# Options for aspiring Upstate NY Lineworker



## UpstateNYer

Hey everyone, new guy here.

This post is to see what my options are to become a lineworker in upstate NY.

I just graduated with my Bachelors in Finance and realized that the career is not what i thought. However, since graduation i have been digging through Lineworker field manuals, the NEC, and have talked to a few lineworkers and decided that it is a career i would enjoy doing everyday. 

With all that said, i am hitting a brick wall every time i try to get my foot in the door. The overheard lineworker certificate program at my local community college has a wait list thats unexceptionally long and there are no local union halls offering the outside lineworker apprenticeship. The local poco (National Grid) hires mostly internally, through the union, or through the community college. All other jobs that are available to the public are for management positions. I don't mind being the grunt and gassing/loading up line trucks, digging holes, etc.. There just isn't an opportunity to do even that.

Are my only options to wait for the program to open up or move closer to a local union that offers the apprenticeship?

Thanks in advance for any info.


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## cabletie

Have you looked into North Eastern joint apprenticeship training, NEAT. 

They train lineman. Not exactly sure how it works. I was taking a class at our Hall a few weeks ago. The same weekend the lineman were doing some sort of training in one of the other rooms. They also had 25-30 NEAT guys out back on the poles. 

I talked to one of their teachers about what they were doing. They were basically running them through a few weekends of like a basic training. He told me that Sunday was their last day. He also said not one of them was going to make it. He didn't seem happy about it. 

I'm not sure where the next group comes from? It's a hard job. I think on their last day they have to climb the pole, grab a 200lb dummy, bring him down and do so many minutes of CPR. They have to do it all under so many minutes. 

Good luck with it.


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## cabletie

Oh and I forgot, welcome to the forum!


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## MechanicalDVR

Welcome aboard @UpstateNYer!

Not to sound like a prick but why waste all that time and money to go be a mindless grunt?


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## Joe Robert

Try getting a different job with the poco that falls under the same Union. Use meter reading or something else that requires minimal training as a way to get your foot in the door.


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## Speedy Petey

MechanicalDVR said:


> Not to sound like a prick but why waste all that time and money to go be a mindless grunt?


You really consider linemen to be "mindless grunts"??? 
WOW!

I know a lot of them and that's never even entered my mind.


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## Speedy Petey

UpstateNYer said:


> Are my only options to wait for the program to open up or move closer to a local union that offers the apprenticeship?


Most guys that I know in recent years have gone to one of the several lineman schools. One of my closest friends went to SLTC in Ga, and another kid I know very well just started school in TN. 
The one that went to SLTC got right into the utility and is doing extremely well.


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## MechanicalDVR

Speedy Petey said:


> You really consider linemen to be "mindless grunts"???
> WOW!
> 
> I know a lot of them and that's never even entered my mind.


I know many of them as well, related to several.

My cousin was the President of his local in a very large market for years.

Doesn't change the fact that it's a physical job, grunt labor 90% of the time.

What real brain work do they have to do consistently?


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## splatz

Grunt work, not grunt work, who cares - the main reason to go into line work (or any work) is the money. Most places lineman pays more than wireman.


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## MechanicalDVR

splatz said:


> Grunt work, not grunt work, who cares - the main reason to go into line work (or any work) is the money. Most places lineman pays more than wireman.


But how long can one do linework?

My point is would you knowing what you do at this point want to be a lineman?

More so, would you blow the money on college you just spent to make the switch?


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## splatz

MechanicalDVR said:


> But how long can one do linework?
> 
> My point is would you knowing what you do at this point want to be a lineman?
> 
> More so, would you blow the money on college you just spent to make the switch?


Knowing what I know now, I might have gone that way ... might have done a LOT Of things different! If I ever got to do my life over knowing what I know now - YOW. Nobody would be safe :laughing: 

Two good points we agree on: 

I'd really try not spend much on college to go into line work - if you can't get in through a union apprenticeship in your area, try to get in through the utility company. 

(I wouldn't rule out community college, IF it will really get you in - around here it's about $2,000 a semester for residents. Spending $8,000 on education over two years to land a job you'll be making six figures at in a few years is not unreasonable.) 

And yes I'd really think hard about different contingencies for the future, I would not count on 30 years as a lineman, have a plan for the second half of your career.


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## MechanicalDVR

splatz said:


> Knowing what I know now, I might have gone that way ... might have done a LOT Of things different! If I ever got to do my life over knowing what I know now - YOW. Nobody would be safe :laughing:
> 
> Two good points we agree on:
> 
> I'd really try not spend much on college to go into line work - if you can't get in through a union apprenticeship in your area, try to get in through the utility company.
> 
> (I wouldn't rule out community college, IF it will really get you in - around here it's about $2,000 a semester for residents. Spending $8,000 on education over two years to land a job you'll be making six figures at in a few years is not unreasonable.)
> 
> And yes I'd really think hard about different contingencies for the future, I would not count on 30 years as a lineman, have a plan for the second half of your career.


Most of my cousins that have gone that route worked until they dropped basically.


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## Speedy Petey

MechanicalDVR said:


> Doesn't change the fact that it's a physical job, grunt labor 90% of the time.





MechanicalDVR said:


> But how long can one do linework?
> 
> My point is would you knowing what you do at this point want to be a lineman?
> 
> More so, would you blow the money on college you just spent to make the switch?


At what pathetic point in this sad country did physical labor become a bad/negative thing? What ever happened to being proud of a hard day's work?


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## MechanicalDVR

Speedy Petey said:


> At what pathetic point in this sad country did physical labor become a bad/negative thing? What ever happened to being proud of a hard day's work?


If you are too hard headed to realize it's a job that one can't do forever and it takes a huge toll on your body I actually feel bad for you.

I equate the job to ditch digging, okay for kids but not a career many will last in 30 years without orthopedic and other health problems. 

Most of those guys drink constantly.


Maybe lose the confrontational attitude of always looking to argue with me and look at the larger picture before you bark young man.


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## Joe Robert

The trade has become a lot less less physically demanding than it was even 15 years ago (the old men say). 20 years ago they piked backyard poles and climbed damn near everything, even if they had a bucket there was a man on the pole too. Now we’ve got backyard diggers and lineman that haven’t seen their hooks in 10 years. Of course this all depends on where you work and who you work for, but in my 4 months the hardest thing I’ve done is lift a cross arm from my belt to my chest.


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## Joe Robert

As for the “mindless” part (assuming you’re referring to their understanding of electrical theory), that’s a matter of choice. I pester every journeyman/ leader I’m assigned to with endless trade/electrical theory questions. I’d say about half of them know little outside of the mechanical aspect of the job and how to not die, which to be fair are the two most important things. From there a quarter seem to be experts about everything (to my novice mind) and the other quarter a mixture of the two. I’d wager similar ratios exist in most of the trades.


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## MechanicalDVR

Joe Robert said:


> As for the “mindless” part (assuming you’re referring to their understanding of electrical theory), that’s a matter of choice. I pester every journeyman/ leader I’m assigned to with endless trade/electrical theory questions. *I’d say about half of them know little outside of the mechanical aspect of the job *and how to not die, which to be fair are the two most important things. From there a quarter seem to be experts about everything (to my novice mind) and the other quarter a mixture of the two. I’d wager similar ratios exist in most of the trades.


That has been my experience with more like 75% of them out east.


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## Speedy Petey

MechanicalDVR said:


> If you are too hard headed to realize it's a job that one can't do forever and it takes a huge toll on your body I actually feel bad for you.


Well, in my experience they have enough manpower to ease the physical burden. And I know of several guys who were older when I started and are now retired. These guys are in better shape than most old men I know, especially retired IBM'ers who mostly sat at a desk all day.






MechanicalDVR said:


> I equate the job to ditch digging, okay for kids but not a career many will last in 30 years without orthopedic and other health problems.


If you equate being a lineman to being a ditch digger then I question that you've ever been in this trade. 





MechanicalDVR said:


> Maybe lose the confrontational attitude of always looking to argue with me and look at the larger picture before you bark young man.


I will not dignify this with a reply.


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## splatz

Joe Robert said:


> The trade has become a lot less less physically demanding than it was even 15 years ago (the old men say).


I remember talking to a lineman that I used to subcontract in about that time frame, it would have been 15 years ago or maybe a little longer. He was bitching about how these new kids were not learning to climb with their spikes, scared to hang a ladder off a wire, etc. I think he called them "bucket babies" LOL. If you aren't working for a shoddy shop, things are pretty safe these days. 

I did some work for years for another utility contractor before their shop closed, I still keep in touch with a couple people from there, they work at the union hall now. The owner was a great employer, did things right and treated people very well, very fairly. 

When they were in the process of closing, he told me a little about what the men there were making, what the men at the utility companies were making, and what their non-union competition was paying. 

Without wanting to get too controversial, the disparity between union and non-union compensation in line work is MUCH bigger than it is for wireman work. The union contractors in this area and I suspect in most areas are going to struggle between disasters, and the union linemen aren't going to get the steady work they used to. 

The utility companies are different, with a little storm work every year they make great money and the way things are done these days they aren't chewed up so bad by the job.


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## cabletie

Even if they don't climb everyday, they still have to qualify every so offen. I can't remember how often the instructor told me they had to do the pole top rescue. 

He also said something about their retirement. Maybe 55 and out or double pension after 55? He said he was never out of work, although I think he traveled at least the state.


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## MechanicalDVR

cabletie said:


> Even if they don't climb everyday, they still have to qualify every so offen. I can't remember how often the instructor told me they had to do the pole top rescue.
> 
> He also said something about their retirement. Maybe 55 and out or double pension after 55? He said he was never out of work, although I think he traveled at least the state.


Most of my cousins that are linemen work for JCP&L and PSE&G.

Anytime there is a big storm someplace they are gone for the duration.


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## stiffneck

MechanicalDVR said:


> If you are too hard headed to realize it's a job that one can't do forever and it takes a huge toll on your body I actually feel bad for you.
> 
> I equate the job to ditch digging, okay for kids but not a career many will last in 30 years without orthopedic and other health problems.
> 
> Most of those guys *drink constantly*.


No chance of alcohol having a roll in health problems? Including orthopedic.


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## stiffneck

splatz said:


> I remember talking to a lineman that I used to subcontract in about that time frame, it would have been 15 years ago or maybe a little longer. He was *bitching about how these new kids* were not learning to climb with their spikes, scared to hang a ladder off a wire, etc. I think he called them "bucket babies" LOL. If you aren't working for a shoddy shop, things are pretty safe these days.
> 
> I did some work for years for another utility contractor before their shop closed, I still keep in touch with a couple people from there, they work at the union hall now. The owner was a great employer, did things right and treated people very well, very fairly.
> 
> When they were in the process of closing, he told me a little about what the men there were making, what the men at the utility companies were making, and what their non-union competition was paying.
> 
> Without wanting to get too controversial, the disparity between union and non-union compensation in line work is MUCH bigger than it is for wireman work. The union contractors in this area and I suspect in most areas are going to struggle between disasters, and the union linemen aren't going to get the steady work they used to.
> 
> The utility companies are different, with a little storm work every year they make great money and the way things are done these days they aren't chewed up so bad by the job.



Back in the 1980's and 1990's I tried repeatedly to get into this line of work. And, I always ran into the same road block; Nepotism, followed by Affirmative Action with the big Utilities. What I did NOT have was a piece of paper. If I'd known back then, I would have gone to school to increase my chances of getting hired. As far as an IBEW apprenticeship is concerned; here in Saint Louis, (both sides of the river) it's all about Nepotism as well. Yes, I applied there as well, repeatedly. Not once was I allowed to test, interview for anything (locals 1 and 2). One time only, I was allowed to sign a book for inside work, at 1. Open the doors up and let some of the other "kids" have a chance. Might be surprised what you might get.


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## MechanicalDVR

stiffneck said:


> No chance of alcohol having a roll in health problems? Including orthopedic.


I'm sure it's a contributing factor!


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## Joe Robert

splatz said:


> I remember talking to a lineman that I used to subcontract in about that time frame, it would have been 15 years ago or maybe a little longer. He was bitching about how these new kids were not learning to climb with their spikes, scared to hang a ladder off a wire, etc. I think he called them "bucket babies" LOL. If you aren't working for a shoddy shop, things are pretty safe these days.
> 
> 
> 
> I did some work for years for another utility contractor before their shop closed, I still keep in touch with a couple people from there, they work at the union hall now. The owner was a great employer, did things right and treated people very well, very fairly.
> 
> 
> 
> When they were in the process of closing, he told me a little about what the men there were making, what the men at the utility companies were making, and what their non-union competition was paying.
> 
> 
> 
> Without wanting to get too controversial, the disparity between union and non-union compensation in line work is MUCH bigger than it is for wireman work. The union contractors in this area and I suspect in most areas are going to struggle between disasters, and the union linemen aren't going to get the steady work they used to.
> 
> 
> 
> The utility companies are different, with a little storm work every year they make great money and the way things are done these days they aren't chewed up so bad by the job.




Yep, get in with the right company and you’ve got a relatively easy job that pays quite well. Safety is the biggest concern of most of the POCO’s, and that means easy work most of the time.


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## Unionpride277

Befor I got into the ibew “inside wireman apprentiship program “I wanted to be a line man .

From what I was told is you need to have your cdl then you must go onto neats website and fill out an application .

Once they call you then you take an aptitude test depending on how you score they put you on a list and when your number is called they give you an interview .

If your accepted you go to boot camp and they put you on a list .

Once a utility company calls them they will send you to work . 

This is through neats program witch is union .

So like I said go on their website and fill out application .
They will call you after that .


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