# Seeking some answers/advice on unions



## The_Modifier (Oct 24, 2009)

Pdon580 said:


> I am currently a non union, unemployed, second year 309A apprentice in Ontario Canada. I`ve been having problems finding another apprentice job for the past year and the situation to find a job seems more and more dire everyday. This lack of work has me considering joining the local union, I myself am unaware of the rules of unions and am looking for some answers.


Depending on your location would be the availability of work, i.e. plenty down south, not much up North. Your profile should be filled out a little more to the general area of ontario- not a city as we all know Cletus would probably watch you through a set of binoculars. :jester:



Pdon580 said:


> If I joined the union and finished my apprenticeship what would happened if I decided to quit the union after?


Then you're a non union worker.:thumbsup:



Pdon580 said:


> If I did become a journeyman in the union and left would I keep my ticket?


Unfortunately yes, I further went on to get my masters and start my own company. And no- we're not hiring before you ask.



Pdon580 said:


> Is the idea of joining and quitting after I become a journeyman even a good idea at all, or should I keep trying to tough it out?


That would be a personal decision.



Pdon580 said:


> This whole situation is very aggravating to me and has me considering another job stream completely. Any advice from someone that has been through this would be nice.


Just because you're out of work and you feel like your career is at a stand still, you can still study and research. Look at all the posts here, plenty of knowledgeable posts- albeit some go off course for a bit, but lots of information to read. Just start *HERE* first and you will be off and running. Just remember to do lots of necro posting so Harry has a good run for his money, lol.

Seriously, we have all had highs and lows in just about all facets of our lives, just because it seems tough right now, doesn't mean it won't get better.:thumbup:


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## Pdon580 (Sep 29, 2014)

So there are no repercussions for joining a union to finish an apprenticeship they quitting to take a non union job? I`m guessing if I wanted to join again after quitting there would be problems. Also I live in the GTA area of ontario.


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## Dan the electricman (Jan 2, 2011)

You should probably talk with someone who works in the local union. They can tell you the pros and cons, and consequences of changing your mind.

Here, if you finish your apprenticeship, and then start working non-union (once you have your journeyman license), you owe the union for the cost of the training. Unless you work for the union (and pay dues) for 5 years. It's something you agree to, when you join the apprenticeship.


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## spark-ski (Jun 8, 2014)

I took a pay cut to start in a union apprenticeship. I was making decent money after I left the service. I was trying to get in when the economy in USA was taking a dump and it took me a few years to get selected. It was worth it. Pay raises come fast and decent (as long as you get passing grades and show up for work on time), and the benifits are awesome. Not many other jobs offer a pension and good medical care. Unfortunately unions are struggling these days and it all depends on union market share in your area


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## Pdon580 (Sep 29, 2014)

spark-ski said:


> Unfortunately unions are struggling these days and it all depends on union market share in your area


I would say this is the case in the area I am located. I have a union electrician neighbor that seems to be on and off working. I can`t really ask his opinions on the union because he is totally biased towards them even when he doesn`t work for several months.


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## The_Modifier (Oct 24, 2009)

Pdon580 said:


> So there are no repercussions for joining a union to finish an apprenticeship they quitting to take a non union job?


It all depends on the halls policies. Some frown upon it, you also may have the opportunity to salt for them. When they had no work, they asked me to, but I didn't feel comfortable with it. (It's not for everyone or everyone would do it).



Pdon580 said:


> I`m guessing if I wanted to join again after quitting there would be problems. Also I live in the GTA area of ontario.


They used to dock a few hours, despite the proof employment when I was union. Although that may have been just the one halls policy. 

I had the pleasure of working with many fine union workers (and some not so fine- but that happens no matter if you're union or not). Check your pm's btw:thumbup:


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## JourneymansGF (Jan 24, 2013)

I salted & it sucked! My agent forced me to out myself to my non union company that I was salting... In return I got spit on, tools dropped on me, tires slashed & with the company I salted when you completed the journeyman training they were supposed to reimburse you the costs, give you a $500 bonus & your journeyman card ("diploma")... At the company's journeyman ceremony I got public humiliation, because when I was finally called up on stage, theycalled me last & made me stand there & then announced they couldn't find my check, my bonus or my journeyman card... 1 of the guys I got to go Union with me got to skip the Union schooling, but I had to do another 2yrs of apprenticeship before I was made a journeyman... So In the 8 years since I went Union, I've only been a journeyman for 6 years & of those 6 years I've been laid off 6 times... Of which 1 of those times I was out for almost 2yrs. However those were the hard times of 2010, which wouldn't have been so bad had I not been laid off 4 days after buying a new $35k truck.

On a side bore, I'm in the Northeastern states & works slow to the point of being non-existent... The local around here hadn't hired apprentices for the last 2yrs & the ones I've heard of them hiring have had to have I believe an associates degree, or so many college credits just to be considered for the apprenticeship program...

But if you do decide to go Union, I'd recommend bulking up on the different certifications that are offered to you, such as Refinery cert (PSM) & get your TWIX Card... Different certifications will give you a leg up on getting work that a Journeyman cert alone won't offer. I just got a call tonight to go work at a refinery tomorrow after being benched the last 2months, crossing my fingers that the pain management I've been on for a back hernia won't ruin it for me since they have stricter policies & stipulations than other job sites.

Good luck Man!!


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## The_Modifier (Oct 24, 2009)

JourneymansGF said:


> But if you do decide to go Union, I'd recommend bulking up on the different certifications that are offered to you, such as Refinery cert (PSM) & get your TWIX Card... Different certifications will give you a leg up on getting work that a Journeyman cert alone won't offer. I just got a call tonight to go work at a refinery tomorrow after being benched the last 2months, crossing my fingers that the pain management I've been on for a back hernia won't ruin it for me since they have stricter policies & stipulations than other job sites.
> 
> Good luck Man!!


A lot of the courses that you mentioned are not in Ontario (Canada is where the OP is From). Our entire licensing only takes (if you're employed for the entire time that is) 5 years tops, providing you pass the C of Q.

And Pdon580 thanks for the email. You will do fine in the trade- no matter how frustrating it gets. Lol


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