# Lighting Relays



## Dennis Alwon (May 9, 2009)

I believe Lutron has a device that will help with this situation. It has to be wired in line with the dimmer, I believe. I cannot remember what it is called--- old age sucks


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## splatz (May 23, 2015)

There are a number of ways I could see it working out ... 

If they are all on a single circuit switched at the breaker, you could put that circuit on the contacts of a suitable relay / contactor, and turn the coil on and off with a circuit switched by a Pico. 

If they are on several circuits, you might find a multi pole relay that will cover it, you might need a lighting contactor, and again the coil will be energized by the Pico. 

I am not sure if there is a limit how many Picos you can pair, if you have more trucks than you can cover with a single Pico it could be an issue, but you could install the bridge and let them control it with an app ... although that's a whole other can of worms. 

You could use the Vive system that Kevin E. mentioned in another thread, put relays on every light, or other lighting control system, but that would probably be overkill if this is all they want to do.


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## joebanana (Dec 21, 2010)

Take your choice:

https://www.platt.com/search.aspx?q=2+pole+lighting+contactor+120v+coil


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## WronGun (Oct 18, 2013)

Looks like I just need a basic single pole contactor 120V/20A


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## Kevin (Feb 14, 2017)

splatz said:


> There are a number of ways I could see it working out ...
> 
> If they are all on a single circuit switched at the breaker, you could put that circuit on the contacts of a suitable relay / contactor, and turn the coil on and off with a circuit switched by a Pico.
> 
> ...


With lutron Caseta and vive, I believe it's 10 pico remotes to 1 switch/relay pack/dimmer OR 1 pico remote to 10 switches, relay packs/dimmers without the bridge/hub.

We have done some lighting contactors before. Some were miltiple 3 or 4 pole contactors and some are 3 pole contactors controlling a whole panel.

I would use the Vive relay with a suitable contactor/relay. The Vive is the commercial line.

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## Kevin (Feb 14, 2017)

WronGun said:


> I have a lighting circuit with (16) led UFO lights @100 watts each. I would like to install a Lutron casetta switch kit so all the trucks can have remotes to turn on the shops lights.
> 
> Casetta has a 600w max. I’ve wired basic heating relays for 24v/120v LV t-stats. I’m not sure what to use for a 120v lighting circuit. Any suggestions ?
> 
> ...


How many trucks are there? You may have to install the hub/bridge for it. 

Without it, there can only be 10 remotes paired to 1 switch (IIRC).

With the lutron Caseta bridge, the devices have to be within 30' radius of the bridge. Caseta maxes out at 50 devices. 

Lutron Vive, using their bridge/hub, the pico remotes communicate directly with the device, and must be within 30' according to the literature.

Fun fact: you can pair the Vive motion sensors to a Caseta switch, but then you cannot use that device on the Caseta bridge. The motions only work with the Vive bridge/hub.

Edit to add: lutron makes a 16 amp rated relay pack and it supports up to 10 pico remotes (I checked the installation guide). See image for details. You may be able to forget the contactor.

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## Alexander1989 (Sep 17, 2019)

WronGun said:


> I have a lighting circuit with (16) led UFO lights @100 watts each. I would like to install a Lutron casetta switch kit so all the trucks can have remotes to turn on the shops lights.
> 
> Casetta has a 600w max. I’ve wired basic heating relays for 24v/120v LV t-stats. I’m not sure what to use for a 120v lighting circuit. Any suggestions ?
> 
> ...



Hmm! Need to think about it !


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## Kevin (Feb 14, 2017)

Alexander1989 said:


> Hmm! Need to think about it !


Please fill out your profile. 

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## JoeSparky (Mar 25, 2010)

You are putting way too much thought into this. Just slap a 20 amp rated rib relay in and control the coil with the Casetta switch.


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## WronGun (Oct 18, 2013)

JoeSparky said:


> You are putting way too much thought into this. Just slap a 20 amp rated rib relay in and control the coil with the Casetta switch.




This was my first thought , but the rib relays I looked at online have a low voltage side. I would need 120 on both sides.


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## splatz (May 23, 2015)

WronGun said:


> This was my first thought , but the rib relays I looked at online have a low voltage side. I would need 120 on both sides.


RIB and just about all brands have models with 120V coils. 

This one you can put 24VAC, 24VDC, or 120VAC on the coil: 

https://www.functionaldevices.com/downloads/datasheets/RIBT2401B.pdf


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## splatz (May 23, 2015)

Functional Devices has a good article 

https://www.functionaldevices.com/about/blog/2018/05/electronic-ballast-what-is-this-contact-rating/ 



> What are examples of electronic ballast loads? *All the new LED drivers on the market fall into the electronic ballast category. That would include the LED bulbs that you can purchase at any home improvement supplies retailer. *Many AC to DC power supplies or converters may be considered a type of electronic ballast, as the electrical components used in the power supplies or converters are similar to the electronic ballast loads. A lot of different loads fall into the AC to DC converter category, so if you have any questions about the type of load you want to control with a relay and which relay to choose, please call us!


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## WronGun (Oct 18, 2013)

I’m not that experienced with relays. I’m confused as to how this would get wired? 


I have a basic lighting circuit with a line and load on a caseta. 




I just want to take the flow off of the caseta switch










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## splatz (May 23, 2015)

The reason for the relay is because the Caseta switch isn't rated for 1600W. Rather than energize the lights directly, the Caseta will energize the relay coil, the lighting load will be switched by the relay contacts. 

So if there's an existing switch, you'd lift the two wires from the switch terminals and connect them to the yellow and orange. That's the contacts to load connection. 

The black and red wires of the Caseta switch will connect to wht/black and wht/yellow, those are the coil. Connect the white and green on the Caseta. 



Cap the white-blue on the RIB (you don't have 24V) and cap the blue on the Caseta that's for three-way wiring. If you want to make it a little more complicated, you could install the Caseta as a three way and replace the existing switch with a three way, that way no change for people turning lights on and off inside, and you may be able to locate the Caseta in a position where it gets better range to the Picos in the trucks. 



Then you just pair the switch and the remotes. 


Now when you close the switch with the Pico, the relay coil is energized, and the NO contacts close, and the lights come on.


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## WronGun (Oct 18, 2013)

splatz said:


> The reason for the relay is because the Caseta switch isn't rated for 1600W. Rather than energize the lights directly, the Caseta will energize the relay coil, the lighting load will be switched by the relay contacts.
> 
> So if there's an existing switch, you'd lift the two wires from the switch terminals and connect them to the yellow and orange. That's the contacts to load connection.
> 
> ...




So this doesn’t make sense to me. 

All I have is a casetta switch. Line and load. 

The relay has 3 wires yellow/orange/blue 


I fed the relay with 120v on the inside terminal and neutral on the common. 

Now I have 2 wires coming from the switch red and black..... 

I have a load going to the lights and a yellow and orange on the relay.

I tried it the way you explained with no luck. 

I don’t have a white/black , white/yellow. 

I will post a picture shortly.


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## Kevin (Feb 14, 2017)

Here's the link to the data sheet. https://www.functionaldevices.com/downloads/datasheets/RIBT2401B.pdf 
I've also attached a screenshot of the data sheet.









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## Kevin (Feb 14, 2017)

WronGun said:


> So this doesn’t make sense to me.
> 
> All I have is a casetta switch. Line and load.
> 
> ...


I think you're on the right track. I've never used these relays though...

Your Caseta would feed the 120 volt control terminal. 

Common would be the neutral.

Orange and yellow are your load connection. 

Am I wrong? I'm pretty sure this is right.

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## Awg-Dawg (Jan 23, 2007)

WronGun said:


> So this doesn’t make sense to me.
> 
> All I have is a casetta switch. Line and load.
> 
> ...



Take the neutral to the RIB and the lighting loads.

Take the hot to the line side of the Casetta and to the yellow of the RIB.

Take the switch leg from the Casetta to the line side of the RIB (the 120v leg)

Take the switch leg from the lights to the orange wire on the RIB.


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## WronGun (Oct 18, 2013)

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## Kevin (Feb 14, 2017)

@WronGun like this.

Grey= neutral
Black=120 volt "line"
Orange= 120 volt "load"
Red from Caseta to 120 volt terminal on relay.









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## WronGun (Oct 18, 2013)

The terminology and the way this is setup is confusing. 

Why can’t my caseta simply turn on the line side of this relay which closes the loop and powers up the load.....

I’m used to seeing things labeled L1, L2, L3, N, T1, T2, T3...etc

Why is a N a Common ?! 


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## Kevin (Feb 14, 2017)

WronGun said:


> Why is a N a Common ?!


Edit- what hacks said.


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

WronGun said:


> I’m used to seeing things labeled L1, L2, L3, N, T1, T2, T3...etc
> 
> Why is a N a Common ?!


Because at 24VDC (which you can use on that relay) it's not a neutral.


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## splatz (May 23, 2015)

Kevin posted a different relay than wrongun has pictured ... 

Source hot to caseta line terminal 
white black to caseta load terminal 
white yellow to source neutral 
yellow to source hot 
orange to lights hot 
lights neutral to source neutral


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## splatz (May 23, 2015)

If you're struggling, maybe temporarily connect a regular switch instead of the caseta and verify that first without wondering if the caseta is actually opening and closing.


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## Kevin (Feb 14, 2017)

splatz said:


> Kevin posted a different relay than wrongun has pictured ...
> 
> Source hot to caseta line terminal
> white black to caseta load terminal
> ...


Post #14 has 2 different model numbers. OP said he has no white yellow nor white black. See post #16 for that. This means that he has a RIBT2401B...

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## splatz (May 23, 2015)

Kevin_Essiambre said:


> Post #14 has 2 different model numbers. OP said he has no white yellow nor white black. See post #16 for that. This means that he has a RIBT2401B...


Ah OK now makes sense.


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## Easy (Oct 18, 2017)

Lutron Casetta is rated *150W* for *LED* / 600W for Incandescent/ Halogen Loads. I was going to set up 3 x 150 watt UFO's per switch without a lighting contractor but now I can see that my load is to high for the Casetta. Glad I read this post. I have heard lots of good things about the switch but have never actually installed one. As for the RIB relay or lighting contractor it's a simple install. Line Load and 120 Coil controlled by the Switch.


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## Easy (Oct 18, 2017)




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## Kevin (Feb 14, 2017)

I'm curious to know how the Caseta will work with the RIB relay with the current trickling through. It's probably not an issue but it's something I always worry about. 

If you use a Caseta switch with a neutral it's not a worry.

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## splatz (May 23, 2015)

I would use the Caseta switch that uses a neutral and is not a dimmer 

PD-6ANS- 

https://www.casetawireless.com/products/dimmers-switches


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## Easy (Oct 18, 2017)

splatz said:


> I would use the Caseta switch that uses a neutral and is not a dimmer
> 
> PD-6ANS-
> 
> https://www.casetawireless.com/products/dimmers-switches


Thanks Splatz ... I looked at the specs on the PD-6ANS. The installation guide has a chart that shows 720 watts for Incandescent/ Halogen and ELV's but shows amperage limits of 6 Amps for LED's or Florescent's. 6 x 120 is 720 watts so I guess this would be a much better switch for my application. I don't need a dimming function as the UFO's I have came with 1-10v dimming leads and I just received my 100k Ohm Potentiometers from the dark web today and I will see how well they work for dimming.


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

Easy said:


>


What did you use to make this?


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## Easy (Oct 18, 2017)

HackWork said:


> What did you use to make this?


I just quickly garbed 2 PDF's from the web one on the switch and one for the relay. I brought them into *Adobe Illustrator* and drew in the wire connections. Kind of lame but I love to draw stuff as it helps me figure things out.


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

I'd like a simple, lite, easy to use program to do that type of thing.


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## macmikeman (Jan 23, 2007)

Look on Ebay for a Macintosh Classic 2 with a copy of Mac Draw on it. Should be cheap. 


Best drawing program ever . Nobody's matched it's ease of use .


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## splatz (May 23, 2015)

Easy said:


> Thanks Splatz ... I looked at the specs on the PD-6ANS. The installation guide has a chart that shows 720 watts for Incandescent/ Halogen and ELV's but shows amperage limits of 6 Amps for LED's or Florescent's. 6 x 120 is 720 watts so I guess this would be a much better switch for my application. I don't need a dimming function as the UFO's I have came with 1-10v dimming leads and I just received my 100k Ohm Potentiometers from the dark web today and I will see how well they work for dimming.


:thumbsup:

Don't forget, the Caseta is only switching the relay coil - tiny load - it's the RIB, not the Caseta, that has to be rated for the lighting load.


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## splatz (May 23, 2015)

HackWork said:


> I'd like a simple, lite, easy to use program to do that type of thing.


http://draw.io 

is pretty good, @macmikeman posted it - not to hard to get the hang of it.


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## Easy (Oct 18, 2017)

splatz said:


> :thumbsup:
> 
> Don't forget, the Caseta is only switching the relay coil - tiny load - it's the RIB, not the Caseta, that has to be rated for the lighting load.


Thanks Spatz. I was just thinking of going with a switch and no relay. I will only have 3 UFO's per switch so I figured that 450 watts on a 720 watt rated switch will work fine. I could also just use standard switches and run conduit and travelers to the other 2 locations and make more money on labor rather than giving the money to the manufacture. Thanks Hackworks..

I'm lucky my boss does not care how I do it. The project that I am working on seems to change on a daily basis and now they want LED strip lighting and some DMX fixtures controlled from a tablet or computer. Maybe if I'm lucky I can find a way to incorporate the high bay UFO's onto a control surface of some kind. I still want to have some actual switches at the entry and exit but those could be connected with Ethernet cables. I think it wont be that complicated. I know he also like the Control 4 stuff for automation but that's to complex for me.


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## macmikeman (Jan 23, 2007)

splatz said:


> http://draw.io
> 
> is pretty good, @macmikeman posted it - not to hard to get the hang of it.



I was using draw.Io the other day, and whenever I clicked on the line tool it sent my drawing a line all right- but at a stinking 45 deg angle to the drawing base. And it's not so easy to straighten it out Macdraw was superb. It did everything right. No fooling around with things. Funny- they kept all those drawing tools and internal codes in Filemaker. When you design layouts for databases you have the exact same tools as macdraw had and they work flawlessly as well. 
But Filemaker turned into a subscription based program. I don't use it any longer.


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## Easy (Oct 18, 2017)

If you have a Windows system you could go with Auto Cad "it's too complex for me but it is the widely used in the building trades" Visio is good program that is easy to use and works well. I like Illustrator because I have always used it. Gimp offers an illustration program that works on all platforms and is free. Try gimp as it is open source and it works great.


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