# IBEW Apprenticeship Test



## clockworkmike83 (Dec 1, 2011)

Hey guys ,new here and just got a few simple questions.

I've been a licensed Journeyman Electrician for over 10 years now and recently I was given an offer letter in the mail to appear before the local IBEW and take an Apprenticeship Test. I would really like to join the IBEW and have talked with them prior but never had a chance to join. I was just wondering what the test involves, would I have to suffer through the apprenticeship program despite having over 10 years documented experience, etc. Any info would be appreciated! Thanks


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## HARRY304E (Sep 15, 2010)

clockworkmike83 said:


> Hey guys ,new here and just got a few simple questions.
> 
> I've been a licensed Journeyman Electrician for over 10 years now and recently I was given an offer letter in the mail to appear before the local IBEW and take an Apprenticeship Test. I would really like to join the IBEW and have talked with them prior but never had a chance to join. I was just wondering what the test involves, would I have to suffer through the apprenticeship program despite having over 10 years documented experience, etc. Any info would be appreciated! Thanks


Well mike in my opinion if you are going to have to start over and do the whole Apprenticeship all over again it would not be worth it.

Will they let you hold your journeyman license?, Or will they make you surrender it to the state so you will be just an apprentice? 

Can you afford the pay cut?

Find out if they will recognize your Journeyman license and take you on as a journeyman Electrician otherwise i would not do it.

You worked way to hard to become a Journeyman Electrician why would you want to give that up if there is no guarantee that you will be able to finish the apprenticeship in a timely manner .


Welcome to the forum enjoy the fun and games..:thumbup::thumbup:


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## clockworkmike83 (Dec 1, 2011)

*Thanks*

Well when I talked to the people at the local, they said if I could prove I had 6000hrs experience, I could get an interview regardless pass/fail on the test and could be eligible to retain my status without going through the apprenticeship program. However, once I provided all my documents (which included my VOTECH certificate, High School Transcripts with passing grades, WV Journeyman's Card, Specialty Licenses and W-2s proving over 18000hrs), they began sort of back-pedaling I felt. The woman started giving me flack saying "Well you don't have proof of your hours exactly here, we want specific hours per job". As I informed her, over 10 years there is no possible realistic way I could document the hours per job ( as time had elapsed too long) but the payscale I had matched the hours perfectly in the W-2s, proving my experience. They still gave me a lot of grief over it and I'm very leery of their intentions.

I would love to join the IBEW for the sheer fact of SOME sense of job security,benefits and stability ( I have none where I am now). But I'm not going to willfully hand over everything I've worked hard to establish. If they are willing to play ball and treat me fairly, I am MORE than willing to give them 115%. I'm not trying to offend anyone with this, but quite frankly, no one in the apprenticeship program in ANY state is going to know more than me at this point. By no means am I trying to sound arrogant ( I am anything but that) , but you can't replace 10 years On the Job Training and experience with a 6 year school apprentice, I'm sorry. Their actions however, would seem to want to disagree with me and I will disagree with them.


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## Mr Rewire (Jan 15, 2011)

clockworkmike83 said:


> Well when I talked to the people at the local, they said if I could prove I had 6000hrs experience, I could get an interview regardless pass/fail on the test and could be eligible to retain my status without going through the apprenticeship program. However, once I provided all my documents (which included my VOTECH certificate, High School Transcripts with passing grades, WV Journeyman's Card, Specialty Licenses and W-2s proving over 18000hrs), they began sort of back-pedaling I felt. The woman started giving me flack saying "Well you don't have proof of your hours exactly here, we want specific hours per job". As I informed her, over 10 years there is no possible realistic way I could document the hours per job ( as time had elapsed too long) but the payscale I had matched the hours perfectly in the W-2s, proving my experience. They still gave me a lot of grief over it and I'm very leery of their intentions.
> 
> I would love to join the IBEW for the sheer fact of SOME sense of job security,benefits and stability ( I have none where I am now). But I'm not going to willfully hand over everything I've worked hard to establish. If they are willing to play ball and treat me fairly, I am MORE than willing to give them 115%. I'm not trying to offend anyone with this, but quite frankly, no one in the apprenticeship program in ANY state is going to know more than me at this point. By no means am I trying to sound arrogant ( I am anything but that) , but you can't replace 10 years On the Job Training and experience with a 6 year school apprentice, I'm sorry. Their actions however, would seem to want to disagree with me and I will disagree with them.


 Sounds like this is not going to be a good fit for you. I had 15 years in the trade when I approached the union I was willing to start at day one simply because I had my eye on the prize and that was full JW scale with benefits. Where will you be in six years?


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## clockworkmike83 (Dec 1, 2011)

Mr Rewire said:


> Sounds like this is not going to be a good fit for you. I had 15 years in the trade when I approached the union I was willing to start at day one simply because I had my eye on the prize and that was full JW scale with benefits. Where will you be in six years?


Well wait just a second. You said they offered you the full pay grade correct? Then yeah, how's that any different than what I'm saying? That's all I want, to be paid and treated fairly according to the background experience. To suggest I should start from ground zero at a level 1 apprentice is just idiotic to put it kindly. That's equating me with any bum off the street with zero experience and that's a complete offense to me. All I want is the fair treatment I deserve. To suggest I should start ALL over again would be saying what I have accomplished, learned and executed over the years was a complete washout and I'm no better than a guy who just started.

What I neglected to mention here is the fact that while I've been a licensed electrician for over 10 years, I've been doing this since I was 11, so that makes it closer to 17 years ( despite the legality of my work, child labor and all) I was working residential and commercially before most people even learned how to wire a light-switch ( thanks to a dad who took advantage of an easy labor lol). By the time I was 19, I was already a lead man and by 21 I was a full-blown foreman ( however, a WORKING foreman, not the guy who stands by the print table harking orders, the one who is actually DOING the work)


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## Mr Rewire (Jan 15, 2011)

clockworkmike83 said:


> Well wait just a second. You said they offered you the full pay grade correct? Then yeah, how's that any different than what I'm saying? That's all I want, to be paid and treated fairly according to the background experience. To suggest I should start from ground zero at a level 1 apprentice is just idiotic to put it kindly. That's equating me with any bum off the street with zero experience and that's a complete offense to me. All I want is the fair treatment I deserve. To suggest I should start ALL over again would be saying what I have accomplished, learned and executed over the years was a complete washout and I'm no better than a guy who just started.
> 
> What I neglected to mention here is the fact that while I've been a licensed electrician for over 10 years, I've been doing this since I was 11, so that makes it closer to 17 years ( despite the legality of my work, child labor and all) I was working residential and commercially before most people even learned how to wire a light-switch ( thanks to a dad who took advantage of an easy labor lol). By the time I was 19, I was already a lead man and by 21 I was a full-blown foreman ( however, a WORKING foreman, not the guy who stands by the print table harking orders, the one who is actually DOING the work)


 Like i said this will probably not be a good fit for you. they didn't offer me JW to start I interviewed for the apprentiship program because even after 15 years I knew I could still learn something and what the goal was is to be an IBEW A ticket. I don't think this is what you want because you are putting alot of effort into not getting it.


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## FireInTheWire (Oct 30, 2011)

Wow. That is bull that they would give you grief if you've been licensed for over 10 years. 

I can understand if they wanted you to take some Journey-level con-ed classes at the JATC or something like that, but doing the whole apprenticeship again... hmmm.... It doesn't make sense. 

The apprenticeship test is EASY. Reading comprehension and Algebra, with some linear algebra mixed in. It's multiple choice, and if you go to the NJATC.org site they should have some sample questions.

Good luck... and hope you get some straight answers out of the union people.


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## clockworkmike83 (Dec 1, 2011)

FireInTheWire said:


> Wow. That is bull that they would give you grief if you've been licensed for over 10 years.
> 
> I can understand if they wanted you to take some Journey-level con-ed classes at the JATC or something like that, but doing the whole apprenticeship again... hmmm.... It doesn't make sense.
> 
> ...



Hey man thanks! I appreciate that alot. You and maybe one other person here has been cool enough to give me a straight answer without sounding like some pompus-jerk. So for that? Thank you for real man! Yeah I just want to try to do better for myself you know? I've been at this on-the-books, since the day I got out of high school and now that I got a wife and am trying to start a family? I just want some sense of security and am I looking into the long-term, with benefits. 

Unfortunately, where I am now? I got nothing. We have no medical, no retirement, no bonuses, no paid holidays, no sick-days. It's basically work without any perks. And to make matters worse? You are often left to fend for yourself; if you ask for material? It's either stuff the shop has laying around ,where you have to piece it together to make it work or often you just don't get what you need. You also find yourself working alone on jobs where it easily should have 3-5 people ( which is really unsafe and frustrating.) What's bad about all of this though? Is I have NEVER had a job go over schedule. It's usually the opposite, finishing AHEAD of schedule. How this happens? I have no idea. I guess you're just working yourself to death with spit-and-chewing gum for parts, often Macguyvering things , which is terrible to say lol


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## clockworkmike83 (Dec 1, 2011)

HARRY304E said:


> Well mike in my opinion if you are going to have to start over and do the whole Apprenticeship all over again it would not be worth it.
> 
> Will they let you hold your journeyman license?, Or will they make you surrender it to the state so you will be just an apprentice?
> 
> ...


Thank you by the way for the information and straight answers my friend! I sincerely appreciate that. I will do my best in trying to get in the IBEW and as I said, if the treatment is fair? They get 115% out of me, nothing less. 

By the way, noticed the Massachusetts on your name : Go pats!


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## FireInTheWire (Oct 30, 2011)

clockworkmike83 said:


> Hey man thanks! I appreciate that alot. You and maybe one other person here has been cool enough to give me a straight answer without sounding like some pompus-jerk. So for that? Thank you for real man! Yeah I just want to try to do better for myself you know? I've been at this on-the-books, since the day I got out of high school and now that I got a wife and am trying to start a family? I just want some sense of security and am I looking into the long-term, with benefits.
> 
> Unfortunately, where I am now? I got nothing. We have no medical, no retirement, no bonuses, no paid holidays, no sick-days. It's basically work without any perks. And to make matters worse? You are often left to fend for yourself; if you ask for material? It's either stuff the shop has laying around ,where you have to piece it together to make it work or often you just don't get what you need. You also find yourself working alone on jobs where it easily should have 3-5 people ( which is really unsafe and frustrating.) What's bad about all of this though? Is I have NEVER had a job go over schedule. It's usually the opposite, finishing AHEAD of schedule. How this happens? I have no idea. I guess you're just working yourself to death with spit-and-chewing gum for parts, often Macguyvering things , which is terrible to say lol


Thanks for that. I've been union from my first day on any electrical jobsite, so I don't know what it's like to join after having been out of the union. BUT... I do know there is always someone in these offices that HAS to power trip. One time someone told me I was not accepted into the apprenticeship, right after I got off the phone with the training director when he told me I was in!!!! (I'm in  )

If you have been talking to front-office personnel, perhaps it's time to try and find contact information for the union rep if you haven't already done so. The people in the office do a great job with their office administration, etc, but I feel like sometimes to get a straight answer about this stuff you have to go in for the kill. Maybe even contact the JATC's training director too.

Keep us posted!!! Good luck!!!


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## Pompadour (Mar 19, 2011)

you proved 18,000 hours and they still want you to go through the apprenticeship? well, that just plain sucks. my experience was totally different.

i joined the union 13 years ago-ish, when times were good. i was organized as a "book 3" journeyman. i do not think "book 3" exists any more. anyways, i had to stay "book 3" until i had 7 years total, and then took a "journeyman upgrade" test. at that point, i was a JIW or "book 1". i do not thank any of this exists anymore.


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## slickvic277 (Feb 5, 2009)

These dopes play to many games. Hey, were to good for you, were so special that we have 5% of the market share. That's right, we're exclusive! morons.


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## knowshorts (Jan 9, 2009)

Tell them you want to enter as a book 1 JW. Not an apprentice, not an IJ, not a CE, and not a CW. No ifs, ands, or butts. If they don't like it, walk away. Go find a contractor who will give you whhat you want or start your own business.


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## local 532 (Dec 5, 2011)

Mike, The apprenticship is going to test you on simple things like conduit bending... they will probably give you a small written test also. This is just an apptitude test. They will not start you at ground zero. Get your hours properly documented before you go to your test. The IBEW has different classifications. Construction Electrician, Construction Wireman, Journeyman Wireman. They in no way whatsoever they would start you as a first year apprentice if you have ten years experience. My name is Kelly Stolp, Im the orgainzer for local 532 IBEW billings montana, Please feel free to email me at [email protected]. Ill be happy to put you in contact with the IBEW in your area and get you to talk to real people. There are some good people in these forums, but your going to hear some real stupid advice also. Going union was the best career decision I ever made.


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