# Temp service



## Magnettica (Jan 23, 2007)

I made this temporary service panel for when I do service upgrades. We've been over this before so no, this is not to be used as a temporary service for a new house build. It's only purpose is to provide temporary power for an 8-10 hour period so we don't steal any electrons from the poco. 

In the picture you can see how I tapped into this UG meter set up. Can I get something more convenient for tapping into utility? I would somehow like to use the same jaws or something similar to a meter so I don't have to worry about rusted lugs and opening a can of worms. This meter was less than 30 yrs old but some of the other old meters could bring problems along with rusted lugs. 


Any ideas are welcome.


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## B4T (Feb 10, 2009)

We roll differently around here.. I took a old pair of car jumper cables.. cut it 24" long and put a handy box and receptacle on the end...

I can clamp it on the POCO wires or inside the meter pan.. no issues with "stealing power".. they have passed by and waved.. :thumbsup:


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## NolaTigaBait (Oct 19, 2008)

Yeah I don't bother to do that either. Just hook straight to the drop and work...


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## Magnettica (Jan 23, 2007)

I'm gonna open shop in N'orleans.


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## backstay (Feb 3, 2011)

This is what I use.


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## Edrick (Jun 6, 2010)

If they're coming after you for the $2.50 in power you used for the whole day they must be hurting for money.


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## Jmohl (Apr 26, 2011)

Doing a panel change/ service upgrade had one of those cheater boxes to run tools while doing the change over. I'm on the ladder drilling into the side of the house for the new entry and I accidently pull one of the gator clips loose. Go to hook it back in (while still on the ladder leaning over sideways, and made contact with the lug. Jw I was with said I yelled out every curseword known to man in the .2 seconds it took for me to land on the ground.....


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## muck (Jun 30, 2008)

Jmohl said:


> Doing a panel change/ service upgrade had one of those cheater boxes to run tools while doing the change over. I'm on the ladder drilling into the side of the house for the new entry and I accidently pull one of the gator clips loose. Go to hook it back in (while still on the ladder leaning over sideways, and made contact with the lug. Jw I was with said I yelled out every curseword known to man in the .2 seconds it took for me to land on the ground.....


So you weren't wearing your PPE? DUH!


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## Jmohl (Apr 26, 2011)

Man, back then we couldn't even spell PPE!!! Dad (the EC) use to call me a big P***y for not wanting to work a recep hot. 'Sides that, it was one of those brain fart moments, clip comes off, just reach over and hook it back up.....


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## Salvatoreg02 (Feb 26, 2011)

B4T said:


> We roll differently around here.. I took a old pair of car jumper cables.. cut it 24" long and put a handy box and receptacle on the end...
> 
> I can clamp it on the POCO wires or inside the meter pan.. no issues with "stealing power".. they have passed by and waved.. :thumbsup:


NICE!!!

Sent from my iPhone using ET Forum


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## A Little Short (Nov 11, 2010)

Magnettica said:


> I made this temporary service panel for when I do service upgrades. We've been over this before so no, this is not to be used as a temporary service for a new house build. It's only purpose is to provide temporary power for an 8-10 hour period so we don't steal any electrons from the poco.
> 
> In the picture you can see how I tapped into this UG meter set up. Can I get something more convenient for tapping into utility? I would somehow like to use the same jaws or something similar to a meter so I don't have to worry about rusted lugs and opening a can of worms. This meter was less than 30 yrs old but some of the other old meters could bring problems along with rusted lugs.
> 
> ...


What's the short jumpers wire-nutted to your cable for?


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## user4818 (Jan 15, 2009)

Little-Lectric said:


> What's the short jumpers wire-nutted to your cable for?



I'd guess it's solid wire to land under the terminals a bit easier.


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## A Little Short (Nov 11, 2010)

Peter D said:


> I'd guess it's solid wire to land under the terminals a bit easier.


Makes sense!:thumbsup:


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## Shockdoc (Mar 4, 2010)

Too much time on your hands, I just tie my quad box directly off the lateral.


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

Jmohl said:


> Doing a panel change/ service upgrade had one of those cheater boxes to run tools while doing the change over. I'm on the ladder drilling into the side of the house for the new entry and I accidently pull one of the gator clips loose. Go to hook it back in (while still on the ladder leaning over sideways, and made contact with the lug. Jw I was with said I yelled out every curseword known to man in the .2 seconds it took for me to land on the ground.....


That will knock the wind out of you...:laughing:


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## oldtimer (Jun 10, 2010)

Little-Lectric said:


> What's the short jumpers wire-nutted to your cable for?


 What kind of cable is that.......Blk/Blue/Green?

Maybe I have lead a sheltered life.........but I have never seen a cable with that colour combination.


Just curious.:001_huh:




Just took a closer look......it is a white wire, taped blue. O.K. I'm losing it!


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## Tiger (Jan 3, 2008)

Like backstay, I use a small portable generator.


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## Magnettica (Jan 23, 2007)

Shockdoc said:


> Too much time on your hands, I just tie my quad box directly off the lateral.


So you run the risk of being fined.


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## BBQ (Nov 16, 2010)

Magnettica said:


> So you run the risk of being fined.


He is way too tough to worry about fines.:laughing:


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## Magnettica (Jan 23, 2007)

oldtimer said:


> What kind of cable is that.......Blk/Blue/Green?
> 
> Maybe I have lead a sheltered life.........but I have never seen a cable with that colour combination.
> 
> ...


The white conductor was re-identified.


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## Jlarson (Jun 28, 2009)

I either use a generator or go without power, I have cordless tools and cordless lighting I'm good.


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## Magnettica (Jan 23, 2007)

Jlarson said:


> I either use a generator or go without power, I have cordless tools and cordless lighting I'm good.


...until the batteries go dead :whistling2:


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## mmiller9 (Jan 2, 2009)

just because its temporary doesnt mean it had to be dangerous. im glad up here you would never get away with a mickey-mouse setup like that.


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## Jlarson (Jun 28, 2009)

Magnettica said:


> ...until the batteries go dead :whistling2:


I forgot about my inverter in the truck. Putting inverters on the trucks was a great move. 

I'm putting a second battery and an inverter/charger in my next service truck along with a transfer option between batteries, it be nice to only need the generators or welder/generators for big stuff.


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## captkirk (Nov 21, 2007)

I would be carefull with that. I got my ass chewed out by a POCO dude about a month ago for using the house meter on a temp service. He told me when you are using temp power you need a different meter that is on a commercial rate. I personally use a number 10 sj cord with a GFCI breaker on it and a quad box on the bottom. THe breaker is in a small metal box with a kelman strap coming out of the top. I usually hang it by the connection point and plug into the bottom quad.


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## BBQ (Nov 16, 2010)

B4T said:


> I can clamp it on the POCO wires or inside the meter pan.. no issues with "stealing power".. they have passed by and waved.. :thumbsup:





captkirk said:


> I would be carefull with that. I got my ass chewed out by a POCO dude about a month ago for using the house meter on a temp service.


It just depends on which POCO person drives by, linemen are not normally going to give a crap, one of the metering department people might flip out.

In any case I am sure if push comes to shove the written policies will be on the side of the power company.

I know we used to 'steal' power all the time during service changes, now I would not. We have generators if cordless is not enough.


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## NolaTigaBait (Oct 19, 2008)

Magnettica said:


> I'm gonna open shop in N'orleans.


You should:laughing:


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## robnj772 (Jan 15, 2008)

Magnettica said:


> So you run the risk of being fined.


Have you ever heard of anyone that got fined?

I cut an extension cord and put alligator clamps on the end.


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## jarhead0531 (Jun 1, 2010)

I did the same as RobNJ. Hacked up an extension cord with some alligator clips from radio shack with a quad gfi on the other end. Only used it a couple times when I needed a heat gun for some pvc work.

I can't imagine that anyone giving me a hard time about it.


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## Magnettica (Jan 23, 2007)

robnj772 said:


> Have you ever heard of anyone that got fined?
> 
> I cut an extension cord and put alligator clamps on the end.


Yes I have. $500 fine. An old boss got fined. Thats probably why I am cautious.


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## B4T (Feb 10, 2009)

Magnettica said:


> Yes I have. $500 fine. An old boss got fined. Thats probably why I am cautious.


I thought your old boss was a dirt bag.. the POCO guy probably didn't like him either..


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## Tiger (Jan 3, 2008)

jarhead0531 said:


> I did the same as RobNJ. Hacked up an extension cord with some alligator clips from radio shack with a quad gfi on the other end. Only used it a couple times when I needed a heat gun for some pvc work.
> 
> I can't imagine that anyone giving me a hard time about it.


12 ga, no fuse?


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## NolaTigaBait (Oct 19, 2008)

Tiger said:


> 12 ga, no fuse?


yeah, it's just temp power...


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## Tiger (Jan 3, 2008)

jarhead0531 said:


> I did the same as RobNJ. Hacked up an extension cord with some alligator clips from radio shack with a quad gfi on the other end. Only used it a couple times when I needed a heat gun for some pvc work.
> 
> I can't imagine that anyone giving me a hard time about it.


I'll be the one to give you a hard time about it. 

Extension cords are rated at 140 degrees F. In round numbers copper boils at 1800F (1000C) and evaporates at 4700F (2600C). I don't know what the utility fuses at, but obviously over 200 amps. Extension cords are rated 20A max. In a short situation WHEN the insulation burns off the extension cord, there will be live, high temperature conductors. Arm/hand paralysis occurs at 10mA and respiratory paralysis occurs at 30mA.

From OSHA Electrical Safety Work Practices regarding arc and blast dangers:
Electric arc up to 35,000 degrees (4 times hotter than the surface of the sun).
Pressure from instantaneous heating of air surrounding the arc and from expansion.
Molten metal droplets in the blast cause burns.

...then you fall off the ladder.


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## screwball (May 22, 2011)

Tiger said:


> I'll be the one to give you a hard time about it.
> 
> Extension cords are rated at 140 degrees F. In round numbers copper boils at 1800F (1000C) and evaporates at 4700F (2600C). I don't know what the utility fuses at, but obviously over 200 amps. Extension cords are rated 20A max. In a short situation WHEN the insulation burns off the extension cord, there will be live, high temperature conductors. Arm/hand paralysis occurs at 10mA and respiratory paralysis occurs at 30mA.
> 
> ...


 glad to see im not the only screwball


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

screwball said:


> glad to see im not the only screwball


Aren't we all screwballs...:laughing:


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## TOOL_5150 (Aug 27, 2007)

Tiger said:


> 12 ga, no fuse?


The #12 IS the fuse..


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## jarhead0531 (Jun 1, 2010)

Tiger said:


> I'll be the one to give you a hard time about it.
> 
> Extension cords are rated at 140 degrees F. In round numbers copper boils at 1800F (1000C) and evaporates at 4700F (2600C). I don't know what the utility fuses at, but obviously over 200 amps. Extension cords are rated 20A max. In a short situation WHEN the insulation burns off the extension cord, there will be live, high temperature conductors. Arm/hand paralysis occurs at 10mA and respiratory paralysis occurs at 30mA.
> 
> ...


While I appreciate the the continuing education, I never said you had to do what I did.

I don't use it very often, because I don't need temp power very often on service changes. If I could I would have a generator on the truck, but cost vs use vs lack of room wins the battle of what I carry.

But I see your point, and now I wondering how hard it would be to put an inline fuse right before the clips... hmmm


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## lefleuron (May 22, 2010)

Side line.

Last home we bought, I did my own service (, I cut the lock and pulled my own meter- resi guys do this all the time).

I changed the panel and all new to the weather head. When I called the POCO to cut over, they were kind of sh#tty pants with me- they figured I was just some handy homeowner messing with their stuff.

I explained exactly what I did for a living, then this dink was sure I was "somehow" stealing power, and actually used a mirror on a stick and pulled the clips off to make sure I hadn't run bootlegs. Then he threatened me with "we will know" if you are stealing power.

Anyone else ever get this, or was this guy a one-in-a-million? Maybe I came off wrong, or maybe I was supposed to tip him or something....


Besides, we all know we are too dumb to figure out how to steal power if we wanted to (besides Kaboler- he could do it).:jester:


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## B4T (Feb 10, 2009)

lefleuron;454425
Anyone else ever get this said:


> You just got a guy with "issues" that had nothing to do with you..
> 
> You did the noble thing by calling the POCO.. but next time I wouldn't bother and just wait for them to notify you.. if it ever happens..
> 
> Some here will jump all over my post as bad advise.. but I am used to it.. :thumbsup:


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## robnj772 (Jan 15, 2008)

Tiger said:


> I'll be the one to give you a hard time about it.
> 
> Extension cords are rated at 140 degrees F. In round numbers copper boils at 1800F (1000C) and evaporates at 4700F (2600C). I don't know what the utility fuses at, but obviously over 200 amps. Extension cords are rated 20A max. In a short situation WHEN the insulation burns off the extension cord, there will be live, high temperature conductors. Arm/hand paralysis occurs at 10mA and respiratory paralysis occurs at 30mA.
> 
> ...


Blah Blah Blah 

I do real electrical work for a living I don't just change out GFI's and hang ceiling fans for little old ladies.

It is a wonder how some of you pansy A$$es even gather enough courage to leave your homes in the morning :lol: :lol: :lol:

Or is this you?


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## DiegoXJ (Jul 29, 2010)

Old GC I worked for got a nice $500 fine. Of course his temp panel had been in place unmetered for a few months after the side of the house the original one was demo'd. I've spoken to a few linemen and even a guy that came out to program the bi-directional Meter for a house with a PV system. None of them cared that I was tapped off the service conductors, the meter dude just needed power to set the meter. One guy actually mentioned to me that the new smart meters (if they ever start working) will transmit a signal back home when they get pulled.


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## guest (Feb 21, 2009)

Magnettica said:


> I made this temporary service panel for when I do service upgrades. We've been over this before so no, this is not to be used as a temporary service for a new house build. It's only purpose is to provide temporary power for an 8-10 hour period so we don't steal any electrons from the poco.
> 
> In the picture you can see how I tapped into this UG meter set up. *Can I get something more convenient for tapping into utility?* I would somehow *like to use the same jaws or something similar to a meter* so I don't have to worry about rusted lugs and opening a can of worms. This meter was less than 30 yrs old but some of the other old meters could bring problems along with rusted lugs.
> 
> ...



Yes sir I have an idea for you.....get a meter from this company: http://www.hialeahmeter.com/spwm.html

It is only $16 and their shipping is reasonable. 

Carefully disassemble it and gut the mechanism, attach your temp leads to the top lugs inside, (lead your neutral out through a hole in the gutted base and attach it before plugging the modified meter shell in) and you are good to go. Route the lead out of the cover with a strain relief and use a strain relief clamp. 

Or if you have a good working relationship with your POCO talk to them about getting an old meter you can gut for the purpose. 

Maybe I should start building those for you guys...:thumbup:


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## lefleuron (May 22, 2010)

robnj772 said:


> Blah Blah Blah
> 
> I do real electrical work for a living I don't just change out GFI's and hang ceiling fans for little old ladies.
> 
> ...


 
Though the message is wrong, the sentiment is correct in my opinion.

We had a guy a few years back who was drop dead frightened of a 4-20 mA signal wire because it could kill you dead. I am pretty sure he wanted to pull the big switch at the nuke plant so he could troubleshoot. He didnt make it long enough to wire a MOP at 110, much less anything near the 4160 subs. 

I am a big believer in safety, but this has to be tempered a bit.

And I really believe that the over stimulation of fear by some of the instructors and learning institutes has gone beyond teaching you to be safe- into teaching you to be frozen with fright.

I mean come on, there has to be some middle ground. 

If you see me in a monkey suit with the shield down and the gloves on...be scared.

If you see me flinch and say " that's really hot", don't touch it.

If I check a 9 volt battery with my tongue, I guarantee it wont kill you if you hold it in your hand.

Kill the power if at all possible, but also tell these guys 120 volts is not going to jump 4 feet through the air and kill them.:no:


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## Tiger (Jan 3, 2008)

Here's another guy that did "real electrical work", not just changing out GFCIs and hanging ceiling fans for little old ladies. Definitely not drop dead frightened of a little electrical work.

http://www.osha.gov/OshDoc/data_FatalFacts/f-facts60.html


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## robnj772 (Jan 15, 2008)

Tiger said:


> Here's another guy that did "real electrical work", not just changing out GFCIs and hanging ceiling fans for little old ladies. Definitely not drop dead frightened of a little electrical work.
> 
> http://www.osha.gov/OshDoc/data_FatalFacts/f-facts60.html


 
Refer to post #41 Bubble Boy


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## NolaTigaBait (Oct 19, 2008)

Tiger said:


> Here's another guy that did "real electrical work", not just changing out GFCIs and hanging ceiling fans for little old ladies. Definitely not drop dead frightened of a little electrical work.
> 
> http://www.osha.gov/OshDoc/data_FatalFacts/f-facts60.html


I refuse to click the link. Grow a pair , will ya?...


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## B4T (Feb 10, 2009)

robnj772 said:


> Refer to post #41 Bubble Boy


LMAOOO.. Bubble boy.. :thumbup:


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

robnj772 said:


> Blah Blah Blah
> 
> I do real electrical work for a living I don't just change out GFI's and hang ceiling fans for little old ladies.
> 
> ...


Bubble boy...:laughing::laughing::thumbup::thumbup::lol:


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## Jlarson (Jun 28, 2009)

Mag's setup it pretty safe. Obviously loosing the lugs to put the taps in presents some risk. He has over current protection in there at the panel, only way that thing will go 3 mile island is if there is a fault in the cord or wire before the panel. 

I wouldn't loose and sleep over the ufused conductors, I've made countless taps from unfused service conductors and high current feeders for meters and controls, and phase monitors. Couple 100 amp starters with #16 tapped off the feeders is not uncommon in my area.

I'm all for safety but, common sense safety.


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## B4T (Feb 10, 2009)

Jlarson said:


> I'm all for safety but, common sense safety.


Common sense is not NEC recognized and you will be chastised and shunned for even mentioning those words..


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## lefleuron (May 22, 2010)

oh good,

Now I am surrounded by Serial Killers, Pipetricians, and Bubble Boys...

:blink: :laughing:


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## robnj772 (Jan 15, 2008)

Tiger said:


> Here's another guy that did "real electrical work", not just changing out GFCIs and hanging ceiling fans for little old ladies. Definitely not drop dead frightened of a little electrical work.
> 
> http://www.osha.gov/OshDoc/data_FatalFacts/f-facts60.html


 
Man I hope you don't have a cat


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## Jlarson (Jun 28, 2009)

I would never get any work done in a bubble. I'd be too busy looking for hills to roll down in the thing. :laughing:


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## dronai (Apr 11, 2011)

robnj772 said:


> Blah Blah Blah
> 
> I do real electrical work for a living I don't just change out GFI's and hang ceiling fans for little old ladies.
> 
> ...


 

Best Post Here, deserves another look !!!:laughing:


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## cabletie (Feb 12, 2011)

I have a similar set up I haven’t used it in years. The ply-wood is cut with a shape that you can roll the sj cord around when stored, and has a handle hole cut into it. It has enough cord to get to the service drop where it attaches with large alligator clips. No meter. And until recently jcp&l used to require that they do a disconnect & re-connect the day of the service change, sometimes I would hand them the alligator clips to save me the trip! It was a pain setting up a service change with the poco and the inspectors all in the same day. Depending on the crew or how well you knew them they would not re-connect without a cut-in card from the inspector. Other times you might only have the outside done and they would swing by and hook it up. I do remember the days with pse&g and temp bugging in the service with romex connectors because they always threw away whatever bugs you did use, to use there own days later after inspection.


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