# Pot light layout



## ohm it hertz (Dec 2, 2020)

You want recessed lights no closer than 2' from a wall to avoid sharp shadows, but not so far in that it's only lighting the floor in the center of the room. If you have a corner cabinet, find the center of the cabinet door and align it with where your row will be. Typical 8' ceilings I space them out no more than 6' apart in each row (4' for 4" lights) for effective wall washing (gentle shadows). The center globe could be replaced with a high end track light to fill in any "dead spots", and match the finish of your appliances or pendants. There's also no guarantee the original light was ever center of the room to begin with, which could throw off your center recessed light plan. Try to remain symmetrical to the room, cabinets, windows and doorways as much as possible.

I'd go with 8 high lumen 4" wafers and consider a center fixture of some kind, both on dimmers. Too many 6" recessed lights can start to make a room feel smaller if you're not careful.


----------



## 99cents (Aug 20, 2012)

Here’s how I do it:

Measure from the upper cabinets out, not the wall. The fridge will stick out so make sure you don’t have a fixture above the fridge. Your line should be far enough out from the cabinets anyway so a fixture should end up in front of the fridge and not above it.

I am using 6” mostly now. You can space fixtures a little further apart and light distribution is fine. If you have attic above, put a surface mount fixture in the existing location. You don’t want to be disturbing the vapour barrier. I had a job recently where the customer put in a large 14” flat fixture in that location. It complimented the recessed fixtures well. Unless you enjoy self abuse, why would you install a ceiling fan?

If you have attic above, I can tell you how I install recessed fixtures but it’s too much typing unless you really want to know. One thing I can say is don’t trust the factory default if they’re colour selectable. It’s a PITA when you fire things up and one fixture is the wrong colour. 😐


----------



## Funkadelicfred (Jan 30, 2019)

ohm it hertz said:


> You want recessed lights no closer than 2' from a wall to avoid sharp shadows, but not so far in that it's only lighting the floor in the center of the room. If you have a corner cabinet, find the center of the cabinet door and align it with where your row will be. Typical 8' ceilings I space them out no more than 6' apart in each row (4' for 4" lights) for effective wall washing (gentle shadows). The center globe could be replaced with a high end track light to fill in any "dead spots", and match the finish of your appliances or pendants. There's also no guarantee the original light was ever center of the room to begin with, which could throw off your center recessed light plan. Try to remain symmetrical to the room, cabinets, windows and doorways as much as possible.
> 
> I'd go with 8 high lumen 4" wafers and consider a center fixture of some kind, both on dimmers. Too many 6" recessed lights can start to make a room feel smaller if you're not careful.





ohm it hertz said:


> You want recessed lights no closer than 2' from a wall to avoid sharp shadows, but not so far in that it's only lighting the floor in the center of the room. If you have a corner cabinet, find the center of the cabinet door and align it with where your row will be. Typical 8' ceilings I space them out no more than 6' apart in each row (4' for 4" lights) for effective wall washing (gentle shadows). The center globe could be replaced with a high end track light to fill in any "dead spots", and match the finish of your appliances or pendants. There's also no guarantee the original light was ever center of the room to begin with, which could throw off your center recessed light plan. Try to remain symmetrical to the room, cabinets, windows and doorways as much as possible.
> 
> I'd go with 8 high lumen 4" wafers and consider a center fixture of some kind, both on dimmers. Too many 6" recessed lights can start to make a room feel smaller if you're not careful.


Here is a quick layout I drew and my intended plan for the lights. Would you say it's acceptable or should it be altered? (Sorry for the bad drawings, not good at these yet)


----------



## 99cents (Aug 20, 2012)

That’s bare minimum. Are you putting in undercabinet lighting?

We often put a fixture above the sink on a separate switch.

BTW, that fridge location is really bad. 😐


----------



## Funkadelicfred (Jan 30, 2019)

99cents said:


> That’s bare minimum. Are you putting in undercabinet lighting?
> 
> We often put a fixture above the sink on a separate switch.
> 
> BTW, that fridge location is really bad. 😐


Lol it's a 120 year old house, there isn't too much to be done with it I just find the one light in the centre sucks. I wasn't planning on it cause it would be hell to fish it and get a wire up so I didn't really plan on it. It's really only the place the fridge can go too. Here's a pic, if you have any suggestions please let me know.


----------



## 99cents (Aug 20, 2012)

I guess if your house is that age, you don’t have to worry much about vapour barrier. 😀

It’s hard to say what you have up there for insulation. It could be wood chips, batts with paper or vermiculite. If it’s vermiculite, it will pour all over the floor as soon as you make the hole unless you get up there first and scoop it out.

I cut my holes very carefully and run the hole saw mostly backwards. The perfect hole, if it’s drywall, is where you peel out the disc and the back layer of drywall paper stays intact. I cut the lead on the driver and butt splice LVT in as an extension. If you’re a guy who is horrified by that you can order in factory extensions.

I cut 3’ pieces of #12 single conductor, tape them to the driver leads and poke them up through the insulation. I then go up into the attic and pull all the leads to a central location and mount all the drivers on a framing member above the insulation. In your case, you can mount the drivers by the attic hatch and do that work off a ladder.


----------



## Funkadelicfred (Jan 30, 2019)

99cents said:


> I guess if your house is that age, you don’t have to worry much about vapour barrier. 😀
> 
> It’s hard to say what you have up there for insulation. It could be wood chips, batts with paper or vermiculite. If it’s vermiculite, it will pour all over the floor as soon as you make the hole unless you get up there first and scoop it out.
> 
> ...


Insulation is blown-in so I'm not too worried about that but otherwise the layout looks fine? And what do you suggest for the center light? I thought a potlight but will it not look a bit weird if it's spaced like the 5 on a domino?


----------



## 99cents (Aug 20, 2012)

Funkadelicfred said:


> Insulation is blown-in so I'm not too worried about that but otherwise the layout looks fine? And what do you suggest for the center light? I thought a potlight but will it not look a bit weird if it's spaced like the 5 on a domino?


I dunno, I did a “five” recently at the customer’s request and it looked okay. The only person who will complain is another electrician and I don’t have to tell you how to handle that. 🤣


----------



## mofos be cray (Nov 14, 2016)

Why not put a better light in the existing spot and see if that makes it better without adding.
Also 120 y/o house will be plaster lathe and lots of blocking in the framing. Its also probably run with know and tube wiring.


----------



## Funkadelicfred (Jan 30, 2019)

mofos be cray said:


> Why not put a better light in the existing spot and see if that makes it better without adding.
> Also 120 y/o house will be plaster lathe and lots of blocking in the framing. Its also probably run with know and tube wiring.


Nope, no knob and tube it's all Romex or that cloth romex stuff. I don't need to go down any walls or through any framing the ceiling in the kitchen is trusses with drywall over it and I was just going to tail off of the light in the center to go to the others.


----------



## Funkadelicfred (Jan 30, 2019)

99cents said:


> I dunno, I did a “five” recently at the customer’s request and it looked okay. The only person who will complain is another electrician and I don’t have to tell you how to handle that. 🤣


Yeah and it beats the other options. I don't want to do a fixture and the only other thing I could think of was a fan.


----------



## splatz (May 23, 2015)

I really don't think there's anything wrong with five can lights but I'd leave that middle a plain octagon box. If you make it a can, that's a one-way trip, leave it a fixture and change it to something old-time looking. You could put some really dim LED filament lights in there and switch it separately so it's basically a night light, let the cans do the real lighting. I like ceiling fans but not in the kitchen and it looks like it's too close to the access panel.


----------



## 99cents (Aug 20, 2012)

I have been installing these on octagon boxes and they’re really nice.


----------



## Funkadelicfred (Jan 30, 2019)

splatz said:


> I really don't think there's anything wrong with five can lights but I'd leave that middle a plain octagon box. If you make it a can, that's a one-way trip, leave it a fixture and change it to something old-time looking. You could put some really dim LED filament lights in there and switch it separately so it's basically a night light, let the cans do the real lighting. I like ceiling fans but not in the kitchen and it looks like it's too close to the access panel.


No cans just slimfit LEDs and they're all going to be on together. Getting another wire down that wall to the switch box would be hell.


----------



## 99cents (Aug 20, 2012)

Funkadelicfred said:


> No cans just slimfit LEDs and they're all going to be on together. Getting another wire down that wall to the switch box would be hell.


If you have constant power in the attic, put a Caseta up there and a Pico on the wall. Don’t give up that easily. 😊


----------



## splatz (May 23, 2015)

Have you looked up there to see how the framing is? At that age the house is probably balloon framing and sometimes that makes fishing wires very easy.


----------



## Funkadelicfred (Jan 30, 2019)

And the center light is not centered I just checked. 
Now the question is do I just pretend that it is and go on as planned? Or do I have to reconsider the whole layout now?


----------



## Funkadelicfred (Jan 30, 2019)

99cents said:


> If you have constant power in the attic, put a Caseta up there and a Pico on the wall. Don’t give up that easily. 😊


I haven't given up yet,


splatz said:


> Have you looked up there to see how the framing is? At that age the house is probably balloon framing and sometimes that makes fishing wires very easy.


Not yet because my plan was just to make my center light a potlight and then just connect them all together and they'll already be at the switch so there would be no need to do another run. It's a 120 year old house so I'm not trying to super modernize everything I'm just trying to make it look a little less shitty and get a little more light.


----------



## 99cents (Aug 20, 2012)

Funkadelicfred said:


> I haven't given up yet,
> 
> 
> Not yet because my plan was just to make my center light a potlight and then just connect them all together and they'll already be at the switch so there would be no need to do another run. It's a 120 year old house so I'm not trying to super modernize everything I'm just trying to make it look a little less shitty and get a little more light.


I can tell you’re not familiar with renos. They always get out of control with extras. 😊

When my kid was small, he plugged up the toilet when he flushed my glasses. That turned into a complete bath remodel. 🤣


----------



## ohm it hertz (Dec 2, 2020)

I'm making many assumptions and guesses without precise measurements, but here's my stab at it. Based on your feedback I'd put three 4" wafers at the counter on their own switch, keeping the remaining recessed lights in line with center on their own switch. Lastly, a centered accent fixture of some kind on its own switch. Hopefully you can align with something in the room, whether it's doorways or windows.

Good luck. If it's balloon constructed you'll have an easier time fishing wires on outside walls, but the lathe and plaster will even the odds lol.


----------



## ohm it hertz (Dec 2, 2020)

99cents said:


> When my kid was small, he plugged up the toilet when he flushed my glasses. That turned into a complete bath remodel. 🤣


Has anyone seen my bifecals?


----------



## Funkadelicfred (Jan 30, 2019)

All done guys, did the 4 and left the center light (hole too big for another potlight) and will probably stick a fan there someday. Thanks for all the help.


----------

