# Philips EnduraLED 48"T8 apparently 32% less efficient than mercury gas technology



## Edrick (Jun 6, 2010)

I started reading this then said hmm why does this sound like a post from that guy who hates LED. Sure enough...

Although I am curious as to how well these works as one of my clients is getting a swap out done to these.


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## Electric_Light (Apr 6, 2010)

Edrick said:


> I started reading this then said hmm why does this sound like a post from that guy who hates LED. Sure enough...
> 
> Although I am curious as to how well these works as one of my clients is getting a swap out done to these.


Philips make both LED and fluorescent, so there's no more conflict of interest than comparing their HIDs to fluorescent. 

All the numbers are from catalog. The exception is that they didn't include value for the T8 system or if they actually tried to match output lumen.

Here I combined high lumen F32T8 in a two lamp setup against three 48" T8 shaped LED tubes, so that the final mean output by the book is within 10%.


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## BBQ (Nov 16, 2010)

Electric_Light said:


> Philips make both LED and fluorescent, so there's no more conflict of interest


But who do you work for?


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## erics37 (May 7, 2009)

BBQ said:


> But who do you work for?


Sylvania :laughing::whistling2:


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## Electric_Light (Apr 6, 2010)

I didn't name Sylvania products once in the comparison.

There's minimal difference in performance between OSI/GE/Philips fluorescent lamps anyways


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## Cletis (Aug 20, 2010)

*Shang*



Electric_Light said:


> I didn't name Sylvania products once in the comparison.
> 
> There's minimal difference in performance between OSI/GE/Philips fluorescent lamps anyways


Those lamps are all made in same factory in Shanghi anyway


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## mbednarik (Oct 10, 2011)

Electric_Light said:


> Available in 11W 825lm and 22W 1650lm.. 40,000 hrs/85% maintenance(over how many hrs, I don't know)
> 
> Can't be used with shunted instant-start sockets. It's wired like a glow-starter type fluorescent lamp with a jumper in place of the glow starter. No idea why it needs a shunt going from one end to the other.
> 
> ...


Where do you get 48 watts? Wouldn't the input be 64 plus ballast loss?


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## Cletis (Aug 20, 2010)

*..*

Maybe 2-28 watt bulbs driven at 0.77 = 48 watts (ballast loss not included)


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## Electric_Light (Apr 6, 2010)

mbednarik said:


> Where do you get 48 watts? Wouldn't the input be 64 plus ballast loss?


The ballast specs. 

T8 lamp book specs are based on 60Hz operation. When they're operated at 50KHz like electronic ballasts do, the lamp itself becomes 10% more efficient. 

So, it only takes 29W to produce catalog value. Now, catalog value assumes lamps are operated to provide 100% of rated output. If they're actually driven at 32W each, they actually produce 100% output...

Standard T12 magnetic ballasts, now out of production typically only came in one type. 95% rated output. 

Commercially available T8 ballasts typically don't drive them to produce 100% output. Standard ones drive them at 87%. Low output ones (like the one I used above) drive them at 77% with corresponding reduction power usage.


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## k_buz (Mar 12, 2012)

At over $65 bucks a lamp, I can't believe this is going to be an easy sell.


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## mbednarik (Oct 10, 2011)

i installed 4 of these. The main thing i did not like about them besides the cost was the head sink on the back side of the lamp. It would effect the photometrics of fixtures.


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## 10492 (Jan 4, 2010)

never mind..............


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## Electric_Light (Apr 6, 2010)

mbednarik said:


> i installed 4 of these. The main thing i did not like about them besides the cost was the head sink on the back side of the lamp. It would effect the photometrics of fixtures.


Who's idea was it?

As long as it's legal, customer's request trumps everything. 

If you're selling cars and someone is determined to buy a V10 truck against your personal opinion, why bother persuading them into something inferior?


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## gesparky221 (Nov 30, 2007)

Cletis said:


> Those lamps are all made in same factory in Shanghi anyway


Just so you know I work in GE's main T8 lamp plant for worldwide production here in Ohio! We actually ship T8 lamps all over the world from here.


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## Cletis (Aug 20, 2010)

*?*



gesparky221 said:


> Just so you know I work in GE's main T8 lamp plant for worldwide production here in Ohio! We actually ship T8 lamps all over the world from here.


Do you inject the mercury and phosphors at the plant in ohio? How is it living in ohio anyhow? I've heard good things...


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## Electric_Light (Apr 6, 2010)

I love factory tours.


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## gesparky221 (Nov 30, 2007)

Our plant takes the clear tube and assemble it, adding phosphor, mercury, making the mount, that holds the lead wires and lamp cathode add gas, and test each lamp. It is highly automated. We have 4 main lines, an older T12 line which runs 6000 lamps per hour, and 3 T8 lines that run between 7000-8000 lamps per hour. Our shop runs 24/7. Living in Ohio is ok most of the time. I have worked at this plant for 27 years. We just added a new line to our plant, which was moved from Canada to our location.


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## Big John (May 23, 2010)

How on earth do y'all add the mercury? Is there a mercury pumping system? That's gotta be nuts.

-John


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