# Solar backfeeding a panel



## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

I would say this answers my question:



> (5) Fastening. Listed plug-in-type circuit breakers backfed
> from utility-interactive inverters that are listed and identified
> as interactive shall be permitted to omit the additional fastener
> normally required by 408.36(D) for such applications.


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## MikeFL (Apr 16, 2016)

Glad I could help.


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## Peter Goldwing (Sep 23, 2011)

You're welcome, Hack


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## Service Call (Jul 9, 2011)

Where do we send the bill? IBTL


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

HackWork said:


> > It's common here to have a residential solar array connected to the house's electrical system by just backfeeding a breaker.
> 
> 
> Yes, but it's problematic in that the panel bus may need to be calculated up to where one could assume a 200A panel, on a 100A drop or lateral
> ...


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

Yeah, the stickers are something I need to get. 

The solar work was done and inspected. But the solar companies don't like doing electrical work, since they aren't qualified for it, so they backfeed old and crappy panels. In this situation they backfeed an old Pushmatic panel that is busting at the seems, and the customer wants me to change out to a new panel of the same ampacity.


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## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

But you may or may not have to up the ampacity of the new panel Hax

sorry, but the '17 art 690 isn't as easy for me as it might be others

~CS~


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## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

oh and, iirc, your inverted infeed needs to go on the bottom of it

something about spreading the load on the buss....

~CS~


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

We are on the 2014. If the installation was ok for an old Pushmatic panel, why wouldn't it work on a new Siemens?


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## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

I'm sorry to_ not_ have a code article Hax ....~CS~


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## RigidRack (Dec 11, 2017)

Hack....I know this post is a few months old but........i primarily do commercial/industrial work.....i am not clear on what this breaker hold down kit is and when it's required. I looked it up on the net and it seems like a way to bolt down stab in breakers that are common in resi work. Can you give me a short explanation if you don't mind?


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

RigidRack said:


> Hack....I know this post is a few months old but........i primarily do commercial/industrial work.....i am not clear on what this breaker hold down kit is and when it's required. I looked it up on the net and it seems like a way to bolt down stab in breakers that are common in resi work. Can you give me a short explanation if you don't mind?


Basically, a main breaker has to be bolted to a panel.

Most panels will allow you to backfeed a branch circuit breaker and use that as a main breaker for the panel. If you do that, you will need to use a hold-down kit to hold the breaker in.

The point is that they don't want a main breaker to be able to come off of the bus while still hot.

This usually comes into play with smaller main lug only panels when you want to add a 100A or smaller breaker to serve as the main breaker. Or, when installing a generator interlock kit since the breaker that you backfeed the generator with will become a main breaker and needs a hold-down kit installed on it.

In this thread, I was wondering if a breaker that was backfed with solar would require a hold-down kit. I found that it doesn't because the solar shuts itself off as soon as the grid power is lost, so if the breaker comes off the bus it goes dead.



> *408.36(D)* Back-Fed Devices. Plug-in-type overcurrent protection
> devices or plug-in type main lug assemblies that are
> backfed and used to terminate field-installed ungrounded
> supply conductors shall be secured in place by an additional
> ...


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## Jonathan Kemler (Oct 17, 2020)

HackWork said:


> Yeah, the stickers are something I need to get.
> 
> The solar work was done and inspected. But the solar companies don't like doing electrical work, since they aren't qualified for it, so they backfeed old and crappy panels. In this situation they backfeed an old Pushmatic panel that is busting at the seems, and the customer wants me to change out to a new panel of the same ampacity.


I just swapped out a 200 amp Zinsco that was backfed with a 50amp breaker (violating the rule of 120%), and on top of that, they put the 50amp backfed breaker which should have been a line side tap directly beneath the main, which means they would not have been allowed the extra 20% in the first place as code clearly states if you put the backfed breaker near the main breaker you are only allowed 100% max ampaciry of the panel between main breaker and backfed breaker.. As easy as solar electric is, these hacks that call themselves electricians at those companies massacre people’s electrical systems..


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