# Ice Cube Relays & Bases



## Lone Crapshooter (Nov 8, 2008)

I am looking for a site that I can find the contact arrangements for ice cube relays. 2 3 4 pole round and square bases . 
The base contact identification I have never been able to find them and I have to get a magnifying glass to read them on the actual base.
I can find sales sites but some of the diagrams are not the best.

Thanks LC


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## wildleg (Apr 12, 2009)

https://www.google.com/webhp?sourceid=chrome-instant&ion=1&espv=2&ie=UTF-8#q=relay%20pin%20base%20layout

http://www.automationdirect.com/static/specs/75relays.pdf


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## derekwalls (Dec 18, 2012)

http://www.how-to-wire-it.com/how-to-wire-a-relay.html


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## Big John (May 23, 2010)

:lol: Pretty sure _Lone_ knows how to wire a relay, he's just looking for a list of common base configurations.


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## backstay (Feb 3, 2011)

Lone Crapshooter said:


> I am looking for a site that I can find the contact arrangements for ice cube relays. 2 3 4 pole round and square bases . The base contact identification I have never been able to find them and I have to get a magnifying glass to read them on the actual base. I can find sales sites but some of the diagrams are not the best. Thanks LC


Sucks to get old, join the crowd.


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## Lone Crapshooter (Nov 8, 2008)

"Sucks to get old, join the crowd." 

If that ain't the truth.

I find it hard to believe that out of all the information and all the other surpurfilious BS on the internet there is very little information on ICE CUBE RELAYS, USA PROPRIETARY FIRE ALARMS SYSTEMS and INDUSTRIAL STATIONARY BATTERIES.
I would think there would be at least a discussion group on USA fire alarm systems and industrial batteries. I have found fire alarm discussion groups for other countries but nothing for the USA.

LC


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## wildleg (Apr 12, 2009)

there's a lot of catalogs out there on relays - I'm suprised you can't find what you need.

As to the Fire alarm thing - I think the lack of information is maybe due to 3 things - proprietary information, perceived liability issues and nondisclosure agreements.


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## Big John (May 23, 2010)

I wish there was a substation equipment forum. Or a testing forum. There's a lot of aspects of the trade that don't really have specific forums.


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## JRaef (Mar 23, 2009)

There are maybe only a dozen or so standard base configurations, by which I mean pins and keys, but how any given relay mfr uses those pins is totally up to the relay mfr, not the base. So although almost all "octal" 8 pin round sockets are the same, and MOST simple relay mfrs WANT to use the same configuration so their products can interchange, you can find many other different configurations as to how the relay mfrs connect to the same pins. So the place to see the pin configuration is on the RELAY, not the base. As far as I know, every plug-in relay or timer I have seen will have that info shown on the outside of the relay case.

Case in point:








This mfr shows 3 different wiring configurations for the exact same round octal socket.

By the way, little known side fact:
Plug-in relays and their bases are NOT UL listed, they are UL Recognized Components. That means that each relay can officially ONLY be plugged into an EXACT base that it was tested with by UL, and since one mfr will usually not want to test their relay with a base from a competitor, the relays and bases must match. So although a Tyco relay will plug into an Idec base and vice versa, if you are a UL panel shop UL can (will) bounce you for that.


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## derekwalls (Dec 18, 2012)

Thanks JR, I can't believe I've never noticed that these relays are not UL listed. Is there anything you don't know lol. I was just looking at a square d base and an Idec relay I had lying around and sure enough no UL listing.


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## Big John (May 23, 2010)

Yeah, usually I give some weight to "UR" arguments, but I'll be damned if I'm not gonna put any relay in any base that fits it.


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## JRaef (Mar 23, 2009)

Big John said:


> Yeah, usually I give some weight to "UR" arguments, but I'll be damned if I'm not gonna put any relay in any base that fits it.


Yeah, you and 99.99% of people who use them. We all know the freakin bases are all probably made in the same 3 factories in China anyway, maybe even two or one! I only mentioned it as an oddity that jumps up and bites UL508 shops in the ass once in a while. That's how I learned.

When I worked for Siemens there was a world-wide shortage of the small square based SPDT 1/2" wide relays (Idec RR2), so everyone was scrambling for about 9 months to meet customer demands. Turned out that something like 80% of those relays, regardless of brand, came from one factory in China and they had a fire.


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## just the cowboy (Sep 4, 2013)

I have seen the relay have letters and the socket has numbers, so don't assume numbers always match too.


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## Lone Crapshooter (Nov 8, 2008)

I want to take this time to thank every for for their reply. 
What brought all this on it on is that I was building a ice cube relay tester. I got the idea from the ELEVATOR ADJUSTER'S posts on You Tube. I modified his circuit plus added several popular plug-in industrial control relay bases and ways to put various voltages into the circuit. 
It tests 2,3,poles standards, miniature squares as well as large squares. 
and it does TDR's with 5/6 or 5/7 external switches.

Got to go

LC


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## JRaef (Mar 23, 2009)

> I was building a ice cube relay tester.


Testing of a $5 disposable relay seems like a waste of time and money if you ask me. 

Timers? Maybe.


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## Lone Crapshooter (Nov 8, 2008)

That is true but if you do not have any spares to substitute and you think that $ 5.00 relay is bad it can be a real time saver . 
It will also check timers and most any control module that plugs into a one of the relay sockets ,has operating power applied to the same points as the relay coils, and opens or closes contacts wired they same the relay contacts are.

LC


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## JRaef (Mar 23, 2009)

So if you don't have a spare relay, and your tester finds that one is bad, what good is the knowledge? 

Just playing devil's advocate here.


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## wdestar (Jul 19, 2008)

Lone Crapshooter said:


> I am looking for a site that I can find the contact arrangements for ice cube relays. 2 3 4 pole round and square bases .
> The base contact identification I have never been able to find them and I have to get a magnifying glass to read them on the actual base.
> I can find sales sites but some of the diagrams are not the best.
> 
> Thanks LC


One thing I've learned - never trust any image, symbol or representation garnished from the internet. Fools copy fools and re-posters imitate imposters' interpretations.

To reiterate from one of my favorite Cheers episodes... Norm's reply: "It's a dog eat dog world out there and I'm wearing milkbone underwear."

NAD


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## derekwalls (Dec 18, 2012)

JRaef said:


> So if you don't have a spare relay, and your tester finds that one is bad, what good is the knowledge?
> 
> Just playing devil's advocate here.


I guess to know how many relays you need to get:nerd:


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## Lone Crapshooter (Nov 8, 2008)

Here are 4 other relay testers
1 http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=the+relay+tester++elevator+adjuster
2 http://www.youtube.com/results?search_query=micro+relay+tester++elevator+adjuster
3 http://www.qualityelev.com/main/tool/reltest.ht

And I hope you found this little lesson useful. 
Thank you and have a nice day. 

LC


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## John Valdes (May 17, 2007)

Lone Crapshooter said:


> I want to take this time to thank every for for their reply.
> What brought all this on it on is that I was building a ice cube relay tester. I got the idea from the ELEVATOR ADJUSTER'S posts on You Tube. I modified his circuit plus added several popular plug-in industrial control relay bases and ways to put various voltages into the circuit.
> It tests 2,3,poles standards, miniature squares as well as large squares.
> and it does TDR's with 5/6 or 5/7 external switches.
> ...


Does each contact tested have a load on it, rated for the contact?
Just because a contact closes, does not mean it will carry current.


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## Lone Crapshooter (Nov 8, 2008)

John I would like to put a 5 amp load in the circuit but the contact test voltage is 24 volts and I am using a Moore Industries instrument power supply for that and it can only deliver 2.4 amps. 
I am lighting a Ideal pilot lamp for the load and I think I will a resister that will increase my test current to 1 amp.

LC


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