# Violation or not? 2014 nec



## tates1882 (Sep 3, 2010)

Is there a violation here or not? Ahj calls violation do to grounding electrode conductor being spliced on terminal bar in the panel. I could see the main bonding jumper leaving the panel enclosure being a violation or the fact there are parallel mbjs but not the gec being spliced. Gec becomes mbj once it leaves the ground heading toward grounded point in the system. 

Thoughts? 
Code ref


Also is there a way to keep the voltage produced by the electronic equipment that's present on the ig bar in the panel, separate from the equipment ground all the way back to the source? The drawing is an attempt to accomplish just that by keeping the equipment grounding conductor and isolated grounding conductor separate all the way back to the xo lug on the transformer where the ground/neutral bond is made. If the ground/neutral bond is in the panel and the eg and ig are tied together in the panel, is there a possibility that the metal surfaces will have voltage present on them because of the electronic equipment and the ig system? 

Thoughts?


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## papaotis (Jun 8, 2013)

i dont see a 'splice'?


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## kg7879 (Feb 3, 2014)

You do not run your GEC from your transformer and you first disconnect. It is either one or the other and where you decide to put your system bonding jumper is where your GEC would originate from.

For the IG. I really have not dealt with that but here is a link that talks about it.
https://www.mikeholt.com/technical....g1&type=u&title=Isolated Ground Reference One


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## tates1882 (Sep 3, 2010)

kg7879 said:


> You do not run your GEC from your transformer and you first disconnect. It is either one or the other and where you decide to put your system bonding jumper is where your GEC would originate from. For the IG. I really have not dealt with that but here is a link that talks about it. https://www.mikeholt.com/technical.php?id=grounding/unformatted/ig1&type=u&title=Isolated%20Ground%20Reference%20One


 thanks. 
According to the link the ig ground shouldn't carry any voltage, but if you've ever lifted a branch circuit ig ground from the terminal bar then test voltage between it and the bar you'll see 7-10 v


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## 13/2 (Apr 30, 2015)

A true is isolated grounding system ( In my opinion ) should be isolated. The code book 
says all grounding shall be bonded together. but after testing with some sensitive 
equipment I found that a good ground path directly to earth was far better than bonding it with the rest of the grounding system.


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## MDShunk (Jan 7, 2007)

13/2 said:


> A true is isolated grounding system ( In my opinion ) should be isolated. The code book
> says all grounding shall be bonded together. but after testing with some sensitive
> equipment I found that a good ground path directly to earth was far better than bonding it with the rest of the grounding system.


lol. And what is this sensitive equipment, and how does it provide a low impedance path to the transformer xo to clear a fault? :whistling2:


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## 13/2 (Apr 30, 2015)

Where does all grounding lead to.


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## tates1882 (Sep 3, 2010)

13/2 said:


> A true is isolated grounding system ( In my opinion ) should be isolated. The code book says all grounding shall be bonded together. but after testing with some sensitive equipment I found that a good ground path directly to earth was far better than bonding it with the rest of the grounding system.


 so if I'm reading correctly and understanding the meaning, you are suggesting have a separate grounding electrode for the ig and not bonding to the sources grounded point?


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## JW Splicer (Mar 15, 2014)

tates1882 said:


> so if I'm reading correctly and understanding the meaning, you are suggesting have a separate grounding electrode for the ig and not bonding to the sources grounded point?


Don't do this! This is a floating ground, and a violation.


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## JW Splicer (Mar 15, 2014)

I would put a ground kit in the xfmr, bond xo, both panel grounds, and xfmr frame to building steel.

Your splice is the ground kit in the panel. Take GEC directly from xfmr to steel (GE).


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## don_resqcapt19 (Jul 18, 2010)

If you want to make the GEC connection at the panel, you have to either land it directly on the neutral bar, or to the equipment grounding bus if the equipment grounding bus is connected to the neural bar via a system bonding jumper of the wire type. 250.30(A)(5) and Exception #1. You violation could be corrected by moving the GEC to the neural bar, or by installing a wire type system bonding jumper between the grounding and neutral bars.

In addition the conductor shown as an EGC that runs from XO to the panel grounding bus is really a supply side bonding jumper.


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## Black Dog (Oct 16, 2011)

13/2 said:


> A true is isolated grounding system ( In my opinion ) should be isolated. The code book
> says all grounding shall be bonded together. but after testing with some sensitive
> equipment I found that a good ground path directly to earth was far better than bonding it with the rest of the grounding system.





13/2 said:


> Where does all grounding lead to.


Take the time to watch this video....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mpgAVE4UwFw


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## tates1882 (Sep 3, 2010)

JW Splicer said:


> I would put a ground kit in the xfmr, bond xo, both panel grounds, and xfmr frame to building steel. Your splice is the ground kit in the panel. Take GEC directly from xfmr to steel (GE).


 ya understood. Was trying to clarify with the poster if that's what he was suggesting


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## erics37 (May 7, 2009)

13/2 said:


> A true is isolated grounding system ( In my opinion ) should be isolated. The code book
> says all grounding shall be bonded together. but after testing with some sensitive
> equipment I found that a good ground path directly to earth was far better than bonding it with the rest of the grounding system.




Not letting this guy wire anything anywhere near me.


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## JW Splicer (Mar 15, 2014)

tates1882 said:


> ya understood. Was trying to clarify with the poster if that's what he was suggesting


Yeah you're good, I thought it would quote yours and his, the reason being you clarified his bad idea, and we are on the same page...


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## JW Splicer (Mar 15, 2014)

13/2 said:


> Where does all grounding lead to.


Not the dirt.


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