# pvc in ceiling



## chris g (Jan 26, 2012)

Can you pvc feeder pipes in attic space in a commercial bldg.?


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## backstay (Feb 3, 2011)

chris g said:


> Can you pvc feeder pipes in attic space in a commercial bldg.?


Only if you have access.


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## Master Apprentice (Jan 25, 2012)

Why would you need access?


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## backstay (Feb 3, 2011)

Master Apprentice said:


> Why would you need access?


To put it in.


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## That's It? (Aug 31, 2011)

backstay said:


> To put it in.


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## local134gt (Dec 24, 2008)

chris g said:


> Can *you* pvc feeder pipes in attic space in a commercial bldg.?


According to the Chicago Electrical code *I* cannot. I have no idea what code says in your area....


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## backstay (Feb 3, 2011)

local134gt said:


> According to the Chicago Electrical code I cannot. I have no idea what code says in your area....


We generally defer to the NEC or maybe CEC(not really)


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## Master Apprentice (Jan 25, 2012)

backstay said:


> To put it in.


Tue che my friend:thumbsup:


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## Gaterhater (Nov 15, 2011)

Usually more of a call for local building code. Make sure it's not a plenum rated ceiling


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## chris g (Jan 26, 2012)

Thanks for the input


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## backstay (Feb 3, 2011)

Gaterhater said:


> Usually more of a call for local building code. Make sure it's not a plenum rated ceiling


When did this enter the code? Same as romex in a non dwelling? I do work in a apartment building with a hung ceiling and they fed their elevator through that ceiling with PVC. I think it was installed in 1980.


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## Gaterhater (Nov 15, 2011)

backstay said:


> When did this enter the code? Same as romex in a non dwelling? I do work in a apartment building with a hung ceiling and they fed their elevator through that ceiling with PVC. I think it was installed in 1980.


Not sure when it took affect. I know it's been that way for a while. In plenum ceilings , no plastic allowed at all. Even tie raps have to be rated.


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## manchestersparky (Mar 25, 2007)

Gaterhater said:


> Usually more of a call for local building code. Make sure it's not a plenum rated ceiling


 
NEC article 300.22 (C) (1) -
*300.22 Wiring in Ducts Not Used for Air Handling,*
*Fabricated Ducts for Environmental Air, and Other*​ 
*Spaces for Environmental Air (Plenums). *
​​The provisionsof this section shall apply to the installation and uses of​ electrical wiring and equipment in ducts used for dust,loose stock, or vapor removal; ducts specifically fabricated for environmental air; and other spaces used for environmental air (plenums).

*(C) Other Spaces Used for Environmental Air (Plenums).*
This section shall apply to spaces not specifically fabricated for environmental air-handling purposes but used for air-handling purposes as a plenum. This section shall not apply to habitable rooms or areas of buildings, the prime purpose of which is not air handling.

Informational Note No. 1: The space over a hung ceiling used for environmental air-handling purposes is an example of the type of other space to which this section applies.Informational Note No. 2: The phrase “Other Spaces Used for Environmental Air (Plenum)” as used in this section correlates with the use of the term “plenum” in NFPA 90A-2009, _Standard for the Installation of Air-Conditioning and __Ventilating Systems_, and other mechanical codes where the plenum is used for return air purposes, as well as some other air-handling spaces.

_Exception: This section shall not apply to the joist or stud __spaces of dwelling units where the wiring passes through __such spaces perpendicular to the long dimension of such__spaces._



*(1) Wiring Methods. *​ The wiring methods for such other space shall be limited to totally enclosed, nonventilated, insulated busway having no provisions for plug-in connections,Type MI cable, Type MC cable without an overall nonmetallic covering, Type AC cable, or other factoryassembled multiconductor control or power cable that is specifically listed for use within an air-handling space, or listed prefabricated cable assembliesofmetallicmanufacturedwiring systems without nonmetallic sheath. Other types of cables, conductors, and raceways shall be permitted
to be installed in electrical metallic tubing, flexible metallic tubing, intermediate metal conduit, rigid metal conduit without an overall nonmetallic covering, flexible metal conduit, or, where accessible, surface metal raceway or metal wireway with metal covers.






​​​​​​​​

backstay said:


> When did this enter the code? Same as romex in a non dwelling? I do work in a apartment building with a hung ceiling and they fed their elevator through that ceiling with PVC. I think it was installed in 1980.


 



Gaterhater said:


> Not sure when it took affect. I know it's been that way for a while. In plenum ceilings , no plastic allowed at all. Even tie raps have to be rated.


 


Not sure when it was entered into the code , but I know it's been in there since at leats the 1978 edition. Thats as far back as mine go. 480 will have the references to research this question.​


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## MDShunk (Jan 7, 2007)

What's the construction type on the permit or drawings? You might even be able to use Type SER cable.


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## Going_Commando (Oct 1, 2011)

MDShunk said:


> What's the construction type on the permit or drawings? You might even be able to use Type SER cable.


Oh no you di'nt :laughing:


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## Gaterhater (Nov 15, 2011)

Thanks for the reference Manchester.


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## nitro71 (Sep 17, 2009)

So why do we use so much EMT when we can just use PVC? Most ceilings are not a plenum space.


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## randomkiller (Sep 28, 2007)

nitro71 said:


> So why do we use so much EMT when we can just use PVC? Most ceilings are not a plenum space.


 
Almost all the places we work are plenum ceilings and that has been more common that way since people are cheaping out on construction, no or little return ductwork.


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## noarcflash (Sep 14, 2011)

around here, no PVC allowed. plumbing or electrical. except the service entrance.


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