# Time to get busy



## Speedy Petey (Jan 10, 2007)

If you are anywhere near the NY metro area I'd have to say you're right.

I have friends talking of driving 100-300 miles to cash in on some of that work.

**Edit: Sorry, I didn't notice this was in the Union forum. I was obviously referring more to resi work. I'm sure union work will pick up as well. There was plenty of damage in those areas as well.


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## Loose Neutral (Jun 3, 2009)

I'm close. Yeah that whole infrastructure will need repair, but there is talks of data centers and other big jobs in my area. I think either way after Tuesday, These companies are going to have to get off the money.


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## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)




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## Loose Neutral (Jun 3, 2009)

She's hot. You must be sick. I see no words.


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## icefalkon (Dec 16, 2007)

Yes work is picking up for us here in Local 3. While we're not at full employment, we're down to a 10 week wait or so for a job ticket and more and more men are being made Basic by their shops.


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## Vic098 (Oct 27, 2012)

icefalkon said:


> more men are being made Basic by their shops.


I'm not familiar with this terminology. What does that mean?


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## icefalkon (Dec 16, 2007)

Basic means that a contractor likes your work and wants you to continue working for him even after your 6 month job ticket is up.


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## Vic098 (Oct 27, 2012)

icefalkon said:


> Basic means that a contractor likes your work and wants you to continue working for him even after your 6 month job ticket is up.


LOL. I thought thats what it means.
Nothing wrong with that. I got a ticket for 3 weeks and stuck around for a year with my last EC. Although there are some in our IBEW who wants every job to end with a layoff. I, am not in that party. I think your reputation should stand for something.


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## icefalkon (Dec 16, 2007)

Vic098 said:


> LOL. I thought thats what it means.
> Nothing wrong with that. I got a ticket for 3 weeks and stuck around for a year with my last EC. Although there are some in our IBEW who wants every job to end with a layoff. I, am not in that party. I think your reputation should stand for something.


Absolutely! In 26yrs I can count the number of EC's I've worked for on one hand.


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## Vic098 (Oct 27, 2012)

icefalkon said:


> Absolutely! In 26yrs I can count the number of EC's I've worked for on one hand.


Well, your better then me.
:laughing:


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## icefalkon (Dec 16, 2007)

Vic098 said:


> Well, your better then me.
> :laughing:



Nope. I just don't like change! 

LOL


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## Vic098 (Oct 27, 2012)

icefalkon said:


> Nope. I just don't like change!
> 
> LOL


Neither do I.


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

Vic098 said:


> LOL. I thought thats what it means.
> Nothing wrong with that. I got a ticket for 3 weeks and stuck around for a year with my last EC. Although there are some in our IBEW who wants every job to end with a layoff. I, am not in that party. I think your reputation should stand for something.


Years ago(like 30) several members tried to push the everyone is laid off at the end of a job, several members I talked to thought all service drivers should be laid off at the end of the year as well. But they were well into their 2nd 6 pack, so I figured that was just talk.

I think having core men strengthens the company as well as making the union more competitive in the market place.


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## leland (Dec 28, 2007)

brian john said:


> Years ago(like 30) several members tried to push the everyone is laid off at the end of a job, several members I talked to thought all service drivers should be laid off at the end of the year as well. But they were well into their 2nd 6 pack, so I figured that was just talk.
> 
> I think having core men strengthens the company as well as making the union more competitive in the market place.



I think your onto something Brian.:thumbsup:

Good to great workers/employees, make for good to great employers.
In my 30 yrs-, worked for 4 employers- 2 of them twice.

1st move- Co. went under. Very sad, moved to the successor who filled the vacuum.
2nd move -better benefits and money. Facilities. Inside (boring)
3rd move- Back to the challenge and the open road and a 20% pay increase AND a CO. truck.
4th- Back to the inside gig- 15% pay cut and travel expenses.
5Th move- Back to the open road and challenges. loving MOST every minute of it. Paid when my company truck leaves my driveway until it is back in its spot.


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## Loose Neutral (Jun 3, 2009)

icefalkon said:


> Nope. I just don't like change!
> 
> LOL


I'm the opposite, I like change. Nothing better than seeing new faces and a new location.


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## icefalkon (Dec 16, 2007)

I totally agree. Being basic, I feel, is the way to go. Being the money making General Foreman and leading teams of mixed shop guys as well as guys from the Hall has always been the most rewarding for me personally. It's not for everyone...I understand that. I also tell Apprentices to aspire for more than just being an A Journeyman.


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## icefalkon (Dec 16, 2007)

Loose Neutral said:


> I'm the opposite, I like change. Nothing better than seeing new faces and a new location.


That's cool. Many of my friends prefer that and they do very well. I have thought about leaving NYC to take a PM job elsewhere, but the right opportunity hasn't shown up. 

I just heard that our Employment Office was open today and anyone laid off who called was given work starting tomorrow! We're also doing a massive union wide relief effort staged in Brooklyn and Queens.


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

One of my guys has worked for 5 companies (as a journeyman) 4 of them went belly up. A few guys questioned me hiring him when I did, that was 18 years ago.


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## Loose Neutral (Jun 3, 2009)

We have guys that have only worked for 1 contractor their entire career.


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## Vic098 (Oct 27, 2012)

Loose Neutral said:


> We have guys that have only worked for 1 contractor their entire career.


Yup, we have lots of that.

I know some won't believe it (Brian John I'm looking at you) but I usually don't have a problem sticking around somewhere. My problem is my mouth. I just can't play the games that go on with in these cliques that exist in the "shoppie" culture. Last shop I was with had a minority owned division that would do all the minority work in the city, like public housing and stuff like that.

Those guys were brutal and the superintendent thought the rules only applied when they were convenient to him. 

I take a lay off and then a few weeks later the supt calls me back. (We have SOJ 50/50). I was with these guys for months before the layoff.

Well, there was a situation in which I wasn't real happy about BUT I tried to make the best out of it AND keep the men from becoming disgruntled. It ended up with me getting laid off in the middle of the week without even so much as an explanation. The foreman literally hid from me and the supt left the job before I even knew what happened.

I made it through about a half dozen layoffs before then, bounced from job to job, had a great reputation with all the long time foreman, got called back after a brief lay off and then all of a sudden I got the 8 ball and no one wants to be seen with me. :laughing:

It wasn't until then, that I could see me preferring to work the way Loose Noodle likes to work.


But anyway, I think building core employees is essential to company success and keeping a competitive edge in the open market. I don't believe in the "We're all the same" nonsense and I think your work ethic should mean something. JMO.


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

Vic098 said:


> Yup, we have lots of that.
> 
> I know some won't believe it (Brian John I'm looking at you) bu*t I usually don't have a problem sticking around somewhere. My problem is my mouth.* I just can't play the games that go on with in these cliques that exist in the "shoppie" culture. Last shop I was with had a minority owned division that would do all the minority work in the city, like public housing and stuff like that.
> JMO.


Part of the reason I am in business for myself, I ran my mouth at two of the largest firms IN DC, (I was not exactly welcomed by management) I figured I'd do better on my own when the last firm closed down their testing division.

On another note I had the apprentice that was a real PIA, ran into him several years later he claimed to have been at 26 shops in one year.


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## Vic098 (Oct 27, 2012)

brian john said:


> Part of the reason I am in business for myself, I ran my mouth at two of the largest firms IN DC, (I was not exactly welcomed by management) I figured I'd do better on my own when the last firm closed down their testing division.
> 
> *On another note I had the apprentice that was a real PIA, ran into him several years later he claimed to have been at 26 shops in one year*.


Is that even possible?!


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## Loose Neutral (Jun 3, 2009)

It's funny, cause I too like to call it as i see it also. I've never left on bad terms though and am welcome back with open arms every time. Except for maybe once where I had to smack a foreman around. The owner was calling the hall complaining that I beat up his foreman.


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## Loose Neutral (Jun 3, 2009)

Vic098 said:


> Is that even possible?!


Yeah 26 2 weekers. :laughing:


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

Vic098 said:


> Is that even possible?!


I knew an open shop guy that had 22 W2's one year.

The Union electrician that was my PIA apprentice told me he had 26 jobs in a year, true????? besides being a PIA he lied a lot.

Our local was trying to weed real problem children out of the local, I never saw this guy again.


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## Vic098 (Oct 27, 2012)

Loose Neutral said:


> It's funny, cause I too like to call it as i see it also. I've never left on bad terms though and am welcome back with open arms every time. Except for maybe once where I had to smack a foreman around. The owner was calling the hall complaining that I beat up his foreman.


 :laughing:


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## big2bird (Oct 1, 2012)

My first contractor I was there 9 years till he retired. If not, I'd still be there. 2end EC was 7 years before the politics got to me. I bounced a few years here, a few years there, and have been here for 7 years. I like the stability myself. I plan on being here till I retire, but you never know for sure.


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## Vic098 (Oct 27, 2012)

Yeah well, check this out Brian. On that job where I took the redass layoff there was a "journeyman" who couldn't do basic residential electric. 3 ways and 4 ways, down stream GFI protection, Knowing where Arc Faults went and where they didn't, things like that.

I knew him, and I liked him too. I tried to help him the best I could. Put him in situations where he wouldn't/couldn't mess up. Anyway, he was the only other guy to get laid off when I did. :laughing: You know how many switches had toi be rewired behind this guy?

Just another example of how indentured apprenticeships hurt the apprentices. Kids should bounce around for a varied experience in the field.


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## Loose Neutral (Jun 3, 2009)

I find lately, basically since 08 that you can't even make suggestions without being treated like your going against the grain. It's a different model out there now. Basically go in act like a robot and your good. If you have the slightest thought pattern your toast.


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## Loose Neutral (Jun 3, 2009)

Vic098 said:


> Yeah well, check this out Brian. On that job where I took the redass layoff there was a "journeyman" who couldn't do basic residential electric. 3 ways and 4 ways, down stream GFI protection, Knowing where Arc Faults went and where they didn't, things like that.
> 
> I knew him, and I liked him too. I tried to help him the best I could. Put him in situations where he wouldn't/couldn't mess up. Anyway, he was the only other guy to get laid off when I did. :laughing: You know how many switches had toi be rewired behind this guy?
> 
> Just another example of how indentured apprenticeships hurt the apprentices. Kids should bounce around for a varied experience in the field.


I've seen 25 year company men that couldn't hook a stop start.


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## MDShunk (Jan 7, 2007)

Loose Neutral said:


> I've seen 25 year company men that couldn't hook a stop start.


I wouldn't hold that against a guy. It's easily conceivable that a man can go his whole career and never need to.


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## Loose Neutral (Jun 3, 2009)

True that, but not this company. All they do is big work. He was just a pusher.


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

Vic- I encourage open shop apprentices to move around I feel the advantages of seeing as much as possible in the 4-5 years you are supposedly an apprentice is the best solution.

If I could I'd have them spend 6 months at a supply house on the counter.

6 months in residential and the rest in schools, churches, stores pumping stations and the like.

I have worked with a few JW's that did basically the same thing for 3-4 years of their apprenticeship and were almost lost when they became JW's


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## Loose Neutral (Jun 3, 2009)

I'm definitely for rotation of apprentices.


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## MDShunk (Jan 7, 2007)

Loose Neutral said:


> I'm definitely for rotation of apprentices.


That's a concept I hope everyone can get behind. The work experience should mirror the classroom training if that work is available.


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## icefalkon (Dec 16, 2007)

That is what we do up here. Apprentices are rotated yearly to shops doing g different aspects of electrical work. While we do not send them to work in supply houses (different division)...we try to expose them to residential, large open construction, small commercial, data and fiber. That is what indentured apprenticeships are. We force their rotation. We also been weeding out the bad eggs with over 80 being removed from the program. 

The thing is...we all have to work to train these kids. I mean. Being an instructor and working full time is one thing...the guys in the field have to supplement what we teach them.


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## TGGT (Oct 28, 2012)

icefalkon said:


> That is what we do up here. Apprentices are rotated yearly to shops doing g different aspects of electrical work. While we do not send them to work in supply houses (different division)...we try to expose them to residential, large open construction, small commercial, data and fiber. That is what indentured apprenticeships are. We force their rotation. We also been weeding out the bad eggs with over 80 being removed from the program.
> 
> The thing is...we all have to work to train these kids. I mean. Being an instructor and working full time is one thing...the guys in the field have to supplement what we teach them.


I've been trying to get the jman I'm with now to do that with our apprentice. Thing is, there's only so much you can learn on these big commercial jobs. Too often, it's 1 repetitive task for weeks or months on end.

Another part of the problem is some of the journeymen don't know much more than the apprentices.

I've jumped around a lot as an apprentice. It's worked to my benefit. Now I have a clearer idea where I want to be in the future, and it's changed since I've started.


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## big2bird (Oct 1, 2012)

icefalkon said:


> That is what we do up here. Apprentices are rotated yearly to shops doing g different aspects of electrical work. While we do not send them to work in supply houses (different division)...we try to expose them to residential, large open construction, small commercial, data and fiber. That is what indentured apprenticeships are. We force their rotation. We also been weeding out the bad eggs with over 80 being removed from the program.
> 
> The thing is...we all have to work to train these kids. I mean. Being an instructor and working full time is one thing...the guys in the field have to supplement what we teach them.


Material handler in the shop is a good substitute for wholesale house. Unfortunately, housing here is virtually nonexistant for the unions, and the school of simple circuiting is dead except for TI. Sad really, as housing is as expensive as it ever was.


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## icefalkon (Dec 16, 2007)

I totally understand the frustration. I grew up in my old mans shop so I have a somewhat different perspective than the organization at times. I too believe that the kids should spend their first year doing material. That's it. Learning material. Then move on. I'm also of the belief that their 5th year SHOULD be spent in a truck working...jobbing on their own and thinking for themselves.


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## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

icefalkon said:


> I just heard that our Employment Office was open today and anyone laid off who called was given work starting tomorrow! We're also doing a massive union wide relief effort staged in Brooklyn and Queens.


any non-Sandy work ?

~CS~


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## icefalkon (Dec 16, 2007)

chicken steve said:


> any non-Sandy work ?
> 
> ~CS~


I don't know yet. Let me tell u with lower manhattan being under water for days...it's bad. Real bad.


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## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

despite the circumstances , it's work

but i'd be wary of that _'fema check'_ in the mail....

~CS~


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## icefalkon (Dec 16, 2007)

chicken steve said:


> despite the circumstances , it's work
> 
> but i'd be wary of that _'fema check'_ in the mail....
> 
> ~CS~



Yeah, I hear that. I'm actually up near Burlington now...not Downstate. But I've been getting calls and calls about how:

A. Bad it is...to which I say...Hey...are you WORKING? If so...stop complaining.

or

B. How great it is that they're working...to which I say...why are you calling me before lunch time? 

LOL


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## eejack (Jul 14, 2012)

Vic098 said:


> Is that even possible?!


Yes. My record is 26 2 week calls (20 contractors) in a year, but I screwed up and went to some of the same contractors twice.


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