# Tool size



## splatz (May 23, 2015)

I'd just show up with a set of Channellock 420 's which are actually 9.5" tongue and groove pliers, not 9" slip joint pliers. That's probably what they are after. They're an industry standard. They are $14 at Home Depot which is about as good a deal as you'll get for a high quality made in USA tool. 

https://www.homedepot.com/p/Channellock-9-1-2-in-Tongue-and-Groove-Plier-420/202304947

There's no such a thing as 9" slip joint pliers and nobody uses slip joint pliers except DIY car mechanics. But I wouldn't start my first day pointing out they have their head up their ass with the tool list.


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## CBhammer (Dec 29, 2018)

Thanks for the info.
I have researched so many brands and have just gone brain fried almost.
Is channel lock or Knipex the way to go?


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

Channel locks are damn good for the price. I use Knipex, but I have a long time of experience to know which ones I will be using the most. I would suggest you wait it out before buying premium tools.

This here is a good example, splatz says to get the 420's but I say the 430's. The 420's are great and I used them a lot, but if you are only going to have 1 pair I think the 430's are the ones you should have.

This is completely opinion based, and why I say you should wait to see what YOU need and want before buying the expensive brands.


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## CBhammer (Dec 29, 2018)

Thanks for the info.
I appreciate it a lot
I just do not want to keep buying things over and over
I would like to make the investment in tools that will last 10-15 years etc


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

CBhammer said:


> Thanks for the info.
> I appreciate it a lot
> I just do not want to keep buying things over and over
> I would like to make the investment in tools that will last 10-15 years etc


I hear you, but you also don't want to spend $40 on a Pair of Knipex Cobras just to find that you prefer the smaller size and have to go buy them.

The channel locks will last you for a long time. And if you want longevity, I think the 430's are the best bet as being the "classic" size.


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## CBhammer (Dec 29, 2018)

Will do
Thanks for the help


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## splatz (May 23, 2015)

Another thing I'd check, Channellock has some sets that are even better deals. I am sure there will be lineman's pliers on your list, and probably diagonals as well, Channellocks are by far the best bang for the buck. I don't know if they have a set with others you have to buy. Either way, they are actually cheaper than some of the made in China junk at Home Depot.


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## MechanicalDVR (Dec 29, 2007)

splatz said:


> I'd just show up with a set of Channellock 420 's which are actually 9.5" tongue and groove pliers, not 9" slip joint pliers. That's probably what they are after. They're an industry standard. They are $14 at Home Depot which is about as good a deal as you'll get for a high quality made in USA tool.
> 
> https://www.homedepot.com/p/Channellock-9-1-2-in-Tongue-and-Groove-Plier-420/202304947
> 
> *There's no such a thing as 9" slip joint pliers and nobody uses slip joint pliers except DIY car mechanics.* But I wouldn't start my first day pointing out they have their head up their ass with the tool list.


I could swear I've seen this posted here before in the past but couldn't find the post. Some one isn't familiar with the nomenclature of Channellock (arc joint) pliers.


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## MikeFL (Apr 16, 2016)

When I saw the thread title I thought it was going to be in the Locker Room Talk section. 

Apprentices are at that age where they're sensitive about that subject.


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## Going_Commando (Oct 1, 2011)

HackWork said:


> CBhammer said:
> 
> 
> > Thanks for the info.
> ...


The 430s are good, but I prefer the 440s since they will do up to 2" compression emt connectors. My daily use are 10" knipex, but the 440s are still in my tool bag.


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

Going_Commando said:


> The 430s are good, but I prefer the 440s since they will do up to 2" compression emt connectors. My daily use are 10" knipex, but the 440s are still in my tool bag.


I find the 440 ‘s to be too big, unless I am doing 2”. 

But this discussion illustrates the point I was making to the OP perfectly. Everyone has their own preference and sometimes it takes a few years of working in order to find what your preference truly is.


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## TGGT (Oct 28, 2012)

CBhammer said:


> Thanks for the info.
> I appreciate it a lot
> I just do not want to keep buying things over and over
> I would like to make the investment in tools that will last 10-15 years etc


Be aware that as an apprentice you will be loaning out your tools often, and they will end up either broken or lost. Go too cheap and your tools will not perform well. Buy too expensive and you'll find the performance doesn't usually outweigh the cost and you'll be crying when they are lost or stolen.

I agree with the 430's, even though it's the only pair I don't own. I've gotten by with 420's and 7" knipex cobras. 440's on occasion, but I don't carry them most days and they go back in the extra bag when I'm done. Really depends on your work.

Sent from my SM-G930T using Tapatalk


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## stuiec (Sep 25, 2010)

Short and girthy, think hairy pancake. 


Oh...sorry, misleading title...


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## glen1971 (Oct 10, 2012)

I carry a pair of Channellock 420's and 440's in my pouch, with a pair of 480's in the truck for the odd larger locknut.. No one has ever set limits on the tools I use, except with knives..


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## MechanicalDVR (Dec 29, 2007)

glen1971 said:


> I carry a pair of Channellock 420's and 440's in my pouch, with a pair of 480's in the truck for the odd larger locknut.. No one has ever set limits on the tools I use, except with knives..


Who limited you on knives?

I used to annoy the guards at prisons that count your tools in and out because I carry three knives in my pockets all the time.


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## HackWork (Oct 2, 2009)

MechanicalDVR said:


> Who limited you on knives?
> 
> I used to annoy the guards at prisons that count your tools in and out because I carry three knives in my pockets all the time.


3 knives?!?!?! What are you, some type of killer? Psychopath? Knife nut!





My EDC 14 years ago :whistling2:


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## MechanicalDVR (Dec 29, 2007)

HackWork said:


> 3 knives?!?!?! What are you, some type of killer? Psychopath? Knife nut!


Retired (government trained), maybe a tad, and YES respectively. I grew up in a bad neighborhood.


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## MechanicalDVR (Dec 29, 2007)

HackWork said:


> 3 knives?!?!?! What are you, some type of killer? Psychopath? Knife nut!
> 
> 
> 
> ...


My EDC for years:


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## Navyguy (Mar 15, 2010)

TGGT said:


> Be aware that as an apprentice you will be loaning out your tools often, and they will end up either broken or lost.


I don't get this… why would an apprentice (or anyone) be loaning out their tools for anyone else to use "often"? Tell them to buy their own crap.

Cheers
John


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## glen1971 (Oct 10, 2012)

MechanicalDVR said:


> Who limited you on knives?
> 
> I used to annoy the guards at prisons that count your tools in and out because I carry three knives in my pockets all the time.


One site told me I needed a "spring retractable blade knife:. I said why, "in case you trip and fall, the blade will retract".. Told them it was news to me, and the others sites half an hour away never heard of this. They said I needed that knife and no other ones were allowed on site. I said "Do you supply the knife?" They said no.. "Ok.. Have a good day then... I'm heading home because I don't have the knife you want me to use, and the knife you want me to use is not what I use in my trade." I carry a linesman's knife. After some discussion I was given a special exemption and was allowed to cut in the two generator cables and gave them their power back..


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## MechanicalDVR (Dec 29, 2007)

glen1971 said:


> One site told me I needed a "spring retractable blade knife:. I said why, "in case you trip and fall, the blade will retract".. Told them it was news to me, and the others sites half an hour away never heard of this. They said I needed that knife and no other ones were allowed on site. I said "Do you supply the knife?" They said no.. "Ok.. Have a good day then... I'm heading home because I don't have the knife you want me to use, and the knife you want me to use is not what I use in my trade." I carry a linesman's knife. After some discussion I was given a special exemption and was allowed to cut in the two generator cables and gave them their power back..


Wow that is insane. Telling me what I need to carry is bad enough but telling me what I can't carry really would tweak my nads!

Only fights I've had on a job over tools was because I carried a battery screwdriver.


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## Southeast Power (Jan 18, 2009)

If it cant fit in a Sqwallet, you dont need it.


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## eddy current (Feb 28, 2009)

MechanicalDVR said:


> Wow that is insane. Telling me what I need to carry is bad enough but telling me what I can't carry really would tweak my nads!
> 
> Only fights I've had on a job over tools was because I carried a battery screwdriver.


I’ve worked in high security areas where they always try and limit the amount of tools allowed on your person. Like in an airport on the “air side” or in a police station/jail for instance.


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## splatz (May 23, 2015)

glen1971 said:


> One site told me I needed a "spring retractable blade knife:. I said why, "in case you trip and fall, the blade will retract".. Told them it was news to me, and the others sites half an hour away never heard of this. They said I needed that knife and no other ones were allowed on site. I said "Do you supply the knife?" They said no.. "Ok.. Have a good day then... I'm heading home because I don't have the knife you want me to use, and the knife you want me to use is not what I use in my trade." I carry a linesman's knife. After some discussion I was given a special exemption and was allowed to cut in the two generator cables and gave them their power back..


You really can't make this stuff up. One of my customers has those retractable-blade utility knives for their warehouse. They are spring loaded so you have to push on the button the whole time. Obviously designed by someone sitting in an office that never actually used the device at work. It may mitigate some one in a million cut when not using the knife, but it certainly makes the knife a little less useful, a little more difficult to use properly, and a little less safe to _actually use._ 

One of my all time favorite safety madness stories. I was on a conference call PSA with, no lie: 

Me - subcontracted technician
Maintenance Man - for the contractor 
Admin person - for the contractor 
Project manager - huge engineering firm hiring the contractor 
Admin person - engineering company
Project manager - Fortune 500 owner / customer company hiring the engineering firm
Admin person - owner / customer company 

That's right folks seven people on the phone for over an hour talking about an hour's work with minimal hazards present. 

One of the tasks - the maintenance man was putting down some rubber mulch to keep the weeds down around some of the equipment. The safety officer asked how he'd open the bags. He and I are at a conference table. He gives me a WTF? look. "Uh, with a utility knife?" 

Safety officer comes to life. "OH no, no. There are no fixed blade knives permitted on our sites." 

"Oh mine is not the old fashioned fixed blade type, it has a button and you can put the blade away when you're done." 

Hmmm... discussion.... is that considered fixed blade? ... shouldn't it retract automatically? blah blah blah ....

"Can you use scissors?" 

Rolls eyes. "Sure I can bring scissors." 

General relief. I mute the phone for a second. "Don't run with them!" hahahaha. Unmute. 

Literally kindergarten nonsense. But this is how those people spend their days and they are making the big bucks. 

Meanwhile in China...


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## MechanicalDVR (Dec 29, 2007)

eddy current said:


> I’ve worked in high security areas where they always try and limit the amount of tools allowed on your person. Like in an airport on the “air side” or in a police station/jail for instance.


There was one county jail where the guards would get annoyed about counting in your tools and more than once I brought in a packed Veto on a folding handtruck just to bust chops if the call was for an area at 72deg when they wanted 70 and I had to check the space sensors and the DDC system.


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## MechanicalDVR (Dec 29, 2007)

splatz said:


> You really can't make this stuff up. One of my customers has those retractable-blade utility knives for their warehouse. They are spring loaded so you have to push on the button the whole time. Obviously designed by someone sitting in an office that never actually used the device at work. It may mitigate some one in a million cut when not using the knife, but it certainly makes the knife a little less useful, a little more difficult to use properly, and a little less safe to _actually use._
> 
> One of my all time favorite safety madness stories. I was on a conference call PSA with, no lie:
> 
> ...


You bring up China...where guys with fixed blade knives attack crowds!


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