# ZAPPED in hot tub



## kbsparky (Sep 20, 2007)

I have a customer who complains about getting zapped when getting in or out of their indoor hot tub.

The tub is located on a ceramic tile floor, directly on concrete on grade.

As far as I know, there was not any bonding grid installed in said concrete or tile before the hot tub was set there.

I took a Fluke test meter, and put one lead into the water, and touched the other lead to the tile floor, and got a reading of over 6 Volts. The voltage readings do not change even with the main breaker switched off at the panel.

This tells me that there is some stray voltage around.

I went outside and looked across the street. There is a rather large electrical substation over there, with what appears to be some high-voltage transmission lines going down the street to this substation.

I figure being that close to such a large amount of juice flowing some stray voltage is going to be out and about.

My recommendation to this customer is going to be install an equipotential bonding grid, and the pour some new cement over the existing floor, elevating it a few inches higher. OR jackhammer the existing floor, and install the grid, then re-pour and re-tile.

I don't believe that the POCO will be very cooperative if the customer complains about getting zapped from a non-compliant installation.

Comments are welcome.


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## Dennis Alwon (May 9, 2009)

It can be the neutral from the poco. Go back there and pull the grounding electrode conductor off the metal water pipes-- I am assuming a community water system that is metallic. Also disconnect the gec to the rod. If you still have current then I suspect a poco neutral problem. Disconnect the neutral from the panel and see if it still remains-- if it disappears then it is a poco neutral issue.


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## Mrkbalon4 (Mar 30, 2009)

Call the poco and tell them asap. There shouldn't be stray voltage and plenty of hot tubs have been installed on pads without bonding grids. This is their problem and they should correct it. Plenty of people have died from stray voltage from distribution lines.


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## Dennis Alwon (May 9, 2009)

A bonding grid will not get rid of the voltage but it could fix the issue of feeling the voltage when in the tub.

If they feel it in the tub then the entire basement or slab must be energized.

I agree get poco on it.


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## MDShunk (Jan 7, 2007)

If you bond a new slab, you'll just move the location of the shock from tub-floor to slab-floor.


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## user4818 (Jan 15, 2009)

How is it possible to solve this problem with the use of MGN's? :confused1: Assuming everything else being equal and up to snuff.


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## BBQ (Nov 16, 2010)

Peter D said:


> How is it possible to solve this problem with the use of MGN's? :confused1: Assuming everything else being equal and up to snuff.


Often it is not, ask the cows who get shocks from the step potential in fields.


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## Dennis Alwon (May 9, 2009)

Mike Holt has a great video on stray voltages. Sometimes it takes something short of a miracle to fix the problem. Cows, as Bob said, will not even give milk or drink because of the shock from stray voltages. Grids do tend to help as it puts the tub and the earth at the same potential. The grid would not be the approach I would take.


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## robnj772 (Jan 15, 2008)

Mrkbalon4 said:


> Call the poco and tell them asap. There shouldn't be stray voltage and plenty of hot tubs have been installed on pads without bonding grids. This is their problem and they should correct it. Plenty of people have died from stray voltage from distribution lines.


 
Good luck with that!!!

I have had two seperate cases where there was stray voltage issues coming from Poco underground lines and they could care less.

1- is/was with a pool,evenb with her main off still have 9-12 volts from ground to water. poco said "oh sorry wew don't do anything about that kinda thing"

2- Have 12-15 volts coming out of a lagoon,from water to boat lift. Poco engineer said " Oh thats not our problem"


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## Mrkbalon4 (Mar 30, 2009)

robnj772 said:


> Good luck with that!!!
> 
> I have had two seperate cases where there was stray voltage issues coming from Poco underground lines and they could care less.
> 
> ...


 
That's interesting. Everytime I've ever encountered anything like this the poco jumped right on it. NYSEG and National Grid. Usually they come right out the same day. I guess I've really only encountered things like this a few times in my life but everytime the poco has responded.


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## nitro71 (Sep 17, 2009)

Is the tub on a GFCI? How is the tub bonding? Perhaps the fault is with the tub.


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## jhall.sparky (Jun 14, 2011)

robnj772 said:


> Good luck with that!!!
> 
> I have had two seperate cases where there was stray voltage issues coming from Poco underground lines and they could care less.
> 
> ...


 
local news papers and media usually fix this "couldn't care less attitude"...

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/07/26/scott-evans-dog-electrocuted_n_909672.html


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## jefft110 (Jul 7, 2010)

Dennis Alwon said:


> Mike Holt has a great video on stray voltages. Sometimes it takes something short of a miracle to fix the problem. Cows, as Bob said, will not even give milk or drink because of the shock from stray voltages. Grids do tend to help as it puts the tub and the earth at the same potential. The grid would not be the approach I would take.



http://www.mikeholt.com/strayVoltageVideo.php


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## den (Mar 28, 2009)

Been on hundreds of poco related voltage problems that we were getting blamed for stray voltage. Most people didn't even know what it was. They had just heard about it on the news. 98% of the time when we checked it was on the customers side in bad neutrals or bad/no grounding so I wouldn't be so quick to just say it was the poco's problem. we would get there very quick on voltage problems and if it was our problem we would take care of it. If you are right close to a high voltage transmission line you can get static that can shock but is hard to ground out. Otherwise check grounding and neutrals first. animals can feel lower voltage than people can and just a couple of volts will screw with them. Poco's have to keep records of inspections which include ground resistance testing and they have to be done regularly


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