# Aluminum wiring



## Hotlegs (Oct 9, 2011)

What's some history behind aluminum wiring? What years was it used in residential house wiring ? Do you see much of it in your area?


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## Ty Wrapp (Aug 24, 2011)

I am now in the process of renovating my 1972 era house. It has all aluminum wiring with regular wirenuts. As of yet, I have not found any questionable splices. I am replacing what I can with copper wire. What does not get replaced, I will be using aluminum rated devices and all splices will be with Alumicons. Either the electrician that originally wired the house was very good, or I have been very lucky!


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## RGH (Sep 12, 2011)

late 60's thru late 70's.....rpia.....larger ga's then copper per load spec..so boxs are cramped....antiox splice to copper...or rip it out...


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## Shockdoc (Mar 4, 2010)

I don't see many of those aluminum burn outs anymore, but back in the 80s I saw at least one a week . Mass pigtailing with standard wirenuts was a seller as soon as the customer saw the problem. I kinda miss those days.


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## Shockdoc (Mar 4, 2010)

Hotlegs said:


> What's some history behind aluminum wiring? What years was it used in residential house wiring ? Do you see much of it in your area?


Copper crunch of the 60's starting around 62' brought smaller Al conductors. I saw 10/3 aluminum BX from that era. I believe it ended in 73' for a turn to CU clad. Almost every hi end tract house i have dealt with in that era had AL branch ckts, some had Cu SABCs. A properly spliced aluminum conductor with a properly regulated load poses no danger.


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## Hotlegs (Oct 9, 2011)

What was the cause of the copper crunch in the 60's. Were they not mining as much ?


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## Shockdoc (Mar 4, 2010)

Hotlegs said:


> What was the cause of the copper crunch in the 60's. Were they not mining as much ?


I'll say the war, just like this time around.


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## Hotlegs (Oct 9, 2011)

How long after people starting using it for residential wiring did they realize it was a problem or could be a problem as far as it contracting and expanding enough to cause loose connections on devices that could lead to melting and possible fires? Did manufactures know when they were making it that it was such a poor conductor of electricity ?


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## Shockdoc (Mar 4, 2010)

Hotlegs said:


> How long after people starting using it for residential wiring did they realize it was a problem or could be a problem as far as it contracting and expanding enough to cause loose connections on devices that could lead to melting and possible fires? Did manufactures know when they were making it that it was such a poor conductor of electricity ?


Soon after they realized that the brass device connections and backstabs were failing and starting fires. I know in the last years of it's use pigtailing was mandatory.


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## don_resqcapt19 (Jul 18, 2010)

Shockdoc said:


> Soon after they realized that the brass device connections and backstabs were failing and starting fires. I know in the last years of it's use pigtailing was mandatory.


Who made pigtailing mandatory? 
The device connections were not brass, but brass plated steel. The real issue was the difference in the amount of expansion between the steel and the aluminum.
In late 73 or early 74 a new alloy of aluminum was introduced into the market along with the CO/ALR devices. These devices had aluminum screws and back plates so the expansion was the same as the condutor.


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## Shockdoc (Mar 4, 2010)

don_resqcapt19 said:


> Who made pigtailing mandatory?
> The device connections were not brass, but brass plated steel. The real issue was the difference in the amount of expansion between the steel and the aluminum.
> In late 73 or early 74 a new alloy of aluminum was introduced into the market along with the CO/ALR devices. These devices had aluminum screws and back plates so the expansion was the same as the condutor.


It might have been a builder/EC that wired a community where i worked in multiple houses and seen the progression of straight wired devices on the early 70s, original pigtailed devices on the later house 73ish, cu clad 74 to 78.


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## Shockdoc (Mar 4, 2010)

don_resqcapt19 said:


> Who made pigtailing mandatory?
> The device connections were not brass, but brass plated steel. The real issue was the difference in the amount of expansion between the steel and the aluminum.
> In late 73 or early 74 a new alloy of aluminum was introduced into the market along with the CO/ALR devices. These devices had aluminum screws and back plates so the expansion was the same as the condutor.


You have more experience in the time era than i I've only dealt with the existing systems from 87' on. with all the new technology and devices, why was the smaller Al conductors removed from the code in the following years ? And why was Cu Clad so unpopular that it diminished in the late 70's?


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## Hotlegs (Oct 9, 2011)

When the aluminum wire came out did breaker manufacturers change the way their breakers were made or have to get the current ones listed by UL for use with aluminum? 

Also, do they make a GFCI receptacle listed for use with aluminum wire? The ones on my truck don't say anything about the type of wire they are listed for.


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## RIVETER (Sep 26, 2009)

Hotlegs said:


> What's some history behind aluminum wiring? What years was it used in residential house wiring ? Do you see much of it in your area?


Aluminum is actually a very good conductor of current. It is cheaper than copper to carry the same current. It is, however, not as forgiving as copper is because of its rate of expansion with heat applied. The electricians of the day were not given enough information when they installed it and the rest is history. Aluminum is still good if installed properly.


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## brian john (Mar 11, 2007)

I wired quite a few apartments with #12 and #10 AL, It was a pain to use. 

Used a knife to pencil the conductors insulation no strippers or kleins for stripping.

AL/CU devices, Penetrox (pet rocks as we called it in the 70's)

And the kicker Zinsco panels...


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## Shockdoc (Mar 4, 2010)

Hotlegs said:


> When the aluminum wire came out did breaker manufacturers change the way their breakers were made or have to get the current ones listed by UL for use with aluminum?
> 
> Also, do they make a GFCI receptacle listed for use with aluminum wire? The ones on my truck don't say anything about the type of wire they are listed for.


No GFCI device as far as I know of is AL/CU rated. Only some duplex and toggle versions from what I've come across are AL/CU rated.


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## don_resqcapt19 (Jul 18, 2010)

Shockdoc said:


> You have more experience in the time era than i I've only dealt with the existing systems from 87' on. with all the new technology and devices, why was the smaller Al conductors removed from the code in the following years ? And why was Cu Clad so unpopular that it diminished in the late 70's?


The NEC has never prohibited the use of 15 and 20 amp sized aluminum conductors. The history of the old aluminum wiring made it so that no one really wanted to use aluminum. The small conductor new alloy aluminum was only on the market for a year or two. They just could not over come the reputation of fires from the old stuff.
Not sure about the copper clad...I have never used that.


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## don_resqcapt19 (Jul 18, 2010)

brian john said:


> I wired quite a few apartments with #12 and #10 AL, It was a pain to use.
> 
> Used a knife to pencil the conductors insulation no strippers or kleins for stripping.
> 
> ...


I did not see any issues in using the aluminum. Yes it is larger than the copper for the same amps but bends easier. We had to use strippers, no knife as just a small knick in the conductor would make it break easy. Note this was an EMT job with the new alloy and CO/ALR devices.


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## Shockdoc (Mar 4, 2010)

don_resqcapt19 said:


> I did not see any issues in using the aluminum. Yes it is larger than the copper for the same amps but bends easier. We had to use strippers, no knife as just a small knick in the conductor would make it break easy. Note this was an EMT job with the new alloy and CO/ALR devices.


I came across #10 AL TW in flourescent industrial lighting rows using 567 3M crimps taps. Seen that stuff in commercial BX, but mostly resi in the hi end communities from the 70s. My first mishap with it in my first week on the job was using pliers to strip it during a pigtail job and then having to find where we lost it. A good twist, penetrox, a solid wirenut, never a problem.


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## tarrcm (Sep 25, 2012)

don_resqcapt19 said:


> The NEC has never prohibited the use of 15 and 20 amp sized aluminum conductors. The history of the old aluminum wiring made it so that no one really wanted to use aluminum. The small conductor new alloy aluminum was only on the market for a year or two. They just could not over come the reputation of fires from the old stuff.
> Not sure about the copper clad...I have never used that.


I don't recall if the NEC prohibited the use of AL for 15 & 20 branch circuits since at the time I worked for an electrical contractor in NJ and it might have been a state law but I suspect it was indeed NEC prohibited. This was back in 1971-1974 but just before Federal Pacific went out of business. Then CU clad AL was used (by some contractors) for 15 & 20 branch ckts even after that became illegal since at a glance it looked like CU. In a lab AL worked well but in the real world many electricians were wireing houses and appartment buildings in high production mode having to meet a quota for the day - I'm not talking piece work either. Using strippers or side-cutters would inevitably nick the wires and hence cause problems.


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## MHElectric (Oct 14, 2011)

Shockdoc said:


> I came across #10 AL TW in flourescent industrial lighting rows using 567 3M crimps taps. Seen that stuff in commercial BX, but mostly resi in the hi end communities from the 70s. My first mishap with it in my first week on the job was using pliers to strip it during a pigtail job and then having to find where we lost it. A good twist, penetrox, a solid wirenut, never a problem.


I pull all my ranges, HVAC units, and feeders in ALU. Much much cheaper, just as good as copper! :thumbsup:

Every old ALU backstabbed rec. or splice Ive fixed were all a different type of alloy. Alot more brittle and much more soft to the touch. The stuff they make nowdays is a better quality metal.


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## 19kilosparky984 (Sep 14, 2011)

tarrcm said:


> I don't recall if the NEC prohibited the use of AL for 15 & 20 branch circuits since at the time I worked for an electrical contractor in NJ and it might have been a state law but I suspect it was indeed NEC prohibited. This was back in 1971-1974 but just before Federal Pacific went out of business. Then CU clad AL was used (by some contractors) for 15 & 20 branch ckts even after that became illegal since at a glance it looked like CU. In a lab AL worked well but in the real world many electricians were wireing houses and appartment buildings in high production mode having to meet a quota for the day - I'm not talking piece work either. Using strippers or side-cutters would inevitably nick the wires and hence cause problems.


Federal pacific didn't go out of business until 1988


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## Shockdoc (Mar 4, 2010)

MHElectric said:


> I pull all my ranges, HVAC units, and feeders in ALU. Much much cheaper, just as good as copper! :thumbsup:
> 
> Every old ALU backstabbed rec. or splice Ive fixed were all a different type of alloy. Alot more brittle and much more soft to the touch. The stuff they make nowdays is a better quality metal.


Local laws only allow Al for services in residential . I push AL as much as I can and am often deemed an outcast around here.


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## Shockdoc (Mar 4, 2010)

19kilosparky984 said:


> Federal pacific didn't go out of business until 1988


A friend of the family had got stuck with a FPE panel in the new home they had built that year.


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## tarrcm (Sep 25, 2012)

19kilosparky984 said:


> Federal pacific didn't go out of business until 1988


 My Bad, during the era of early to mid 1970's the State of NJ prohibited use and ensued with a class action suit against FPE.


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## 19kilosparky984 (Sep 14, 2011)

tarrcm said:


> My Bad, during the era of early to mid 1970's the State of NJ prohibited use and ensued with a class action suit against FPE.


Your still at least a decade off. None of that took place until the late 80's.

There are a ton of houses here in NJ built in the 80's with al/ copper clad al and FPE panels.


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## tarrcm (Sep 25, 2012)

19kilosparky984 said:


> Your still at least a decade off. None of that took place until the late 80's.
> 
> There are a ton of houses here in NJ built in the 80's with al/ copper clad al and FPE panels.


I'm sure there are sparky, I'm only speaking of my own experience at the time. Because laws changed doesn't mean that all contractors complied. Were you an electrician in the 70's doing residential work in NJ? I've seen inspectors getting paid off to look the other way, not right but reality.


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## Celtic (Nov 19, 2007)

19kilosparky984 said:


> Federal pacific didn't go out of business until 1988





tarrcm said:


> My Bad, during the era of early to mid 1970's the State of NJ prohibited use and ensued with a class action suit against FPE.



The NJ class action lawsuit against FPE was settled in 2005.


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## don_resqcapt19 (Jul 18, 2010)

tarrcm said:


> I don't recall if the NEC prohibited the use of AL for 15 & 20 branch circuits since at the time I worked for an electrical contractor in NJ and it might have been a state law but I suspect it was indeed NEC prohibited. ...


The NEC has never prohibited the use of 15 and 20 aluminum conductors. Other local or state codes may have, but not the NEC.


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## buddhakii (Jan 13, 2011)

I wish aluminum wiring was allowed. The new aluminum is much better, so they day. If it isn't it is job security.


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