# IBEW Apprentice Obligation



## slickvic277 (Feb 5, 2009)

How the hell could you join a LOCAL union and forget to tell them the part that you move a lot?


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

slickvic277 said:


> How the hell could you join a LOCAL union and forget to tell them the part that you move a lot?


They do not need to know that and no one should tell them that unless they will be moving in short order.

Hello VIC good to see you..:thumbup::thumbup:


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## lrc2089 (May 21, 2012)

slickvic277 said:


> How the hell could you join a LOCAL union and forget to tell them the part that you move a lot?


Haven't joined anything yet, but thanks for the constructive post. Still weighing my options: pay my own way at a school and sit for the JW test a year sooner and not be tied to a 5 year commitment, or jump through a bunch of hoops to be in union only to get furloughed. Hmm...decisions.


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## Celtic (Nov 19, 2007)

lrc2089 said:


> Okay, I understand it takes 5 years to reach journeyman level, but the local here told me that after that, I would have an additional 5 year obligation to the company that paid my way through the apprenticeship. Does this mean I have to work for the same contractor for 10 years total or any unionized shop?? I mean, we move a lot due to my wife's job. How would that be handled?



Get through the 5 years of school and all the "moving" before planning the next 5 years.
A lot can happen in one year.


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## Swayze (May 3, 2012)

lrc2089 said:


> Okay, I understand it takes 5 years to reach journeyman level, but the local here told me that after that, I would have an additional 5 year obligation to the company that paid my way through the apprenticeship. Does this mean I have to work for the same contractor for 10 years total or any unionized shop?? I mean, we move a lot due to my wife's job. How would that be handled?


This is not Dubai...they didnt take your passport did they? And promise to give it back after the 10 years is up?

I never heard of that...once you get your ticket you can travel the country and sign other books from different halls and work in different states and locals as long as you have the right licences in the jurisdiction.


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## lrc2089 (May 21, 2012)

Swayze said:


> This is not Dubai...they didnt take your passport did they? And promise to give it back after the 10 years is up?
> 
> I never heard of that...once you get your ticket you can travel the country and sign other books from different halls and work in different states and locals as long as you have the right licences in the jurisdiction.


Answer I was looking for. Thanks.


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## don_resqcapt19 (Jul 18, 2010)

Many of the apprentice agreements say that if the apprentice leaves the union to work as a non-union electrician less than 5 years after he or she has topped out, the former apprentice has to pay the JATC the cost of the apprenticeship training. I expect this is really what the original poster was told.


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## Southeast Power (Jan 18, 2009)

lrc2089 said:


> Haven't joined anything yet, but thanks for the constructive post. Still weighing my options: pay my own way at a school and sit for the JW test a year sooner and not be tied to a 5 year commitment, or jump through a bunch of hoops to be in union only to get furloughed. Hmm...decisions.


If you have a chance to get into a union JATC program, no one here would tell you not to. You will have more options than most five years from now. This could be anything from staying there, contracting or even getting out of the trade altogether. 
Don't turn down an opportunity for a decent education.
As far as the five year obligation is concerned, understand that the people that paid for your education would like to receive some benefit from it. It can be any siginatory contractor.


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

HARRY304E said:


> They do not need to know that and no one should tell them that unless they will be moving in short order.
> 
> Hello VIC good to see you..:thumbup::thumbup:


 
Harry that is a very important point.


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

slickvic277 said:


> How the hell could you join a LOCAL union and forget to tell them the part that you move a lot?


 
OMG....I am agreeing with Vic....Always good to see you posting.


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## lrc2089 (May 21, 2012)

HARRY304E said:


> They do not need to know that and no one should tell them that unless they will be moving in short order.
> 
> Hello VIC good to see you..:thumbup::thumbup:


Yeah, and maybe saying we move a lot is an over-statement. We really do not have any indication that we will be moving anytime in the immediate future. I'm definitely not going to plant that seed in their minds in the name of self preservation! Ha!


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## lrc2089 (May 21, 2012)

jrannis said:


> If you have a chance to get into a union JATC program, no one here would tell you not to. You will have more options than most five years from now. This could be anything from staying there, contracting or even getting out of the trade altogether.
> Don't turn down an opportunity for a decent education.
> As far as the five year obligation is concerned, understand that the people that paid for your education would like to receive some benefit from it. It can be any siginatory contractor.


That's what I've heard, but can't figure out why it takes 5 years when the state requires only 4 years for JW. I guess as long as I'm getting paid, who cares.


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

lrc2089 said:


> Yeah, and maybe saying we move a lot is an over-statement. We really do not have any indication that we will be moving anytime in the immediate future. I'm definitely not going to plant that seed in their minds in the name of self preservation! Ha!


:thumbsup::thumbsup:


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## bthesparky (Jan 23, 2009)

You will find that even nonunion does this. At least ABC has this same setup. People that pay your way should get some benefit from their investment in you.


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## lrc2089 (May 21, 2012)

bthesparky said:


> You will find that even nonunion does this. At least ABC has this same setup. People that pay your way should get some benefit from their investment in you.


Totally agree. Would never intentionally shaft anyone.


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## Wildwirerunner (May 26, 2012)

lrc2089 said:


> Okay, I understand it takes 5 years to reach journeyman level, but the local here told me that after that, I would have an additional 5 year obligation to the company that paid my way through the apprenticeship. Does this mean I have to work for the same contractor for 10 years total or any unionized shop?? I mean, we move a lot due to my wife's job. How would that be handled?



I just finished my orientation last week so its still sort of fresh. But it all should be in your paperwork that you receive when you get called up. But I was told basically you have to pay the JATC back for your tuition. The value of the education you receive over the duration of the program is approx $7800. So you have to work for a signatory shop (after you reach JW status), and they pay the JATC for you. I was told that in no way does it come out of our pay or benefits. Now if you choose to not work for a signatory shop, you can opt to pay that total to the JATC and work anywhere you want, and for whomever you want. I also asked about moving, and as long as its a signatory shop, in any juristiction, you are okay.


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## user4818 (Jan 15, 2009)

don_resqcapt19 said:


> Many of the apprentice agreements say that if the apprentice leaves the union to work as a non-union electrician less than 5 years after he or she has topped out, the former apprentice has to pay the JATC the cost of the apprenticeship training. I expect this is really what the original poster was told.


That's exactly right because that's what I was told when I applied to the union apprenticeship program.


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## Chris1971 (Dec 27, 2010)

Wildwirerunner said:


> I just finished my orientation last week so its still sort of fresh. But it all should be in your paperwork that you receive when you get called up. But I was told basically you have to pay the JATC back for your tuition. The value of the education you receive over the duration of the program is approx $7800. So you have to work for a signatory shop (after you reach JW status), and they pay the JATC for you. I was told that in no way does it come out of our pay or benefits. Now if you choose to not work for a signatory shop, you can opt to pay that total to the JATC and work anywhere you want, and for whomever you want. I also asked about moving, and as long as its a signatory shop, in any juristiction, you are okay.



That's all fine and dandy but, would it hold up in court?


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## don_resqcapt19 (Jul 18, 2010)

Chris1971 said:


> That's all fine and dandy but, would it hold up in court?


Probably...it is a contract.


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

don_resqcapt19 said:


> Probably...it is a contract.


 
I think they have been through this more than once and have crossed all their* T's* and dotted their* i**'s.* It cost money for this and there is a price to in a certain amount of loyalty and labor.


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## jp8302 (May 25, 2012)

I am finishing my apprenticeship right now, the "you owe us 5" is a legal contract drawn up through your local njatc, for non compete reasons. If you go 4 years through my program, and you take a non-compete job your fine. They don't want to "pay to train you" and have you work for the non-union sector


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## Loose Neutral (Jun 3, 2009)

Chris1971 said:


> That's all fine and dandy but, would it hold up in court?


That's funny.


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## John Valdes (May 17, 2007)

lrc2089 said:


> Yeah, and maybe saying we move a lot is an over-statement. We really do not have any indication that we will be moving anytime in the immediate future. I'm definitely not going to plant that seed in their minds in the name of self preservation! Ha!


If you indeed are offered a chance to serve the apprenticeship, why in the world would you want to do anything to mess that up.
5 years is nothing. It seems like a long time now. When you are older and look back, it will be like minutes of your life.
So make a decision. Take the apprenticeship and give it your all, or travel around. Real tough decision. :whistling2:



don_resqcapt19 said:


> Probably...it is a contract.


There are some contracts are very hard to hold up/enforce. Non-compete is the first to come to mind.
The cost of judicial input sometimes far outweighs the reward.


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## Loose Neutral (Jun 3, 2009)

yeah some times it aint worth throwing good money for the bad. Unless it's a matter of principle. It's really a moot point. Most people are nervous signing a contract, but it's rare for someone who has ticket to flip. It's usually the other way around.


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