# VFD Low Speed



## JRaef (Mar 23, 2009)

GEORGE D said:


> I have a situation where I connected (4) small 3-ph fan motors to VFD, I set max HZ to 60 but all run really really slow at that frequency. I don't want to speed it up in case I burn up motors, any suggestions?


Can you describe what you have better? For example, if your drive is a Sensorless Vector Control drive and the factory default is for it to be in SVC mode, then you have multiple motors connected behind the drive, you cannot get an accurate motor model for the SVC mode to work from, so it may be confused and is current limiting as a result, which artificially limits the frequency output regardless of what you have it set at. Of you have a drive that is too small, same net effect.

An easy thing to check though is also the motor connections. If you have 230V available but the motors are strapped for 460V, you are cutting the peak motor torque to 1/4 of what the motor is capable of and the load from the fans is dragging them down to run slower.


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## GEORGE D (Apr 2, 2009)

There are 2 fly fan (aka air curtains) units each housing (2) 3-ph motors rated at roughly 1.8 a each. These fans came with a controller which has ol's for each individual motor and 1 main contactor which feeds all ol's. I fed main contactor from output of vfd and ran my start/run control wires through spare n.o contacts on main contactor which is controlled via door switch. Sorry for all unnecessary info but wanted to see if all is good with this setup. Everything seems to be working just fine its just that at 60 hz max on drive, I'm getting a fraction of what the fans were capable of before vfd was installed. As for motors i dont have nameplate info at hand, but will be back again tomorow and provide if it helps any. The vfd is double the HP of combined motors btw.


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## GEORGE D (Apr 2, 2009)

Oh and as for SV mode, i am going to look into that now. Mind you this is bottom of the barrel vfd pure Chinese goodness from ebay, I think it was around $120 new, so not sure if thats the real problem or not.


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## Big John (May 23, 2010)

So they actually ramp up to speed and then slow down once you hit 60Hz, is that correct? Did you auto-tune the drive when you were setting it up? What is the current being drawn during all this?


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## Jlarson (Jun 28, 2009)

Check everything Jref suggested. 

As for the setup loose the contactor, contactor on the load side of drive = no no unless absolutely needed and interlocked properly (ie an early break aux contact to kill the drive before the contactor opens) take the door switch(s) right to the drive and wire the individual OL contacts to the drive in series to stop the drive on an OL.


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## GEORGE D (Apr 2, 2009)

Jlarson said:


> Check everything Jref suggested.
> 
> As for the setup loose the contactor, contactor on the load side of drive = no no unless absolutely needed and interlocked properly (ie an early break aux contact to kill the drive before the contactor opens) take the door switch(s) right to the drive and wire the individual OL contacts to the drive in series to stop the drive on an OL.


Yeah this was my initial thought but then I though since it will open/close at same time it should be ok, then again what the hell do i know!


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## GEORGE D (Apr 2, 2009)

Big John said:


> So they actually ramp up to speed and then slow down once you hit 60Hz, is that correct? Did you auto-tune the drive when you were setting it up? What is the current being drawn during all this?


At 60 hz it was pulling about .7 amps on one of the motors legs


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## JRaef (Mar 23, 2009)

You probably are dealing with the Huanyang VFD from China that lots of people are selling dirt cheap on Fleabay. Wholesalers are able to buy them for about $50-$60 US in quantity, then they double their money selling them retail for $100-$120 on Fleabay. That thing is an absolute piece of junk, they are notorious for out of the box failures and the Fleabay sellers disappear after selling a few hundred, then pop up again under a different name with a new batch. Huanyang can only be contacted by calling China directly, then they don't have many people that can speak engrish.

That drive is SVC out of the box, so if you attempted to do an auto-tune with two motors connected, it doesn't know what to do and you end up with a garbage motor model, which leads to what I described above. If you can read and understand their Chinglish translated manual, you need to find the parameter that allows it to go back to V/Hz control. If you do that, it should work fine. If not, you have Chinese junk (not the boat either).

PS: Oops, it appears as though most of the Fleabay Huanyang drives being sold lately are the cheaper HY series, which is NOT SVC capable. So forget that entire issue if that's what you have.


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## Jlarson (Jun 28, 2009)

JRaef said:


> Huanyang VFD


 I really hate those, I'd rather deal with a French garbage Altivar then those Chinese POS.


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## JRaef (Mar 23, 2009)

Jlarson said:


> I really hate those, I'd rather deal with a French garbage Altivar then those Chinese POS.


I have a freind who does machine control systems for a living, I help him out on occasion with VFD problems, usually on spindles (in exchance for other projects he does for me). I went out on 4 calls for him on Huanyang drives last year that had been bought by users on Fleabay and where they attempted to put them in and program them on their own. They were all out-of-the-box failures and in all cases, the end users got left holding the bag because the Huanyang Fleabay dealers had flown the coop. Huanyang sells high speed spindles and motors for machine tools too, that is a complete disaster! Think of a spindle turning 10,000RPM made from the cheapest pot metal they could find in China by melting down someone's old scooter. You can SEE the imperfections in the metal of the shafts! I refuse to be near them when they are running.


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## GEORGE D (Apr 2, 2009)

JRaef said:


> I have a freind who does machine control systems for a living, I help him out on occasion with VFD problems, usually on spindles (in exchance for other projects he does for me). I went out on 4 calls for him on Huanyang drives last year that had been bought by users on Fleabay and where they attempted to put them in and program them on their own. They were all out-of-the-box failures and in all cases, the end users got left holding the bag because the Huanyang Fleabay dealers had flown the coop. Huanyang sells high speed spindles and motors for machine tools too, that is a complete disaster! Think of a spindle turning 10,000RPM made from the cheapest pot metal they could find in China by melting down someone's old scooter. You can SEE the imperfections in the metal of the shafts! I refuse to be near them when they are running.


Haha you got it, its that exact brand. "by melting down someone's old scooter", haha, thats too good. So in other words Im screwed and just tossed $120 into a chinese trash can. As for svt like you said, that isnt an optioon on this pos. Anyone selling a non-chinese 3hp, 220 volt drive?


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## Jlarson (Jun 28, 2009)

Scooters :laughing: with the handles and wheels left on and melted in probably.


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## JRaef (Mar 23, 2009)

GEORGE D said:


> Haha you got it, its that exact brand. "by melting down someone's old scooter", haha, thats too good. So in other words Im screwed and just tossed $120 into a chinese trash can. As for svt like you said, that isnt an optioon on this pos. Anyone selling a non-chinese 3hp, 220 volt drive?


Don't give up yet though, make sure the motors were not strapped for 460V by accident. I run into that more often than you would think. Also make sure all of your connections are tight and that the contactor you have in there is in good shape, no resistance across the contacts. last resort, find out how to reset everything in the VFD to the factory defaults and start over on the programming. You may have inadvertently made some sort of seemingly minor error that is causing this sort of thing.

If the Huanyang turns out to be bad, I would recommend an Allen Bradley PowerFlex 4 drive to replace it, but I work for them and that would be unethical, so I won't do it... :innocent: :whistling2:


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## GEORGE D (Apr 2, 2009)

JRaef said:


> Don't give up yet though, make sure the motors were not strapped for 460V by accident. I run into that more often than you would think. Also make sure all of your connections are tight and that the contactor you have in there is in good shape, no resistance across the contacts. last resort, find out how to reset everything in the VFD to the factory defaults and start over on the programming. You may have inadvertently made some sort of seemingly minor error that is causing this sort of thing.
> 
> If the Huanyang turns out to be bad, I would recommend an Allen Bradley PowerFlex 4 drive to replace it, but I work for them and that would be unethical, so I won't do it... :innocent: :whistling2:


Ok, I'll try that first, about the motors being set for 480, they were running just fine before drive, wouldn't that have been an issue otherwise?


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## micromind (Aug 11, 2007)

JRaef said:


> If the Huanyang turns out to be bad, I would recommend an Allen Bradley PowerFlex 4 drive to replace it, but I work for them and that would be unethical, so I won't do it... :innocent: :whistling2:


I don't work for A/B, and I would highly recommend an A/B drive. 

I don't think I've ever had an issue with any of them. I have had trouble with Square D Altivars, GE AF 300 and 600, and one Baldor that had a bad output card. Plus, the A/Bs seem easier to program than some of the others. 

Like a lot of electrical equipment, generally speaking, you get what you pay for.


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## Cow (Jan 16, 2008)

JRaef said:


> If the Huanyang turns out to be bad, I would recommend an Allen Bradley PowerFlex 4 drive to replace it, but I work for them and that would be unethical, so I won't do it... :innocent: :whistling2:


I'd also recommend a Powerflex 4. Basic programming doesn't even take 5 mins, it's super simple. Plus the manual has an English section....:jester:


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## JRaef (Mar 23, 2009)

GEORGE D said:


> Ok, I'll try that first, about the motors being set for 480, they were running just fine before drive, wouldn't that have been an issue otherwise?


Maybe. If they were strapped for 460 but receiving 230V running across the line, the speed would be the same but the torque is a fraction of why it should be. Sometimes they still run though, especially if the load is light. But once you put a drive on it and turn down the speed, the loss of torque becomes more noticeable.

Still, you have a good point. If it was running OK before the drive, chances are it's the drive.


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## John Valdes (May 17, 2007)

Are you relying on the drive readout to tell you how fast they are going?
Have you checked the output voltage at the drive at 60z.
Have you manually checked the RPM to be certain what it is?

I agree with most everything recommended above. My thinking is to do the simple stuff first.


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## GEORGE D (Apr 2, 2009)

John Valdes said:


> Are you relying on the drive readout to tell you how fast they are going?
> Have you checked the output voltage at the drive at 60z.
> Have you manually checked the RPM to be certain what it is?
> 
> I agree with most everything recommended above. My thinking is to do the simple stuff first.


Yes, going off of drive display (60 HZ). Don't have equipment to check rpm, even if it would be painful getting to motors. Also as for voltage on output I haven't, I thought that required scope? Forgot I have a 289 now and could at least check HZ with that, problem is I had an emergency call and can't get back out there today.


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## Peewee0413 (Oct 18, 2012)

A/B is definitely my first choice. Power flex 4 is as simple as stated above. .


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## GEORGE D (Apr 2, 2009)

Peewee0413 said:


> A/B is definitely my first choice. Power flex 4 is as simple as stated above. .


Yeah, I'm no VFD expert but can say they are very user friendly. I wish AB could fit into this tight budget, for now I'm gonna try and make this melted down scooter work.


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## Jlarson (Jun 28, 2009)

You can always hit up local supply houses, the one I hate the least usually has danfoss micro drives. Or a Kamen Industrial or Motion industries if you have one nearby.


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## Peewee0413 (Oct 18, 2012)

Automation direct has cheap drives, that work...GS series drives...I've installed 4 in my time...no power flex, but it works ..


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## John Valdes (May 17, 2007)

George. You can measure output voltage with your meter. Just put the meter selector on AC volts as you would with an across the line motor reading.

At full speed (base speed) you should read approximately the voltage the motor is wired for. However. The drive compensates for speed loss due to load and other outside influences.
So to read 500 volts on a 460 volt drive and motor would not be uncommon.
If you have two meters you can measure the voltage and the frequency at the same time and have an amp clamp on it too.
This way you can see exactly whats happening.


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## GEORGE D (Apr 2, 2009)

John Valdes said:


> George. You can measure output voltage with your meter. Just put the meter selector on AC volts as you would with an across the line motor reading.
> 
> At full speed (base speed) you should read approximately the voltage the motor is wired for. However. The drive compensates for speed loss due to load and other outside influences.
> So to read 500 volts on a 460 volt drive and motor would not be uncommon.
> ...


I thought due to drive converting to chopped up dc you couldn't get an accurate reading without scope, then again it was worth trying too. I'll be back there Monday or Tuesday and hopefully get something resolved with this without reordering a drive.


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## John Valdes (May 17, 2007)

This output voltage can even be read with a analog meter.
It is a simulated sign wave. If you were to observe it on a scope you would see how the PWM works.

A meter is much simpler and does give you an accurate voltage measurement.

I like the idea of two meters. One for voltage and one for frequency. And a clamp for amps. 

See if everything adds up to the actual speed of the motors. Remember. Its voltage and frequency that must be adjusted to control the speed of an ac motor.

For example. A 460 volt, 1800 RPM motor at half (900 rpm) speed will see approximately 30 Hz and 230 volt.
And 15 HZ at 115 volts at 450 RPM.

Like Jraef said before. If you autotuned these motors to this drive, it has no idea as to what its supposed to do.

So you may need to manually adjust the parameters for multi motor applications like yours.


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## GEORGE D (Apr 2, 2009)

John Valdes said:


> This output voltage can even be read with a analog meter.
> It is a simulated sign wave. If you were to observe it on a scope you would see how the PWM works.
> 
> A meter is much simpler and does give you an accurate voltage measurement.
> ...


I forgot to ask about number of poles for motor, I remember this was in parameters and I left the default which I think was 2, does that seem right for this type of motors? I think 4 pole was generally for a higher rpm motor.


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## JRaef (Mar 23, 2009)

GEORGE D said:


> I forgot to ask about number of poles for motor, I remember this was in parameters and I left the default which I think was 2, does that seem right for this type of motors? I think 4 pole was generally for a higher rpm motor.


2 pole would be a faster motor, 3600RPM synch speed . 4 poles is 1800RPM synch speed. 

Synch RPM = F x 120/P, where F = frequency in Hz and P = number of winding poles. So 2 pole = 60 x 120/2, 7200/2 = 3600. 4 pole would then be 7200/4 = 1800

It would make no difference on a non-vector drive, the drive only uses it to calculate actual speed for the display instead of Hz.


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## GEORGE D (Apr 2, 2009)

JRaef said:


> 2 pole would be a faster motor, 3600RPM synch speed . 4 poles is 1800RPM synch speed.
> 
> Synch RPM = F x 120/P, where F = frequency in Hz and P = number of winding poles. So 2 pole = 60 x 120/2, 7200/2 = 3600. 4 pole would then be 7200/4 = 1800
> 
> It would make no difference on a non-vector drive, the drive only uses it to calculate actual speed for the display instead of Hz.


Gotcha, good info by the way!


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## GEORGE D (Apr 2, 2009)

Ok back here again, checked voltage and frequency, looks good except voltage is high. 









Corresponds with VFD display


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## GEORGE D (Apr 2, 2009)

Sorry hit send by accident, anyhow my amps are low, what might be causing this?









Motors are rated 1.6 each and there are 4.


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## Peewee0413 (Oct 18, 2012)

Try posting the VFD settings


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## GEORGE D (Apr 2, 2009)




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## GEORGE D (Apr 2, 2009)

And here are the rest.


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## Peewee0413 (Oct 18, 2012)

Ok and your settings, from 003 to 011.


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## Peewee0413 (Oct 18, 2012)

What's the current load side of the VFD


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## GEORGE D (Apr 2, 2009)

03-60
04-60
05-60
06-2.5 (default)
07-0.5 (d)
08-220
09-13.0 (d)
10-6.5(d)
11-0


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## Peewee0413 (Oct 18, 2012)

Have you tried opening disconnects and running one at a time?


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## GEORGE D (Apr 2, 2009)

Yes, tried 1 alone and got same output. Kind of weird, considering its getting voltage/HZ.


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## GEORGE D (Apr 2, 2009)

How bad is it to try ramping up frequency until I get some kind of reaction?


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## Peewee0413 (Oct 18, 2012)

Ya that's weird. That pretty much says the VFD is junk. I dunno ill keep thinking, good luck


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## Peewee0413 (Oct 18, 2012)

http://www.automationdirect.com/adc/Overview/Catalog/Drives

If price is an issue these vfd's are simple cheap and reliable. I installed 4 gs2's in small enclosures, outside in the new Mexico heat. Still running strong from what I hear.


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## GEORGE D (Apr 2, 2009)

Oh wow, good call, I'm gonna check that out, I didn't think they would be that cheap in price, my dumbass should've asked or looked into that first, thanks!


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## Peewee0413 (Oct 18, 2012)

I think ramping up will be fine its slow speeds that usually causes motor damage. Its mechanical issues you should be worried about, at high speeds.(but your slower than normal right now) Speed increase may falsely show a fix to your actual problem. I'd say trash the VFD, if there is no other circuit problems.


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## Jabberwoky (Sep 2, 2012)

Does PD146 Motor no-load current say 40? Even if that is supposed to be 4.0 that would seem a bit high to me. If you have 4 fan motors running at around 1.8 amps or 7.2 total. I would expect magnetizing current to be in the ballpark of 2.3.

What are your motor parameters and what does the motor nameplate say? Have you tried an autotune with just one motor? I have never dealt with a multiple motor setup on a single drive before. So I'm not sure how to adjust the slip for that setup.

Also, shouldn't your PD176 be set to 60Hz if you are using motors with 60Hz base frequencies?


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## GEORGE D (Apr 2, 2009)

There is no auto tune as far as I see, and I did change 176 to 60, still no luck. I'm getting ready to pull the trigger on a G2 2HP from automation direct, anyone see a reason I shouldn't? I know a 3 hp or higher would probably be better but on a serious budget and must trim every corner if you know what I mean. Also, I didn't see a surface type adapter to surface mount it, is there such a thing as a universal or not an option?


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## GEORGE D (Apr 2, 2009)

Do I size VFD based on input or output current? Why do they differ by the way?


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## Peewee0413 (Oct 18, 2012)

Differ like how?


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## GEORGE D (Apr 2, 2009)

Input rating is 9, output is 7. I guess I'm confused at the existence of input current, I would think only output exists. Which one should I base my motors amps to?


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## Peewee0413 (Oct 18, 2012)

Output...


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## Peewee0413 (Oct 18, 2012)

In one sentence, why the difference. U get "loss " or "consumption " by the VFD... its normal.


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## 8V71 (Dec 23, 2011)

PD141 and 142? Can you easily drive only one motor to see what happens?


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## Peewee0413 (Oct 18, 2012)

He said same problem, that's why things point to bad drive


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## GEORGE D (Apr 2, 2009)




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## GEORGE D (Apr 2, 2009)

8V71 said:


> PD141 and 142? Can you easily drive only one motor to see what happens?


Yeah tried it as mentioned. My motors are 1.8 [email protected], do you guys think the specs I posted are adequate?


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## GEORGE D (Apr 2, 2009)

GEORGE D said:


> Yeah tried it as mentioned. My motors are 1.8 [email protected], do you guys think the specs I posted are adequate?


Oh and 1/2 HP


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## Peewee0413 (Oct 18, 2012)

What's the drive make and model?


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## GEORGE D (Apr 2, 2009)

peewee0413 said:


> what's the drive make and model?


gs1-22po


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## Peewee0413 (Oct 18, 2012)

That's the currently installed VFD?


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## GEORGE D (Apr 2, 2009)

No, that's what I'm looking to get, you think those specs are good?


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## Peewee0413 (Oct 18, 2012)

I'd choose one rated higher than 2 hp to run 2 hp worth of motors, but that is my opinion. Others on here may state otherwise. Need I also mention this is no A-B Powerflex. Which adds to my opinion to higher the VFD rating. A 5 hp may be twice the price, but would give you a little buffer of being a lower quality VFD. Saying this I've installed this same make VFD with a matched VFD/motor rating, and they still run like champs...... knock on wood.... Heads or tails?


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## JRaef (Mar 23, 2009)

GEORGE D said:


> Sorry hit send by accident, anyhow my amps are low, what might be causing this?
> 
> Motors are rated 1.6 each and there are 4.


Are you sure that you don't have an open circuit between the drive and the motors somewhere? Seems odd that there is virtually no current flow even though the output is at 60Hz. Most V/Hz VFDs don't have any way of knowing that there is an open circuit on the output, they just hum right along oblivious. The fact that you are reading mA is likely just the fly back diodes in the output transistors leaking current a little, that's normal. So for it to only read that much, that means there is NO current flowing in the output circuit of that VFD. So either the circuit is open, or ALL of your transistors are blocked from firing. 

Some drives do that on purpose in certain types of faults, it's called a "base block" feature, where the base emitters of the transistors are blocked from getting signals, which ensures they are incapable of accidentally firing if there are high DI/DT conditions on the output. DI/DT means Delta (change) in I (current) over Delta t (time), a way of saying that the rate of change in current flow is too high, for example in short circuit conditions. If you have too high of a DI/DT, it can cause transistors that are not supposed to be firing to conduct on their own, which leads to the destruction of the transistors. So it the drive detects this condition, it blocks the base emitter of all of the transistors. So for instance if you were firing into a bolted fault, that might be the result. But USUALLY, the drive display will tell you this! You would have posted that little tidbit of info I know, so that's why this leads me to think the only thing left is an open circuit.

Some drives, like ABB, allow you to program an Input to artificially trigger a base block command when you want it. I have used that on ABB drives when I have multiple motors on the output, where I tie in the NO aux contacts of motor protective switches in parallel to that input, so that if one motor trips on Short Circuit, the drive is protected. You might want to look for something like that, and if it's there, and the aux contact is stuck closed, that may be the culprit. Still, on ABB drives the display tells you that you have an external base block, but maybe the Chinese ran out of code? Or maybe they copied ABB but didn't know how to translate "base brock" so they just didn't put in anything...


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## JRaef (Mar 23, 2009)

OK, pursuant to that concept, check P044 - P049, and see if any of them are programmed as "13", which is "Emergency Stop". Sometimes mfrs use base blocking as how they facilitate an E-Stop, because it ignores all other stop parameter programming and just cuts power to the motor by blocking the base emitters. Again, it should tell you that on the display, but maybe that's the design flaw.

So if one of the inputs is set to 13, then see what is wired to that input and trace it back to check for a problem in the circuit. If one is programmed to that function, but NOTHING is wired to it, then that may be the issue as well. It will depend on what the manual says about the E-Stop logic, it may be looking for it to be high, meaning a NC contact and with nothing wired to it, it's low so it's active and blocking.


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## GEORGE D (Apr 2, 2009)

JRaef said:


> OK, pursuant to that concept, check P044 - P049, and see if any of them are programmed as "13", which is "Emergency Stop". Sometimes mfrs use base blocking as how they facilitate an E-Stop, because it ignores all other stop parameter programming and just cuts power to the motor by blocking the base emitters. Again, it should tell you that on the display, but maybe that's the design flaw.
> 
> So if one of the inputs is set to 13, then see what is wired to that input and trace it back to check for a problem in the circuit. If one is programmed to that function, but NOTHING is wired to it, then that may be the issue as well. It will depend on what the manual says about the E-Stop logic, it may be looking for it to be high, meaning a NC contact and with nothing wired to it, it's low so it's active and blocking.


Oh sorry, I just noticed it shows milliamperes but is actually .6 amps, (its the i400 clamp). The motors were spinning but very slow, around 1/10 normal speed at this amp draw. There is definitely no open circuit. I removed drive today and motors are running fine on standard system voltage. I'm thinking of the GS2 3HP drive from automation, what's your take on that Mr. Drive Guru?


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## Peewee0413 (Oct 18, 2012)

Sounds ok...Ya I seen the pic of the meter and seen it was .6 amps. I am no guru by the way.


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## GEORGE D (Apr 2, 2009)

Peewee0413 said:


> Sounds ok...Ya I seen the pic of the meter and seen it was .6 amps. I am no guru by the way.


Sorry Peewee, that was aimed at JRaef, he's on top of the motor/drive game amongst other things I'm sure, but you seem pretty knowledgable as well, my background is primarily new construction commercial but have taken on more industrial the past 2 years (as self employed) and glad I did. I appreciate all you guys help by the way!


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## Jabberwoky (Sep 2, 2012)

Can you get your hands on a scope? The output waveform can tell a lot about what is going on at one glance. 

I'm also curious what the buss voltage is doing if you can get to it with the DMM. Before and after you start it.

I also noticed that you didn't say what you put in for PD141 and PD142 settings. You just said your motors are 1.8 amps at 208V. I'd imagine you don't want PD141 set for just 1.8 amps because the drive assumes you are using just one motor.


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## JRaef (Mar 23, 2009)

GEORGE D said:


> Sorry Peewee, that was aimed at JRaef, he's on top of the motor/drive game amongst other things I'm sure, but you seem pretty knowledgable as well, my background is primarily new construction commercial but have taken on more industrial the past 2 years (as self employed) and glad I did. I appreciate all you guys help by the way!


Hey, I'm no guru, I are an "ex-spurt"... 

Ex, as in has-been, 
Spurt, as in drip under pressure.

So I freely admitted that I work for A-B, yet you want me to endorse an AutomationDestruct drive? Taint gonna happen my friend, I have to draw the line there...

But if you are asking if I endorse using a 3HP drive to run 4 x 1/2HP motors, that's fine. I would do it with a 2HP drive though, especially if the money is tight. But given the brand you are choosing, it might be prudent to over size it. You certainly can't afford to change it AGAIN! That's why I keep wondering if it's something other than the idea of a defective drive, I would be super PO'd if I bought another brand and the problem followed, only to find out it was something unrelated.


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## JRaef (Mar 23, 2009)

Peewee0413 said:


> Sounds ok...Ya I seen the pic of the meter and seen it was .6 amps. I am no guru by the way.


Actually, it doesn't say .6A, it says .683mA AC. He just forgot to mention that he used the wrong clamp on adapter and was off by a factor of 1000!


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## GEORGE D (Apr 2, 2009)

JRaef said:


> Actually, it doesn't say .6A, it says .683mA AC. He just forgot to mention that he used the wrong clamp on adapter and was off by a factor of 1000!


Good call, just noticed myself!


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## Jlarson (Jun 28, 2009)

I didn't use to work for anybody so no loyalty. :lol: 

We install tons of abb, ab, danfoss, woods/vacon, some weg, baldor, hitachi and tons of automation direct too. I put in 2 gs2's and 2 gs3's just myself this weekend.

Only drives I really can't say good things about are these cheapies off eBay and Schneider altivars. 

I'd have gone with a 3 HP gs2, load reactor, and mms's for each motor wired to stop the drive.


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## Peewee0413 (Oct 18, 2012)

Exspurt....I'm gonna steal that by the way.


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## Peewee0413 (Oct 18, 2012)

Don't you add the motor nameplate amps and input it in 142?


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## JRaef (Mar 23, 2009)

Peewee0413 said:


> Don't you add the motor nameplate amps and input it in 142?


As long as the total FLC adds up to less than the rated output of the drive, the value entered into the current setting of the drive is actually irrelevant in multi-motor applications. That setting is there for calculating the motor thermal overload trip function of the drive if you are using it alone to protect the motor, because drives are usually sized a little over the FLC rating of a typical motor and you need to make sure it protects it adequately. But in a multi-motor application, each motor must have its own separate OL relay anyway, so you will want to set that at the VFD maximum current to avoid nuisance tripping.


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## Peewee0413 (Oct 18, 2012)

Was rhetorical to a statement somebody else said. Maybe I should have put an ! Not a ? .....


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## GEORGE D (Apr 2, 2009)

Jabberwoky said:


> Can you get your hands on a scope? The output waveform can tell a lot about what is going on at one glance.
> 
> I'm also curious what the buss voltage is doing if you can get to it with the DMM. Before and after you start it.
> 
> I also noticed that you didn't say what you put in for PD141 and PD142 settings. You just said your motors are 1.8 amps at 208V. I'd imagine you don't want PD141 set for just 1.8 amps because the drive assumes you are using just one motor.


Sorry I'm a little late on your reply but as for scope, no don't know anybody with one at hand right now, and as for P 141 and 142 I set the voltage to 208 and I set the amp at 10. I'm starting to worry about replacing and finding out this pos could of worked. I am going to give it one final shot before I pull trigger on replacement, I will surely be online with this forum during troubleshooting for y'all's expertise.


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## GEORGE D (Apr 2, 2009)

Ok new drive same problems. Just hot off the phone with tech support and he's stumped as well. I need some serious help guys!!


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## Peewee0413 (Oct 18, 2012)

best bet is to draw us the complete circuit diagram...


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## GEORGE D (Apr 2, 2009)




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## 8V71 (Dec 23, 2011)

The wires going to the motors from the VFD. Just like a straight point to point wire/contact connection? Have these motors ever been used with a VFD? Pics of the motor name plate and motor itself possible?


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## GEORGE D (Apr 2, 2009)

8V71 said:


> The wires going to the motors from the VFD. Just like a straight point to point wire/contact connection? Have these motors ever been used with a VFD? Pics of the motor name plate and motor itself possible?


Never used with drive other then the previous Chinese one. I will post the nameplate pic I have at hand. I plan on returning to site this afternoon and will take better pics.


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## GEORGE D (Apr 2, 2009)

These motors are thermally protected, I don't think that matters does it?


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## Peewee0413 (Oct 18, 2012)

Run 1 motor off the VFD?


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## GEORGE D (Apr 2, 2009)

Peewee0413 said:


> Run 1 motor off the VFD?


Yeah that's what I plan on, tech-support called back and suggested same. I tried that on other drive and still did nothing, hopefully this one will.


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## Peewee0413 (Oct 18, 2012)

Makes no sense.


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## 8V71 (Dec 23, 2011)

GEORGE D said:


> Yeah that's what I plan on, tech-support called back and suggested same. I tried that on other drive and still did nothing, hopefully this one will.


When you tried one motor on the first drive did you hook directly to the disconnected motor leads, bypassing everything else in the system?


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## GEORGE D (Apr 2, 2009)

8V71 said:


> When you tried one motor on the first drive did you hook directly to the disconnected motor leads, bypassing everything else in the system?


No. Just turned off other motor discos.


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## 8V71 (Dec 23, 2011)

GEORGE D said:


> No. Just turned off other motor discos.


I would definitely go straight to the motor leads at this point.


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## 8V71 (Dec 23, 2011)

I mean.....it has to work. The path between the VFD and the motors. Nothing but wire and contactors? No weird unknown stuff? All of the contactors are energized before applying a run signal to the fans?


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## GEORGE D (Apr 2, 2009)

8V71 said:


> I mean.....it has to work. The path between the VFD and the motors. Nothing but wire and contactors? No weird unknown stuff? All of the contactors are energized before applying a run signal to the fans?


Yes, absolutely.


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## GEORGE D (Apr 2, 2009)

Ok problem solved and I'm officially a dumbass......drumroll.........................................was reversed! Now I'm gonna try that china one and see if its good. Thanks again for everyone's help, I'm just glad it's resolved.


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## JRaef (Mar 23, 2009)

You mean all of the motors were spinning backward?
Seems to me that even the unloaded motor current would have been higher than what you showed.


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## Tsmil (Jul 17, 2011)

Deleted


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## GEORGE D (Apr 2, 2009)

JRaef said:


> You mean all of the motors were spinning backward?
> Seems to me that even the unloaded motor current would have been higher than what you showed.


Yes, when hooked to line voltage the rotation was fine but when connected to drive in same sequence it would run the motors backwards in 'forward' mode, soon as I ran in reverse it was fine. Apparently it was running same rpm's in reverse but seemed like a fraction due to lack of air and sound. Lesson learned, look for the obvious first.


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## Peewee0413 (Oct 18, 2012)

Wow!


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## Wimpie (May 16, 2013)

*Powerflex 700 basic start up*

Hi everyone I am new to the site but I really need some help. Can someone please tell me what parameters needs to be set when powering up a Powerflex 700 drive just for normal 3 wire control and what the settings are. There is a whole lot of manuals on the net but I am unable to find an answer.


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## Jabberwoky (Sep 2, 2012)

Wimpie said:


> Hi everyone I am new to the site but I really need some help. Can someone please tell me what parameters needs to be set when powering up a Powerflex 700 drive just for normal 3 wire control and what the settings are. There is a whole lot of manuals on the net but I am unable to find an answer.


Hi Wimpie and welcome to the forums. It would be best to post your question in a new thread. The question may be related to the same equipment but it is a different situation and may get noticed easier in its own thread.

The manual posted on the Rockwell website looks fairly clear as to how to hook it up on page 1-45. The settings will depend on your specific application. Here is the link to the manual I just used as a reference. http://literature.rockwellautomation.com/idc/groups/literature/documents/um/20b-um002_-en-p.pdf


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