# Splicing Grounding electrode Conductor



## 6 shooter (Feb 4, 2008)

Would a short section of a grounding buss, the ones used for a grounding bars in say a sq d home line or qo panel satisfy 250.64c2 for a splice.

Copper thieves came in cut the 6 bare ground where it goes into a finished part of the basement and need to splice it back to the panel.


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## Dennis Alwon (May 9, 2009)

I don't believe that is what section 250.64(C)(2) is talking about. I think that is talking about busbars not grounding bars.

IMO you would have to use an exothermic weld or a fitting that joins the wire together and is irreversible. T&B makes them

http://www.tnb.com/ps/fulltilt/index.cgi?a=tiff2pdf&f=shared/inst/ta00628-tb2.tif


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## MDShunk (Jan 7, 2007)

Probably don't want to cadweld that close to the building, so an H-tap or C-tap is what's typically used. The utility would normally use a C-tap, but I use the H because that's what I stock.


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## 6 shooter (Feb 4, 2008)

MDShunk said:


> Probably don't want to cadweld that close to the building, so an H-tap or C-tap is what's typically used. The utility would normally use a C-tap, but I use the H because that's what I stock.


Trouble is you have to by the crimp tool right? If im not mistaken they are expensive right? I really don't do that much that requires crimping of that sort. Hopefully I could find some one that has one to use.


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## MDShunk (Jan 7, 2007)

6 shooter said:


> Trouble is you have to by the crimp tool right? If im not mistaken they are expensive right? I really don't do that much that requires crimping of that sort. Hopefully I could find some one that has one to use.


"irreversible compression splice" necessarily involves something to do the compressing. Yes, you'd have to buy some kind of crimp tool. Maybe you already own a #6 or #4 cadweld mold? You'd have to buy that if you go that route, and they ain't exactly cheap either. Maybe your supply house rents an MD6?


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## Mshea (Jan 17, 2011)

6 shooter said:


> Trouble is you have to by the crimp tool right? If im not mistaken they are expensive right? I really don't do that much that requires crimping of that sort. Hopefully I could find some one that has one to use.


Here the local wholesale outlets often will lend or rent you the tool.

Hypress or thermit weld


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## 6 shooter (Feb 4, 2008)

Mshea said:


> Here the local wholesale outlets often will lend or rent you the tool.
> 
> Hypress or thermit weld


I did ask them awhile back and they use to lend them out but don't anymore. I only have a account at one wholesale house but could ask others if they do rent them out. The tool always seemed to disappear they said.


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## Hmacanada (Jan 16, 2014)

I have bought three pairs of Blackburn type crimpers at pawn shops in the states for no more than sixty bucks. 800 bucks here new ,by the time you get the dies you need.
Found a pair at a antique shop once to. Paid thirty buck for them and give them to another electrician friend of mine.
Spent 4 or five years trying to get a pair cheap, then find them all over the place.


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## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

I'm confused.

I thought only ONE GEC had to be constant, unspliced (or irreversible so)

unfuzz me plz

~CS~


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## 6 shooter (Feb 4, 2008)

There is one ground rod and a wire to that to panel. Then there is a wire to the water pipe. Actually it is a well. Its a older well with the metal suction pipe in the ground. Normally its poly pipe and I would not even bother trying to get gec back to that.


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## gnuuser (Jan 13, 2013)

chicken steve said:


> I'm confused.
> 
> I thought only ONE GEC had to be constant, unspliced (or irreversible so)
> 
> ...


thats the way it is in my area too even if you have to use 2 ground rods it still has to be one piece


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## manchestersparky (Mar 25, 2007)

chicken steve said:


> I'm confused.
> 
> I thought only ONE GEC had to be constant, unspliced (or irreversible so)
> 
> ...


The code does not specify that only one must be continuous. The code uses the term "conductor(s)" leading one down the path of all Grounding Electrode Conductors must be continuous .

_250.64(C)_
_Continuous. Grounding electrode conductor(s) shall be installed in one continuous length without a splice or joint except as permitted in (1) and (2):_

_(1) splicing shall be permitted only by irreversible compression-type connectors listed as grounding and bonding equipment or by exothermic welding process_
_(2) sections of busbar shall be permitted to be connected together to form a grounding electrode conductor_


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## BuzzKill (Oct 27, 2008)

Is there a crimp tool for #6?


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## robnj772 (Jan 15, 2008)

BuzzKill said:


> Is there a crimp tool for #6?


Of course there is.

There is a crimp tool for every size wire there is.


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## BuzzKill (Oct 27, 2008)

robnj772 said:


> Of course there is.
> 
> There is a crimp tool for every size wire there is.


Well duh, I'm hoping someone looks it up for me cause I'm lazy.


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## Hmacanada (Jan 16, 2014)

I use these crimpers. You can get all kinds of different size dies for them. These are on eBay for 35 bucks


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## Southeast Power (Jan 18, 2009)

BuzzKill said:


> Is there a crimp tool for #6?


Burndy has an insulated butt splice that works nice.

insulink


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## 6 shooter (Feb 4, 2008)

jrannis said:


> Burndy has an insulated butt splice that works nice.
> 
> insulink


Does that one require the tool to crimp?


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## Nom Deplume (Jul 21, 2013)

Cadweld now makes a one shot mold for splicing wires.
I'm not sure what they cost but the one shots for ground rods are about $6. 

https://www.erico.com/products/E1145WB06.asp

See page 22 bottom of page. 
https://www.erico.com/public/library/fep/LT0355.pdf


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## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

manchestersparky said:


> The code does not specify that only one must be continuous. The code uses the term "conductor(s)" leading one down the path of all Grounding Electrode Conductors must be continuous .
> 
> _250.64(C)_
> _*Continuous.* Grounding electrode conductor(s) shall be installed in one continuous length without a splice or joint except as permitted in (1) and (2):_
> ...


Thanks Mspark.....so it would appear that in lieu of _proper _toolage , validated via low useage, that small change EC's like myself will be mired focusing on the term _continuous_

~CS~


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## Dennis Alwon (May 9, 2009)

gnuuser said:


> thats the way it is in my area too even if you have to use 2 ground rods it still has to be one piece


You can go to the first rod unspliced but the second rod is a bonding jumper between the rods. I do it unspliced but it does not have to be done that way


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## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

Just a thought....now that these are popular i would imagine Mr Kirchoff's electrical theories addressed easier via individual runs....dividing the lightning strike charge?








~CS~


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## Dennis Alwon (May 9, 2009)

chicken steve said:


> Just a thought....now that these are popular i would imagine Mr Kirchoff's electrical theories addressed easier via individual runs....dividing the lightning strike charge?




That is only for the intersystem bonding. The smaller wires are connected to the utility systems and are not grounding electrode conductor's . Around here the cable company will not use them instead they use the split bolts as they always have done. Not sure what their problem is with that.


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## chicken steve (Mar 22, 2011)

I stand corrected.... i _think_....:001_huh:, we're _not _to use that for multiple GEC's then Denny?

~CS~


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## Dennis Alwon (May 9, 2009)

chicken steve said:


> I stand corrected.... i _think_....:001_huh:, we're _not _to use that for multiple GEC's then Denny?
> 
> ~CS~


That is not the intended purpose of it and I don't think the terminals are large enough for most grounding electrode conductor's


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## manchestersparky (Mar 25, 2007)

chicken steve said:


> Thanks Mspark.....so it would appear that in lieu of _proper _toolage , validated via low useage, that small change EC's like myself will be mired focusing on the term _continuous_
> 
> ~CS~


I would say that or create a relationship with another electrical contractor who would be willing to let you utilize his crimp tool.


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## 6 shooter (Feb 4, 2008)

I ordered up those yellow crimpers in the case that HMACANADA posted. I'll give them ago. Beats spending a fortune for something used for me ever once and awhile.


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## Ultrafault (Dec 16, 2012)

Many blackburn h taps, c taps, and butt splices are not rated for copper to copper connections. I don't know about burndy connectors because I am not made of money.


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## RIVETER (Sep 26, 2009)

6 shooter said:


> Would a short section of a grounding buss, the ones used for a grounding bars in say a sq d home line or qo panel satisfy 250.64c2 for a splice.
> 
> Copper thieves came in cut the 6 bare ground where it goes into a finished part of the basement and need to splice it back to the panel.


I hear that copper thieves leave in "gettaway cars" they would never take the BUSS.


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## MWayne (Nov 8, 2010)

6 shooter said:


> I ordered up those yellow crimpers in the case that HMACANADA posted. I'll give them ago. Beats spending a fortune for something used for me ever once and awhile.


Let us know how they work, what kind of quality, etc.


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## sparky402 (Oct 15, 2013)

I bought those yellow hydraulic crimpers just for this purpose. Ive used them a couple times and they work pretty good. For some reason i dont think the jaw opens up very big though


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## T&K (Jun 18, 2012)

chicken steve said:


> Just a thought....now that these are popular i would imagine Mr Kirchoff's electrical theories addressed easier via individual runs....dividing the lightning strike charge?
> 
> ~CS~


I use an Arlington brand. They have multiple ports large enough for up to #4 bare. I have been told by one inspector that he approves the GEC to land here, and another jumper to the meter (I had the same problem with a UFER ground being short) then had another inspector tell me it was not an approved method. I agree with the later of the two.


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## 6 shooter (Feb 4, 2008)

MWayne said:


> Let us know how they work, what kind of quality, etc.


Yep. I used it the other day. Worked perfect for what I needed it to do.


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## dvpvic (Jul 23, 2021)

6 shooter said:


> Yep. I used it the other day. Worked perfect for what I needed it to do.


Ordered that same tool? What specific crimp c taps do you used with that tool?


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