# 0-10v dimming cable



## VELOCI3 (Aug 15, 2019)

NM in a building could be a violation. What type of building and how many floors?


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## DashDingo (Feb 11, 2018)

It’s a one level slab on grade wood framed, no places of assembly 


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## VELOCI3 (Aug 15, 2019)

Is it residential or commercial?


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## splatz (May 23, 2015)

I think this boils down to whether your dimming power (power pack / source for the 0-10V circuit) is class 1 or class 2. 

If your dimming is class 1, 725.48(B)(1) allows you to run power for "functionally associated" class 1 and class 2 in the same cable or conduit - certainly lights and dimming are functionally associated. For the wiring method, 725.46 says Class 1 you run with basically chapter 3 wiring methods. 725.43 also requires overcurrent protection on class 1 circuits. 

If your dimming is class 2, a lot of the chapter 3 stuff doesn't apply, things like exposed splices etc. are OK, but you don't have 725.48(B)(1) allowing you to run them together in cable or conduit. 

If you have a class 2 supply and want to use the 725.48 rules to put the dimming and power in the same cable or conduit, 725.130(A) lets you do this but you have to remove the class 2 marks off the power supply. Once you remove the mark, it's no longer a class 2 circuit, it's a class 1 circuit. 

So I think if you want to use 12-4, you may have to remove the class 2 mark from the dimming power pack.


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## HertzHound (Jan 22, 2019)

Why not just use the MC type Luminare cable?


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## Forge Boyz (Nov 7, 2014)

HertzHound said:


> Why not just use the MC type Luminare cable?


I wouldn't want to use MC with wafer lights.

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## splatz (May 23, 2015)

HertzHound said:


> Why not just use the MC type Luminare cable?


NM boxes...


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## HertzHound (Jan 22, 2019)

> I know I’ve done it with EMT plenty of times where the 0-10v wires are not in a separate cable assemblies but are in the same conduit at the line v conductors.


I asked the same question during a code update/Continuing education class. The answer didn't seem to address the situation I was talking about. I didn't want to be the A-hole to continue the conversation and drag on the class. 

I was basically asking the question, if the 0-10 had to be in a jacketed cable, like it is in the Luminare cable. Is it the Jacket on the purple/grey that makes the Luminare cable legal? I never wanted to ask an inspector. I would be afraid of the costly answer.


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## splatz (May 23, 2015)

HertzHound said:


> I was basically asking the question, if the 0-10 had to be in a jacketed cable, like it is in the Luminare cable. Is it the Jacket on the purple/grey that makes the Luminare cable legal? I never wanted to ask an inspector. I would be afraid of the costly answer.


I think there's a jacket around the 0-10v that counts as a barrier 

Is it okay to use MC w/ 0-10V Cable in it? (force.com)


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## HertzHound (Jan 22, 2019)

> I wouldn't want to use MC with wafer lights.





> NM boxes...


All the wafer lights I just searched had small metal junction boxes? I would rather deal with #12 MC with the smaller purple/grey than 12-4 Romex. Do they stock 12-4 Romex, or would that also have a lead time? I would also have no problem changing out plastic nail-ons with metal four squares and mud rings.


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## Easy (Oct 18, 2017)

Here is a link to some cable you could use. Go here You might not need plenum rated but I would think that as long as it's jacketed and rated for the voltage it comes in contact with your code compliant. Something that I'm not sure about is the minimum conductor size, 18 gage? and the color of the wire? Does it really need to be purple/violet and grey?


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## splatz (May 23, 2015)

Easy said:


> Here is a link to some cable you could use. Go here You might not need plenum rated but I would think that as long as it's jacketed and rated for the voltage it comes in contact with your code compliant. Something that I'm not sure about is the minimum conductor size, 18 gage? and the color of the wire? Does it really need to be purple/violet and grey?


It doesn't have to be purple and gray but I sure wouldn't mind the colors matching, anything that makes it easier to check your work. 

For class 1, I think 18 gauge is the minimum but you can go smaller for class 2. 

Plenum rated probably isn't needed seeing as NM is allowed but that's a pretty good price for plenum. 

If you don't want to pay for the insulation colors matching, this stuff is cheap at Home Depot, if it's running parallel to power the shield might not be a bad thing. 

Southwire 500 ft. 18/2 Gray Stranded CU CL3R Shielded Security Cable-57573144 - The Home Depot


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## DashDingo (Feb 11, 2018)

HertzHound said:


> All the wafer lights I just searched had small metal junction boxes? I would rather deal with #12 MC with the smaller purple/grey than 12-4 Romex. Do they stock 12-4 Romex, or would that also have a lead time? I would also have no problem changing out plastic nail-ons with metal four squares and mud rings.


The slim LED fixture actually mounts to a standard round box.


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## DashDingo (Feb 11, 2018)

HertzHound said:


> Why not just use the MC type Luminare cable?


It’s a wood framed building and all the boxes will need to be vapor tight as they will be in the attic.
I already have the place boxed out, the dimming was an after thought.


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## DashDingo (Feb 11, 2018)

HertzHound said:


> All the wafer lights I just searched had small metal junction boxes? I would rather deal with #12 MC with the smaller purple/grey than 12-4 Romex. Do they stock 12-4 Romex, or would that also have a lead time? I would also have no problem changing out plastic nail-ons with metal four squares and mud rings.


The slim led fixtures actually mount to a round nm box


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## DashDingo (Feb 11, 2018)

splatz said:


> I think this boils down to whether your dimming power (power pack / source for the 0-10V circuit) is class 1 or class 2.
> 
> If your dimming is class 1, 725.48(B)(1) allows you to run power for "functionally associated" class 1 and class 2 in the same cable or conduit - certainly lights and dimming are functionally associated. For the wiring method, 725.46 says Class 1 you run with basically chapter 3 wiring methods. 725.43 also requires overcurrent protection on class 1 circuits.
> 
> ...


Thank you, I am going to look into this further.


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## MotoGP1199 (Aug 11, 2014)

What about security cable from HD. Its 18/2 and rated for 300v. $81 for 500' of cable. It is however shielded that I don't think would cause any issues.









Cerrowire 500 ft. 18/2 Gray Stranded CL3R Copper Shielded Security Alarm Cable 225-1002J2 - The Home Depot


Use the 500 ft. 18/2 Security Alarm Cable for your home-security and alarm systems. The 500 ft. cable features copper conductor construction. This cable is UL listed.



www.homedepot.com


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## HertzHound (Jan 22, 2019)

Since it’s not going to be under the jacket of the NM cable, it doesn’t matter what he uses. Luminaire cable doesn’t use shielded for the 0-10 either.

Going by the Accuity link Splatz provided, it would be illegal to use 12/4 Romex because it wouldn’t provide a barrier between the power and the 0-10. Now it’s just up to separation in the JB. Without looking it up, it may just be 1/4”? The Troffers aren’t designed to keep any separation, it’s all in the same wiring compartment. For years it used to be a big no no to mix LV with line voltage. That seems to be going away when we’re talking 0-10 dimming. I remember using the fancy Crestron wire and having to spice it just under the plastic nail-on with Dolphin crimps because the inspector didn’t want it in the box, even though all the literature said that it could. The wall plate would just cover the notch in the Sheetrock.


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## macmikeman (Jan 23, 2007)

Forge Boyz said:


> I wouldn't want to use MC with wafer lights.


I've done that plenty of times, it's not so bad, but not as easy as nm cable I will grant you. I try to use 14-2 stranded mc when I do use mc cable for wafer lights though (usually high rise residential condo's)


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## VELOCI3 (Aug 15, 2019)

HertzHound said:


> All the wafer lights I just searched had small metal junction boxes? I would rather deal with #12 MC with the smaller purple/grey than 12-4 Romex. Do they stock 12-4 Romex, or would that also have a lead time? I would also have no problem changing out plastic nail-ons with metal four squares and mud rings.


12-2-2 or 14-2-2 is common


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## VELOCI3 (Aug 15, 2019)

macmikeman said:


> I've done that plenty of times, it's not so bad, but not as easy as nm cable I will grant you. I try to use 14-2 stranded mc when I do use mc cable for wafer lights though (usually high rise residential condo's)


High rise buildings are type I or II. HI uses NEC?


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## macmikeman (Jan 23, 2007)

VELOCI3 said:


> High rise buildings are type I or II. HI uses NEC?
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk


2017


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## Tonedeaf (Nov 26, 2012)

you can buy wafer lights with 0-10V dimming??....all the ones i work with are line voltage dimmers

either way I never you the structured cable I always run a separate 18-2 stranded CMP cable to each fixture.


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## VELOCI3 (Aug 15, 2019)

RAB wafers can use triac dimmers


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