% left over shouldn't have no problem. No code required to run each one seperate.


----------



## Saywhat16 (Jan 17, 2013)

backstay said:


> I run up to two openers off one circuit, but I feed from a GFCI receptacle on the wall.


Cheaper to run gfci breaker on the one circuit. Wait till they want AFCI on all breakers. From my understanding it will happen in the next decade.


----------



## Saywhat16 (Jan 17, 2013)

bmailman20 said:


> I do the same, so I can gfi protect the openers for the inspector, and then line-side it afterwards (wink).


Just do the right thing. Shows ur character if u change something u should not. And they can come back on u for that and maybe pull ur licsense.


----------



## Jlarson (Jun 28, 2009)

sbrn33 said:


> What is a nuisance trip?


Bull ****


----------



## ElectricJoeNJ (Feb 24, 2011)

Saywhat16 said:


> Just do the right thing. Shows ur character if u change something u should not. And they can come back on u for that and maybe pull ur licsense.


I never gfi protect GDO's. I put in a single recept which eliminates the need for gfi protection. Never failed either, I do the same for sumps.


----------



## toolaholic (Aug 13, 2010)

*About gd operators !*

I install all My doors. Last one I did was a chamberlin Belt Quiet drive with Battery back up. Soo Quiet. It's the only one I will ever sell . !!:thumbsup:


----------



## Nukie Poo (Sep 3, 2012)

bmailman20 said:


> '08 requires ALL outlets in garages and unfinished basements to have gfi protection. This includes GDOs, alarm systems, freezers, and ejector pumps. Major pain in the a$$ when there's a nuisance trip. The only exception is a fire protection panel


Not if you install twist-loc cord caps and receptacles.


----------



## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

Nukie Poo said:


> Not if you install twist-loc cord caps and receptacles.


Code reference, please.


----------



## Nukie Poo (Sep 3, 2012)

kbsparky said:


> A "nuisance" trip occurs when the GFCI trips out when there has not been any ground fault condition from connected equipment. The GFCI trips out usually due to outside influences, such as from surges.
> 
> In my experience this usually happens during thunderstorms, from distant and not-so-distant lightning strikes.
> 
> ...


Twist-loc


----------



## Nukie Poo (Sep 3, 2012)

Saywhat16 said:


> Just do the math what size motor and how many watts it takes. For example if ur using 1000watt on each opener than run two openers if needed. Gives u 20% left over shouldn't have no problem. No code required to run each one seperate.


You shouldn't use this method; this is a motor load not a resistive load. Also, the 125% rule does not apply to noncontinuous loads.


----------



## Big John (May 23, 2010)

Nukie Poo said:


> Not if you install twist-loc cord caps and receptacles.


 The code doesn't specify the NEMA type of the receptacle requiring GFCI protection, it just specifies voltage and amperage. Twist lock would make no difference.


----------



## Wingman2002 (Jan 2, 2011)

The garage doors being GFCI protected is another one of those code changes that is created to protect the homeowner from themselves (like everything being Arc fault) When actually what it created was the homeowner now getting less than what they were getting. We would pull a 12-2 home run to the openers, now we jump it off the GFCI in the garage. We would ask if there was going to be a freezer in the garage and pull a separate circuit. Now with everything in the garage GFCI, they do not get a dedicated circuit. For years all receptacles were 12 and lights 14, now the only 12 is what is required by code!!


----------



## Nukie Poo (Sep 3, 2012)

480sparky said:


> Code reference, please.


I cant give you a code ref because there isn't one; apparently I'm wrong.


----------



## Nukie Poo (Sep 3, 2012)

Wingman2002 said:


> The garage doors being GFCI protected is another one of those code changes that is created to protect the homeowner from themselves (like everything being Arc fault) When actually what it created was the homeowner now getting less than what they were getting. We would pull a 12-2 home run to the openers, now we jump it off the GFCI in the garage. We would ask if there was going to be a freezer in the garage and pull a separate circuit. Now with everything in the garage GFCI, they do not get a dedicated circuit. For years all receptacles were 12 and lights 14, now the only 12 is what is required by code!!


About 12 yrs ago, we got an interesting service call: an estate with a 3-car detached garage had one opener short out. All three openers were on one circuit. The problem was those garage doors were the *ONLY* doors one the structure. No windows either. As you might imagine, the solution involved a Saw-Zall.


----------



## Big John (May 23, 2010)

Folks have proposed amendments to exempt door-openers from being GFCI protected in situations where the garage door was the only means of entry into the garage.

CMPs reason for rejection was that most doors have manual releases. :blink: I didn't really think they understood the proposal.


----------



## FanelliBT (Dec 14, 2012)

Big John said:


> Folks have proposed amendments to exempt door-openers from being GFCI protected in situations where the garage door was the only means of entry into the garage.
> 
> CMPs reason for rejection was that most doors have manual releases. :blink: I didn't really think they understood the proposal.


We put the GFCI outside the garage and load off that to the door so you can't be locked out.


----------



## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

Big John said:


> Folks have proposed amendments to exempt door-openers from being GFCI protected in situations where the garage door was the only means of entry into the garage.
> 
> CMPs reason for rejection was that most doors have manual releases. :blink: I didn't really think they understood the proposal.



You mean it's impossible to walk to the front door of the house? :001_huh:


----------



## Shockdoc (Mar 4, 2010)

Big John said:


> Folks have proposed amendments to exempt door-openers from being GFCI protected in situations where the garage door was the only means of entry into the garage.
> 
> CMPs reason for rejection was that most doors have manual releases. :blink: I didn't really think they understood the proposal.


 Or just place the GFCI on the outside of the garage. I ran into that situation before on a detach so I placed the GFCI at the house , that in fact only required me to a depth of 12" which save d some work.


----------



## davis9 (Mar 21, 2009)

A stand alone garage with no man door could be an issue.

If the door opener is small enough to go on a General purpose branch circuit so be it. If it's a large custom that is paying more it may get an individual branch circuit. May.


----------



## BBQ (Nov 16, 2010)

Big John said:


> Folks have proposed amendments to exempt door-openers from being GFCI protected in situations where the garage door was the only means of entry into the garage.
> 
> CMPs reason for rejection was that most doors have manual releases. :blink: I didn't really think they understood the proposal.


If someone has a garage with only an overhead door to get into it and they put an electric opener on it they would be an idiot for not spending $15 on an external door release. 

https://www.google.com/search?q=ove...98,d.dmg&fp=7550d67865486630&biw=1024&bih=672











This installs in about 10 minutes, the key part goes on the moving door up high in the middle, you turn the key, pull it out and the cord yanks the release inside.

Simple, effective and stupid not to have if you are counting on the door opener to work.


----------



## Nukie Poo (Sep 3, 2012)

BBQ said:


> If someone has a garage with only an overhead door to get into it and they put an electric opener on it they would be an idiot for not spending $15 on an external door release.
> 
> https://www.google.com/search?q=overhead+door+emergency+release&ie=UTF-8&oe=UTF-8&hl=en&client=safari#q=overhead%20door%20emergency%20release&hl=en&safe=off&client=safari&source=lnms&tbm=shop&sa=X&ei=27lOUffCK8zh4AO68IGoBw&ved=0CA4Q_AUoAQ&num=20&sei=6blOUer1CuS20QHhlYCgBg&bav=on.2,or.&bvm=bv.44158598,d.dmg&fp=7550d67865486630&biw=1024&bih=672
> 
> ...


This was a $20 million estate owned by one of the executives from Revlon. Architects don't always use household garage door openers on such homes. This one was a commercial type with the motor on the side of the door header and with a manual clutch release and hoist chain on the side. On another estate, we had a similar problem with one of those Schwise bifold aircraft hanger doors that the architect spec'd out for a garage door. Have you ever seen one of these? They fold up like a big giant book with the binding facing out towards the driveway. The gearhead motor lives on the backside of the door and turns a shaft that rolls up these sealbelt-like straps that pulls the bifolds up. When fully open, you cannot see or get at the motor. Theres a special tool that you would use to manually close it if the motor failed. This tool would need to be inserted between the folds, from the side using a tall ladder. The problem was that structure had walls on Either side of the garage door projecting outward. No way to get a tool in there!


----------



## Celtic (Nov 19, 2007)

ElectricJoeNJ said:


> I never gfi protect GDO's. I put in a single recept which eliminates the need for gfi protection. Never failed either.....


....whether or not you fail has no bearing on if the installation is a violation or not ~ it only indicates that both you and the EI are not up on your code.

NJ has no amendment to 210.8(A)(2) and there is no exception that would allow a single device to relieve you of the GFCI requirement.

It may have been allowed due to Exception No. 1 in 2008 [under the 2005], but not today :no:


----------

