# HELP!!! problems with multiple 4 lamp ballast



## mdnholla (Nov 20, 2011)

Me and my company are doing a 600,000 square foot warehouse the shell was done in 07 and had alot of the warehouse lighting done. They are 6 lamp t5 fixtures they have one 2 lamp ballast and one 4 lamp ballast. the 2 lamp ballast are fine but i would say 70% of the 4 lamp ballast are not working. The model # for the four lamp ballast is b454punv-e rapid start. now when i replace the ballast the fixture works fine, but i need to find out what caused this in the first place so i do not have to worry about it happening again. Now the ballast can also be wired as a three lamp as well but i have checked several and they are wired correctly as a 4 lamp configuration. now when one of the lamps burn out or is not in none of the lamps on that ballast will fire. now when this shell was done they did share nuetrals. the building has two seprate services half of the lighting from one and half from the other. if anyone has any ideas what it could be i would appricate it thanks.


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## alpha3236 (May 30, 2010)

Is the warehouse heated? If not you may have a problem with the minimum temperature that the ballasts are rated for. Just a thought.


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## mdnholla (Nov 20, 2011)

yes it is heated


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## CTshockhazard (Aug 28, 2009)

We had many problems with 6 lamp T5 hibays back around '07, mostly due to factory miswiring. 

The ballasts can be self-protecting and shut down when a lamp goes out to prevent damage to the ballast.


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

mdnholla said:


> Me and my company are doing a 600,000 square foot warehouse the shell was done in 07 and had alot of the warehouse lighting done. They are 6 lamp t5 fixtures they have one 2 lamp ballast and one 4 lamp ballast. the 2 lamp ballast are fine but i would say 70% of the 4 lamp ballast are not working. The model # for the four lamp ballast is b454punv-e rapid start. now when i replace the ballast the fixture works fine, but i need to find out what caused this in the first place so i do not have to worry about it happening again. Now the ballast can also be wired as a three lamp as well but i have checked several and they are wired correctly as a 4 lamp configuration. now when one of the lamps burn out or is not in none of the lamps on that ballast will fire. now when this shell was done they did share nuetrals. the building has two seprate services half of the lighting from one and half from the other. if anyone has any ideas what it could be i would appricate it thanks.



On a rapid start ballast all the lamps depend on each other so if 1 out of 4 burns out then all 4 will go out with it ....


Just like the old t-12 2 lamp rapid start ballast if 1 lamp burned out then both lamps would not light up even though 1 of the lamps would still be good it could not light without the other lamp being good.

most t-8 ballast are just trigger start so when 1 lamp burned out the other would still light up like normal.


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## mdnholla (Nov 20, 2011)

i have replaced the lamps im sure its the ballast


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## ce2two (Oct 4, 2008)

alpha3236 said:


> Is the warehouse heated? If not you may have a problem with the minimum temperature that the ballasts are rated for. Just a thought.


Temp problems with old ballasts the ones that oozze and stink when they go bad..Electronic ballast never had a problem 10-100 f degrees....


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## Sparky208 (Feb 25, 2011)

Defect from the manufacture. The company that I work for has replaced 100s if not a 1000 or more of bad T5 ballasts. We have done a ton of lighting upgrades and the T5 seems to have alot of problems. The manufacture always requires us to send them back.


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## mdnholla (Nov 20, 2011)

well i just dont understand why its only affecting the 4 lamp ballast and all the 2 lamp ballast are fine


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

mdnholla said:


> well i just dont understand why its only affecting the 4 lamp ballast and all the 2 lamp ballast are fine


Are the 2 lamp ballast the rapid start type?


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## Bulldog1 (Oct 21, 2011)

It's possible the factory got a batch of bad ballasts. I had to change about half of the ballasts we put in an office within a month a few years ago.


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## mdnholla (Nov 20, 2011)

yes the 2 lamp are rapid start


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

mdnholla said:


> yes the 2 lamp are rapid start


4 lamp ballast seem to be nothing but trouble..:no:


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## McClary’s Electrical (Feb 21, 2009)

HARRY304E said:


> 4 lamp ballast seem to be nothing but trouble..:no:


 Now that's just a silly statement.


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

mcclary's electrical said:


> Now that's just a silly statement.


Why is that ?:blink:


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## McClary’s Electrical (Feb 21, 2009)

HARRY304E said:


> Why is that ?:blink:


 
Beause it's unwarranted. We install hundreds of 4 tube layin fixtures every year with no problems. This is another example of you talking out of your ass.


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## Cletis (Aug 20, 2010)

*....*


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

mcclary's electrical said:


> Beause it's unwarranted. We install hundreds of 4 tube layin fixtures every year with no problems. This is another example of you talking out of your ass.


Reallythat's great .

The Op is talking about 6 lamp T-5 with 1- 4 lamp t-5 rapid start ballast and 1 -2 lamp rapid start ballast

He is having trouble with the 4 lamp ballasts ("Because they suck")

I have 3 posts in this thread trying to help out the "op"


You have 2 posts giving me chit and 0 posts helping out the "OP"


Considering that you have installed 100's you should be able to answer the "OP's with half your brain tied behind your back right.

Looks like you talking out of your ass.:laughing:


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## McClary’s Electrical (Feb 21, 2009)

HARRY304E said:


> Reallythat's great .
> 
> The Op is talking about 6 lamp T-5 with 1- 4 lamp t-5 rapid start ballast and 1 -2 lamp rapid start ballast
> 
> ...


 

I gave you chit because you're making up stuff, like usual with you.
If he had been having trouble with the 2 lamp ballast, you would have said" yeah the 2 lamp ballast are nothing but trouble" You are completely incapable of thinking for yourself.


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

mcclary's electrical said:


> I gave you chit because you're making up stuff, like usual with you.
> If he had been having trouble with the 2 lamp ballast, you would have said" yeah the 2 lamp ballast are nothing but trouble" You are completely incapable of thinking for yourself.


Wrong .

2 lamp rapid start ballasts have been around since the 1940's and have a proven track record of reliability until they changed then to electronic crap.


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

mcclary's electrical said:


> I gave you chit because you're making up stuff, like usual with you.
> If he had been having trouble with the 2 lamp ballast, you would have said" yeah the 2 lamp ballast are nothing but trouble" You are completely incapable of thinking for yourself.


Considering your such an expert on the subject why don't you answer the OP's question..


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## McClary’s Electrical (Feb 21, 2009)

HARRY304E said:


> Considering your such an expert on the subject why don't you answer the OP's question..


 
Not interested. Only interested in pointing out your BS whenever you spew it, which is quite often. So get used to it, or quit acting like Rewire.


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## Sparky J (May 17, 2011)

Been drinking for a while (happy turkey day) you two need a hug.


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

mcclary's electrical said:


> Not interested. Only interested in pointing out your BS whenever you spew it, which is quite often. So get used to it, or quit acting like Rewire.


OK..................:sleep1::sleep1::sleep1:..zzz.


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

Sparky J said:


> Been drinking for a while (happy turkey day) you two need a hug.


:laughing::laughing::laughing:


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## frenchelectrican (Mar 15, 2007)

I have not got too many widespread failure with 4 lamp ballast on T-5 verison most common useally surge that useally do it.

To OP., what voltage did you have the luminares is set for ?


Oh BTW., Mcclary and Harry just keep this civil S.V.P. ?

Merci,
Marc


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## mdnholla (Nov 20, 2011)

277 volts


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## frenchelectrican (Mar 15, 2007)

mdnholla said:


> 277 volts


Ok we are getting somewhere but with 277 volts some case you may have unbalnaced voltage that can cause the issue with the luminaires ballast go out.

As I mention before the surge or unbalanced voltage will useally can finsh off the electroic ballast and few mention some case a bad batch as well.

Do any of the lumiares run on the MWBC or just stragiht single circuits ? if on the MWBC the most common cuprit is bad connection on netural conductor.

Merci,
Marc


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## BBQ (Nov 16, 2010)

mdnholla said:


> well i just dont understand why its only affecting the 4 lamp ballast and all the 2 lamp ballast are fine


Because the four lamp ones have a factory defect and the two lamp ones do not. At least that is sure what it seems like.


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## BBQ (Nov 16, 2010)

HARRY304E said:


> Wrong .
> 
> 2 lamp rapid start ballasts have been around since the 1940's and have a proven track record of reliability until they changed then to electronic crap.


There is no relationship between a 1940s T-12 ballast and a modern T-5 ballast.


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## BBQ (Nov 16, 2010)

frenchelectrican said:


> Do any of the lumiares run on the MWBC or just stragiht single circuits ? if on the MWBC the most common cuprit is bad connection on netural conductor.


I would think if that was the issue it would also effect the two lamp ballasts.


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## frenchelectrican (Mar 15, 2007)

BBQ said:


> I would think if that was the issue it would also effect the two lamp ballasts.


 Figures. I knew you will say it one way or other.

I did recall some of the 4 lamp ballast on T-5's few don't like to operated on very hot everoment area and I am aware that some of the 4 lamp ballast do run hotter than 2 lamp verison so it may be a cuprit.

Merci.
Marc


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## McClary’s Electrical (Feb 21, 2009)

frenchelectrican said:


> I have not got too many widespread failure with 4 lamp ballast on T-5 verison most common useally surge that useally do it.
> 
> To OP., what voltage did you have the luminares is set for ?
> 
> ...


 
Hary know not to tkae me seiously. But what is SVP?


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## Cletis (Aug 20, 2010)

*chart*

Just another troubleshooting chart...

http://nemesis.lonestar.org/reference/electricity/fluorescent/trouble.html


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## frenchelectrican (Mar 15, 2007)

mcclary's electrical said:


> Hary know not to tkae me seiously. But what is SVP?


 
S'il Vous Plaît = S.V.P. = Please in French.

Merci,
Marc


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## sbrn33 (Mar 15, 2007)

HARRY304E said:


> Wrong .
> 
> 2 lamp rapid start ballasts have been around since the 1940's and have a proven track record of reliability until they changed then to electronic crap.


 
Really?? 2 lamp T5 ballast have been around since the 40's?? Where did they find the lamps? Pretty sure the F54 T5HO lamp came out around 2005. I could be wrong though.


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## frenchelectrican (Mar 15, 2007)

sbrn33 said:


> Really?? 2 lamp T5 ballast have been around since the 40's?? Where did they find the lamps? Pretty sure the F54 T5HO lamp came out around 2005. I could be wrong though.


Not the *T-5* ballast the old school *T-12* ballast that been around for very long time. That make the differnce and the T-5 is been around about 10 years or so I don't have the excat date when they first came out on it.

Merci,
Marc


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## sbrn33 (Mar 15, 2007)

Right, Harry thinks the T12 ballast and the T5 work on the same princible. Anybody in the trade know better.


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## freeagnt54 (Aug 6, 2008)

We have also had a few 4-lamp t5 ballasts go bad in the 6 lamp fixtures, haven't had a single 2 lamp go bad yet. I think we have had about 5 or 6 go bad in about 300 we have put up all within about a year.


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## kaboler (Dec 1, 2010)

Harry's right. Magnetic ballasts last forever. Electronic suck, but don't guzzle energy.

I did a job that had a bad batch of ballasts. I think somewhere they were dropped hard on the production line, because the fail rate was well above what I think is a normal 5% fail rate for electronic. I didn't wire them hot. No reason for it.


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## user4818 (Jan 15, 2009)

kaboler said:


> Harry's right. Magnetic ballasts last forever. Electronic suck, but don't guzzle energy.
> 
> I did a job that had a bad batch of ballasts. I think somewhere they were dropped hard on the production line, because the fail rate was well above what I think is a normal 5% fail rate for electronic. I didn't wire them hot. No reason for it.


:ban:


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## kaboler (Dec 1, 2010)

Peter D said:


> :ban:


Calling on a ban for what? That I've had a bad batch of electronic ballasts?

Cheeseball.


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

BBQ said:


> There is no relationship between a 1940s T-12 ballast and a modern T-5 ballast.


Yes i know that .

I believe you miss understood my post.


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

sbrn33 said:


> Really?? 2 lamp T5 ballast have been around since the 40's?? Where did they find the lamps? Pretty sure the F54 T5HO lamp came out around 2005. I could be wrong though.


Really i was not talking about T-5 ballasts.


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## Scott Paullin (Dec 17, 2011)

*bad 4 lamp ballasts*



mdnholla said:


> i have replaced the lamps im sure its the ballast


Put a voltage tester on the commons


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