# breaking seal offs, pouring



## don_resqcapt19 (Jul 18, 2010)

I use 1.5 hours just for an original install and pouring of a seal...less if there are a number of them in close proximity to each other.

If the seals are in the middle of a run, that is an location where you cannot remove the conduit on one side of the seal, you will have to add unions and rework the conduit. If you have to do this, then I would just cut the conduit on the side that has to be reworked and spin the seals off the other conduit.


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## RIVETER (Sep 26, 2009)

te12co2w said:


> I am pricing a job that will require me to break off two 1" vertical seal offs, three 3/4" vertical seal offs, replace the wire and re pour the new seal offs. Class 1 Div 1. I am putting in 7 hours for breaking the seal offs and one hour each for pouring the new ones. I wonder if that is enough time. Has anyone done this? How long does it take to break a seal off? I know the few times I have poured these, it always takes me more time than I expected. I hope to use a grinder to split the seal offs and then break them with two small sledges. Anyone use Chico Speed seal? It looks like it could save some time. Not cheap though. $50 worth might do 2 seals. Thanks


To me, the labor seems adequate. Don't forget to figure in the use of UNYs or UNFs to reinstall. I went back and read post# 2. He has the right idea.


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## varmit (Apr 19, 2009)

I would figure some rework to the conduit. Depending on how carried away someone was pouring the seals originally, it could be impossible to unscrew either end of the seal. If you are considering the epoxy(?) premixed sealing mixture, I do not like it. After the epoxy is activated you must use it quickly. It also seems to overfill the seal off and make a mess. The regular Chico only takes a few seconds more to mix and is easier to control the amount used. A long plastic funnel that the spout will fit in a 3/4" hole is a great help.


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## glen1971 (Oct 10, 2012)

If you are repulling the conductors, why not just cut through the centers of the seals and avoid trying to bust them with two hammers? Depending on the layout, you may have to modify the conduit to allow for UNYs.. Is using a split seal an option? 

Also, not sure if it would help, but in lots of cases area classification seals were installed and are no longer required, such as when a whole area is reclassified to Class 1 Div 2.. Are yours still needed? If not a Condulet C would save a ton of time...


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## Southeast Power (Jan 18, 2009)

1/2 the time, they are poured very thin or not at all.
Most of the time, I can break out the Chico with a screwdriver.
If I can't do that I drill them out 
last resort, cut and use a union and a nipple on one side.


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## hardworkingstiff (Jan 22, 2007)

I'm curious as to how you wound up with 3 3/4" sealoffs. Usually the conduit is sealed at both ends, and if you are pulling new wire, the number of seals wind up being an even number.


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## Southeast Power (Jan 18, 2009)

hardworkingstiff said:


> I'm curious as to how you wound up with 3 3/4" sealoffs. Usually the conduit is sealed at both ends, and if you are pulling new wire, the number of seals wind up being an even number.


Maybe he is just working on one side but, maybe he should find that fourth one. :whistling2:


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## wendon (Sep 27, 2010)

I don't know if anyone else does this but I use those big disposable syringes modified with a piece of 3/8" tubing to pour my sealoffs.


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## don_resqcapt19 (Jul 18, 2010)

hardworkingstiff said:


> I'm curious as to how you wound up with 3 3/4" sealoffs. Usually the conduit is sealed at both ends, and if you are pulling new wire, the number of seals wind up being an even number.


Very few of the conduit runs I install have more than one seal. Most just have the boundary seal. It is Class I, Division 2 area, and we have very few items in the field that require a seal.


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## Jlarson (Jun 28, 2009)

I'm pretty good at slicing them with the grinder. I get as close to threads as possible then I slam a 3/4" cold chisel in. Same way I get stuck gal and black iron apart.


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## five.five-six (Apr 9, 2013)

Jlarson said:


> Same way I get stuck gal and black iron apart.


Are you a plumber?


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## don_resqcapt19 (Jul 18, 2010)

Jlarson said:


> I'm pretty good at slicing them with the grinder. I get as close to threads as possible then I slam a 3/4" cold chisel in. Same way I get stuck gal and black iron apart.


I have done that where I needed to save the wire, but used a hacksaw for the cut as the seal was in the classified area.

The OP said that the wire was to be replaced, so I would not take the time to split the seal.


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## hardworkingstiff (Jan 22, 2007)

don_resqcapt19 said:


> Very few of the conduit runs I install have more than one seal. Most just have the boundary seal. It is Class I, Division 2 area, and we have very few items in the field that require a seal.


I mostly worked on gas stations and bulk plants. Kind of hard to get out of the classified areas with one stick of conduit in those locations.


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## te12co2w (Jun 3, 2007)

don_resqcapt19 said:


> I use 1.5 hours just for an original install and pouring of a seal...less if there are a number of them in close proximity to each other.
> 
> If the seals are in the middle of a run, that is an location where you cannot remove the conduit on one side of the seal, you will have to add unions and rework the conduit. If you have to do this, then I would just cut the conduit on the side that has to be reworked and spin the seals off the other conduit.


 I do anticipate some conduit rework. And unions.


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## te12co2w (Jun 3, 2007)

glen1971 said:


> If you are repulling the conductors, why not just cut through the centers of the seals and avoid trying to bust them with two hammers? Depending on the layout, you may have to modify the conduit to allow for UNYs.. Is using a split seal an option?
> 
> Also, not sure if it would help, but in lots of cases area classification seals were installed and are no longer required, such as when a whole area is reclassified to Class 1 Div 2.. Are yours still needed? If not a Condulet C would save a ton of time...


 I guess split seal could be an option. I don't know about reclassification here. This is an above ground storage tank (3 tanks combined as one structure. One for regular gas, one for premium and one for diesel) situation with dispensers. Most of the work will be closest to the diesel dispenser but still within 20' radius of gasoline dispensers.


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## te12co2w (Jun 3, 2007)

jrannis said:


> 1/2 the time, they are poured very thin or not at all.
> Most of the time, I can break out the Chico with a screwdriver.
> If I can't do that I drill them out
> last resort, cut and use a union and a nipple on one side.


 I know they are poured. I don't know how well. If I get the project, I will be checking if I have to remove them or not. I want to put enough time in the bid to replace if needed.


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## te12co2w (Jun 3, 2007)

hardworkingstiff said:


> I'm curious as to how you wound up with 3 3/4" sealoffs. Usually the conduit is sealed at both ends, and if you are pulling new wire, the number of seals wind up being an even number.


 The 3/4" seal offs are on top of the the 3 tanks for remote read level sensors. Veeder Root system. Out of the sensor to the seal off and then to guat for splicing. Then 3/4" grc down to the top of the 1" union. Someone used a re bushing there. I don't know if that bushing is proper or not. Planning on keeping most of that original except for the seal seal off.


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## te12co2w (Jun 3, 2007)

wendon said:


> I don't know if anyone else does this but I use those big disposable syringes modified with a piece of 3/8" tubing to pour my sealoffs.


This sounds like a good idea. Vet syringes? Can you clean them out to use again?


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## te12co2w (Jun 3, 2007)

don_resqcapt19 said:


> I have done that where I needed to save the wire, but used a hacksaw for the cut as the seal was in the classified area.
> 
> The OP said that the wire was to be replaced, so I would not take the time to split the seal.


 I am concerned about using a grinder or sawzall in classified area, but it is outside and in the diesel area so maybe I won't blow myself up.


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## hardworkingstiff (Jan 22, 2007)

te12co2w said:


> The 3/4" seal offs are on top of the the 3 tanks for remote read level sensors. Veeder Root system. Out of the sensor to the seal off and then to guat for splicing. Then 3/4" grc down to the top of the 1" union. Someone used a re bushing there. I don't know if that bushing is proper or not. Planning on keeping most of that original except for the seal seal off.


The V/R probe/sensor circuits are intrinsically safe. I don't install x-proof seals on those, I just use ductseal and have not been turned down for it yet, although I've heard arguments saying that's (ductseal) not approved for the application.


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## don_resqcapt19 (Jul 18, 2010)

te12co2w said:


> The 3/4" seal offs are on top of the the 3 tanks for remote read level sensors. Veeder Root system. Out of the sensor to the seal off and then to guat for splicing. Then 3/4" grc down to the top of the 1" union. Someone used a re bushing there. I don't know if that bushing is proper or not. Planning on keeping most of that original except for the seal seal off.


Hard piped to the instrument without a union? We always would use a union on an installation like that so that the instrument could be replaced if needed without having to break the seal.
REs are fine as long they are of the correct type. Some are not marked or listed for use in classified areas.


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## te12co2w (Jun 3, 2007)

don_resqcapt19 said:


> Hard piped to the instrument without a union? We always would use a union on an installation like that so that the instrument could be replaced if needed without having to break the seal.
> REs are fine as long they are of the correct type. Some are not marked or listed for use in classified areas.


 I don't know now whether it is hard piped without a union there or not. I agree a union would make replacement a lot easier. I hope not to have to get into that end of this project. They did say that they think one of their sensors is bad, but didn't put replacement of that in the job scope. If there isn't a union there and they do need to replace it, maybe we will get an extra out of it.


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## Cow (Jan 16, 2008)

te12co2w said:


> This sounds like a good idea. Vet syringes? Can you clean them out to use again?


I bought a couple of these to use when I needed to fill about 100 sealoffs. I thought I might of needed a spare but the first one did the whole job:

http://www.amazon.com/60-Disposable-Syringe-without-Needle/dp/B0002YFRAM/ref=sr_1_9?ie=UTF8&qid=1390871632&sr=8-9&keywords=50cc+syringe


It almost makes filling sealoffs fun it works so well. I also planned on using a hose on the end but I didn't need one. The syringe squirts it right where you need it and it's easy to clean out between batches of chico.


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## glen1971 (Oct 10, 2012)

Cow said:


> I bought a couple of these to use when I needed to fill about 100 sealoffs. I thought I might of needed a spare but the first one did the whole job:
> 
> http://www.amazon.com/60-Disposable...8&qid=1390871632&sr=8-9&keywords=50cc+syringe
> 
> ...


 
That's all I ever use.. They used to come in SC4 kits, but I never needed them in there.. Cleaning it out when you are done is the key and you can keep re-using it..


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