# How can you tell if you have salt in your soup?



## e57 (Jun 5, 2009)

Sorry to be so cryptic....


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## mikeh32 (Feb 16, 2009)

share your drugs?


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## doubleoh7 (Dec 5, 2009)




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## miller_elex (Jan 25, 2008)

You paranoid? Probably just a guy who needs to pay the bills.


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## e57 (Jun 5, 2009)

I just find it funny when very well spoken guys from the brotherhood start looking for work.


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## mikeh32 (Feb 16, 2009)

do what ever it takes to keep the food on the table....

Hate to say it, but ive been apart of the union since may, and ive been off for 4 months....

I sold off my company for this?


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## e57 (Jun 5, 2009)

I donno - maybe I'm just bitter.... Paying bills is one thing - but the exclusionary nature of the local local, and previous bowls of saline minestrone in the past make me weary.... So easy to screw up good soup these days....


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## doubleoh7 (Dec 5, 2009)

The nuns at school didn't wear panties like that.


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## e57 (Jun 5, 2009)

doubleoh7 said:


> The nuns at school didn't wear panties like that.


I've always like to think they dont wear any at all. But did YOU get a chance to look????


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## doubleoh7 (Dec 5, 2009)

e57 said:


> I've always like to think they dont wear any at all. But did YOU get a chance to look????


 
I did not have a choice in the matter. Now, I've finally caught on, this thread is about union stuff. I thought it was about cooking or it was some kind of riddle wrapped in an enigma.


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## TOOL_5150 (Aug 27, 2007)

I really dont know how I would get a lazy, overpaid guy out of my soup. I guess I could start with telling him to STFU AND GTFO.

Why is he in my soup anyway. He cant solicit his own soup, its against the rules of their brotherhood.

~Matt


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## Bob Badger (Apr 19, 2009)

TOOL_5150 said:


> I really dont know how I would get a lazy, overpaid guy out of my soup. I guess I could start with telling him to STFU AND GTFO.


When we had salt on one of our jobs that is pretty much what I did each break time.

Me: _We don't want you here, why don't you go F yourself'_

Him: _I am just trying to show you guys how much better it can be'_

Me: _'We did not ask you for any help, go F yourself'_

This pretty much went on each day. :laughing:

This salt would do all the bare minimums, just enough to be a piece of S*** employee but not quite enough to justify firing him which is what he was going for so his local (99) could help him sue for unjust termination.


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## Southeast Power (Jan 18, 2009)

That doesn't sound like a very "right to work" environment Bob.
Why didn't you show him all of the good reasons to work non-union? :whistling2:


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## Bob Badger (Apr 19, 2009)

jrannis said:


> That doesn't sound like a very "right to work" environment Bob.


He did not come 'to work', he came to f with a company that was taking great care of it's employees. The problem was we were taking some of the projects that local 99 assumed were owed to them. We were both 'out of state' and non-union.



> Why didn't you show him all of the good reasons to work non-union? :whistling2:


Had he asked I would have, he did not ask. Instead he just kept pushing his unsolicited agenda on us ....... much like a crazy born again Christian can never just go through the day without asking WWJD every few minutes. 

You will have to take my word for it, this person was a piece of work. ..... Maybe it was brother Noah. :laughing:


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## drsparky (Nov 13, 2008)

Bob Badger said:


> He did not come 'to work', he came to f with a company that was taking great care of it's employees. The problem was we were taking some of the projects that local 99 assumed were owed to them. We were both 'out of state' and non-union.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


One bad salt and you don't like the rest. If you get a bad cup of coffee do you hate all coffee? No you throw it out and hope the next one is better. It make life less boring if your routine gets shaken up a bit.


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

drsparky said:


> One bad salt and you don't like the rest. If you get a bad cup of coffee do you hate all coffee? No you throw it out and hope the next one is better. It make life less boring if your routine gets shaken up a bit.


 
I doubt there any good salts, they might be good men in general. But to take a job like salting a company in my opinion automatically turns a person into the slime beneath a dog turd laying on the side walk in the summer sun.

I have dealt with one salt when I worked open shop and work was not on his mind. The other cases of salts ended up with the EC's spending 1000.00's in legal fees. 

I think the union is great for workers, I would recommended it to any HARD WORKING electricians, but if someone wants to own an open shop and his men are working and getting paid, LEAVE HIM TO F ALONE.

Several things I do not understand, How a salt can look in the mirror with any pride, how salts do not end up in a ditch with two black eyes.


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## slickvic277 (Feb 5, 2009)

And these locals wanna know why their struggling. Their stuck in the 1950's with their mind sets. 

The correct way to salt IMO is only to target shops that are known cheaters. Usually we send hard working guy's out to shops and tell them to keep their mouths shut and bust their ass. If the shop is cheating, it will destroy it's self. If after a few months, things look to be on the up and up we'll either tell the salt to start getting a job else where or we'll cherry pick the best talent from the shop.

We have caught TONS of shops cheating in this fashion. Word to the wise, if your working on PW job's pay the goddamn rate.

I know this gonna stir the sh*t up but it's reality.


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## Bob Badger (Apr 19, 2009)

slickvic277 said:


> The correct way to salt IMO is only to target shops that are known cheaters. Usually we send hard working guy's out to shops and tell them to keep their mouths shut and bust their ass. If the shop is cheating, it will destroy it's self. If after a few months, things look to be on the up and up we'll either tell the salt to start getting a job else where or we'll cherry pick the best talent from the shop.


And why do you think any of what a non-union company does is the unions job to be the police?



> We have caught TONS of shops cheating in this fashion. Word to the wise, if your working on PW job's pay the goddamn rate.


I believe you entirely and agree with you 100%.

But I still see no reason this is the Unions issue to pursue anymore then it is the unions job to watch the local traffic light for red light runners.

The only reason for the union to do this is just another way to bust balls and that is just plain lame. 

Don't tell me it is to 'protect the non union workers' because that is a huge load of crap. 



> I know this gonna stir the sh*t up but it's reality.


I agree companies cheating on PW is a reality with many companies.


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## miller_elex (Jan 25, 2008)

Bob Badger said:


> And why do you think any of what a non-union company does is the unions job to be the police?
> 
> But I still see no reason this is the Unions issue to pursue anymore then it is the unions job to watch the local traffic light for red light runners.
> 
> ...


Its not about busting balls to bust balls or play traffic cop. Its only partially about protecting non-union workers...

Its about protecting our contractors. Its about leveling the playing field.

As for the OP about well spoken guys looking for work, alot of guys in this field have bad ADD. They can't spend more than a couple years anywhere, and will never make a permanent home at a contractor, but are hi-quality hands.


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## Bob Badger (Apr 19, 2009)

miller_elex said:


> Its not about busting balls to bust balls or play traffic cop.


Not buying it for a minute, the goal is to bust the merit shop companies balls by looking to find something they do that may be actionable.




> Its only partially about protecting non-union workers...


It has nothing to do with that at all. 



> Its about protecting our contractors. Its about leveling the playing field.


You are making me spit food out of my mouth, please do not say such funny stuff. :laughing:

Suddenly you care about the contractors ........ yeah right. That is a real knee slapper. :thumbup:


The only purpose of salts, at least in my area, has been to hurt the targeted non-union shop that happens to be doing projects that the union feels belong to them.


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## miller_elex (Jan 25, 2008)

Bob Badger said:


> Suddenly you care about the contractors


Nothing sudden about it, I've always cared. Not everyone is a parasite Bob. Some believe in contributing more to society than we receive. It just happens that we believe in different approaches to the same problems, which are conflicting. I give you alot of credit because I know you're a PM who treats your subordinates well. But like you've said before, life ain't fair, nothing's fair, so the end justifies the means. I believe it shows a lesser man to glue somebody's locks or steal tools, that's against the law and the troublemaker deserves an ass whooping.

The union membership needs to adapt to reality. What form the adaptation brings, or if it we can't come together to adapt, remains to be seen. There is a good amount of union members opposing positive changes. Management at the Hall has their own agenda, which is probably self-serving, and changing how we do business cannot get the priority it deserves. Until then Bob, all the A-Team can do is try to level a playing field against contractors who pay significantly less per man hour.


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## Brother Noah1 (Mar 23, 2010)

You will have to take my word for it, this person was a piece of work. ..... Maybe it was brother Noah. :laughing:[/quote]

Thank you Brother Bob(he is an under covert union member) for the invitation to the conversation. I have been asked to go out to a contractor, work hard and help that said contractor earn money for a said time then go to that said contractor and ask if it would be beneficial for a contract with the union to be signed? If not then I would proceed to another contractor.No ill will intent, only to show a contractor a different way to possibly earn a living. No Bob is not union, to my knowledge could not keep his dues up, maybe it was a lack of fortitude.LOL


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## B4T (Feb 10, 2009)

Bob Badger said:


> When we had salt on one of our jobs that is pretty much what I did each break time.
> 
> Me: _We don't want you here, why don't you go F yourself'_
> 
> ...


Good to see your making friends where ever you go.. :laughing:

Must be fun to work around you when the mood is not right..


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

Brother Noah said:


> You will have to take my word for it, this person was a piece of work. ..... Maybe it was brother Noah. :laughing:





> Thank you Brother Bob(he is an under covert union member) for the invitation to the conversation. I have been asked to go out to a contractor, work hard and help that said contractor earn money for a said time then go to that said contractor and ask if it would be beneficial for a contract with the union to be signed? If not then I would proceed to another contractor.No ill will intent, only to show a contractor a different way to possibly earn a living. No Bob is not union, to my knowledge could not keep his dues up, maybe it was a lack of fortitude.LOL



Noah having read you post for some time I do not doubt this for one second, You seem to care about doing what's right. But around here, based on very little personal experience, a lot of scuttle butt and talk with EC's, few contractors see the type of salting you are discussing.


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## slickvic277 (Feb 5, 2009)

> *Bob Badger;*317004]And why do you think any of what a non-union company does is the unions job to be the police?


Because the state does not enforce the laws that they write to protect the labor and the contractors who play by the rules. 



> I believe you entirely and agree with you 100%.


There's so much cheating that goes on and on so many different levels it's disgusting. There's not one trick that I have not seen.



> But I still see no reason this is the Unions issue to pursue anymore then it is the unions job to watch the local traffic light for red light runners.
> 
> The only reason for the union to do this is just another way to bust balls and that is just plain lame.


Bob I believe your experiences with the union in your area are legit and I have never questioned you on the validity of your claims. But having experience dealing with the union and working with a union are two totally different things.

There's no way for you to really no what goes on because your not a member or a contractor. If this isn't the business of the union's then I don't know what is. The state does not enforce the laws that they write. The fraud that goes on in PA on prevailing wage jobs is incredible. You have contractors pocketing thousands of tax payers dollars while not providing the basic pay and healthcare set forth by the PW laws. And no one checks. Right now the local utility company just tried to circumvent davis bacon and pocket 400 million in tax payer cash.



> Don't tell me it is to 'protect the non union workers' because that is a huge load of crap.


No, it protects ALL workers, to ensure that they receive the level of compensation that is entitled to them by law. It also levels the playing field for ALL contractors playing things by the book. Pursuing, catching, and prosecuting cheating contractors allows legit contractors, not just union, to win bids on PW work.

It's quite simple, if your company bids PW jobs according to the law and another company is shaving $15 per hour off of each man hour, you will never ever win the bid. 




> I agree companies cheating on PW is a reality with many companies.


Happens more then people on this site like to admit to. 

If your of the mindset that PW rates are to high and no one deserves that type of money or those types of benefits, then fine, your entitled to those opinions. And you can easily practice what you deem is fair pay and conditions by not bidding on PW work. BUT what your not entitled to do is cheat on these jobs and pocket the tax payers money for yourself.


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## slickvic277 (Feb 5, 2009)

brian john said:


> Noah having read you post for some time I do not doubt this for one second, You seem to care about doing what's right. But around here, based on very little personal experience, a lot of scuttle butt and talk with EC's, few contractors see the type of salting you are discussing.



I agree. It's counter productive in my opinion. There's nothing to gain by sending people to sabotage or slow down a shop or a job. All it does is piss off the contractor and turn off the men.

The method that I think is the most successful is targeting the shops that are known cheaters OR trying to solicit the best talent from the biggest companies. My local has been very successful with these types of approaches.

Some of our biggest companies are organized companies. I think somewhere in the range of 25-35% of the men in my local are organized hands.


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

slickvic277 said:


> I agree. It's counter productive in my opinion. There's nothing to gain by sending people to sabotage or slow down a shop or a job. All it does is piss off the contractor and turn off the men.


I think this goes back to my marketing post and mistakes unions have made. Any good that may be gained for workers or the union is defeated by the term SALT and at this point in time re-marketing it as anything else will still taste like salt and will be a waste IMO.


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## e57 (Jun 5, 2009)

slickvic277 said:


> Because the state does not enforce the laws that they write to protect the labor and the contractors who play by the rules.
> 
> There's so much cheating that goes on and on so many different levels it's disgusting. There's not one trick that I have not seen.
> 
> ...


I know you addressed this to Bob - but we're all still here....

What exactly is "cheating"? Paying actual market wages/benefits? Is that cheating - or is doing it without paying the union - cheating? The Union has done nothing for me - except exclude, and hinder - so what do I owe them???? NOTHING!

And yes - being in the gang/club I would assume is better than not being in the gang/club - If you wanted or could join it. But since I did not know or blow anyone - I'm not in it....

And this has nothing to do with the highway robbery scam of PW jobs - which 'In this state' all play by the same set of rules - since the IBEW bought their way into enforcing them...

THIS - is about a new shop - getting work they want - it's about jealousy and bitterness about the failings of the gang/club. 'Oh - the reason you're out of work is those guys' - not the the real reason of they bill for an uncompetitive wage on non-PW work - used to drive up PW wages artificially in PW work. (since the people who set such wages are disconnected with the real world.) Once they get in - they usually set up some buddy action which turns to whispering about how this or that could be better and how everyone would get paid more.... In shops that do get rolled over - they lay off the book 4 guys (chaf) - swap in the book 1 guys - then proceed to dry the company out - until it dies - then go back to the competition level they want. 

The idiots they were trying to 'help' (Burn more like it) are then jobless paying dues to an organization that cares little for them - untill they give up and find a real job. Like the non-union one they had before...


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## miller_elex (Jan 25, 2008)

e57 said:


> What exactly is "cheating"? Paying actual market wages/benefits? Is that cheating - or is doing it without paying the union - cheating? The Union has done nothing for me - except exclude, and hinder - so what do I owe them???? NOTHING!
> 
> And yes - being in the gang/club I would assume is better than not being in the gang/club - If you wanted or could join it. But since I did not know or blow anyone - I'm not in it....
> 
> ...


You made some really good points there.

Just make sure you obey the PW rules.


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## e57 (Jun 5, 2009)

miller_elex said:


> You made some really good points there.
> 
> Just make sure you obey the PW rules.


The point is - the particular company, and a number of others I have dealt with the Onion in - did not even bid PW work. Yet were targets....


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## Southeast Power (Jan 18, 2009)

brian john said:


> Noah having read you post for some time I do not doubt this for one second, You seem to care about doing what's right. But around here, based on very little personal experience, a lot of scuttle butt and talk with EC's, few contractors see the type of salting you are discussing.


Thats how we are required to do it in our local. If you cause trouble, it sets back the whole program.
I would expect that for every one person that is like Bob described, there are 1000 more that SALT properly.


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## Southeast Power (Jan 18, 2009)

*Bobs Salting experience*

I kinda see the salting message in this guys story :laughing:

And everyone is still friends..........







I was camping in Northern Cali with my best friend. We each grabbed a bottle of red wine and downed it, along with substantial amounts of NorCal weed, then went to bed.
I woke up in the middle of the night with an insane urge to pee. My drunkeness must have kept me asleep until my body absolutely could not take anymore. However, I was still ****faced when I woke up.
It was too dark too see anything and I couldn't find the zipper to the door. Each passing second hurt more than the last. Finally, I sort of stumble over my friend and find a zipper!!! As soon as I open it, I realize it is just the rain flap for a tent window that has a permanent mesh screen but I just couldn't wait any longer...
I kneeled next to the window, pulled my **** out, stretched the mesh screen as much as I could, put my **** right up to the screen and pushed the piss out as hard as I could - thinking that if I can just give it enough "water-pressure" to make it thru the mesh, I would be fine.
The problem was that I wasn't really paying attention to where my friend was. I was too drunk to realize that I was hovering directly on top of him. His face was literally less than a foot away from my **** as I was pissing and he was still passed out drunk...
He woke to the feeling of my piss splashing off the mesh screen and hitting him in the face. He immediately started freaking out and tried to push me off him but I had started pissing and there was no stopping until I was done! I tried as hard as I could to pin him down but he won and when he pushed me off of him I shot piss straight up into the air and all over everything for a few more seconds until enough was out of my bladder than I could finally take control and stop.
I don't really remember what happened after that, I was too drunk and think I more or less just rolled over and went back to sleep and my friend did the same. When we woke in the morning we crawled out of the tent, stretched and as soon as we made eye contact we both remembered what happened. We fell to the ground laughing so hard we were crying.
To this day (4 years later) we will still randomly say to each other "You/I pissed in the tent" and then just lose our **** and start cracking up again.


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## Bob Badger (Apr 19, 2009)

jrannis said:


> Thats how we are required to do it in our local. If you cause trouble, it sets back the whole program.
> I would expect that for every one person that is like Bob described, there are 1000 more that SALT properly.




And you know that how?

From all your years of working for a targeted company?

John, we had 3 salts from 99 on that one job, they all had the same set of programming.

For years 103 had the company owner in their web site 'Hall of Shame', they finally took it down when the company folded.

http://www.ibew103.com/Contractors-Hall-of-Shame.aspx

You know what they said about him?

Little about work and much about his personal life. How he had a nasty divorce and how the cops had to go to his house. How that had anything to do with the Union I have no idea. Bit it sure showed what type of people run that Local.


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## Southeast Power (Jan 18, 2009)

Bob Badger said:


> And you know that how?
> 
> From all your years of working for a targeted company?
> 
> ...


Bob,
You are describing a very small sample of a national program that is considered to be successful.
Im sorry that you have had a bad experience in the past but you choose to work in an area where you are not welcomed and have guys doing the same work for less pay and benefits for no reason at all. The jobs are very close in price, its just that the money goes in different pockets. 
I just dont know why someone that works as hard as we do would be so delighted about getting paid less.


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

jrannis said:


> Bob,
> You are describing a very small sample of a national program that is considered to be successful.
> Im sorry that you have had a bad experience in the past but you choose to work in an area where you are not welcomed and have guys doing the same work for less pay and benefits for no reason at all. The jobs are very close in price, its just that the money goes in different pockets.
> I just dont know why someone that works as hard as we do would be so delighted about getting paid less.



I bet not one target open shop employer agrees with you. 

I bet most agree with Bob.

Anyone coming into a firm with other than positive thought about being productive worker is trouble.

Salts are just that salts, not there for ANYTHING positive to help the owner, and it is HIS COMPANY, that is not the salts to screw up.


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## George Stolz (Jan 22, 2009)

> Im sorry that you have had a bad experience in the past but you choose to work in an area where you are not welcomed...


Please tell me that this was just a bad choice of words.

Why does a business need to be "welcomed" by anything except the AHJ, et al?


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

George Stolz said:


> Please tell me that this was just a bad choice of words.
> 
> Why does a business need to be "welcomed" by anything except the AHJ, et al?


 
In the end the customer should be allowed to make the choice, not a bunch of self appointed laabor regulators.


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## Bob Badger (Apr 19, 2009)

jrannis said:


> Bob,
> You are describing a very small sample of a national program that is considered to be successful.


You are claiming that you know the details of how it works throughout the nation.

That is as much BS as me saying I know how it works where you are.

I don't know how it works whare you are but I do know how it works here.




> Im sorry that you have had a bad experience in the past but you choose to work in an area where you are not welcomed


WTF?

The union does not own the work, if they cannot compete they they lose. It is that simple, the fact they were losing made them behave like A-Holes. 




> and have guys doing the same work for less pay and benefits for no reason at all.


Again, as I have said many times, that company took great care of us. Yes, our hourly wage would be less but our benefit package was great and we were happy.





> I just dont know why someone that works as hard as we do would be so delighted about getting paid less.


Because many of us have to much pride to join a group of thugs, and that is exactly what the union in this area has always appeared to be. 

Maybe if they did not act like such ****s more of us would be interested in joining. 

Attitudes like you express here



> Im sorry that you have had a bad experience in the past but you choose to work in an area where you are not welcomed


are exactly the type of BS I am talking about, along with being called scabs, rats, POSs etc.


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

> Im sorry that you have had a bad experience in the past but you choose to work in an area where you are not welcomed


If the union men were not welcomed in an are what happens? NLRB in a hot second.


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## miller_elex (Jan 25, 2008)

brian john said:


> If the union men were not welcomed in an are what happens? NLRB in a hot second.


I recently heard the private workforce is only 7% union.

Hard to believe 7% gets people all up in arms.

Its a smokescreen for the top 2% that makes more than the bottom 90%.


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## Bob Badger (Apr 19, 2009)

miller_elex said:


> I recently heard the private workforce is only 7% union.


You should get a job on TV making spining numbers to get what you want. :laughing:

That is 7% overall, so in many parts of the country that number is virtually 0 and in those areas no one is 'up in arms'

However in some metropolitan areas the % is much higher, say NYC or Chicago for instance.

In those areas I can see people getting 'up in arms'


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## John Valdes (May 17, 2007)

It has been many years since I worked union and have zero experience with salts or salting. Why does any non-union company hire a union guy to start with?
I mean why bash them, just don't hire them. I am asking?


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## doubleoh7 (Dec 5, 2009)

miller_elex said:


> I recently heard the private workforce is only 7% union.
> 
> Hard to believe 7% gets people all up in arms.
> 
> Its a smokescreen for the top 2% that makes more than the bottom 90%.


The "owners of this country" need a FEW "unskilled" union guys working in a factory doing menial tasks and making $40 hr with good benefits. They can get guys that make $10 to $25/hr angry and jealous of these"overpaid" guys that do menial tasks. This way the anger is diverted away from them when they rake in millions in one year while running their companies into the ground.


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## Bob Badger (Apr 19, 2009)

John Valdes said:


> It has been many years since I worked union and have zero experience with salts or salting. Why does any non-union company hire a union guy to start with?
> I mean why bash them, just don't hire them. I am asking?


Because if you do not hire them when you are hiring you are very likely to get a discrimination action against you.


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## BDB (Jul 9, 2008)

I have been Union my whole professional life, and I never have agreed/liked the "salting" of a company. There are companies/workers that are Union and some that are not. Let each make up their own mind and do not try and force your beliefs on others.


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## miller_elex (Jan 25, 2008)

Bob Badger said:


> That is 7% overall, so in many parts of the country that number is virtually 0 and in those areas no one is 'up in arms'


There's alot of guys from the south and midwest on here, where it is virtually zero, and they're all up in arms about the union. Some have probably never even seen a van from a union shop! But they'll ramble on-and-on how the unions are in league with the anti-christ... :laughing: Watchout! Its the union boogeyman! The union is in your closet Tommy! The union is under your bed! The union eats fat babies! :laughing:


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## miller_elex (Jan 25, 2008)

John Valdes said:


> Why does any non-union company hire a union guy to start with?


Because they need to man the jobs. I salted, it was two weeks until I got promoted. Next thing I know, I am running hospital work. WTF? 

You'll have to take my word for it, but I never did them wrong. They wanted me to bring in more of my union buddys because of their huge backlog of work. After the big jobs wrapped up, I left for a union shop. They wanted to match my union pay and bennies, but I declined. 

I kind of regret it, they were awfully nice. The work was gravy, 30 minute coffee break, 45 minute lunch, leave 15 minutes early, I never got treatment like that at a union shop. When the PM came to the hospital and wanted to talk, we might take an hour coffee break in the cafeteria. I felt spoiled, but, it is what it is...  Call me a union radical.


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

miller_elex said:


> Because they need to man the jobs. I salted, it was two weeks until I got promoted. Next thing I know, I am running hospital work. WTF?


Were you qualified?




> I kind of regret it, they were awfully nice. The work was gravy, 30 minute coffee break, 45 minute lunch, leave 15 minutes early, I never got treatment like that at a union shop. When the PM came to the hospital and wanted to talk, we might take an hour coffee break in the cafeteria. I felt spoiled, but, it is what it is...  Call me a union radical.


I have seen breaks and lunches stretched equally on any type of job.


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

miller_elex said:


> I
> Its a smokescreen for the top 2% that makes more than the bottom 90%.



Why would the 91% do the bidding of the 2%.


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## miller_elex (Jan 25, 2008)

brian john said:


> Were you qualified? .


 
Hell yeah I am qualified, but I question the judgement of a non-union contractor who puts a salt in charge of their best accounts. If you are going to hire salts, keep them as manpower for chrissakes.

The first thing to change was the customers perception of quality. And I don't mean increased quality while sacrificing quantity. Even with the jobs coming back positive and the customer's bliss with satisfaction, it would never be enough to convince the shop to sign on. The only reason they hired salts was because the backlog was dire.


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## miller_elex (Jan 25, 2008)

brian john said:


> Why would the 91% do the bidding of the 2%.


Because they're mistakenly convinced it is in their best interest? :blink:


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

miller_elex said:


> Because they're mistakenly convinced it is in their best interest? :blink:


Maybe it is, not everyone seems management as the bad guys and not everyone sees the feds as the saviors.


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

miller_elex said:


> Hell yeah I am qualified, but I question the judgement of a non-union contractor who puts a salt in charge of their best accounts. If you are going to hire salts, keep them as manpower for chrissakes.
> e.


When I first joined the local the company I was with put me in charge of a large project after 5 days. Maybe both firms realize good men are in short supply?


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## miller_elex (Jan 25, 2008)

brian john said:


> Maybe both firms realize good men are in short supply?


Good men are in short supply everywhere. I've dug through tons of resumes, and when it comes to electricians, most all the resumes look like crap with misspellings, different fonts, and bad grammar to boot. To me that shows gross lack of attention to details, and lack of willingness to pour effort into something worthwhile as a resume.

One email address really cracked me up. I got one resume from 'bisexual couple.'

The best resume I got, was from a guy I already knew, and he was known for leaving a wake of fuhckups and destruction behind him. Had I not known, the guy would have been an easy hire.

Other than that, the only respectable resumes I received were from guys who didn't quite meet my needs.

Yep, B. John, looks like finding good capable people is like finding a needle in a haystack, no matter where you are. So far as I can tell, the guy with the ugliest truck, who drops the eff-bomb every five seconds, and has kids with multiple women, is likely the diamond in the rough.


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## JTMEYER (May 2, 2009)

miller_elex said:


> There's alot of guys from the south and midwest on here, where it is virtually zero, and they're all up in arms about the union. Some have probably never even seen a van from a union shop! But they'll ramble on-and-on how the unions are in league with the anti-christ... :laughing: Watchout! Its the union boogeyman! The union is in your closet Tommy! The union is under your bed! The union eats fat babies! :laughing:


 
I work in a small town in the midwest. We have 2 union shops in town, and several non-union. I have come in to RATS painted on our building. I have had a "freind" that spent 10 years non-union talk down to me after he went union. Hell I worked as a "card holder" member in the carpenters union just to be told to my face "we don't need to protect YOUR job, your reliable, you come in everyday. We need to protect these other guys that show up late and screw everything up." I was told by a union rep that tried to recruit us at the electrical trade school I went to that "NOOONE has EVER tested in at a higher grade than first year apprentice." So for those keeping score, I've been lied to, threatened by, and let down by the union. As far as I'm concerned I don't care if the union gives winning lottery tickets to first year guys you can count me out, permanantly!


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## RUSSIAN (Mar 4, 2008)

JTMEYER said:


> I work in a small town in the midwest. We have 2 union shops in town, and several non-union. I have come in to RATS painted on our building. I have had a "freind" that spent 10 years non-union talk down to me after he went union. Hell I worked as a "card holder" member in the carpenters union just to be told to my face "we don't need to protect YOUR job, your reliable, you come in everyday. We need to protect these other guys that show up late and screw everything up." I was told by a union rep that tried to recruit us at the electrical trade school I went to that "NOOONE has EVER tested in at a higher grade than first year apprentice." So for those keeping score, I've been lied to, threatened by, and let down by the union. As far as I'm concerned I don't care if the union gives winning lottery tickets to first year guys you can count me out, permanantly!


Thats the problem with the IBEW in America in 2010, It's completely different in other areas. There is no uniformity and definitely nobody making sure these small locals are acting on the up and up. I work in a local that is probably a rarity, but is a good representation of how it should be. The members are compensated well and the large majority of the contractors are making a killing, 2009 being the exception, and some had their best years ever.
To the O.P, all I can say is you work in "union" town, where it seems almost everyone is part of a union. I'm not surprised your bitter, but I am surprised your complaining about a bad salt in a town that usually has 95% market share and has a nasty reputation for not allowing non-union in.

Just a side story, when I worked non-union, we had a job at the SF hilton, we were told we could only do the work on weekends, not only because of local 6, but because the hotel workers would back local 6 and walk out if we were there during normal business hrs and local 6 threw up a picket. Local 6 is a very strong local, and I don't condone some of there actions, but you can't expect to work there and not have issues with their members


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## B4T (Feb 10, 2009)

When I first read the title, I thought the OP was on a no salt diet and was having trouble eating in restaurants.. :laughing:

I never heard of "salting" before joining ET..


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## slickvic277 (Feb 5, 2009)

Black4Truck said:


> When I first read the title, I thought the OP was on a no salt diet and was having trouble eating in restaurants.. :laughing:
> 
> I never heard of "salting" before joining ET..


Your by far my favorite contractor on this site.:thumbsup::jester:

And here all along I thought "salting" was this huge epidemic sweeping the country, I mean, your in New York and you never even heard of it.:laughing::thumbup:


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## Jlarson (Jun 28, 2009)

slickvic277 said:


> And here all along I thought "salting" was this huge epidemic sweeping the country, I mean, your in New York and you never even heard of it.


Using info from B4T really doesn't put a lot of force behind your argument. :laughing:


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## B4T (Feb 10, 2009)

slickvic277 said:


> Your by far my favorite contractor on this site.:thumbsup::jester:
> 
> And here all along I thought "salting" was this huge epidemic sweeping the country, I mean, your in New York and you never even heard of it.:laughing::thumbup:


Gee thanks.. :laughing::thumbup::laughing:

I don't run with the big boys fighting over territory other than blowing my horn at the giant rat.. :whistling2:


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## slickvic277 (Feb 5, 2009)

Black4Truck said:


> Gee thanks.. :laughing::thumbup::laughing:
> 
> I don't run with the big boys fighting over territory other than blowing my horn at the giant rat.. :whistling2:



One time for fun I got in my wife's Nissan and drove by the Rat and gave it the finger and screamed a bunch of obscenities.

The only problem was, one of the guy's on the line recognized me.


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## B4T (Feb 10, 2009)

slickvic277 said:


> One time for fun I got in my wife's Nissan and drove by the Rat and gave it the finger and screamed a bunch of obscenities.
> 
> The only problem was, one of the guy's on the line recognized me.


That can be a problem, but only if the catch you..


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## slickvic277 (Feb 5, 2009)

Black4Truck said:


> That can be a problem, but only if the catch you..



I deny it to this day. I did get a good laugh outta of it though.:laughing:


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## B4T (Feb 10, 2009)

slickvic277 said:


> I deny it to this day. I did get a good laugh outta of it though.:laughing:


First rule of survival.. deny everything and sign nothing.. :thumbsup:


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## bobelectric (Feb 24, 2007)

Local #5 has over 500 members on the bench,waiting for work. (Pittsburgh,pa.15201)​


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