# What do you think of Drywallers?



## curranelectric (Aug 7, 2007)

I don't know how many times I've do a remodel I come back to install the plugs and switches and find that the Drywallers have made a mess of them. I did one about 2 weeks ago and 90% of them I had to get all the mud and paint out of them to only find out that they have cut the insulation of the wires with there rotozip. 








I got on the internet and found this item. 

http://www.thewireguard.com/Main.Aspx

















Looks good to me so I ordered some and going to try them out.
Can't hurt.


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## MDShunk (Jan 7, 2007)

Those WireGaurd's would solve the problem, but I'm not sure I really want to go to the expense to stop something that shouldn't be happening in the first place. I can deal with a couple, but more than just a very few, and you start getting into change orders and back charges. That's the only way they'll learn. That, and plenty of pictures of the damage for CYA. In your pic, it looks like they boogered the box up pretty good too. I've had them where the first 3/4" of box was ground down paper thin.


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## Dayne (Mar 17, 2007)

Yea, the drywall man. We've all fallen victim to him at least once. I've learned how to fold and tuck my joints so far in the box there's no way possible the guy could hit my wires. That metal plate looks like a nifty idea though. 

Last drywaller I worked with tried to play electrician to save the HO some cash. Hung a fan and drove one of the bracket screws right through the romex, which btw he didn't strip back all the way. He called me telling me the fan was shorting out.......


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## curranelectric (Aug 7, 2007)

That picture was off there website. I've had that happen to me too. One time they cutoff the screw hole on 5 boxes and I had to replace them with new box in at the owner expense. Now if he billed the drywall guys I don't know. It seems to be getting worst out here. Not to be mean but It seems like anybody can do drywall. I had it happen just a couple of weeks ago the guy cut the hole for a box and left a slot about 2 in off one side where he messed the box and didn't even fill. They just painted over it. I told the customer and he said he will fix it. That is not right.


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## Nosparxsse (Aug 12, 2007)

I have found that the only way to prevent this (without spending any money) 
try this.
1. Take the butt end of your hammer and push the wires back into the box....farther back...hence.... less likely to be cut
2. Low voltage---if u are using regular plasic boxes, cut little squares ot of cardboard and stuff it into box to keep wires back. (there is always plenty of cardboard on a jobsite.) we used to do this before starting to use low volt rings.
3. Talk to the general on the job.
4. If this fails, stop in and talk to hangers.........if u inform them this will be a $$$$$ to be taken off of their check----before they get it, they are more likely to be more careful.
5. Put a little voltage in random places!!!!!!!  that will fry a couple of router bits and maybee they will stop!!
Just kidding on the last one.............That is not safe for everyone else........
You are better off having a good relationship with other contractors on site. The better you all understand each other the less likely problems will happen. and when they do, they will be resolved faster.. Most jobs I am on it is an ongoing joke to the drywall guys...........I will call the main guy and tell him "Hey you gotta come here and see this , man, I just had to cut this humogous hole in your wall!!!:laughing: :laughing: It is more fun to joke around about stuff that doesn't happen than to worry about silly mistakes that can usually be fixed with a little PR with the drywall guys............:thumbup: and if you do have to fix something for them or them for you, It all usually works out.


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## MDShunk (Jan 7, 2007)

By the time I get there to finish, the drywall guy is just another unknown crew that came before me. I nearly never know who the other subs were on the job, particularly in resi, unless they happen to be there the same time as me. This never happens in resi.


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## Nosparxsse (Aug 12, 2007)

MDShunk said:


> By the time I get there to finish, the drywall guy is just another unknown crew that came before me. I nearly never know who the other subs were on the job, particularly in resi, unless they happen to be there the same time as me. This never happens in resi.


I guess I have an advantage that some of u don't. Our jobsites are very close nit groups that work together. Usually 3-6 month jobs--3 or 4 houses together. Yeah, there are issues sometimes, but if u follow steps 1-3 like I listed above........ it will avoid some issues:thumbsup:


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## Nosparxsse (Aug 12, 2007)

When I started in this trade, about 10 years ago, we had a drywaller that kept doing this. We used the hammer trick and it usually worked. needless to say this guy didn't last long...............word got out in area and people quit using him because he cost them more. Other electricians and gen contractors around, learned the hard way.


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## GregS (May 22, 2007)

I still say 3M Tuck Tape.

Stuff your wires back, tape over the box. That will save getting mud in them. May not help entirely with a Rotozip though.

I use Tuck Tape on vac inlets so they are less likely to fill up with 'stuff'.


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## MDShunk (Jan 7, 2007)

GregS said:


> I still say 3M Tuck Tape.


This just dawned on me...

How do you get a ruff inspection with Tuck Tape or Wire Gaurd's on all the boxes?


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## GregS (May 22, 2007)

MDShunk said:


> How do you get a ruff inspection with Tuck Tape or Wire Gaurd's on all the boxes?


Good point.. Rough-inspection comes prior to drywall doesn't it? I guess that's a second trip.

Doesn't affect my stuff, but chances are if my stuff gets cut, the electricians are getting cut too.


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## macmikeman (Jan 23, 2007)

I use a different hammer trick to stymie rotozip cutting into my wiring. It involves the metal end and the finished walls. Wanna guess what it is????


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## JohnJ0906 (Jan 22, 2007)

I've certainly been hit many times. I wish they would leave the guard on the roto-zip. There is no effin way that they need 2" of blade.

Are those wire guard things going to be required under 2008 NEC? For some reason, I seem to recall hearing something about that. Maybe that's why I seem to see ads for them all the time now.


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## Dayne (Mar 17, 2007)

macmikeman said:


> I use a different hammer trick to stymie rotozip cutting into my wiring. It involves the metal end and the finished walls. Wanna guess what it is????



Hahahaha, classic.


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## frank (Feb 6, 2007)

*What do you think of Drywallers?* 



Same as I think of decorators. Drywallers/Plasterers will cut it short or box it in. Decorators will change its colour and leave you to scrape it clean.


Frank


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## Gummi Bear (Aug 2, 2007)

I don't do much residential. When I do, however, I closely coordinate with the drywaller to prevent this. It's happened, and we had a 'Come-to-Jesus' meeting about it. Haven't had it happen since.

In most of the commercial and industrial work that I do, it's simply not an issue. The level of professionalism, and pride in craftsmanship is much higher. It's rare anymore to have that happen. Usually, they'll cut their holes before hanging the sheet.


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## sparkysteve (Jan 23, 2007)

A few years ago I started folding my joints instead of rolling them. If you get cut, it's only on the end. I also tuck them in real good. With phone/cable, I knock holes in the top and bottom of the box, feed the wire through, and put a loose staple or two below the box to hold the tail end. In the finish, you just pull your wire into the box and terminate. No cut wires.


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## GregS (May 22, 2007)

sparkysteve said:


> With phone/cable, I knock holes in the top and bottom of the box, feed the wire through, and put a loose staple or two below the box to hold the tail end.


Ugh, I hate it when crews use electrical boxes for phone/network. Somehow the sheath always gets cut on the box edge and sometimes the conductor sheath also gets cut. I had one like that today.

Use Caddies. They can work in a simular way you mention. However I loop the cable up, squeeze the middle of the loop, wedge it between the U's and zip tie the bottom of the bundle. When it comes for termination just snip the zip and you have a nice bundle of cable to pull out. It's also back far enough that the RotoZip won't hit it.


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## MDShunk (Jan 7, 2007)

GregS said:


> Ugh, I hate it when crews use electrical boxes for phone/network.


I used to use regular wall boxes, in the manner described. With the number of cables to each plate location growing, I've started to use nail-on low voltage rings from Arlington: http://www.aifittings.com/l_4a.htm


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## GregS (May 22, 2007)

I was considering moving to Arlington, found the local supplier and everything, but then I went in to modify a rough-in for a house that was done in Arlington brackets last week. Didn't like what I saw.. cat3 pulled through the plastic loop and then tied in a knot. I'd definately loop it and zip tie to the plastic.

Also, I had to move a couple of locations.. and damnit, nail on brackets are a pain to move! I guess that's what I like about Caddies and #8 screws. Easy to move.


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## joebell (Sep 1, 2007)

Years ago when I was doing residential we were wiring my bosses brother-in laws house. The knuckle head drywaller broke all his roto zip bits so he decided to get a drill bit out of his truck and finish the job. Needless to say I don't think he missed 1 wire. What a mess.


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## GregS (May 22, 2007)

Here's a quick pic of what I do for low-vo using caddies.

So far so good for not getting nipped.


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## mclovin (Feb 22, 2011)

all we do is push the wires as far back as we can and we also leave safety loops at all our boxes, all it is, is a 3-4 inch loop of wire outside the box where the romex enters.


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## Shockdoc (Mar 4, 2010)

I haven't had that problem lately,the cheap hack flip guys are using knives and saws to cut boxes. Sometimes i wonder if they graduated kindergarten since they cut square holes for round boxes.


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## kevmanTA (Jul 20, 2010)

Those drywall savers would be great.. But the last guys I worked with would probably just board over the box.. We're on number 7 on cutting out buried switches/plugs.


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## RyanB (Jul 14, 2009)

That's the cable for temporary power. It was aluminum and was flattened where the wheels drove over it. I came downstairs and caught him in the act.

The same guy used the scissor lift to smash down part of a concrete wall.


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## sarness (Sep 14, 2010)

GregS said:


> Also, I had to move a couple of locations.. and damnit, nail on brackets are a pain to move! I guess that's what I like about Caddies and #8 screws. Easy to move.


Holy reserected thread!

I hate those, get my hands cut up on the screws all the time and its hard to make those tight.

I use a MPLS1, much nicer, till my supply house stopped carrying them!


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## leland (Dec 28, 2007)

curranelectric said:


> I don't know how many times I've do a remodel I come back to install the plugs and switches and find that the Drywallers have made a mess of them. I did one about 2 weeks ago and 90% of them I had to get all the mud and paint out of them to only find out that they have cut the insulation of the wires with there rotozip.
> View attachment 241
> 
> 
> ...



Way too much money. How many boxes-what size- how many projects---
Do the math Dude!

Get the French Canadians in there. They are top notch!!!

Don't mess with the rookies. (ya get what ya pay for. In every trade)

Few problems! :thumbsup:


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## farlsincharge (Dec 31, 2010)

kevmanTA said:


> Those drywall savers would be great.. But the last guys I worked with would probably just board over the box.. We're on number 7 on cutting out buried switches/plugs.


I'll find and cut out 3, after that...









I've had drywall guys that were blown away when I showed them that their guns had a tool to pierce the tubes of acoustical, and that they no longer had to use our wires.


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

curranelectric said:


> I don't know how many times I've do a remodel I come back to install the plugs and switches and find that the Drywallers have made a mess of them. I did one about 2 weeks ago and 90% of them I had to get all the mud and paint out of them to only find out that they have cut the insulation of the wires with there rotozip.
> View attachment 241
> 
> 
> ...


Your problem is caused by the Carlon blue box.:whistling2:


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

480sparky said:


> Your problem is caused by the Carlon blue box.:whistling2:


Gee ken it only took you 3 years 7 months 7 hours 11 minutes to respond.

You need to pick up the pace....:laughing::laughing:


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

HARRY304E said:


> Gee ken it only took you 3 years 7 months 7 hours 23 minutes to respond.
> 
> You need to pick up the pace....:laughing::laughing:



Sorry. I gotta keep hauling cars out of my front yard.


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

480sparky said:


> Sorry. I gotta keep hauling cars out of my front yard.


You need to put up a good fence..:whistling2:


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## 480sparky (Sep 20, 2007)

HARRY304E said:


> You need to put up a good fence..:whistling2:



Nah... too cheesy. 








Besides, I lost my map and may dig up some of the PVC boxes buried out there.


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

480sparky said:


> Nah... too cheesy.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


That will work...:thumbup::laughing:


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## keithbussanich (Apr 3, 2011)

dealt with a drywaller once who thought he could read blueprints tried to precut the drywall for the boxes but didnt know what the "AFF" stood for


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## keithbussanich (Apr 3, 2011)

in a nutshell i think they are mud slinging monkeys


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## pjmurph2002 (Sep 18, 2009)

We worked for 1 GC doing the electric 90% of the time. He used the same drywallers on every job. They were constantly filling our boxes with mud. We asked the boss (only one that spoke english) to speak with his men about the issue. Nothing changed. We began to rip the mud out of the boxes, and pulled any tape that was part of the seam along the side of the boxes. The drywaller soon changed his tune.


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## Josue (Apr 25, 2010)




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## thegoldenboy (Aug 15, 2010)

Well since this thread is active again, I'll chirp in.

I play hockey with two guys that own their own drywall businesses.

Never worked with them but I told them how I find buried boxes and they said they would kill me if I did that to them, sad thing is that I don't think they were joking. 

My only bad experiences with drywallers have been the ones that weren't exactly, uh what we could call professionals. 

One kitchen remodel we did, the professionals we were working with hadn't touched one wall yet and we asked what size rock they were putting up and they told us one layer of 1/2". We do our thing, leave and go back to do the finish only to find another layer of 5/8" over the 1/2".


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## keithbussanich (Apr 3, 2011)

thegoldenboy said:


> Never worked with them but I told them how I find buried boxes and they said they would kill me if I did that to them, sad thing is that I don't think they were joking.


see how angry and disgruntled ALL sheetrockers are


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## thegoldenboy (Aug 15, 2010)

keithbussanich said:


> see how angry and disgruntled ALL sheetrockers are


It's got to be a French Canadian thing.


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## chewy (May 9, 2010)

Is there any particular reason the box holes arent cut in the sheets before theyre glued and screwed? They do that here, measure the sheet and cut to size and cut any box holes while theyre at it, dosent seem econimical time wise to go around again with a router cutting out holes.


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## d-fi (Feb 21, 2011)

chewy said:


> Is there any particular reason the box holes arent cut in the sheets before theyre glued and screwed? They do that here, measure the sheet and cut to size and cut any box holes while theyre at it, dosent seem econimical time wise to go around again with a router cutting out holes.


Drywallers we deal with are pretty good, they precut their holes. Occasionally we get a buried box but thats an easy fix with the long level trick; usually . The hacks seem to be the ones rotozipping holes as they go. Thankfully most of the builders we work for have found decent drywallers and don't just go for the cheapest guys.


Heard a decent joke about Drywallers today,

"Why are drywallers so fast?"




















"because they spent 9 months dodging a coathanger"


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## piperunner (Aug 22, 2009)

Well you asked honestly i hate dry wallers !!:thumbup:


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## sparkymcwiresalot (Jan 29, 2011)

Drywallers are the go to guys on any jobsite.....
If you need some coke.


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