# 240 high leg



## b-cap (Oct 7, 2014)

what is the proper way to identify or mark high leg in panel of a240/120 3 phase panel?


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## macmikeman (Jan 23, 2007)

Macmike alway put bright olange tape and lug into center phase of panel .


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## ponyboy (Nov 18, 2012)

110.15


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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## frenchelectrican (Mar 15, 2007)

b-cap said:


> what is the proper way to identify or mark high leg in panel of a240/120 3 phase panel?


It is pretty much SOP to marked or identify the high leg with orange tape or orange conductor.

So here a quick color code .,,
240/120 volts 
*Black*
*Orange*
*Red*

Just give you a head up the old delta system may marked in RED on wild leg so just be aware of that.

And all the delta system with high leg being used I always put a warning label on it.


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## TGGT (Oct 28, 2012)

frenchelectrican said:


> It is pretty much SOP to marked or identify the high leg with orange tape or orange conductor.
> 
> So here a quick color code .,,
> 240/120 volts
> ...


We did black orange blue in a commercial system that had an old 120/240 system.


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## frenchelectrican (Mar 15, 2007)

TGGT said:


> We did black orange blue in a commercial system that had an old 120/240 system.


That is the other common color option it been used in High leg Delta system.


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## MechanicalDVR (Dec 29, 2007)

This is the way I've always done it and seen it done around areas I've worked in.

120/240V, single-phase — black, red, and white

120/208V, 3-phase — black, red, blue, and white

120/240V, 3-phase — black, orange, blue, and white

277/480V, 3-phase — brown, orange, yellow, and gray; or, brown, purple, yellow, and gray


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## frenchelectrican (Mar 15, 2007)

MechanicalDVR said:


> This is the way I've always done it and seen it done around areas I've worked in.
> 
> 120/240V, single-phase — black, red, and white
> 
> ...


That is most common arrangement for the three phase system like that.

even in my island too we used the same color pattern but only thing we are aware with netural color and phase color is blue it can be either way depending on it came from.


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## TGGT (Oct 28, 2012)

MechanicalDVR said:


> This is the way I've always done it and seen it done around areas I've worked in.
> 
> 120/240V, single-phase — black, red, and white
> 
> ...


I've only seen brown purple yellow used a handful of times, mostly in Louisiana, never around here.


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## Southeast Power (Jan 18, 2009)

TGGT said:


> I've only seen brown purple yellow used a handful of times, mostly in Louisiana, never around here.


The local in the next county was mostly a suitcase local and the guys did quite a bit of traveling.
Somehow they brought back Brown Purple Yellow from some of the industrial sites they worked. So here in Dade County, we are Brown Orange Yellow. Broward County you will find Brown Purple Yellow almost everywhere that hasn't been built in the last 20 years.

Back to the OPs question. The POCO sets the highleg on C phase. It really makes sense just due to the fact that A&B share a transformer and C is from the second one.
I see quite a few panels with C marked as the hi-leg.


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## Southeast Power (Jan 18, 2009)

macmikeman said:


> Macmike alway put bright olange tape and lug into center phase of panel .


When did you develop an accent? And that third person thing?


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## MechanicalDVR (Dec 29, 2007)

Suncoast Power said:


> When did you develop an accent? And that third person thing?


I was wondering if he was still in celebration mode since the 8th and binging on a martial arts movie marathon session?


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## MechanicalDVR (Dec 29, 2007)

TGGT said:


> I've only seen brown purple yellow used a handful of times, mostly in Louisiana, never around here.


I don't know where 'around here' is but it's common in the north east.


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## Southeast Power (Jan 18, 2009)

MechanicalDVR said:


> I don't know where 'around here' is but it's common in the north east.


Do you have that in commercial buildings or in industrial or both?


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## MechanicalDVR (Dec 29, 2007)

Suncoast Power said:


> Do you have that in commercial buildings or in industrial or both?


Both, some guys only used purple for 277v.


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## b-cap (Oct 7, 2014)

*high leg*

Local ahj informed me that the high leg must be on the b phase on customer equipment.


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## MechanicalDVR (Dec 29, 2007)

b-cap said:


> Local ahj informed me that the high leg must be on the b phase on customer equipment.


That's very standard.


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## Southeast Power (Jan 18, 2009)

b-cap said:


> Local ahj informed me that the high leg must be on the b phase on customer equipment.


Yes, Its required for us to have the hi-leg on B


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## b-cap (Oct 7, 2014)

*high leg*

I know to mark the lug and wire with red or orange tape. I was asking about marking the panel itself.


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## Southeast Power (Jan 18, 2009)

b-cap said:


> I know to mark the lug and wire with red or orange tape. I was asking about marking the panel itself.


Orange, It can only be orange!!

I write it inside just to remind the handiman.


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## TGGT (Oct 28, 2012)

MechanicalDVR said:


> I don't know where 'around here' is but it's common in the north east.


Sorry, Texas.


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## MechanicalDVR (Dec 29, 2007)

TGGT said:


> Sorry, Texas.


No sweat.


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## telsa (May 22, 2015)

EUSERC phased out high-leg Services quite some time ago. If you request such, it will be refused. It's just too much trouble.

If a customer really needs 240, then he'd better buy his own autoformers to jack up 208.

Out here, PG&E places the stinger on the C phase... and I've seen plenty of old customer's panels that show exactly that layout.

Black, Red, Orange.


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## micromind (Aug 11, 2007)

b-cap said:


> I know to mark the lug and wire with red or orange tape. I was asking about marking the panel itself.


I usually write, in bold letters, something like;

WARNING
CAUTION
DANGER
BE CAREFUL
PELIGRO

120/240 3Ø 4 WIRE ∆
PHASE B 208 VOLTS TO NEUTRAL

And if there's enough room, I'll include;

IF A 120 VOLT LOAD IS CONNECTED TO PHASE B, IT WILL BE

RUINED
DESTROYED
BLOWN UP
WRECKED


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## emtnut (Mar 1, 2015)

I know all about bitch legs, but I've NEVER come across one up here. Interested if any other canucks have come across them !


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## Southeast Power (Jan 18, 2009)

telsa said:


> EUSERC phased out high-leg Services quite some time ago. If you request such, it will be refused. It's just too much trouble.
> 
> If a customer really needs 240, then he'd better buy his own autoformers to jack up 208.
> 
> ...


I see them almost every day.
Thee next two services I am changing are both 3 phase open Delta, One 1000 amps the other 600 amps.


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## frenchelectrican (Mar 15, 2007)

Suncoast Power said:


> I see them almost every day.
> Thee next two services I am changing are both 3 phase open Delta, One 1000 amps the other 600 amps.


Ya keeping open delta or not when you upgrading the service?


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

Suncoast Power said:


> I see them almost every day.
> Thee next two services I am changing are both 3 phase open Delta, One 1000 amps the other 600 amps.


The problem with a split phase delta, High Leg, 240/120 delta, call it any the number of the names this system is called, IS.

1. They have become rarer (at least around here) so there is little exposure to these systems

2. A lack of professionals that do not understand how to approach any electrical distribution they have to edeal with. Look, Read, Test and Understand


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## Southeast Power (Jan 18, 2009)

frenchelectrican said:


> Ya keeping open delta or not when you upgrading the service?


For sure.
All of the equipment in both places have calculations based on 240 volts. I dont want to be the guy bringing in a lower voltage. Its an acre or more at one plant, the other has residential condensers that are being used as chillers, and I dont want to change much if I can help it.

Besides, open delta is used very extensively here so, no one even thinks twice about it.


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## Barjack (Mar 28, 2010)

For identification in panelboards with a high leg, see Art. 408.3(F)



> *(F) High-Leg Identification.* A switchboard or panelboard
> containing a 4-wire, delta-connected system where the midpoint
> of one phase winding is grounded shall be legibly and
> permanently field marked as follows:
> “Caution _____ Phase Has _____ Volts to Ground”


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

Suncoast Power said:


> I see them almost every day.
> Thee next two services I am changing are both 3 phase open Delta, One 1000 amps the other 600 amps.


Almost any Secondary Delta configuration messes up electricians, a few weeks back we had a 208 Wye to 480 Delta and the electrician (?) pulled the neutral through from 208 to the 480 delta and bonded it in the panel. Luckily all loads were 3-phase 3-wire.


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## sbrn33 (Mar 15, 2007)

brian john said:


> Almost any Secondary Delta configuration messes up electricians, a few weeks back we had a 208 Wye to 480 Delta and the electrician (?) pulled the neutral through from 208 to the 480 delta and bonded it in the panel. Luckily all loads were 3-phase 3-wire.


Briian, why woiuld anyone ever go wye to delta? Why not wye to wye? I don't believe there is any advantage to delta over wye is there?


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## micromind (Aug 11, 2007)

sbrn33 said:


> Briian, why woiuld anyone ever go wye to delta? Why not wye to wye? I don't believe there is any advantage to delta over wye is there?


Very likely this was a backfed 480∆ - 120/208Y transformer that was installed in a building with a 208 service and 480 equipment. 

I've done it a number of times myself. I usually ground H2 and it becomes a 480 grounded B system though once in a while there is a need for 277. In this case, I connect 3 relatively small single phase transformers zig-zag to create a neutral.


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## cabletie (Feb 12, 2011)

For a two year stretch we did a lot of work for an HVAC contractor that used to add thee phase equipment to buildings with single phase services. Small churches or store fronts. I did more single phase to three phase delta service changes in two years, than I have done in thirty. 

I am not sure if it was because of existing equipment on the buildings that shared the transformer bank, or crowded utility poles. 

We always used black, orange, blue for 120/240 even though the NEC said red for the high leg. For feeder size conductors I always gave it orange with a candy stripe of red. Anything to make it stand out. 

I had made two round wood wedges that would sandwich a roll of electrical tape with a piece of threaded rod. I could chuck it into a drill press and use a razor knife to cut into the center. I used to do that with yellow tape also, for isolated grounds. The yellow I would cut the rolls into thirds. I always kept red and yellow like that in my tool bag. I don't do it anymore because I haven't needed either in at least fifteen years.


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## Southeast Power (Jan 18, 2009)

brian john said:


> Almost any Secondary Delta configuration messes up electricians, a few weeks back we had a 208 Wye to 480 Delta and the electrician (?) pulled the neutral through from 208 to the 480 delta and bonded it in the panel. Luckily all loads were 3-phase 3-wire.


I cant imagine that work was inspected.


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## Southeast Power (Jan 18, 2009)

micromind said:


> Very likely this was a backfed 480∆ - 120/208Y transformer that was installed in a building with a 208 service and 480 equipment.
> 
> I've done it a number of times myself. I usually ground H2 and it becomes a 480 grounded B system though once in a while there is a need for 277. In this case, I connect 3 relatively small single phase transformers zig-zag to create a neutral.


Is there a reason not to just use two transformers or would that have increased the size too much?

I got it, you needed the neutral.


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

sbrn33 said:


> Briian, why woiuld anyone ever go wye to delta? Why not wye to wye? I don't believe there is any advantage to delta over wye is there?


What Micro said


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## macmikeman (Jan 23, 2007)

telsa said:


> EUSERC phased out high-leg Services quite some time ago. If you request such, it will be refused. It's just too much trouble.
> 
> If a customer really needs 240, then he'd better buy his own autoformers to jack up 208.
> 
> ...


There is still plenty of them around here and we are Euserc. Kakaako , Airport , Mapunapuna, 3 places offhand I can think of having had to do work with existing stinger leg services. Waialae Ave also.


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## AU Facilities (Mar 25, 2015)

PSEG Long Island​ 
4.9.2 Secondary color coding of three phase conductors at the service connection and meter
enclosure shall be marked as follows:
*208Y/120* Blue, Black, Red
*240/120 delta *Blue, Black, Orange
*480Y/277* Brown, Orange, Yellow​


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