# Metal Mud Ring on Plastic Box



## user4818 (Jan 15, 2009)

I've done it. Not sure it's legal. I figured it's bonded through the devices.


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## Cletis (Aug 20, 2010)

*..*

ok. 

1 for yes 

this will get exciting....


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## Magnettica (Jan 23, 2007)

Pass or fail?

Fail.


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## Cletis (Aug 20, 2010)

*Carlon*

What would be difference in that v.s. the plastic carlon boxes with metal attatchment brackets ? 

Just asking..for debate


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## jefft110 (Jul 7, 2010)

Cletis said:


> this will get exciting....


:no:

:yawn:


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## B4T (Feb 10, 2009)

Cletis said:


> this will get exciting....


You just need one of these..


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

Cletis said:


> Can you put a metal mud ring on a plastic box without bonding ??
> 
> Code Ref ?


Read all of 250.4 In fact read all of Article 250 , 

100 times it's good for you..:laughing::thumbup::laughing:


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## Cletis (Aug 20, 2010)

*...*

Play along...

So, how would you bond it then ??


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## jefft110 (Jul 7, 2010)

Cletis said:


> Play along...
> 
> So, how would you bond it then ??


OK.

Old school...wrap the egc around one of the 8-32's that holds the ring on.


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## Cletis (Aug 20, 2010)

*...*

No. Fail


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

Cletis said:


> Play along...
> 
> So, how would you bond it then ??


Drive a self taper right into the cover and wrap the wire around it...:laughing:


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## Cletis (Aug 20, 2010)

*....*

Bzzzzt. No


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

jefft110 said:


> OK.
> 
> Old school...wrap the egc around one of the 8-32's that holds the ring on.


Tek screws..:whistling2:


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

Cletis said:


> Bzzzzt. No


Exothermic welding:laughing:


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## Mr. Sparkle (Jan 27, 2009)

Self grounding device connected to the ground tail.


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## arni19 (Nov 20, 2009)

Fail, the device would bond it if it was a receptacle or a switch with a ground screw, but most switches dont have ground screws and bond to ground threw the box so if it was meant for a switch you would have un bonded metal.. Think if you had a stainless steel plate on there and it c
Became energized.. Zap... Zap.. Zap..


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## user4818 (Jan 15, 2009)

Use the Carlon plastic mud rings they sell at HD. :whistling2:


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## Cletis (Aug 20, 2010)

*...*

problem is i needed a 1" mudring. they didn't make those in plastic for a slater box.


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## user4818 (Jan 15, 2009)

Cletis said:


> problem is i needed a 1" mudring. they didn't make those in plastic for a slater box.


Oh. Well in that case use a metal one and be like me - don't bond it. :thumbup:


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## Rudeboy (Oct 6, 2009)

If was in the situation where I actually used a plastic 4sq (don't think I've ever used one) and didn't have a plastic mud ring I'd probably just use a ground clip.

Of course you could also drill and tap 10-32 on the inside of the mudring and use a ground screw.


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## user4818 (Jan 15, 2009)

Rudeboy said:


> If was in the situation where I actually used a plastic 4sq (don't think I've ever used one) and didn't have a plastic mud ring I'd probably just use a ground clip.
> 
> Of course you could also drill and tap 10-32 on the inside of the mudring and use a ground screw.



:yawn:


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## Rudeboy (Oct 6, 2009)

Peter D said:


> :yawn:


HEY HARRY!!!!!!!!

TAKE A LOOK AT THAT!!!!!


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## Mr. Sparkle (Jan 27, 2009)

Cletis said:


> problem is i needed a 1" mudring. they didn't make those in plastic for a slater box.












*+*


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## Jlarson (Jun 28, 2009)

Rudeboy said:


> Of course you could also drill and tap 10-32 on the inside of the mudring and use a ground screw.


I bet I've done that about a billion times, not just to mud rings either, metal covers and extension rings too. 

Somebody sells a metal 1900 cover with a tapped hole and screw too.


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## Cletis (Aug 20, 2010)

*...*

there is no way I could do that grey on blue. It's just not right and it looks hacky


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## user4818 (Jan 15, 2009)

Cletis said:


> there is no way I could do that grey on blue. It's just not right and it looks hacky


You could also say it looks B4T and it would mean the exact same thing.


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## goose134 (Nov 12, 2007)

Having never used plastic boxes, I just don't understand how the screws hold. Not just over time, but how they hold at all. Are they tapped? Seems really chintzy.


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## Magnettica (Jan 23, 2007)

Cletis said:


> Play along...
> 
> So, how would you bond it then ??


Drive a 40' brass ground rod


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

Peter D said:


> You could also say it looks B4T and it would mean the exact same thing.


:wallbash::wallbash::sleep1:


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## BBQ (Nov 16, 2010)

Cletis said:


> Can you put a metal mud ring on a plastic box without bonding ??
> 
> Code Ref ?


250.4(A)(3)




> (3) Bonding of Electrical Equipment. Normally non–
> current-carrying conductive materials *enclosing electrical
> conductors or equipment, or forming part of such equipment,*
> shall be connected together and to the electrical supply
> ...


I think an inspector could fail you, I am not saying they should, just that I think they would be on solid ground if they did.


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## nrp3 (Jan 24, 2009)

I carry those Arlington sleeves in several sizes. Use one of those. Not a big fan of the carlon low voltage ring. Arlingtons is much better.


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## Southeast Power (Jan 18, 2009)

arni19 said:


> Fail, the device would bond it if it was a receptacle or a switch with a ground screw, but most switches dont have ground screws and bond to ground threw the box so if it was meant for a switch you would have un bonded metal.. Think if you had a stainless steel plate on there and it c
> Became energized.. Zap... Zap.. Zap..


Interesting. All of our switches here in the States have a green screw.


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## BBQ (Nov 16, 2010)

arni19 said:


> the device would bond it if it was a receptacle or a switch with a ground screw, but most switches dont have ground screws


That is not true, if it was that would be a problem.



> *404.9(B) Grounding.* Snap switches, including dimmer and
> similar control switches, shall be connected to an equipment
> grounding conductor and shall provide a means to
> connect metal faceplates to the equipment grounding conductor,
> ...


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## CraigV (May 12, 2011)

BBQ said:


> 250.4(A)(3)
> 
> 
> Quote:
> ...


Odd that they aren't specific about the manner of establishing an effective groundfault current path in the article. Pretty much anything suggested so far (yes, even Peter D's 40-foot brass rod :laughing could be interpreted as either effective or a terrible hack.


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## AFOREMA1 (Nov 23, 2009)

arni19 said:


> Fail, the device would bond it if it was a receptacle or a switch with a ground screw, but most switches dont have ground screws and bond to ground threw the box so if it was meant for a switch you would have un bonded metal.. Think if you had a stainless steel plate on there and it c
> Became energized.. Zap... Zap.. Zap..


All the switches I use have a ground screw. So what are you talking about?


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## stackappartment (Apr 4, 2010)

Cheetah switchs are all plastic and dont have a ground screw


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## stackappartment (Apr 4, 2010)

Heres a picture


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## macmikeman (Jan 23, 2007)

stackappartment said:


> Cheetah switchs are all plastic and dont have a ground screw


Are they still making the Cheetah system? I used to hear lots about it, but that seemed to die down after a while. Never saw any in use.


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## user4818 (Jan 15, 2009)

macmikeman said:


> Are they still making the Cheetah system? I used to hear lots about it, but that seemed to die down after a while. Never saw any in use.


The Cheetah system seems to go well with tract and production housing, and since that's in the toilet right now, I would guess the Cheetah system is as well.


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