# Bench Warmers



## micromind (Aug 11, 2007)

Wow.....but actually I'm not surprised.


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## eddy current (Feb 28, 2009)

My local 8 am is starting time but it can be adjusted no more than 1 hour each way so earliest and most common start is 7.


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## blueheels2 (Apr 22, 2009)

brian john said:


> Our local is in need of manpower, the bench is empty and the last few members that went out leave something to be desired.
> 
> Had one guy either come in late or did not come in at all, when he was asked what his problem was he stated. "I am not used to this shift, the last job I worked different hours." We work from 6:00-2:30, so he was asked what his last job hours were. He responded "7:00-3:30" Pink Slip.
> 
> ...


That guys an idiot. If I was going to work in your local your shop would be top of my list to work for.


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## blueheels2 (Apr 22, 2009)

And aren’t you in D.C. Tha t 6-2:30 shift is the only way to avoid traffic right. Saves lots of commuting time?


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## Easy (Oct 18, 2017)

It's kind of sad that people don't seem to have the very good work ethics. People are collecting unemployment with extra pay due to covid and don't seem to be willing to get back to work. 
I'm an old guy and probably would have a hard time keeping up but showing up on time would not be a problem. Having a job is a gift but some consider it a curse. Work is by far the most rewarding part of life and why mess that up with dumb comments like some of the applicants made.


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## John Valdes (May 17, 2007)

Maybe the IBEW is in need of a facelift. Maybe they need to be a bit more inclusive? Make it easier for guys to get in, not harder.
I am not saying bring less desirable candidates, but be more open to strangers and those with no ties to the local or the int.
I know when I was working out of the local in Miami it was very hard to get in. If you were not related to a member you needed guys to "Stand Up" for you.
I hope one day to see unions be as strong as they can be. As strong as they were 50 years ago.
Bringing in new guys with new ideas seems like the way to go. Maybe what saves them in the big picture.


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

eddy current said:


> My local 8 am is starting time but it can be adjusted no more than 1 hour each way so earliest and most common start is 7.


As noted 6:00 AM beats traffic and makes it easier to find a parking spot. Some jobs were starting at 5:00 AM for these reasons. Guys living, 60-80 miles out (which is not unusual) were getting up at 2:15 AM.


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

John Valdes said:


> Maybe the IBEW is in need of a facelift. Maybe they need to be a bit more inclusive? Make it easier for guys to get in, not harder.
> I am not saying bring less desirable candidates, but be more open to strangers and those with no ties to the local or the int.
> I know when I was working out of the local in Miami it was very hard to get in. If you were not related to a member you needed guys to "Stand Up" for you.
> I hope one day to see unions be as strong as they can be. As strong as they were 50 years ago.
> Bringing in new guys with new ideas seems like the way to go. Maybe what saves them in the big picture.


John in our local if you can walk in, you can get in. Apprenticeships are a snap to obtain, open shop, welcomed with open arms. This is not a recent occurrence this local has been encouraging any and all to apply.


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## TGGT (Oct 28, 2012)

If a guy can make the same rate on a job with better conditions why stay?

Those kind of hours can be rough for young parents.

Sent from my SM-G930T using Tapatalk


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## u2slow (Jan 2, 2014)

I hear these problems from my BiL project manager... 3rd/4th year apprentice isn't "feeling it" anymore and wants to change careers. Something they don't have to work so hard at, and make better money.... Sigh.

Noise bylaws often limit the start times.

1-2hrs change in hours is nothing. Try shift rotation with all 3 shifts (am, pm, night)... yeah, 1-2 hours deviation is nothing.

The best win is to work less days with a few more hours. I was a young parent once. 10-11 hours out of the house to do the 8hr job didn't make for "quality time" at the end of the day. You're exhausted. Days off are quality time.


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## 211023 (Apr 22, 2021)

u2slow said:


> I hear these problems from my BiL project manager... 3rd/4th year apprentice isn't "feeling it" anymore and wants to change careers. Something they don't have to work so hard at, and make better money.... Sigh.
> 
> Noise bylaws often limit the start times.
> 
> ...


Changing career when they could get at least a journeymen first doesn't make sense. I would have figure to quit by a year.


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## Easy (Oct 18, 2017)

brian john said:


> John in our local if you can walk in, you can get in. Apprenticeships are a snap to obtain, open shop, welcomed with open arms. This is not a recent occurrence this local has been encouraging any and all to apply.


I'm not currently looking for work but I have a question about your local and perhaps others like yours. I'm 63 years old and my Journeyman's license expired in 1981. I am still employed but have only worked part time over the past 5 years or so. I'd probably enjoy working as an apprentice but would that even be possible? I show up on time, never complain and am willing to do any electrical work including digging ditches. I don't think at this point of my life I would bother trying to get Journeyman status but I would probably be more valuable and work harder than some of the apprentices you guys talk about.


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

TGGT said:


> If a guy can make the same rate on a job with better conditions why stay?
> 
> Those kind of hours can be rough for young parents.
> 
> Sent from my SM-G930T using Tapatalk


He can't do either he is a full all-out slug, we would not have been sent him if he was worth a durn. Additionally, 6:00 AM or earlier is the start time on all construction jobs I know of in this area.

Fortunately for him, he will get to spend more time with his family.


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## TGGT (Oct 28, 2012)

brian john said:


> He can't do either he is a full all-out slug, we would not have been sent him if he was worth a durn. Additionally, 6:00 AM or earlier is the start time on all construction jobs I know of in this area.


We don't have slugs in Texas. They all hit the road and head up your way for better pay.


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## blueheels2 (Apr 22, 2009)

TGGT said:


> We don't have slugs in Texas. They all hit the road and head up your way for better pay.


NC guys love that D.C. pay as well.


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## micromind (Aug 11, 2007)

It used to be that Union Electricians were regarded as slow but dependable and knowledgable. And goofed off a lot.......

I think a lot of them are pretty good hands though, it's just that the Unions way of managing help doesn't encourage excellence. It seems to be based on every person is the same as every other person. 

Maybe they need to re-think that.


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## Flyingsod (Jul 11, 2013)

brian john said:


> getting up at 2:15 AM.


I have to do that once in awhile and all I can say is that if it was permanent- **** that, Burger King is hiring. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## u2slow (Jan 2, 2014)

Easy said:


> I'm not currently looking for work but I have a question about your local and perhaps others like yours. I'm 63 years old and my Journeyman's license expired in 1981. I am still employed but have only worked part time over the past 5 years or so. I'd probably enjoy working as an apprentice but would that even be possible? I show up on time, never complain and am willing to do any electrical work including digging ditches. I don't think at this point of my life I would bother trying to get Journeyman status but I would probably be more valuable and work harder than some of the apprentices you guys talk about.


I don't follow. Your contracting license may have expired - like mine has - but I'm a journeyman for life. If I lost my current union job, I might very well go back and knock on the IBEW door.


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## blueheels2 (Apr 22, 2009)

u2slow said:


> I don't follow. Your contracting license may have expired - like mine has - but I'm a journeyman for life. If I lost my current union job, I might very well go back and knock on the IBEW door.


I think you have to keep paying your dues. At least I have anyway. That way if work got slow I can go take a call. Thank God it hasn’t because the thought of working for someone else makes me sick.

If your not paying dues I would think your ability to come back as a jw depends on how bad your loca needs the help.


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## Easy (Oct 18, 2017)

micromind said:


> It used to be that Union Electricians were regarded as slow but dependable and knowledgable. And goofed off a lot.......
> 
> I think a lot of them are pretty good hands though, it's just that the Unions way of managing help doesn't encourage excellence. It seems to be based on every person is the same as every other person.
> 
> Maybe they need to re-think that.


It kind of depends on several factors. For example: Let's say you have a large crew of Journeyman electricians and they work for a company that signs a 3 year contract with the union. The members of that union vote on a new contract every 3 years and it just goes on for 30 or 40 years. They pay and benefits are good so there is really no reason to go on strike. After a while members gain seniority and eventually the company has a lay off. The guys with seniority are protected and the company has to abide by that if it's in the contract or I'm not sure if that's a union thing. In some instances this causes *some* of the most senior guys to become lazy. Not all just a *some*. The lazy ones are given jobs like checking for leaks in microwave ovens or calibrating LEL meters in the shop. The rest of the crew is out doing important stuff. If there's a budget cut then the new guys go no matter how good they are. Personally I like the union for what it did for me throughout the 32 years as a member. If a new hire comes in and can't cut the mustard the company has 90 days to decide if they want to retain them. At least that's how it was where I worked.
Some guys love what they do and others are just there for a pay check.


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## u2slow (Jan 2, 2014)

blueheels2 said:


> I think you have to keep paying your dues. At least I have anyway. That way if work got slow I can go take a call. Thank God it hasn’t because the thought of working for someone else makes me sick.
> 
> If your not paying dues I would think your ability to come back as a jw depends on how bad your loca needs the help.


By knocking I meant re-apply. They look at you in a different light when you're a unionized tradesman already (or at least my local used to.)


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## LGLS (Nov 10, 2007)

brian john said:


> Our local is in need of manpower, the bench is empty and the last few members that went out leave something to be desired.
> 
> Had one guy either come in late or did not come in at all, when he was asked what his problem was he stated. "I am not used to this shift, the last job I worked different hours." We work from 6:00-2:30, so he was asked what his last job hours were. He responded "7:00-3:30" Pink Slip.
> 
> ...


Every working person leaves something to be desired for the greedy. Once we start grading people, there will always be the bottom of that list some people have to populate, to be belittled and scorned, by unavoidable design. As they become relegated to a revolving door of employment created by simple math, don't act surprised when their attitude reflects their overall treatment and experience.

I won't comment on the specific manifestations as they're moot. These workers are clearly unhappy - and lack of overall happiness and positive attitude is a natural byproduct of capitalism. Were the union to eliminate the bottom 10% "slugs"... and refresh it's membership with replacements... There will still be a bottom 10% which you will continue to $hit on. Even if you were to somehow populate your shop with the top shop rockets of the local only, your list will still be there, because you have to have someplace to $hit.



micromind said:


> Wow.....but actually I'm not surprised.


That a contractor is complaining that he's not getting perfection and 100% efficiency from everyone? I agree. It's a tale as old as time.



eddy current said:


> My local 8 am is starting time but it can be adjusted no more than 1 hour each way so earliest and most common start is 7.


Common in most locals. Any start before 7am should pay premium. Construction work is not a bakery or an ICU ward or a police station. It doesn't HAVE to be crazy hours and normal-life disrupting. The underlying cause is that contractors working in a location aren't paying enough for their employees to actually live convenient to that location - therefore it's somehow all their fault. But they conveniently turn the tables and act like it's the employees who are unappreciatiave of the benefits of a quicker easier commute. As if getting up at 2:30 am amounts to nothing, and should be considered normal. 



blueheels2 said:


> That guys an idiot. If I was going to work in your local your shop would be top of my list to work for.


Consider a proviso that you've only ever heard Brian's side of his stories.



blueheels2 said:


> And aren’t you in D.C. Tha t 6-2:30 shift is the only way to avoid traffic right. Saves lots of commuting time?


Don't assume for a second this is being done purely with altruistic intent. For some or even most it may well be a win-win scenario. But I can guess who the real winner is here. If local traffic is indeed that drastic, 3 12 hour shifts per 7 day week would make a lot more sense. Anyone commuting on the regular 4 hours a day actually has another part-time un-paid job - driving to and from work. For free. Now do the math, apply the take home pay averaging it over an actual 60 hour week at 40 hours pay and you'll understand why a human being looking at the big picture is actually acting... just like a human being.


brian john said:


> As noted 6:00 AM beats traffic and makes it easier to find a parking spot. Some jobs were starting at 5:00 AM for these reasons. Guys living, 60-80 miles out (which is not unusual) were getting up at 2:15 AM.


Some people just can't see the forest for the trees. Or it's just not in their financial interests to do so.


TGGT said:


> If a guy can make the same rate on a job with better conditions why stay?
> 
> Those kind of hours can be rough for young parents.


Those kinds of hours, and drive times would be be rough for anyone. It's just too easy to blame the victims.


micromind said:


> It used to be that Union Electricians were regarded as slow but dependable and knowledgable. And goofed off a lot.......
> 
> I think a lot of them are pretty good hands though, it's just that the Unions way of managing help doesn't encourage excellence. It seems to be based on every person is the same as every other person.
> 
> Maybe they need to re-think that.


Most of the time, the top 10% of any shop I've ever work in makes no more money than the bottom 10%. One of the things that keep the top 10 there is the utter fear of being judged as anything less than a top dog. Egomaniacs. And also tend to be those who have structured their lives in a manner in which a layoff would be devastating, financially or to their psyche. True, the shop rockets often are rewarded, thrown a bone as it were of more overtime opportunities, and bonus hours - but nothing really life-altering. More so ego-affirming.


Flyingsod said:


> I have to do that once in awhile and all I can say is that if it was permanent- **** that, Burger King is hiring.


Different strokes for different folks. It's confusing why some people refuse to understand that when it's not in their own interests to, and pretend nobody is going to catch on to their hypocrisy. Because you can bet the shop super, the office staff, the project managers, or the owner's alarm clocks aren't ringing at 2:30 am as well. They're not going to bed at 7PM either. Blinders. 

But the workers should be happy to take this one on the chin, lest they be cast out with the slugs.



Easy said:


> It kind of depends on several factors. For example: Let's say you have a large crew of Journeyman electricians and they work for a company that signs a 3 year contract with the union. The members of that union vote on a new contract every 3 years and it just goes on for 30 or 40 years. They pay and benefits are good so there is really no reason to go on strike. *After a while members gain seniority and eventually the company has a lay off. The guys with seniority are protected and the company has to abide by that if it's in the contract or I'm not sure if that's a union thing. In some instances this causes some of the most senior guys to become lazy.* Not all just a *some*. The lazy ones are given jobs like checking for leaks in microwave ovens or calibrating LEL meters in the shop. The rest of the crew is out doing important stuff. If there's a budget cut then the new guys go no matter how good they are. Personally I like the union for what it did for me throughout the 32 years as a member. If a new hire comes in and can't cut the mustard the company has 90 days to decide if they want to retain them. At least that's how it was where I worked.
> Some guys love what they do and others are just there for a pay check.


In any IBEW construction division, there is no such thing as seniority. If a 20 year employed shop rocket suddenly develops an attitude, they're as pink-slippable as anyone else. 

Perhaps our labor laws need some adjusting - to reflect and recognize the fact that it's no longer the 1930's. when workers typically lived a stone's throw away from their factories that employed them. "Going to work" wasn't an issue. 8 hours work for 8 hours pay, 8 hours of sleep and 8 hours of "me" time... But It's clear now that employers drawing from a pool of workers by forcing them to give up their unpaid me-time as if that personal sacrifice required to make the modern system work should be borne only by the person making the sacrifice- yet wholly for the benefit of the employer and the outdated system. It's as though the workers who value that me time are somehow crazy for considering it has worth, unrecognized by employers who clearly have the notion that an employee's me time is theirs to exploit as well.

Were clock-in paid hours to start at the beginning of a worker's commute and end when they got home, or somehow miles from the work site compensated in some way - would employers still insist on drawing from a far off remote workforce what spends 1/3 of their entire work day unpaid and unproductively commuting? Or would they be forced to compensate adequately for workers to live locally? Physically this is far more practical- but in the far higher cost of living area where the job site is, at higher wages, necessary to maintain a decent lifestyle.


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

Easy said:


> I'm not currently looking for work but I have a question about your local and perhaps others like yours. I'm 63 years old and my Journeyman's license expired in 1981. I am still employed but have only worked part time over the past 5 years or so. I'd probably enjoy working as an apprentice but would that even be possible? I show up on time, never complain and am willing to do any electrical work including digging ditches. I don't think at this point of my life I would bother trying to get Journeyman status but I would probably be more valuable and work harder than some of the apprentices you guys talk about.


If you applied for the local as a residential electrician or helper you could.


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## Flyingsod (Jul 11, 2013)

Yeah, no age requirement? Or is age just a thing for being in the pension club?


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## Navyguy (Mar 15, 2010)

LGLS said:


> Entire post...


I get what you are saying, but each employee has a choice; no one is forcing them to get up early, drive 60 miles, etc.

It is not the employer's responsibility to make things "easier" for the employee, it is the employee's responsibility to make decisions that benefit them and their family.

While I agree that the employer could do more (if they choose to), there has to be a benefit (usually more profit) to the employer to do that. There is a small town outside of Ottawa that is offering housing to seasonal workers because the workers cannot afford to live in or close to the city they work in. The benefit to the employer is that they have workers to run their business, but as am employee to you want to live with a bunch of other workers - we are not talking about a camp job either, this is a restaurant just outside a fairly large city.

Ultimately it boils down to two things...

Employers are there to make money - to support their shareholders or protect their investment; and
Employees are there to trade their time for the employer's money.

How that business is conducted is between the two parties, and if they both keep up their end of the bargain it is not up to us to say if it is good or bad. Almost everybody wants to work less and get paid more... but then there is reality.

Cheers
John


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## LGLS (Nov 10, 2007)

Navyguy said:


> I get what you are saying, but each employee has a choice; no one is forcing them to get up early, drive 60 miles, etc.
> 
> It is not the employer's responsibility to make things "easier" for the employee, it is the employee's responsibility to make decisions that benefit them and their family.
> 
> ...


Oh my god you have got things so bass-ackwards I'm floored. No employer makes any money. No employer has any money for the workers to make. Not a one. The employees do all the money making, all the work, all the producing. The employer is just the conductor, not the orchestra. No music comes from that wand - and the customer's aren't paying to see it waving about. The employees pay themselves AND their employer AND the shareholders. All of it. It comes from their time and their skills and their input and their output. The employer simply collects all the proceeds from the sales and redistributes it. Mostly to themselves.

And no, it is not a choice the employees make to do what's best for them and their family. "Do it, or something similar or become impoverished" isn't really a choice. Your example is just another exactly like the situation I described. Why can't the restaurant hire local people to work there? Because local people need 3K a month to live in an apartment - and that means the restaurant has to pay higher wages, that means lower profits or higher costs and therefore fewer meals sold or some combination of all of that... 

The entire "lets bus people in from cheaper cost of living areas afar" is just another cheat employers exploit, and it's only possible because the time an employee spends commuting isn't the concern or responsibility of the employer. Internalize the profits and externalize the liabilities. But when that means employees are simply doing nothing but driving to and from work, working, and going home only to sleep - the human factor -LIVING.... (not to be confused with being alive) is not happening. They're now robots - with no free time, no personal time, no creative time or relaxing time or teaching time and family time... 

And of course there is reality - that's the point. The reality is, as the world progresses.... shouldn't life get better for everyone? I expect to pay more for a steak dinner in NYC than out in the burbs where I live - but if the labor costs for a restaurant in NYC are just as cheap as they are out here, because the steakhouse in NYC is housing and busing their workers from a rental on my street, then why am I still paying more for that dinner?


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## Easy (Oct 18, 2017)

brian john said:


> If you applied for the local as a residential electrician or helper you could.


I'd probably go for it if I was younger but I can remember how brutal it was doing residential work. Besides that the closest local is nearly 50 miles away and most of the work is even farther out. Local 440 is in Riverside and that place is as bad as south central LA. I think they want like 2 homes roped per day. I'll pass... Maybe I could join up with Jimmy Carter and work for homes for humanity.


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## Navyguy (Mar 15, 2010)

@LGLS 

I am not an anthropologist, but I would argue that people have been travelling to sustain themselves (family) since before recorded history.

Now we have come a long way from a technological and quality of life perspective since those days, but fundamentally some things are still the same. People still need to follow the herd to find food for their families. In this case the herd is the employer that is offering work.

Maybe someday we will be in the Federation of Planets, where nobody “has” to work, poverty and illness are eliminated; but until that time, people will continue to trade time for money. That trade comes with advantages and disadvantages to both sides. The employer, like the employee, would love to make more money and have to do less to earn it. So this is not an employer / employee conflict; but a result of one side of the equation trying to advance their own improvement at the cost of the other.

The employer is trying to make more profit based on what the market will bear. There are only two ways around that, increase income or lower expenses.

The employee is trying to make a better home or put food on the table for his family. The only ways to do that is to work more hours at a lower income, work less hours at a higher income or redistribute your income to prioritize putting food on the table, paying the mortgage, etc. Basic Maslow stuff here…

However saying that, the employer is an employee also, he works for his customers and shareholders, so he has the same obstacles and decisions that a ‘traditional” employee has to make, but they both have the same goal(s).

I am a huge supporter of work / life balance, but people choose their jobs and it is up to them (not anyone else) to make the best of it.

Cheers
John


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## u2slow (Jan 2, 2014)

Navyguy said:


> I am not an anthropologist, but I would argue that people have been travelling to sustain themselves (family) since before recorded history.


Me neither... but I can conclude hunter-gatherer populations aren't much of an economy. Farming on the other hand - you needed extra people to do it. Farm-hands live at the farm. That's where the work is. A larger farm with specially-skilled individuals would share or do work for neighbouring farms. Even free-lancing your services isn't a commuting problem - getting to the job, the next job, and so on, is *part of the job*. We most certainly had commuting beat long ago...


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## LGLS (Nov 10, 2007)

Navyguy said:


> @LGLS
> 
> I am not an anthropologist, but I would argue that people have been travelling to sustain themselves (family) since before recorded history.


This issue at hand is traveling everyday - 3-4 or more hours to sustain oneself and family, not locating to where the work is, or moving to where the work is. Or periodic expeditions.


> Now we have come a long way from a technological and quality of life perspective since those days, but fundamentally some things are still the same. People still need to follow the herd to find food for their families. In this case the herd is the employer that is offering work.


Yes, but the hunters that are local want nothing to do with the herd - as it's not valuable enough to the locals, and only wants to graze and feed off the locals.


> Maybe someday we will be in the Federation of Planets, where nobody “has” to work, poverty and illness are eliminated; but until that time, people will continue to trade time for money. That trade comes with advantages and disadvantages to both sides. The employer, like the employee, would love to make more money and have to do less to earn it. So this is not an employer / employee conflict; but a result of one side of the equation trying to advance their own improvement at the cost of the other.
> 
> The employer is trying to make more profit based on what the market will bear. There are only two ways around that, increase income or lower expenses.
> 
> ...


When it comes to work life balance, this is exactly the issue. The balance is artificially upset when an outside force not organic to the equation is involved. And that outside force is introduced into the equation by the employer in order to upset it's natural balance, and to profit from that upset. It's why an employer from Ohio bids on work in NYC and intends to staff it with Ohio residents at Ohio wages.


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## 460 Delta (May 9, 2018)

It's why an employer from Ohio bids on work in NYC and intends to staff it with Ohio residents at Ohio wages.
[/QUOTE]
O-H-I-O! Go Buckeyes!!


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## VELOCI3 (Aug 15, 2019)

John Valdes said:


> Maybe the IBEW is in need of a facelift. Maybe they need to be a bit more inclusive? Make it easier for guys to get in, not harder.
> I am not saying bring less desirable candidates, but be more open to strangers and those with no ties to the local or the int.
> I know when I was working out of the local in Miami it was very hard to get in. If you were not related to a member you needed guys to "Stand Up" for you.
> I hope one day to see unions be as strong as they can be. As strong as they were 50 years ago.
> Bringing in new guys with new ideas seems like the way to go. Maybe what saves them in the big picture.


IBEW 3 is starting or might have already started a new system of filling classes. You can apply online anytime instead of the old way of applying on a specific date. 

The idea is that we are losing out on good potential members when you tell them they could wait up to three years for a response after they apply. Really who would want to wait that long with no guarantee.

When the list is short you end up with the big job guys. The only way for them to maintain employment is to get lost on a big job. Mostly because they get bounced from crew to crew on the same job before the owner catches on and fires them.

I can tell how good an electrician is by how they walk across a site when they think nobody is looking. 


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## SWDweller (Dec 9, 2020)

6:00 am ? Why so late? Joking, 

Here in the Sunny Southwestern Deserts we start when we can see. Right now about 5:00
It will get back to 4:00 if the summer comes off as they think it will. Already had the first triple digit day. By 10 am if you not wearing gloves you can not pick up conduit, well maybe you can, it is to hot for me.


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## eddy current (Feb 28, 2009)

In many hot countries they work in the morning and evening only due to heat. 
Everyone takes a nap in the afternoon


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

Easy said:


> Some guys love what they do and others are just there for a pay check.


And some are just lazy individuals taking advantage of the company they work for, in a market starving for quality help.


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## manchestersparky (Mar 25, 2007)

brian john said:


> Our local is in need of manpower, the bench is empty and the last few members that went out leave something to be desired.
> 
> Had one guy either come in late or did not come in at all, when he was asked what his problem was he stated. "I am not used to this shift, the last job I worked different hours." We work from 6:00-2:30, so he was asked what his last job hours were. He responded "7:00-3:30" Pink Slip.
> 
> ...


Work out of 26 is Booming !! I see it every day !
I also see "those" guys you describe.....


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