# Are you kidding



## RGH (Sep 12, 2011)

Went to help another EC I work for occasionaly...my scope was to remove this disco and install new 150 amp panel....get to it...pull meter...demo disco...punch panel to fit rigid in place....blah blah...done...so I always meter the channel before poco comes...(check for shorts)....well I check line side to and l1..l2...both are 240 to ground.....hey...did you check this when to bid this job....why?.....should of seen his face.....wow...


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

RGH said:


> Went to help another EC I work for occasionaly...my scope was to remove this disco and install new 150 amp panel....get to it...pull meter...demo disco...punch panel to fit rigid in place....blah blah...done...so I always meter the channel before poco comes...(check for shorts)....well I check line side to and l1..l2...both are 240 to ground.....hey...did you check this when to bid this job....why?.....should of seen his face.....wow...


Woops..


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## niteshift (Nov 21, 2007)

HARRY304E said:


> Woops..


oh Chit


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## Awg-Dawg (Jan 23, 2007)

Why do I feel like Im the only one who doesnt get it.:blink:


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## RGH (Sep 12, 2011)

yeah was not a good day for him....I have seen this in old buildings form time to time....not to often for sure...:no:


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## RGH (Sep 12, 2011)

Awg-Dawg said:


> Why do I feel like I'm the only one who doesn't get it.:blink:


Dawg.....L1 to grn= 240v....L2 to grn=240v was probably a odd ball machine or heater there eons ago....building is maybe 75..100yrs old. thing is he forgot/or didn't meter the disco to check voltage he figured it was 120....


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## Awg-Dawg (Jan 23, 2007)

RGH said:


> Dawg.....L1 to grn= 240v....L2 to grn=240v


This is what I dont get.

I dont think Ive seen that voltage.


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## RGH (Sep 12, 2011)

its out there...rare but out there....boy did he freak.....I work for this guy from time to time...nice guy..but drives me nuts....always yakking and not working....totally disorganized...always off on his time estimates ..always forgets chit...like checking voltage:whistling2:


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## frenchelectrican (Mar 15, 2007)

Awg-Dawg said:


> This is what I dont get.
> 
> I dont think Ive seen that voltage.


I have see it before and that is a Corner Grounded Delta system that will really plucker up your day in big time if you are not aware with this set up.

The one you see is that is open delta verison.

Merci,
Marc


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## RGH (Sep 12, 2011)

I have seen the corner delta ground differently aswell...I would like to be there when he meets with his customer monday....I am sure this one is going to hurt...we have all made mistakes..this was a classic...I am at the point where I want to tell him to lose my number....he is a real corner cutter...


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## frenchelectrican (Mar 15, 2007)

RGH said:


> I have seen the corner delta ground differently aswell...I would like to be there when he meets with his customer monday....I am sure this one is going to hurt...we have all made mistakes..this was a classic...I am at the point where I want to tell him to lose my number....he is a real corner cutter...


I think for myself I feel more wiser to ask him not to use your number anymore in case he do more screw up and the word " corner cutter " useally a automatique red flag for me.

The reason why is that due if someone cut the corner without checking the facts first will useally cost the corner cutter more than if done right in first place.

And let me remind you the corner ground delta do actually come in two verison either open delta or close delta.

Now the last question on the old disconnect switch I did glimmed at photo that was a yellow tape on black conductor if that so that is a netual or not ? if so you will get very wonky reading on voltage., I have see it before and it will get ya pretty good.

Merci,
Marc


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## RGH (Sep 12, 2011)

yes Marc... the yellow flagged leg was a nuetral he had yanked the meter and brought it into area where I was working...I tested disco and leads where dead...I wired in new panel...went outside to test out the meter socket and found the issue neutral and ground tied together in socket...voltage was crazy...but seemed to stay at or near 240v...so thought oh chit and radio'ed him over...this is no 120/single....I thought maybe 240single with center tap xfrm grounded..poco will tell him for sure monday...what a mess..


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## frenchelectrican (Mar 15, 2007)

The fastest way to tell if you have delta corner grounded system is look at the POCO cans if there is 2 or more then you will have corner ground.

The other thing is the electrique meter it will be not standard as conventail single phase meter arrangment is they useally have 5 or 7 jaw arrangment depending on which type socket it used.

Merci,
Marc


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## MHElectric (Oct 14, 2011)

RGH said:


> yes Marc... the yellow flagged leg was a nuetral he had yanked the meter and brought it into area where I was working...I tested disco and leads where dead...I wired in new panel...went outside to test out the meter socket and found the issue neutral and ground tied together in socket...voltage was crazy...but seemed to stay at or near 240v...so thought oh chit and radio'ed him over...this is no 120/single....I thought maybe 240single with center tap xfrm grounded..poco will tell him for sure monday...what a mess..


 I have never ran into this set up before, but just listening to the sound of this mess has got me feeling bad for this guy.

Note to self - Always Always check voltages before giving price!


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## frenchelectrican (Mar 15, 2007)

MHElectric said:


> I have never ran into this set up before, but just listening to the sound of this mess has got me feeling bad for this guy.
> 
> Note to self - Always Always check voltages before giving price!


That is probly the best answer is check the voltage and *phase* that will really save your arse if you knew what it was set up.

Merci,
Marc


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## RGH (Sep 12, 2011)

when I went to check can I saw 5th jaw...what the heck...then I followed lines out to street and around corner...3 xfrm set up....oh boy....thanks Marc...you have confirmed my thoughts....this guy says he is a Master sparky....several times he has said things or did things I thought were way off....now I am really wondering about him...old IBEW guy that hurt on job...head injury....I wonder how severe....I am not kidding this was bad...:001_huh:


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## RGH (Sep 12, 2011)

Update...seems customer was mad at nat-grid for charging merter fee everymonth....when I spoke to EC suggested to have Nat-grid pull can and term drop....dah...customer wants addl't recp'ts in back of shop and panel has space for expansion...new sq-d-qo in shop now..plenty of space on panel..(I checked it out on my walk thru).....suggested just add sub panel of main...demand low..but many different machines through out shop...oh yeah..told him I am to busy to help..:thumbup: (he don't like pipe)..bet he figured I would be kicken it all...:whistling2: thanks again Marc..les yeux le meilleur !!


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## frenchelectrican (Mar 15, 2007)

RGH., Pas de problem at all.

At least you learn something along the way and I have done work on few CGD's before and I did warn the customer with the cost will go up with CGD's ( I useally ask if they want to switch over to conventail Delta or go with Wye connection if the POCO do allow it. ) 

The other thing CGD's they are pretty much gone beside few exsting installment. I know my POCO in Wisconsin do not allow anymore Delta system to new customers only the exsting one can stay and they only can increase to match the main breaker / fuse rating but nothing more above that.

We do have Delta system in France but they are very limited on them useally found in industrail location ( most rather have in wye format ) 

Merci,
Marc


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